Bruin Ruin

[SoCalDukeFan]

Article on the front page about UCLA.

I am certainly not going to defend Howland or try to say that everything is ok in Westwood, but to be fair Tony Parker is not playing because he is injured.

Personally I think there are lots wrong with the Bruins. I only watched the 2nd half last night but Shabazz and Anderson were not impressive at all. They have 8 scholarship players and one of them is hurt. The Wear Twins are really two guys with about the same skills. Drew II is Drew II. Team chemistry and perimeter defense were hard to find.

My UCLA friends tell me that team chemistry and defense take time to develop and its a young team. They did go to China but without Shabazz.

Will be interesting to watch but Howland may be nearing the end of his run.

SoCal

[Nosbleuatu]

SoCal,

Is there a feeling from UCLA fans that chemistry will improve with the departures of Smith and Lamb? I'm wondering which players are jumping ship, and whether it means things might turn around or just sink faster...

[burnspbesq]

SoCal,

Is there a feeling from UCLA fans that chemistry will improve with the departures of Smith and Lamb? I'm wondering which players are jumping ship, and whether it means things might turn around or just sink faster...

Lest we forget, at about this time in 1979, the cover story in SI was headlined "The Bruins Are in Ruins." That freshman-heavy UCLA team ended up a missed Kiki Vandeweghe layup from winning the national championship.

[Cameron]

Lest we forget, at about this time in 1979, the cover story in SI was headlined "The Bruins Are in Ruins." That freshman-heavy UCLA team ended up a missed Kiki Vandeweghe layup from winning the national championship.

As I said in the other thread, Ben Howland is the problem. There is a pattern of ineptitude in Westwood and it starts and ends with the coaching. The talent has been there, and yet, UCLA has missed the NCAAs two of the last three years, suffered through a 14-18 campaign in 2010, and consistently drops embarrassing game after embarrassing game to teams that casual fans have never even heard of. Cal Poly, Cal Irvine (the Bruins actually won this one, in an OT squeaker), Middle Tennessee, Montana, Portland, Loyola Marymount, etc.

If UCLA doesn't regroup and reach the Final Four this year, Howland is through. Frankly, he should have been through after last season. Competency is clearly lacking in LA. There appears to be a major problem with regard to team chemistry and the ability of Howland to get his guys to buy in. You can it see right out there on the floor. Just watch a UCLA game. There is none.

[Kdogg]

As I said in the other thread, Ben Howland is the problem. There is a pattern of ineptitude in Westwood and it starts and ends with the coaching. The talent has been there, and yet, UCLA has missed the NCAAs two of the last three years, suffered through a 14-18 campaign in 2010, and consistently drops embarrassing game after embarrassing game to teams that casual fans have never even heard of. Cal Poly, Cal Irvine (the Bruins actually won this one, in an OT squeaker), Middle Tennessee, Montana, Portland, Loyola Marymount, etc.

If UCLA doesn't regroup and reach the Final Four this year, Howland is through. Frankly, he should have been through after last season. Competency is clearly lacking in LA. There appears to be a major problem with regard to team chemistry and the ability of Howland to get his guys to buy in. You can it see right out there on the floor. Just watch a UCLA game. There is none.

How is this different from UCLA under Lavin? His NCAA performance is the only thing that kept him in Westwood for so long.

[MChambers]

As I said in the other thread, Ben Howland is the problem. There is a pattern of ineptitude in Westwood and it starts and ends with the coaching. The talent has been there, and yet, UCLA has missed the NCAAs two of the last three years, suffered through a 14-18 campaign in 2010, and consistently drops embarrassing game after embarrassing game to teams that casual fans have never even heard of. Cal Poly, Cal Irvine (the Bruins actually won this one, in an OT squeaker), Middle Tennessee, Montana, Portland, Loyola Marymount, etc.

If UCLA doesn't regroup and reach the Final Four this year, Howland is through. Frankly, he should have been through after last season. Competency is clearly lacking in LA. There appears to be a major problem with regard to team chemistry and the ability of Howland to get his guys to buy in. You can it see right out there on the floor. Just watch a UCLA game. There is none.
That's what shocked me about the SI article: it portrayed Howland as completely out of touch with his players. I really haven't seen that refuted.

[Greg_Newton]

Shabazz might have cost himself a lot of money by going to UCLA, even if the rumors are true. He could always pull a 180, but if I were an NBA GM drafting today, I wouldn't draft him before mid-lottery, maybe later.

He's not really a shooter, he's a ballstopper, he hasn't even shown he can win with a talented team against mediocre competition, and maybe worst of all... he's fat. How an elite, 6'5 college basketball player lets that happen, I have no clue, but it's not a good sign.

[BD80]

... fat ... elite, 6'5 college basketball player ...

Charles Barkley?

[miramar]

Lest we forget, at about this time in 1979, the cover story in SI was headlined "The Bruins Are in Ruins." That freshman-heavy UCLA team ended up a missed Kiki Vandeweghe layup from winning the national championship.

I still remember that article and also the championship game against Louisville. IIRC that layup would have put UCLA up by seven, but after the miss Louisville immediately took the ball down to close to three and eventually won the game.

I think your comments present two questions: 1) are the current UCLA freshmen as good as the four in 1979-80? and 2) is Ben Howland as good as Larry Brown?

I would say that the answer to the first question is yes on paper, but we'll have to see how that works out on the hardwood. The second question is much easier to answer.

[Clipsfan]

I grew up in LA and went to UCLA for my masters so have a strong affiliation and many good friends who are avid fans. The general feeling is that Howland, never a good offensive coach, has lost all buy-in from the players on the defensive side and needs to go. There have been enough stories out there about how the "star" players ran the team/created conflict that there is likely some truth. I was talking with someone who deals with Howland on a regular basis just this afternoon and he agreed with the general consensus. The only reason Howland was kept for this year was because of the recruiting class. This start to the season is likely the nail. What's funny, for those who watched the game yesterday and thought UCLA was awful, is that it was one of their better played games. I am still hoping that as Shabazz continues to heal from his shoulder injury and hopefully Parker gets healthy that Kyle will learn to shoot and the team will realize it has enough talent to win despite the coach. That happened quite a bit under Lavin...the downside would be that Howland might save his job and we'd be subjected to another season of early losses to teams that you didn't know existed.

[Cameron]

I grew up in LA and went to UCLA for my masters so have a strong affiliation and many good friends who are avid fans. The general feeling is that Howland, never a good offensive coach, has lost all buy-in from the players on the defensive side and needs to go. There have been enough stories out there about how the "star" players ran the team/created conflict that there is likely some truth. I was talking with someone who deals with Howland on a regular basis just this afternoon and he agreed with the general consensus. The only reason Howland was kept for this year was because of the recruiting class. This start to the season is likely the nail. What's funny, for those who watched the game yesterday and thought UCLA was awful, is that it was one of their better played games. I am still hoping that as Shabazz continues to heal from his shoulder injury and hopefully Parker gets healthy that Kyle will learn to shoot and the team will realize it has enough talent to win despite the coach. That happened quite a bit under Lavin...the downside would be that Howland might save his job and we'd be subjected to another season of early losses to teams that you didn't know existed.

Thanks for the insight. I agree that with all of the stories of tumult in Westwood floating out there right now that there has to be some validity to them. UCLA is in a state of disorder and Ben Howland needs to go. The product on the court for the talent that is there is beyond atrocious. I don't know how it can even be defended at this point.

[yootheman]

Shabazz might have cost himself a lot of money by going to UCLA, even if the rumors are true. He could always pull a 180, but if I were an NBA GM drafting today, I wouldn't draft him before mid-lottery, maybe later.

He's not really a shooter, he's a ballstopper, he hasn't even shown he can win with a talented team against mediocre competition, and maybe worst of all... he's fat. How an elite, 6'5 college basketball player lets that happen, I have no clue, but it's not a good sign.

Uncle Drew?

[SoCalDukeFan]

I grew up in LA and went to UCLA for my masters so have a strong affiliation and many good friends who are avid fans. The general feeling is that Howland, never a good offensive coach, has lost all buy-in from the players on the defensive side and needs to go. There have been enough stories out there about how the "star" players ran the team/created conflict that there is likely some truth. I was talking with someone who deals with Howland on a regular basis just this afternoon and he agreed with the general consensus. The only reason Howland was kept for this year was because of the recruiting class. This start to the season is likely the nail. What's funny, for those who watched the game yesterday and thought UCLA was awful, is that it was one of their better played games. I am still hoping that as Shabazz continues to heal from his shoulder injury and hopefully Parker gets healthy that Kyle will learn to shoot and the team will realize it has enough talent to win despite the coach. That happened quite a bit under Lavin...the downside would be that Howland might save his job and we'd be subjected to another season of early losses to teams that you didn't know existed.

Its funny that you say it was one of their "better played games." My friend who went to UCLA and follows them more closely than I said the same thing to me. And I thought they looked pretty mediocre. Of course, I was comparing to a Duke team that is a pretty much a veteran team with a frosh who fits right in.

Sjhabazz should heal, Parker should get healthy, whether or not Kyle becomes a great shooter I don't know.

I think its going to be a long season for the Bruins. Where is there leadership? Drew II is the only senior on the team and the Wears the only juniors that get playing time. Also how do the parts Howland has left fit the team and style that Howland wants to play? How will the frosh react to the negativity of losing?

SoCal

[sue71, esq]

The exodous out of Westwood started several years ago. Chace Stanback went to UNLV (graduated in May), as did current Runnin Rebel Mike Moser. Stanback excelled at UNLV and Moser has developed into a legitimate MWC & National POY candidate. Drew Gordon went to New Mexico and also excelled there (also graduated in May), with several MWC POW awards. Matt Carlino transferred to BYU. They're not the only ones, but definitely some of the more prominent players, and they've definitely done better for their new schools than at UCLA. There was a great deal of discontent among UCLA supporters with the fact that these guys (in particular) were gaining not only conference, but national recognition (at times), playing with their respective new schools (having left UCLA). The cry seemed to question how Howland could let them go...

You might find this March 2012 article (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1195501/index.htm) from CNNSI interesting background.

[Clipsfan]

That article was a hack job but there was some element if truth. That's the article referred to above. Still, those departures hurt ( especially seeing how well Moser has done).

SoCal - you're correct that it was a poor performance by UCLA. Their other games were just that bad. My UCLA friends are sick of my comments about how Coach K wouldn't let something or other happen. Makes this Duke team that much more fun to watch.

[mgtr]

If things are so bad, why not get of Howland right now? I'm sure you could get Seth Greenberg :D. I would guess that UCLA wants a top line coach, so they could bring in an interim coach for the rest of the year. Lets see now, are there any ex-UNC coaches that are available? :D I suppose we will be reminded of this for a couple years, but Rick Majerus would have been great at coming in for half a season, shape there guys up, and win a few games. There are so many ways he will be missed. Sad.

[English]

If things are so bad, why not get of Howland right now? I'm sure you could get Seth Greenberg :D. I would guess that UCLA wants a top line coach, so they could bring in an interim coach for the rest of the year. Lets see now, are there any ex-UNC coaches that are available? :D I suppose we will be reminded of this for a couple years, but Rick Majerus would have been great at coming in for half a season, shape there guys up, and win a few games. There are so many ways he will be missed. Sad.

