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Lotus000
07-27-2007, 10:54 PM
Does anybody know if the home/home vs. G'Town runs thru this year? I know we played them last year in Cameron, but I'm about to start a post-bac for pre med at G'Town in August, and want to try early to get tickets, wear my Duke rig, and cheer against everybody here in DC.

jimbonelson
07-28-2007, 06:40 AM
i went ot the game in dc 2 years ago they played in the verizon center downtown and was easy enough to get tickets there was a sea of duke blue there much more than the colors of the hoyas was a great game but duke lost

duketaylor
07-28-2007, 07:20 AM
Doesn't look like we play G'town this year.

Cameron
07-28-2007, 12:18 PM
was a great game but duke lost

Still not quite sure what Paulus was doing on that last play; I still have nightmares about JJ not getting the last shot.

mapei
07-28-2007, 05:07 PM
But JJ did get a shot, right? It was blocked by Brandon Bowman. Maybe that was the possession before. Paulus had a horrible game, and so did Shel as I recall.

I was completely miserable the entire day, since my two teams were playing each other. My SO and I didn't sit in our usual seats in the Hoya season-tix section, but wimped out and watched it from the restaurant level.

I think I read on the Hoya board that the series is taking a year off and will resume the year after.

Cameron
07-28-2007, 07:29 PM
^^If I remember correctly--and I am pretty sure that this horrific moment is entombed in my brain for the rest of my life--I believe we never actually got a final shot off in the '06 G-town game. Paulus brought the ball up the floor and pretty much just dribbled it out of bounds to end the game. I recall being so p*ssed off that JJ was not given the ball sooner. He had been absolutely torching the nets that day, in one of his famous "grooves." I have no doubt that he would have sent home the game tying three (I think we were down 3, right?)

Anyway, JJ would probably have scored ten plus in the extra period and walked off into the sunset with 50-some points... Oh, the what if's in life...

mapei
07-28-2007, 11:23 PM
You're right. I just checked the play-by play. Bowman's block on JJ came with 29 seconds left and the score 83-78. After that Georgetown hit four FTs interspersed with buckets by Paulus (1) and Dockery (2) to make the score 87-84.

On the final possession Shelden grabbed a rebound off a missed FT with 6 seconds left. "Instead of getting the ball to Redick, however, freshman point guard Greg Paulus was dribbling near midcourt and got stripped by [Jon] Wallace with 4 seconds left." http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=260210046

And that was that. JJ was heroic in that game, but so was Bowman, with 23 points, 8 boards, 3 blocks, a steal and an assist. Jeff Green had 18 points, 5 boards, 7 assists, and 3 steals.

greybeard
07-29-2007, 11:38 AM
For those who were at the game, here's an interesting factoid. If you go to McDonnough, and, after walking in the front, hang a left, walk to the staricase near the end of the hall, and go up the stairs. At the landing there is an alcove about 8 feet wide. On the walls (it goes around to the side) is a color photo of the floor at the version center after the whistle, with everyone flooding the floor. Bring a magnifying glass and you can find yourself.

Cameron
07-29-2007, 12:46 PM
At the landing there is an alcove about 8 feet wide. On the walls (it goes around to the side) is a color photo of the floor at the version center after the whistle, with everyone flooding the floor.

That kind of reminds me of the oversized picture we have hanging in an alcove of the Vic Bubas Corridor, commemorating our victory over Georgetown in 2003.

Oh wait, there isn't one, because a regular season win over Georgetown means nothing. Lol.

We Are Duke.

greybeard
07-29-2007, 12:52 PM
That kind of reminds me of the oversized picture we have hanging in an alcove of the Vic Bubas Corridor, commemorating our victory over Georgetown in 2003.

Oh wait, there isn't one, because a regular season win over Georgetown means nothing. Lol.

We Are Duke.

Not exactly, but your point is well taken. I'd get off the couch to see Duke (actually I did); I don't know that I do that for too many other teams. That is why I posted here repeatedly that that year's Duke team was the top team in the country, for which I got grief on this here board. Every place those guys played I'm sure it was as electric as it was that afternoon at the Verizon Center. Georgetown played the game of the decade for itself, and the Duke kids were so poised, represented so well, and almost won in a game in which they had been outplayed.

Cameron
07-29-2007, 01:05 PM
^^I definitely understand your point regarding Georgetown's victory over top ranked Duke in 2006. It was, literally, a landmark win for John Thompson III and his previously struggling Hoya program. That win really did help turn the tides of what the team would become over the remainder of that season and into 2006-07, as well. Certainly something to be proud of.

