Nerlens Noel Cleared by NCAA to practice and play

[tommy]

Per the NY Times, the NCAA has begun to nose around into star Kentucky recruit Nerlens Noel and his recruitment. The inquiry involves some financial issues, some academics, and a possible link (through an "advisor") to an agent. It's all pretty vague, everybody's cooperating and downplaying at this point, it's not even a formal investigation yet, the kid deserves the benefit of the doubt at the outset, etc., but still . . .

Here's the link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/09/sports/basketball/nerlens-noel-kentucky-recruit-attracts-ncaa-inquiry.html?_r=2&ref=sports



edit: title of the thread should've said "Inquiry" instead of "Investigation" -- don't think I can change it now.

[UrinalCake]

Someone needs to tell Noel this ain't no House Party

[elvis14]

the kid deserves the benefit of the doubt at the outset, etc

I thought Noel signed with UK :confused:

[licc85]

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/09/sports/basketball/nerlens-noel-kentucky-recruit-attracts-ncaa-inquiry.html

Man, I hope Calipari gets nailed for this one . . . doesn't sound like he had much to do with it as of now, but come on . . . it's more than just a trend at this point. UK fans are already in full panic mode, and I can't help but grin.

EDIT: whoops . . . didn't see the other thread, feel free to toss this one.

[Greg_Newton]

Three down... http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?28496-Here-We-Go-Nerlens-Noel-Investigation-Opened-by-NCAA

[ChicagoCrazy84]

Three down... http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?28496-Here-We-Go-Nerlens-Noel-Investigation-Opened-by-NCAA


I listened to an ESPN Podcast from the Scott Van Pelt show who had Pete Thamel talk about it. It is still pretty vague, but a lot of little different things worth looking into. I'm still not quite sure if its a formal investigation, or if its just clearing a few things up. Always interesting though when the final question that comes up is: Will Nerlens Noel play for Kentucky in the fall? His answer: I don't know. It at least makes you think twice. I'm not going to start trying to speculate what will come of it, and I am certainly not going to start the "how this will affect Amile's decision making" ;)

[mapleleafdevil]

Can you just imagine both UK and UNC being taken down in the same year?

[MChambers]

Can you just imagine both UK and UNC being taken down in the same year?

I have a very hard time imagining the NCAA doing this. I expect Austin Peay and High Point to be put on probation. Daniel Ewing may get a technical foul.

Hope I'm wrong.

[MarkD83]

I have a very hard time imagining the NCAA doing this. I expect Austin Peay and High Point to be put on probation. Daniel Ewing may get a technical foul.

Hope I'm wrong.

Daniel Ewing will still get the technical but it is Cleveland State that will be put on probation.

[oldnavy]

Can you just imagine both UK and UNC being taken down in the same year?

Nothing will happen to UNC because Roy has already completely debunked the whole AA studies issue with his declaration that: A, other students not just athletes took the courses, and B, that the BB players did the work assigned to them. So we have, both a rationalization (they did EVERYTHING that was not asked of them) and an "everybody else was doing it" statement from the head man.... nothing left to discuss here.

[Kdogg]

This is old hat for UK and Calipari. Rose (at Memphis), Bledsoe, Kanter, Davis and now Noel. I wouldn't be surprised if they have someone in the SID's office that works on this full time. Nothing came out of the Davis thing last year and it was quickly sweep under the rug. The only reason Kanter was forced to sit was because his old euro club felt spurned and spoke out about his salary. I'm not holding my breathe for truth or justice if somethings wrong.

[gumbomoop]

Update on Noel's recruitment -

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/basketball/ncaa/08/22/nerlens-noel-ncaa/index.html

"The presence of two NCAA enforcement officials and Bell [UK chief compliance officer] gives the appearance that this case has gone beyond the routine checking of top prospects, according to one former NCAA investigator.....A veteran compliance official with no direct connection to Noel's case called the presence of Kentucky's Bell in the meeting with the NCAA: 'unusual but not incredibly unusual.'"

And: "The NCAA didn't focus on Noel's academics in the meeting and asked mostly about the people involved with Noel's recruitment."

[tommy]

Si.com (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/basketball/ncaa/08/22/nerlens-noel-ncaa/index.html?sct=hp_t2_a2)has a story up that the NCAA has been back up to New England earlier in August, this time to his prep school in Tilton, NH to re-open the investigation of Nerlens Noel's eligibility. This time they're focussing not on academics but rather on benefits he may have received -- how he paid for visits, that kind of thing. Kentucky sent its Chief Compliance Officer to be involved in the meetings, which has been described by some as unusual.

