Jabari Parker Article - This Makes Me Sick!

[Rich]

Seeing this in print really made my stomach turn:

"Parker is a target of the nation's top programs, including famed one-and-done (star players that play one year before declaring for the NBA) programs Duke and Kentucky."

So now we're a one-and-done factory in the same category as Kentucky? I'm disgusted by the comparison.

[Johnny Chill]

Duke isnt in the same category as Kentucky in terms of 1 and done. Duke needs to continue to bring in top talent, 1 and done guys as well as 4 year guys. I dont like the 1 and done rule, but thats the way it is, so get use to it.

[Slackerb]

Both programs do have stars that play one year and then go pro.

You added the word factory.

I think it's an accurate sentence.

[m g]

Seeing this in print really made my stomach turn:

"Parker is a target of the nation's top programs, including famed one-and-done (star players that play one year before declaring for the NBA) programs Duke and Kentucky."

So now we're a one-and-done factory in the same category as Kentucky? I'm disgusted by the comparison.

I think this is awesome. One and dones are a reality of college basketball. If Duke can have the perception that it's a good place for one and dones, but still maintains a clean program and emphasize academics, that is pretty much ideal. Being mentioned in the same sentence as Kentucky doesn't mean Duke has to do everything like Kentucky.

[blazindw]

You cannot call us a 1-and-done factory. We've had 4 players turn pro after their freshman year EVER. UK had 4 drafted in the 1st round of the 2010 Draft alone. And we don't have to remind ourselves how those 4 freshman did in the tournament that year or what we ended up doing.

Until the NBA and NCAA work to change the rule, we will have 1-and-dones and we cannot avoid kids who are thinking about going that route. If we did, there would be very few kids left to recruit.

[Slackerb]

How many programs have had their star go pro after one year, two years in a row?

Kentucky
Duke

Note that only the OP has changed the discussion to factory.

[CDu]

How many programs have had their star go pro after one year, two years in a row?

Kentucky
Duke

Note that only the OP has changed the discussion to factory.

Yeah, the term factory changes the entire debate, and that's a spin provided by the poster not the article. We've had two notable one-and-dones in a row now. As such, that puts us in the conversation.

Clearly, Kentucky is the hands-down runaway leader in the one-and-done debate. After them? We're probably next. So the article isn't all that misleading.

[tbyers11]

How many programs have had their star go pro after one year, two years in a row?

Kentucky
Duke

Note that only the OP has changed the discussion to factory.

While I agree that the term factory (not used by the author) suggests a more negative image than the term program, anyone who suggests that Duke is a one-and-done program on the level of Kentucky hasn't done their homework and suffers from a recency bias. Since the one and done was enacted in 2006, Duke has had 2 such players, Irving and Rivers. Kentucky has had 8 (MKG, Davis, Teague, Knight, Wall, Cousins, Bledsoe, Orton). Ohio St has had 5 (Mullens, Koufos, Oden, Conley, Cook). Texas has had 4 (Durant, Bradley, Thompson, Joseph). Heck, Georgia Tech has had 3 (Crittenton, Thaddeus Young and Favors). I'm sure other programs have had 2 or more as well. But these came off the top of my head with a minute of research to confirm.

As for one-and-dones as a whole, I don't have a problem with having them at Duke mixed in with 3 and 4 year players. Both Rivers and Irving bought into the team concept and will be great ambassadors for Duke during their NBA careers.

[DukeDevilDeb]

Yeah, the term factory changes the entire debate, and that's a spin provided by the poster not the article. We've had two notable one-and-dones in a row now. As such, that puts us in the conversation.

Clearly, Kentucky is the hands-down runaway leader in the one-and-done debate. After them? We're probably next. So the article isn't all that misleading.

I disagree with you and others on this thread who are not offended by the "one and done" label attached to our team. We have had two guys do this (one after playing only a limited number of games for us). That means you can count them on your thumbs. In order to total Kentucky one and dones, you need to take off your shoes and use your toes as well as your fingers! :rolleyes:

We are a storied basketball program with the winningest coach ever in the NCAA. We didn't get there by having one and dones... and we won't perpetuate our winning record that way. While Kyrie, had he remained healthy for the entire season, would have likely made a huge difference, Austin wasn't built to fit the Duke system.

