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dukedoc
03-16-2013, 12:07 PM
Carmody out at Northwestern per Goodman. Coach Collins may be a candidate.
LINK (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21892012/report-northwestern-parts-ways-with-carmody)

Native
03-16-2013, 12:20 PM
Carmody out at Northwestern per Goodman. Coach Collins may be a candidate.
LINK (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21892012/report-northwestern-parts-ways-with-carmody)

The Chronicle (http://sports.chronicleblogs.com/2013/03/16/report-chris-collins-to-northwestern/) is calling him "the favorite". Speculation at this point IMO.

sagegrouse
03-16-2013, 01:23 PM
The Chronicle (http://sports.chronicleblogs.com/2013/03/16/report-chris-collins-to-northwestern/) is calling him "the favorite". Speculation at this point IMO.

Here's the money quote from the OP link:



By Eye on College Basketball staff
March 16, 2013 11:58 am ET

....
The frontrunner to replace Carmody, sources told CBSSports.com, is Duke assistant coach and Illinois native Chris Collins.

A bit more than speculation, but there is also the "supply side" of the transaction: Would Chris take the job?

sagegrouse

BlueDevilBrowns
03-16-2013, 01:27 PM
Here's the money quote from the OP link:



A bit more than speculation, but there is also the "supply side" of the transaction: Would Chris take the job?

sagegrouse

Hmmm... Well, he should be careful, because if he takes the job, our "stalker" Maryland may just make Northwestern their new "bitter rival" when they show up in 2015.

Seriously, I think if Coach Collins wants to be the head coach at Duke one day, this would be a logical stepping-stone. It certainly could hurt our Chicago recruiting pipeline, though.

pfrduke
03-16-2013, 01:38 PM
Hmmm... Well, he should be careful, because if he takes the job, our "stalker" Maryland may just make Northwestern their new "bitter rival" when they show up in 2015.

Seriously, I think if Coach Collins wants to be the head coach at Duke one day, this would be a logical stepping-stone. It certainly could hurt our Chicago recruiting pipeline, though.

Yeah, it's not like we have another coach from Chicago sitting on our bench. Oh, wait....

Blue KevIL
03-16-2013, 02:15 PM
The Northwestern job is one of two things: a sleeping giant who has never been awake OR a coaches graveyard.
The Wildcats have never made the NCAA Tournament and have only been ranked by the AP Poll for a total of 12 weeks.
Eleven of those weeks took place in 1969 and prior.

Bill Carmody had the most success the Wildcats had seen in years and his record over 13 years was just 191-204 (69-148 in B1G play) with 4 NIT bids.
The best he did in the B1G was 8-8 in 2004 to tie for 5th.

The best a Hall of Fame coach the likes of Tex Winter could do in 5 years was 44-87 (25-61 in Big Ten play).

While researching this I came accross infomation I did not previously know:
Jim Calhoun was, at one point, the top candidate for the Northwestern job in April 1986.
This was while he was still at Northeastern and before he built UConn into what it became.

Calhoun turned down the job because, according to the article I found, "his idea of improvement was grander than Northwestern's" and "he aspires to higher goals than finishing in the middle of a conference."
NU opted to go with former Duke head coach Bill Foster instead.
Foster spent 7 years at NU and went 54-141 (13-113 in Big Ten play) -- yes, that's right, 100! games under .500 in 7 seasons of conference play.

The Northwestern AD's comments about Calhoun after he turned them down are laughable in hindsight:
"It's obvious Jim was intimidated by the quality of programs and coaches in the Big Ten," Doug Single said.
"If that's the way he feels he's obviously not ready to coach in the Big Ten."

Article link (but it's pay archive): http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-3759270.html
Chicago Sun-Times April 3, 1986 Dan Pompei - NU's Single turns pitch to Foster

Cameron
03-16-2013, 03:15 PM
If Chris takes the Northwestern job, I suppose we could bring in Johnny Dawkins as an independent contractor to conduct interviews at half time and other ancillary tasks.

As much as I'd hate to see Chris and his undeniable love and passion for the program leave the family, Northwestern would provide for a perfect scenario to prepare Chris for the difficult balance of basketball and rigorous academic excellence that is expected of a coach at Duke. It worked out superbly for Johnny at Stanford.

If Collins does leave, I wonder if that would open the door for Chris Carrawell to rejoin the staff? Since it would without a doubt be a former Duke player or coach replacing Chris on the staff, who are the other prime candidates for when that time comes? Laettner? Hurley? Paulus?

burnspbesq
03-16-2013, 03:17 PM
The only person I can think of who might be happy about Carmody getting fired is Pat Haden.

sagegrouse
03-16-2013, 03:20 PM
While researching this I came accross infomation I did not previously know:
Jim Calhoun was, at one point, the top candidate for the Northwestern job in April 1986.
This was while he was still at Northeastern and before he built UConn into what it became.



Easy there, big guy! You're gonna make the rest of us look bad?

sage

OldPhiKap
03-16-2013, 03:25 PM
Easy there, big guy! You're gonna make the rest of us look bad?

sage

I always wondered what the rest of you were doing in Perkins.

simmias
03-16-2013, 04:26 PM
The NU job is about as no-win of a proposition as you can get. Lousy gym, lousy fan support, lousy co-eds, and admission standards aren't "relaxed" anywhere near to the extent that they are for other schools.

We did recently win a bowl game for the first time in 65 years, so that's one item off my bucket list. I fear the second NU-related one, NCAA tourney appearance, won't happen until the field is expanded to 128.

Native
03-16-2013, 04:33 PM
If Collins does leave, I wonder if that would open the door for Chris Carrawell to rejoin the staff? Since it would without a doubt be a former Duke player or coach replacing Chris on the staff, who are the other prime candidates for when that time comes? Laettner? Hurley? Paulus?

Carrawell certainly has the lead in the "Being Named Chris" category, that's for sure.

Blue KevIL
03-16-2013, 05:13 PM
Supposedly, there is a story about Tommy Amaker turning down the Northwestern job in 1993.

The reason?
He brought two redacted high school transcripts with him.
He showed them to the NU administration and asked if those two players would be admitted.
NU told Amaker that neither would be granted admission to NU -- those two players were Laettner & Hurley.

Amaker turned the job down because he knew that Northwestern could never succeed with those admission restrictions.

Nothing has changed at NU with regard to admissions and that is why they have never accomplished anything in basketball.
Bill Carmody could be considered a miracle-worker with those resources.

Unless Chris Collins can convince them to adapt, he should stay away from Northwestern.

SoCalDukeFan
03-16-2013, 05:14 PM
The Northwestern job is one of two things: a sleeping giant who has never been awake OR a coaches graveyard.
The Wildcats have never made the NCAA Tournament and have only been ranked by the AP Poll for a total of 12 weeks.
Eleven of those weeks took place in 1969 and prior.

Bill Carmody had the most success the Wildcats had seen in years and his record over 13 years was just 191-204 (69-148 in B1G play) with 4 NIT bids.
The best he did in the B1G was 8-8 in 2004 to tie for 5th.

The best a Hall of Fame coach the likes of Tex Winter could do in 5 years was 44-87 (25-61 in Big Ten play).

While researching this I came accross infomation I did not previously know:
Jim Calhoun was, at one point, the top candidate for the Northwestern job in April 1986.
This was while he was still at Northeastern and before he built UConn into what it became.

Calhoun turned down the job because, according to the article I found, "his idea of improvement was grander than Northwestern's" and "he aspires to higher goals than finishing in the middle of a conference."
NU opted to go with former Duke head coach Bill Foster instead.
Foster spent 7 years at NU and went 54-141 (13-113 in Big Ten play) -- yes, that's right, 100! games under .500 in 7 seasons of conference play.

The Northwestern AD's comments about Calhoun after he turned them down are laughable in hindsight:
"It's obvious Jim was intimidated by the quality of programs and coaches in the Big Ten," Doug Single said.
"If that's the way he feels he's obviously not ready to coach in the Big Ten."

Article link (but it's pay archive): http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-3759270.html
Chicago Sun-Times April 3, 1986 Dan Pompei - NU's Single turns pitch to Foster

Calhoun at NW would have been a real mismatch.

NW's problem is wanting to be Ivy like in academics and not making enough of a concession to be Big 10 in athletics.

The head bball coaching job is very tough. However succeed and other bigger doors should open. Will be interesting to watch.

SoCal

Blue KevIL
03-16-2013, 05:16 PM
Calhoun at NW would have been a real mismatch.

NW's problem is wanting to be Ivy like in academics and not making enough of a concession to be Big 10 in athletics.

The head bball coaching job is very tough. However succeed and other bigger doors should open. Will be interesting to watch.

SoCal

Agreed on the Calhoun mismatch. I just thought it was comical of NU to suggest that Calhoun didn't have the chops to coach in a big time conference.

simmias
03-16-2013, 05:46 PM
Calhoun at NW would have been a real mismatch.

NW's problem is wanting to be Ivy like in academics and not making enough of a concession to be Big 10 in athletics.

The head bball coaching job is very tough. However succeed and other bigger doors should open. Will be interesting to watch.

SoCal
NU (and it is NU, not NW) makes concessions in football, and competes quite well. They just won't in basketball. It's just never been an important sport at NU.

tommy
03-16-2013, 09:23 PM
As much as I'd hate to see Chris and his undeniable love and passion for the program leave the family, Northwestern would provide for a perfect scenario to prepare Chris for the difficult balance of basketball and rigorous academic excellence that is expected of a coach at Duke. It worked out superbly for Johnny at Stanford.

It did? How so?

Mudge
03-16-2013, 09:41 PM
NU (and it is NU, not NW) makes concessions in football, and competes quite well. They just won't in basketball. It's just never been an important sport at NU.

That's the thing that confuses me-- why do they do it (concede) in football, but not in basketball? They were horrible for decades (maybe longer than Duke was) in football (although admittedly, against tougher competition), and then suddenly, they seemed like they decided they were tired of getting stomped-- why did they decide that they cared about football (after not caring for so long), and yet they have still never decided to care about basketball? It takes so many fewer special admits (maybe as few as 1-2/year) to make a basketball competitive, while football takes 20-30 special admits-- surely basketball will not damage their standards nearly as much as football concessions would/have.

Cameron
03-16-2013, 09:42 PM
It did? How so?

It most definitely did not. I was being ironic.

Mudge
03-16-2013, 09:45 PM
If Chris takes the Northwestern job, I suppose we could bring in Johnny Dawkins as an independent contractor to conduct interviews at half time and other ancillary tasks.

As much as I'd hate to see Chris and his undeniable love and passion for the program leave the family, Northwestern would provide for a perfect scenario to prepare Chris for the difficult balance of basketball and rigorous academic excellence that is expected of a coach at Duke. It worked out superbly for Johnny at Stanford.

If Collins does leave, I wonder if that would open the door for Chris Carrawell to rejoin the staff? Since it would without a doubt be a former Duke player or coach replacing Chris on the staff, who are the other prime candidates for when that time comes? Laettner? Hurley? Paulus?

Neither Laettner nor Hurley has done anything to position themselves to be a coach-- Laettner lives in a dreamland where he thinks somebody is going to eventually name him an NBA coach-- he is completely delusional, both about his career possibilities and his financial situation. I don't think Hurley (surprisingly, given his dad) has any desire to get into coaching. Paulus is clearly the most likely to join the staff, of the ones you mention.

Does your comment about Dawkins pre-suppose that he is going to be fired at Stanford? Because the latest news suggests that he has already been given (at least) a one year reprieve from the firing squad.

NashvilleDevil
03-16-2013, 09:49 PM
Neither Laettner nor Hurley has done anything to position themselves to be a coach-- Laettner lives in a dreamland where he thinks somebody is going to eventually name him an NBA coach-- he is completely delusional, both about his career possibilities and his financial situation. I don't think Hurley (surprisingly, given his dad) has any desire to get into coaching. Paulus is clearly the most likely to join the staff, of the ones you mention.

Does your comment about Dawkins pre-suppose that he is going to be fired at Stanford? Because the latest news suggests that he has already been given (at least) a one year reprieve from the firing squad.

Isn't Hurley an assistant with his brother at Rhode Island?

As for Northwestern choosing to be competitive in football. Have you seen the money schools get just for going to a bowl game?

Cameron
03-16-2013, 09:53 PM
Neither Laettner nor Hurley has done anything to position themselves to be a coach-- Laettner lives in a dreamland where he thinks somebody is going to eventually name him an NBA coach-- he is completely delusional, both about his career possibilities and his financial situation. I don't think Hurley (surprisingly, given his dad) has any desire to get into coaching. Paulus is clearly the most likely to join the staff, of the ones you mention.

Bobby Hurley is the associate head coach at Rhode Island, where his brother Danny is the head coach. He launched his coaching career in 2010 when his brother was leading the program at Wagner. As long as Bobby doesn't mind leaving his brother's staff, I wouldn't see why Bobby joining the staff at Duke would be an improbable feat. I think he'd possibly be a great addition.

Chris Carrawell seems like the most likely option.


Does your comment about Dawkins pre-suppose that he is going to be fired at Stanford? Because the latest news suggests that he has already been given (at least) a one year reprieve from the firing squad.

I was more or less just pointing toward the inevitable. Johnny has been in Palo Alto for five years now, and none of those seasons has resulted in an NCAA berth. That's not a bright omen for Johnny moving forward.

Mudge
03-16-2013, 10:00 PM
Bobby Hurley is the associate head coach at Rhode Island, where his brother Danny is the head coach. He launched his coaching career in 2010 when his brother was leading the program at Wagner. As long as Bobby doesn't mind leaving his brother's staff, I wouldn't see why Bobby joining the staff at Duke would be an improbable feat. I think he'd possibly be a great addition.

Chris Carrawell seems like the most likely option.



I was more or less just pointing toward the inevitable. Johnny has been in Palo Alto for five years now, and none of those seasons has resulted in an NCAA berth. That's not a bright omen for Johnny moving forward.

Oops--forgot that Bobby joined Danny recently-- for so many years, he just seemed interested in horse-racing... I still don't think his heart is really in it... not the way his dad's is/was... you're probably right about JD... too bad, that. Laettner is the main one that I think is ridiculous-- Paulus is a far, far more likely choice than the other two-- he has done nothing since quitting playing except take whatever job he could get, to advance his cause-- of being a coach.

Grey Devil
03-16-2013, 10:30 PM
Supposedly, there is a story about Tommy Amaker turning down the Northwestern job in 1993.

The reason?
He brought two redacted high school transcripts with him.
He showed them to the NU administration and asked if those two players would be admitted.
NU told Amaker that neither would be granted admission to NU -- those two players were Laettner & Hurley.

Amaker turned the job down because he knew that Northwestern could never succeed with those admission restrictions.


And what's the story about his move to Harvard? Did he do the same thing there? Somehow I think not...

Grey Devil

SoCalDukeFan
03-16-2013, 10:37 PM
The only person I can think of who might be happy about Carmody getting fired is Pat Haden.

Why would Pat Haden be happy?

SoCal

Blue KevIL
03-16-2013, 11:16 PM
And what's the story about his move to Harvard? Did he do the same thing there? Somehow I think not...

Grey Devil

I think the big difference is that Harvard plays Princeton, Yale, Penn, et al. & all have comparable admission restrictions.
Whereas, Northwestern plays Indiana, Michigan State, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, Purdue & none have NU's admission restrictions.
Oh, and... B1G Basketball > Ivy Basketball.

throatybeard
03-16-2013, 11:17 PM
Supposedly, there is a story about Tommy Amaker turning down the Northwestern job in 1993.

The reason?
He brought two redacted high school transcripts with him.
He showed them to the NU administration and asked if those two players would be admitted.
NU told Amaker that neither would be granted admission to NU -- those two players were Laettner & Hurley.

Amaker turned the job down because he knew that Northwestern could never succeed with those admission restrictions.

Nothing has changed at NU with regard to admissions and that is why they have never accomplished anything in basketball.
Bill Carmody could be considered a miracle-worker with those resources.

Unless Chris Collins can convince them to adapt, he should stay away from Northwestern.

So why are they good at football, which is much harder to succeed in?

Collins' name comes up every time there's a job anywhere near Illinois. I think I heard it mentioned for Barack Obama's old Senate seat. What I don't understand is why everyone thinks he's so much more qualified than Wojo when Coach K retires.

lotusland
03-16-2013, 11:17 PM
Why would Pat Haden be happy?

SoCal

Because he was a Rhodes scholar and because Jack Youngblood was on his team

Blue KevIL
03-16-2013, 11:52 PM
So why are they good at football, which is much harder to succeed in?

I think what happened was that NU Football had some success (back-to-back Big Televen titles in 1995 & 1996) and built on it.
A case of success breeding success. NU spent the money to upgrade its football facilities after the initial bowl appearances and now has a culture of winning -- punctuated by its first bowl win in Jan-2013 since the 1949 Rose Bowl. Somehow, they broke their cycle of failure.

There has never been any success for the NU Basketball program to build on -- unless Carmody's tenure can be deemed successful.
With no NCAA appearances and, by-far, the worst basketball facilities in the B1G, it's hard to sell that program to any recruits who have the academics to go there. I think they need one break-through year to start and could find the hoops success to breed further success. But, it's going to take some strong-willed individuals (coach & players) who believe in one another to do that. NU Basketball has no culture of winning to lean on.

