Julius Randle Recruiting Thread

[dukedoc]

I'm a relative newbie here, so I'm not sure if I need to earn my stripes before starting new threads, but I thought Mr. Julius deserves his own thread, similar to one on Jabari. He shows strong interest in us and as a well respected big man he could truly be pivotal for us in many ways. ESPN's latest diary is a good one (http://espn.go.com/blog/high-school/boys-basketball/post/_/id/2195/rappin-with-randle-north-carolina-college-visit-tour). Some definite positive vibes.

[roywhite]

How does he compare to Jabari Parker?

A little bigger and more of an inside player I'm guessing, but interested in comments from those that follow or have seen both.

[Faison1]

Interesting perspective on his blog about "Recruit X". I've watched "He Got Game" many times, and always wondered where/if those types of recruiting trips take place.

And even closer to home, I wonder if that sort of thing happens in our neighborhood.

[dukedoc]

I'm hesitant to post this because it is so dated, but a little something on Randle from nbadraft.net (from summer 2010 though)

NBA Comparison: Chris Webber

Strengths: Strong body ... Has a high skill level for a high school sophomore ... Excels at facing up and putting the ball on the floor ... Very good finisher around the basket ... Can step out and hit shots all the way to college 3pt. range ... Can play with his back to the basket but prefers face up game ... A good kid with a great work ethic ...

Weaknesses: While very solid, especially considering his age, not a jaw dropping physical specimen type of athlete ... Doesn't play on the box as much as he should, too perimeter oriented. Should focus a little more on refining his post game which will really be his bread and butter as he gets older ... Settles for too many jumpers at times instead of imposing his will inside ... Too left hand dominant. Needs to work at using his right hand better ...

Notes: Considered by many to be the top player in the 2013 class ...Measured 6'9 (in shoes) 243 lbs, with a 6'10 wingspan at the 2011 LeBron James Skills Academy.

[Ichabod Drain]

From what i've read i think he is leaning heavily toward Duke. I know him and Matt Jones are very close friends and I believe they play on the same AAU team. Randle said Duke was high on the list before Jones commited.

[dukedoc]

Jason Jordan compares Julius to Garnett in the video released for the common masses by Watzone (http://bluedevilnation.net/2012/01/espns-jason-jordan-talks-duke-basketball-recruiting-with-bdn/). A nice interview with some stuff on Pinson, Richmond, Tony Parker, and Julius.

[TexHawk]

From what i've read i think he is leaning heavily toward Duke. I know him and Matt Jones are very close friends and I believe they play on the same AAU team. Randle said Duke was high on the list before Jones commited.
Everything I hear says he's leaning heavily towards UNC, but I don't think anybody knows anything. KU also took a commitment from Zach Peters, another close friend and high school teammate of Randle.

[Ichabod Drain]

Everything I hear says he's leaning heavily towards UNC, but I don't think anybody knows anything. KU also took a commitment from Zach Peters, another close friend and high school teammate of Randle.

I guess it's tough to tell. Here's a link to a phone interview with Randle on the subject. It's followed by an interview with Matt Jones after he decided to commit to Duke.



http://coast2coastrecruiting.net/2011/12/julius-randle-there-is-a-high-chance-i-might-go-to-duke/

[Jim3k]

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/high-school/post/_/id/10393/prestonwoods-randle-visits-duke-unc-nc-st

Randle says some nice things about Coach K and CIS. But he's keeping his options open.

[jimsumner]

Everything I hear says he's leaning heavily towards UNC, but I don't think anybody knows anything. KU also took a commitment from Zach Peters, another close friend and high school teammate of Randle.

Randle has given Duke positive feedback. Capel helps here. Capel had started to recruit Randle when Capel was at OU, so they go back aways.

[-bdbd]

THis ESPN Blog picks Randle to Duke...
http://espn.go.com/blog/high-school/boys-basketball/post/_/id/1995/12-bold-hs-hoops-predictions-for-2012

However... they also predict Tony Parker to OSU and 'bazz to UNLV. I would have my doubts about that last one. Hope the first one (Randle to Duke) pans out though.

:rolleyes:

[gam7]

THis ESPN Blog picks Randle to Duke...
http://espn.go.com/blog/high-school/boys-basketball/post/_/id/1995/12-bold-hs-hoops-predictions-for-2012

However... they also predict Tony Parker to OSU and 'bazz to UNLV. I would have my doubts about that last one. Hope the first one (Randle to Duke) pans out though.

:rolleyes:

Yes, and in the diary entry linked in the first post in this thread (buried near the bottom), Randle himself says "I got a chance to read ESPNHS' story on predictions for 2012 and that was interesting what they predicted about me ending up at Duke. I’m not saying that it will or won’t happen, but there’s a good chance they could be right. Who knows, we’ll have to see."

I'll take "good chance" at this point in the process.

[-bdbd]

Yes, and in the diary entry linked in the first post in this thread (buried near the bottom), Randle himself says "I got a chance to read ESPNHS' story on predictions for 2012 and that was interesting what they predicted about me ending up at Duke. I’m not saying that it will or won’t happen, but there’s a good chance they could be right. Who knows, we’ll have to see."

I'll take "good chance" at this point in the process.

Thanks gam7. I had just caught that too. Certainly sounded positive, as did his comparison comment about Cameron being the "most Live" of the three he visited - also NCSU and Dean Dome.