Anything that compares us to Kentucky (and with a negative slant) makes me furious. :mad: When Calipari gets his 900+ win, then I'll think about the viability of such a comparison. Until then, we are a program that has won with seniors (Laettner, Hurley, Hill, Battier, James, Scheyer, Thomas, Zoubek... and any others I've not mentioned). Now THAT is something to be proud of!!!

Go Devils 2012-2013!

[Monmouth77]

I disagree with you and others on this thread who are not offended by the "one and done" label attached to our team. We have had two guys do this (one after playing only a limited number of games for us). That means you can count them on your thumbs. In order to total Kentucky one and dones, you need to take off your shoes and use your toes as well as your fingers! :rolleyes:

We are a storied basketball program with the winningest coach ever in the NCAA. We didn't get there by having one and dones... and we won't perpetuate our winning record that way. While Kyrie, had he remained healthy for the entire season, would have likely made a huge difference, Austin wasn't built to fit the Duke system.

Anything that compares us to Kentucky (and with a negative slant) makes me furious. :mad: When Calipari gets his 900+ win, then I'll think about the viability of such a comparison. Until then, we are a program that has won with seniors (Laettner, Hurley, Hill, Battier, James, Scheyer, Thomas, Zoubek... and any others I've not mentioned). Now THAT is something to be proud of!!!

Go Devils 2012-2013!

The bolded part here is just not true. Unless you have 4 thumbs.

Obviously Duke and Kentucky have different recruiting standards and strategies. The schools are vastly different institutions. And Coach K and Calipari have different legacies.

It is true, however, that Duke has, and will continue to recruit "one-and-done" level talent-- i.e., guys who are good enough to make the leap to the NBA after one year. And we should. That is how the rules are set up, and Coach K has successfully adapted to those rules. For an example of what happens to a program when its leader can't or won't change, look at the last few discontented years of Bob Knight's career at Indiana. Pretty sure Coach K has this well in mind.

And by the way, Duke is also a team that has won championships and made Final Fours with freshman playing decisive roles (Hill, Deng, Duhon, Hurley)

[Azdukefan]

In terms of Jabari, there really would be no way that he would stay at Duke for more than one year. I'm sure very few of you know the process for going on a Mormon mission but essentially you apply when you turn 19 and leave shortly thereafter. Upon return, Jabari would be 21 and enter the NBA. This type of commitment is a huge sacrifice on his career and even more of a reason that I think this kid belongs at Duke.

As far as becoming a "one and done factory," I think we will continue to have at least one of these players every other year (minimum). I personally am not a fan of it but, it is the way of NCAA basketball.

[Jderf]

Anything that compares us to Kentucky (and with a negative slant) makes me furious. :mad: When Calipari gets his 900+ win, then I'll think about the viability of such a comparison. Until then, we are a program that has won with seniors (Laettner, Hurley, Hill, Battier, James, Scheyer, Thomas, Zoubek... and any others I've not mentioned). Now THAT is something to be proud of!!!

Go Devils 2012-2013!

But there was no negative slant in the article! That "negative slant" has been projected onto by those who choose to detest basketball players based on an extremely meaningful integer between 1 and 4.

Personally, as long as K continues to recruit high-character kids who represent the university well, I will continue to not judge people for how long it takes them to fully prepare for the next stage in their lives.

[gumbomoop]

Always best to tred lightly into a new thread that already has posters irritated with each other.

I guess maybe we could focus on the key phrase in the article, which, we agree, does not include the word "factory." Good, we agree on something.

The key phrase - we might be able to agree, before we re-commence to disagreeing - is "famed one-and-done... programs Duke and Kentucky." My complaint here is that Duke's fame in the intermediate-to-long-term [K era = roughly 30 years] isn't a product of our 2 recent one-dones. Does the author actually remember and refer also to Maggette and Deng?

I suppose one might argue that UK's one-done-related "fame" is, like Duke's, of very recent vintage, and that, like Duke, its historic fame comes from other things, like championships.

Still, Kentucky's recent one-done fame is a good deal more dramatic and publicized than Duke's. A key factor in Calipari's recruiting strategy is his success in getting guys to the league after but one season. So maybe the argument in this thread will devolve into a debate about whether K should emulate Calipari, in this regard .

Everyone here wants K to have wonderful recruiting successes. We might still differ on what constitutes success, or the wisest path thereto. No one here wants Duke to emulate the other thing, historically, for which UK is sometimes known: cheating. And it's that [I]infamy, rather than fame, that some posters will recoil against, whenever Duke and K are mentioned in the same breath with UK and Calipari.