[sagegrouse]

Si.com (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/basketball/ncaa/08/22/nerlens-noel-ncaa/index.html?sct=hp_t2_a2)has a story up that the NCAA has been back up to New England earlier in August, this time to his prep school in Tilton, NH to re-open the investigation of Nerlens Noel's eligibility. This time they're focussing not on academics but rather on benefits he may have received -- how he paid for visits, that kind of thing. ]Kentucky sent its Chief Compliance Officer to be involved in the meetings, which has been described by some as unusual[/U].

I can clarify the situation; the presence of the Kentucky compliance officer will be to ensure that the NCAA understands that any problems that arise are the fault of Cleveland State.

sagegrouse

[SupaDave]

Thanks for keeping up with this guys. During the summer I've been a little out of pocket and didn't really notice this in May due to taking my final exams. This IS a big deal for me b/c my younger cousin is currently on the Tilton HS basketball team and was teammates with Noel last year. Of equal importance is my own cousin's academic background b/c he transferred from a school in Saudi Arabia straight to Tilton. So we are keeping an eye on this now in a major way.

[UrinalCake]

Not sure if this belongs in its own thread, or maybe we could update the title of this one, but Shabazz Muhammad is also under investigation (http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-basketball/2012/8/14/3243466/shabazz-muhammad-ineligible-ucla-improper-benefits) for receiving improper benefits and has been ruled ineligible for the team's trip to China. Is it possible that we dodged some major bullets by avoiding Purvis and Noel and being turned down by Shabazz?

(It should be mentioned that Purvis's situation is very different from the other two and involves his high school's certification, not anything that he himself has done).

[killerleft]

Unforgettables II? This could turn out to be a heartwarming story for the Wildcat faithful. We've already started grooming MPIII for the starring "dagger through the heart" role, I hope.

[Olympic Fan]

Not sure if this belongs in its own thread, or maybe we could update the title of this one, but Shabazz Muhammad is also under investigation (http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-basketball/2012/8/14/3243466/shabazz-muhammad-ineligible-ucla-improper-benefits) for receiving improper benefits and has been ruled ineligible for the team's trip to China. Is it possible that we dodged some major bullets by avoiding Purvis and Noel and being turned down by Shabazz?

(It should be mentioned that Purvis's situation is very different from the other two and involves his high school's certification, not anything that he himself has done).

Just to be clear, you are right -- we're dealing with two very different situations. In the Purvis case, Duke WAS interested, but voluntarily backed off the kid because of concerns about his academic situation. This is very much lik Eric Bledsoe in 2009 -- we were interested, took a look at his academic record and couldn't back out of the room fast enough. I don't think Purvis' case is that bad, but there were concerns that caused us to quit recruiting him.

I'm not as clear about the Muhammad case, except there were strong rumors after he committed to UCLA that he told friends that he had wanted to go to Duke, but there were reasons that he had to go to UCLA. Again, just rumors, but the rumors were that his father had reaped a large sum from adidas to deliver his son.

Now, those are just rumors, so take if FWIW. We'll let the NCAA investiogation play out.

But in Purvis' case, I'm glad we backed off the kid ... while in Muhammad's case, it's very possible that we didn't get him BECAUSE of irregularities .. ie, he or his family was paid to go elsewhere.

[mkline09]

Just to be clear, you are right -- we're dealing with two very different situations. In the Purvis case, Duke WAS interested, but voluntarily backed off the kid because of concerns about his academic situation. This is very much lik Eric Bledsoe in 2009 -- we were interested, took a look at his academic record and couldn't back out of the room fast enough. I don't think Purvis' case is that bad, but there were concerns that caused us to quit recruiting him.

I'm not as clear about the Muhammad case, except there were strong rumors after he committed to UCLA that he told friends that he had wanted to go to Duke, but there were reasons that he had to go to UCLA. Again, just rumors, but the rumors were that his father had reaped a large sum from adidas to deliver his son.

Now, those are just rumors, so take if FWIW. We'll let the NCAA investiogation play out.

But in Purvis' case, I'm glad we backed off the kid ... while in Muhammad's case, it's very possible that we didn't get him BECAUSE of irregularities .. ie, he or his family was paid to go elsewhere.