Actually, my first thought was that it is a good cautionary tale to fans, that these kids actually do read these sites - so be careful what you say!
(BTW, if I were a kid reading the ESPN 'Predictions' blog/post, and read all of the catty, name-calling fan posts at the bottom of the story, I think I'd just get really turned off of their schools really fast. Fortunately it was largely UK, NC@CH and UNLV fans all trying to one-up their insults of one another's schools... Ugh!)

[dukedoc]

It was obviously an outlier, but Julius had a huge 50 and 20 game last night. Not many people (even on a perfect night) could match that type of production. LINK (http://www.ihigh.com/vypedfwprivateschools/article_101052.html)

[PackMan97]

Randle and Prestonwood Christian take on NC State's Tyler Lewis and Oak Hill this Saturday at 6:00pm. Oak Hill is undefeated and ranked #2 by ESPN. Prestonwood is ranked #19. Should be a great game.

Hopefully he'll realize how great it would be to play with Lewis instead of against him ;) Though I view State as a long shot to land Julius.

[roywhite]

Randle and Prestonwood Christian take on NC State's Tyler Lewis and Oak Hill this Saturday at 6:00pm. Oak Hill is undefeated and ranked #2 by ESPN. Prestonwood is ranked #19. Should be a great game.

Hopefully he'll realize how great it would be to play with Lewis instead of against him ;) Though I view State as a long shot to land Julius.

Thanks for the tip, PackMan, and hope you'll stop by more.
I like what I see going on at State in terms of the current team, the coach, and recruiting.
After a long walk in the wilderness, I think you guys are on the right track.

[PackMan97]

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/high-school/post/_/id/10515/oak-hill-va-neutralizes-randle-prestonwood

Oak Hill clobbered Prestonwood 85-55.

Randle had 23pts, 9 boards and 3 blocks.
Lewis had 15pts and 9 assists.

[BlueDevil16]

Any update on his recruiting? I know hes 2013, but he's most likely to be one and done correct?

[dukedoc]

Any update on his recruiting? I know hes 2013, but he's most likely to be one and done correct?

Well, incidentally, it sounds like Julius is going to transfer to Word of God Christian Academy in Raleigh for his final year in school. I don't have a link but will try to find one. Curious how people think this will impact his recruitment (if at all)?

[dukedoc]

Well, incidentally, it sounds like Julius is going to transfer to Word of God Christian Academy in Raleigh for his final year in school. I don't have a link but will try to find one. Curious how people think this will impact his recruitment (if at all)?

Well, this was apparently a rumor which I inappropriately mongered without vetting it further. Apologies. He will stay put.

Evan Daniels ‏ @EvanDanielscout
Julius Randle on the transfer rumor: "False, I don't even know how that rumor started."

[roywhite]

Well, incidentally, it sounds like Julius is going to transfer to Word of God Christian Academy in Raleigh for his final year in school. I don't have a link but will try to find one. Curious how people think this will impact his recruitment (if at all)?

Would seem to move him into the ACC sphere of things and perhaps be favorable to our chances. But who knows?

Be nice to follow his progress and perhaps see him play.

[Class of '94]

Would seem to move him into the ACC sphere of things and perhaps be favorable to our chances. But who knows?

Be nice to follow his progress and perhaps see him play.

It also puts him more in reach of NC State and UNC. I know I'm sounding paranoid and a lot of people support the resurgence of State; but I think this move along with State's success in the tournament this year could mean that Duke could get heavy competition from both UNC and State for Randle's services.

[superdave]

Saw a couple of places tonight that Randle is not going to WOG, from Evan Daniels on twitter specifically.

[dukedoc]

A brief snippet of Mr. Randle (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IV40lnHvFok)

[dukedoc]

Some pretty nice stuff from Julius (http://www.youtube.com/watch?&gl=US&hl=en&client=mv-google&feature=m-feedu&v=xLHXfFLJCjg&nomobile=1)

[SupaDave]

Some pretty nice stuff from Julius (http://www.youtube.com/watch?&gl=US&hl=en&client=mv-google&feature=m-feedu&v=xLHXfFLJCjg&nomobile=1)

Pretty nice? Sheesh. Some of that was amazing! A 6'9 player crossing cats over at the three point line and taking it to the hole? Wow. Who else does that? I have to really think about this.

[g-money]

Pretty nice? Sheesh. Some of that was amazing! A 6'9 player crossing cats over at the three point line and taking it to the hole? Wow. Who else does that? I have to really think about this.

Lebron James :p

[SupaDave]

Lebron James :p

Basically. But honestly he struck me as a little Dwayne Wadeish with it. Can't recall a jumper to give me some Dirk perspective.

[G man]

He is a impressive player. Great body control. I also like how bullish he is going to the cup!

[dukedoc]

Seems like Julius is getting a lot of praise these days. Here's a little piece from the Sporting News about Matt Jones and Julius.

LINK (http://aol.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/story/2012-07-26/julius-randle-recruitment-no-2-player-class-of-2013-matt-jones-duke?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

[MChambers]

Seems like Julius is getting a lot of praise these days. Here's a little piece from the Sporting News about Matt Jones and Julius.

LINK (http://aol.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/story/2012-07-26/julius-randle-recruitment-no-2-player-class-of-2013-matt-jones-duke?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

Elton Brand was pretty darned athletic at Duke. Maybe he didn't jump that high, but he wasn't a bad jumper. More importantly, he was extremely quick for his size and had great hands. So if Randle is like Brand, but more athletic, I'll take that any day.