I was just having a little fun:)

mapei
07-29-2007, 02:43 PM
No offense taken here, Cameron. It was a fair point! A Duke win over Gtown in the early 2000s meant little, but the Hoya win over Duke meant everything to that program. A Duke win now would mean a little more, of course. ;)

I have an odd history with the two programs. I grew up in NC and always knew about Duke. I was probably more of a UNC fan growing up, but I knew people who went to Duke and definitely respected the school and the basketball program. Then I ended up getting a degree from Georgetown and staying in DC, soon becoming a passionate fan.

I married a Duke grad, as it turned out, so through her I started watching Duke again and soon found all the things there are to like about K and the program. So I became a passionate Duke fan and, although I occasionally went to Georgetown games, as their fortunes declined I became more of a Duke fan first.

I think the first rekindling with Georgetown came with the building of the Verizon (then MCI) Center within walking distance of my office. I started going to more games and, eventually, along came JT3, along came Jeff Green, Roy Hibbert, and Jon Wallace, and soon there was something to get really excited about. So now I'm a strong fan of both teams and have season tix to the Hoyas. Following both makes for a busy winter with way too many nights spent in front of TV screens, but it's too late to stop now. :)

greybeard
07-29-2007, 11:56 PM
^^I definitely understand your point regarding Georgetown's victory over top ranked Duke in 2006. It was, literally, a landmark win for John Thompson III and his previously struggling Hoya program. That win really did help turn the tides of what the team would become over the remainder of that season and into 2006-07, as well. Certainly something to be proud of.

I was just having a little fun:)

I got it. Have to tell you though, JTIII is the real deal; he AND his players figure out how to tweak what they do to go after opponents. A different paradigm for coaching. One I think lends the kind of dignity to athletes that over-coaching deprives them of.

Green's loss will be significant. But, Sommer might end up being a real, real outside threat to go along with Wallace. It will be interesting to see if, with Green gone, they go straight Princeton with Hibbert the only center, or a derirvative such as Green's last two years (first year he had the pivot to himself). That would take Hibbert away from the basket more, but he'd still get there in every set, low that is. Hibbert is the best passer/thinker as a big that they have. Ideal for being the lone pivot in the Princeton were he not 7'2". I don't think that Patrick really can fit Green's spot. Doesn't seem to see-it-it-gets- done the way you'd like from a pivot player in the Princeton, and also has a certain looseness with the ball. That said, he probably gets that position. If he can keep it under control, look out. Georgetown is deep and Hibbert is the best big in the country.

JTIII might be on his way to placing him in the elite in college coaching in a way that the old man didn't. He is truly exceptional.

BTW, this fantacy camp thing; not a boad recruiting tool!

mapei
07-30-2007, 06:06 PM
One lineup a guy at the Kenner League suggested was Hibbert, Summers, Tyler Crawford, Sapp, and Wallace. Summers is 6-8 or 6-9 so he still can play "big" on defense (though he's nowhere near as good on D as Jeff was), and Crawford is an excellent defensive player with great rebounding skills. On offense, he's got a nice outside shot. He's not a true 3, but he plays a little bigger than the average 2. He would have played more last year if not for some early season injury and illness that set him back. But he's a rising senior and co-captain who knows the system.

Coming off the bench you then have Macklin (for Hibbert), PE2 (Summers), Freeman (Crawford), and Wright/Rivers (Sapp/Wallace).

That's a very good team.

greybeard
07-31-2007, 11:58 AM
One lineup a guy at the Kenner League suggested was Hibbert, Summers, Tyler Crawford, Sapp, and Wallace. Summers is 6-8 or 6-9 so he still can play "big" on defense (though he's nowhere near as good on D as Jeff was), and Crawford is an excellent defensive player with great rebounding skills. On offense, he's got a nice outside shot. He's not a true 3, but he plays a little bigger than the average 2. He would have played more last year if not for some early season injury and illness that set him back. But he's a rising senior and co-captain who knows the system.

Coming off the bench you then have Macklin (for Hibbert), PE2 (Summers), Freeman (Crawford), and Wright/Rivers (Sapp/Wallace).

That's a very good team.