With his resume (and recent affinity for getting back on the CBB bench), this seems like it would have been a perfect fit for Larry Brown. He's shown a chronic pattern of only committing to short term salvage projects and is obviously a wiz as a coach. His style has typically been defense-focused, so it's unclear if it would translate to getting a group of undisciplined talent to buy in while they're in town for a year or two, but if he can do it repeatedly with some bottom-of-the-barrel NBA talent (e.g., Bobcats), he should be able to do it with the type of talent in Westwood. Plus, he's gotten some national recruits to look toward Dallas and SMU, so there's little doubt in my mind that he could compete on the recruiting trail to bring more kids to UCLA going forward.

I'm not a historian of UCLA, so perhaps there's bad blood in the past--I'm speaking principally of a match between Brown's skillset and what's available these days at UCLA.

[Clipsfan]

I don't know what the chances are, but there is some hope among some i know that the UCLA job would be appealing enough to get one of the up and coming coaches who have stayed at schools like Butler and VCU.

[tommy]

With his resume (and recent affinity for getting back on the CBB bench), this seems like it would have been a perfect fit for Larry Brown. He's shown a chronic pattern of only committing to short term salvage projects and is obviously a wiz as a coach. His style has typically been defense-focused, so it's unclear if it would translate to getting a group of undisciplined talent to buy in while they're in town for a year or two, but if he can do it repeatedly with some bottom-of-the-barrel NBA talent (e.g., Bobcats), he should be able to do it with the type of talent in Westwood. Plus, he's gotten some national recruits to look toward Dallas and SMU, so there's little doubt in my mind that he could compete on the recruiting trail to bring more kids to UCLA going forward.

I'm not a historian of UCLA, so perhaps there's bad blood in the past--I'm speaking principally of a match between Brown's skillset and what's available these days at UCLA.

Brown had verbally accepted an offer to leave Kansas and return to UCLA in 1988. UCLA had the media event planned and ready to go. Brown got on a plane to return to Lawrence to tell the Kansas folks, but while there he had a change of heart and decided to stay put. This did not go over well in Westwood.

It's been 25 years, so I don't know how many of those negative feelings remain in UCLA's craw. But those events, plus Brown's age I think would make him an unlikely candidate to succeed the doomed Howland.

Who might be in the mix? I'd say Steve Fisher, but he's too old too, probably. I'd expect to see Mark Few, maybe Steve Alford thrown out there. Jamie Dixon would've been in there except they're not going to hire Howland's successor at Pitt. And Dixon now has an ACC job. The obligatory call would be made to Shaka Smart, but I don't see that one happening. Have to think about what other names will be on the list.

All I know is this: AD Dan Guerrero better get it right. He missed on several football coaches -- badly -- before finally bagging the right guy in Jim Mora, Jr. Can't miss on the basketball hire at UCLA.

[roywhite]

Who might be in the mix? I'd say Steve Fisher, but he's too old too, probably. I'd expect to see Mark Few, maybe Steve Alford thrown out there. Jamie Dixon would've been in there except they're not going to hire Howland's successor at Pitt. And Dixon now has an ACC job. The obligatory call would be made to Shaka Smart, but I don't see that one happening. Have to think about what other names will be on the list.

All I know is this: AD Dan Guerrero better get it right. He missed on several football coaches -- badly -- before finally bagging the right guy in Jim Mora, Jr. Can't miss on the basketball hire at UCLA.

Gotta look at Brad Stevens from Butler.

Don't know if he would be interested, but he is IMO a guy that could handle a job on the order of UCLA, Kansas, Duke, or UNC. A possible presentation to Stevens would be that he could follow in the steps of John Wooden, a quiet guy from Indiana.

[-jk]

Gotta look at Brad Stevens from Butler.

Don't know if he would be interested, but he is IMO a guy that could handle a job on the order of UCLA, Kansas, Duke, or UNC. A possible presentation to Stevens would be that he could follow in the steps of John Wooden, a quiet guy from Indiana.

I hope Stevens is bright enough to steer well clear of Westwood. No good deed goes unpunished there.

Duke, KU, and unc are all dramatically more civilized places to coach. Hell, it's been 50 years since a coach has been burned in effigy.

-jk

[BD80]

I hope Stevens is bright enough to steer well clear of Westwood. No good deed goes unpunished there.

Duke, KU, and unc are all dramatically more civilized places to coach. Hell, it's been 50 years since a coach has been burned in effigy.

-jk

I'm a bit deficient in knowlege of bruin doins. Can you give me a short list of some of the good deeds committed there?

And where the heck is effigy?

[77devil]

Duke, KU, and unc are all dramatically more civilized places to coach. Hell, it's been 50 years since a coach has been burned in effigy.

-jk

It was pretty close for two coaches in the '70's at one of these campuses.

[Cameron]

I think John Beilein might be a dark horse candidate for the UCLA job. What he's done while at his most recent stops at West Virginia and Michigan is nothing short of impressive, bringing two once proud programs back from the ruins -- and in Michigan's case, at least the first or second ring of hell -- and rebuilding each into national powers. Beilein took West Virginia to the precipice of a Final Four in '05, dropping the last game of the season in OT to Louisville in the great eight. And the restoration job he's in the middle of working on in Ann Arbor currently has the Wolverines ranked No. 3 in the land and the beneficiaries of a top ten national recruiting class this fall.

Beilein is an excellent recruiter (not sure, however, what his pipeline is like out West), has proven to get just as much out of unheralded kids at WVU as he does from highly touted ones at UofM, coaches an exciting style of play predicated on versatile players who can get out and run and chuck threes, and great success seems to follow him everywhere. He'd be an excellent person to at least give a call.

Another name to throw out there might be Mick Cronin. He's a Cincinnati guy, but Westwood might be enough to lure Cronin away. He has the Bearcats in the top 15 nationally and back to playing the brand of successful ball that Bobby Huggins had Cincy playing in the late '90s.

[burnspbesq]

Two more names to add to the discussion would be Dave Rice (UNLV) and Randy Bennett (St. Mary's).

[burnspbesq]

And where the heck is effigy?

Isn't it south of Charlotte, near Waxhaw?

[-jk]

I'm a bit deficient in knowlege of bruin doins. Can you give me a short list of some of the good deeds committed there?

And where the heck is effigy?

Perhaps I should have suggested no deed goes unpunished at ucla.

And I think it's been firmly established that Effigy is somewhere just outside Charlotte.

-jk

[lotusland]

Isn't it south of Charlotte, near Waxhaw?

That'd be Marvin or Mineral Springs. I think Effigy is northwest of the Charlotte near Bessemer City.

[roywhite]

Isn't it south of Charlotte, near Waxhaw?

My bad.

I was thinking it was up in a corner of Wake County, kind of in between Zebulon and Lizard Lick.

[tommy]

Two more names to add to the discussion would be Dave Rice (UNLV) and Randy Bennett (St. Mary's).

Write this down. UCLA will not be hiring a basketball coach from UNLV. Especially one who played for and maintains many close and direct ties with Jerry Tarkanian.

[Indoor66]

That'd be Marvin or Mineral Springs. I think Effigy is northwest of the Charlotte near Bessemer City.

Check your geography. Effigy has always been a suburb of Cherryville. Max told me so himself.

[miramar]

Write this down. UCLA will not be hiring a basketball coach from UNLV. Especially one who played for and maintains many close and direct ties with Jerry Tarkanian.

That goes back to the early seventies when Tarkanian was coaching at Cal State Long Beach, where he built a powerhouse program that few people remember. Tarkanian would complain that UCLA wouldn't schedule him, although the two teams met three straight times in the NCAA regionals, including one time that UCLA won by only two. Tark would also complain that UCLA wasn't as squeaky clean as you might think based on Coach Wooden's exalted reputation.

Our old friend Tark was of course exactly right on both points, which is why UCLA would look askance at Rice. But it has been a long time and Coach Wooden has passed away, so while Rice won't be at the top of UCLA's list, neither was Coach Wooden in his day. It all depends on how desperate they get.

[ChillinDuke]

I hope Stevens is bright enough to steer well clear of Westwood. No good deed goes unpunished there.

Duke, KU, and unc are all dramatically more civilized places to coach. Hell, it's been 50 years since a coach has been burned in effigy.

-jk

Not that I know a whole lot about specifics on UCLA or their program. But would anyone steer well clear of that job? Isn't it one of the premier posts in all the land?

I get that Howland has been far from a success there, to put things nicely. But it's still UCLA. Wouldn't just about any coach at least entertain the offer? I just can't imagine what a coach would be waiting for if not a program like UCLA. No?

- Chillin

[Cameron]

Not that I know a whole lot about specifics on UCLA or their program. But would anyone steer well clear of that job? Isn't it one of the premier posts in all the land?

I get that Howland has been far from a success there, to put things nicely. But it's still UCLA. Wouldn't just about any coach at least entertain the offer? I just can't imagine what a coach would be waiting for if not a program like UCLA. No?

- Chillin

I would tend to agree with you on this. The only reason that I could see a coach fully steering clear of the UCLA job is a desire to not live in L.A. nor have to deal with the extra "hoopla," for lack of a better term, that might accompany coaching the Bruins under the bright lights of tinseltown, but not jobs at other big time schools (save, of course, for Kentucky. Big Blue Nation is like an alien race.)

Brad Stevens, for instance, probably wouldn't be a good fit in Westwood. He's made mention serveral times that he absolutely loves the small school he is currently employed at and the small town feel of Indianapolis. He's your traditional "hoosier," so to speak, and I don't think Los Angeles would be the greatest of fits for him. Although, I am confident that Stevens could perform the job well if he did. He seems much more suited for a job at Duke or North Carolina or Connecticut. I think that Tom Crean will be at IU for at least 15 more years -- if he doesn't get the professional itch -- so I do not see Bloomington in Stevens' future.

Just my opinion.

[COYS]

Not that I know a whole lot about specifics on UCLA or their program. But would anyone steer well clear of that job? Isn't it one of the premier posts in all the land?

I get that Howland has been far from a success there, to put things nicely. But it's still UCLA. Wouldn't just about any coach at least entertain the offer? I just can't imagine what a coach would be waiting for if not a program like UCLA. No?

- Chillin

I completely agree. Arizona and Gonzaga can recruit pretty well, but aside from those two, UCLA has free reign to bring in virtually all of the west coast recruits plus enough of a national profile to attract the odd east coaster or two. The history of the program combined with its stature among schools in the west has got to make it an intriguing destination.

