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Jim3k
03-07-2012, 05:37 PM
Former Duke forward Olek Czyz finished his regular season career on a high note. His Nevada team won the WAC (http://www.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2012120304001) championship and he was named to the All-WAC first team (http://www.wacsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=45988&SPID=4126&DB_LANG=C&ATCLID=205391662&DB_OEM_ID=10100). His season stats (http://www.wacsports.com/fls/10100/stats/basketballm/2011/nev.htm?DB_OEM_ID=10100#team.ind) are pretty good (scroll down).

Glad he was able to put it together. I suspect, however, his transfer was a good thing for him as he would not have earned as many minutes at Duke to put up the offensive and rebound numbers he achieved at UNR. Still, nice to see him succeed.

Sgt. Dingleberry
03-07-2012, 05:44 PM
Former Duke forward Olek Czyz finished his regular season career on a high note. His Nevada team won the WAC (http://www.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2012120304001) championship and he was named to the All-WAC first team (http://www.wacsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=45988&SPID=4126&DB_LANG=C&ATCLID=205391662&DB_OEM_ID=10100). His season stats (http://www.wacsports.com/fls/10100/stats/basketballm/2011/nev.htm?DB_OEM_ID=10100#team.ind) are pretty good (scroll down).

Glad he was able to put it together. I suspect, however, his transfer was a good thing for him as he would not have earned as many minutes at Duke to put up the offensive and rebound numbers he achieved at UNR. Still, nice to see him succeed.

Yeah, I have been checking out his box scores throughout the year, it has been nice to see him take off. I'll still never forget getting to see the guys practice in 2009 in Greensboro before the tourney. I had no idea he could jump out of the gym!

Congrats to Olek, maybe we'll see you in the tourney.

Verga3
03-07-2012, 07:30 PM
Former Duke forward Olek Czyz finished his regular season career on a high note. His Nevada team won the WAC (http://www.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2012120304001) championship and he was named to the All-WAC first team (http://www.wacsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=45988&SPID=4126&DB_LANG=C&ATCLID=205391662&DB_OEM_ID=10100). His season stats (http://www.wacsports.com/fls/10100/stats/basketballm/2011/nev.htm?DB_OEM_ID=10100#team.ind) are pretty good (scroll down).

Glad he was able to put it together. I suspect, however, his transfer was a good thing for him as he would not have earned as many minutes at Duke to put up the offensive and rebound numbers he achieved at UNR. Still, nice to see him succeed.

Thanks for the Olek update, Jim3k! What hops and energy he brings...and more, given the stats. Glad to see him doing so well.

Steven43
03-07-2012, 08:31 PM
It still puzzles me that Olek never got a decent shot to show what he could do while at Duke. I had high hopes for him.

chaosmage
03-07-2012, 09:36 PM
I taught the point guard for his team (who actually played small forward for us). Trust me, I'd hate to see Nevada in the tourney.

CDu
03-07-2012, 10:53 PM
It still puzzles me that Olek never got a decent shot to show what he could do while at Duke. I had high hopes for him.

Its because we had a pretty decent set of forwards in front of him:

2009: Henderson, Singler, Thomas
2010: Singler, Mason, Kelly

That doesn't even include the centers Zoubek and Miles. The kid is a very good player for the WAC. In the ACC he was a backup.

Cameron
03-07-2012, 11:08 PM
Yeah, I have been checking out his box scores throughout the year, it has been nice to see him take off. I'll still never forget getting to see the guys practice in 2009 in Greensboro before the tourney. I had no idea he could jump out of the gym!

Congrats to Olek, maybe we'll see you in the tourney.

Before Christmas in '08, against Presbyterian I believe it was, Olek and Elliot got some court time in the second half and turned the game into their own personal dunk contest. It was only a couple of dunks, but they were so good they probably could won one of the those Foot Locker Slam competitions from the early '90s. Olek had a ferocious up-and-under reverse jam on the baseline (IIRC) and then Elliot sent Cameron Indoor into delirium on a breakaway with a Ricky Price signature twirly world.

Two cool cats. No doubt.