Difficult to see PE2 and Summers not both starting. The interesting question is how do they run the Princeton--PE2 is the logical choice to take Green's spot, but it is hard to see him as the Hub for the passing game. Hibbert is the best decision making/passing big, and the classic Princeton had only one guy in the middle but that one guy had to always be willing to take and make 16 footers; I don't see Hibbert as that guy. Maybe Summers in that spot, but he seems to lack the vision/quick decision making of a hub player.

Be interesting to see whether your guy was on to something, Maipei; but it is hard to see Georgetown playing small at the forward spot for extended periods.

Classof06
07-31-2007, 03:37 PM
Not exactly, but your point is well taken. I'd get off the couch to see Duke (actually I did); I don't know that I do that for too many other teams. That is why I posted here repeatedly that that year's Duke team was the top team in the country, for which I got grief on this here board. Every place those guys played I'm sure it was as electric as it was that afternoon at the Verizon Center. Georgetown played the game of the decade for itself, and the Duke kids were so poised, represented so well, and almost won in a game in which they had been outplayed.

Great point. That has to be one of JTIII's biggest wins and I'd imagine it was his first huge win as the Georgetown coach. Though that game indirectly ruined a couple of my possessions (which were thrown across the room), Georgetown played a hell of a game. I still contend that, IMO, this was the only bad game Shelden Williams had the entire season. Literally.

greybeard
08-01-2007, 12:53 PM
Great point. That has to be one of JTIII's biggest wins and I'd imagine it was his first huge win as the Georgetown coach. Though that game indirectly ruined a couple of my possessions (which were thrown across the room), Georgetown played a hell of a game. I still contend that, IMO, this was the only bad game Shelden Williams had the entire season. Literally.

JTIII went with Green as the sole center in the classic Princeton. No one has ever done that position better and Green never did it better than that afternoon. He was sensational. Sometimes you just get beat. That's what happened to Shelden that game.

My theory of the great game is that it all begins with offensive concepts. If a team can get it done offensively despite the other team's best efforts, that team's performance on the other end is greatly enhanced. The (I don't know if it is the converse, obverse, or some other verse) is true with regard to the other team's offense.

On an individual level, K had made a strategic decision when JTIII took Hibbert out that Shelden would shut down Green on the high post. Green had Shelden defending in territory that not only left the basket exposed, but also allowed Green to undress Shelden who spent all his time in territory that was as unfamiliar as it was unkind. K's bad, imo, not Shelden's.

mapei
08-01-2007, 02:02 PM
The technique of pulling Shel out of position, one way or another, seemed effective. I remember other teams doing it on occasion, and I also remember Killingsworth of Indiana and the guy at NC State having near-dominating games against Shel-without-help.

A key to Georgetown's win over Duke, in addition to Green, was Bowman. That was perhaps his best game as a Hoya. His career was sort of Nelson-like, in that he was so inconsistent people on the Hoya board started to refer to him as "good Brandon" or "bad Brandon" depending on his decision-making and execution. When he was good, he could be very good indeed and, like Nelson, he was Gtown's leading scorer over a couple of seasons. But he was also capable of the complete bonehead move. In the Duke game we saw only good Brandon.

For next year, PE2's value to the team so far has been mainly in providing a very high-energy spark off the bench. Those who think he won't start next year (in deference to Macklin, Crawford or even Freeman) believe that JT3 would like to keep him in that role. The challenge is that Green was really irreplacable. It's like replacing Battier or JJ; no one, no matter how good, is going to be AS good at the things they provided. And, in Green's case, he provided a lot of versatility. So no matter who takes the slot, it will be in a different role than Jeff had. Both the offense and defense will change somewhat.

greybeard
08-01-2007, 02:40 PM
The technique of pulling Shel out of position, one way or another, seemed effective. I remember other teams doing it on occasion, and I also remember Killingsworth of Indiana and the guy at NC State having near-dominating games against Shel-without-help.

A key to Georgetown's win over Duke, in addition to Green, was Bowman. That was perhaps his best game as a Hoya. His career was sort of Nelson-like, in that he was so inconsistent people on the Hoya board started to refer to him as "good Brandon" or "bad Brandon" depending on his decision-making and execution. When he was good, he could be very good indeed and, like Nelson, he was Gtown's leading scorer over a couple of seasons. But he was also capable of the complete bonehead move. In the Duke game we saw only good Brandon.

For next year, PE2's value to the team so far has been mainly in providing a very high-energy spark off the bench. Those who think he won't start next year (in deference to Macklin, Crawford or even Freeman) believe that JT3 would like to keep him in that role. The challenge is that Green was really irreplacable. It's like replacing Battier or JJ; no one, no matter how good, is going to be AS good at the things they provided. And, in Green's case, he provided a lot of versatility. So no matter who takes the slot, it will be in a different role than Jeff had. Both the offense and defense will change somewhat.