[Class of '94]

In terms of Jabari, there really would be no way that he would stay at Duke for more than one year. I'm sure very few of you know the process for going on a Mormon mission but essentially you apply when you turn 19 and leave shortly thereafter. Upon return, Jabari would be 21 and enter the NBA. This type of commitment is a huge sacrifice on his career and even more of a reason that I think this kid belongs at Duke.

As far as becoming a "one and done factory," I think we will continue to have at least one of these players every other year (minimum). I personally am not a fan of it but, it is the way of NCAA basketball.

I thought it was a 1-yr mission as opposed to two. Does that mean Stillman White will be away from the Carolina program for 2 years since I believe he's left for his missionary service? I'm not sure if I'm correct on this but I thought Shawn Bradley went on his missionary service just before or while he played in the NBA; and I didn't recall him missing any time in college; but again I could be mistaken.

As far as Parker only playing 1 year at Duke, that could happen; but I could see him coming back to Duke for at least one more year after his missionary service to build his skills back up in preparation for the NBA. I would find it hard to believe that Jabari would jump directly into the NBA after being away from competitive basketball and practice for 2 years. I could be wrong; but I don't believe there would be a lot of time devoted to keeping up his game while Jabari is conducting his missionary service.

[CDu]

I disagree with you and others on this thread who are not offended by the "one and done" label attached to our team. We have had two guys do this (one after playing only a limited number of games for us). That means you can count them on your thumbs. In order to total Kentucky one and dones, you need to take off your shoes and use your toes as well as your fingers! :rolleyes:

We are a storied basketball program with the winningest coach ever in the NCAA. We didn't get there by having one and dones... and we won't perpetuate our winning record that way. While Kyrie, had he remained healthy for the entire season, would have likely made a huge difference, Austin wasn't built to fit the Duke system.

Anything that compares us to Kentucky (and with a negative slant) makes me furious. :mad: When Calipari gets his 900+ win, then I'll think about the viability of such a comparison. Until then, we are a program that has won with seniors (Laettner, Hurley, Hill, Battier, James, Scheyer, Thomas, Zoubek... and any others I've not mentioned). Now THAT is something to be proud of!!!

Go Devils 2012-2013!

We have had 4 guys do this in the past 13 years. And I didn't say we were on the level of Kentucky in terms of one and done status. They are a one-and-done factory. But we have probably as many one-and-done players as any other program in the country. And we have more one-and-dones in the last two years than any program other than Kentucky. So when discussing Parker's possible destinations, it seems reasonable to consider us a team that dabbles in the one and dones.

I also disagree with your statement that we won't perpetuate our records with one-and-dones. Coach K went hard after a likely one-and-done this past year (Muhammad), he's going hard after two possible one-and-done next years (Parker and Randle), and he's going after one (possibly two) one-and-dones the following year (Okafor and Wiggins). That's the reality of the college landscape. The best players don't plan to stay long-term anymore. So if you're going after the best players, you're going after likely one-and-dones. And Coach K is certainly going after the best players.

[moonpie23]

even tho the majority of my studio's output currently is rock/pop, if the next two hits that come out of here are "gangsta rap", trust me, we're a "gangsta rap factory"...


perception...

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

C'mon folks. Mountains out of mole hills here. As noted above, the reference to Duke as a program that is "famed" for one-and-dones is something to which many folks obviously have a visceral reaction. But it's not like this characterization is being spewed regularly by major media outlets. It had not become our identity. It's one guy in salt lake city who probably put 0.5 seconds worth of thought into choosing the word "famed" when penned this article. My bet is that he was more interested in showing just how impressive it is that Jabari is getting such attention from major programs like Duke and others. I wish as a fan base we could take a chill pill and quit over-interpreting every word that is said or written about the Duke program. It's just so... whiny.

[Olympic Fan]

Just to be clear -- we've had four one-and-dones in our history. Kentucky has had 10 one-and-dones in the last three years.

That's not quite the same thing.

Amazingly, Duke does not lead the ACC in this category -- Georgia Tech has had five one-and-dones: Stephon Marbury, Chris Bosh, Javaris Crittendon, Thaddeus Young and Derrick Favors. You could also count Dion Glover as a sixth -- he played as a freshman, tore up his knee in preseason and sat out his sophomore season, then went pro without playing another game at Georgia Tech.