[RepoMan]

The Elton days were awesome. He was simply unstoppable. A man among boys. If Randle is comparable to Elton, then I sure hope we see him in Duke blue.

[Ichabod Drain]

Elton Brand was pretty darned athletic at Duke. Maybe he didn't jump that high, but he wasn't a bad jumper. More importantly, he was extremely quick for his size and had great hands. So if Randle is like Brand, but more athletic, I'll take that any day.

I'd take just the "like Brand" part any day.

[CDu]

I'd take just the "like Brand" part any day.

Agreed. I'd even take "not quite as good as Brand."

[duke1983]

Brand was much more of a back to the basket/banger during his Duke days while Randle seems to be more of a face up player and much quicker. Although they have somewhat similar body types, they are two different players (at this point in their development anyway). Brand was special because of his hands and his feel around the basket and Randle doesn't seem to have those skills yet. He is much more like Blake Griffin (but with a better perimeter game). Poor man's Lebron, maybe? A bulldozer, madman who dunks on everyone and can hit 15 - 20 footers.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Brand was much more of a back to the basket/banger during his Duke days while Randle seems to be more of a face up player and much quicker. Although they have somewhat similar body types, they are two different players (at this point in their development anyway). Brand was special because of his hands and his feel around the basket and Randle doesn't seem to have those skills yet. He is much more like Blake Griffin (but with a better perimeter game). Poor man's Lebron, maybe? A bulldozer, madman who dunks on everyone and can hit 15 - 20 footers.

I'd take a Brand with more athleticism, a Brand with less athleticism, a poor man's Lebron, a homeless man's Lebron, or a Julius Randle 1.0.

[OldPhiKap]

Poor man's Lebron, maybe?

I think whoever gets Julius will be a "one-percenter" no matter how you slice it.

But agreed, his game seems more like Lebron's than Elton's at this stage.

Personally, I would be happy to have him and in a few years folks can talk about "the poor man's Randle"

[UrinalCake]

This article makes him sound amazing and exactly what we'd need in 2013 with Mason and Ryan graduating. If Marshall Plumlee can develop into a threat, pairing him with Randle would make for a beastly front court to go along with our very athletic perimeter/wings. I think I agree with the poster in another thread who suggested that Randle might be a better get for us than the higher-rated Parker, as he would fill more of a positional need. Obviously we would take them both if we could ;)

[flyingdutchdevil]

This article makes him sound amazing and exactly what we'd need in 2013 with Mason and Ryan graduating. If Marshall Plumlee can develop into a threat, pairing him with Randle would make for a beastly front court to go along with our very athletic perimeter/wings. I think I agree with the poster in another thread who suggested that Randle might be a better get for us than the higher-rated Parker, as he would fill more of a positional need. Obviously we would take them both if we could ;)

Even if Marshall doesn't become an offensive threat but a defense threat (think poor man's Tyson Chandler), then Randle would have even more incentive to come over. That would be nasty frontcourt combo mixed with (alarmingly) athletic wing players. However, I don't want to think about Randle coming to Duke - I've gotten my heart broken before (although the last time that happened, we ended up winning the tourney and that player turned out to be the most overrated recruit in the last 10 years).

[CDu]

This article makes him sound amazing and exactly what we'd need in 2013 with Mason and Ryan graduating. If Marshall Plumlee can develop into a threat, pairing him with Randle would make for a beastly front court to go along with our very athletic perimeter/wings. I think I agree with the poster in another thread who suggested that Randle might be a better get for us than the higher-rated Parker, as he would fill more of a positional need. Obviously we would take them both if we could ;)

Randle absolutely fills more of a need than Parker, as we have two 6'8" SF options already. That said, I would certainly be okay with adding Parker as well.

But if we could only get one, Randle would seem the more important get.

[jimsumner]

I tend to be a bit wary of comparisons. But the one I've heard from people I respect is Chris Webber.

[OldPhiKap]

I tend to be a bit wary of comparisons. But the one I've heard from people I respect is Chris Webber.

Can he keep track of how many timeouts are left?

[juise]

Can he keep track of how many timeouts are left?

In my expert opinion, Shane Battier is a good comp for Randle's timeout tracking abilities. Well, either Shane or Magic. We'll have to see how Randle develops in his senior year.

[Greg_Newton]

I tend to be a bit wary of comparisons. But the one I've heard from people I respect is Chris Webber.

I hear that a lot, but the only problem is that Chris Webber had a massive, 7'3.5" wingspan, while Randle has short arms and an underwhelming 6'10" wingspan (that's the difference between Miles Plumlee and Henson/Anthony Davis). I also don't think Webber was quite the bull-in-a-china-shop Randle is, especially at the same stage; he's like a 6'9 fullback.

He's actually looked pretty similar to Lebron James physically, when I've seen him, maybe without a little of the high-end leaping ability. Skill and IQ-wise, he's obviously nowhere close, but I don't really think there is a great power-post comparison for Randle... which may well explain his recent attempts to develop a more Lebron-esque attacking game from the perimeter and high post. He already struggles a bit on the block against length if he can't simply bull his way to the rim.

