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jimsumner
11-26-2012, 03:22 PM
http://www.theacc.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/112612aaf.html

sagegrouse
11-26-2012, 03:27 PM
http://www.theacc.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/112612aaf.html

Congratulations to Cockrell and Monday on the first team, and to Vernon and Canty on the 2nd.

sagegrouse

94duke
11-26-2012, 04:09 PM
Ok, I might need some extra eyes to double-check my totals, but Duke placed nine players overall (fourth highest!).


Total Selections

FSU 16
unc 15
Clemson 10
Duke 9
UVa 8
State 7
VPI 7
BC 6
Miami 6
Ga Tech 5
MD 5
Wake 3

Dev11
11-26-2012, 04:10 PM
Ok, I might need some extra eyes to double-check my totals, but Duke placed nine players overall (fourth highest!).


Total Selections

FSU 16
unc 15
Clemson 10
Duke 9
UVa 8
State 7
VPI 7
BC 6
Miami 6
Ga Tech 5
MD 5
Wake 3

Ugh, does that mean we have to go to the Sun Bowl?

[/bowl selection angst]

Congrats to all the players who got picked! I wish Vernon has gotten a 1st team nod for setting those ACC records, having not gotten a 1st team nod in his career.

94duke
11-26-2012, 04:16 PM
Ugh, does that mean we have to go to the Sun Bowl?

[/bowl selection angst]

Congrats to all the players who got picked! I wish Vernon has gotten a 1st team nod for setting those ACC records, having not gotten a 1st team nod in his career.

Looks like Vernon was two votes shy of making first team:


WR-DeAndre Hopkins, Clemson (80)
WR-Alex Amidon, Boston College (53)

WR-Conner Vernon, Duke (51)
WR-Michael Campanaro, Wake Forest (32)

MCFinARL
11-26-2012, 04:17 PM
Congratulations to Cockrell and Monday on the first team, and to Vernon and Canty on the 2nd.

sagegrouse

Also to honorable mentions Anunike, Crowder, Harding, Martin, Simmons.

-bdbd
11-26-2012, 04:57 PM
Ugh, does that mean we have to go to the Sun Bowl?[/bowl selection angst]

Congrats to all the players who got picked! I wish Vernon has gotten a 1st team nod for setting those ACC records, having not gotten a 1st team nod in his career.

Don't worry, not gonna happen. Unless GT gets turned down by the NCAA on their appeal request, then I just don't see a shot at all. Even then, they'd be more likely to take VPI over Duke for the Sun. Recall the ACC rule that the ACC runner-up must be taken by the Sun if it is still available. I expect that to still be in play even if GT is 6-7, unless the Sun anticipated this scenario and requested an "out" clause in their contract with the ACC. And the Russell Athletic Bowl has already said they'd take one of GT, NCSU, or VPI (not Duke). So doubtful that we're going any further south than Charlotte, NC (note: that leaves Nashville as still possible). :D

But serious congrats to the Coaching staff and Duke FB team. It seems like only a year or two ago that you could count Duke All-ACC selections on one hand! Er, wait a sec....
:rolleyes:

johnb
11-26-2012, 05:42 PM
Also to honorable mentions Anunike, Crowder, Harding, Martin, Simmons.

and so most are coming back next year...

loran16
11-26-2012, 05:44 PM
Don't worry, not gonna happen. Unless GT gets turned down by the NCAA on their appeal request, then I just don't see a shot at all. Even then, they'd be more likely to take VPI over Duke for the Sun. Recall the ACC rule that the ACC runner-up must be taken by the Sun if it is still available. I expect that to still be in play even if GT is 6-7, unless the Sun anticipated this scenario and requested an "out" clause in their contract with the ACC. And the Russell Athletic Bowl has already said they'd take one of GT, NCSU, or VPI (not Duke). So doubtful that we're going any further south than Charlotte, NC (note: that leaves Nashville as still possible). :D

But serious congrats to the Coaching staff and Duke FB team. It seems like only a year or two ago that you could count Duke All-ACC selections on one hand! Er, wait a sec....
:rolleyes:

Well, its not that the Russell doesn't want Duke, it's that it can't take Duke. A Bowl cannot take an ACC team if there is a team with an ACC record two games better than it available. In our case, GT is 5-3 in conference, while Duke is 3-5. Thus, Duke cannot be taken over GT. However, VT (4-4) and NC State (4-4) can be taken ahead of GT, and thus are the likely selection.