Wait I thought Bledsoe took and passed Alg. II before taking Alg I or maybe I misremembered:p

But with regard to Purvis is anyone really shocked that a school called Upper Room Academy has questionable academic standards? Glad Duke backed off on him.

I'll be interested to see what happens with Muhammad's case though as there was a lot of speculation about Adidas and the possible intaglements the family may or may not have had with his sister's connection to Adidas as well as UCLAs. He seems like a good kid (not that Purvis doesn't) but I'd hate to see things others may have done cost him but it happens.

[lotusland]

But with regard to Purvis is anyone really shocked that a school called Upper Room Academy has questionable academic standards? Glad Duke backed off on him.



"Upper Room" is a common term of Christianity that references Jesus' teachings to the Disciples as related in the Gospel of John. I'm not sure the name alone should indicate questionable academics but I have noticed that it is common for these basketball academies to adopt Christianity based names. Does anyone have an opinion regarding Christ School from whence the Plumlee boys hale?

[-jk]

"Upper Room" is a common term of Christianity that references Jesus' teachings to the Disciples as related in the Gospel of John. I'm not sure the name alone should indicate questionable academics but I have noticed that it is common for these basketball academies to adopt Christianity based names. Does anyone have an opinion regarding Christ School from whence the Plumlee boys hale?

I get where you're going with the name thing, but it doesn't carry to Christ School.

Christ School is over 100 years old. Hoops is not a focus, though all students are required to participate in sports.

Not in the same league (figuratively anyway) as the Upper Room basketball factory.

(Disclaimer: my cousin has kids enrolled there, and some good friends went to school at their chief rival - Ashville - ages ago)

-jk

[UrinalCake]

Upper Room, Word of God, Mt. Zion... there do seem to be a lot of basketball factories that adopt Christian names. Maybe it's an attempt to stave off allegations by making the accusers seem anti-religious?

(I have a similar theory of why UNC named their corrupt department "African American Studies," but that's another discussion entirely...)

[cspan37421]

"Upper Room" is a common term of Christianity that references Jesus' teachings to the Disciples as related in the Gospel of John. ... from whence the Plumlee boys hail?

-- FYFY

I think you may be mistaken about "upper room". I recall it from Acts. Looking up in a concordance, it appears in the NT in Mark and Luke (once each), and several times in Acts (which is effectively Luke pt. 2). But not in John. Your broader point is quite correct, though - it's a common term.

[cspan37421]

Upper Room, Word of God, Mt. Zion... there do seem to be a lot of basketball factories that adopt Christian names. Maybe it's an attempt to stave off allegations by making the accusers seem anti-religious?

(I have a similar theory of why UNC named their corrupt department "African American Studies," but that's another discussion entirely...)

I strongly doubt the latter was created with the intention of perpetrating academic fraud via the athletic program. As someone in another thread noted, it's a legitimate field of inquiry and scholarship, and if it does not operate as such at UNC, then so much the worse for UNC students.

I'm not so sure about the former, though ... did they have much operational history prior to becoming "basketball factories" as you put it?

[gam7]

Just to be clear, you are right -- we're dealing with two very different situations. In the Purvis case, Duke WAS interested, but voluntarily backed off the kid because of concerns about his academic situation. This is very much lik Eric Bledsoe in 2009 -- we were interested, took a look at his academic record and couldn't back out of the room fast enough. I don't think Purvis' case is that bad, but there were concerns that caused us to quit recruiting him.

I'm not as clear about the Muhammad case, except there were strong rumors after he committed to UCLA that he told friends that he had wanted to go to Duke, but there were reasons that he had to go to UCLA. Again, just rumors, but the rumors were that his father had reaped a large sum from adidas to deliver his son.

Now, those are just rumors, so take if FWIW. We'll let the NCAA investiogation play out.

But in Purvis' case, I'm glad we backed off the kid ... while in Muhammad's case, it's very possible that we didn't get him BECAUSE of irregularities .. ie, he or his family was paid to go elsewhere.

At the time, I think folks were saying (or perhaps speculating) we backed off of Purvis because of the emergence of Sulaimon. Don't recall the academics justification. Was that published somewhere? Or just generally accepted? Just curious...

[UrinalCake]

I thought the previous story with Shabazz was that he had an uncle or family member hired by Adidas, and UCLA is an Adidas school, but that whole situation was already reviewed by the NCAA and he was cleared to go there. The recent investigation sounds like something totally new.

