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View Full Version : Amile Jefferson ~ Brian Zoubek?



Mudge
02-09-2013, 02:32 PM
Is Amile Jefferson really 6'9" tall (with the arms of a 7' tall player)? If so, are those arms attached to the hands of Brian Zoubek? Otherwise, how to explain Amile's apparent inability to dunk a basketball, despite being passed the ball with an open path to the rim numerous times, and then generally finishing with shots off the backboard (which have been blocked about as often as they have gone in)?

If this man is really 6'9" with a 7' "wingspan", then why does he dunk like a 5'9" man (and I don't mean Spud Webb)?

... and no, I don't need to hear from GreyBeard again why a layup is actually a better, smarter, more fundamentally sound shot than a dunk, with less risk of injury-- No, it is not, and it offers substantially greater chances of being blocked. None of the vicious rim-wreckers of yore were side-lined because of their propensity for dunking-- Shaq may have missed a lot of time with injuries-- but that was mostly because he was bigger (and weighed more) than a Le(a)d Zeppelin in the latter half of his career-- not because he was likely to tear your arm off, if you got it in the way, when he was dunking the ball.

devildeac
02-09-2013, 02:39 PM
Is Amile Jefferson really 6'9" tall (with the arms of a 7' tall player)? If so, are those arms attached to the hands of Brian Zoubek? Otherwise, how to explain Amile's apparent inability to dunk a basketball, despite being passed the ball with an open path to the rim numerous times, and then generally finishing with shots off the backboard (which have been blocked about as often as they have gone in)?

If this man is really 6'9" with a 7' "wingspan", then why does he dunk like a 5'9" man (and I don't mean Spud Webb)?

... and no, I don't need to hear from GreyBeard again why a layup is actually a better, smarter, more fundamentally sound shot than a dunk, with less risk of injury-- No, it is not, and it offers substantially greater chances of being blocked. None of the vicious rim-wreckers of yore were side-lined because of their propensity for dunking-- Shaq may have missed a lot of time with injuries-- but that was mostly because he was bigger (and weighed more) than a Le(a)d Zeppelin in the latter half of his career-- not because he was likely to tear your arm off, if you got it in the way, when he was dunking the ball.

Not enough beard:rolleyes:;).

dukelifer
02-09-2013, 03:10 PM
Is Amile Jefferson really 6'9" tall (with the arms of a 7' tall player)? If so, are those arms attached to the hands of Brian Zoubek? Otherwise, how to explain Amile's apparent inability to dunk a basketball, despite being passed the ball with an open path to the rim numerous times, and then generally finishing with shots off the backboard (which have been blocked about as often as they have gone in)?

If this man is really 6'9" with a 7' "wingspan", then why does he dunk like a 5'9" man (and I don't mean Spud Webb)?

... and no, I don't need to hear from GreyBeard again why a layup is actually a better, smarter, more fundamentally sound shot than a dunk, with less risk of injury-- No, it is not, and it offers substantially greater chances of being blocked. None of the vicious rim-wreckers of yore were side-lined because of their propensity for dunking-- Shaq may have missed a lot of time with injuries-- but that was mostly because he was bigger (and weighed more) than a Le(a)d Zeppelin in the latter half of his career-- not because he was likely to tear your arm off, if you got it in the way, when he was dunking the ball.

Maybe because he is not explosive. He can dunk (plenty of high school highlights),

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJGivAmaXyQ

but he is not explosive. He has learned to score by getting his shot off quickly in traffic. He is a lot like Antawn Jamison, who, as I recall, was not an explosive dunker. He mostly used timing to get his shots off around the hoop. For me, this means Amile is likely a four year guy. Amile is only going to get better.

ScreechTDX1847
02-09-2013, 03:12 PM
He makes quick moves farther away from the rim to get an advantage on the defender. His high school highlights are the same. He is typically fully extended when laying up the ball.

It's part of why people here like to call his game "crafty".

Mudge
02-09-2013, 03:20 PM
He makes quick moves farther away from the rim to get an advantage on the defender. His high school highlights are the same. He is typically fully extended when laying up the ball.

It's part of why people here like to call his game "crafty".

I am not talking about when he has to make a move to beat someone to the basket-- I'm talking about when he gets a pass that sets him up with a clear path the rim, and then he tries to lay it in-- he's just begging for somebody to come swooping in and block the shot-- which happens all too often. If he wants to be a highly effective inside scorer, he's going to need to learn how to dunk the ball, when he has outmaneuvered his defender, and has an open path the rim-- like Mason Plumlee does constantly.

uh_no
02-09-2013, 03:22 PM
I am not talking about when he has to make a move to beat someone to the basket-- I'm talking about when he gets a pass that sets him up with a clear path the rim, and then he tries to lay it in-- he's just begging for somebody to come swooping in and block the shot-- which happens all too often. If he wants to be a highly effective inside scorer, he's going to need to learn how to dunk the ball, when he has outmaneuvered his defender, and has an open path the rim-- like Mason Plumlee does constantly.

he weighs what, 40lbs less than plumlee? we all know he needs to put on some muscle....but I think the similarities between his and zoubek's offensive games are scant.

weezie
02-09-2013, 03:49 PM
he weighs what, 40lbs less than plumlee?