Nothing to argue with here; you do know your Hoyas. JT3 might not be able to use PE2 the way he would like, aka off the bench, just because the kid has a shot (the other kind of shot) and few off-the-bench players get taken. That said, the way JT3 can shuffle the cards during games he might well be able to get PE2 off the court early, etc.

My guy had told me about Crawford last year, and he showed some stuff even in his limited role. I'm telling you Maipei, Sommer has some crazy range. We are talking crazy. I see him filling Green's role more than PE2, who has daring and skills but sometimes is too loose with both. You don't want misstakes from the pivot in the Princeton; it cannot work if you have them.

The guy I'm intrigued with is Macklin. He seemed terribly shy, deferential when on the court last year. He might well have the temperment to play the pivotal role in the Princeton. Whether he has the skills and poise is another matter. If he does, Georgetown is going to make a real run.

Classof06
08-01-2007, 02:40 PM
The technique of pulling Shel out of position, one way or another, seemed effective. I remember other teams doing it on occasion, and I also remember Killingsworth of Indiana and the guy at NC State having near-dominating games against Shel-without-help.


Definitely. If Killingsworth wouldn't have been absolutely gassed the last five minutes of the game, Indiana could've won that game. That game was when I realized just how much Shelden was responsible for on the defensive end. With perimeter players like Paulus and Redick, and the fact that Duke loves to pressure the passing lanes, Williams was left on an island with this man every night, while expected to be the last line of defense for dribble penetration. And he had to stay out of foul trouble.

And Simmons from NC State entered the NBA Draft based solely on the game of his life that he had in Cameron. Duke won but Simmons had 28pts and 9rebs; he averaged 12 ppg on the season.

mapei
08-01-2007, 10:48 PM
>The guy I'm intrigued with is Macklin. He seemed terribly shy, deferential when on the court last year. He might well have the temperment to play the pivotal role in the Princeton. Whether he has the skills and poise is another matter. If he does, Georgetown is going to make a real run.

Me too. At first I thought Macklin was the logical choice to take the starting spot vacated by Jeff. That way Summers could keep playing the 3, PE2 could keep coming off the bench, etc. But the conventional wisdom seems to be that Macklin's role will be to sub for Roy. Last year, sometimes Jeff would sub for Roy, and PE2 would sub for Jeff when Roy went out. At other times, Macklin would sub for Roy.

At any rate, I wouldn't get too bogged down in thinking that someone always needs to play the high post in JT3's system. True, they have done it a lot but not exclusively. With Jeff gone, he may need to adjust to the strengths and weaknesses of his personnel. And it might make sense - not saying that it necessarily will happen - to run a more guard-oriented offense next year because they are absolutely loaded with talent there: Wallace, Sapp, Crawford, Rivers, Freeman, Wright. I mean, wow. In a way, you can say that Georgetown's strengths (Hibbert and 4 guys who can play point guard well) are exactly Duke's weaknesses (no proven 5 and only one proven 1).

Not to mention Summers, who has oodles of talent but is still growing in consistency, the sometimes electrifying PE2, and the big-upside Macklin. All these guys may not fit the classic Princeton as well as last year's team did, but figuring out how to use them all successfully is a nice problem for JT3 to have.

greybeard
08-02-2007, 10:52 AM
>The guy I'm intrigued with is Macklin. He seemed terribly shy, deferential when on the court last year. He might well have the temperment to play the pivotal role in the Princeton. Whether he has the skills and poise is another matter. If he does, Georgetown is going to make a real run.

Me too. At first I thought Macklin was the logical choice to take the starting spot vacated by Jeff. That way Summers could keep playing the 3, PE2 could keep coming off the bench, etc. But the conventional wisdom seems to be that Macklin's role will be to sub for Roy. Last year, sometimes Jeff would sub for Roy, and PE2 would sub for Jeff when Roy went out. At other times, Macklin would sub for Roy.

At any rate, I wouldn't get too bogged down in thinking that someone always needs to play the high post in JT3's system. True, they have done it a lot but not exclusively. With Jeff gone, he may need to adjust to the strengths and weaknesses of his personnel. And it might make sense - not saying that it necessarily will happen - to run a more guard-oriented offense next year because they are absolutely loaded with talent there: Wallace, Sapp, Crawford, Rivers, Freeman, Wright. I mean, wow. In a way, you can say that Georgetown's strengths (Hibbert and 4 guys who can play point guard well) are exactly Duke's weaknesses (no proven 5 and only one proven 1).