Also, as a separate question, UCLA claims they're holding him out of this exhibition trip until they know the results of the investigation. But if they're just exhibition games, why does it matter? If he winds up being declared ineligible, would they have to forfeit their exhibition wins, and if so, who cares?

[MCFinARL]

I thought the previous story with Shabazz was that he had an uncle or family member hired by Adidas, and UCLA is an Adidas school, but that whole situation was already reviewed by the NCAA and he was cleared to go there. The recent investigation sounds like something totally new.

Also, as a separate question, UCLA claims they're holding him out of this exhibition trip until they know the results of the investigation. But if they're just exhibition games, why does it matter? If he winds up being declared ineligible, would they have to forfeit their exhibition wins, and if so, who cares?

Pretty sure this issue about the financial advisors is not new. One, who I think lives or lived in North Carolina, paid for Shabazz to come visit him and unofficially visit Duke and UNC early on. The other one I think had some links to his non-school team but I can't really remember the details. Both were described as family friends by Shabazz's dad and the Muhammads denied that there was any sort of quid pro quo involved. I tried to research this in the Muhammad recruiting thread, where I think it was mentioned at one point, but I couldn't find it quickly and gave up. :(

[JasonEvans]

Also, as a separate question, UCLA claims they're holding him out of this exhibition trip until they know the results of the investigation. But if they're just exhibition games, why does it matter? If he winds up being declared ineligible, would they have to forfeit their exhibition wins, and if so, who cares?

Well, if he has not been cleared by the NCAA to be a member of the team, then playing him anyway would be a violation of NCAA rules. I would imagine that the penalty for knowingly playing a player who was not approved would be much worse than just forfeiting the games. I could see scholarship revocations, post-season bans, and fines being on the table for something as serious as thumbing your nose at the NCAA by playing an unapproved player.

-Jason "it would also speak toward a 'lack of institutional control' for a school to knowingly break rules like that" Evans

[mccollums]

You know the old saying ... where there's smoke there's fire? What if the smoke is coming from the same person? Does it hold true?

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/29/sports/ncaabasketball/29recruit.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/25/sports/ncaabasketball/25bledsoe.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/sports/ncaabasketball/08basketball.html?pagewanted=all
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/13/sports/ncaabasketball/13kentucky.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/09/sports/basketball/nerlens-noel-kentucky-recruit-attracts-ncaa-inquiry.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/basketball/ncaa/08/22/nerlens-noel-ncaa/index.html

Notice a trend here? One reporter seems to be awfully concerned about UK.

first two articles were about Eric Bledsoe..... what Thamel fails to mention is UK didn't start recruiting him until late in his senior year and the coach at that time was Billy G. Bledsoe was a late bloomer and was not on alot of high major radars until his senior season. Calipari wasn't hired until April of Bledsoe's senior season.

Next 2 were about Enes Kanter, and heck yeah his family received money from the Pro club, that's how it works in Europe. Kanter's family kept records and even offered to pay it back, but the Pro club did not cooperate. It did not help UK that Kanter changed his commitment from Washington to UK as did Terrance Jones. (cough* Mark Emmert former Pres of Univ of Washington. Kanter never took any money personally, the money was funneled to his Dad, then his dad paid the expenses.

Next up Nerlens Noel! Noel is an elite recruit that reclassified. NCAA ALWAYS looks into those situations. Nerlens list was Syracuse, Georgetown, and UK. Where do you think Thamel went to school? Syracuse. Noel's AAU coach wanted Syracuse too, and that's where Thamel is getting his info from...

Andy Katz weighs in:
http://johnclay.bloginky.com/2012/08/23/andy-katz-on-the-nerlens-noel-investigation/

The fact is - if you recruit elite high school talent you are taking a big risk. Your compliance department has to be very thorough to make sure the University does not get embarrassed. It's my opinion that most elite recruits could be ruled ineligible before colleges even start recruiting them. I don't think all of it is insidious either. AAU teams/coaches/players become very close because of the time spent together traveling. Are there leeches out there ready to befriend elite talent? ABSOLUTELY. There are also alot of other people in AAU that are actually looking out for the kids best interest (most of the kids are not elite).