UNC has done better -- just two one-and-dones (Marvin Williams and Brandon Wright) unless you count Bob McAdoo (he was a two-year juco who went pro after one year at UNC). You've got to be impressed by Roy's ability to keep lottery picks for an extra year. A lot of guys who are mid to late first-rounders elect to return to school in the ACC -- Mason Plumlee and C.J. Leslie this year, Kyle Singler and Nolan Smith after 2010 ... too many to list.

But how many people in ACC history have passed up the lottery to come back?

For Duke, Jason Williams after 2001 for sure (he would have been No. 1 in the draft that year) ... Grant Hill after 1992 and maybe even 1991. Laettner after 1991. At Wake, Tim Duncan would have been lottery in 1995 and 1996 (maybe No. 1) before he was No. 1 in 1997.

At UNC under Roy, you have Ed Davis after 2009, Barnes and maybe Henson after 2011 and McAdoo this year. Don't get me wrong, I'm not ripping Roy -- I admire his ability to convince lottery picks to return for another year. So far, I don't think it helped. Davis' stock dropped a bit when he proved he couldn't carry the team in 2010 and Barnes certainly didn't help himself with a lackluster sophomore year. Henson actually seemed to show me a lot as a junior ... but his draft projections seem lower this year than they were before he pulled out of the draft last year. We'll see where he ends up.

And we'll see if McAdoo (projected 7 to 9 on most lists before he pulled out) helps himself by staying another year.

[OldPhiKap]

If a kid thinks he's gonna be a one-and-done candidate, and Coach wants him here, I'm happy to be a famed o-a-d program.

But I do long for the days when all of our players graduated, and we didn't hang the class banner if they didn't. So I am sympathetic to the OP's gut reaction. Being in the same sentence as Kentucky is rarely good.

[Azdukefan]

I thought it was a 1-yr mission as opposed to two. Does that mean Stillman White will be away from the Carolina program for 2 years since I believe he's left for his missionary service? I'm not sure if I'm correct on this but I thought Shawn Bradley went on his missionary service just before or while he played in the NBA; and I didn't recall him missing any time in college; but again I could be mistaken.

As far as Parker only playing 1 year at Duke, that could happen; but I could see him coming back to Duke for at least one more year after his missionary service to build his skills back up in preparation for the NBA. I would find it hard to believe that Jabari would jump directly into the NBA after being away from competitive basketball and practice for 2 years. I could be wrong; but I don't believe there would be a lot of time devoted to keeping up his game while Jabari is conducting his missionary service.

LDS missions are two year missions. Stillman will be gone for two years. I am not LDS myself but am related to a number of LDS members.

During his mission he will not be maintaining his game as the entire time is spent serving the church/god.

Especially for a kid like Jabari, it is nice to see that he puts life and thereafter ahead of money and basketball.

[CDu]

In terms of Jabari, there really would be no way that he would stay at Duke for more than one year. I'm sure very few of you know the process for going on a Mormon mission but essentially you apply when you turn 19 and leave shortly thereafter. Upon return, Jabari would be 21 and enter the NBA. This type of commitment is a huge sacrifice on his career and even more of a reason that I think this kid belongs at Duke.

As far as becoming a "one and done factory," I think we will continue to have at least one of these players every other year (minimum). I personally am not a fan of it but, it is the way of NCAA basketball.

Note that Parker hasn't committed to the idea of doing a mission. It's just a possibility. Not all Mormons go on missions. Jimmer Fredette, for example, did not. Nor did Chris Burgess. As far as I've read, Parker has not ruled out the possibility of going on a Mormon mission, but has certainly not decided to do one. So being a "two-and-done" is still very much a possibility.

[JNort]

You cannot call us a 1-and-done factory. We've had 4 players turn pro after their freshman year EVER. UK had 4 drafted in the 1st round of the 2010 Draft alone. And we don't have to remind ourselves how those 4 freshman did in the tournament that year or what we ended up doing.

Until the NBA and NCAA work to change the rule, we will have 1-and-dones and we cannot avoid kids who are thinking about going that route. If we did, there would be very few kids left to recruit.