It's like NU Basketball is what Duke Football was for a good number of recent years.
They need their hoops version of a David Cutcliffe to come in and believe and convince others to believe.

brevity
03-17-2013, 12:04 AM
There has never been any success for the NU Basketball program to build on -- unless Carmody's tenure can be deemed successful.
With no NCAA appearances and, by-far, the worst basketball facilities in the B1G, it's hard to sell that program to any recruits who have the academics to go there. I think they need one break-through year to start and could find the hoops success to breed further success. But, it's going to take some strong-willed individuals (coach & players) who believe in one another to do that. NU Basketball has no culture of winning to lean on.

That does sound like a tough sell. It's fun to speculate about Chris Collins, and re-address the weird desperation at DBR to change up the Duke coaching staff. (Can we please fnd someone shorter than Wojo to coach the bigs? I wanna see some minds explode.) But if Collins isn't interested, which head coach from the MAC will Northwestern target?

JasonEvans
03-17-2013, 12:51 PM
There is a good bit of chatter (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21892012/report-northwestern-parts-ways-with-carmody) about Collins to Northwstern now that Bill Carmody is out.

But, the Chicago Trib says nothing is going to happen quickly and throws out a ton (http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-03-16/sports/ct-spt-0317-northwestern-candidates-basketball-20130317_1_nu-assistant-duke-associate-head-coach-president-morton-schapiro) of other possible names, including Tommy Amaker.

I don't know why Tommy would take it. His wife is quite happy at Harvard and his team is set up to be historically good for the Ivy League next season. My bet is that he stays at Harvard until a major-league program comes calling. Northwestern ain't that.

-Jason "I think Collins would be a good fit -- he knows how to recruit with academics in mind" Evans

BD80
03-17-2013, 01:21 PM
... until a major-league program comes calling. Northwestern ain't that.

-Jason "I think Collins would be a good fit -- he knows how to recruit with academics in mind" Evans

Northwestern has the distinction of being one of only five of the original 160 Division I schools that has never gone to the tournamen in its 75 years.


http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/fandom/post/_/id/19449/ncaa-tournaments-un-fab-five-are-0-for-75

Army is another, but in 1968, with a VERY tempermental coach and an unpronounceable point guard, they chose the NIT over an NCAA invite.

Dev11
03-18-2013, 04:16 PM
Supposedly, there is a story about Tommy Amaker turning down the Northwestern job in 1993.

The reason?
He brought two redacted high school transcripts with him.
He showed them to the NU administration and asked if those two players would be admitted.
NU told Amaker that neither would be granted admission to NU -- those two players were Laettner & Hurley.

Amaker turned the job down because he knew that Northwestern could never succeed with those admission restrictions.

Nothing has changed at NU with regard to admissions and that is why they have never accomplished anything in basketball.
Bill Carmody could be considered a miracle-worker with those resources.

Unless Chris Collins can convince them to adapt, he should stay away from Northwestern.

Not that I'm questioning the validity of the story, but do you have a source? It sounds too good to be true, like the Grant Hill-Georgetown recruiting story.

Billy Dat
03-18-2013, 04:23 PM
And what's the story about his move to Harvard? Did he do the same thing there? Somehow I think not...
Grey Devil


I think the big difference is that Harvard plays Princeton, Yale, Penn, et al. & all have comparable admission restrictions.
Whereas, Northwestern plays Indiana, Michigan State, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, Purdue & none have NU's admission restrictions.
Oh, and... B1G Basketball > Ivy Basketball.

It also bears mentioning that when Amaker was considering Northwestern in 1993, he was a white hot coaching star on the rise analyzing which was the best opportunity to start his head coaching career. When he took the Harvard job, he was a middle aged coach rebuilding a coaching career that fell short of original expectations on a grand stage.


Collins' name comes up every time there's a job anywhere near Illinois. I think I heard it mentioned for Barack Obama's old Senate seat. What I don't understand is why everyone thinks he's so much more qualified than Wojo when Coach K retires.

Funny, with no inside knowledge at all, just basing it on what I read about the program and the way people talk about him, I always get the sense that if K had to name his successor, today, from the current staff, Wojo would get the nod.

wallyman
03-18-2013, 04:52 PM
It also bears mentioning that when Amaker was considering Northwestern in 1993, he was a white hot coaching star on the rise analyzing which was the best opportunity to start his head coaching career. When he took the Harvard job, he was a middle aged coach rebuilding a coaching career that fell short of original expectations on a grand stage.



Funny, with no inside knowledge at all, just basing it on what I read about the program and the way people talk about him, I always get the sense that if K had to name his successor, today, from the current staff, Wojo would get the nod.

Really? On Wojo. Knowing nothing, and not thinking it will be any of them, I would have put Collins and Capel higher.
As for Northwestern, don't think this is such a bad job. All you have to do is get to the NCAA tournament and you're a miracle worker. It's a pretty low bar for success.

Dev11
03-18-2013, 04:57 PM
All you have to do is get to the NCAA tournament and you're a miracle worker. It's a pretty low bar for success.

That's a much higher bar than getting late 90s/00s Duke Football to a bowl game, and yet we fired a few coaches in trying to reach that goal.

wallyman
03-18-2013, 05:43 PM
Easier and cheaper to turn around a basketball program. Only need a handful of players to get there. Bet the next Northwestern coach makes the tournament.
Carmody almost did.

Blue KevIL
03-18-2013, 05:47 PM
Not that I'm questioning the validity of the story, but do you have a source? It sounds too good to be true, like the Grant Hill-Georgetown recruiting story.

May be an urban legend that continues to get repeated, but here's where I have seen it (the first article is from 1993, but it does not mention the urban legend):

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1993-05-04/sports/9305040115_1_northwestern-bill-foster-athletics-and-recreation
http://www.laketheposts.com/index.php/2007/09/13/the-football-basketball-identity-challenge/
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2011/01/11/bernstein-northwestern-should-just-play-ball/
http://tobaccoroadblues.com/2012/03/13/the-last-wallflower/
http://www.sippinonpurple.com/northwestern-wildcats-basketball/2013/3/16/4093732/northwestern-basketball-coaching-search-tommy-amaker

burnspbesq
03-18-2013, 05:59 PM
Why would Pat Haden be happy?

SoCal

Because one of the most under-the-radar stories in higher education in the last couple of decades is how much the quality of undergraduate education, and the admissions standards, have improved at USC. It's #24 in the 2013 US News ranking, even with UVa and ahead of (among others) Wake, UNC, and Michigan. Having a coach who can recruit in the face of admissions challenges is going to be important.

tommy
03-18-2013, 06:14 PM
Because one of the most under-the-radar stories in higher education in the last couple of decades is how much the quality of undergraduate education, and the admissions standards, have improved at USC. It's #24 in the 2013 US News ranking, even with UVa and ahead of (among others) Wake, UNC, and Michigan. Having a coach who can recruit in the face of admissions challenges is going to be important.


Yes, but are those admissions standards going to apply to USC athletes? I haven't seen any evidence of it thus far.

And if they are, what on earth are they doing interviewing Tim Floyd?

Blue KevIL
03-18-2013, 06:18 PM
Not that I'm questioning the validity of the story, but do you have a source? It sounds too good to be true, like the Grant Hill-Georgetown recruiting story.

For those unware of the Grant Hill story (third column): http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1988&dat=19950218&id=QEEiAAAAIBAJ&sjid=M60FAAAAIBAJ&pg=1301,4048684

Mal
03-18-2013, 06:47 PM
Thoughts on a number of the thoughts posted above:

- that story about Amaker and the transcripts almost has to be apocryphal. Did Tommy share the level of recruit those two guys were, as well as their transcripts? That said, I suppose it's possible the school still had a strict "will not bend" rule on academics for basketball players at that point and was insistent on telling their new coach that wasn't about to change. Also, I have to think anyone intelligent enough to work in the Athletic Department or whatever at a school such as Northwestern would have seen right through that and asked "Which Duke players were these?"

- agreed on the comments that it's very strange that NW hasn't broken down on the academic exceptions for basketball, where it's a lot easier to build success with a couple players, vs. football, where you simply can't get anywhere in the B1G without a lot of talent on the field. I suspect the reason is pretty $imple, though.

- I would not be shocked, however, if NW is now at the point where the basketball program has reached Duke Football circa 2008 levels of despondence, and there will be enough alumni pressure to get insitutional buy-in on a legitimate commitment to make the program better this time around. The success of the football program, and Pat Fitzgerald's infectious "We CAN compete in the Big Ten if we just try hard enough and care more" attitude has raised excitement, and expectations, about Northwestern's sports ceiling. At least among the alums I know. The facilities stink (feels like a high school gym), but could be improved - it's not like they need a football stadium expansion. The location could be a decent selling point, if kids can get over the weather.

- If there is, in fact, an institutional decision to be competitive in basketball, THEN it might be a good job for Collins, and he a good guy for the position. Carmody was a great choice for where they were a decade ago, but he was coming from Princeton and was never going to make them legit through recruiting. Collins obviously can handle the recruiting portion of the job, and has undoubtedly learned a lot about striking the balance between student athletes who can thrive in both school and sport at Duke. And due to his father, Collins' name is pretty strong here, considering he hasn't lived in the area for 20 years. He's the same age as Fitzgerald, as well, and would represent a jolt of relative youth.

- Also, if ever there is a time to improve in the B1G, and at least solidify a spot outside the lowest tier, now might be it. The reason being that, while the conference as a whole is stronger than it's been in years, the lowest tier of the B1G has been expanding, and just did so again. Nebraska is awful and has no commitment to hoops. Likewise Penn. St. Iowa has been relegated to the basement and there are no signs it's coming upstairs any time soon. In any given year, Purdue, Illinois and/or Minnesota might implode. And after next season, Rutgers comes in, and as much as Maryland's had time in the sun, I'm not convinced they'll be in the top half of the B1G anytime soon given their current state (results against Duke this season notwithstanding). They'll never reach the upper echelons anytime in the foreseeable future, but if Northwestern can commit to being a decent basketball program, it can assure itself of no worse than 9th out of 14 in the average season. A couple good scheduling breaks and an upset or two and you can find yourself with a .500 season and with a legit noncon schedule, Presto! You've broken the magic spell keeping you out of the NCAA Tournament all these years.

- Last time we were discussing Collins to an Illinois school, last year, it was Illinois. I think that would have been a better fit, in terms of having the institutional support in place needed to have some success, although it came at the cost of higher expectations. One the other hand, the time before that we were discussing Depaul. NW would be a significantly better opportunity than that graveyard of a job (although that might actually improve as a result of the Big East breakup).

dukedoc
03-23-2013, 09:53 PM
Howland out at UCLA per Yahoo LINK (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaab--sources--ben-howland-out-at-ucla-013325438.html).

BD80
03-23-2013, 09:55 PM
Howland out at UCLA per Yahoo LINK (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaab--sources--ben-howland-out-at-ucla-013325438.html).

That will get the carousel spinning

BlueDevilBrowns
03-23-2013, 10:00 PM
Howland out at UCLA per Yahoo LINK (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaab--sources--ben-howland-out-at-ucla-013325438.html).


That will get the carousel spinning

Well, count out Jamie Dixon, as he's been extended at Pitt through 2023(crazy!).


http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/21/marshall-henderson-had-an-epic-press-conference-today/

My guess is he told Pitt put your money where your mouth is or he was headed to USC.

EDIT: And I could really see Pastner at UCLA if the Bruins can't land a "Big Name":

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/23/should-josh-pastner-get-out-of-memphis/

Blue KevIL
03-23-2013, 10:04 PM
I see that Mark Gottfried has been mentioned as a potential replacement for Ben Howland.
Gottfried was an assistant under Jim Harrick at UCLA.

I would be very surprised to see UCLA hiring anyone with ties to Jim Harrick.

IBleedBlue
03-23-2013, 10:10 PM
So now the biggest question is: where does Tony Parker head to to set screens and get rebounds??

sporthenry
03-23-2013, 10:17 PM
Well, count out Jamie Dixon, as he's been extended at Pitt through 2023(crazy!).


http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/21/marshall-henderson-had-an-epic-press-conference-today/

My guess is he told Pitt put your money where your mouth is or he was headed to USC.

EDIT: And I could really see Pastner at UCLA if the Bruins can't land a "Big Name":

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/23/should-josh-pastner-get-out-of-memphis/


Best response was Barkely who quipped, "He lost didn't he? Could have gotten one through 2050 had they won." Dixon always struck me as one of those guys who is very good but not in that elite group.

arnie
03-23-2013, 10:20 PM
I see that Mark Gottfried has been mentioned as a potential replacement for Ben Howland.
Gottfried was an assistant under Jim Harrick at UCLA.

I would be very surprised to see UCLA hiring anyone with ties to Jim Harrick.

State Fan will go berserk if Gott leaves. They will blame both K and Roy and the refs.

moonpie23
03-23-2013, 10:32 PM
why would they want Gott?

Mal
03-24-2013, 12:20 AM
Well, count out Jamie Dixon, as he's been extended at Pitt through 2023(crazy!).

I can't believe he'd have been a target, would he have? Why go hire a second guy in a row from Pitt, this one who's shown a propensity for underachieving tourney teams?

I'll be happy as long as they don't go and get Brad Stevens.

hurleyfor3
03-24-2013, 12:56 AM
If the world of college basketball was waiting for a job worthy of Brad Stevens to move to... here we go. Forget about the contract; Ucla definitely has people willing to make this happen.

throatybeard
03-24-2013, 12:58 AM
All of the persistent Duke hyperventilation over Brad Stevens has me convinced that Brad Stevens will never coach here.

I'd be very happy for someone to rub this post in my face in 2022.

Duvall
03-24-2013, 01:14 AM
I predict that Stevens will be coaching in one of the top six power conferences as early as next season.

brevity
03-24-2013, 01:18 AM
I predict that Stevens will be coaching in one of the top six power conferences as early as next season.

Bold! Meanwhile, Mick Cronin and Kevin Ollie could be working in a mid-major conference next year.

FerryFor50
03-24-2013, 01:22 AM
UCLA apparently wants Shaka or Stevens. How creative and quaint.

I doubt they get either...

luburch
03-24-2013, 01:41 AM
UCLA apparently wants Shaka or Stevens. How creative and quaint.

I doubt they get either...

I agree. I just can't see either of them leaving, at least not right now anyway. Of course I have nothing to back this up, just what my gut tells me.

sporthenry
03-24-2013, 01:50 AM
I agree. I just can't see either of them leaving, at least not right now anyway. Of course I have nothing to back this up, just what my gut tells me.

Those 2 basically have blank checks waiting for them whenever they want to leave. But UCLA is a major program so turning down Illinois or NC State isn't exactly comparable. Stevens is going to the BE so he might want to try that on for size and neither has shown any urgency in moving. The only fear is that if you don't move when you can, you might not get the chance later.

But you have to think as they start to get more competitive and realize the disadvantage they are at, they'll want to make the move. Not even from their own financial standpoint, but the resources that the other schools have for facilities and staff. Recalling the Butler Moneyball article, I think Stevens pretty much said he couldn't really pay Cannon. Imagine Duke coming and offering him a contract that Butler can't compete with.

UCLA isn't in great shape but there have been far worse major programs like IU. I doubt either makes the move but it wouldn't surprise me.

moonpie23
03-24-2013, 08:56 AM
it's much easier to get a new coach come to an established competitor than a dumpster fire...

dukedoc
03-24-2013, 09:15 AM
Ucla now denying Howland has been fired. Seems inevitable but maybe they weren't ready to tell the world yet.

BlueDevilBrowns
03-24-2013, 09:20 AM
I can't believe he'd have been a target, would he have? Why go hire a second guy in a row from Pitt, this one who's shown a propensity for underachieving tourney teams?

I'll be happy as long as they don't go and get Brad Stevens.

I was referencing USC in regards to Dixon, not UCLA.

As far as UCLA, they'll aim high but my guess is they'll end up with Josh Pastner from Memphis.

tommy
03-24-2013, 12:12 PM
I was referencing USC in regards to Dixon, not UCLA.

As far as UCLA, they'll aim high but my guess is they'll end up with Josh Pastner from Memphis.

I don't think so, for two reasons. First, Pastner has won a grand total of one NCAA tournament game in his years in Memphis. He has demonstrated the ability to win a mediocre league, though to be fair he has recruited pretty well. Second, he is very loyal to Lute Olson and the Arizona program. I have a hard time envisioning him seeking battle withl Arizona on the court and on the recruiting trail.

Cameron
03-24-2013, 05:52 PM
Chaka Kahn better not be too picky. If UCLA comes calling, he should rent a Uhaul and leave VCU as quickly as the Colts left Baltimore. He is a poor man's Brad Stevens and two years in a row now in the NCAA Tournament his gimmick has been exposed by more elite and athletic talent. If you have two primo backcourt players, you can dissect his havoc defense. Additionally, as others here have already touched upon, I do not think that his particular system would work at a major school like UK or UCLA. The really elite guys don't want to be pigeonholed into that type of system. I think it's a perfect fit for the kinds of players that VCU can attract, role players and "lesser" stars like Troy Daniels that are tailor-made for mid-major basketball, but I do not feel that guys like Nerlens Noel or Shabazz Muhammad would want to play in it. Just my take.

Maybe I am being too harsh on Smart, but I just don't like his incessant self-promotion. Havoc, havoc, havoc. It's all he talks about. He discusses the "branding" aspect of the system all the time, in a very ego-centric way. I much prefer the more stately Stevens who doesn't seem to be so much about his brand. Smart is the coaching version of Prince Harry.