Wildcat
03-07-2012, 11:18 PM
Olek brought to that team, what he would've brought to this team: toughness, strength, ability to play inside and offensive swag!
I'm glad to hear him doing well. I too hope we don't see him during the tourney. I wonder why players like him have difficulty at Duke. He seems to have fit in the Marty category; jumping ability, ability to score at the rim, BAD DEFENSE, toughness and athleticism. It's kind of ironic that, the same skills Olek possesses, are the same skills we need. Oh well, let the defensive apologetics begin. BTW, Thomas, Singler and Henderson struggled that year.

Greg_Newton
03-07-2012, 11:32 PM
On a related note, Carrick Felix scored 23 to lead ASU over bubble-team Arizona the other night. ASU is awful this year, but he's having a pretty solid year for them in his first year of eligibility.

juise
03-08-2012, 12:58 AM
On a related note, Carrick Felix scored 23 to lead ASU over bubble-team Arizona the other night. ASU is awful this year, but he's having a pretty solid year for them in his first year of eligibility.

Carrick played last year (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/51084/year/2011/carrick-felix), too.

davekay1971
03-08-2012, 08:55 AM
Olek brought to that team, what he would've brought to this team: toughness, strength, ability to play inside and offensive swag!
BTW, Thomas, Singler and Henderson struggled that year.


To which of Kyle's seasons are you referring? Kyle had some shooting slumps in his career, but, year by year, it's hard to think of a more consistent performer.

Kyle Singler Stat Summary:

Season GP MPG PPG FG% 3FG% FT% APG RPG BPG SPG
2010-11 37 34.757 16.892 43.0 32.1 80.6 1.622 6.838 0.324 0.919
2009-10 40 35.95 17.675 41.5 39.9 79.8 2.4 6.975 0.8 1.025
2008-09 37 32.243 16.459 44.1 38.3 71.3 2.405 7.676 1.027 1.541
2007-08 34 28.6 13.3 45.7 34.0 77.4 1.4 5.8 0.7 1.1

As for what Olek would have brought to this year's team, I agree it's unbelievable that Coach K wasn't able to see the future and tell Olek, "Just hang in there playing behind a guy who's an all-game/every-game performer destined to have his jersey in the rafters, kid, because in the 2011-2012 season, we'll be thin at the 3 and you'll get your shot."

addendum: tried to get the table better formatted to make it easier to read, sorry I failed. But I think it's readable enough to get the point. Here's the link for a better looking table: http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/duke/kyle-singler

To Olek: congratulations on a stellar season! I'm thrilled to see him doing so well, and hope he has a fantastic NCAA tourney. Would love to see some SC highlights of someone (as long as it ain't Duke) getting Czyzed.

CDu
03-08-2012, 09:20 AM
Olek brought to that team, what he would've brought to this team: toughness, strength, ability to play inside and offensive swag!
I'm glad to hear him doing well. I too hope we don't see him during the tourney. I wonder why players like him have difficulty at Duke. He seems to have fit in the Marty category; jumping ability, ability to score at the rim, BAD DEFENSE, toughness and athleticism. It's kind of ironic that, the same skills Olek possesses, are the same skills we need. Oh well, let the defensive apologetics begin. BTW, Thomas, Singler and Henderson struggled that year.

Corrected for factual errors.

2009:
Henderson was 1st Team All-ACC and Singler was 2nd Team All-ACC. Henderson averaged 16.5 points (on 45% shooting) and Singler averaged 16.5 points (on 44% shooting) and 7.7 rebounds. The team won the ACC Tournament, won 30 games overall, and was a #2 seed in the NCAA Tournament. They happened to face a very good Villanova team in the Sweet-16 and shot atrociously (19% on 3s, 27% overall) and got rocked. I don't see any reasonable argument to suggest that individuals or the team struggled in 2009. It was a really good season that included a couple of really bad losses (@Clemson, UNC, Villanova).

Czyz as a freshman and sophomore simply wasn't going to top those All-ACC players offensively as a freshman. And he wasn't going to provide the defense that Thomas provided. And when we added Kelly and Mason in front of him in the post in 2009-2010, the writing was on the wall that he wasn't going to play PF at Duke. We gave him a chance to play on the wing, but he just didn't have that game. Now, with Nevada, he's getting the chance to play his position in a lower-tier conference and he's making the most of it.