I disagree with you and others on this thread who are not offended by the "one and done" label attached to our team. We have had two guys do this (one after playing only a limited number of games for us). That means you can count them on your thumbs. In order to total Kentucky one and dones, you need to take off your shoes and use your toes as well as your fingers! :rolleyes:

We are a storied basketball program with the winningest coach ever in the NCAA. We didn't get there by having one and dones... and we won't perpetuate our winning record that way. While Kyrie, had he remained healthy for the entire season, would have likely made a huge difference, Austin wasn't built to fit the Duke system.

Anything that compares us to Kentucky (and with a negative slant) makes me furious. :mad: When Calipari gets his 900+ win, then I'll think about the viability of such a comparison. Until then, we are a program that has won with seniors (Laettner, Hurley, Hill, Battier, James, Scheyer, Thomas, Zoubek... and any others I've not mentioned). Now THAT is something to be proud of!!!

Go Devils 2012-2013!

Well if you look at it like I do then yes we could be considered a "one and done school" but so could unc and a few others. We target one and done type of guys every year (Austin, Drummond, Barnes, Kyrie, Knight, Wall, Monroe, Bledsoe, Julius Randle, Jabari Parker, etc...) but we do not always get them to commit. Kentucky has just gotten more commits from top tier talent in the last few years than we have which has given them that perception. We could very easily be what Kentucky is now if we had gotten a few more guys signed (prob not as bad as UK but we would be right there).

That said Duke has targeted more 4 year guys than UK as well and this is where UK is really off from us.

[tommy]

How many programs have had their star go pro after one year, two years in a row?

Kentucky
Duke

Note that only the OP has changed the discussion to factory.

UCLA also experienced this relatively recently, with Kevin Love and Jrue Holiday going pro after a single season in Westwood, Love in 2007-08 and Holiday in 2008-09.

[ThePublisher]

This was on bleacher report right? I mean that tells you right there. They're all about 'shock factor' and what not.

Kentucky is truly a 1nDone factory; just because Duke has had two in a row in Kyrie and Austin, it doens't make us a factory. Pretty ridiculous of the writer to say this.

[Bluedog]

This was on bleacher report right? I mean that tells you right there. They're all about 'shock factor' and what not.

Kentucky is truly a 1nDone factory; just because Duke has had two in a row in Kyrie and Austin, it doens't make us a factory. Pretty ridiculous of the writer to say this.

No, it wasn't for Bleacher Report. It was a writer for the Deseret News, a Salt Lake City newspaper (second in circulation in the state behind the Salt Lake City Tribune).

[CDu]

This was on bleacher report right? I mean that tells you right there. They're all about 'shock factor' and what not.

Kentucky is truly a 1nDone factory; just because Duke has had two in a row in Kyrie and Austin, it doens't make us a factory. Pretty ridiculous of the writer to say this.

To clarify - the writer did not say "factory." That was editorialization by the original poster. And it wasn't a Bleacher Report article. It appears to instead be a bit of sour grapes from the Mormon perspective (it's a Salt Lake City article), perhaps hoping that Parker would choose BYU.

Relative to BYU, Duke is most certainly more of a one-and-done program. In fact, relative to anyone but Kentucky, we're on the shortest of lists of one-and-done schools.

[Rich]

So I am sympathetic to the OP's gut reaction. Being in the same sentence as Kentucky is rarely good.

Thanks for the defense. I suppose my use of the word "factory" was more inflammatory than the original article intended, but being placed in the same category as Cal-tucky in this regard just seems so unsavory and dirty.

[BD80]

Thanks for the defense. I suppose my use of the word "factory" was more inflammatory than the original article intended, but being placed in the same category as Cal-tucky in this regard just seems so unsavory and dirty.

Anytime you are in proximity to coach cal, check your wallet and watch, and have your wife, your daughter and your dog take pregnancy tests.

[gumbomoop]

To clarify - the writer did not say "factory." That was editorialization by the original poster.

Actually, on rereading the article, I now see that the writer did use the word "factory."

The 2 relevant passages are [1] the aforementioned "famed one-and-done... programs Duke and Kentucky." But then, lo and behold, in the very next paragraph, [2] the writer wonders whether Parker will choose "a one-and-done factory."

So it may well be that the OP has taken a little more flack than is deserved. It's not actually much of a stretch to infer that the writer either wittingly or unwittingly suggested that UK and Duke are one-done "factories." And if - if - witting, then the OP has even less to apologize for than this follow-up suggests.