Ben1029
03-24-2013, 10:19 PM
UCLA has made it official:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21940447/official-ucla-fires-howland-

nyesq83
03-25-2013, 02:17 AM
Chaka Kahn better not be too picky. If UCLA comes calling, he should rent a Uhaul and leave VCU as quickly as the Colts left Baltimore. He is a poor man's Brad Stevens and two years in a row now in the NCAA Tournament his gimmick has been exposed by more elite and athletic talent. If you have two primo backcourt players, you can dissect his havoc defense. Additionally, as others here have already touched upon, I do not think that his particular system would work at a major school like UK or UCLA. The really elite guys don't want to be pigeonholed into that type of system. I think it's a perfect fit for the kinds of players that VCU can attract, role players and "lesser" stars like Troy Daniels that are tailor-made for mid-major basketball, but I do not feel that guys like Nerlens Noel or Shabazz Muhammad would want to play in it. Just my take.

Maybe I am being too harsh on Smart, but I just don't like his incessant self-promotion. Havoc, havoc, havoc. It's all he talks about. He discusses the "branding" aspect of the system all the time, in a very ego-centric way. I much prefer the more stately Stevens who doesn't seem to be so much about his brand. Smart is the coaching version of Prince Harry.

I live two blocks away from the arena where VCU plays. I don't know where you live and what sports or news coverage you get, but I am curious about where and how you hear Coach Smart incessantly promoting himself. I have found him to be anything but ego-centric.

Richmond has many successful ad agencies here in town, and VCU is known for its highly successful advertising and marketing programs. VCU's recent bball success has had a major impact on increased interest in the school and in the city. Many here in RVA (oh yeah, that's a branding thing too) are aware of the positive feedback loop, and this Mad-Ave-speak is pervasive in town.

Seems like Duke has had a reputation or "brand" that's done pretty well for itself for the last 33 years. I seem to remember some awful marketing from Duke Football in the last 35 years, too. Red Means Go, Air Force or some such thing etc.

Calling Coach Smart "Chaka Khan" is petulant, akin to calling K by some asinine misnomer, as our haters do incessantly.

Not buying your anti-Smart silliness, despite some viable opinions on how Havoc can be beaten or (less so) how Havoc might not translate to bigger more storied programs with blue chippers on the roster.

sporthenry
03-25-2013, 02:31 AM
Chaka Kahn better not be too picky. If UCLA comes calling, he should rent a Uhaul and leave VCU as quickly as the Colts left Baltimore. He is a poor man's Brad Stevens and two years in a row now in the NCAA Tournament his gimmick has been exposed by more elite and athletic talent. If you have two primo backcourt players, you can dissect his havoc defense. Additionally, as others here have already touched upon, I do not think that his particular system would work at a major school like UK or UCLA. The really elite guys don't want to be pigeonholed into that type of system. I think it's a perfect fit for the kinds of players that VCU can attract, role players and "lesser" stars like Troy Daniels that are tailor-made for mid-major basketball, but I do not feel that guys like Nerlens Noel or Shabazz Muhammad would want to play in it. Just my take.

Maybe I am being too harsh on Smart, but I just don't like his incessant self-promotion. Havoc, havoc, havoc. It's all he talks about. He discusses the "branding" aspect of the system all the time, in a very ego-centric way. I much prefer the more stately Stevens who doesn't seem to be so much about his brand. Smart is the coaching version of Prince Harry.

Well what belief is there that he wouldn't adapt his system to his players? And who knows, with better players, maybe they can do the havoc even better. Pitino is effectively running a very similar system to Havoc and they are the overall #1 seed. Oregon uses a similar style and while Roy doesn't press, he preaches the fast paced style.

And Shaka will more than likely always have a chance at a BCS program whenever he wants it. So he doesn't have to jump whenever they come calling. Heck, some might call what Wisconsin runs a gimmick offense and Butler has been known to slow the pace down. Syracuse runs a gimmick defense.

VCU got to a F4 and I highly doubt that is a gimmick and VCU was very impressive until they ran into their worst match up. Such is the tournament.

Cameron
03-25-2013, 09:27 AM
Well what belief is there that he wouldn't adapt his system to his players? And who knows, with better players, maybe they can do the havoc even better. Pitino is effectively running a very similar system to Havoc and they are the overall #1 seed. Oregon uses a similar style and while Roy doesn't press, he preaches the fast paced style.

And Shaka will more than likely always have a chance at a BCS program whenever he wants it. So he doesn't have to jump whenever they come calling. Heck, some might call what Wisconsin runs a gimmick offense and Butler has been known to slow the pace down. Syracuse runs a gimmick defense.

VCU got to a F4 and I highly doubt that is a gimmick and VCU was very impressive until they ran into their worst match up. Such is the tournament.

Just my opinion. I have been wrong many times before. I made Creighton out to be the 1977 Portland Trail Blazers. Glad I was wrong. Although, to be fair, I approach every game that way. I am extremely superstitious. Albany was the '94 Rockets. If I see a black cat this time of year, I kill it. Even my mine. Sorry, Mr. Whiskers. :(

As for my opinion of Shaka Smart, I haven't followed him as closely as some here obviously have, but I have seen coverage of the TV commercials and highway billboards that promote Havoc which I guess has for whatever reason rubbed me the wrong way. Shaka also constantly compares his program to Butler every time he is on TV as if to remind everyone that he is in the same company as Stevens, but I just don't see it. He had one good tournament run but has not consistently been able to beat top teams year after year in the same fashion that Butler has. Smart is 2-7 against BCS teams since his magical run in 2011. The two wins were Alabama and Seton Hall. Brad Stevens, on the other hand, was 5-2 against the BCS this year alone and 13-8 overall since 2010.

I'm really not looking for an argument. I simply feel that Brad Stevens is a better coach than Shaka Smart and that his brand of basketball will translate better in a bigger conference. Two tournaments in a row now Smart's defense has unraveled against better, faster, more athletic teams. It could be that if he were at a better school where he can attract better talent -- like Nolan Richardson at Arkansas -- that the havoc system would be even more effective. But I just think it'd be a hard sell with today's kids. Havoc is a lot more extreme than what Oregon or Louisville does. It is Arkansas on steroids.

Sounds Reasonable
03-25-2013, 12:35 PM
Can anyone else see this happening? He is obviously a hired gun a UK with no ties to that program. I see him as a guy who would value the self-promotion opportunities and attention he would get in LA. I would expect that he could get just as many kids to come to UCLA as UK (I mean the level of kids he goes after have to be thinking about branding and endorsements). The thing I'm not sure about is whether the stable of recruits for next year has signed LOI's or just verbally committed. My recollection is that he flipped several recruits from Memphis to UK when he made that switch.

Dev11
03-25-2013, 12:37 PM
Can anyone else see this happening? He is obviously a hired gun a UK with no ties to that program. I see him as a guy who would value the self-promotion opportunities and attention he would get in LA. I would expect that he could get just as many kids to come to UCLA as UK (I mean the level of kids he goes after have to be thinking about branding and endorsements). The thing I'm not sure about is whether the stable of recruits for next year has signed LOI's or just verbally committed. My recollection is that he flipped several recruits from Memphis to UK when he made that switch.

You really know how to make an impression with your first post on a forum. Welcome to DBR, Sir or Madam.

wilko
03-25-2013, 12:40 PM
Can anyone else see this happening? He is obviously a hired gun a UK with no ties to that program. I see him as a guy who would value the self-promotion opportunities and attention he would get in LA. I would expect that he could get just as many kids to come to UCLA as UK (I mean the level of kids he goes after have to be thinking about branding and endorsements). The thing I'm not sure about is whether the stable of recruits for next year has signed LOI's or just verbally committed. My recollection is that he flipped several recruits from Memphis to UK when he made that switch.


Money always talks - but, I doubt he's wanting for anything.
Hes living life like a rockstar. Unless he hears the footsteps of the NCAA hammer - there's no reason to leave to go to UCLA (where he still wont be John Wooden) or anywhere else.

Bluedog
03-25-2013, 12:43 PM
Can anyone else see this happening? He is obviously a hired gun a UK with no ties to that program. I see him as a guy who would value the self-promotion opportunities and attention he would get in LA. I would expect that he could get just as many kids to come to UCLA as UK (I mean the level of kids he goes after have to be thinking about branding and endorsements). The thing I'm not sure about is whether the stable of recruits for next year has signed LOI's or just verbally committed. My recollection is that he flipped several recruits from Memphis to UK when he made that switch.

No. He's got a really good gig at UK, can do basically whatever he wants, hand picks top recruits, and gets paid $5M+ a year.

dukedoc
03-25-2013, 12:43 PM
Tubby is out at Minnesota per Goodman.

Reilly
03-25-2013, 12:56 PM
Googled to find out more about Tubby and saw where Goodman mentioned "Villa 7" in his article. Didn't know what that was so looked it up:

http://www.nooga.com/155045/villa-seven-at-the-axis-of-ncaa-coaching-carousel/

Billy Dat
03-25-2013, 01:01 PM
No. He's got a really good gig at UK, can do basically whatever he wants, hand picks top recruits, and gets paid $5M+ a year.

I agree....Kentucky to UCLA is a pretty big step down, unless he relished the challenge of restoring a once great dynasty to its former glory, as he did in Lexington. Had Sam Gilbert not died in 1987, I think he'd have at least thought about it.

The only way Cal leaves Lexington is if some huge NBA program hands him the front office and coaching keys. I bet that will happen within 5 years.

hurleyfor3
03-25-2013, 01:01 PM
Link to a credible media outlet on Tubby Smith:

http://www.startribune.com/sports/gophers/199883041.html

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-25-2013, 01:02 PM
Tubby is out at Minnesota per Goodman.

If true, that's a tough fire.

luburch
03-25-2013, 01:15 PM
Tubby to UCLA? Hard to believe Minnesota fired him. 20 wins in 5 of his 6 seasons. Not sure what they expect.

TruBlu
03-25-2013, 01:36 PM
Money always talks - but, I doubt he's wanting for anything.
Hes living life like a rockstar. Unless he hears the footsteps of the NCAA hammer - there's no reason to leave to go to UCLA (where he still wont be John Wooden) or anywhere else.

Bingo, you nailed it. He has a history of being one step ahead of the "cops", and thus far has gotten away with it.

Native
03-25-2013, 01:45 PM
If Tubby's out, I think he'd be a great move for Wake should Buzz get the hammer.

Mal
03-25-2013, 01:46 PM
Tubby to UCLA? Hard to believe Minnesota fired him. 20 wins in 5 of his 6 seasons. Not sure what they expect.

No schnitzel, man. Tubby came in and replaced Dan Monson, who completely and utterly underwhelmed when it came to wins and losses. I defended Monson until the end because he, of course, knowingly inherited the shipwreck left by Clem Haskins, and cleaned it up admirably and put the program on solid academic and citizenship standing again. Which was a big thing in and of itself. But he lost a LOT of games. He was a terrible game coach and recruited poorly, and it showed.

Tubby's out this year simply because his team played to its full talent level early on and then went into a long funk in the middle/end of the B1G season after expectations had skyrocketed. They beat Michigan State and Indiana, Memphis and others out of conference, played Duke tough in the Bahamas, and smoked UCLA in the first round of the tournament before refusing to give up yesterday to Florida. That's a good season most times, but when you start 4-1 in a really loaded conference and then fail to finish above .500, resentment and disappointment can snowball in a hurry, I guess.

There was a feeling the last two years that Tubby, while assembling good collections of talent, couldn't coach them into gelling and reaching close to their ceiling. I think that's a forgiveable sin, but apparently Gopher fans don't agree. I think in most programs the improvement to consistent respectability and increased profile he's accomplished would have earned him at least one more year. This is not a program that's going to land Howland or poach Smart or something - Tubby himself practically fell into their hands through a remarkable set of circumstances and perfect timing. Not likely to happen again.

DukeWarhead
03-25-2013, 02:02 PM
Tubby to UCLA? Hard to believe Minnesota fired him. 20 wins in 5 of his 6 seasons. Not sure what they expect.

True, true. Looks like the Gophers are gettin' too big for thier golden britches. (Can't help but love the word britches.) Seemed like this year was a big step in the right direction and one to build upon. Why shake it up now? Are Minnesota's expections really that high?

TexHawk
03-25-2013, 02:03 PM
I'm really not looking for an argument. I simply feel that Brad Stevens is a better coach than Shaka Smart and that his brand of basketball will translate better in a bigger conference. Two tournaments in a row now Smart's defense has unraveled against better, faster, more athletic teams. It could be that if he were at a better school where he can attract better talent -- like Nolan Richardson at Arkansas -- that the havoc system would be even more effective. But I just think it'd be a hard sell with today's kids. Havoc is a lot more extreme than what Oregon or Louisville does. It is Arkansas on steroids.

They unraveled two tournaments in a row? In 2012, as a #12, VCU upset #5 seed Wichita State. In the next, they led #4 Indiana for the majority of the game, only to lose by two on a jumper from Will Sheehey in the final minute.

I fail to see how that invalidates an entire system. They were 12 seconds away from a Sweet 16 matchup with Kentucky one year after making the Final 4.

johnb
03-25-2013, 02:04 PM
Chris is from Chicago, but moving back hasn't seemed like a huge priority.

He seems to enjoy warm weather. He has a dad who knows his way around the NBA. He has coached or played with dozens of NBA players, including the Olympic team. He has been the primary assistant at Duke for years. He's solid, scandal free, and looks more like a movie star than the typical coach. I'm thinking he'd be a great fit for UCLA. Obviously, UCLA might prefer someone who has more thoroughly vetted themselves as a head coach. But coaching at a mid major (e.g., VCU or Butler) means you shape mid-major talent for 4 years, and 20 games per year are completely below the national radar. Coaching at UCLA is as fishbowl as it gets--it combines the expectations of Kentucky, Duke, or Kansas with national media outlets.

I don't know Collins or his goals, but, if I wanted a job where the administration would let me recruit most of the top players but where the overall academic reputation is high, where the types of possible recruits are basically at the Kentucky/Duke level, and where I could walk around in flips flops in April, I'd take the job in a minute. And when it came to controlling the junk that goes into recruiting the top players, he can fall back on his experience with Duke recruits as well as his pro connections. I'd think it much more fun to manage the Shabazz Express (or decide to recruit a slightly different player), for example, than try to make a top 200 player into a top 100 player who can compete against the top 20 players who will be the foci of every other team in your league (as would be the case at Northwestern)

And it's a MUCH better basketball job than Stanford, which is renowned for being unusually difficult when it comes to admissions. If Northwestern wouldn't take some of our players, Stanford would be even less likely to let them in. Harvard is harder, but Amaker got concessions before agreeing to coach there; that led to some widespread irritation around the Ivy League, but his results are clearly positive.

Cameron
03-25-2013, 02:04 PM
True, true. Looks like the Gophers are gettin' too big for thier golden britches. (Can't help but love the word britches.) Seemed like this year was a big step in the right direction and one to build upon. Why shake it up now? Are Minnesota's expections really that high?

It's championship or bust in the Land of 10,000 Lakes apparently. They mean serious bizness.

moonpie23
03-25-2013, 02:20 PM
Cal is a rockstar in LEXINGTON KY...........with footsteps closing in, being a rockstar in LA should be pret-ty glittery to him right now....

he's already "restored" UK to greatness...

wilko
03-25-2013, 02:24 PM
Googled to find out more about Tubby and saw where Goodman mentioned "Villa 7" in his article. Didn't know what that was so looked it up:

http://www.nooga.com/155045/villa-seven-at-the-axis-of-ncaa-coaching-carousel/

So its an AAU system for Coaches..?

SoCalDukeFan
03-25-2013, 02:39 PM
Minnesota AD is Norwood Teague who was hired from VCU.
Shaka Smart to Minnesota is a possibility.

I don't see Tubby at UCLA, but he might be great for USC. High character guy, which they need, good coach. Get an assisant who knows LA to handle recruiting and they would be in good shape.

To me the big problem at UCLA is the AD - Dan Guerrero. What exactly were the expectations did he lay out for Howland and what support did he give him? The reputation of the school should matter as much as winning. It is really too bad that the pressure of winning caused Howland to put up with some difficult to handle recruits and their families. I think Howland had reached the end of his rope at UCLA but DG just let him hang.

SoCal

brevity
03-25-2013, 03:14 PM
Googled to find out more about Tubby and saw where Goodman mentioned "Villa 7" in his article. Didn't know what that was so looked it up:

http://www.nooga.com/155045/villa-seven-at-the-axis-of-ncaa-coaching-carousel/

Great find. It's like the Six Sigma of coaching. Quoted in part:


VCU was the beneficiary of its own ingenuity after Grant left to take the Alabama job. Yet another Donovan assistant, Shaka Smart, was already on the radar screen.

“They could’ve hired any assistant coach in the country,” Smart told Michael Litos, author of Cinderella: Inside the Rise of Mid-Major College Basketball. “I’m not the type of guy you meet one time and people come away with ‘that guy is unbelievable.’ I’m not super flashy. That two-year opportunity to develop my relationship certainly helped strengthen my profile in Norwood’s mind.”

I'm totally reading that book.

Jim3k
03-25-2013, 03:40 PM
True, true. Looks like the Gophers are gettin' too big for thier golden britches. (Can't help but love the word britches.) Seemed like this year was a big step in the right direction and one to build upon. Why shake it up now? Are Minnesota's expections really that high?

I smell a new AD trying to put his own imprint on his program. This firing has nothing to do with Smith's capabilities as a HC. He's too good to fire.