MulletMan
03-08-2012, 09:29 AM
Has anyone who is lauding Olek's season actually watched Nevada play this year? Like actually watched a full game? I have, and while the stats are great and Olek can still dunk in the open court, anyone who thinks that he would have gotten off the bench for Duke this season is on drugs. He is still completely lost on D and only garners a significant amount of rebounds because of the competition that he plays against in the WAC.

In the few games that Nevada played against even remotely big time competition he put up pathetic numbers (UNLV - 3 pts, 5rbs, L, Washington - 10pts, 3rbs, OT W, Arizona State - 6pts, 4rbs, W).

Big. Darn. Deal.

Dev11
03-08-2012, 09:30 AM
As for what Olek would have brought to this year's team, I agree it's unbelievable that Coach K wasn't able to see the future and tell Olek, "Just hang in there playing behind a guy who's an all-game/every-game performer destined to have his jersey in the rafters, kid, because in the 2011-2012 season, we'll be thin at the 3 and you'll get your shot."

I don't know, that's telling a kid who was a mid-to-high major recruit that he has to wait until he's a senior to get PT, and at the time he transferred, there was no guarantee that we would be "thin at the 3" this year (point of reference: Olek transferred soon after we missed on Harrison Barnes, and we pursued other SFs after that like Roscoe Smith). I think it's unreasonable to put that blame on the coach. At the time, Olek transferring made a lot of sense, since he was nowhere near ready to play at either end of the floor his freshman year, and we got two highly rated (and much taller) forwards in the next class.

If I was Olek, I would have done the same thing. Teams like Duke can't generally carry 12 players and have them all be happy. Now that K is so amenable to the redshirt freshman idea, hindsight really says that it would have made sense for Olek to do so and get 2 guaranteed non-Singler years instead of just 1.

Oh well, good luck to him. It didn't seem like he left on bad terms, so I think its ok for Duke fans to be rooting for him.

CDu
03-08-2012, 09:49 AM
Has anyone who is lauding Olek's season actually watched Nevada play this year? Like actually watched a full game? I have, and while the stats are great and Olek can still dunk in the open court, anyone who thinks that he would have gotten off the bench for Duke this season is on drugs. He is still completely lost on D and only garners a significant amount of rebounds because of the competition that he plays against in the WAC.

In the few games that Nevada played against even remotely big time competition he put up pathetic numbers (UNLV - 3 pts, 5rbs, L, Washington - 10pts, 3rbs, OT W, Arizona State - 6pts, 4rbs, W).

Big. Darn. Deal.

In fairness, he did put up 28 and 7 against an Iona team that was pretty decent and 17 and 9 against a Montana team that is actually pretty good. But otherwise, I agree. Nice energy guy and highlight guy, but he wouldn't crack the main rotation for Duke this year. He might play as much as Hairston, but that'd only be if his defense has gotten a lot better.

MulletMan
03-08-2012, 10:06 AM
As for what Olek would have brought to this year's team, I agree it's unbelievable that Coach K wasn't able to see the future and tell Olek, "Just hang in there playing behind a guy who's an all-game/every-game performer destined to have his jersey in the rafters, kid, because in the 2011-2012 season, we'll be thin at the 3 and you'll get your shot."



I don't know, that's telling a kid who was a mid-to-high major recruit that he has to wait until he's a senior to get PT, and at the time he transferred, there was no guarantee that we would be "thin at the 3" this year (point of reference: Olek transferred soon after we missed on Harrison Barnes, and we pursued other SFs after that like Roscoe Smith). I think it's unreasonable to put that blame on the coach. At the time, Olek transferring made a lot of sense, since he was nowhere near ready to play at either end of the floor his freshman year, and we got two highly rated (and much taller) forwards in the next class.

If I was Olek, I would have done the same thing. Teams like Duke can't generally carry 12 players and have them all be happy. Now that K is so amenable to the redshirt freshman idea, hindsight really says that it would have made sense for Olek to do so and get 2 guaranteed non-Singler years instead of just 1.

Oh well, good luck to him. It didn't seem like he left on bad terms, so I think its ok for Duke fans to be rooting for him.