People have always kind of thrown around the question "If Lebron didn't have such an incredible skill set for his size, could he have still made it as a very good PF if he embraced contact and focused his bruising physical gifts around the rim?" And IMO, Randle is the closest thing there is to an answer...

[juise]

I know that internet comments are generally not considered worthy of discussion, but I thought that this one from an ESPN article (http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/62268/coach-ks-legacy-streaked-with-gold) on K in the Olympics was interesting, since it is signed as being from Randle's AAU coach:


What can you say, Coach K is the ultimate Coach in the basketball Coaching profession. When Matthew Jones was making his decision on where to go to college I simply said to Matthew "if the United States of America can trust Coach K, Why can't you". Thank you Coach K for bringing Basketball Gold/Honor back home where it belongs.. Scott Pospichal Texas Titans Basketball

His logic may be a bit oversimplified, but I hope that he is making similar recommendations to Julius. I'm sure that Matt Jones is. :)

[rhynelander]

Per Scout, Julius Randle has Duke in his newly minted top 10, joining our blue devils are Texas, Kansas, Baylor, UNC, Kentucky, Florida, NC State, Oklahoma & Ok State. Nothing too eye opening here, however the article also mentions that FL has already locked up an official visit the weekend of the 6th in October. Would love to see Julius and Matt suit up in the duke blue next season.

http://scouthoops.scout.com/2/1215255.html

[oldnavy]

Per Scout, Julius Randle has Duke in his newly minted top 10, joining our blue devils are Texas, Kansas, Baylor, UNC, Kentucky, Florida, NC State, Oklahoma & Ok State. Nothing too eye opening here, however the article also mentions that FL has already locked up an official visit the weekend of the 6th in October. Would love to see Julius and Matt suit up in the duke blue next season.

http://scouthoops.scout.com/2/1215255.html

I can't get to excited over a "narrowed" list that includes 10 schools. I may garner up some interest if Duke is in the mix when he gets it down to 2 or 3... Ten schools = narrowed list??? Yeesh.

[UrinalCake]

Ten schools = narrowed list??? Yeesh.

Yeah, it kind of makes you wonder how big his original "list" was...

[jimsumner]

Yeah, it kind of makes you wonder how big his original "list" was...

More than 10? :)

I wouldn't worry about Duke making the list when he makes another cut.

[dukedoc]

Per Watzone's twitterage, Duke will have an in-home with Julius on 9/11. Would love to be a fly on the wall for any of K's in-homes. Does anyone know what actually happens? Chit chat, dinner, and spiel? Powerpoint? Song and dance? Whatever it is, hope K's in the zone that night.

[subzero02]

More than 10? :)

I wouldn't worry about Duke making the list when he makes another cut.

We shouldn't worry because we are a lock to make the cut?

[JNort]

Per Watzone's twitterage, Duke will have an in-home with Julius on 9/11. Would love to be a fly on the wall for any of K's in-homes. Does anyone know what actually happens? Chit chat, dinner, and spiel? Powerpoint? Song and dance? Whatever it is, hope K's in the zone that night.

He usually has dinner with the family, talks to the parents about their expectations and what they want their kid to achieve, lets the parents ask questions about him or the university, talks to the recruit of course about how they will fit in the system and usually sets up some sort of time when he will contact them again for either a phone call, school visit, attending a game, etc...

[dukedoc]

He usually has dinner with the family, talks to the parents about their expectations and what they want their kid to achieve, lets the parents ask questions about him or the university, talks to the recruit of course about how they will fit in the system and usually sets up some sort of time when he will contact them again for either a phone call, school visit, attending a game, etc...

I guess I'm particularly curious about the style of K's approach to these visits. Undoubtedly K, Cal, Roy and others will cover the same bases, but I imagine there is a certain art form to these visits and they each have their own strategies and style. How do they set themselves apart from each other? Would be interesting to see.

[superdave]

I guess I'm particularly curious about the style of K's approach to these visits. Undoubtedly K, Cal, Roy and others will cover the same bases, but I imagine there is a certain art form to these visits and they each have their own strategies and style. How do they set themselves apart from each other? Would be interesting to see.

I would imagine it goes something like this -

No other program can match the atmosphere in Cameron, the training and video facilities. No one travels as well as we do and no one has more games on national tv than us. No one has had more consistent success on the court for as long as we have, ever. When it comes time to go pro, no one else can get you the feedback I can or set up you up with the connections I have.

Then he probably speaks directly to the parents about leadership, values and how the kid will grow up and always be a part of the Duke family.

I bet there's no ra-ra to it, just straight up "We're the best at everything we do".

[OldPhiKap]

The parents of our players often say that they trust K to take care of their children and to make them better men. The word "honest" often comes up as well.

In addition, I think I've read somewhere that K believes a good relatinship with the mom is one of the keys.

I also imagine that he talks about his principles (honesty, teamwork, "fist") and the role/player he sees the prospect filing, more than where Duke basketball is as a program. We're a pretty known commodity at this point.

It also helps that he can call up King James or Kobe, and asks if he'll fly to Paducah to meet the kid, too. ;>)

[lotusland]

Randle moves to the top spot in the latest rivals poll ahead of Parker

http://basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1401746

[oldnavy]

The parents of our players often say that they trust K to take care of their children and to make them better men. The word "honest" often comes up as well.

In addition, I think I've read somewhere that K believes a good relatinship with the mom is one of the keys.