But now, Smith suddenly becomes a hot property: UCLA, Northwestern, maybe some underperforming colleges looking to step back up--Washington comes to mind. I'm sure there are others.

sporthenry
03-25-2013, 03:44 PM
True, true. Looks like the Gophers are gettin' too big for thier golden britches. (Can't help but love the word britches.) Seemed like this year was a big step in the right direction and one to build upon. Why shake it up now? Are Minnesota's expections really that high?

I agree. It is probably tough to hear from a fan's perspective but UM isn't exactly a hot landing spot. I guess they think they can get Shaka but I'd be very surprised to see that. Tubby has been to the NCAAT 3 of his 6 years there. Prior to him getting there, they went once in the previous 7 years. Tubby is responsible for 30% of their NCAA berths since the tourney expanded to 64 teams.

Mal
03-25-2013, 05:16 PM
I agree. It is probably tough to hear from a fan's perspective but UM isn't exactly a hot landing spot. I guess they think they can get Shaka but I'd be very surprised to see that. Tubby has been to the NCAAT 3 of his 6 years there. Prior to him getting there, they went once in the previous 7 years. Tubby is responsible for 30% of their NCAA berths since the tourney expanded to 64 teams.

This is quite right, and I say that as a native 'sotan whose parents have had Gopher season tickets for 40 years, and who would like to think highly of the program. They've been to four Sweet 16's (ever), forfeited their one Final Four appearance, and haven't been consistently better than average since the late '70's - early '80's and the first couple years of Haskins' tenure. Sounds a lot like, I don't know, UVa or similar, except for the forfeited Final Four appearance. There are 7 teams with higher profiles and better track records of success in the B1G, and in another year that will be 8. That's not the kind of program Shaka Smart goes to. Shaka goes to a place where he can lever up to a top 10 or 15 historical program within 5 years.

Tubby was a gift who fell into Minnesota's lap after slipping out of the encroaching tentacles of the Kentucky fan base. He has, on the one hand, seemed a little disengaged at times, and like he might just be cruising toward retirement. And he did clearly fail to get as much juice out of this year's orange, which is a very talented bunch of players with a lot of diverse skill sets and without a ton of injury or health issues, than a good coach should have. On the other hand, he did assemble this team from nothing when he took over, they did make the tournament, and win a game.

I will say sporthenry should discount the 7 years prior to Tubby's arrival at least a bit, since the first half of that was putting things back together after the Haskins academic scandal debacle crippled the program. That said, 4 Sweet Sixteens in history and one Final Four that's been vacated.

I think Jim3K's right, although I wouldn't say it has nothing to do with the job Tubby actually did. Just not mostly that. The new AD has big plans and they don't include the old guy.

tommy
03-25-2013, 05:47 PM
I smell a new AD trying to put his own imprint on his program. This firing has nothing to do with Smith's capabilities as a HC. He's too good to fire.

But now, Smith suddenly becomes a hot property: UCLA, Northwestern, maybe some underperforming colleges looking to step back up--Washington comes to mind. I'm sure there are others.

I don't see UCLA or Washington. Tubby has no ties whatsoever to the west coast. He's been as far west as Tulsa and as far north as Minnesota, but the rest of his career, and his personal roots, are in the south and on the east coast. Hard to imagine him, at age 61, starting fresh in brand new territory. I like him, though, and hope he gets a good gig that he can ride into retirement whenever he's ready -- maybe an SEC or an ACC job when one opens. Wake Forest, if they get rid of Bzdelik, which I don't think they will, or should?

sporthenry
03-25-2013, 06:32 PM
This is quite right, and I say that as a native 'sotan whose parents have had Gopher season tickets for 40 years, and who would like to think highly of the program. They've been to four Sweet 16's (ever), forfeited their one Final Four appearance, and haven't been consistently better than average since the late '70's - early '80's and the first couple years of Haskins' tenure. Sounds a lot like, I don't know, UVa or similar, except for the forfeited Final Four appearance. There are 7 teams with higher profiles and better track records of success in the B1G, and in another year that will be 8. That's not the kind of program Shaka Smart goes to. Shaka goes to a place where he can lever up to a top 10 or 15 historical program within 5 years.

Tubby was a gift who fell into Minnesota's lap after slipping out of the encroaching tentacles of the Kentucky fan base. He has, on the one hand, seemed a little disengaged at times, and like he might just be cruising toward retirement. And he did clearly fail to get as much juice out of this year's orange, which is a very talented bunch of players with a lot of diverse skill sets and without a ton of injury or health issues, than a good coach should have. On the other hand, he did assemble this team from nothing when he took over, they did make the tournament, and win a game.

I will say sporthenry should discount the 7 years prior to Tubby's arrival at least a bit, since the first half of that was putting things back together after the Haskins academic scandal debacle crippled the program. That said, 4 Sweet Sixteens in history and one Final Four that's been vacated.

I think Jim3K's right, although I wouldn't say it has nothing to do with the job Tubby actually did. Just not mostly that. The new AD has big plans and they don't include the old guy.

Fair enough about the time before Tubby. I'm not as versed in their history, but even with Tubby underachieving, they could very well end up worse off after all of this. People that go to these types of programs are guys like Groce. Not that there is anything wrong with Groce and their next guy could turn out great, but odds are they take a step back at least in the short term and then they have to hope the coach is the real deal. Names I've heard were Howland, who probably has a higher ceiling than Tubby but could crash and burn and Buzz Williams who doesn't seem like a huge upgrade.

As for Shaka, apart from having ties to Teague, I don't know how he goes to Minnesota. As it stands now, he is a big fish in a small pond. He is able to get very good talent and his system works in the mid-majors ranks. I think havoc can work in BCS conferences but he'll need good talent and that is why I'd think he'd want to go somewhere where the school name alone will recruit itself. He goes to UM and falls on his face, he loses his shot at a bigger program. He goes to UCLA or UNC and by name alone, he'll get top talent.

gocanes0506
03-25-2013, 06:46 PM
I think we will see either Shaka or Stevens going to UCLA. I dont see any of the other major colleges coaches wanting to go to UCLA. I dont see many UCLA would want to go after and ones that have ties to UCLA.

The FGCU coach could go to Minnesota. He was an assistant in Milwaukee for the Bucks (I know thats in Wisconsin but he has atleast been in the region of the country before).

Mal
03-25-2013, 06:46 PM
People that go to these types of programs are guys like Groce. Not that there is anything wrong with Groce and their next guy could turn out great, but odds are they take a step back at least in the short term and then they have to hope the coach is the real deal. Names I've heard were Howland, who probably has a higher ceiling than Tubby but could crash and burn and Buzz Williams who doesn't seem like a huge upgrade.

I think that's right, and that it's a risk. I would rather they had let Tubby continue to build the stability and better-than-mediocrity a few more years, and then take their time finding someone to take them to the next level. Now they're likely to end up scrambling for an up and comer that's a 50/50 crash and burn proposition, and will just bolt if they do better than expected. And in the meantime, they probably miss out entirely on a once in a generation crop of local talent. Which, by the way, if any of it ends up down Interstate 94 in Madison, might bring people to burn down Williams Arena out of frustration.

As for Howland, he's been to three consecutive Final Fours with one of the most distinguished and storied programs in college basketball. He'd take a few years off and show up on TV before he settled for Minnesota, I would think. Buzz Williams I could see - it's closer to a lateral move, as he's made Marquette into an annual factor and really done a nice job there, but could be nervous about the new Big East and might want more resources than Marquette can offer. I don't get the feeling he's got any intention of leaving at the moment.

hurleyfor3
03-25-2013, 08:05 PM
The complete list of active coaches with more FFs than Howland is: K, Roy, Izzo, Pitino, Calipari. Strike Cal if you don't count vacations.

The more I think about Ucla's decision, the more ridiculous it seems.

Why wouldn't Shaka or Brad agree?

sbroc012
03-25-2013, 08:23 PM
I would be shocked if Stevens left Butler, next year Butler is in a power conference, they will be in the new Big East, this guy is gonna start getting whatever recruits he wants in the near future. I very well can see Butler becoming the "Duke" of the midwest very soon. Stevens isn't going anywhere. Besides who in their right mind would want to go to UCLA? The way they treated Howland the last couple of years should steer most coaches away.

burnspbesq
03-25-2013, 09:05 PM
I smell a new AD trying to put his own imprint on his program. This firing has nothing to do with Smith's capabilities as a HC. He's too good to fire.

But now, Smith suddenly becomes a hot property: UCLA, Northwestern, maybe some underperforming colleges looking to step back up--Washington comes to mind. I'm sure there are others.

Romar's contract at U-Dub runs through the 2019-20 season at a reported $1.7 million per. Unless some alum or booster steps up to fund a buyout, the Huskies aren't looking for a new coach.

burnspbesq
03-25-2013, 09:12 PM
Andy Enfield will end up taking one of these high-profile jobs. His market value is never going to be higher than it is right now, and he's got the same thing going for him that Carmody had when he left Princeton to go to Northwestern, i.e., the "imagine what he could do with elite talent" intangible.

The other guy who will be on every short list is Gregg Marshall. Forget what he's done at Wichita State: the guy won at Winthrop, for cryin' out loud.

tbyers11
03-25-2013, 09:19 PM
The complete list of active coaches with more FFs than Howland is: K, Roy, Izzo, Pitino, Calipari. Strike Cal if you don't count vacations.

The more I think about Ucla's decision, the more ridiculous it seems.


I would be shocked if Stevens left Butler, next year Butler is in a power conference, they will be in the new Big East, this guy is gonna start getting whatever recruits he wants in the near future. I very well can see Butler becoming the "Duke" of the midwest very soon. Stevens isn't going anywhere. Besides who in their right mind would want to go to UCLA? The way they treated Howland the last couple of years should steer most coaches away.

Are you guys forgetting this scathing indictment (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/magazine/02/28/ucla/1.html) from SI in Feb 2012 about the mess that Howland's program had become. I was under the impression that the Muhammad/Anderson etc recruiting class bought him a year or two to prove himself. UCLA ended up winning the Pac12 reg season and a 6 seed but with all that talent I still think they underachieved a fair bit. With Shabazz gone, Parker likely transferring and Anderson undecided the future isn't too bright.

JasonEvans
03-25-2013, 09:24 PM
I wonder if Greg McDermott at Creighton gets some attention. His son is seen by everyone as a mid-first round draft pick and is likely to leave for NBA riches. Creighton moves into the new Big East next year, but I wonder if Greg may want to go to a bigger program. Minnesota perhaps?

I think it would be a foolish hire. Greg was not much of a coach at all when he was at Iowa St. He basically fled to Creighton before Iowa St could fire him. His Creighton tenure has all been with his son leading the team to major heights. Who knows how good they will be once Doug moves on?

-Jason "if UCLA calls on Brad Stevens, would he really turn it down?" Evans

OldPhiKap
03-25-2013, 09:35 PM
-Jason "if UCLA calls on Brad Stevens, would he really turn it down?" Evans

Hard to think of a non-Duke asketbsll guy I'd like to sit down and talk to. No idea what really drives his ambition wagon. But I really like his demeanor, skill and aura. Kid has "it" in spades.

weezie
03-25-2013, 11:01 PM
I wonder if Greg McDermott at Creighton gets some attention. His son is seen by everyone as a mid-first round draft pick and is likely to leave for NBA riches.

Really? I don't follow the draft stuff until it is upon us but that's interesting. He's money on the free throw line but really not that big, NBA style. He's darned handsome, that's for sure. Not super fast for his height, but maybe he's just held back by the rest of his team.
It's such a weak year though...

tommy
03-26-2013, 01:46 AM
Really? I don't follow the draft stuff until it is upon us but that's interesting. He's money on the free throw line but really not that big, NBA style. He's darned handsome, that's for sure. Not super fast for his height, but maybe he's just held back by the rest of his team.
It's such a weak year though...

Getting off topic a bit, but Doug McDermott is 6'8" 225 lbs. He's plenty big enough to play in the NBA, especially given that he's a deadeye shooter who moves well without the ball and who can also work in the post. If he can defend, he'll be a player.

FerryFor50
03-26-2013, 02:15 AM
Getting off topic a bit, but Doug McDermott is 6'8" 225 lbs. He's plenty big enough to play in the NBA, especially given that he's a deadeye shooter who moves well without the ball and who can also work in the post. If he can defend, he'll be a player.

If Kyle Korver could have a decent NBA career, so can Doug McDermott. Plus McDermott rebounds better. Could be a David Lee type of player.

luburch
03-26-2013, 09:35 AM
ESPN actually just took each team in the tournament and previewed the top NBA prospects from each team. I would link it but it's an insider article. I'll list the Sweet 16 teams below

Indiana
Lottery: Oladipo, Zeller
Potential 2nd Rounder: Watford
Wait until next year: Yogi Ferrell, Hanner Perea

Miami
Potential 2nd rounder: Kadji, Scott, Johnson
Wait until next year: Larkin

Marquette
Potential 2nd rounder: Vander Blue, Davante Gardner

Syracuse
Lottery: Carter-Williams
Potential 2nd rounder: CJ Fair, James Southerland
Wait until next year: DaJuan Coleman, Rakeem Christmas, Baye Keita

Louisville
1st rounder: Gorgui Dieng
Potential 2nd rounder: Smith, Siva
Wait until next year: Wayne Blackshear, Chane Behanan, Montrezl Harrell

Oregon
Potential 2nd rounders: Kazemi, Woods
Wait until next year: Dominic Artis, Damyean Dotson

Michigan State
Lottery: Gary Harris
Potential 2nd rounder: Payne, Appling
Wait until next year: Branden Dawson

Duke
Lottery: Plumlee
Potential 2nd rounder: Kelly, Curry
Wait until next year: Sheed, Cook, Jefferson, MP3

Wichita State
Potential 2nd rounder: Carl Hall

La Salle
Wait until next year: Jerrell Wright

Arizona
Potential 2nd rounder: Solomon Hill
Wait until next year: Tarczewski, Ashley, Jerret, Johnson

Ohio State
Potential 2nd rounders: Thomas, Craft
Wait until next year: LaQuinton Ross

Kansas
Lottery: McLemore
1st round: Withey
Potential 2nd rounder: Elijah Johnson, Kevin Young
Wait until next year: Perry Ellis, Jamari Traylor

Michigan
Lottery: Burke
1st round: Robinson III
Potential 2nd rounder: Hardaway Jr
Wait until next year: McGary, Stauskas

Florida
1st round: Patrick Young
Potential 2nd rounder: Erik Murphy, Kenny Boynton Jr
Wait until next year: Scottie Wilbekin, Casey Prather

FGCU
None

weezie
03-26-2013, 09:39 AM
If Kyle Korver could have a decent NBA career, so can Doug McDermott. Plus McDermott rebounds better. Could be a David Lee type of player.

True. I stand corrected with that reference.

MartyClark
03-26-2013, 10:42 AM
I think Tad Boyle, the Colorado coach, is starting to appear on the radar of some of the schools needing a coach. He has has done a good job recruiting and a better job of reviving interest in a moribund basketball program. Colorado had a number of sold out crowds this year. Boyle played, actually sat on the bench, at Kansas.

brevity
03-26-2013, 11:05 AM
I'm calling it now. Thank me later.

UCLA: Jim Boeheim, former Syracuse head coach ("It was time for a change.")
USC: Mike Hopkins, former Syracuse assistant coach ("I wanted to be near Jim.")
Minnesota: Mark Few, former Gonzaga head coach ("Well, it worked out so well for Dan Monson.")
Northwestern: Chris Collins, former Duke assistant coach ("I've already mastered the halftime soundbite.")
Syracuse: Dr. John Giannini, former LaSalle head coach ("How many advanced degrees did Boeheim have? Anyone?")
Gonzaga: Andy Enfield, former FGCU head coach ("Like this team. Needs more dunking, though.")
LaSalle: Tim Legler, former ESPN pro basketball commentator and former LaSalle player ("It was me or Lionel Simmons, and he already said no.")
FGCU: Steve Wojciechowski, former Duke assistant coach ("My experience coaching big men will keep Fort Myers looking like Lob City.")

And Nate James moves up the bench.

TruBlu
03-26-2013, 11:11 AM
I'm calling it now. Thank me later.

UCLA: Jim Boeheim, former Syracuse head coach ("It was time for a change.")
USC: Mike Hopkins, former Syracuse assistant coach ("I wanted to be near Jim.")
Minnesota: Mark Few, former Gonzaga head coach ("Well, it worked out so well for Dan Monson.")
Northwestern: Chris Collins, former Duke assistant coach ("I've already mastered the halftime soundbite.")
Syracuse: Dr. John Giannini, former LaSalle head coach ("How many advanced degrees did Boeheim have? Anyone?")
Gonzaga: Andy Enfield, former FGCU head coach ("Like this team. Needs more dunking, though.")
LaSalle: Tim Legler, former ESPN pro basketball commentator and former LaSalle player ("It was me or Lionel Simmons, and he already said no.")
FGCU: Steve Wojciechowski, former Duke assistant coach ("My experience coaching big men will keep Fort Myers looking like Lob City.")

And Nate James moves up the bench.

Gotta correct you on the bolded (above):

UCLA: Sylvia Hatchel, former UNC female head coach ("I already have the ugly pale blue outfits")

tele
03-26-2013, 11:38 AM
I'm calling it now. Thank me later.