I suppose my use of the word "factory" was more inflammatory than the original article intended....

To come full circle, then, I began this post by correcting something CDu wrote. I end by saying CDu may be onto a key point, suggesting some "sour grapes" by the writer.


It appears to instead be a bit of sour grapes from the Mormon perspective (it's a Salt Lake City article), perhaps hoping that Parker would choose BYU.

In short, the use of the phrase "one-and-done factory" may not be just a coincidence, coming only a few sentences after pairing UK and Duke as "famed one-and-done programs." Maybe the writer, rather than the OP, was being inflammatory.

I don't actually care whether the writer of the article was being deliberately inflammatory. But I think the OP need not apologize, at all.

[johnb]

Dissed by a sportswriter at the 2nd biggest newspaper in SLC? We're getting a little sensitive.

If we can average an annual K-approved 0ad, I'll be perfectly happy.

[Rich]

Actually, on rereading the article, I now see that the writer did use the word "factory."

The 2 relevant passages are [1] the aforementioned "famed one-and-done... programs Duke and Kentucky." But then, lo and behold, in the very next paragraph, [2] the writer wonders whether Parker will choose "a one-and-done factory."

So it may well be that the OP has taken a little more flack than is deserved. It's not actually much of a stretch to infer that the writer either wittingly or unwittingly suggested that UK and Duke are one-done "factories." And if - if - witting, then the OP has even less to apologize for than this follow-up suggests.



To come full circle, then, I began this post by correcting something CDu wrote. I end by saying CDu may be onto a key point, suggesting some "sour grapes" by the writer.



In short, the use of the phrase "one-and-done factory" may not be just a coincidence, coming only a few sentences after pairing UK and Duke as "famed one-and-done programs." Maybe the writer, rather than the OP, was being inflammatory.

I don't actually care whether the writer of the article was being deliberately inflammatory. But I think the OP need not apologize, at all.

Thanks Gum. I guess I forgot that I read the "factory" bit in the article and so I believed I didn't have much in terms of defending myself. I have to admit that I kind of find all of this amusing. I've been a member and fairly consistent poster on this website since the days it had a basketball court as the background, went by the name Sagarmatha, and was run by a game named James. The flaming is just part of being a member. Sometimes you write something smart and sometimes you don't. All in all, though, I think the discourse on the one-and-done factory topic and Duke's place in it has been really interesting.

[OldPhiKap]

Thanks for the defense. I suppose my use of the word "factory" was more inflammatory than the original article intended, but being placed in the same category as Cal-tucky in this regard just seems so unsavory and dirty.

Got your back, bro. I feel the same.

K has said in the past that the 1-&-done rule is bad. Either let the kids go straight to the NBA, or require at least two years. Seems reasonable to me. But we've got to play with the rules we have, and I can't see telling someone that they don't fit our model because they have major league chops. Kyrie is a great example -- wonderful kid, good student, etc. -- that I was proud to have associated with our school and hope he gets his degree when he can.

[Gthoma2a]

This title is really melodramatic. It is so much ado about nothing. We get star players... that isn't a bad thing on our program, but rather on THE SPORT. We play by the rules of the sport. So to be competitive and recruit, we have to be willing to take the top talent for however long they intend to participate in the sport.

Also, this article may mention us in the same sentence, but really they are speaking of teams that get the best players and compete for titles. Better they list us next to them than next to someone irrelevant. This is not to mention that we have had 3 one and done players in the past several years. That is not bad (and one was a transfer; I list him because I am going to miss Silent G)...

[UrinalCake]

If we want to recruit good players we're going to have to deal with one and dones. For every guy that goes one-and-done there are probably 5-10 guys who are similarly talented at the time we start recruiting them (i.e. around their sophomore year of high school) but wind up staying in school for 2-4 years. There's so much uncertainty in how guys will develop, so if we were to stop recruiting anyone who has even a remote chance of being a one-and-doner, then we're cutting out a pretty significant percentage of the overall talent pool. Guys like Kyle and Mason were potential one-and-doners as high schoolers. What if we had laid off of them out of the fear of being labeled an NBA factory?

[-bdbd]

Dissed by a sportswriter at the 2nd biggest newspaper in SLC? We're getting a little sensitive.

If we can average an annual K-approved 0ad, I'll be perfectly happy.