I'm going to go out on this really thick limb here and suggest that davekay was being ever so slightly sarcastic.

Matches
03-08-2012, 10:12 AM
If I was Olek, I would have done the same thing. Teams like Duke can't generally carry 12 players and have them all be happy. Now that K is so amenable to the redshirt freshman idea, hindsight really says that it would have made sense for Olek to do so and get 2 guaranteed non-Singler years instead of just 1.



As I recall, K recommended to Olek that he redshirt, and Olek declined.

davekay1971
03-08-2012, 10:33 AM
I'm going to go out on this really thick limb here and suggest that davekay was being ever so slightly sarcastic.

That's a very, very safe limb. But Dev's reply was dead on accurate and I agree completely with what he said.

A-Tex Devil
03-08-2012, 10:48 AM
Duke was really, really, really missing someone at the 3 spot this year that would not take something off the table at either end of the court. The fact that we had to guard Harrison Barnes with Ty Thornton most of the time against UNC this year speaks volumes to that.

That said, I agree that Olek wouldn't have been the answer here, although he would have been given a shot had he redshirted as was asked of him. Carrick Felix, on the other hand, might have been helpful in this role. I don't know though.

I do know that we really need Gbinje, Murphy and/or Hairston to step up next year and give us that person that can guard a small forward when a team is playing 3 forwards without giving up 6 inches, and without being a negative on the offensive end.

jv001
03-08-2012, 10:54 AM
Duke was really, really, really missing someone at the 3 spot this year that would not take something off the table at either end of the court. The fact that we had to guard Harrison Barnes with Ty Thornton most of the time against UNC this year speaks volumes to that.

That said, I agree that Olek wouldn't have been the answer here, although he would have been given a shot had he redshirted as was asked of him. Carrick Felix, on the other hand, might have been helpful in this role. I don't know though.

I do know that we really need Gbinje, Murphy and/or Hairston to step up next year and give us that person that can guard a small forward when a team is playing 3 forwards without giving up 6 inches, and without being a negative on the offensive end.

I was going to wait until this year is over, but now is a good place as any to say this. The most improvement needed over the off season is our returning perimenter guys to get better at guarding the ball. That has been the glaring weakness of this team. I hope that Sheed is a good on the ball defender and like you say, Gbinijie, Murphy and Hairston step up next year. Beginning with defense. GoDuke!

Wildcat
03-08-2012, 12:10 PM
Cmon people; i don't even know where to start. My point was: Olek can do things even Singler had difficulty doing. Finishing strong at the rim. Olek could do things our current team/players have trouble doing: finishing strong at the rim. Olek was not a "three-point powerhouse," like basically our whole team is. Olek was an aggressive player, (he had heart) something we have been clamoring for much this year. Many on this board are too analytical; with all respect. There is so much more to the game than stats. There is a vernacular of speech used in some circles that says: game recognize game. Olek had game; trust me.

David
03-08-2012, 12:11 PM
First, congrats to Olek on his success this year and good luck to him in the NCAA tournament.

Second, learning about Olek's success at Nevada makes me appreciate the non-superstar players who remain at Duke for four years such as Zoubs, Lance Thomas, or Miles (as 3 recent examples). How good would Miles be in the WAC this year? It takes a different type of player to trade-off playing time and personal stats elsewhere for more team-oriented goals at Duke.

A-Tex Devil
03-08-2012, 12:19 PM
Cmon people; i don't even know where to start. My point was: Olek can do things even Singler had difficulty doing. Finishing strong at the rim. Olek could do things our current team/players have trouble doing: finishing strong at the rim. Olek was not a "three-point powerhouse," like basically our whole team is. Olek was an aggressive player, (he had heart) something we have been clamoring for much this year. Many on this board are too analytical; with all respect. There is so much more to the game than stats. There is a vernacular of speech used in some circles that says: game recognize game. Olek had game; trust me.

The thing is, the problem with this year's team hasn't *really* been getting to the rim. Are they great at it? Other than Austin, no. But we didn't lose any of our 4 games because of a failure to get to the rim. We lost 3 of them due to poor defense allowing us to get way behind followed by our threes not falling at our average clip as we tried to catch up. The only game that didn't follow that pattern was FSU, but check the second half line -- we allowed 50 points. Getting to the rim has nothing to do with that.