UCLA: Jim Boeheim, former Syracuse head coach ("It was time for a change.")
USC: Mike Hopkins, former Syracuse assistant coach ("I wanted to be near Jim.")
Minnesota: Mark Few, former Gonzaga head coach ("Well, it worked out so well for Dan Monson.")
Northwestern: Chris Collins, former Duke assistant coach ("I've already mastered the halftime soundbite.")
Syracuse: Dr. John Giannini, former LaSalle head coach ("How many advanced degrees did Boeheim have? Anyone?")
Gonzaga: Andy Enfield, former FGCU head coach ("Like this team. Needs more dunking, though.")
LaSalle: Tim Legler, former ESPN pro basketball commentator and former LaSalle player ("It was me or Lionel Simmons, and he already said no.")
FGCU: Steve Wojciechowski, former Duke assistant coach ("My experience coaching big men will keep Fort Myers looking like Lob City.")

And Nate James moves up the bench.

Sounding like you have the northwestern one right, Coach C interviewed there yesterday, people are saying it went well and it's his job if he wants it. I'd be surprised if he doesn't take it, bird in hand and all that. Evanston's campus is on the coast with beaches just like FGCU, you can ice skate there too.

CDu
03-26-2013, 11:48 AM
If Kyle Korver could have a decent NBA career, so can Doug McDermott. Plus McDermott rebounds better. Could be a David Lee type of player.

Lee is a far more athletic guy than McDermott, not to mention that he's a little bigger (6'9" with a 7'0" wingspan). I'd say McDermott is closer to Korver than he is to Lee. In fact, I think McDermott could be a rich man's Korver (elite catch-and-shoot guy at SF).

CDu
03-26-2013, 11:53 AM
Sounding like you have the northwestern one right, Coach C interviewed there yesterday, people are saying it went well and it's his job if he wants it. I'd be surprised if he doesn't take it, bird in hand and all that. Evanston's campus is on the coast with beaches just like FGCU, you can ice skate there too.

As a Gulf Coast Floridian who has spent a fair number of days in Chicago, I chuckled to myself at this post.

That said, it does sound like Collins may go there. Would be an interesting situation if he took that job. On the one hand, he'd have little pressure to actually do well (nobody expects Northwestern to compete in the Big-10). On the other hand, he'll have the deck stacked against him (there are a lot of well-established programs in the conference that he'll have to compete with for recruits).

However, one interesting aspect is that it could pave the way for Collins to eventually take over for Coach K. He could coach in the Chicago area and further establish his recruiting connections there. Then, when Coach K eventually retires, he could come to Duke and maintain the already strong Chicago recruiting connections that we have (Coach K doesn't lose on Chicagoland recruits).

Bluedog
03-26-2013, 12:12 PM
Sounding like you have the northwestern one right, Coach C interviewed there yesterday, people are saying it went well and it's his job if he wants it. I'd be surprised if he doesn't take it, bird in hand and all that. Evanston's campus is on the coast with beaches just like FGCU, you can ice skate there too.


As a Gulf Coast Floridian who has spent a fair number of days in Chicago, I chuckled to myself at this post.

haha, I was thinking the same thing. As somebody who has lived in Evanston in the past, it's absolutely nothing like south Florida. The "beach" near Northwestern's campus is basically a bunch of rocks...although there are some areas with sand. But it's certainly not like a Miami beach and you can only take advantage of it in the summer when classes aren't in session (although Northwestern doesn't get out until like mid-June, so perhaps during finals week you can chill on the beach ;) ).

CDu
03-26-2013, 12:24 PM
haha, I was thinking the same thing. As somebody who has lived in Evanston in the past, it's absolutely nothing like south Florida. The "beach" near Northwestern's campus is basically a bunch of rocks...although there are some areas with sand. But it's certainly not like a Miami beach and you can only take advantage of it in the summer when classes aren't in session (although Northwestern doesn't get out until like mid-June, so perhaps during finals week you can chill on the beach ;) ).

And to compound that, the beaches on the Gulf Coast are in my opinion WAY nicer than the beaches on the Atlantic Coast. Of course, Miami has better... umm... scenery than Fort Myers has, that's for sure. But if you're looking for pristine, soft, white sand beaches, the Gulf Coast is the way to go. Neither the Atlantic nor Pacific compare, in my opinion. Unless you're looking for big waves - then the Gulf Coast is a distant third.

HaveFunExpectToWin
03-26-2013, 12:27 PM
Sounding like you have the northwestern one right, Coach C interviewed there yesterday, people are saying it went well and it's his job if he wants it. I'd be surprised if he doesn't take it, bird in hand and all that. Evanston's campus is on the coast with beaches just like FGCU, you can ice skate there too.

FGCU's "beach" is really on a lake not the Gulf, but I imagine the view isn't bad at all. Fort Myers Beach is only about 30-45 min away however.

I'm actually headed down there tomorrow. Might have to pick up a t-shirt to wear around Georgetown.

Indoor66
03-26-2013, 12:51 PM
FGCU's "beach" is really on a lake not the Gulf, but I imagine the view isn't bad at all. Fort Myers Beach is only about 30-45 min away however.

I'm actually headed down there tomorrow. Might have to pick up a t-shirt to wear around Georgetown.

Actually, Fort Meyers Beach is about 19 miles and 35 minutes from the Campus and Sanibel Island is about 24 miles and about 40 minutes. I GUARANTEE you that the beaches outshine those on the big lake to the north near Northwestern!

Mal
03-26-2013, 01:19 PM
haha, I was thinking the same thing. As somebody who has lived in Evanston in the past, it's absolutely nothing like south Florida. The "beach" near Northwestern's campus is basically a bunch of rocks...although there are some areas with sand. But it's certainly not like a Miami beach and you can only take advantage of it in the summer when classes aren't in session (although Northwestern doesn't get out until like mid-June, so perhaps during finals week you can chill on the beach ;) ).

Surely y'all realize that was tongue in cheek from tele, right? The ice skating line was the giveaway if one was needed.

CDu
03-26-2013, 01:21 PM
Surely y'all realize that was tongue in cheek from tele, right? The ice skating line was the giveaway if one was needed.

Yes, that's why I said it made me chuckle.

Mal
03-26-2013, 01:28 PM
Yes, that's why I said it made me chuckle.

I figured. Guess I should have replaced the "y'all" with "you" for Bluedog, who seemed dead serious in the response. That you then engaged in a discussion of the relative merits of East Coast vs. West Coast Florida beaches (for the record, I'm on your side - Atlantic beaches in Florida pale in comparison to the Gulf) made me wonder, though. :)

Bluedog
03-26-2013, 01:50 PM
I figured. Guess I should have replaced the "y'all" with "you" for Bluedog, who seemed dead serious in the response. That you then engaged in a discussion of the relative merits of East Coast vs. West Coast Florida beaches (for the record, I'm on your side - Atlantic beaches in Florida pale in comparison to the Gulf) made me wonder, though. :)

Yes, I'll admit I wasn't 100% sure if it was tongue in cheek or not. I have actually heard people talk about "living on the water" as a positive attribute when deciding to attend Northwestern in the past, so it escaped me. My bad.

Mal
03-26-2013, 02:54 PM
Yes, I'll admit I wasn't 100% sure if it was tongue in cheek or not. I have actually heard people talk about "living on the water" as a positive attribute when deciding to attend Northwestern in the past, so it escaped me. My bad.

Yeah, no worries. I will note that, as NW does sit directly on the shore of Lake Michigan, and Lake Michigan is to non-Midwesterners a significantly larger body of water than you probably think (my office in downtown Chicago's on the 51st floor and while I can see Indiana from here, I cannot see across the lake to Michigan), the campus is, in fact, in a very nice location. It has a lot more natural beauty to recommend it than your average Midwestern school set in a town of 100,000 or whatever Evanston is. You don't get to really use the beach, but looking out the window of a classroom at the lake is an intangible that adds to the experience of being there, and looks good in brochures. On the flip side, NW is a little hemmed in, as a campus, by the lake on one side and Sheridan Road on the other. If they'd just had the foresight to buy up all the land for another 6 blocks west a hundred years ago, we might be talking about one of the best college settings in America.

HaveFunExpectToWin
03-26-2013, 03:18 PM
Actually, Fort Meyers Beach is about 19 miles and 35 minutes from the Campus and Sanibel Island is about 24 miles and about 40 minutes. I GUARANTEE you that the beaches outshine those on the big lake to the north near Northwestern!

Right, but they also have a "beach" right next to the dorms with tiki huts, right? FMB looks like little more wild though.

I'll be in Bonita Springs/Naples for the week.

Duvall
03-26-2013, 03:59 PM
Bobby Hurley to Buffalo? (https://mobile.twitter.com/TBNSully/status/316637436186857472?p=v)

NSDukeFan
03-26-2013, 04:17 PM
Bobby Hurley to Buffalo? (https://mobile.twitter.com/TBNSully/status/316637436186857472?p=v)

I love the first comment:
@byErikBrady Maybe Bobby Hurley thinks Christian Laettners grow on trees in Buffalo...

burnspbesq
03-26-2013, 06:40 PM
Right, but they also have a "beach" right next to the dorms with tiki huts, right? FMB looks like little more wild though.

I'll be in Bonita Springs/Naples for the week.

If you want to go to school at the beach, no place beats UC Santa Barbara.

Jim3k
03-26-2013, 09:30 PM
Here's a recrimination article from a moderately savvy newspaper in Spartanburg, SC lamenting former South Carolina coach Darrin Horn's decision to run a player off. South Carolina missed an opportunity with Galloway (http://www.goupstate.com/article/20130325/ARTICLES/130329765/0/wire). LaSalle's Ramon Galloway has become a hot property this year, leading his team to the NCAA Regionals. He used to play for South Carolina. Apparently Horn didn't know what sort of talent Galloway was back in 2011 and thought he would do better with some incoming freshmen. So Horn ran Galloway off. A year later Horn is fired and Galloway is in the Sweet Sixteen. I see some irony in all this. But...what the hey...South Carolina basketball has never been about good decision-making. Right, Frank McGuire?

And a Spartanburg publication making the connection? -- Unlikely source, but good for them; well done.

And Darrin Horn? On sabbatical and awaiting an opening (http://www.kentucky.com/2012/09/02/2320356/mark-story-ex-creeker-and-college.html). Don't hold your breath, Darrin. The carousel may be rotating, but I don't think they'll let you ride.

BlueDevilBrowns
03-26-2013, 10:41 PM
Remove Josh Pastner from the potential candidates list:

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/26/usc-ucla-out-of-luck-as-josh-pastner-reportedly-signs-extension-with-memphis/

I doubt he was ever the #1 choice for any school, but I'm sure he was on the top of the 2nd tier options for most of them. Smart move by Memphis to go ahead and lock him up before things got too serious.

WiJoe
03-26-2013, 10:41 PM
"Northwestern zeroes in on Duke's Chris Collins"

http://www.csnchicago.com/blog/kapman/northwestern-zeroes-dukes-chris-collins

kaplan, who makes it sound like it's a done deal, has pretty good sources. He's still not the most accurate fellow on earth. Likes to hear himself talk, and has ample opportunities in Chicago. Of course, it does make sense for Chris to be leading candidate. If you don't watch the video, you'll miss the fact the host says Jon Scheyer "might have some role" on Collins' staff.

All FWIW

Tappan Zee Devil
03-26-2013, 11:04 PM
"Northwestern zeroes in on Duke's Chris Collins"

http://www.csnchicago.com/blog/kapman/northwestern-zeroes-dukes-chris-collins

kaplan, who makes it sound like it's a done deal, has pretty good sources. He's still not the most accurate fellow on earth. Likes to hear himself talk, and has ample opportunities in Chicago. Of course, it does make sense for Chris to be leading candidate. If you don't watch the video, you'll miss the fact the host says Jon Scheyer "might have some role" on Collins' staff.

All FWIW

My daughter, who lives in Chicago, told me that her boyfriend, who went to NWU and has connections in the NW Athletic Dept. said that it is a done deal. So of course it will happen ;)
Again just FWIW

Also FWIW, he is very excited about the prospect.

luburch
03-26-2013, 11:05 PM
The Hurley hire is official per ESPN

BD80
03-27-2013, 09:05 AM
"Northwestern zeroes in on Duke's Chris Collins"

http://www.csnchicago.com/blog/kapman/northwestern-zeroes-dukes-chris-collins

kaplan, who makes it sound like it's a done deal, has pretty good sources. He's still not the most accurate fellow on earth. Likes to hear himself talk, and has ample opportunities in Chicago. Of course, it does make sense for Chris to be leading candidate. If you don't watch the video, you'll miss the fact the host says Jon Scheyer "might have some role" on Collins' staff.

All FWIW

I think it would be kinda cool for Chris to hire Tubby as an assistant for a year or so. Tubby has integrity, experience, a solid reputation, midwest ties, Big10/11/12/? experience. It might work for Tubby to wait a year or so for another gig, and would let him kick a little sand in Minnesota's face by helping NW recruit kids he's been working on.

If Chris leaves, that will likely lead to a substantial turnover in our staff, as he would likely take another assistant with him. That would bump CC and Nate up the ladder (here or with Chris). Hopefully it also brings Paulus into the fold. Vince Taylor was on Tubby's staff, and would be a good fit here or at NW.

devilsadvocate85
03-27-2013, 09:14 AM
Would you be shocked if Doug joined Chris at Northwestern? He's likely done with the 76ers.


I think it would be kinda cool for Chris to hire Tubby as an assistant for a year or so. Tubby has integrity, experience, a solid reputation, midwest ties, Big10/11/12/? experience. It might work for Tubby to wait a year or so for another gig, and would let him kick a little sand in Minnesota's face by helping NW recruit kids he's been working on.

If Chris leaves, that will likely lead to a substantial turnover in our staff, as he would likely take another assistant with him. That would bump CC and Nate up the ladder (here or with Chris). Hopefully it also brings Paulus into the fold. Vince Taylor was on Tubby's staff, and would be a good fit here or at NW.

davekay1971
03-27-2013, 09:57 AM
I was surprised to see the Gott to UCLA link on the front page. Despite the zagsblog story, I thought this was still pretty much in the rumor-mill category. If UCLA does take on Gott with his large buyout plus whatever salary it would take to entice Gott there, it would surprise me. Gott has two data points so far on his coaching resume: an arc at Alabama that included raising the program up transiently before it declined back down to mediocrity, and now a 2 year arc at State of upgrading the talent (although CJL, Howell, Brown, and Wood were all Lowe recruits), yet still underperforming (although not as badly as the Lowe teams did). Gott has State moving in the right direction, but one has yet to see if, unlike at Alabama, he can sustain it, and, unlike last season, he can get the most out of the talent on hand.

I'm not slamming the guy or saying he's a bad coach. But he has yet to establish a track record worthy of the kind of money it would take UCLA to get him. And, if he does go, Archie Miller, if State went after him and could get him, might be a much happier long term marriage for the Pack.

Cameron
03-27-2013, 10:09 AM
Northwestern has hired Chris Collins as their next basketball coach. (http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/27/report-northwestern-has-hired-chris-collins-as-their-head-coach/)

Sad to see Chris go, but excited for his opportunity.

Duvall
03-27-2013, 07:54 PM
Shaka, with wallet bulging. (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-basketball/news/20130327/vcu-shaka-smart/)


VCU head coach Shaka Smart has turned down an opportunity to join UCLA, informing them today that he'll be staying with the Rams, according to a source with direct knowledge of the situation.

Smart has let UCLA know he accepted a contract extension and will be staying in Richmond. VCU is expected to announce formally Smart's contract extension in the next 24 hours. The deal will go through the year 2023 and will pay him approximately $1.5 million per year, up from the $1.2 million he'd been making.

nyesq83
03-28-2013, 01:53 AM
Northwestern has hired Chris Collins as their next basketball coach. (http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/27/report-northwestern-has-hired-chris-collins-as-their-head-coach/)

Sad to see Chris go, but excited for his opportunity.

I am just as excited that Shaka Smart is staying at VCU. There was a USA Today article last week that stated Smart was not a fan of the excessive branding efforts, but to further rebut the "facts" of your earlier opinion:

Pete Thamel>INSIDE COLLEGE BASKETBALL (SI.com), here is the whole article, Cameron aka Don Imus Face:

VCU's Shaka Smart turns down UCLA, signs contract extension

VCU head coach Shaka Smart has turned down an opportunity to join UCLA, informing the Bruins today that he'll be staying with the Rams, according to a source with direct knowledge of the situation.

Smart has let UCLA know he accepted a contract extension and will be staying in Richmond. VCU is expected to announce formally Smart's contract extension in the next 24 hours. The deal will go through 2023 and will pay him approximately $1.5 million per year, up from the $1.2 million he'd been making.

A majority of what Smart asked VCU for was improvements for his staff and program. That includes more salary for his staff and a bevy of things like better meals for players, improved travel for the program and other perks for his staff.

With Smart's name bandied about at job openings at UCLA, USC and Minnesota, his choice to stay at VCU shows his belief that he can win there long term. He's resisted other overtures the past few seasons, including interest from schools like Illinois and North Carolina State.

Smart, 35, got a raise to $1.2 million in guaranteed money after the 2011 season when he led VCU to the Final Four.

He's since led the Rams to back-to-back NCAA tournament appearances. No. 5 VCU blew out Akron in its first game last week before losing to No. 4 Michigan in the Round of 32.

He's also led VCU to another plane off the floor, as the Rams joined the Atlantic 10 this season and could be considered for a spot in the Big East when it grows from its current 10 teams.