That being said, it does have its disadvantages. The Lakers and even the Clippers rule LA basketball, no matter how good UCLA is. Plus, a coach will have to be willing to deal with the Tinsel Town lifestyle with its glitz and glamour. However, the administration has been very patient with Howland, implying that a new coach would get a fair shot even if there are some struggles early on. To be honest, it's rare to find a premier program that is as patient with its coaches as UCLA has been with Howland considering the rash of transfers, the underwhelming seasons, and the negative publicity that has come out regarding the Reeves Nelson situation (yes, he was a bad apple, but Howland has to take some blame for not nipping that situation in the bud). Plus, Howland has been successful on the recruiting circuit despite employing an aesthetically unappealing defense first style. Even his top teams were relatively poor on the offensive end, with the exception of his 2008 squad when the offense went through the ultra-efficient Kevin Love. A coach with a slightly more attractive style might even be able to improve UCLA's recruiting.

[wilko]

So the real question - the only question worth asking...
Who is likely to want to transfer to Duke?

[tommy]

I completely agree. Arizona and Gonzaga can recruit pretty well, but aside from those two, UCLA has free reign to bring in virtually all of the west coast recruits plus enough of a national profile to attract the odd east coaster or two. The history of the program combined with its stature among schools in the west has got to make it an intriguing destination.

That being said, it does have its disadvantages. The Lakers and even the Clippers rule LA basketball, no matter how good UCLA is. Plus, a coach will have to be willing to deal with the Tinsel Town lifestyle with its glitz and glamour. However, the administration has been very patient with Howland, implying that a new coach would get a fair shot even if there are some struggles early on. To be honest, it's rare to find a premier program that is as patient with its coaches as UCLA has been with Howland considering the rash of transfers, the underwhelming seasons, and the negative publicity that has come out regarding the Reeves Nelson situation (yes, he was a bad apple, but Howland has to take some blame for not nipping that situation in the bud). Plus, Howland has been successful on the recruiting circuit despite employing an aesthetically unappealing defense first style. Even his top teams were relatively poor on the offensive end, with the exception of his 2008 squad when the offense went through the ultra-efficient Kevin Love. A coach with a slightly more attractive style might even be able to improve UCLA's recruiting.

Howland's recruiting was very good in his first few years, then not so hot the last few -- including the fact that a number of pretty highly rated guys turned out to just not be that good -- then he came up with the monster class for this season. Sure, he could've been more consistent, but the problem at UCLA is not an inability to recruit.

I've been to dozens of UCLA home games in the years I've lived in LA, and I really think one of the problems with the program has to do with (not sure what the right word is here) but maybe atmospherics. Meaning, the environment in the arena is just not very exciting. It's dead. There's no electricity in the air. And it's almost always been that way. In the Harrick era there were some electric environments when they'd play Lute Olson's Arizona teams, but not a whole lot of other times.

As stated above, this is a Lakers basketball town, no question. It seems like there's just not any intensity to the fans' approach to UCLA basketball. It's just something to do, to go to a Bruins game. The fans arrive a little late, they've got plans to do something else after the game, but they're just not living and dying with the team like they do in Durham, Lexington, Syracuse, Lawrence, or lots of other places.

Even the students don't really bring it. They aren't seated on top of the court. They arrive late sometimes too. It seems like they've just come in from the beach or throwing the frisbee or a bike ride or whatever, and this is just another stop during their day. And they're not all that into basketball and not all that knowledgeable about the game.

And the "deadness" of the atmosphere in the stands definitely has an impact on what's going on on the court. UCLA rarely plays with focus and intensity. They always seem kinda sleepy out there, just like the crowd. No sense of urgency at all.

So I don't know. Howland has certainly struggled, but he didn't forget how to coach winning basketball. He was very successful, against a consistently better league than he's playing in now, while at Pitt, and he took 3 UCLA teams to Final Fours. The obvious retort to " those teams had overwhelming talent" is "so does this one." There's no question that the heat is on. An earlier poster is correct in that UCLA does not fire coaches willy-nilly; they're almost always given plenty of time to prove themselves. And part of that is money -- UCLA has been notoriouslly cheap, until the hire of Jim Mora, Jr. as football coach, and doesn't want to be paying big bucks to more than one coach in the same sport. But this thing is a mess right now, and Dan Guerrero's hand may be forced if the downward spiral continues.

[Duvall]

So the real question - the only question worth asking...
Who is likely to want to transfer to Duke?

Does UCLA have a player left that Duke would want?

[TKG]

Would there be mutual interest between UCLA and Calipari?

[g-money]

Howland's recruiting was very good in his first few years, then not so hot the last few -- including the fact that a number of pretty highly rated guys turned out to just not be that good -- then he came up with the monster class for this season. Sure, he could've been more consistent, but the problem at UCLA is not an inability to recruit.

I've been to dozens of UCLA home games in the years I've lived in LA, and I really think one of the problems with the program has to do with (not sure what the right word is here) but maybe atmospherics. Meaning, the environment in the arena is just not very exciting. It's dead. There's no electricity in the air. And it's almost always been that way. In the Harrick era there were some electric environments when they'd play Lute Olson's Arizona teams, but not a whole lot of other times.

As stated above, this is a Lakers basketball town, no question. It seems like there's just not any intensity to the fans' approach to UCLA basketball. It's just something to do, to go to a Bruins game. The fans arrive a little late, they've got plans to do something else after the game, but they're just not living and dying with the team like they do in Durham, Lexington, Syracuse, Lawrence, or lots of other places.

Even the students don't really bring it. They aren't seated on top of the court. They arrive late sometimes too. It seems like they've just come in from the beach or throwing the frisbee or a bike ride or whatever, and this is just another stop during their day. And they're not all that into basketball and not all that knowledgeable about the game.

And the "deadness" of the atmosphere in the stands definitely has an impact on what's going on on the court. UCLA rarely plays with focus and intensity. They always seem kinda sleepy out there, just like the crowd. No sense of urgency at all.

So I don't know. Howland has certainly struggled, but he didn't forget how to coach winning basketball. He was very successful, against a consistently better league than he's playing in now, while at Pitt, and he took 3 UCLA teams to Final Fours. The obvious retort to " those teams had overwhelming talent" is "so does this one." There's no question that the heat is on. An earlier poster is correct in that UCLA does not fire coaches willy-nilly; they're almost always given plenty of time to prove themselves. And part of that is money -- UCLA has been notoriouslly cheap, until the hire of Jim Mora, Jr. as football coach, and doesn't want to be paying big bucks to more than one coach in the same sport. But this thing is a mess right now, and Dan Guerrero's hand may be forced if the downward spiral continues.

Good post. As a NorCal resident, I would argue you could exchange "UCLA" for "West Coast U" and have it hold true in almost every case.

This is not exactly earth-shattering news, but you rarely see truly fanatical fans out here, which has a particularly large impact on the atmosphere of college sporting events.

In part I think this is the result of the mild winters, which let people play sports outside instead of being stuck inside watching them. And on a December day that is 65 and sunny, I'm not complaining!

[wilko]

Gotta look at Brad Stevens from Butler.

I hope Kevin White has him on some kind of retainer... something to ensure he'll pick up the phone and talk when that fateful day comes...

[-jk]

Good post. As a NorCal resident, I would argue you could exchange "UCLA" for "West Coast U" and have it hold true in almost every case.

This is not exactly earth-shattering news, but you rarely see truly fanatical fans out here, which has a particularly large impact on the atmosphere of college sporting events.

In part I think this is the result of the mild winters, which let people play sports outside instead of being stuck inside watching them. And on a December day that is 65 and sunny, I'm not complaining!


Ha! In dc today it was 72 and sunny.

-jk

[lotusland]

Would there be mutual interest between UCLA and Calipari?

That would be fabulous just to hear UK fans turn on Cal once he left them High and Dry.

[Ichabod Drain]

A lot of told me this wasn’t for me I wish I would’ve listened

— tony parker (@tonyparker32) December 23, 2012

Being in LA for Christmas is nothing like home

— tony parker (@tonyparker32) December 25, 2012

Counting down the days

— tony parker (@tonyparker32) December 25, 2012


Sounds like more troubles in Westwood. Kinda feel bad for the kid but he made the decision.

[JasonEvans]

A lot of told me this wasn’t for me I wish I would’ve listened

— tony parker (@tonyparker32) December 23, 2012

Being in LA for Christmas is nothing like home

— tony parker (@tonyparker32) December 25, 2012

Counting down the days

— tony parker (@tonyparker32) December 25, 2012

Sounds like more troubles in Westwood. Kinda feel bad for the kid but he made the decision.

Plenty of folks in the College Basketball world are talking about (http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/12/27/tony-parkers-homesick-tweets-say-more-about-ucla-than-about-parker/) this. Parker said he plans to stay at UCLA "this year." Sounds like he will seriously consider seeking a new home over the summer.

By the way, the best headline out of the Parker story is this one from BruinsNation.com:

Tony Parker is Sick and Miserable in Ben Howland’s Dead & Joyless UCLA Basketball Program (http://www.bruinsnation.com/2012/12/24/3801538/ucla-basketball-fire-ben-howland-tony-parker)

The rest of the article is a fun read!

-Jason "and that article comes from a UCLA fan site! Yikes!" Evans

[sagegrouse]

Plenty of folks in the College Basketball world are talking about (http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/12/27/tony-parkers-homesick-tweets-say-more-about-ucla-than-about-parker/) this. Parker said he plans to stay at UCLA "this year." Sounds like he will seriously consider seeking a new home over the summer.

By the way, the best headline out of the Parker story is this one from BruinsNation.com:

Tony Parker is Sick and Miserable in Ben Howland’s Dead & Joyless UCLA Basketball Program (http://www.bruinsnation.com/2012/12/24/3801538/ucla-basketball-fire-ben-howland-tony-parker)

The rest of the article is a fun read!

-Jason "and that article comes from a UCLA fan site! Yikes!" Evans

With "friends" like Nestor, the author of the post, UCLA has no need for enemies. -- sagegrouse

[OldPhiKap]

Plenty of folks in the College Basketball world are talking about (http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/12/27/tony-parkers-homesick-tweets-say-more-about-ucla-than-about-parker/) this. Parker said he plans to stay at UCLA "this year." Sounds like he will seriously consider seeking a new home over the summer.



He better start the press conference in May if he wants to conclude before the next season starts.

In all seriousness, I feel bad for the kid. Some choices don't work out well, and most of us never have to make decisions in the spotlight. Even if an eighteen year old kid bought into the rush of early stardom, that doesn't make it easy to step back with maturity and take your lumps.


This reminds me a lot of McCants and the "UNC is like jail" comment. Change is coming to Westwood, and they can only hope to convince Parker to ride it out. Sounds from those tweets that part of the problem isn't the program though -- it's L.A.

[Starter]

Man, so much talent in that wack-job program. Shabazz and Kyle Anderson are starting to ball out big time, Jordan Adams has been an enormous pleasant surprise. I'm interested to see how they do against Missouri tonight. But I can't help but think all these guys would be better off elsewhere. Man, would Kyle Anderson be a perfect Duke kid. And Howland's days are numbered. I'm still surprised he survived last year's SI article which basically painted him as a sociopath. On top of that, he came out with this class? This should be a Final Four team, he has that sort of talent.

As for Parker, I've never liked his game, thought he played himself for a fool during his recruitment/announcement. It still rankles me Krzyzewski chased him as much as he did; the level of attention paid by coaches and the media is nowhere near commensurate to his actual game. I feel bad for the kid, but it seems like he went there for all the wrong reasons. If he had come to Duke, I don't know if he'd necessarily be playing that much more. But I feel like he'd be learning the right things and on a path to somewhere instead of nowhere.