I also imagine that he talks about his principles (honesty, teamwork, "fist") and the role/player he sees the prospect filing, more than where Duke basketball is as a program. We're a pretty known commodity at this point.

It also helps that he can call up King James or Kobe, and asks if he'll fly to Paducah to meet the kid, too. ;>)

I have a question about your last comment, would that be allowed? It almost seems that it would be illegal given the tight reins the NCAA holds on recruiting. Now I could understand that the NCAA would have no interest if Kobe or King James came to Duke to teach an independant studies program that basically consisted of a pick up game and grade...

[UrinalCake]

I guess I'm particularly curious about the style of K's approach to these visits. Undoubtedly K, Cal, Roy and others will cover the same bases, but I imagine there is a certain art form to these visits and they each have their own strategies and style. How do they set themselves apart from each other? Would be interesting to see.

Numerous recruits have mentioned Coach K being upfront and honest with them. He doesn't promise them playing time or a starting spot, they'll have to work for it, no matter how highly ranked they are. That approach works for some recruits and not for others, but that's the way it is (Patrick Patterson chose to play for Kentucky instead after Billy Gillespie promised him 30 shots a game, if I remember correctly).

I also think Coach K carries an aura that no other coach can match. Not even Doc Rivers could intimidate him. Coach K doesn't care if your father is an NBA Coach, if you're not performing you're going to get benched. Again, certain players respond well to that style while others won't.

As for the Mom angle, education is of course a huge selling point. Duke is like the straight-A student you want your daughter to date. Unfortunately, she doesn't always choose him ;)

[ThePublisher]

I would imagine it goes something like this -

No other program can match the atmosphere in Cameron, the training and video facilities. No one travels as well as we do and no one has more games on national tv than us. No one has had more consistent success on the court for as long as we have, ever. When it comes time to go pro, no one else can get you the feedback I can or set up you up with the connections I have.

Then he probably speaks directly to the parents about leadership, values and how the kid will grow up and always be a part of the Duke family.

I bet there's no ra-ra to it, just straight up "We're the best at everything we do".


Sold! Where do I sign?! I like this, especially the "We're the best" part.

[JasonEvans]

"Son, do you want to have an impact on college basketball? Do you want to be one of the players that everyone in the nation knows about and who plays for the highest honors the college game has to offer? Well, here is a list of players at Duke who played in a Final Four, a list of guys who were All-ACC, a list of those who were All-American, a list of players who were first round draft picks, a list of players who won some kind of national award, a list of guys who played more than 20 games on national TV."

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Stack-of-paper.jpg

-Jason "oh, and by the way, each of these lists are longer than any other coach out there can show you" Evans

[-bdbd]

I have a question about your last comment, would that be allowed? It almost seems that it would be illegal given the tight reins the NCAA holds on recruiting. Now I could understand that the NCAA would have no interest if Kobe or King James came to Duke to teach an independant studies program that basically consisted of a pick up game and grade...
I was thinking that maybe a Lebron or a Kobe just happening to be visiting K at Duke, or in townusing Duke's great facillities, during the weekend the kid visits. I can't imagine that Cut didn't introduce a few recruits to his protege QB from the NFL who was rehabbing for a while at Duke a few months ago... Also, I suspect there'd be nothing illegal with asking Lebron, or Kobe, or Durant to make a phone call on K's behalf to the kid. (Can you just imagine being a 16-year-old HS b-ball player, answering your cell in the car with mom on your way home from school: "Hello?" "Yes, Julius? This is Lebron James calling from South Beach... just got back from London...." :eek: :eek: !!!!!


Numerous recruits have mentioned Coach K being upfront and honest with them. He doesn't promise them playing time or a starting spot, they'll have to work for it, no matter how highly ranked they are. That approach works for some recruits and not for others, but that's the way it is (Patrick Patterson chose to play for Kentucky instead after Billy Gillespie promised him 30 shots a game, if I remember correctly).

I also think Coach K carries an aura that no other coach can match. Not even Doc Rivers could intimidate him. Coach K doesn't care if your father is an NBA Coach, if you're not performing you're going to get benched. Again, certain players respond well to that style while others won't.

As for the Mom angle, education is of course a huge selling point. Duke is like the straight-A student you want your daughter to date. Unfortunately, she doesn't always choose him ;)

UC, I really agree with your description 100%, based on the snippets we've heard from the kids about these visits over the years. One other thing that I've seen said (and would expect no less) is that Duke comes into a visit extremely well prepared. K will sit the kid down and show tape of his game, and provide analysis; and then show tape of a similar Duke player - think of showing Randle some tape of Battier or Boozer in action - and draw comparisons (and give the kid and parents a taste of the level of development/coaching he'll receive at Duke).

As the father of two girls I like your "daughters dating the staright-A kid" analogy. You just hope she doesn't choose to invest her time with just the most popular or flashiest boy...

[UrinalCake]

By contrast, here's what Roy Williams says at an in-home visit:

"Hey Mike, hold that door!"

Thank you, thank you, I'll be here all night.

[dukedoc]

As the father of two girls I like your "daughters dating the staright-A kid" analogy. You just hope she doesn't choose to invest her time with just the most popular or flashiest boy...