Not to mention Summers, who has oodles of talent but is still growing in consistency, the sometimes electrifying PE2, and the big-upside Macklin. All these guys may not fit the classic Princeton as well as last year's team did, but figuring out how to use them all successfully is a nice problem for JT3 to have.

The fulcrum for the Princeton is the high post player. That player must understand the game, have poise, be a great receiver, be decisive in his passes, be willing and able to shoot and make it from where he catches, and then be able to put it on the floor and finish without putting undue strain on his body or himself in danger of charging. In classic Princeton fashion, that meant finishing with a classic hook shot game, usually either hand.

Without that fulcrum, there is no Princeton. One caveat, Sidney Lowe seems to have modified what he inherited into a very inventive derivative of the Princeton. From what I could tell, entry passes come primarily from the side of the court to the hub in the low post. The dives to the basket come from the off guard position on the other side of the court, or something like it.

I do not see JTIII abandoning the Princeton or going Lowe. I do think that your perspective about the efficacy of doing something different to be intriguing; if you've called this one, Maipei, you deserve a special spot on this board. Jumbo who?;)

mapei
08-02-2007, 01:29 PM
JT3 definitely doesn't use the high post on every possession. If it's essential to the classic Princeton, then it is erroneous to say that JT3 runs the classic Princeton. They sometimes run a low post, and sometimes use the guards to make the key passes to cutters. Wallace and Sapp are both great at it.

And I'm really talking out of my http://www.dukebasketballreport.comhttp://www.dukebasketballreport.comhttp://www.dukebasketballreport.com on this stuff! I'm defintely not a Jumbo-esque expert, though I love the compliment. :) I'm just another enthusiastic fan. Although I probably know the Hoyas' players better than you, I'm sure you know the Xs and Os of basketball better than I do.

Reisen
08-02-2007, 03:22 PM
I'm starting B-School at Georgetown in less than two weeks, and have already ordered my season tickets, so I'll be at most of the home games. I was really hoping they'd renew the series with Duke this year, but at least it sounds like there's talk of starting it up again next year (I'll be there through May of 2009).

Sounds like we have a couple of DBR posters who will be at the games, eh? We should meet up before a game some time!

greybeard
08-02-2007, 09:44 PM
JT3 definitely doesn't use the high post on every possession. If it's essential to the classic Princeton, then it is erroneous to say that JT3 runs the classic Princeton. They sometimes run a low post, and sometimes use the guards to make the key passes to cutters. Wallace and Sapp are both great at it.

And I'm really talking out of my http://www.dukebasketballreport.comhttp://www.dukebasketballreport.comhttp://www.dukebasketballreport.com on this stuff! I'm defintely not a Jumbo-esque expert, though I love the compliment. :) I'm just another enthusiastic fan. Although I probably know the Hoyas' players better than you, I'm sure you know the Xs and Os of basketball better than I do.

The straight Princeton has only one player in the middle, as JTIII did Hibbert and Green's first year when Green stormed onto the scene and then in the famous Duke game when Hibbert sat for most of it. So no, they do not run the straight Princeton, if indeed there really is such a thing. However, the Princeton only works if there is a center who comes high. Everytime down? Yeap. Does the center go low sometimes, yes. In the Princeton, everyone is a passer, initiator; everybody is "smart" in that way. The pivot guy rarely however is the recipient of backdoors. That changed towards the end of last season with Green.

The Princeton as the Kings employed it under Carrill's stewardship always had a high-low element, unlike his teams at, well, Princeton, which never did. There is absolutely nothing wooden about the concepts that Carrill embraced; it is a dynamic system that he and others evolve with. JTIII was so refreshing last year during his team's run. Would say, we, he and his players, would figure out how to use what they knew to attack the next team up. HE AND HIS TEAM WOULD FIGURE IT OUT!! I do not think that that was puffing. Terribly refreshing. Sports actually end up involving the players themselves in the figuring out process. Wow!!!

greybeard
08-02-2007, 10:18 PM
JT3 definitely doesn't use the high post on every possession. If it's essential to the classic Princeton, then it is erroneous to say that JT3 runs the classic Princeton. They sometimes run a low post, and sometimes use the guards to make the key passes to cutters. Wallace and Sapp are both great at it.