[dukejunkie]

Not starting a rumor or even wondering whether it's good or bad but...

If Parker has already decided to move on and transfers in the next few days (if that is what he meant by counting the days), then he should be eligible to play January, 2014, correct? I assume the ship has sailed, but is it possible K would take him?

[Edouble]

Not starting a rumor or even wondering whether it's good or bad but...

If Parker has already decided to move on and transfers in the next few days (if that is what he meant by counting the days), then he should be eligible to play January, 2014, correct? I assume the ship has sailed, but is it possible K would take him?

I think he means counting the days until the end of the year. If he had already decided to transfer, wouldn't he be back in GA by now? No need to stick around over Christmas. Plus, as has already been noted in the thread, he said he plans to stay at UCLA "this year". I assume that means this school year, not the year 2012, but I could be wrong.

Although this thread paints a grim picture of Coach Howland and the college hoops culture in LA, were Parker to transfer to another big time program (eg Duke), I think he would be in the same situation, namely, riding the pine. It was widely discussed during his recruitment that he would not be a big impact freshman. I think that he might find himself behind MP3 and Amile next January, were he to transfer now. Reminds me a bit of the Taylor King and Chris Burgess situations, where highly regarded recruits were told what they needed to work on, decided to transfer instead, and then were told the same thing at their new schools. (King = play D, do more than shoot 3s, Burgess = play in the post)

[JasonEvans]

Not starting a rumor or even wondering whether it's good or bad but...

If Parker has already decided to move on and transfers in the next few days (if that is what he meant by counting the days), then he should be eligible to play January, 2014, correct? I assume the ship has sailed, but is it possible K would take him?

I think it was fairly clear that Parker meant it was just a few days until he would be headed home for the XMas break. He has stated that he plans to be at UCLA for the rest of the year.

I don't know how receptive Duke would be to a Parker transfer. I suppose it is possible, but we have limited scholarships and I am not sure we even would have space for Parker on next year's roster if he wanted to come here. We currently have 11 players under scholarship for next season (Hairston, Thornton, Cook, Hood, Marshall P, Jefferson, Suliamon, Murphy, Jones, Ojeleye, and Parker). The talk is that K will look for a 5th year senior immediately eligible transfer to help us up front. K does not like to carry 13 scholarship players, he almost never does. So, I doubt we would have room for Parker.

Also worth noting that we are looking at several big men who would arrive at Duke the same time Parker would be eligible if he were to transfer. I don't really see a transfer making sense.

--Jason "I suppose it is worth noting as well that Parker is struggling to get minutes at UCLA... and Duke is a better program than UCLA" Evans

[Edouble]

I think it was fairly clear that Parker meant it was just a few days until he would be headed home for the XMas break. He has stated that he plans to be at UCLA for the rest of the year.

I don't know how receptive Duke would be to a Parker transfer. I suppose it is possible, but we have limited scholarships and I am not sure we even would have space for Parker on next year's roster if he wanted to come here. We currently have 11 players under scholarship for next season (Hairston, Thornton, Cook, Hood, Marshall P, Jefferson, Suliamon, Murphy, Jones, Ojeleye, and Parker). The talk is that K will look for a 5th year senior immediately eligible transfer to help us up front. K does not like to carry 13 scholarship players, he almost never does. So, I doubt we would have room for Parker.

Also worth noting that we are looking at several big men who would arrive at Duke the same time Parker would be eligible if he were to transfer. I don't really see a transfer making sense.

--Jason "I suppose it is worth noting as well that Parker is struggle to get minutes at UCLA... and Duke is a better program than UCLA" Evans

Wow... I really think Duke would take him.

As long as there was no bad blood from the way that Parker told Coach K "no" earlier this year, I can't see Coach K turning him down. He's a kid and he made a mistake. He's admitted it to the whole world over twitter. That's gotta be a little bit humbling. I say that we would take him, in part, because Coach K wanted him sooo badly. Even if we get him in a manner that we did not originally anticipate, I think Coach K would love to have him in the program.

I will be curious to follow Parker's transfer at the end of the school year and see where Duke plays into things, if at all.

[oldnavy]

Wow... I really think Duke would take him.

As long as there was no bad blood from the way that Parker told Coach K "no" earlier this year, I can't see Coach K turning him down. He's a kid and he made a mistake. He's admitted it to the whole world over twitter. That's gotta be a little bit humbling. I say that we would take him, in part, because Coach K wanted him sooo badly. Even if we get him in a manner that we did not originally anticipate, I think Coach K would love to have him in the program.

I will be curious to follow Parker's transfer at the end of the school year and see where Duke plays into things, if at all.

I could see it happening as well provided the scholarships are there. He would have had two full years of college ball to improve (one year at Duke), so he would be more of a finished product and hopefully more of a realist with regards to his worth as a player (i.e., more humble)...

[Tom B.]

I don't know how receptive Duke would be to a Parker transfer. I suppose it is possible, but we have limited scholarships and I am not sure we even would have space for Parker on next year's roster if he wanted to come here. We currently have 11 players under scholarship for next season (Hairston, Thornton, Cook, Hood, Marshall P, Jefferson, Suliamon, Murphy, Jones, Ojeleye, and Parker). The talk is that K will look for a 5th year senior immediately eligible transfer to help us up front. K does not like to carry 13 scholarship players, he almost never does. So, I doubt we would have room for Parker.

Also worth noting that we are looking at several big men who would arrive at Duke the same time Parker would be eligible if he were to transfer. I don't really see a transfer making sense.

--Jason "I suppose it is worth noting as well that Parker is struggle to get minutes at UCLA... and Duke is a better program than UCLA" Evans


Agree with everything you said -- plus, didn't Parker have a choice quote or two about Duke after he picked UCLA? Something to the effect of how he didn't want to go to Duke and set screens for four years, or something like that? I can't see K being that eager to bring him on board after that.

[UrinalCake]

"Parker is averaging just 3.3 points and 1.4 rebounds in only 8.8 minutes per game even though coach Ben Howland is down to eight scholarship players."

But how many screens does he set per game?

[UrinalCake]

I don't think we'd have any interest in him. Aside from the history, he doesn't seem to fit the playing style we'll have next year, which is fast, athletic, and versatile players who will run like crazy and defend like heck. Sticking a lumbering center in the middle of all that would just clog the lane. Plus there's the small fact that he's just not very good.

[Edouble]

I don't think we'd have any interest in him. Aside from the history, he doesn't seem to fit the playing style we'll have next year, which is fast, athletic, and versatile players who will run like crazy and defend like heck. Sticking a lumbering center in the middle of all that would just clog the lane. Plus there's the small fact that he's just not very good.

Well, if we are running, he can't be clogging the lane in transition, unless he is already back and then we would just get him the ball.

It looks like he wouldn't be available for the 2013-14 season anyway, if he sticks out the school year at UCLA.

I also am not sure if the jury is in on him not being very good. I would trust our staff's opinion of his talent, and they were very high on him 8 months ago. I think he is somewhat of a project player that should be worth the time invested. Common knowledge is that big guys take longer to develop. Just look at our own MP2.

I'm not saying he is good. I just feel like the evidence for him being good (one of our top targets this past year) outweighs the evidence for being bad (he's not playing much for a program, that by many accounts, is a complete mess).

[lotusland]

Well, if we are running, he can't be clogging the lane in transition, unless he is already back and then we would just get him the ball.

It looks like he wouldn't be available for the 2013-14 season anyway, if he sticks out the school year at UCLA.

I also am not sure if the jury is in on him not being very good. I would trust our staff's opinion of his talent, and they were very high on him 8 months ago. I think he is somewhat of a project player that should be worth the time invested. Common knowledge is that big guys take longer to develop. Just look at our own MP2.

I'm not saying he is good. I just feel like the evidence for him being good (one of our top targets this past year) outweighs the evidence for being bad (he's not playing much for a program, that by many accounts, is a complete mess).

Just curious - if Howland is canned could Parker be allowed to transfer and play immediately?

[UrinalCake]

Just curious - if Howland is canned could Parker be allowed to transfer and play immediately?

No. There was some talk of instituting such a rule a couple years ago, but it never passed. Parker could petition the NCAA for a waiver, but it's not likely to be granted unless there's some extenuating circumstance, like a family illness or, in the case of that player from Maryland, being a punk.

The other exception is incoming freshmen who haven't played yet. They can "transfer" to another school without waiting as long as the first school grants them a release.

[DUKIE V(A)]

I don't think we'd have any interest in him. Aside from the history, he doesn't seem to fit the playing style we'll have next year, which is fast, athletic, and versatile players who will run like crazy and defend like heck. Sticking a lumbering center in the middle of all that would just clog the lane. Plus there's the small fact that he's just not very good.

Agree. Amile ended up being a much better fit. Much more versatile offensively and defensively and has a personality that fits the program well.

[Edouble]

Agree. Amile ended up being a much better fit. Much more versatile offensively and defensively and has a personality that fits the program well.

I agree, but I will say that Amile's ability to defend the 5 remains to be seen. He seems more like the Lance Thomas type, that can defend 3s and 4s. TP appears to have the girth of a Boozer/Brand, if not yet the game. TP was also advertised as one that could run the floor well for his size.

[BD80]

He better start the press conference in May if he wants to conclude before the next season starts. ...

Not to worry, he has the transfer year to complete the announcement

[dchen09]

Basketballwise, I don't think he's as bad of a fit as alot of people make it seems. Actually I don't really know what defines a bad fit for our future team. Running fast breaks rarely require all 5 members of the team to run down the floor. Yes, we may lose a bit of mobility, but how many college big man can run the floor like Plumlee or Zeller in the first place? If you think Parker is going to bog down the lane in a half court set, that's not true either. He has the ability to hit that 15-18' jumper when he's open (example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRiFgYnmi3o)). So if the big guarding him decides to help off of him to shut down a driver, he would have the ability to receive the pass and make that shot, a la Boozer. There's not much difference between a big that gets around his defender by facing up and driving and a big that posts up and scores on a back to the basket move. The end result is 2 points and maybe a foul. Spacing is created more by positioning/offensive ability rather than motion. Also, unlike Plumlee or Kelly who have difficult time establishing post position sometimes, Parker can really get deep post position. This opens up the perimeter for our many shooters (Suilamon, Hood, Murphy, Cook, Jones). If anything, just imagine what Josh Hairston has been trying to do this year, but with more natural talent to do it. Defensively, Parker maybe the answer to those big bruisers that often kill our team. How many times have something like Sulliger or Reggie Johnson put up huge numbers on us. How beneficial would it be for us to be able to put someone on them to keep them out of the lane, reducing both in the paint scoring and also offensive rebounding.