Back on topic: I'm kind of embarrassed to see Cockrell up there. No offense to Ross - who definitely had his share of good moments this year - but Duke was basically last in Defense in the ACC this year (Again) and really doesn't deserve to have a defensive player on first team. Someone from our offense would be first team, if not for the fact that the ACC has plenty of good QBs and WRs, but not very many good DBs.

Monday on the other hand deserves it (as does the missing Ross Martin).

Devil in the Blue Dress
11-26-2012, 05:57 PM
In his post game comments after the Miami game, Coach Cutlciffe said that Conner Vernon belongs on first team ACC and that if he's not recognized as first team, he (Cutcliffe) wouldn't have much interest in such votes in the future.

I agree. Conner Vernon should have been on first team.

I'm sorry to see Ross Martin not included at all.

Overall, it's a giant step forward for a program that was once the laughing stock of the entire country because of a record long losing streak.

Olympic Fan
11-26-2012, 06:22 PM
Back on topic: I'm kind of embarrassed to see Cockrell up there. No offense to Ross - who definitely had his share of good moments this year - but Duke was basically last in Defense in the ACC this year (Again) and really doesn't deserve to have a defensive player on first team. Someone from our offense would be first team, if not for the fact that the ACC has plenty of good QBs and WRs, but not very many good DBs.

Monday on the other hand deserves it (as does the missing Ross Martin).

I have to politely disagree ... the only crime with Cockrell is that he wasn't the top vote-getter at cornerback. He was the best cover corner in the ACC this year and one of the best as far as run support.

Yeah, Duke had a lousy defense overall, but that doesn't mean Cockrell wasn't first rate. If you still have the Miami game, go back and watch how Duke gave up 52 points -- AND NOT ONE PASS WAS COMPETED TO A RECEIVER BEING COVERED BY COCKRELL. Miami targeted Tony Foster and Walt Canty and burned them time after time. They threw at Cockrell three times -- and none were completed.

Cockrell led the ACC in interceptions and was second in passes defender. His numbers actually slipped later in the season, because with all our injuris in the secondary, there were plenty of holes there and they could throw away from him.

Absolutely nothing to be ashamed of.

The only thing to be ashamed of is the ACC voters who voted Clemson's Catanzarro and UNC's Barth (who only played in 10 games) ahead of Ross Martin.

Catanzaro made 12 of 16 field goals and missed an extra point.
Barth made 15 of 19 field goals and was 44 of 44 on extr points
Martin made 18 of 20 field goals and was 44 of 44 on extra points ... and was, IMHO, the best kickoff man of the three.

He wuz robbed.

Devil in the Blue Dress
11-26-2012, 06:59 PM
I have to politely disagree ... the only crime with Cockrell is that he wasn't the top vote-getter at cornerback. He was the best cover corner in the ACC this year and one of the best as far as run support.

Yeah, Duke had a lousy defense overall, but that doesn't mean Cockrell wasn't first rate. If you still have the Miami game, go back and watch how Duke gave up 52 points -- AND NOT ONE PASS WAS COMPETED TO A RECEIVER BEING COVERED BY COCKRELL. Miami targeted Tony Foster and Walt Canty and burned them time after time. They threw at Cockrell three times -- and none were completed.

Cockrell led the ACC in interceptions and was second in passes defender. His numbers actually slipped later in the season, because with all our injuris in the secondary, there were plenty of holes there and they could throw away from him.

Absolutely nothing to be ashamed of.

The only thing to be ashamed of is the ACC voters who voted Clemson's Catanzarro and UNC's Barth (who only played in 10 games) ahead of Ross Martin.

Catanzaro made 12 of 16 field goals and missed an extra point.
Barth made 15 of 19 field goals and was 44 of 44 on extr points
Martin made 18 of 20 field goals and was 44 of 44 on extra points ... and was, IMHO, the best kickoff man of the three.

He wuz robbed.

I agree with what you said about Ross Cockrell's high quality of play. Sometimes it's hard to see high level play of an individual when a unit is not playing at a high level.

I also agree that Ross Martin should have been All ACC. When people voted, they seemed to go on impressions, not stats, game film or other such sources of information. Ross is good. Like Conner, he's so quietly consistent, that those drawn to flash may miss him. He'll make it next year.

chrishoke
11-26-2012, 07:15 PM
I agree with what you said about Ross Cockrell's high quality of play. Sometimes it's hard to see high level play of an individual when a unit is not playing at a high level.

I also agree that Ross Martin should have been All ACC. When people voted, they seemed to go on impressions, not stats, game film or other such sources of information. Ross is good. Like Conner, he's so quietly consistent, that those drawn to flash may miss him. He'll make it next year.

Yes, but Conner won't. I think that's a travesty and feel very bad for Conner.