Smart and VCU have as defined a style of play as any program in the country. The Rams' "Havoc" up-tempo pressing style has become intertwined with VCU's image.

Smart has seemingly adopted a philosophy of, "Don't mess with happy," and has reaffirmed his commitment to VCU.

bedeviled
03-28-2013, 02:22 AM
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar has publicly thrown his hat into the ring for the UCLA job (http://www.foxsportswest.com/collegebasketball/ucla-bruins/story/Ex-Laker-great-wants-the-UCLA-coaching-j?blockID=885257&feedID=3666), an interesting oddity in terms of personality, experience, and school ties.
Note: I apologize if this knowledge somehow serves as a spoiler to the ending of the TV show 'Splash'...which may have been a strategic decision to show that he has a youthful, adventurous spirit and media willingness.

BD80
03-28-2013, 09:33 AM
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar has publicly thrown his hat into the ring for the UCLA job (http://www.foxsportswest.com/collegebasketball/ucla-bruins/story/Ex-Laker-great-wants-the-UCLA-coaching-j?blockID=885257&feedID=3666), an interesting oddity in terms of personality, experience, and school ties.
Note: I apologize if this knowledge somehow serves as a spoiler to the ending of the TV show 'Splash'...which may have been a strategic decision to show that he has a youthful, adventurous spirit and media willingness.

I think his players would eventually tire of him talking down to them

He would be a great choice with respect to how to handle NBA riches, as in investing in jazz albums and rugs, and insurance policies ... Actually, it sounds like he would now be a great person to steer young players into more solid financial planning, he learned a very expensive lesson.

ChillinDuke
03-28-2013, 09:43 AM
Shaka, with wallet bulging. (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-basketball/news/20130327/vcu-shaka-smart/)

Wow. It's one thing to turn down NC State, quite another to turn down UCLA.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Very admirable.

But it certainly makes me wonder - if not UCLA, can anyone lure Shaka away from VCU? Will anyone? Is he going to be a lifer there?

I had just assumed he would jump to a top program when given the opportunity.

- Chillin

Tripping William
03-28-2013, 10:41 AM
I think his players would eventually tire of him talking down to them



But they would all learn that Wisconsin is The Dairy State.

nyesq83
03-28-2013, 10:59 AM
Wow. It's one thing to turn down NC State, quite another to turn down UCLA.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Very admirable.

But it certainly makes me wonder - if not UCLA, can anyone lure Shaka away from VCU? Will anyone? Is he going to be a lifer there?

I had just assumed he would jump to a top program when given the opportunity.

- Chillin

Richmond VA is a very manageable city, it really is 40 minutes from east to west, 30 minutes from north to south.

We have a burgeoning restaurant scene here, great museums, VCU is a working collar but multi-ethnic great art school with some strong graduate programs. And VCU has a passionate fan base, just ask Brad Stevens - is he happy Butler is moving to the Big East? You bet, after being blown out here in Richmond a few weeks ago!

John Thompson made a good point - that mid majors recruit student athletes that tend to stay for four years. Great for maturity and team cohesiveness. Smart is building - really, expanding and strengthening - a program, creating a lasting legacy. How on earth can any coach want to be at UCLA - where the Wooden legacy hinders appreciation for today's program?

Look what happened to former VCU coach Capel and Quin Snyder. Shaka is trying to emulate the K model, by becoming a University leader in development ($$$ to the school), not just a Coach. Note that private citizens are donating to the VCU program to feather Smart's nest AND IMPROVE FACILITIES ETC. Corporations are giving to improve all athletics at the school partly because of the Final Four afterglow.

Note well: VCU's football team is undefeated. They don't have one. Basketball is king (and Olympic sports are strong).

Shaka's wife loves it here, they have a very young child. I think she has a fantastic job too.

brevity
03-29-2013, 02:52 AM
This UCLA opening has been interesting enough to make me seek out news tidbits, even from Twitter. (Ugh.)

A few hours ago Jon Crispin from Fox Sports tweeted (https://twitter.com/CrispinHoops/status/317478168422395904) that Brad Stevens is visiting Westwood. Which would be a very interesting development. I'm surprised he made the trip. (Then again, John Wooden was also from Indiana.)

Thoughts? UCLA fans must be drooling that there's even a sign of mutual interest. It is UCLA, even in its current form, and maybe Stevens owes it to himself to hear them out. Even if no followup news surfaces this weekend, you'd have to think UCLA will take its time to let Stevens make up his mind.

ETA: Bruin Report tweets (https://twitter.com/BruinReport/status/317474122697424897) the same, and provides an update link to premium Scout content. (Don't know what it says, as I fill up my tank with regular unleaded Scout content.)

uh_no
03-29-2013, 12:49 PM
This UCLA opening has been interesting enough to make me seek out news tidbits, even from Twitter. (Ugh.)

A few hours ago Jon Crispin from Fox Sports tweeted (https://twitter.com/CrispinHoops/status/317478168422395904) that Brad Stevens is visiting Westwood. Which would be a very interesting development. I'm surprised he made the trip. (Then again, John Wooden was also from Indiana.)

Thoughts? UCLA fans must be drooling that there's even a sign of mutual interest. It is UCLA, even in its current form, and maybe Stevens owes it to himself to hear them out. Even if no followup news surfaces this weekend, you'd have to think UCLA will take its time to let Stevens make up his mind.

ETA: Bruin Report tweets (https://twitter.com/BruinReport/status/317474122697424897) the same, and provides an update link to premium Scout content. (Don't know what it says, as I fill up my tank with regular unleaded Scout content.)

brad stevens took his name out of contention.....

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9111901/brad-stevens-staying-butler-ucla-overtures

i think the biggest takeaway from duke's perspective that it's not a given that we can just pick and choose whoever we want when K retires

superdave
03-29-2013, 02:39 PM
It will be interesting to see who the Bruins may try to lure -

Billy Donovan. He likely would not talk to them in a serious way until the Gators are done with the tournament. I could see him taking a serious look at this job. He does not seem afraid of the challenge.

Mark Gottfried. This is not an upgrade over Ben Howland.

Gregg Marshall. At $1 million per year, he'd have to coach for 20 more years to make $20 million. He could do that in 5 years at UCLA. Could be enticing simply from that perspective. Yahoo Sports article (http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/warning-schools-interested-gregg-marshall-won-t-easy-145403691--ncaab.html)on his skepticism of the big job.

Josh Pastner. If he's a climber, this could be his big shot. But he just signed an extension (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9105645/josh-pastner-memphis-tigers-agree-contract-extension) at Memphis and his loyalties lie with Arizona.

At this point, UCLA should also look at some former NBA coaches.

Some LA guys could get attention - Kurt Rambis, Brian Shaw - as could some other ex-NBA coaches like Nate McMillan of Jeff Van Gundy.

NashvilleDevil
03-29-2013, 02:48 PM
Other than Harrick's blip and Howland's first few years UCLA had not been a great job. Obviously Wooden's legacy casts a gigantic shadow but unlike football, where only a handful of schools can really win it every year, in basketball just about any school can make the final four and win it all.

FerryFor50
03-29-2013, 02:59 PM
It will be interesting to see who the Bruins may try to lure -

Billy Donovan. He likely would not talk to them in a serious way until the Gators are done with the tournament. I could see him taking a serious look at this job. He does not seem afraid of the challenge.

Mark Gottfried. This is not an upgrade over Ben Howland.

Gregg Marshall. At $1 million per year, he'd have to coach for 20 more years to make $20 million. He could do that in 5 years at UCLA. Could be enticing simply from that perspective. Yahoo Sports article (http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/warning-schools-interested-gregg-marshall-won-t-easy-145403691--ncaab.html)on his skepticism of the big job.

Josh Pastner. If he's a climber, this could be his big shot. But he just signed an extension (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9105645/josh-pastner-memphis-tigers-agree-contract-extension) at Memphis and his loyalties lie with Arizona.

At this point, UCLA should also look at some former NBA coaches.

Some LA guys could get attention - Kurt Rambis, Brian Shaw - as could some other ex-NBA coaches like Nate McMillan of Jeff Van Gundy.

Gottfried already said he's staying at State. But you're right - he's not really an upgrade.

UCLA's best bet is a coach that will let them run and bring a "showtime" mentality to the program. That seems to suit the area and fanbase and would help recruiting. Won't translate into tourny wins, though.

I can't help but wonder if we're not getting a glimpse at what life after K will look like.... The Wooden curse.

NashvilleDevil
03-29-2013, 03:08 PM
Gottfried already said he's staying at State. But you're right - he's not really an upgrade.

UCLA's best bet is a coach that will let them run and bring a "showtime" mentality to the program. That seems to suit the area and fanbase and would help recruiting. Won't translate into tourny wins, though.

I can't help but wonder if we're not getting a glimpse at what life after K will look like.... The Wooden curse.

I think life after K hinges on one of K's assistants being successful. UNC has been fine other than the Doh years post Dean.

UCLA is a lot like Alabama was post-Bear and pre-Saban. Problem is how little computers and pollsters have to do with winning a title in basketball.

burnspbesq
03-29-2013, 03:21 PM
Starting to look like Tubby may be headed for Lubbock.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9109374/tubby-smith-contacted-texas-tech-raiders-sources

tele
03-29-2013, 03:49 PM
If you want to go to school at the beach, no place beats UC Santa Barbara.

For length of beach on campus probably so, but Pepperdine has some nice beaches too, like Dan Blocker Beach. Of course none of these are on fresh water like the Lake Michigan beaches.

I'd like to see what Jabbar could do with the UCLA job, not just for the nostalgia links to the program but because of what he has already done for the game as a player. It would be great to see him leading the program at UCLA. The best players don't always make the best coaches, but he was a unique individual even as a player so it is possible he might be just as great a coach as he was a player. I'd like to see him get the chance to try it and it's not like the "experienced journeyman" hires have done much with their westwood opportunities.

tele
03-29-2013, 03:53 PM
"Northwestern zeroes in on Duke's Chris Collins"

http://www.csnchicago.com/blog/kapman/northwestern-zeroes-dukes-chris-collins

kaplan, who makes it sound like it's a done deal, has pretty good sources. He's still not the most accurate fellow on earth. Likes to hear himself talk, and has ample opportunities in Chicago. Of course, it does make sense for Chris to be leading candidate. If you don't watch the video, you'll miss the fact the host says Jon Scheyer "might have some role" on Collins' staff.

All FWIW

Kaplan coached Chris Collins on some aau team or other, so they do know each other, not that makes him more or less right about anything.

Cameron
03-29-2013, 06:52 PM
I am just as excited that Shaka Smart is staying at VCU. There was a USA Today article last week that stated Smart was not a fan of the excessive branding efforts, but to further rebut the "facts" of your earlier opinion:

Pete Thamel>INSIDE COLLEGE BASKETBALL (SI.com), here is the whole article, Cameron aka Don Imus Face:

VCU's Shaka Smart turns down UCLA, signs contract extension

VCU head coach Shaka Smart has turned down an opportunity to join UCLA, informing the Bruins today that he'll be staying with the Rams, according to a source with direct knowledge of the situation.

Smart has let UCLA know he accepted a contract extension and will be staying in Richmond. VCU is expected to announce formally Smart's contract extension in the next 24 hours. The deal will go through 2023 and will pay him approximately $1.5 million per year, up from the $1.2 million he'd been making.

A majority of what Smart asked VCU for was improvements for his staff and program. That includes more salary for his staff and a bevy of things like better meals for players, improved travel for the program and other perks for his staff.

With Smart's name bandied about at job openings at UCLA, USC and Minnesota, his choice to stay at VCU shows his belief that he can win there long term. He's resisted other overtures the past few seasons, including interest from schools like Illinois and North Carolina State.

Smart, 35, got a raise to $1.2 million in guaranteed money after the 2011 season when he led VCU to the Final Four.

He's since led the Rams to back-to-back NCAA tournament appearances. No. 5 VCU blew out Akron in its first game last week before losing to No. 4 Michigan in the Round of 32.

He's also led VCU to another plane off the floor, as the Rams joined the Atlantic 10 this season and could be considered for a spot in the Big East when it grows from its current 10 teams.

Smart and VCU have as defined a style of play as any program in the country. The Rams' "Havoc" up-tempo pressing style has become intertwined with VCU's image.

Smart has seemingly adopted a philosophy of, "Don't mess with happy," and has reaffirmed his commitment to VCU.

First off, I wasn't delivering facts. It was my opinion. And I still hold my opinion that Smart's style will not translate to a school like UCLA or Kentucky, which might be why Smart decided to remain at VCU. Maybe he's just comfortable there coaching the kinds of players that he can attract at VCU.

Thanks for the article, though.

Cameron
03-29-2013, 07:05 PM
Wow. It's one thing to turn down NC State, quite another to turn down UCLA.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Very admirable.

But it certainly makes me wonder - if not UCLA, can anyone lure Shaka away from VCU? Will anyone? Is he going to be a lifer there?

I had just assumed he would jump to a top program when given the opportunity.

- Chillin

This is a very interesting point, and makes me wonder as well. I think the answer could be a combination of Smart being happy with where he and his family currently are and the kind of program he is currently building at VCU. I just feel that Smart's brand of basketball suits the mid-major player better than it would the type of blue-chip recruit that typically chooses to play for UCLA. Perhaps Smart believes that as well and doesn't want to "mess with happy."

DangerDevil
03-30-2013, 11:37 AM
According to Andy Katz, Steve Alford headed to UCLA.

BD80
03-30-2013, 11:52 AM
According to Andy Katz, Steve Alford headed to UCLA.

Interesting hire. His wife's name is Tanya Frost. Not kidding. If nothing else her name fits La-La land.

luburch
03-30-2013, 11:53 AM
Ten days ago he signed a new 10 year, $20 million deal with New Mexico.

sagegrouse
03-30-2013, 12:36 PM
Ten days ago he signed a new 10 year, $20 million deal with New Mexico.

ACC fan favorite, Craig "Noodles" Neal, will be the interim coach. If he doesn't get ythe HC job, he will probably go to LA with Alford.

sagegrouse

Atlanta Duke
03-30-2013, 12:42 PM
Ten days ago he signed a new 10 year, $20 million deal with New Mexico.

Hope New Mexico at least included a buyout clause - if that is not a record for the shortest period of time in which a HC bolts after signing a "long term" contract it has to at least be in the Elite Eight

sagegrouse
03-30-2013, 12:45 PM
Ten days ago he signed a new 10 year, $20 million deal with New Mexico.


Hope New Mexico at least included a buyout clause - if that is not a record for the shortest period of time in which a HC bolts after signing a "long term" contract it has to at least be in the Elite Eight

I wonder whether the extension was signed. The ESPN article said Alford "had just agreed to" an extension "last week." Such contracts are complicated and it may not have been signed. Anyway, UCLA would probably foot the bill if there is one.

sagegrouse

jay
03-30-2013, 01:03 PM
Ten days ago he signed a new 10 year, $20 million deal with New Mexico.

This is why I never, ever pay attention to whatever deal a coach may or may not have just signed. Contracts mean next to nothing anymore.

mgtr
03-30-2013, 02:09 PM
This is why I never, ever pay attention to whatever deal a coach may or may not have just signed. Contracts mean next to nothing anymore.

Just like when a foreign country states "there is no chance that we will devalue our currency!" Generally happens the next morning.

sue71, esq
03-30-2013, 04:00 PM
I wonder whether the extension was signed. The ESPN article said Alford "had just agreed to" an extension "last week." Such contracts are complicated and it may not have been signed. Anyway, UCLA would probably foot the bill if there is one.

sagegrouse

I just read that he signed a Letter of Agreement but not the final contract, so that made a difference. The same article also indicated that UCLA will be helping with his buyout, but didn't state to what extent.

Forgive me for not linking (it was about an hour ago), but I can dig up the article if you'd like.

burnspbesq
03-30-2013, 04:34 PM
http://tracking.si.com/2013/03/30/usc-coach-andy-enfield-florida-gulf-coast/

Makes sense for the Trojans. If they ever want to be relevant as the fourth team in a four-team market, they need to both win and entertain.

Does it make sense for Enfield? That could be a different story.

sagegrouse
03-30-2013, 06:01 PM
I just read that he signed a Letter of Agreement but not the final contract, so that made a difference. The same article also indicated that UCLA will be helping with his buyout, but didn't state to what extent.

Forgive me for not linking (it was about an hour ago), but I can dig up the article if you'd like.

No problem, Sue -- How are the legal studies going? Since it was a contract extension, there was probably some sort of buyout clause in the original contract.

sagegrouse

nmduke2001
03-30-2013, 06:59 PM
The last 2 weeks in New Mexico have been comical. First a little background. UNM Men’s Basketball is the only game in town. People here are fanatical despite the lack of success. Andy Katz, who worked for the Albuquerque Journal, described UNM fans as crazy as Kentucky fans.

Two weeks ago, UNM won the MWC tournament again and were in line for a number 3 seed at the worst. Knowing that Alford would probably be a hot commodity, the UNM AD approached Alford with a 10 year contract extension. Terms were agreed and a letter of agreement was signed. The actual contract was to be signed on April 1. UNM fans were ecstatic. They would have Alford for ten more years and UNM would finally reach the promise land.

One week later, UNM looked lethargic in a loss to 14 seed Harvard. UNM fans were devastated. Alford was now the bum that couldn’t win in the tournament. People came out of the wood work to question the rational of the 10 year contract. Alford came on the radio and at one point stated that coaches don’t miss shot, players do.