I think the real questions for Parker are, is he better than Marshall and if not, is he ok backing Marshall (and maybe Okafor) up? The answer to the first question is probably not. Marshall is taller, more athletic, and faster than Parker. He also has more than a year experience with Duke's offensive and defensive sets. If he's anything like his brothers, he'll get some burn just finishing pick and rolls and cuts to the hoop. If he lives up to the "6th best player in practice" rumor, I would say he is definitely better than Parker who can't even crack the floor at UCLA with only the Wear twins in front of him. However, Marshall will probably get pushed around a bit since he's still rather skinny for a 7ft. He also has quite a short wingspan (6'8) compared to Tony Parker's 7'1. It's his attitude that is the main concern for me. We already know that he wants playing time. Can he really crack our rotation even a year and a half from now (assuming he transfers after this season)? Keep it mind that we're also recruiting Jahlil Okafor for 2014 who has very similar measurements to Tony Parker and probably a superior skillset. I remember Coach K saying he'd love to have Okafor on the team LAST year. Plus, if Parker is homesick at UCLA, I'm not sure Duke is that much better of an environment. Maybe its just Ben Howland but he probably misses the overall southern environment. Duke isn't exactly very Southern either (despite the delicious BBQ).

So, if Parker is ok with potentially getting only garbage minutes in 2014-2015, and possibly only 15-20min for the rest of his career (he'll have 3 years wherever he transfers to), then sure, come to Duke. It would be nice to have a Boozer type player again. Who knows, maybe he'll be a beast on the inside and supplant Marshall Plumlee at the 5. If he's not willing to work for it though, Duke is definitely not the school to come to.

[Edouble]

Basketballwise, I don't think he's as bad of a fit as alot of people make it seems. Actually I don't really know what defines a bad fit for our future team. Running fast breaks rarely require all 5 members of the team to run down the floor. Yes, we may lose a bit of mobility, but how many college big man can run the floor like Plumlee or Zeller in the first place? If you think Parker is going to bog down the lane in a half court set, that's not true either. He has the ability to hit that 15-18' jumper when he's open (example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRiFgYnmi3o)). So if the big guarding him decides to help off of him to shut down a driver, he would have the ability to receive the pass and make that shot, a la Boozer. There's not much difference between a big that gets around his defender by facing up and driving and a big that posts up and scores on a back to the basket move. The end result is 2 points and maybe a foul. Spacing is created more by positioning/offensive ability rather than motion. Also, unlike Plumlee or Kelly who have difficult time establishing post position sometimes, Parker can really get deep post position. This opens up the perimeter for our many shooters (Suilamon, Hood, Murphy, Cook, Jones). If anything, just imagine what Josh Hairston has been trying to do this year, but with more natural talent to do it. Defensively, Parker maybe the answer to those big bruisers that often kill our team. How many times have something like Sulliger or Reggie Johnson put up huge numbers on us. How beneficial would it be for us to be able to put someone on them to keep them out of the lane, reducing both in the paint scoring and also offensive rebounding.

I think the real questions for Parker are, is he better than Marshall and if not, is he ok backing Marshall (and maybe Okafor) up? The answer to the first question is probably not. Marshall is taller, more athletic, and faster than Parker. He also has more than a year experience with Duke's offensive and defensive sets. If he's anything like his brothers, he'll get some burn just finishing pick and rolls and cuts to the hoop. If he lives up to the "6th best player in practice" rumor, I would say he is definitely better than Parker who can't even crack the floor at UCLA with only the Wear twins in front of him. However, Marshall will probably get pushed around a bit since he's still rather skinny for a 7ft. He also has quite a short wingspan (6'8) compared to Tony Parker's 7'1. It's his attitude that is the main concern for me. We already know that he wants playing time. Can he really crack our rotation even a year and a half from now (assuming he transfers after this season)? Keep it mind that we're also recruiting Jahlil Okafor for 2014 who has very similar measurements to Tony Parker and probably a superior skillset. I remember Coach K saying he'd love to have Okafor on the team LAST year. Plus, if Parker is homesick at UCLA, I'm not sure Duke is that much better of an environment. Maybe its just Ben Howland but he probably misses the overall southern environment. Duke isn't exactly very Southern either (despite the delicious BBQ).

So, if Parker is ok with potentially getting only garbage minutes in 2014-2015, and possibly only 15-20min for the rest of his career (he'll have 3 years wherever he transfers to), then sure, come to Duke. It would be nice to have a Boozer type player again. Who knows, maybe he'll be a beast on the inside and supplant Marshall Plumlee at the 5. If he's not willing to work for it though, Duke is definitely not the school to come to.

Great thoughts.

As an Atlanta who attended Duke, I can say with confidence that Durham, NC is much closer, literally and figuratively, to Lithonia, GA than LA, CA! It's an easy 6 hour car trip for family and friends to come and see one of his games and hang out over the weekend. While the student body is not completely Southern, there are more Southerners at Duke than at UCLA.

[tommy]

Parker was disrespectful to Coach Krzyzewski and the program in a public way in the late stages of his recruitment, and showed zero appreciation for the effort Duke put into recruiting him and the opportunity he was being offered. He came across as an ungrateful, immature, self-absorbed, self-deluded jerk, an image he only reinforced with that absurd announcement. I can't imagine any scenario in which K would even consider taking him as a transfer.

[gep]

Parker was disrespectful to Coach Krzyzewski and the program in a public way in the late stages of his recruitment, and showed zero appreciation for the effort Duke put into recruiting him and the opportunity he was being offered. He came across as an ungrateful, immature, self-absorbed, self-deluded jerk, an image he only reinforced with that absurd announcement. I can't imagine any scenario in which K would even consider taking him as a transfer.

Not only this, but I don't think Duke will take a transfer who declined a recruitment for another school. After all, weren't there only 3 transfers under Coach K so far? IIRC, D.Jones, S.Curry, and one other before Jones... :confused: Well, also count R.Hood... so 4 transfers? And, I don't think any of the 4 were recruited by Duke. I personally feel Duke moves forward with what it has and is currently recruiting. The past recruiting misses are just that... misses that's now water under the bridge.

[loran16]

"How did Roy Williams ever let (the Wear twins) get away?!?!" - Bill Walton.

Wait, WHAT?!

[JasonEvans]

Folks, if Tony Parker does decide to transfer, my bet is that he goes to UGA which (according to most reports) was his #2 school when he selected UCLA. In fact, many think Duke was #4 behind Ohio State in TP's pecking order. Georgia would be closer to home and would be a program where instant minutes would seem much more likely to be available versus higher profile programs like Ohio St and Duke.

-Jason

[FerryFor50]

Not only this, but I don't think Duke will take a transfer who declined a recruitment for another school. After all, weren't there only 3 transfers under Coach K so far? IIRC, D.Jones, S.Curry, and one other before Jones... :confused: Well, also count R.Hood... so 4 transfers? And, I don't think any of the 4 were recruited by Duke. I personally feel Duke moves forward with what it has and is currently recruiting. The past recruiting misses are just that... misses that's now water under the bridge.

Rashawn McLeod was the other transfer.

Not sure that there is any rule Duke has in place for transfers that turned them down. That would just be petty. Besides, Duke recruited Parker for a reason. If he still fit a need, I'm sure Duke would take him. The question is, would he still fit a need?

Think of it this way though.... Imagine if a big man recruit who thought Duke wasn't a big man school had a change of heart and transferred here? Wouldn't that be a great recruiting sell for future targets?

[UrinalCake]

Rashawn McLeod was the other transfer.

Good lord! Try Roshown McLeod. The other thing that all four transfers have in common is that they all proved themselves in their time at their previous schools, they weren't brought in based on high school reputation.

[sagegrouse]

Folks, if Tony Parker does decide to transfer, my bet is that he goes to UGA which (according to most reports) was his #2 school when he selected UCLA. In fact, many think Duke was #4 behind Ohio State in TP's pecking order. Georgia would be closer to home and would be a program where instant minutes would seem much more likely to be available versus higher profile programs like Ohio St and Duke.

-Jason

TP only got three minutes in the UCLA upset of Mizzou -- and UCLA played only eight players. Lots of questions about his future worth -- UGa sounds like the right place for him.

sagegrouse

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Folks, if Tony Parker does decide to transfer, my bet is that he goes to UGA which (according to most reports) was his #2 school when he selected UCLA. In fact, many think Duke was #4 behind Ohio State in TP's pecking order. Georgia would be closer to home and would be a program where instant minutes would seem much more likely to be available versus higher profile programs like Ohio St and Duke.

-Jason


TP only got three minutes in the UCLA upset of Mizzou -- and UCLA played only eight players. Lots of questions about his future worth -- UGa sounds like the right place for him.

sagegrouse


Agreed. As evidenced by his constant updating to the media about where he would "take his talents to" during his recruitment and his ludicrous, self-absorbed announcement(all that was missing were some Greek Columns), it's safe to say Tony Parker wants to be a Big Fish in the biggest pond possible.

I think he's finding out that not only is he not a Big Fish in L.A., he's not even a barnacle (something like the server at Applebees saying "you're Tony Who?, sorry you'll still have to pay full price for the queso dip"). Now, I think he has the ability deep inside him (because I think ALL of us do) to become a "somebody" at UNCLA, but TP's going to have to fight for it, but I just don't see it happening.

He's going back to Georgia, IMO, because UGA would allow him to be a Big Shot again at a school that, in his mind, would truly appreciate his talents.

[miramar]

Folks, if Tony Parker does decide to transfer, my bet is that he goes to UGA which (according to most reports) was his #2 school when he selected UCLA. In fact, many think Duke was #4 behind Ohio State in TP's pecking order. Georgia would be closer to home and would be a program where instant minutes would seem much more likely to be available versus higher profile programs like Ohio St and Duke.

-Jason


I believe that Duke wasn't even one of the three caps that Parker took to the presser, but I fell asleep in the middle so I could be wrong.

After so much worrying that he didn't want to be the next Chris Burgess, he has become the next Stuart Gray, UCLA's version of the big man disappointment.

[dchen09]

Folks, if Tony Parker does decide to transfer, my bet is that he goes to UGA which (according to most reports) was his #2 school when he selected UCLA. In fact, many think Duke was #4 behind Ohio State in TP's pecking order. Georgia would be closer to home and would be a program where instant minutes would seem much more likely to be available versus higher profile programs like Ohio St and Duke.

-Jason

I agree he will almost definitely not come to Duke regardless if he transfers or not. I just wanted to point out how he could fit into our system if he did.

[Kdogg]

Good lord! Try Roshown McLeod. The other thing that all four transfers have in common is that they all proved themselves in their time at their previous schools, they weren't brought in based on high school reputation.

Agreed, but we did recruit Ro when he was in high school so the staff knew a good bit about him. (Joey Beard got offered the scholarship first and took it.) He was the first transfer under K so that background info was important back then. For that reason I don't think Duke would be interested. He seems to listen more to his posse than his parents.