Jim3k
11-26-2012, 08:18 PM
I'm sorry to see Ross Martin not included at all.

Overall, it's a giant step forward for a program that was once the laughing stock of the entire country because of a record long losing streak.

Martin did make honorable mention. That said, he should have been higher.

uh_no
11-26-2012, 09:40 PM
http://www.theacc.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/112612aaf.html

break all the ACC receiving records?

ehhh Best I can do is second team

-ACC media

Native
11-26-2012, 09:42 PM
Conner got absolutely jobbed. No question. How do you rewrite the ACC Record Books in receiving and not make 1st team All-Conference your senior year?

Travesty.

gep
11-27-2012, 12:27 AM
Martin did make honorable mention. That said, he should have been higher.

But... as a freshman, just imagine the FUTURE!!!!

killerleft
11-27-2012, 08:56 AM
Yes, but Conner won't. I think that's a travesty and feel very bad for Conner.

Agreed. It is not defendable that the ACC's top statistical receiver ever couldn't make first team All-ACC. Ross Martin's exclusion is just a head scratcher. I'd like to hear a sane argument against either of the two.

Dev11
11-27-2012, 09:55 AM
Agreed. It is not defendable that the ACC's top statistical receiver ever couldn't make first team All-ACC. Ross Martin's exclusion is just a head scratcher. I'd like to hear a sane argument against either of the two.

I would liken Conner to Kyle Singler, who was probably our best 4-year player since JJ and Shelden over the course of his career, but was never considered the best player on any Duke team (Nelson-Henderson-Scheyer-Smith getting those informal titles). I would like to think I'll look back at Conner's career the way I look at Kyle's career.

jimsumner
11-27-2012, 10:52 AM
RE: Connor Vernon.

Full disclosure. I voted for Vernon for first team WR, along with Hopkins.

I would also note that the powers-that-be insist on an outdated model, in which we have two RBs and two WRs on the first team, despite the fact that the base offense for most ACC teams consists of one RB and three WRs.

If we had two RBs and three WRs, then he's first team.

That said, we may be comparing apples and oranges. Vernon's career records are aggregate records based on four-year totals. This is a vote for this season only. And Alex Amidon did have better season stats than Vernon.

So, if you're a voter, how much weight do you place on Vernon's career stats versus Amidon's season stats? Obviously, I elected to place some weight on the career stats.

Not everyone else did. But that's a defensible position. It's disappointing for Vernon and Duke but I do not see it as an outrage or an injustice.

captmojo
11-27-2012, 11:10 AM
Due to being on the cusp of tops in the conference record books, it had to be assured that he played throughout the season as a marked man by all opponents, even to the point of being on the receiving end of everyone's cheap shots. (see unc game)
He was the most dangerous man on the field wearing a Duke uniform. Being Renfree's 1st option on nearly every play, and defenses knowing it, his accomplishments are remarkable to the point of having to believe that there was a bias in the vote selection.
Through it all, the record books were still forced to be rewritten. Take that! Vernon was 2nd to none. The pro scouts should be drooling in anticipation for his arrival to what they should wish will be their team. I predict an early draft selection.

CDu
11-27-2012, 12:29 PM
Conner got absolutely jobbed. No question. How do you rewrite the ACC Record Books in receiving and not make 1st team All-Conference your senior year?

Travesty.

It's not a lifetime achievement award. It's an in-season award.

DeAndre Hopkins: 1,214 yards, 16 TDs
Alex Amidon: 1,210 yards, 7 TD

Jamison Crowder: 1,025 yards, 8 TD
Connor Vernon: 955 yards, 7 TD

Vernon had a terrific career and was amazingly consistent (between 746 and 956 yards all four years). But he did not deserve to be 1st Team All-ACC this year over either of the two guys who received the honor.

jimsumner
11-27-2012, 01:38 PM
Due to being on the cusp of tops in the conference record books, it had to be assured that he played throughout the season as a marked man by all opponents, even to the point of being on the receiving end of everyone's cheap shots. (see unc game)
He was the most dangerous man on the field wearing a Duke uniform. Being Renfree's 1st option on nearly every play, and defenses knowing it, his accomplishments are remarkable to the point of having to believe that there was a bias in the vote selection.
Through it all, the record books were still forced to be rewritten. Take that! Vernon was 2nd to none. The pro scouts should be drooling in anticipation for his arrival to what they should wish will be their team. I predict an early draft selection.

Wouldn't Alex Amidon have been the most dangerous player wearing a BC uniform? Wouldn't he have been a marked man?

Again, I simply see no reason to see any bias here. Picking Amidon over Vernon is a defensible position.