Geez, at least! He can fly but right now he's bouncing off defenders.

OldPhiKap
02-09-2013, 03:52 PM
I have not studied Amile's finishing style, and my game is decidedly below the rim. It seems that jamming requires the ability to absorb a hit in most cases, and Amile probably has to run around in the shower to get wet. As a freshman. Give him 30 lbs of upper-body training though and I think he will be slam bam jam city as he matures into his potential.

SupaDave
02-09-2013, 05:12 PM
Forget dunking. 2 points is 2 points. I'd rather him develop a 10-15 jump shot. Would take him to a whole other level. I'm thinking he could be very Richard Howellesque by the time it's said and done and that would be stellar.

rthomas
02-09-2013, 05:18 PM
Alarmingly like a Duke phenotype? lol.

OldPhiKap
02-09-2013, 05:37 PM
Amile = Tony Lang with better hands and offensive "get-to-the-rackishness"

Kid will be a real force before all is said and done, assuming he puts in the work. Hood is probably a good model as well, I would think, if Amile develops his handle and outside shooting.

tommy
02-09-2013, 06:07 PM
Forget dunking. 2 points is 2 points. I'd rather him develop a 10-15 jump shot. Would take him to a whole other level. I'm thinking he could be very Richard Howellesque by the time it's said and done and that would be stellar.

Richard Howell is listed as 257 pounds, and he's probably heavier than that. And his style is a bruising one. I know, he proved he can step out and hit an outside J too, but still, he's a banger. I don't see Amile as ever gaining enough weight, or changing his style, to be like Howell.

weezie
02-09-2013, 06:46 PM
Kid will be a real force before all is said and done, assuming he puts in the work.

OPK regulates yet again. AJ will be the shooting Lance.

SupaDave
02-09-2013, 07:58 PM
Richard Howell is listed as 257 pounds, and he's probably heavier than that. And his style is a bruising one. I know, he proved he can step out and hit an outside J too, but still, he's a banger. I don't see Amile as ever gaining enough weight, or changing his style, to be like Howell.

If Amile can see 225 - he'll be Howell and then some. He doesn't need the bulk of Howell - just enough to hold his ground.

davekay1971
02-09-2013, 08:20 PM
Amile = Tony Lang with better hands and offensive "get-to-the-rackishness"

Kid will be a real force before all is said and done, assuming he puts in the work. Hood is probably a good model as well, I would think, if Amile develops his handle and outside shooting.

That was the exact comparison I always thought of with Amile, and the comparison I make when dealing w State fan friends claiming Amile had consigned himself to four years of rebounding and screening for guards when he came to Duke. It's amazing to me that one year of Lance and Zoubs using their best gifts (defense, rebounding, and willingness to do whatever the team needed to win - ie: screen for and feed 3 amazing perimeter scorers...culminating in a natty) made so many people forget about 30 years of scoring forwards under Coach K. However, Amile is not Lance or Zoubs...he's got the potential to be a very good, very effective mid-range and close- range scorer. Tony Lang with even better upside is a very apt comparison.

JNort
02-09-2013, 09:09 PM
I am not talking about when he has to make a move to beat someone to the basket-- I'm talking about when he gets a pass that sets him up with a clear path the rim, and then he tries to lay it in-- he's just begging for somebody to come swooping in and block the shot-- which happens all too often. If he wants to be a highly effective inside scorer, he's going to need to learn how to dunk the ball, when he has outmaneuvered his defender, and has an open path the rim-- like Mason Plumlee does constantly.

Nobody in Duke history has dunked as much as Mason on a consistent basis.... Why should Amile? Further more he is not the athlete Mason is. What he needs to learn is positioning when he is laying those shots in and of course how to eat more....

uh_no
02-09-2013, 09:25 PM
Nobody in Duke history has dunked as much as Mason on a consistent basis.... Why should Amile? Further more he is not the athlete Mason is. What he needs to learn is positioning when he is laying those shots in and of course how to eat more....

nobody in duke history has dunked as must as mason.....period! he holds the dunk record!

with a 7'1 wingspan, once he bunks up, I'm sure he'll get his fair share of dunks and be pumped to throw down when he gets the opportunity.

what I think is best about him right now, is that he seems to be aware of exactly what he is capable of and where he needs to improve (bulk up!!) and what the increased PT has gotten him is the insight to do exactly what he can, not more. I think the biggest similarity between he and zoubek is that they both figured that out. For brian, it took until his senior year when he was healthy to get it, for amile, it seems to have taken a few games.

Either way, this kid will get bigger, and I think when he realizes all the new stuff he CAN do, he'll be a beast.

gep
02-09-2013, 09:40 PM
what I think is best about him right now, is that he seems to be aware of exactly what he is capable of and where he needs to improve (bulk up!!) and what the increased PT has gotten him is the insight to do exactly what he can, not more. I think the biggest similarity between he and zoubek is that they both figured that out. For brian, it took until his senior year when he was healthy to get it, for amile, it seems to have taken a few games.

Either way, this kid will get bigger, and I think when he realizes all the new stuff he CAN do, he'll be a beast.