[Starter]

Basketballwise, I don't think he's as bad of a fit as alot of people make it seems. Actually I don't really know what defines a bad fit for our future team. Running fast breaks rarely require all 5 members of the team to run down the floor. Yes, we may lose a bit of mobility, but how many college big man can run the floor like Plumlee or Zeller in the first place? If you think Parker is going to bog down the lane in a half court set, that's not true either. He has the ability to hit that 15-18' jumper when he's open (example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRiFgYnmi3o)). So if the big guarding him decides to help off of him to shut down a driver, he would have the ability to receive the pass and make that shot, a la Boozer. There's not much difference between a big that gets around his defender by facing up and driving and a big that posts up and scores on a back to the basket move. The end result is 2 points and maybe a foul. Spacing is created more by positioning/offensive ability rather than motion. Also, unlike Plumlee or Kelly who have difficult time establishing post position sometimes, Parker can really get deep post position. This opens up the perimeter for our many shooters (Suilamon, Hood, Murphy, Cook, Jones). If anything, just imagine what Josh Hairston has been trying to do this year, but with more natural talent to do it. Defensively, Parker maybe the answer to those big bruisers that often kill our team. How many times have something like Sulliger or Reggie Johnson put up huge numbers on us. How beneficial would it be for us to be able to put someone on them to keep them out of the lane, reducing both in the paint scoring and also offensive rebounding.

I think the real questions for Parker are, is he better than Marshall and if not, is he ok backing Marshall (and maybe Okafor) up? The answer to the first question is probably not. Marshall is taller, more athletic, and faster than Parker. He also has more than a year experience with Duke's offensive and defensive sets. If he's anything like his brothers, he'll get some burn just finishing pick and rolls and cuts to the hoop. If he lives up to the "6th best player in practice" rumor, I would say he is definitely better than Parker who can't even crack the floor at UCLA with only the Wear twins in front of him. However, Marshall will probably get pushed around a bit since he's still rather skinny for a 7ft. He also has quite a short wingspan (6'8) compared to Tony Parker's 7'1. It's his attitude that is the main concern for me. We already know that he wants playing time. Can he really crack our rotation even a year and a half from now (assuming he transfers after this season)? Keep it mind that we're also recruiting Jahlil Okafor for 2014 who has very similar measurements to Tony Parker and probably a superior skillset. I remember Coach K saying he'd love to have Okafor on the team LAST year. Plus, if Parker is homesick at UCLA, I'm not sure Duke is that much better of an environment. Maybe its just Ben Howland but he probably misses the overall southern environment. Duke isn't exactly very Southern either (despite the delicious BBQ).

So, if Parker is ok with potentially getting only garbage minutes in 2014-2015, and possibly only 15-20min for the rest of his career (he'll have 3 years wherever he transfers to), then sure, come to Duke. It would be nice to have a Boozer type player again. Who knows, maybe he'll be a beast on the inside and supplant Marshall Plumlee at the 5. If he's not willing to work for it though, Duke is definitely not the school to come to.

I don't know. Maybe I caught him on a bad day last year, but he didn't look very impressive at all when I saw him live, skills- or conditioning-wise. Combine that with an overinflated sense of self-worth, and well... I get the benefit of a guy like Carlos Boozer. I'm just saying this isn't him, at least not yet, and possibly not ever.

I mean, I don't want it to seem like I'm simply angry he didn't pick Duke. Julius Randle didn't want to come to Duke, eliminated them early, cool by me. I was just really put off by Parker seemingly tipping his hand early on that he had no use for his Duke visits, etc., and then continuing to keep them on the hook for months and months. Compare that to someone like Jabari Parker or Karl Towns, each of whom easily could have strung out their recruitment period for months to reap the school visits and attention benefits, but figured out what they wanted and got on with it.

[Kjeffrey]

We currently have 11 players under scholarship for next season (Hairston, Thornton, Cook, Hood, Marshall P, Jefferson, Suliamon, Murphy, Jones, Ojeleye, and Parker). The talk is that K will look for a 5th year senior immediately eligible transfer to help us up front. K does not like to carry 13 scholarship players, he almost never does. So, I doubt we would have room

Is Dawkins not under scholarship for next year?

[DukieInBrasil]

Is Dawkins not under scholarship for next year?

He most certainly will be, if he decides to continue playing basketball. So far, all indications are that he will. Other posters here at DBR have pointed out that he has a) been at all the home games cheering on the team from behind the bench and b) that comments from Dre and his parents indicate that he intends on playing next year. I don't know Dre and have not spoken to him so that's all i can offer.

[blueduke59]

Parker was disrespectful to Coach Krzyzewski and the program in a public way in the late stages of his recruitment, and showed zero appreciation for the effort Duke put into recruiting him and the opportunity he was being offered. He came across as an ungrateful, immature, self-absorbed, self-deluded jerk, an image he only reinforced with that absurd announcement. I can't imagine any scenario in which K would even consider taking him as a transfer.

Gotta agree. If I were K I wouldn't take him if he crawled all the way from Westwood to Durham wearing Duke gear. 5 minutes in that circus they portrayed as an "announcement" earlier this year I was thinking "Dear Lord please make that inflated ego (and body) go somewhere other than Duke".

[sagegrouse]

He most certainly will be, if he decides to continue playing basketball. So far, all indications are that he will. Other posters here at DBR have pointed out that he has a) been at all the home games cheering on the team from behind the bench and b) that comments from Dre and his parents indicate that he intends on playing next year. I don't know Dre and have not spoken to him so that's all i can offer.

Andre, from all reports, is not playing basketball, however. How long will it take him to get back to being a Division I player, and when will he start?

sagegrouse

[Edouble]

Andre, from all reports, is not playing basketball, however. How long will it take him to get back to being a Division I player, and when will he start?

sagegrouse

Good point. I would think he would have to start conditioning some time during the summer. As a life long athlete, I would think he is doing something during the year to stay fit... running/lifting, but who knows? I get stir crazy and my body feels weird when I don't get out and exercise, and I am not a DI athlete. Of course, there are the Kruks and El-Amins of the world, so I guess some athletes are fine with sitting around and eating pizza.

[OldPhiKap]

Good point. I would think he would have to start conditioning some time during the summer. As a life long athlete, I would think he is doing something during the year to stay fit... running/lifting, but who knows? I get stir crazy and my body feels weird when I don't get out and exercise, and I am not a DI athlete. Of course, there are the Kruks and El-Amins of the world, so I guess some athletes are fine with sitting around and eating pizza.

I imagine that the staff gave him some ideas, and I guess he still has access to the conditioning folks if he feels the desire.

[SoCalDukeFan]

I believe that Duke wasn't even one of the three caps that Parker took to the presser, but I fell asleep in the middle so I could be wrong.

After so much worrying that he didn't want to be the next Chris Burgess, he has become the next Stuart Gray, UCLA's version of the big man disappointment.

Stuart Gray had a decent NBA career.

I also think that Coach K is back to recruiting guys he wants to be around and avoiding talented guys he does not want to be around. I would be very surprised if TP came to Duke.

SoCal

[miramar]

Stuart Gray had a decent NBA career.

I also think that Coach K is back to recruiting guys he wants to be around and avoiding talented guys he does not want to be around. I would be very surprised if TP came to Duke.

SoCal

The reason Gray was such a big flop in Westwood is that Alcindor was the best college center of the sixties, Walton the best of the seventies, and Gray was expected to be the best of the eighties. He even dominated Patrick Ewing in a HS all star game and was expected to bring that kind of talent to UCLA.

Gray finally averaged about 10 PPG his junior year, but to his credit he caught on in the NBA. Parker would be lucky to do as well.

I would be equally surprised (stunned actually) if Parker ever wore a Duke uniform.

[timmy c]

I would be equally surprised (stunned actually) if Parker ever wore a Duke uniform.

Complete rumor here, but, I heard he wears his replica #5 Mason Plumlee jersery occasionally.

[BD80]

complete rumor here, but, i heard he wears his replica #5 mason plumlee jersery occasionally.

xxxxxl

[tommy]

Former UCLA washout center Josh Smith is transferring to Georgetown. If Tyler Adams makes it back from his medical issues, the Hoyas better stock up on the XXXXXL drawers. Between the two of them, they should provide a nice hit to the "Georgetown knows how to develop big men" meme.

[SoCalDukeFan]

After UCLA beat Arizona on Senior Day in Pauley, Coach Ben Howland said he had "no doubt" that Shabazz Muhammad had played his last game at Pauley.

While it was expected by most that Shabazz would be "one and done", why would Howland make the statement now? Shouldn't he at least let the player announce it?

SoCal

[FerryFor50]

After UCLA beat Arizona on Senior Day in Pauley, Coach Ben Howland said he had "no doubt" that Shabazz Muhammad had played his last game at Pauley.

While it was expected by most that Shabazz would be "one and done", why would Howland make the statement now? Shouldn't he at least let the player announce it?

SoCal

Well, technically it could be Howland's last game in Pauley, too...

[UrinalCake]

After UCLA beat Arizona on Senior Day in Pauley, Coach Ben Howland said he had "no doubt" that Shabazz Muhammad had played his last game at Pauley.

While it was expected by most that Shabazz would be "one and done", why would Howland make the statement now? Shouldn't he at least let the player announce it?

SoCal

Maybe he thinks it will be a distraction to have people asking about it throughout the postseason, so he'd rather just get it out in the open since all of the players already know

[Rich]

After UCLA beat Arizona on Senior Day in Pauley, Coach Ben Howland said he had "no doubt" that Shabazz Muhammad had played his last game at Pauley.

While it was expected by most that Shabazz would be "one and done", why would Howland make the statement now? Shouldn't he at least let the player announce it?

SoCal

Well, it's a good thing he didn't delegate Tony Parker to make the announcement. Then the announcement itself would take us into the postseason.

[devildeac]

Well, it's a good thing he didn't delegate Tony Parker to make the announcement. Then the announcement itself would take us into the postseason.

2013 or 2014?

[Tom B.]

Speaking of UCLA, has anyone else noticed that former Tarheel turnover machine Larry Drew II has put together a nice little season for himself in Westwood? He's averaging 7.3 points per game, with an assist-to-turnover of more than 3-to-1 (7.8 apg to 2.3 topg, to be precise).

He also leads the team in minutes played, with over 35 minutes per game.

[FerryFor50]

Speaking of UCLA, has anyone else noticed that former Tarheel turnover machine Larry Drew II has put together a nice little season for himself in Westwood? He's averaging 7.3 points per game, with an assist-to-turnover of more than 3-to-1 (7.8 apg to 2.3 topg, to be precise).

He also leads the team in minutes played, with over 35 minutes per game.

It's amazing what a little coaching will do... (yes, that was irony)

[Ichabod Drain]

Speaking of UCLA, has anyone else noticed that former Tarheel turnover machine Larry Drew II has put together a nice little season for himself in Westwood? He's averaging 7.3 points per game, with an assist-to-turnover of more than 3-to-1 (7.8 apg to 2.3 topg, to be precise).

He also leads the team in minutes played, with over 35 minutes per game.

It would be very interesting if they somehow got matched up in the tourny... I can't imagine the message board repercussions of such a game.

[sporthenry]

Well I guess talk of UCLA's demise was premature. Cracked the top 25 and probably on their way to a Pac 12 regular season title. Peaking at the right time.