I too appreciate the dating analogy. On the flip side, it's definitely in the interest of the straight A boy to not get strung along by the pretty girl next door, if that girl is really not the right one. We've all probably experienced at some point in our lives the sense of infatuation with someone who in hindsight we recognize would have been a terrible fit for us long term. Recruits may look fantastic at first blush but that doesn't mean they will turn out to be good fits for our team and program. That's why I think K's honesty approach is ideal. Rather than trying to convince the girl next door to choose you by not being yourself, better to just be your self and find the right one. When you're heading to the altar quickly, no time for games and chicanery.

[jimsumner]

"This is what we do, why we do it and how we do it."

"This is how we see you fitting in."

"No guarantees. But if you do the work and trust the process, you can become part of something special, part of something bigger than yourself. And you'll learn and grow as part of that process."

Or a reasonable facsimile thereof.

[Indoor66]

"This is what we do, why we do it and how we do it."

"This is how we see you fitting in."

"No guarantees. But if you do the work and trust the process, you can become part of something special, part of something bigger than yourself. And you'll learn and grow as part of that process."

Or a reasonable facsimile thereof.

Maybe add in that each one runs his own race....

[oldnavy]

I was thinking that maybe a Lebron or a Kobe just happening to be visiting K at Duke, or in townusing Duke's great facillities, during the weekend the kid visits. I can't imagine that Cut didn't introduce a few recruits to his protege QB from the NFL who was rehabbing for a while at Duke a few months ago... Also, I suspect there'd be nothing illegal with asking Lebron, or Kobe, or Durant to make a phone call on K's behalf to the kid. (Can you just imagine being a 16-year-old HS b-ball player, answering your cell in the car with mom on your way home from school: "Hello?" "Yes, Julius? This is Lebron James calling from South Beach... just got back from London...." :eek: :eek: !!!!!



UC, I really agree with your description 100%, based on the snippets we've heard from the kids about these visits over the years. One other thing that I've seen said (and would expect no less) is that Duke comes into a visit extremely well prepared. K will sit the kid down and show tape of his game, and provide analysis; and then show tape of a similar Duke player - think of showing Randle some tape of Battier or Boozer in action - and draw comparisons (and give the kid and parents a taste of the level of development/coaching he'll receive at Duke).

As the father of two girls I like your "daughters dating the staright-A kid" analogy. You just hope she doesn't choose to invest her time with just the most popular or flashiest boy...

Yea, but how does that square with the fact that as fans of the team we cannot have contact with the kids and try to sell them on Duke? I just don't understand how the recruiting rules work I guess.

[JasonEvans]

I was thinking that maybe a Lebron or a Kobe just happening to be visiting K at Duke, or in town using Duke's great facillities, during the weekend the kid visits. I can't imagine that Cut didn't introduce a few recruits to his protege QB from the NFL who was rehabbing for a while at Duke a few months ago... Also, I suspect there'd be nothing illegal with asking Lebron, or Kobe, or Durant to make a phone call on K's behalf to the kid. (Can you just imagine being a 16-year-old HS b-ball player, answering your cell in the car with mom on your way home from school: "Hello?" "Yes, Julius? This is Lebron James calling from South Beach... just got back from London...." :eek: :eek: !!!!!

I don't think the NCAA would find your scenario 100% kosher.

First of all, if K arranges for one of these stars to speak with a recruit, that is clearly an instance of K using these stars as "Duke boosters." The NCAA has some very specific rules about how boosters can and cannot interact with recruits. It could be problematic and I doubt K would want to risk the stain on his record, the image of Duke, and the potential recruiting sanctions (which most often involve a school not being allowed to recruit the player) if he were to even approach "the line" when it comes to conduct of "Duke boosters."

That said, I have a news flash for all of you -- Mike Krzyzewski is a very smart man. What's more, his staff are also very smart men. I dare say, I doubt there is anything about recruiting that we can think up here that he and his team have not already thought of and weighted the positives and negatives. If K thinks a phone call from LeBron or Durant or whoever will make a difference and it is within the rules for him to make that happen, I am certain he would make it happen.

It is fun for all of us to speculate about all this stuff -- heck, I am most certainly one of the culprits in this regard -- but the reality is that we are largely just guessing and it is almost impossible to fathom that we would have an idea that has not already been considered and vetted by K, Wojo, Collins, Badass, and others.

That said...


"Julius? Hey, Carlos Boozer here. I just got off the phone with Elton Brand. We were comparing the $100 mil I've made so far in my career with the $143 mill he has earned. He said his fortune was bigger than mine. But I told him that's just because he is older and I still have $47 million more coming to me over the next 3 years. So, we decided to call you and ask you which Duke power forward has had a bigger NBA career."

-Jason "see, isn't this a fun game!?!?" Evans

[Newton_14]

"Son, do you want to have an impact on college basketball? Do you want to be one of the players that everyone in the nation knows about and who plays for the highest honors the college game has to offer? Well, here is a list of players at Duke who played in a Final Four, a list of guys who were All-ACC, a list of those who were All-American, a list of players who were first round draft picks, a list of players who won some kind of national award, a list of guys who played more than 20 games on national TV."

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Stack-of-paper.jpg

-Jason "oh, and by the way, each of these lists are longer than any other coach out there can show you" Evans

I have always loved the line Barry Switzer used to use for Oklahoma Football recruits... "Son, with you on our team, we will be ranked in the Top 5 all year and have a great chance to win a National Title. On the otherhand, without you on our team, we will be ranked in the Top 5 all year and have a great chance to win a National Title. Now do you want in on that or not?" :)

But as you noted in a later post, all of us here are just speculating on what actually happens during these visits. All we do know for sure is that K and crew roll up in a Limo, with all dressed in suits. That appeals to some, but not to others, but that is how K rolls.