Yes, maybe we're being a little sensitive. Whenever I see a writer try to poke a finger in Duke's eye, in this case by somewhat inaccurately lobbing us together with KY as a "one and done factory," I start looking for other explanations for the skewed perspective. Maybe the author wants to convince a kid to come to school X instead, maybe he's playing to an audience (that is heavy in Duke-haters) or maybe HE, simply is a Duke hater. Internet searches are easy-enough done on authors. In this case, however, the antagonism is so minor, I mean, who really cares? (Small-time writer, small audience, etc.) Just chalk it up to inaaccurate reporting and move on - nothing to see here folks...

:p

[lotusland]

If we want to recruit good players we're going to have to deal with one and dones. For every guy that goes one-and-done there are probably 5-10 guys who are similarly talented at the time we start recruiting them (i.e. around their sophomore year of high school) but wind up staying in school for 2-4 years. There's so much uncertainty in how guys will develop, so if we were to stop recruiting anyone who has even a remote chance of being a one-and-doner, then we're cutting out a pretty significant percentage of the overall talent pool. Guys like Kyle and Mason were potential one-and-doners as high schoolers. What if we had laid off of them out of the fear of being labeled an NBA factory?

I think Duke has done well with all 4 one and done players thus far. As I said in a another thread I thought all those guys, at the time Duke started recruiting them, still had something to prove at the college level before they would be considered a slam dunk lottery player. I don't think that was true for Bazz or Wall though. Like K said those players are still great kids but they really don't belong in College for 6-mos. We really got in on Bazz kinda late so I never saw the point in recruiting him. I also never really believed he would come to Duke.

[UrinalCake]

I think Duke has done well with all 4 one and done players thus far. As I said in a another thread I thought all those guys, at the time Duke started recruiting them, still had something to prove at the college level before they would be considered a slam dunk lottery player.

I agree with this, and will add that all four of the guys seemed to be completely committed to their academics for the time in which they were in school. That's not true for everyone. Maybe they didn't get their degrees but they did get two semesters of real education at a top university.

It's also kind of funny how as recently as 2010 the consensus was that Duke could no longer recruit one-and-done talent, that we had turned into a mid-major type team that relied on four-year players.

[CDu]

Yes, maybe we're being a little sensitive. Whenever I see a writer try to poke a finger in Duke's eye, in this case by somewhat inaccurately lobbing us together with KY as a "one and done factory," I start looking for other explanations for the skewed perspective. Maybe the author wants to convince a kid to come to school X instead, maybe he's playing to an audience (that is heavy in Duke-haters) or maybe HE, simply is a Duke hater. Internet searches are easy-enough done on authors. In this case, however, the antagonism is so minor, I mean, who really cares? (Small-time writer, small audience, etc.) Just chalk it up to inaaccurate reporting and move on - nothing to see here folks...

:p

Well, he's a writer in Salt Lake City (Mormon country). He's writing with regard to Jabari Parker (Mormon basketball star) and his list of favorites. It doesn't take a huge leap to realize that either (a) the writer has sour grapes that Parker might choose somewhere other than the great local Mormon school BYU, or (b) is pandering to an audience who would hold such beliefs, or (c) both. I'd say one of those 3 choices is more likely than merely inaccurate reporting.

[left_hook_lacey]

So, are we a one and done factory now that will be lumped in with Kentucky? It's interesting to read the opinions on the matter, and how they evolved with our recruiting the past 6 years. :cool:

[PackMan97]

So now we're a one-and-done factory in the same category as Kentucky? I'm disgusted by the comparison.

I encourage you to cheer for NC State instead! Not only do you get used to seeing players stick around for longer, the losing seasons, frequent coaching changes and routine losses to Duke and Carolina really help build character and develop an appreciation for winning that not many Duke fans get to experience.

:)

[moonpie23]

and we won't perpetuate our winning record that way.

ummm.....that's exactly what we're doing currently until the rule is changed.....

[flyingdutchdevil]

I encourage you to cheer for NC State instead! Not only do you get used to seeing players stick around for longer, the losing seasons, frequent coaching changes and routine losses to Duke and Carolina really help build character and develop an appreciation for winning that not many Duke fans get to experience.

:)

You clearly weren't a Duke football fan in the 00s...