And I think Howland has to be safe now. Bazz is gone but I doubt anyone else leaves. Drew is a senior but that leaves the Wear twins, Tony Parker, Kyle Anderson and Jordan Adams to build around. They also add a couple top 100 recruits and they could make a fairly deep run into March.

[FerryFor50]

Well I guess talk of UCLA's demise was premature. Cracked the top 25 and probably on their way to a Pac 12 regular season title. Peaking at the right time.

And I think Howland has to be safe now. Bazz is gone but I doubt anyone else leaves. Drew is a senior but that leaves the Wear twins, Tony Parker, Kyle Anderson and Jordan Adams to build around. They also add a couple top 100 recruits and they could make a fairly deep run into March.

Anderson and Adams could also very well leave early. It's a weak draft this year...

[moonpie23]

is there a place where you could go and swipe your credit card to make unc have a matchup with them in the tourny?


i've got a couple of cards i'd max out....:rolleyes:

[sporthenry]

Anderson and Adams could also very well leave early. It's a weak draft this year...

I highly doubt they leave. I guess the draft is like the bubble each year in that it is always described as weak but apart from not really having a superstar type in the draft, it isn't a terrible draft. The only mock draft that had Anderson had him as a late 2nd rounder.

And Howland isn't going to get fired for players leaving. The only thing this year did was it didn't really buy him much more time. If he was a top 5 team who made the F4, he would have bought himself a few more years and probably helped with recruiting. If Howland has another bad year or two, he could be out.

[subzero02]

It would be very interesting if they somehow got matched up in the tourny... I can't imagine the message board repercussions of such a game.

That would be too much... it might be a really entertaining matchup too( although I think the Heels would win).

[Durham Thunder]

Ben Howland was successful in the short term. 3 final four runs in a row, but after that nothing happened ever again.

Fire Howland, bring in a better coach, and restore UCLA. Don't we as true hoops fans revel in seeing the powers rise up? Seeing Indiana come back to grace, Kansas succeeding and even UNC doing well (so that it's even better when we BEAT THEM)?

UCLA has been a flat out joke and a sorry excuse for a Parks & Rec team. I want to see UCLA come back and make the sport meaningful out west.

[dukelifer]

Ben Howland was successful in the short term. 3 final four runs in a row, but after that nothing happened ever again.

Fire Howland, bring in a better coach, and restore UCLA. Don't we as true hoops fans revel in seeing the powers rise up? Seeing Indiana come back to grace, Kansas succeeding and even UNC doing well (so that it's even better when we BEAT THEM)?

UCLA has been a flat out joke and a sorry excuse for a Parks & Rec team. I want to see UCLA come back and make the sport meaningful out west.

Looks like UCLA is coming together at the right time of the year. They have a very dangerous player who is auditioning for the NBA.

[weezie]

Looks like UCLA is coming together at the right time of the year.


And aren't the talking heads simply giddy about it?! They're hugging themselves with joy. ucla might look good out on the left coast but they'll wilt.

[BD80]

Looks like UCLA is coming together at the right time of the year. They have a very dangerous player who is auditioning for the NBA.

Tony Parker? Nyuck, nyuck,

I loved listening to the commentators discuss Shabazz: 27 games, 24 assists, 45 turnovers. A black hole on offense.

Fellow freshmen Kyle Anderson and Jordan Adams have been as important to the bruins' success, but don't have the lottery buzz. Wonder if they stay?

[sporthenry]

Looks like Howland may still be out. I thought the end of the season saved him but maybe not. I don't really have an opinion on him but if Adams was healthy, they would have definitely have been a threat in this tournament.

Speculation is that Adams might be only one left of their class.


Parker, who has struggled this season, said he is considering whether to transfer.

So the only member of that stellar recruiting class who might be back is guard Jordan Adams, who broke his right foot in a Pac-12 tournament semifinal and was lost for the season.

Muhammad, Anderson and Parker all said they would huddle with their families before making a decision.

"I'm not sure what the future holds for me," Anderson said. "I'm just proud of the guys for the season."

It may have been Howland's last season. He and Athletic Director Dan Guerrero are expected to meet early next week — Guerrero usually meets with coaches at season's end.

Guerrero declined to comment after the game. Asked about his future, Howland said, "No comment."

http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/ucla/

Cue the jokes about how long it'll take Parker to decide where he is transferring.

[ncexnyc]

Looks like Howland may still be out. I thought the end of the season saved him but maybe not. I don't really have an opinion on him but if Adams was healthy, they would have definitely have been a threat in this tournament.

Speculation is that Adams might be only one left of their class.



http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/ucla/

Cue the jokes about how long it'll take Parker to decide where he is transferring.

Does Johnson & Wales Culinary School have a team?

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Does Johnson & Wales Culinary School have a team?

If not culinary school, my bet is he goes home and transfers to Georgia. He gets to be a (very)big fish in a little pond.

[devildeac]

Looks like Howland may still be out. I thought the end of the season saved him but maybe not. I don't really have an opinion on him but if Adams was healthy, they would have definitely have been a threat in this tournament.

Speculation is that Adams might be only one left of their class.



http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/ucla/

Cue the jokes about how long it'll take Parker to decide where he is transferring.

Well, if he starts his presser now, we might have an answer by the fall signing period.

Not saying which year though:rolleyes:.

[Bay Area Duke Fan]

Seth Davis just reported that Howland will be fired.

[bob blue devil]

so... i'm guessing consensus is we shouldn't go after tony parker as a transfer? will ucla enforce the sit out year? did he burn his bridges with duke? is he the type of guy that could have a disappointing experience at UCLA (ave 6 min, 2 pt, 1 reb) and still be a prima donna at duke? is this an excuse for him to go back home to georgia, tail between his legs? obviously we could use someone to push MP3 for minutes defending the 5... not sure parker is worth it, but it's an interesting possibility. that's where i still end up - i'd rather our guys go to battle without this kid.

was just looking at his line against minny - 7 mins, 9 pts on 3-3 and 3-5 on the line, and 4 rebounds, so looks interesting until you get to his FIVE FOULS including a T. tony doesn't foul! tony doesn't foul!

[miramar]

so... i'm guessing consensus is we shouldn't go after tony parker as a transfer? will ucla enforce the sit out year? did he burn his bridges with duke? is he the type of guy that could have a disappointing experience at UCLA (ave 6 min, 2 pt, 1 reb) and still be a prima donna at duke? is this an excuse for him to go back home to georgia, tail between his legs? obviously we could use someone to push MP3 for minutes defending the 5... not sure parker is worth it, but it's an interesting possibility. that's where i still end up - i'd rather our guys go to battle without this kid.

was just looking at his line against minny - 7 mins, 9 pts on 3-3 and 3-5 on the line, and 4 rebounds, so looks interesting until you get to his FIVE FOULS including a T. tony doesn't foul! tony doesn't foul!

I can't see him going to Duke after saying that we don't know how to develop big men and dropping us to his #4 choice. Unfortunately, the LA Times has noted that UCLA is even worse in the development department (or is just him?):

"Parker will [take his time] as well, though his decision is about transferring after struggling all season. The 6-foot-9 freshman was considered a coup for UCLA when he committed, but injuries and slow development kept him on the bench."

http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/basketball/la-sp-0324-ucla-basketball-20130324,0,7545689.story

My take: Maybe all the great things they said about him in the interminable press conference just ain't so.

[Kdogg]

will ucla enforce the sit out year?

UCLA has no say in him sitting out a year. That's the NCAA and I doubt he will get a waiver. Coaching changes rarely if ever lead to a transfer waiver. UCLA can control which teams he is allowed to transfer to though - or more specifically which teams he can not transfer to without sitting out two years.

[sue71, esq]

It's official: Howland is out (http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/basketball/la-sp-ucla-howland-fired-20130325,0,2162674.story).

Seems like they're targeting Shaka Smart of VCU, but the same has been said about USC. It's also been said that Smart's not going anywhere.

This should get interesting with both UCLA & USC searching at the same time. USC is currently 0-1 (whiffing on Dixon... again). UCLA's turn.

[FerryFor50]

I can't see him going to Duke after saying that we don't know how to develop big men and dropping us to his #4 choice. Unfortunately, the LA Times has noted that UCLA is even worse in the development department (or is just him?):

"Parker will [take his time] as well, though his decision is about transferring after struggling all season. The 6-foot-9 freshman was considered a coup for UCLA when he committed, but injuries and slow development kept him on the bench."

http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/basketball/la-sp-0324-ucla-basketball-20130324,0,7545689.story

My take: Maybe all the great things they said about him in the interminable press conference just ain't so.

My money is on Parker going back home to play at Georgia.

[tommy]

The interesting one to watch will by Kyle Anderson. Muhammad is gone, of course, to the league. Parker will almost certainly transfer back to the south, tail between his legs. Jordan Adams is a local LA kid, so he'll stay and be the star of a woeful team next year. But Kyle Anderson has a problem. He's from New Jersey, and knows he doesn't belong out here and can't be happy out here. He also knows he's not ready for the league. But I'm sure he doesn't relish the idea of sitting out a year as a transfer either. What to do? Kid has a problem.

If he does decide to transfer, the list of suitors will be, and should be, long. He's a terrific player, my favorite on the team this year, and really brings a very unique set of skills to the floor. Plays a team game and makes his teammates better. He's just not athletic, at all, but in my mind, he's a winner.

[superdave]

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/blog/_/name/katz_andy/id/9094778/ucla-fires-ben-howland-begins-search-replace-college-basketball

Katz on likely Ucla targets. Shaka will be the first call but is unlikely.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

The interesting one to watch will by Kyle Anderson. Muhammad is gone, of course, to the league. Parker will almost certainly transfer back to the south, tail between his legs. Jordan Adams is a local LA kid, so he'll stay and be the star of a woeful team next year. But Kyle Anderson has a problem. He's from New Jersey, and knows he doesn't belong out here and can't be happy out here. He also knows he's not ready for the league. But I'm sure he doesn't relish the idea of sitting out a year as a transfer either. What to do? Kid has a problem.

If he does decide to transfer, the list of suitors will be, and should be, long. He's a terrific player, my favorite on the team this year, and really brings a very unique set of skills to the floor. Plays a team game and makes his teammates better. He's just not athletic, at all, but in my mind, he's a winner.

I think Anderson goes pro. He has length and multiple skills that NBA Scouts drool over. Plus he has the "potential/upside" Seal of Approval still, being only a Freshman. Couple that with a historically weak draft, and I think Anderson is a lock for at least top 20 this year.

[ChrisP]

How about Jeff Capel Jr.? I'm sure he could get Blake over fairly often to give his kids a pep talk :cool:

Seriously, how is UCLA, along with Duke, Kentucky and UNC not one of the top jobs in college hoops? You've got tradition, a newly refurbished Pauley Pavilion (I mean, it's not even a gym or an arena - it's a Pavilion), and you've got that great SoCal weather. What's not to like. I cannot believe UCLA won't be able to get a top-notch coach. And no, I'm not talking about Mark Gottfried. Seriously? I can't believe he was even mentioned in the Katz article on ESPN.