Fast forward to this morning. Alford is named the coach and UCLA. UNM fans are as angry as a scorned lover. People are claiming that they never liked him anyway and that he was a snake from the beginning. To make matters worse, Alex Kirk, the soon to be Junior 7 foot center has already stated that he is likely to transfer (maybe to UCLA). Kirk has a legit shot of being an All-American. Alford is also taking his incoming freshman son with him. Bryce is a borderline top 100 recruit. Since Alford had not signed the new contract, it is likely that the $2 million buyout will not come into play and a much smaller fee will be paid to UNM.

Honestly, I can’t wait until Monday morning to hear the gnashing of teeth on local sports radio. Speculation is that Craig Neal (former GT Yellow Jacket and current UNM assistant) will remain to coach the team, though there are some reports that UNM is also trying to get the Wichita State coach to come here. He is still coaching in the tournament so that negotiation will have to wait.

throatybeard
03-30-2013, 08:53 PM
I'd like to see what Jabbar could do with the UCLA job, not just for the nostalgia links to the program but because of what he has already done for the game as a player. It would be great to see him leading the program at UCLA. The best players don't always make the best coaches, but he was a unique individual even as a player so it is possible he might be just as great a coach as he was a player. I'd like to see him get the chance to try it and it's not like the "experienced journeyman" hires have done much with their westwood opportunities.

Best of all, he's tall enough to coach big men.

sue71, esq
03-30-2013, 11:38 PM
Alford came on the radio and at one point stated that coaches don’t miss shot, players do.



Yeah, that's a coach I'd want to hire. :rolleyes:

sue71, esq
03-30-2013, 11:40 PM
No problem, Sue -- How are the legal studies going? Since it was a contract extension, there was probably some sort of buyout clause in the original contract.

sagegrouse

Good, thanks for asking! Working on a Points & Authorities that's due at 7am Monday morning. Editing my fingers off... know any lawyers in SoCal that need a summer clerk/intern? :)

luburch
04-01-2013, 03:02 PM
Apparently Tubby Smith is headed to Texas Tech.

Cameron
04-01-2013, 03:23 PM
Is Tubby the first coach to ever serve as a head coach in the SEC, Big Ten and Big XII?

I'm beginning to think that Tubby isn't necessarily underperforming, but rather just enjoys traveling. I have to imagine that he wanted to return closer to his southern roots with his latest destination, anywhere far removed from arctic weather. It will be interesting to see if Tubby can get the Tech program back to the Sweet 16 level it enjoyed under Bobby Knight. Tubby won't be anywhere near as big a draw for recruits, but I imagine he'll be a major upgrade from the previous three guys (starting with Pat Knight).

Native
04-01-2013, 03:38 PM
Apparently Tubby Smith is headed to Texas Tech.

SportsCenter Twitter (https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/318800714098941952) reporting via the AP.

luburch
04-01-2013, 11:13 PM
SportsCenter just tweeted that they expect a deal between Andy Enfield and USC to be complete within the next few days.

luburch
04-01-2013, 11:52 PM
And Andy Katz is now reporting that a six year deal is complete.

chaosmage
04-02-2013, 12:05 AM
That I actually lost some respect for Enfield on this one? He has the chance to do something special, because people will be lining up to give them $$$ at FGCU. Instead, he goes to USC, where money and such flow (I should know, living here). It's more high profile and more of a challenge, and maybe he felt that he's done all he can there, but still.

I just don't like it. My first teaching gig, I would've stayed for 30 years if I had the chance.

sporthenry
04-02-2013, 12:18 AM
That I actually lost some respect for Enfield on this one? He has the chance to do something special, because people will be lining up to give them $$$ at FGCU. Instead, he goes to USC, where money and such flow (I should know, living here). It's more high profile and more of a challenge, and maybe he felt that he's done all he can there, but still.

I just don't like it. My first teaching gig, I would've stayed for 30 years if I had the chance.

I can't really blame him that much. It is much easier for Shaka to stay at VCU with its solid conference and VCU already having a good brand built by Capel and Grant. The Atlantic Sun is much tougher to stay relevant in and get any tourney success coming out of the 14,15,16 seed positions. He has a chance to make a lot more money and has a fair shot at developing a program with BCS money and better access to recruits. This might have been his only shot and I'm sure there are cautionary tales of guys who didn't jump when they could and never got the chance again.

And as Duke fans, we might very much being trying to get the next Enfield. So I wouldn't hate the process that much although I'd hope we get a more battle tested coach than Enfield.

On a side note, it is pretty crazy how one good weekend can get a guy probably something in the neighborhood of a 1,000% raise and one of the top jobs in his field. Amazing how much importance we put on tournament success when it really is a bunch of luck.

brevity
04-02-2013, 12:25 AM
I was going to crack wise about how USC hired a Sweet 16 coach and UCLA didn't. But Steve Alford did make the Sweet 16 -- as SW Missouri State's coach 14 years ago.

tommy
04-02-2013, 04:33 AM
Enfield feels like the flavor of the month, that's all. Has he really proven that he's ready for a high major job? Based on what? One tournament team that had one great win over Georgetown? Color me skeptical.

Papa John
04-02-2013, 06:54 AM
On a side note, it is pretty crazy how one good weekend can get a guy probably something in the neighborhood of a 1,000% raise and one of the top jobs in his field. Amazing how much importance we put on tournament success when it really is a bunch of luck.

Not sure I'd characterize USC basketball as "one of the top jobs" in college basketball... Football, yes... Basketball, no... Unless by 'top jobs' you're meaning a job coaching basketball at any BCS conference school, and that seems to me a pretty loose definition. Frankly, I think there are a bunch of D1 basketball coaching positions at non-BCS schools that I would consider more noteworthy than USC... Of course, FGCU is certainly not one of them, so I don't blame Enfield for wanting to make the step up (just having a nit-picky reaction to the characterization of the USC basketball head coaching job as top flight--I would argue it isn't, and never has been, to my recollection)...

BD80
04-02-2013, 07:27 AM
Enfield feels like the flavor of the month, that's all. Has he really proven that he's ready for a high major job? Based on what? One tournament team that had one great win over Georgetown? Color me skeptical.

He has shown he can build a program from scratch.

His wife his hotter than the Song Girls

Sounds perfect at USC

Mal
04-02-2013, 01:51 PM
He has shown he can build a program from scratch.

His wife his hotter than the Song Girls

Sounds perfect at USC

He's also incredibly wealthy, having made reportedly around $100M on Wall Street. So he speaks the language of USC boosters.

I'm skeptical of whether he can turn that program around, but if he brings the same kind of high flying, fun loving style to USC that he installed at FGCU, they're going to stand out in the Pac and will start to draw eyes, even if they don't usurp Arizona or UCLA in the conference. Don't know if playing that way was out of necessity at FGCU or that's just what the guy likes and he'll definitely try to do the same elsewhere.

I am utterly befuddled by UCLA's choice. Alford has essentially failed his way to the top. I've seen nothing out of him that makes me think he can actually coach at a high level like this. He started to succeed at Iowa in his second year, but then fell off a cliff and hit a plateau; then went on to feasting in the Mountain West (usually) and suffering embarrassing early losses in the NCAA Tournament.

Happy for Tubby and hope things go well there and he can finish off his career on his own terms.

sporthenry
04-02-2013, 04:19 PM
Not sure I'd characterize USC basketball as "one of the top jobs" in college basketball... Football, yes... Basketball, no... Unless by 'top jobs' you're meaning a job coaching basketball at any BCS conference school, and that seems to me a pretty loose definition. Frankly, I think there are a bunch of D1 basketball coaching positions at non-BCS schools that I would consider more noteworthy than USC... Of course, FGCU is certainly not one of them, so I don't blame Enfield for wanting to make the step up (just having a nit-picky reaction to the characterization of the USC basketball head coaching job as top flight--I would argue it isn't, and never has been, to my recollection)...

Well I'd say that while USC isn't one of the best locations, it is still a high profile BCS program. I'd put them behind the UCLA's and Dukes of the world and probably even the Memphis' of the world but I'd say it is in the upper half of a BCS program job. So the guy went from what could possibly be one of the worst D-1 jobs with creating a program from scratch to a program that has already produced guys like Derozan and Mayo.

FerryFor50
04-02-2013, 04:50 PM
Well I'd say that while USC isn't one of the best locations, it is still a high profile BCS program. I'd put them behind the UCLA's and Dukes of the world and probably even the Memphis' of the world but I'd say it is in the upper half of a BCS program job. So the guy went from what could possibly be one of the worst D-1 jobs with creating a program from scratch to a program that has already produced guys like Derozan and Mayo.

They only produced Derozan and Mayo by paying them...

Mal
04-02-2013, 05:18 PM
Well I'd say that while USC isn't one of the best locations, it is still a high profile BCS program. I'd put them behind the UCLA's and Dukes of the world and probably even the Memphis' of the world but I'd say it is in the upper half of a BCS program job. So the guy went from what could possibly be one of the worst D-1 jobs with creating a program from scratch to a program that has already produced guys like Derozan and Mayo.

I agree with this, although it looks like sporthenry and Papa John might just be disagreeing on semantics. Yes, there are non-BCS programs with far better recent successes and profile, but very few of them are within 10 miles of the Pacific Ocean in a huge city with some of the best weather in the country. If I'm Enfield, I'm not looking to step up into the Wichita job if Marshall leaves, for instance. He's already gotten close to what one can get out of the program there. There's more room for easy improvement at USC, on the other hand, especially given the recent sanction troubles.

I'd reckon USC is in the upper half of Pac Whatever hoops programs, at least since 2000 or so, and upper third of the jobs. Certainly UCLA and Arizona are both in another class, and I'd think Stanford, Oregon and maybe Washington could argue better recent success. But that's about it. And clearly USC has the resources and brand name available to a basketball coach to advertise a higher ceiling than any midmajor can offer. I also would think that its location alone would make it more desirable (for some, of course, but not all) than a number of other BCS programs with similar, third or fourth tier hoops success and profiles over the last few decades; schools like Clemson, Auburn, Minnesota, Missouri, etc., and frankly, I'd rather take the USC job than move my family to Manhattan, Kansas or the home of a number of other programs with clearly more success than USC in my lifetime.

Blue KevIL
04-02-2013, 05:48 PM
I am utterly befuddled by UCLA's choice. Alford has essentially failed his way to the top. I've seen nothing out of him that makes me think he can actually coach at a high level like this. He started to succeed at Iowa in his second year, but then fell off a cliff and hit a plateau; then went on to feasting in the Mountain West (usually) and suffering embarrassing early losses in the NCAA Tournament.

If you think about it, Indiana could have pursued Steve Alford at least three times: 1. prior to making Mike Davis a permanent head coach, 2. instead of Kelvin Sampson, and 3. instead of Tom Crean. The fact that Indiana did not bring in a favorite-son-former-player who was IU's first four-time MVP should speak volumes about UCLA's choice.

Remove basketball from the equation and examine how Alford handled the Pierre Pierce sexual assault arrest and UCLA's choice becomes even more questionable.

SoCalDukeFan
04-02-2013, 08:39 PM
I agree with this, although it looks like sporthenry and Papa John might just be disagreeing on semantics. Yes, there are non-BCS programs with far better recent successes and profile, but very few of them are within 10 miles of the Pacific Ocean in a huge city with some of the best weather in the country. If I'm Enfield, I'm not looking to step up into the Wichita job if Marshall leaves, for instance. He's already gotten close to what one can get out of the program there. There's more room for easy improvement at USC, on the other hand, especially given the recent sanction troubles.

I'd reckon USC is in the upper half of Pac Whatever hoops programs, at least since 2000 or so, and upper third of the jobs. Certainly UCLA and Arizona are both in another class, and I'd think Stanford, Oregon and maybe Washington could argue better recent success. But that's about it. And clearly USC has the resources and brand name available to a basketball coach to advertise a higher ceiling than any midmajor can offer. I also would think that its location alone would make it more desirable (for some, of course, but not all) than a number of other BCS programs with similar, third or fourth tier hoops success and profiles over the last few decades; schools like Clemson, Auburn, Minnesota, Missouri, etc., and frankly, I'd rather take the USC job than move my family to Manhattan, Kansas or the home of a number of other programs with clearly more success than USC in my lifetime.

My wife is an alum and we go to almost all of the home football games and a few basketball games.

Most USC alums live and die football and are way less interested in basketball. One problem in the past is that they played in an awful place, the Sports Arena. Then Galen Center, which is great, was built. Tim Floyd had things started but then they got hit with sanctions over OJ Mayo. Most people think AD Mike Garrett tried to sacrific basketball to get lesser penalties in football. That did not work. Floyd was let go. For some reason they hired Kevin O'Neill who was a good defensive coach but was hated by players and staff. He failed to develop any kind of a program and alienated local high school and AAU coaches. This year's team had 10 transfers and one scholarship point guard, senior.

So with the right coach and given some time I think USC should be a terrific job. They have a wonderful place to play and are in the middle of lots and lots of very good high school basketbal players with only one other BCS school in the area. Some success and they should be able to recruit nationally.

Obviously it remains to be seen if Enfield is the guy. He needs to find a point guard for next year. The players will like him way more than O'Neill. I assume that Pat Haden will do his best to see that he runs an honest program. He really needs to do very little next year in improvement to satisfy the alums. The Pac 12, in my opinion, has only a few real good coaches and none of the greats. I do like the coaches at Oregon, Cal, and Arizona. WSU is a very tough spot for recruiting, UCLA's hire is questionable, Johnny D has yet to get it down at Stanford etc. So he could do very well.

If Enfield is a success and Alford a bust then the UCLA alums will want their AD's head.

SoCal

sporthenry
04-02-2013, 09:15 PM
I agree with this, although it looks like sporthenry and Papa John might just be disagreeing on semantics. Yes, there are non-BCS programs with far better recent successes and profile, but very few of them are within 10 miles of the Pacific Ocean in a huge city with some of the best weather in the country. If I'm Enfield, I'm not looking to step up into the Wichita job if Marshall leaves, for instance. He's already gotten close to what one can get out of the program there. There's more room for easy improvement at USC, on the other hand, especially given the recent sanction troubles.

I'd reckon USC is in the upper half of Pac Whatever hoops programs, at least since 2000 or so, and upper third of the jobs. Certainly UCLA and Arizona are both in another class, and I'd think Stanford, Oregon and maybe Washington could argue better recent success. But that's about it. And clearly USC has the resources and brand name available to a basketball coach to advertise a higher ceiling than any midmajor can offer. I also would think that its location alone would make it more desirable (for some, of course, but not all) than a number of other BCS programs with similar, third or fourth tier hoops success and profiles over the last few decades; schools like Clemson, Auburn, Minnesota, Missouri, etc., and frankly, I'd rather take the USC job than move my family to Manhattan, Kansas or the home of a number of other programs with clearly more success than USC in my lifetime.

Yeah, I'm sure it is just a semantics thing. But when you think there are 347 teams in D-1 and FGCU doesn't exactly scream of a top program, I'd say the guy went from a 300 ish program to a top 30-50 program. USC might not be a top program and they might be a football school but everyone loves a winner. If you can build a winner, people will show up which has been evidenced at tons of football schools like Texas, Florida, Stanford (if they are a football program) or even basketball schools like Duke. So if you consider the fact that USC will probably pay top dollar and I'm not 100% familiar with their facilities but I assume just from football overflow they'll blow places like Butler or VCU out of the water.

But on the whole, I pretty much agree with your whole analysis. I'd say it is probably a top 25-30 job in college basketball.

sue71, esq
04-02-2013, 11:02 PM
I think for USC, hiring Enfield was low risk, high reward. He doesn't pan out? Eh, he'll have put some butts in seats for a while and that's important for mbb there. He does moderately well in the P12? Woohoo USC looks brilliant.

Reilly
04-03-2013, 02:46 PM
The article on the front page about Jeff Jones moving to ODU mentioned that UNC assistant Steve Robinson (ex-FSU coach) was one of the five finalists for the ODU job.

Jimmy Patsos is moving from Loyola (MD) to Siena. Loyola is moving to the Patriot League.

sporthenry
04-03-2013, 05:19 PM
Rick Pitino's son, Richard, is apparently taking over at Minnesota. He comes from FIU. Could be a decent hire but that is about what I expected Minnesota to get but it must be a dose of reality to their fans who thought they'd be able to get a big time coach there.

If you asked them whether they want Pitino or Tubby right now, what would the answer be?

brevity
04-03-2013, 05:24 PM
Rick Pitino's son, Richard, is apparently taking over at Minnesota. He comes from FIU. Could be a decent hire but that is about what I expected Minnesota to get but it must be a dose of reality to their fans who thought they'd be able to get a big time coach there.

If you asked them whether they want Pitino or Tubby right now, what would the answer be?

Their answer would be, "Which Pitino?"

FIU needs to hire Saul Smith, just to keep the chain going.

CameronBornAndBred
04-03-2013, 07:01 PM
Interesting. Dan Hurley leads Rutger's options.

http://tracking.si.com/2013/04/03/dan-hurley-tops-rutgers-list/?sct=hp_t2_a5&eref=sihp

Mal
04-03-2013, 07:07 PM
Rick Pitino's son, Richard, is apparently taking over at Minnesota. He comes from FIU. Could be a decent hire but that is about what I expected Minnesota to get but it must be a dose of reality to their fans who thought they'd be able to get a big time coach there.

If you asked them whether they want Pitino or Tubby right now, what would the answer be?