[subzero02]

You cannot call us a 1-and-done factory. We've had 4 players turn pro after their freshman year EVER. UK had 4 drafted in the 1st round of the 2010 Draft alone. And we don't have to remind ourselves how those 4 freshman did in the tournament that year or what we ended up doing.

Until the NBA and NCAA work to change the rule, we will have 1-and-dones and we cannot avoid kids who are thinking about going that route. If we did, there would be very few kids left to recruit.

I think you need to check your math

Corey, Deng, Kyrie, Austin, Jabari, Tyus, Winslow, Ingram, Okafor, Giles, Tatum, and Jackson

[juise]

I think you need to check your math

Corey, Deng, Kyrie, Austin, Jabari, Tyus, Winslow, Ingram, Okafor, Giles, Tatum, and Jackson

Everyone needs to realize that most of this thread is from 2012.

[PackMan97]

You clearly weren't a Duke football fan in the 00s...

No, I was a NC State basketball fan during the mid '90s...which is perhaps worse. I came of age as a State fan as we set the school record for most losses, broke that record the next season and then tied our newly broken record the season after. Fun times. While I've been a fan, NC State has been to exactly one more sweet 16 than Duke FB has won bowl games...and NC State basketball has won exactly as many ACC titles (regular season or championship game) as Duke FB.

[left_hook_lacey]

Everyone needs to realize that most of this thread is from 2012.

This. I just thought it would be fun to look at how our opinions have changed in only 6 years on the subject. Some people were actually quite prophetic in the direction we were headed, however.

[Billy Dat]

I think you need to check your math

Corey, Deng, Kyrie, Austin, Jabari, Tyus, Winslow, Ingram, Okafor, Giles, Tatum, and Jackson

There are more you are forgetting...Eric Boateng, Michael Gbinije, Elliott Williams, Taylor King and Jordan Tucker!

Jamal Boykin and Olek Czyz were pretty close to one-and-done, too.

[jimsumner]

I saw this headline and thought something terrible had happened.

Then I realized this was a thread from SIX years ago.

Sheesh.

[arnie]

No, I was a NC State basketball fan during the mid '90s...which is perhaps worse. I came of age as a State fan as we set the school record for most losses, broke that record the next season and then tied our newly broken record the season after. Fun times. While I've been a fan, NC State has been to exactly one more sweet 16 than Duke FB has won bowl games...and NC State basketball has won exactly as many ACC titles (regular season or championship game) as Duke FB.

No, there was nothing worse than being a Duke football fan in the 00s before Cut arrived.

[blazindw]

Everyone needs to realize that most of this thread is from 2012.

I was wondering why this thread was popped back up to the top, haha.

[TheOldBattleship]

No, there was nothing worse than being a Duke football fan in the 00s before Cut arrived.

What year was that one VaTech game we had at home where they literally had more points than we had net yards? That was a dark day.

[arnie]

What year was that one VaTech game we had at home where they literally had more points than we had net yards? That was a dark day.

Yea, it all runs together now which is a good thing. Of course the excitement of beating ECU in the rain to end a ridiculous losing streak was fun.

[juise]

Yea, it all runs together now which is a good thing. Of course the excitement of beating ECU in the rain to end a ridiculous losing streak was fun.

Still have my chunk of goal post.

[JNort]

Well if you look at it like I do then yes we could be considered a "one and done school" but so could unc and a few others. We target one and done type of guys every year (Austin, Drummond, Barnes, Kyrie, Knight, Wall, Monroe, Bledsoe, Julius Randle, Jabari Parker, etc...) but we do not always get them to commit. Kentucky has just gotten more commits from top tier talent in the last few years than we have which has given them that perception. We could very easily be what Kentucky is now if we had gotten a few more guys signed (prob not as bad as UK but we would be right there).

That said Duke has targeted more 4 year guys than UK as well and this is where UK is really off from us.

Dang I guess I was right... now we are just actually getting more committed.

[75Crazie]

No, there was nothing worse than being a Duke football fan in the 00s before Cut arrived.
I disagree, given the relative importance placed by both schools (taking a bit of liberty here in attempting to represent State fans) of basketball vs football ... and given the fact that the State basketball sanctions of the 90s were imposed by a university governance structure that rules both State and UNC and is dominated by UNC reps. Add to that all the facts coming out later about the true nature of the Carolina Way, and I don't think that Duke fans can come close to appreciating the magnitude of angst that State fans had to bear at that time (and continue to bear).