This is one of the most gifted shooting teams that Duke has ever had, and perhaps, offensively, it would have been a juggernaut with Olek. But I doubt it, and I still think we lose 4 games. Convince me that Olek could have guarded Harrison Barnes better than Ty Thornton and also play good team defense, and maybe I'd come around. But imho, his transfer was the best for him and Duke.

Wildcat
03-08-2012, 12:19 PM
If Olek was good enough to be recruited by Duke; i'm almost positive he would've gotten burn at other schools such as: NCSU, UVA, VT, FSU, Clemson, Maryland, based upon his basketball IQ. We don't recruit players who are not high-character and well rounded guys. I haven't researched his highschool offers; but i'm sure he was recruited by some high-major schools. I saw Cyz play at NCCU over the summer, the guy was spectacular. Many thought he was going to be a star at Duke.

cato
03-08-2012, 12:20 PM
Cmon people; i don't even know where to start.


My point was: Olek can do things even Singler had difficulty doing.


Olek . . . had heart . . . something we have been clamoring for much this year.


trust me.

Funny, I don't even know where to start either.

moonpie23
03-08-2012, 12:23 PM
Olek had game; trust me.

with all respect.....i'll trust K

Wildcat
03-08-2012, 12:25 PM
No, its not getting to the rim that's the issue. Getting to the rim is the offensive diversity, when our threes are not falling. K said himself: our defense seems to thrive on our offense. UNC scored at a higher percentage, quicker and easier than we do. Teams that beat us often score more in the paint, in transition, dunks and put-backs. If our three's are not hitting; we are in trouble. Getting to the rim balances our offensive weaponry. That's all im saying.

Wildcat
03-08-2012, 12:26 PM
Im resting my case. No more posts from me. God Bless you all

Mike Corey
03-08-2012, 01:35 PM
Are you not entertained?

CDu
03-08-2012, 01:50 PM
I was going to wait until this year is over, but now is a good place as any to say this. The most improvement needed over the off season is our returning perimenter guys to get better at guarding the ball. That has been the glaring weakness of this team. I hope that Sheed is a good on the ball defender and like you say, Gbinijie, Murphy and Hairston step up next year. Beginning with defense. GoDuke!

Agreed. And it's not just guarding the SF position (though I don't think we'll see Hairston doing much of that next year as he's a PF). We need to defend every position on the floor better: PG through C. The fact that we will lose probably our best interior defender (Miles) and possibly our best on-ball perimeter defender (Rivers) makes that in even more glaring need for improvement from the rest of the team and incoming freshman/men.

CDu
03-08-2012, 01:52 PM
Cmon people; i don't even know where to start. My point was: Olek can do things even Singler had difficulty doing. Finishing strong at the rim. Olek could do things our current team/players have trouble doing: finishing strong at the rim. Olek was not a "three-point powerhouse," like basically our whole team is. Olek was an aggressive player, (he had heart) something we have been clamoring for much this year. Many on this board are too analytical; with all respect. There is so much more to the game than stats. There is a vernacular of speech used in some circles that says: game recognize game. Olek had game; trust me.

Trust me: if Coach K believed Olek had the game to help the team in 2009, he'd have given Olek the chance to prove it. Olek didn't have the game to help the 2009 team (at least not in game action; I'm sure he was a useful practice player).

Greg_Newton
03-08-2012, 02:15 PM
Carrick played last year (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/51084/year/2011/carrick-felix), too.

Oh, whoops. Thought I remembered he only had two years of eligibility left, guess not.

NM Duke Fan
03-08-2012, 05:04 PM
Glad to see Czyz has been able to develop as a player, and I do enjoy hearing of his successes. Olek certainly has excellent vertical jumping capacities, which is often what people think of with respect to basketball and athleticism. But what is often underestimated is the importance of lateral quickness, especially on defense. In that department, he didn't stand out like I hoped he would when he arrived (Some of the current Duke guards are also not as laterally gifted as I had hoped). IF Olek had had exceptional lateral quickness combined with a defensive dog mentality, he could have made a serious contribution at Duke. Hopefully he will make the very best of his talents and get to the highest level of competition possible after his college career is over.