And I'm really talking out of my http://www.dukebasketballreport.comhttp://www.dukebasketballreport.comhttp://www.dukebasketballreport.com on this stuff! I'm defintely not a Jumbo-esque expert, though I love the compliment. :) I'm just another enthusiastic fan. Although I probably know the Hoyas' players better than you, I'm sure you know the Xs and Os of basketball better than I do.

I am not an X's and O's guy. I am a flow guy; if anything, I have an ability to see flow that might be more acute than the average bear.

The classic princeton was/is played with a single man in the middle, aka as Green and Hibbert's freshman year when Green made his mark and Hibbert sat, and as JT3 employed it to defeat Duke in what shall now be called The Game.

The Princeton is a dynamic concept that evolves and changes, but works around certain principles, the most important of which is player empowerment. When JT3 used to say at press conferences during their run that he and "his players" would figure out how to attack their next opponent I think he really, really meant it.

The classic Princeton certainly includes low post play and utilizes everyone's passing and receiving skills. Guards, forwards, everyone is the potential passer in backdoor plays. A principle difference between the princeton and other systems is that the pivot player is required to be at the hub of a very fluid passing game and to be creative and a decision maker. If there is a point player in that system it is the pivot player, not a guard. That is not to say that guards in the princeton are not every bit as creative and skilled as in other systems. Just that they occupy the ball less and do not have a monopoly on "running" a team. I think that that is a good thing.

In the modern game, bigs are instructed on what to do, and too often are relegated to being unidimensional. I can't blame bigs for recoiling from such a roll. Too few coaches utilize systems that permit bigs the freedom to fully participate. So, we see as an alternative bigs moving away from the middle, which, imo, is the most exciting place to be.

In the pros, Carrill has never employed the classic princeton which always had just one center, the pivot to the offense. In the pros, Carrill always had a true center playing low and the pivot to the offense high. That is what JTIII has used the past two years at Georgetown. Only, he has done it his way, having Hibbert moving to the pivot role as part of the normal flow. Only Hibbert when the "pivot" player, that is coming high to catch, never even considered shooting it. A tweak to the system that I do not believe Carrill ever used in the pros.

The offense will not work if Hibbert is the lone pivot. The guy who catches high and is the pivot point for most of what happens with the ball must be a threat to score the ball as the clock winds down unless he is guarded tightly. If he is guarded tightly, all things are possible in the final seconds.

BTW, from my observation, the Triangle makes a similar use of a high post pivot, usually off to the side of the free throw line or slightly down the side of the lane. The person who usually ends up occupying that position does not start there and can change during a single possession. Mostly, in Chicago, it was MJ; but everybody got a spin, especially Scottie and Horace. MJ killed people there.

In LA, when Kobe lets them run it, it is mostly Kobe. When others get there, and he gets the ball on the exterior, the offense often stops. Apparently, Phil made that concession to allow Kobe to do that upon coming back. I think that he thought that Kobe's desire to win, and the efficacy of the offense, would win out over Kobe's narcisism. Just goes to show you that meditating has its limits; hey, a Zen Koen for the Zen Master (see, meditating as the Zen folks would say is that which occurs when the limits of the mind no longer restrict; I thought it was clever anyway).

BTW, Carrill did not invent anything. He utilized the pivot in the way it always had been in the past. Actually, the extent of back door play, and the keys that trigger it (I have not a clue what they are, btw) are pretty close to an invention. Old time pivot players often came high, and pivot players were always the point of changing the point of attack, whether they did or not. Clyde Lavellet (spelling here), Dolph Shayes come to mind as pivot players who came high in the manner of the Princeton, although I only caught glimpses of them. The most modern example before Carrill made his mark was Jerry Lucas when he was with the Knicks, the year they won their second. This type of play is what I understood the game was always about during my high school years.

mapei
08-03-2007, 11:38 AM
Much to chew on there, very informative summary. You're right, it's very hard to see PE2 in that distributive role - he's a finisher. If not Roy, that leaves Summers and/or Macklin, with pluses and minuses to each.

I actually think Roy himself might well be the guy. His basketball skills have improved so dramatically that he's become a very good passer. Main downside would be diminishing his putback and offensive rebounding value. If Roy plays high post, either Macklin could play low, or they could go without a low. Just sent in my seat reservation deposit today - I want the season to start already!

Reisen, I hope your experience on the Hilltop is a great one. I for one am glad they aren't playing Duke this year - my nerves can't take it!