I think Enfield's signing with USC after the first ten guys on their wish list were quickly ruled out was the dose of reality they needed to actually get pretty enthused by this. Their in-the-know fans are already aware of Richard's success at FIU in his one season there, where he had 5 scholarship players, started 2 walk-ons, and led them to their best finish in the conference in years. They've heard that he came up with the high screen wrinkle that had our guys so perplexed on Sunday (see the "Basketball Breakdown Duke vs. Louisville" thread elsewhere). And they already knew that their AD is a big Villa 7 guy and were aware in advance that an assistant or unproven guy could be the pick. The uninformed fanbase will grouse and feel dissed by this, but Gophers fans who know what they're talking about are generally pretty excited after spending an hour scratching their heads and saying "What?" because Pitino Jr. was not on anybody's list of likely hires. It strikes them as low risk, high reward, and they like the added bonus of the last name.

duke86
04-04-2013, 12:02 AM
I think this is an awful hire for ODU. I know, I know, American U isn't the most powerful basketball team in the most powerful conference, but his job there was admirable but not convincing. Now living in D.C. and taken a few courses at AU. I have followed and watched the AU Eagles since 2008, when they made their first appearance in the NCAAT and have been unconvinced of Jeff's coaching abilities. He never coaches to the players he has, and I know they aren't the most talented teams, but Bucknell, Lehigh, and even Holy Cross have been successful with very similar athletes. He consistently uses an aggressive man-to-man (something not always used in the Patriot League) when he never had the players to succeed in this style of play. His drive and kicks were so very obvious. If you want to beat AU, make sure you guard the perimeter. I know, that sounds like how to beat Duke, but the difference is Duke has other options and more than one scorer...AU did not, and neither does ODU. I suppose it is a "step-up" from the PL, but again, I'm not buying it. I'm pleased to see Jeff Jones leave American (a program that Gary Williams started out at) and hope they can bring in some fresh new coach looking for a decent challenge. Great recruiting area and it once had a good AD (Keith Gill--Duke '94), and now has a new AD who has to find a new coach.

sue71, esq
04-04-2013, 12:50 AM
Glad to see I'm not the only one under-whelmed with ODU's hire.

NovaScotian
04-04-2013, 11:10 AM
Rick Pitino's son, Richard, is apparently taking over at Minnesota.

this could provide for an interesting future acc-big10 matchup in the future

sporthenry
04-04-2013, 11:19 AM
I think Enfield's signing with USC after the first ten guys on their wish list were quickly ruled out was the dose of reality they needed to actually get pretty enthused by this. Their in-the-know fans are already aware of Richard's success at FIU in his one season there, where he had 5 scholarship players, started 2 walk-ons, and led them to their best finish in the conference in years. They've heard that he came up with the high screen wrinkle that had our guys so perplexed on Sunday (see the "Basketball Breakdown Duke vs. Louisville" thread elsewhere). And they already knew that their AD is a big Villa 7 guy and were aware in advance that an assistant or unproven guy could be the pick. The uninformed fanbase will grouse and feel dissed by this, but Gophers fans who know what they're talking about are generally pretty excited after spending an hour scratching their heads and saying "What?" because Pitino Jr. was not on anybody's list of likely hires. It strikes them as low risk, high reward, and they like the added bonus of the last name.

Not saying he is a terrible hire but I just think Tubby got a raw deal and then to see them hire down, at least in my opinion, makes me feel a little better about the Tubby firing. Pitino isn't a Villa 7 guy but I do agree that their AD does know what he is doing with assistant coaches and Pitino did coach under Donovan at Florida where Grant and Smart also came from so I'd suspect that Teague heard good things. But I'd have to think that some people probably wish they never got rid of Tubby.

Bluedog
04-04-2013, 11:51 AM
this could provide for an interesting future acc-big10 matchup in the future

ACC - Big 10 challenge probably won't still be happening by the time Louisville joins...A lot of people in the ACC don't want to renew it (including Coach K).

Mal
04-04-2013, 12:25 PM
Not saying he is a terrible hire but I just think Tubby got a raw deal and then to see them hire down, at least in my opinion, makes me feel a little better about the Tubby firing. Pitino isn't a Villa 7 guy but I do agree that their AD does know what he is doing with assistant coaches and Pitino did coach under Donovan at Florida where Grant and Smart also came from so I'd suspect that Teague heard good things. But I'd have to think that some people probably wish they never got rid of Tubby.

I don't disagree. There were three camps, from what I could see, in Minnesota:

- those who were tired of Tubby and actually thought Minnesota could get a high profile replacement to build on the moderate promise and improvement Tubby had brought
- those who were tired of Tubby and realistic about who could be found to replace him, but convinced they weren't going to climb any higher with Smith so open to the firing regardless
- those who weren't tired of Tubby

The first camp is mostly homers and local sportswriters and radio talkers who can't see beyond the St. Croix River and just don't get what kind of job the Gopher one is generally perceived as. I was probably most in the third camp. The program had clearly improved, both in recruiting and results, in Smith's 6 years. There was, however, an unsettling trend of good starts and disappointing finishes to his seasons, however (exacerbated this year, when they were a fringe top 5 team three games into the conference season before freefalling, with three or four inexcusable losses), and it appeared he was bumping up against a ceiling of some sort. I should note that this feeling of disappointment was felt by all three camps. Greatest by the first, of course, the ornery folks who think it's easy to climb over Ohio State and Wisconsin and Michigan and reach the upper echelons of the conference, Clem Haskins did it and the academic scandal was all b.s. and blah blah blah. But it was a big contributing factor to the general feeling around the fanbase of "It's probably time to move on."

Tubby wasn't the longterm answer for me, but I thought another two or three seasons of better than mediocrity and further establishing a local recuiting pipeline would be worth it, and set the table for a replacement a little closer to the wish list.

The second camp is pretty obviously where Norwood Teague and his staff sit. They had decided to make a move before the NCAA Tournament and were not swayed by the one win there, because they have a different vision for the program than Tubby did, apparently. They kicked the tires on a few high on the wish list guys, then went back to the practice that's served them well in the past with Grant and Shaka while they were at VCU. Hopefully it works. If it doesn't, there will be some (myself possibly included) who will say "See, you should have kept Tubby Smith." But not that many. He had sort of worn out the welcome by underwhelming despite having pieces in place to get more out of them, and not seeming to be all that passionate about what he was doing.

Merlindevildog91
04-04-2013, 01:47 PM
Glad to see I'm not the only one under-whelmed with ODU's hire.

You aren't.

I grew up about 20 minutes from ODU's campus, and both my parents got graduate degrees there. So I have followed ODU since junior high school. ODU was headed in the right direction under Blaine Taylor, sparkly venue, good players, etc. This past year was one of turmoil, but ODU still managed to knock off UVa, and once Jim Corrigan took over, ODU was very competitive. Supposedly they wanted to play an upbeat style, yet they hired a coach whose team was 335th in scoring per game last season.

I don't get it.

sbroc012
04-04-2013, 06:38 PM
I am a current student at ODU and have been here since '09. The first two years I was here the team went to the NCAA tourney and in '10 lost to Baylor in the second round and then in '11 lost to Butler in the first round (on the most heartbreaking buzzer beater in the history of mankind, I was at the game it was unbelievable , watch it if you don't remember
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9xi0u8ZqmY) anyways, the hire of Jeff Jones has me baffled, with the way the program was trending upward this doesn't seem to make sense. Now I was in no way a fan of Blaine Taylor, he had a system and played the system, it was a very rough and tumble, defensive, low-scoring, rebounding style. He had no offensive coaching abilities (drove me nuts)With the success of the football team, which can be used as a recruiting tool, the constant expansion of the campus, the new basketball practice facility to be built in the near future, this hire doesn't make much sense. I was expecting Wood Selig (the AD) to bring in a name and leave his mark on the program, cause he seems to like that kind of thing. But we shall see and only time will tell, maybe we will be pleasantly surprised.

Olympic Fan
04-04-2013, 07:00 PM
I am a current student at ODU and have been here since '09. The first two years I was here the team went to the NCAA tourney and in '10 lost to Baylor in the second round and then in '11 lost to Butler in the first round (on the most heartbreaking buzzer beater in the history of mankind, I was at the game it was unbelievable , watch it if you don't remember
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9xi0u8ZqmY) anyways, the hire of Jeff Jones has me baffled, with the way the program was trending upward this doesn't seem to make sense. Now I was in no way a fan of Blaine Taylor, he had a system and played the system, it was a very rough and tumble, defensive, low-scoring, rebounding style. He had no offensive coaching abilities (drove me nuts)With the success of the football team, which can be used as a recruiting tool, the constant expansion of the campus, the new basketball practice facility to be built in the near future, this hire doesn't make much sense. I was expecting Wood Selig (the AD) to bring in a name and leave his mark on the program, cause he seems to like that kind of thing. But we shall see and only time will tell, maybe we will be pleasantly surprised.

Excuse me ... I don't mean to critical, but do you really mean that the program was trending upward?

ODU won 27 games in 2010 and ranked No. 34 in Pomeroy
ODU won 27 games in 2011 and ranked No. 48 in Pomeroy
ODU won 22 games in 2012 and ranked No. 99 in Pomeroy
ODU won 5 games in 2013 and ranked No. 263 in Pomeroy

Now, that doesn't look like the program was trending upward to me. I don't know about the Jeff Jones hire, but the Blaine Taylor firing looks perfectly understandable to me as an outsider.

I can't speak to Jones' performance at American -- I don't know the circumstances there -- but he did an outstanding job at Virginia from 1991-98. He's clearly the second best coach in Virginia history (behind Terry Holland). In his eight seasons, he played in the NCAA five times. He won an NIT title in 1991 and twice reached the Sweet 16 in the NCAA -- once the Elite Eight.

He was fired at UVa not for performance, but because of off the court issues (he was reportedly having a relative indiscrete affair with a young grad student).

Not saying he's a Hall of Fame coach, but he was 6-5 in NCAA play in Eight years -- the three guys who have replaced him are a combined 1-3 in NCAA play in the 15 seasons since he left.

sbroc012
04-04-2013, 07:13 PM
Excuse me ... I don't mean to critical, but do you really mean that the program was trending upward?
.

From what the program was when Blaine started, yes its upward. As a mid major those Pomeroy numbers the last three years (not this past year) are very closely related and are good compared to most mid-majors. And if you did a little research on your own you would find that Blaine Taylor was not fired because of his team's performance on the court this year, there were some big personal issues that caused that. So yes, the program as a whole has gone up, most programs in mid majors just flounder around and have up and down years. ODU has been consistently good. Sometimes you get so stuck on the current numbers, look at the big picture! The arena was being sold out and students were talking about basketball, the program as a whole was trending upwards, sometimes numbers don't do things justice

Merlindevildog91
04-04-2013, 07:16 PM
Blaine Taylor's bad 2013 was due to off the court issues. ODU had been playing a progressively tougher schedule, IMHO, which is why they looked so abysmal, record-wise, this year. Well, that and (Google his performance on a local radio show) Coach Taylor's problems.

I was hoping for someone young and hungry. The ODU grads in my neck of the woods (central Virginia) are none too happy.

sbroc012
04-04-2013, 07:20 PM
I was hoping for someone young and hungry. The ODU grads in my neck of the woods (central Virginia) are none too happy.

I am a current student and am not too happy. I feel like this is going to be a step backwards. At this point we just have to wait and see!

Acymetric
04-04-2013, 07:41 PM
ACC - Big 10 challenge probably won't still be happening by the time Louisville joins...A lot of people in the ACC don't want to renew it (including Coach K).

I'll be curious to see if the Big 10 challenge actually gets canceled, but if it does I would be perfectly happy to replace it with the new Big East as a replacement.

CameronBornAndBred
04-05-2013, 08:51 AM
I'll be curious to see if the Big 10 challenge actually gets canceled, but if it does I would be perfectly happy to replace it with the new Big East as a replacement.
If we cancel it, then the new Big East would also be the primary targeted partner for the Big 10; both of us will want to continue the challenge in some form with another conference. I don't mind continuing the challenge, it's good competition. Just as long as we don't play Maryland.

sporthenry
04-05-2013, 12:29 PM
If we cancel it, then the new Big East would also be the primary targeted partner for the Big 10; both of us will want to continue the challenge in some form with another conference. I don't mind continuing the challenge, it's good competition. Just as long as we don't play Maryland.

And to look at it from the Big East perspective, they might want to freeze us out just like we would to the Big 10 for poaching teams. Granted the new Big East will look quite a bit different so they might not care as much but who knows. At that point, we'd have the other Big East or the SEC.

Mal
04-05-2013, 01:33 PM
And to look at it from the Big East perspective, they might want to freeze us out just like we would to the Big 10 for poaching teams. Granted the new Big East will look quite a bit different so they might not care as much but who knows. At that point, we'd have the other Big East or the SEC.

And not just for spite. From a pure competition perspective, while the Big East will be a fine basketball conference, do we think they'd have a chance at the revamped ACC lineup in a matchup? I think if I'm them I don't schedule the ACC because of specifically which teams we poached. The best 3 of the Catholic 7 schools at the heart of the new Big East (Georgetown, Marquette, Villanova) are basically balanced out by our additions from the old Big East (Louisville, Syracuse, Pitt). Plus we add Notre Dame to offset their new midmajor additions. Those new teams will add some depth, but there's no one in their lineup to account for Duke and Carolina. Although of course we'll have 5 more teams than the Big East, there's no getting around the fact that we'll have 4 of the 10 or so most blueblooded programs in the country, year in and year out.

I thought I'd look at recent strength rankings to see what a possible ACC/Big East challenge could look like in 2014:

ACC (approximations without much thought):

Duke, Louisville, Carolina, Syracuse, Pitt, Miami, NC State, Notre Dame, FSU, Virginia, Clemson, Tech, BC, VT, Wake

Big East:

Georgetown, Marquette, Butler, Villanova, Xavier, Creighton, St. John's, Seton Hall, Providence, Depaul

Toss out 5 of the ACC sprinkled fairly evenly and you have Duke, Carolina, Syracuse, Miami, NCSt., FSU, UVa, Tech, BC, Wake. The bottom of our conference looks weak on its own, but then the Big East's last 4 is unquestionably worse. If you were looking at this year alone, the ACC would be favored in probably 8 of those matchups. The middle of the order, with the new teams, will be pretty strong for the Big East. But they can't match up at the top, and they can't match up at the bottom.

Reilly
04-12-2013, 07:05 AM
Here's a good recap of all the moves:

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9159201/a-closer-look-coaching-carousel-ncaa-men-college-basketball

In addition, I believe the JMU job could be technically considered open ... Matt Brady was in the last year of an expiring contract, and was expected to be fired coming into the season, but made the NCAAs ... no announcement made on a new contract yet that I know of.

Reilly
04-12-2013, 09:50 AM
... In addition, I believe the JMU job could be technically considered open ... Matt Brady was in the last year of an expiring contract, and was expected to be fired coming into the season, but made the NCAAs ... no announcement made on a new contract yet that I know of.

JMU's coach's contract expires 4/24 ... negotiating ... per:

http://www.breezejmu.org/sports/article_3669f5a0-9cd5-11e2-965c-0019bb30f31a.html?TNNoMobile

Reilly
04-12-2013, 02:24 PM
Loyola (MD) hiring GG Smith ...

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/college/basketball/mens/bal-loyola-to-name-gg-smith-as-new-mens-basketball-coach-source-says-20130412,0,7967083.story

KenTankerous
04-13-2013, 04:16 AM
distracting. impertinent. but entertaining, y'all know, my usual contribution:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2xQCcp9hb0&feature=share

Here is a Turtle
04-13-2013, 01:16 PM
If we cancel it, then the new Big East would also be the primary targeted partner for the Big 10; both of us will want to continue the challenge in some form with another conference. I don't mind continuing the challenge, it's good competition. Just as long as we don't play Maryland.

I doubt the Big East (or AAC) would go for it for the same reasons the ACC would cancel the B1G. The ACC poached what, 5 or 6 teams. I can't see Georgetown being happy they lost their biggest rival to this mess. Seriously, can the ACC really be that mad when the proactive poaching of teams was a large reason the Big East fell apart?

As for playing Maryland, I could see ESPN putting the teams together just because they know it would get good ratings or in the very least push hard for it to happen.

brevity
04-18-2013, 04:52 PM
Lakers assistant Eddie Jordan agrees to coach Rutgers.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9186395/eddie-jordan-agrees-become-rutgers-scarlet-knights-men-basketball-coach

If Rutgers wasn't going to get clean-by-association by getting the vaunted Hurley name, then this was the way to go. This hire does two good things: getting a former NBA head coach (even with a losing record) makes Rutgers look like a major program (even though it isn't). Also, and perhaps more important, he is untainted by college-level scandal. The Rutgers situation was an impossible exercise in risk management, where minimizing legal liabilities came at the expense of one's own job. They needed to get as far away from that experience as possible.

Billy Dat
04-19-2013, 05:49 PM
How about Quin Snyder getting looks from NBA teams for HC vacancies?

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA
Charlotte isn't rushing to make a decision on coach Mike Dunlap's future. Letting exit interviews and coaching market unfold for now.

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA
Among GM's, here are strongest names in assistant pool: Kelvin Sampson (Hou), Mike Malone (GS), Steve Clifford (LAL), Quin Snyder (Russia).

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA
For those recalling Snyder simply at Mizzou, his time w/ Spurs D-League, Lakers and w/ Ettore Messina in Moscow have re-shaped him as coach.