Edouble
03-09-2012, 02:33 PM
Cmon people; i don't even know where to start. My point was: Olek can do things even Singler had difficulty doing. Finishing strong at the rim. Olek could do things our current team/players have trouble doing: finishing strong at the rim. Olek was not a "three-point powerhouse," like basically our whole team is. Olek was an aggressive player, (he had heart) something we have been clamoring for much this year. Many on this board are too analytical; with all respect. There is so much more to the game than stats. There is a vernacular of speech used in some circles that says: game recognize game. Olek had game; trust me.

Olek could do things that Singler couldn't? This is a joke right? Singler could hang with the Top 10 Blue Devils of all time. Olek couldn't get into a game.

I agree that the boards can be too analytical, but to say "Olek can do things even Singler had difficulty doing," just kinda makes me doubt your credibility. Singler would put his life on the line to finish strong at the rim.

If you're gonna say "_______ can do things even Singler had difficulty doing," please use a player that actually got some PT and did something in a game.

In the movie Enter The Dragon, one of Bruce Lee's antagonists holds up a piece of wood, and hits it, smashing it into splinters. Lee says "Board not strike back," or something to that effect. My analogy is maybe Olek could have a monster dunk in a dunk contest (unguarded basket), but what would he have done if the basket was being guarded by, say, Zeller and Henson?

Wildcat
03-09-2012, 05:55 PM
You wouldn't know or see my point; Olek was on such a short leash. A player has to be given the time to play on the court to truly develop.

Kedsy
03-09-2012, 06:51 PM
You wouldn't know or see my point; Olek was on such a short leash. A player has to be given the time to play on the court to truly develop.

I agree that a short leash sometimes hurts a player's confidence and makes him tentative, but that didn't seem to be Olek's problem.

I disagree with your idea that a player "has to be given time to play on the court to truly develop," where I'm assuming you mean play in games. We hear this all the time when people want the guys at the end of the bench to play more (this year it's been a common refrain with Michael). Except Division I college basketball players "play on the court" pretty much every single day. I have never attended a Duke practice, but my guess is most of them include a scrimmage of some sort. And at a school like Duke, where players 1 through 10 (or 11 or 12, etc.) were all high school stars, there's plenty of opportunity for development in the unofficial games that take place during the daily practice. Yes, there are some things that can only be learned in real game situations, mainly involving pressure and clock management and end-game play, but Olek never got to the point where he needed to learn that stuff, he was so far behind elsewhere. And since playing time in games is supposedly allotted based on performance in practice, there was still a reasonable level of pressure in practice anyway.

Wildcat
03-09-2012, 08:03 PM
to say this; but those type of responses are increasingly turning me against Duke basketball. Excuses, excuses and more excuses. If 9 out of 10 people say similar things; wow, there has to be a measure of truth in this argument. That's what frustrates me about us. It's almost like we are obstinate denial. I've been a Duke fan all of my life. I'm a native North Carolinain, maybe, just maybe i can start to cheer for something that closer resembles my ideals and perspectives on life and all things basketball.

CDu
03-09-2012, 11:27 PM
to say this; but those type of responses are increasingly turning me against Duke basketball. Excuses, excuses and more excuses. If 9 out of 10 people say similar things; wow, there has to be a measure of truth in this argument. That's what frustrates me about us. It's almost like we are obstinate denial. I've been a Duke fan all of my life. I'm a native North Carolinain, maybe, just maybe i can start to cheer for something that closer resembles my ideals and perspectives on life and all things basketball.

Feel free to cheer for whomever you like. Clearly you're unhappy with being a Duke fan (if you even really are one). If our opinion that Czyz wasn't wronged makes you tired of being a Duke fan, then I question your loyalty to begin with. And if 9 out of 10 people say the same thing, then may that 10th person is wrong. Just because we don't agree with you doesn't make us wrong. Coach K saw a lot more of Czyz than you or I did. And he's a pretty good coach and evaluator of talent. So pardon me if I don't take your opinion on this over his - especially when your opinion on this is kind of... inconsistent with what most people think already.