One thing that drives me a little crazy is that message board fans act like they know what's going on in recruiting. We have no idea. Period.

btw- i have given up reading most message boards unless they have good posts and are well moderated. This one has always been a good message board. The occasional crack at opposing schools is perfectly normal. So, let's change the subject and all write Thamel a letter and tell him to leave UK alone and start turning his efforts to the UNC academic scandal :)

[Dukeface88]

I strongly doubt the latter was created with the intention of perpetrating academic fraud via the athletic program. As someone in another thread noted, it's a legitimate field of inquiry and scholarship, and if it does not operate as such at UNC, then so much the worse for UNC students.

I'm not so sure about the former, though ... did they have much operational history prior to becoming "basketball factories" as you put it?

I suspect its a correlation-is-not-causation scenario. Most basketball (or more generally, sports) factories are private schools, and most private schools are religious.

[BD80]

You know the old saying ... where there's smoke there's fire? What if the smoke is coming from the same person? Does it hold true?

... So, let's change the subject and all write Thamel a letter and tell him to leave UK alone and start turning his efforts to the UNC academic scandal :)

Nah, let him follow his passion. Does anyone actually believe that calipari is clean?

Although worthy of its own thread, the newest CBS poll of 100 coaches is up, the dirtiest recruitment of players:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/19865011/critical-coaches-which-players-recruitment-is-perceived-dirtiest-of-past-decade

4 of the top 10 ended up with cal, and didn't include Noel: Davis, Wall, Rose, & Jones. (2 @ ucla - including the #1 dirty recruitment of Shabazz)

Do I smell smoke?

[SupaDave]

One thing that drives me a little crazy is that message board fans act like they know what's going on in recruiting. We have no idea. Period.

You'd be quite surprised who is on these boards...

[BD80]

You'd be quite surprised who is on these boards...

I hear ol' roy snoops around here to see who Coach K is interested in

[MulletMan]

Nah, let him follow his passion. Does anyone actually believe that calipari is clean?

Although worthy of its own thread, the newest CBS poll of 100 coaches is up, the dirtiest recruitment of players:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/19865011/critical-coaches-which-players-recruitment-is-perceived-dirtiest-of-past-decade

4 of the top 10 ended up with cal, and didn't include Noel: Davis, Wall, Rose, & Jones. (2 @ ucla - including the #1 dirty recruitment of Shabazz)

Do I smell smoke?

You might notice that Rodney Hood is on that list in the "Others receiving votes". Just saying that maybe some of it is perception. Unless you think Duke is recruiting on the dirty side?

[dpslaw]

I did see Hood on the list but assumed it was referring to his recruitment out of high school. Perhaps I assumed wrongly.

[Greg_Newton]

You might notice that Rodney Hood is on that list in the "Others receiving votes". Just saying that maybe some of it is perception. Unless you think Duke is recruiting on the dirty side?

I thought that was interesting too. Even though it was clearly referring to Mississippi State, who had an extremely dirty rep under Stansbury, any violations in that initial recruitment would still mean that Hood would be a potential liability for Duke, no?

[JasonEvans]

I thought that was interesting too. Even though it was clearly referring to Mississippi State, who had an extremely dirty rep under Stansbury, any violations in that initial recruitment would still mean that Hood would be a potential liability for Duke, no?

I am sure the votes were because of Hood's recruitment to Miss St. It was a recruiting question, not a transfer question.

THE REST OF THIS POST IS A PURE HYPOTHETICAL!!!

As for potential liability to Duke, if Hood were found to have gotten illegal benefits either to attend or once he was at Miss St, then it could mean that he would be declared ineligible to play basketball at Duke. Duke would have committed no wrongdoing, but they still could not use him. If he had already played in games for Duke, Duke could be forced to vacate the result of those games.

Of course, the above is true of any Duke player. There is little way to know what happened from other schools or other "agents" during the kid's career prior to them arriving at Duke. Corey Maggette taught us all we need to know about that. All you can hope, as a program, is that you get to know the kids before they arrive on campus and you try to make sure the kids you recruit (whether as high schoolers or via transfer) are good kids who know the rules and do not break them.

-Jason "again, the above in no way indicates a belief by me that there is anything wrong with Hood... in fact, I am a bit shocked to hear of the suspicions" Evans

[tommy]

Top big man recruit Nerlens Noel has been cleared (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8516669/nerlens-noel-kentucky-wildcats-cleared-practice-play-ncaa-john-calipari-tells-sportscenter) by the NCAA to practice and play at Kentucky.


Note to mods: possibly change name of this thread now?