[dukedoc]

A little Julius from Ball is Life VIDEO (http://ballislife.com/julius-randle-crazy-official-summer-mixtape-1-player-in-the-nation-is-a-straight-beast/)

[G man]

That video is crazy. Granted it is a highlight video, but the guy is athletic. His best attribute is his desire to go to the rim. He goes hard and finishes at the rim. I love that style of play. He is as tough as they come.

[kelly]

Please move this post if this is not the appropriate thread.

For whatever this is worth, just a little story at PCA from yesterday. We took our 4-year-old to visit as it is one of the schools we considered for her. During our conversation with the Admission Office, it somehow got to Julius Randle. My husband asked whether the most recent class graduated has anyone attending Duke. I joked, "Well, there's one being recruited in the current class." The lady then said without much hesitation, "And I think he WILL go there." I didn't know if this conversation is in any kind of NCAA violation, so I didn't continue. But she followed up by saying "Julius loves his mom. For the longest time, we all thought he was going to stay close to home and go to Baylor. But I think, no, his mom is going to where he will be!" Today, I'm glad to hear that his mom is a lifelong Duke fan.

[rhcpflea99]

Please move this post if this is not the appropriate thread.

For whatever this is worth, just a little story at PCA from yesterday. We took our 4-year-old to visit as it is one of the schools we considered for her. During our conversation with the Admission Office, it somehow got to Julius Randle. My husband asked whether the most recent class graduated has anyone attending Duke. I joked, "Well, there's one being recruited in the current class." The lady then said without much hesitation, "And I think he WILL go there." I didn't know if this conversation is in any kind of NCAA violation, so I didn't continue. But she followed up by saying "Julius loves his mom. For the longest time, we all thought he was going to stay close to home and go to Baylor. But I think, no, his mom is going to where he will be!" Today, I'm glad to hear that his mom is a lifelong Duke fan.

Hopefully his momma will make her way to Durham.

[dukedoc]

Please move this post if this is not the appropriate thread.

For whatever this is worth, just a little story at PCA from yesterday. We took our 4-year-old to visit as it is one of the schools we considered for her. During our conversation with the Admission Office, it somehow got to Julius Randle. My husband asked whether the most recent class graduated has anyone attending Duke. I joked, "Well, there's one being recruited in the current class." The lady then said without much hesitation, "And I think he WILL go there." I didn't know if this conversation is in any kind of NCAA violation, so I didn't continue. But she followed up by saying "Julius loves his mom. For the longest time, we all thought he was going to stay close to home and go to Baylor. But I think, no, his mom is going to where he will be!" Today, I'm glad to hear that his mom is a lifelong Duke fan.

Interesting stuff, thanks for sharing. I don't know anything about NCAA rules, but it seems to me that you were simply the passive recipient of the admission office lady's sharing and therefore an innocent bystander. Now, if you had accosted Julius in the halls and screamed "go Duke!" in his face, that would be a different story.

[Cameron]

Interesting stuff, thanks for sharing. I don't know anything about NCAA rules, but it seems to me that you were simply the passive recipient of the admission office lady's sharing and therefore an innocent bystander. Now, if you had accosted Julius in the halls and screamed "go Duke!" in his face, that would be a different story.

Serious question -- because, like some others here, I am not that clear on NCAA rules, as they are many and most unreasonably absurd. Say I were at the Texas state final four, and while walking around in the hallway before one of the games Julius Randle walks by and starts signing autographs for fans. If while he signs my Duke hat I casually say, "You're the next Luol Deng. Go Duke!" is that a violation with punishable consequences? If so, that is pure lunacy.

[-jk]

Lunacy or not, the NCAA has very specific rules. The FAQ sticky (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?3217-FAQ-NCAA-Compliance-TV-Coverage-Game-Chat-quot-9F-quot-NBA&p=205515#post205515) has more info.

-jk

[UrinalCake]

So what's to stop me from yelling "You're the next Jordan, go to UNC!" at him and therefore getting UNC in trouble? "Lunacy" does seem like an appropriate description.

[dukedoc]

So what's to stop me from yelling "You're the next Jordan, go to UNC!" at him and therefore getting UNC in trouble? "Lunacy" does seem like an appropriate description.

It's impossible to enforce most of these rules. They do serve to deter a large chunk of fans who might otherwise think it a good idea to contact recruits, however.

[detule]

So what's to stop me from yelling "You're the next Jordan, go to UNC!" at him and therefore getting UNC in trouble?

The fear that he might take you at your word.

[UrinalCake]

The fear that he might take you at your word.

Good point. Maybe instead I'll yell "You might be the next Harrison Barnes!"

[oldnavy]

Good point. Maybe instead I'll yell "You might be the next Harrison Barnes!"

Yea, but then you would be breaking the law for defamation of character and verbal assault.

[Turtleboy]

Lunacy or not, the NCAA has very specific rules. The FAQ sticky (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?3217-FAQ-NCAA-Compliance-TV-Coverage-Game-Chat-quot-9F-quot-NBA&p=205515#post205515) has more info.