Exactly (to me, at least). Amile appears to "know" his place, skill, capability... and best of all, ACCEPTS IT. And since it appears that he figured it our already, he's got a very bright future in Duke basketball :cool:

Mudge
02-12-2013, 08:39 PM
I have not studied Amile's finishing style, and my game is decidedly below the rim. It seems that jamming requires the ability to absorb a hit in most cases, and Amile probably has to run around in the shower to get wet. As a freshman. Give him 30 lbs of upper-body training though and I think he will be slam bam jam city as he matures into his potential.

If you were to review the BC game, you will notice that at ~6:35 remaining in the first half, Amile gets a pass that would likely have allowed him to dunk the ball-- but he immediately headed towards the backboard, as if to lay it in off the glass-- at which point a shorter, less athletic BC player blocked his layup... from my perspective, it doesn't matter how much he weighs or how strong he gets, if he is not looking to dunk-- just as it didn't matter for Zoubek-- they aren't thinking dunk, so they don't take the proper approach to the basket to accomplish that goal... Spud Webb was looking to dunk from the time he got to NC State-- all 5'7", ~145 lbs. of him-- and he got it done, when he got an open lane to the rim. To be fair, the game commentator mentioned that he thought that when Amile gains some weight "that play is going off somebody's head"-- I just don't see why it has to wait for that.

I also noticed that Jefferson's playing time shrank noticeably in the second half of that game; given that Jefferson's most visible replacement (Hairston) struggles with a number of facets of the game, I don't really understand why Jefferson (who had seemed to be playing better, without fouling quite so frequently) suddenly disappeared again in the second half against BC-- could that play have been a factor-- or maybe it was just the overall physical level of play that BC was employing? Either way, I generally thought that Jefferson has looked better in each progressive game (except for this non-dunking issue), and I would have preferred to see him out there, rather than his replacement.

ncexnyc
02-12-2013, 09:36 PM
You know things are looking good in the world of Duke basketball when we have time for a thread like this one.;)

DukieInBrasil
02-13-2013, 10:27 AM
Is Amile Jefferson really 6'9" tall (with the arms of a 7' tall player)? If so, are those arms attached to the hands of Brian Zoubek? Otherwise, how to explain Amile's apparent inability to dunk a basketball, despite being passed the ball with an open path to the rim numerous times, and then generally finishing with shots off the backboard (which have been blocked about as often as they have gone in)?


Absolute bunk, that one single block that you are focusing on is the only time i remember Amile getting blocked. In fact, i am usually quite surprised at how quickly he gets to the rim and softly puts it in. And who cares if it's a rim shattering dunk? Were you more excited about the time that Josh went strong to the rim and clanked it? Did going up strong withe intent to dunk give Josh 2 points? No, putting the ball through the hoop does, and Amile has shown an excellent knack for converting offensive boards into points through his quickness and angles to the rim and collecting passes and immediately going to the rim rather than gathering himself for an explosive and powerful dunk. In fact, I remember Mason getting blocked much, much more often by gathering himself withe intent of going up strong (this happened at least 3 times just in the Miami game).
I for one appreciate what Amile does on offense and have been pleasantly impressed by how much he has improved over the course of the year so far.

Mudge
02-13-2013, 11:37 AM
Absolute bunk, that one single block that you are focusing on is the only time i remember Amile getting blocked. In fact, i am usually quite surprised at how quickly he gets to the rim and softly puts it in. And who cares if it's a rim shattering dunk? Were you more excited about the time that Josh went strong to the rim and clanked it? Did going up strong withe intent to dunk give Josh 2 points? No, putting the ball through the hoop does, and Amile has shown an excellent knack for converting offensive boards into points through his quickness and angles to the rim and collecting passes and immediately going to the rim rather than gathering himself for an explosive and powerful dunk. In fact, I remember Mason getting blocked much, much more often by gathering himself withe intent of going up strong (this happened at least 3 times just in the Miami game).
I for one appreciate what Amile does on offense and have been pleasantly impressed by how much he has improved over the course of the year so far.

Well, you obviously have not watched enough Duke games this year then, if that's the only one you remember-- or else you aren't paying attention-- it's happened at least 5 times, probably closer to 10.

As for Hairston, I must bite my tongue, lest I get banned for violating this board's prohibition on being overly critical of Duke players-- cold-eyed assessments of Duke players are not particularly welcome around here-- as your response above only underlines... the attempted dunk that you mention was not simply "clanked" off the rim-- Hairston's lack of quickness and jumping ability meant that two opposing players managed to get clean partial blocks on that shot attempt, such that Hairston started to lose control of the ball before he got to the basket, causing him to clank it off the rim... this is not unusual for Hairston-- but Jefferson does not have Hairston's physical limitations-- so, no, Hairston would not be my role model for things that I would hope to see Jefferson begin to do on the court.

flyingdutchdevil
02-13-2013, 12:51 PM
Just saw this on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9F6LHnkOUdA

It's about the physical transformation of a few Mizzu players, including Alex Oriakhi. I wish DukeBluePlanet would do something similar with Amile - I have a feeling that transformation will be ridiculous.