I can't see Brad Stevens in LA. No way. Wonder if Bill Self could be tempted? He's been really successful at Kansas, obviously and doesn't necessarily seem to be an "LA guy" but the man can certainly coach and recruit and I mean, who wouldn't want to trade LA for Lawrence? Barkley was joking about Calipari taking the job and I could definitely see that. Slimy or not, I gotta believe that he would turn that program around FAST.

[miramar]

Seriously, how is UCLA, along with Duke, Kentucky and UNC not one of the top jobs in college hoops? You've got tradition, a newly refurbished Pauley Pavilion (I mean, it's not even a gym or an arena - it's a Pavilion), and you've got that great SoCal weather. What's not to like. I cannot believe UCLA won't be able to get a top-notch coach.

The talent pool in California, which Howland wasn't able to tap into the last two years.

The cupboard will be bare, but a good coach should be able to restock it pretty quickly.

[Cameron]

I went into more detail on the coaching thread, but Shaka would not translate to UCLA. They better keep looking. He is a one-trick pony and I just don't see that working in Westwood. The havoc system would be a really tough sell to elite recruits, in my view.

UCLA should make an offer to Brad Stevens and if he declines, they need to turn their attention to Thad Matta. The guy can coach and as the world's number one anti-Buckeye fan I want him out of Ohio State. In all seriousness, though, look at what he's been able to accomplish at a football school whose fans do not care about basketball at all for 10 months out of the year. It's rather incredible. I also feel that as good a recruiter as Matta has established himself to be, the future is never going to be as bright as his past with the Buckeyes. Next year OSU is bringing in almost nobody. Tom Crean's emergence at Indiana has apparently shut off Matta's recruiting pipeline into Indiana -- where Matta once scored guys like Mike Conley, Greg Oden and Deshaun Thomas -- or at least reduced the flow dramatically. I think it might be time to skip town for a premier job.

Mark Few, if he's even asked, should forget about his car and run to Westwood if offered. He will never win at Gonzaga anyway. He might as well cash in on his regular-season success while he's still a "commodity."

[Atlanta Duke]

The talent pool in California, which Howland wasn't able to tap into the last two years.

The cupboard will be bare, but a good coach should be able to restock it pretty quickly.

This article in SI.com today agrees that Howland could no longer recruit in SoCal and blames it on withdrawing a scholly offer in 2009 that ticked off the local AAU team coaches

That July, Howland did what college coaches often do: He pulled a scholarship from a recruit he no longer wanted. The recruit was Kendall Williams, a long-armed, athletic guard from Los Osos High in Rancho Cucamonga, Calif.,...

Howland had the right to change his mind about Williams, but how he did it peeved several of Southern California's most prominent AAU coaches.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-college-basketball-mens-tournament/news/20130325/ucla-ben-howland/?sct=hp_wr_a2&eref=sihp

[SoCalDukeFan]

This article in SI.com today agrees that Howland could no longer recruit in SoCal and blames it on withdrawing a scholly offer in 2009 that ticked off the local AAU team coaches

That July, Howland did what college coaches often do: He pulled a scholarship from a recruit he no longer wanted. The recruit was Kendall Williams, a long-armed, athletic guard from Los Osos High in Rancho Cucamonga, Calif.,...

Howland had the right to change his mind about Williams, but how he did it peeved several of Southern California's most prominent AAU coaches.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-college-basketball-mens-tournament/news/20130325/ucla-ben-howland/?sct=hp_wr_a2&eref=sihp

Asumming it is close to true, great article.

UCLA next year will have a new coach. They lose Drew 2, their best player this year and Shabazz. Anderson is an excellent player but he needs a supporting cast, so he will probably go pro or transfer. It looks like Parker is done at UCLA.

Could be a pretty bare cupboard for UCLA. Good chance that the Wear twins will have played at UNC-CH and UCLA and managed to get into one NCAA Tournament game.

SoCal

[Mal]

Thad Matta. The guy can coach and as the world's number one anti-Buckeye fan I want him out of Ohio State.

I'm so with you on this. I wasn't that concerned about Matta when he came over, but he's outstanding and has taken a program that was in very good shape and made it even better. But my hatred of all things Ohio State overshadows my respect and admiration for Thad and his accomplishments. Go West, Karl Malden, go West.

[tommy]

The interesting one to watch will by Kyle Anderson. Muhammad is gone, of course, to the league. Parker will almost certainly transfer back to the south, tail between his legs. Jordan Adams is a local LA kid, so he'll stay and be the star of a woeful team next year. But Kyle Anderson has a problem. He's from New Jersey, and knows he doesn't belong out here and can't be happy out here. He also knows he's not ready for the league. But I'm sure he doesn't relish the idea of sitting out a year as a transfer either. What to do? Kid has a problem.

If he does decide to transfer, the list of suitors will be, and should be, long. He's a terrific player, my favorite on the team this year, and really brings a very unique set of skills to the floor. Plays a team game and makes his teammates better. He's just not athletic, at all, but in my mind, he's a winner.

I erred. I don't know who I was thinking of, but of course Jordan Adams is not a local LA kid. He's from Georgia. Korey McCray got him. Still, depending on who the new coach is, I think there's a greater chance that he returns to UCLA than any of the other frosh, for sure.

[JasonEvans]

This article in SI.com today agrees that Howland could no longer recruit in SoCal and blames it on withdrawing a scholly offer in 2009 that ticked off the local AAU team coaches

That July, Howland did what college coaches often do: He pulled a scholarship from a recruit he no longer wanted. The recruit was Kendall Williams, a long-armed, athletic guard from Los Osos High in Rancho Cucamonga, Calif.,...

Howland had the right to change his mind about Williams, but how he did it peeved several of Southern California's most prominent AAU coaches.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-college-basketball-mens-tournament/news/20130325/ucla-ben-howland/?sct=hp_wr_a2&eref=sihp

Of course, the irony is that Williams went to New Mexico and has been a double-digit scoring impact guard for them from day one. This past season he averaged 13.3 ppg, 4.9 apg, and 3.5 rpg. He's a good 3 point shooter and a solid defender. Howland could have really used a kid like that.

-Jason "what a mess..." Evans

[miramar]

This article in SI.com today agrees that Howland could no longer recruit in SoCal and blames it on withdrawing a scholly offer in 2009 that ticked off the local AAU team coaches.

It definitely shows who's in charge:

"Many of the area's AAU coaches already disliked the conservative offensive system that Howland ran, feeling it didn't showcase their players' talents to NBA scouts. . . . Howland's mistreatment of Williams, however, was an even bigger issue. It led several AAU coaches to conclude that Howland couldn't be trusted, and they began advising their best players not to consider UCLA."

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-college-basketball-mens-tournament/news/20130325/ucla-ben-howland/#ixzz2Oc0MCUOc

It reminds me of the problems that Coach G had trying to recruit in Texas, but in that case I believe that the problem was her inability to establish relationships with high school coaches in the state.

[tommy]

Kyle Anderson has wisely decided to come back to Westwood for his sophomore year.

[tommy]

2013 Top 100 guard Allerik Freeman, who Duke had been interested in for awhile before backing off, has now de-committed from UCLA (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/22123221/top100-senior-allerik-freeman-decommits-from-ucla). Coach Alford couldn't keep him in the fold. I'm sure Duke wouldn't be interested -- that's not why I'm posting. Just more negative news for the Bruins, that's all.

[BigWayne]

2013 Top 100 guard Allerik Freeman, who Duke had been interested in for awhile before backing off, has now de-committed from UCLA (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/22123221/top100-senior-allerik-freeman-decommits-from-ucla). Coach Alford couldn't keep him in the fold. I'm sure Duke wouldn't be interested -- that's not why I'm posting. Just more negative news for the Bruins, that's all.
Well he shows up on all the recruiting lists as interested in Duke from before he signed with UCLA. Lot of time has passed since then though.

[miramar]

Well he shows up on all the recruiting lists as interested in Duke from before he signed with UCLA. Lot of time has passed since then though.

After all, there are only two players in the top 100 who are uncommitted at this point. Freeman is no Andrew Wiggins, but at least he'll take phone calls. And make campus visits.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

Just curious, but does anyone know if there are any news on the Tony Parker front? There was a lot of speculation that he would transfer, but he may have realized that he really didn't deserve his #26 ranking and that with the way things are going at Westwood, all he will have to do to get more than 207 minutes of playing time is to show up for the games.

[Ichabod Drain]

2013 Top 100 guard Allerik Freeman, who Duke had been interested in for awhile before backing off, has now de-committed from UCLA (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/22123221/top100-senior-allerik-freeman-decommits-from-ucla). Coach Alford couldn't keep him in the fold. I'm sure Duke wouldn't be interested -- that's not why I'm posting. Just more negative news for the Bruins, that's all.

It says on espn that he had signed to UCLA which i take to mean he signed a Letter of Intent to play at UCLA. Aren't there some restriction to decommitting once you have signed a LOI, that's the whole purpose of a LOI over a verbal commitment right?

[BigWayne]

It says on espn that he had signed to UCLA which i take to mean he signed a Letter of Intent to play at UCLA. Aren't there some restriction to decommitting once you have signed a LOI, that's the whole purpose of a LOI over a verbal commitment right?

Yes, he signed a LOI, but has asked UCLA to release him from it due to coaching changes. Indications are that he will get the release.

http://www.insidesocal.com/ucla/2013/04/23/four-star-allerick-freeman-decommits-from-ucla/
http://www.bruinsnation.com/2013/4/23/4259388/ucla-basketball-recruit-allerik-freeman-decommitts
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/22123221/top100-senior-allerik-freeman-decommits-from-ucla

[tommy]

After all, there are only two players in the top 100 who are uncommitted at this point. Freeman is no Andrew Wiggins, but at least he'll take phone calls. And make campus visits.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

Just curious, but does anyone know if there are any news on the Tony Parker front? There was a lot of speculation that he would transfer, but he may have realized that he really didn't deserve his #26 ranking and that with the way things are going at Westwood, all he will have to do to get more than 207 minutes of playing time is to show up for the games.

Couple weeks ago he tweeted that he's a Bruin, can't wait for next year, etc. Words to that effect. Sounds like he's staying.

[sue71, esq]

Couple weeks ago he tweeted that he's a Bruin, can't wait for next year, etc. Words to that effect. Sounds like he's staying.

That's the rub, from my understanding. He reaffirmed his commitment to UCLA right after Alford was hired, and now wants out. The question everyone seems to be asking is what happened in between?

[tommy]

That's the rub, from my understanding. He reaffirmed his commitment to UCLA right after Alford was hired, and now wants out. The question everyone seems to be asking is what happened in between?

I wasn't clear in my response. It was Tony Parker who said he was still a Bruin, looking forward to next year. So he'll be back.

It's Al Freeman who is out of here.

[tommy]

Freeman is taking his talents to Waco (http://zagsblog.com/articles/allerik-freeman-to-baylor/). Wow, a guy who at one point had pretty significant interest from Duke, transfers all the way out to the Nevada basketball factory Findlay Prep, falls way down in the ratings, finally commits to UCLA, then decommits and now signs up with Scott Drew and his oh-so-upright ways of doing business. Talk about being a long way from home, both literally and figuratively . . .