-jkWell, it looks like devildoc broke one, by visiting his educational institution, albeit for a perfectly legitimate reason. So according to the NCAA, no one who is a fan of Duke can attend any institution where Duke is recruiting someone. Or any child of a fan. Pure and absolute lunacy.

[ThePublisher]

Serious question -- because, like some others here, I am not that clear on NCAA rules, as they are many and most unreasonably absurd. Say I were at the Texas state final four, and while walking around in the hallway before one of the games Julius Randle walks by and starts signing autographs for fans. If while he signs my Duke hat I casually say, "You're the next Luol Deng. Go Duke!" is that a violation with punishable consequences? If so, that is pure lunacy.

"You're the next LeBron" would probably work a little better on him. " Look at what K did with him in the Olympics. "

[Cameron]

"You're the next LeBron" would probably work a little better on him. " Look at what K did with him in the Olympics. "

I would agree. But by dropping a former Duke star's name in Luol, it automatically lets Randle know that I am a Duke fan and that our fans fervently want him coming to Durham to become the next great Blue Devil freshman phenom.

According to the NCAA, however, apparently I should just refrain from doing impressions of Arliss Michaels altogether.

[Starter]

I think turn out the lights on this one. Some combo of Austin Nichols and Jabari Parker -- hopefully -- always seemed to make more sense anyway.


Jason Jordan ‏@JayJayUSATODAY
Just confirmed w/ Julius Randle's mother Carolyn Kyles that he's cut his list to: Kentucky, NC State, Fla, Texas, Kansas and Oklahoma.

[Lord Ash]

Ridiculous. How in the heck we got beat out by a few of those schools is completely and totally beyond me. Just beyond me. Pretty irritated at this news.

[dukedoc]

Ridiculous. How in the heck we got beat out by a few of those schools is completely and totally beyond me. Just beyond me. Pretty irritated at this news.

I'm not certain we actually got beat out by some of the schools. I wonder if some of them remain on the list but are not genuine contenders. Who knows? If Julius didn't want to come here, that's OK, ultimately. I respect him for letting us know now rather than leaving us on the list until the bitter end just for the heck of it. Pro-Duke moms haven't been doing so well recently.

[Steven43]

Ridiculous. How in the heck we got beat out by a few of those schools is completely and totally beyond me. Just beyond me. Pretty irritated at this news.

Remember earlier in the year when many of us were worried about the Class of 2012 and the possibility that Duke was going to miss on Muhammad, Parker, and Jefferson and some posters wrote not to worry because we were looking so good with the Class of 2013, particularly with Jabari Parker and Julius Randle? Well, if it's true that Julius Randle is no longer considering Duke then I am quite disappointed. I expected Duke to be among his final two. If Duke is not even in his final six, it really makes me wonder what happened. This seems to put even more pressure on Coach to convince Jabari Parker to commit.

I am very surprised to not see UNC among his (Randle) finalists. Especially after the way he talked them up last month. And how in the heck has Mark Gottfried suddenly put NC State near the top of the list of so many elite recruits? I wonder if signing Rodney Hood and Amile Jefferson lessened our chances of getting Randle? This recruiting game is perplexing.

[ThePublisher]

Odd we were cut. I was under the impression Duke was a top two favorite. Oh well. One less one-n-done.

Kentucky bound I imagine.

[Steven43]

I think turn out the lights on this one. Some combo of Austin Nichols and Jabari Parker -- hopefully -- always seemed to make more sense anyway.

Why does some combo of Austin Nichols and Jabari Parker make more sense? You mean those two together make more sense than Julius Randle and Jabari Parker?

[tommy]

I'm starting to think the world was a better place when nobody knew anything about recruiting, nobody followed it, and we'd just start off each fall fresh, with it going something like "OK, let's see. What new guys do we have on the team this year? Who are they? Where are they from? What position does it look like this one or that might play?" And just enjoy it. All this angst every year, and all the disappointment, shock, dismay, even sometimes anger, when we don't get a kid regarded as "key" whose recruitiment we've all been following for a year or two, and we don't understand why we didn't get him, and never will -- maybe it was better (at least for me) when we didn't know as much.

[roywhite]

Ridiculous. How in the heck we got beat out by a few of those schools is completely and totally beyond me. Just beyond me. Pretty irritated at this news.


Remember earlier in the year when many of us were worried about the Class of 2012 and the possibility that Duke was going to miss on Muhammad, Parker, and Jefferson (who Duke ended up getting, of course) and some posters wrote not to worry because we were looking so good with the Class of 2013, particularly with Jabari Parker and Julius Randle? Well, if it's true that Julius Randle is no longer considering Duke then I am quite disappointed. I totally expected Duke to be among his final two. If Duke is not even in his final six, it really makes me wonder what happened. This seems to put even more pressure on Coach to convince Jabari Parker to commit.

I am very surprised to not see UNC among his (Randle) finalists. Especially after the way he talked them up last month. And how in the heck has Mark Gottfried suddenly put NC State near the top of the list of so many elite recruits? I wonder if signing Rodney Hood and Amile Jefferson lessened our chances of getting Randle? This recruiting game is perplexing.

Just don't see Duke as a good match for kids who are pretty sure they are one-and-done.

Coach K wants them to "unpack their bags," and get involved with their studies and University life in general.

At the Coal Lounge (or whatever the proper name is) in Lexington, they are checking in for a short stay...more concerned with the amenities and a good one season basketball experience than academics and college life.

We occasionally can get a Kyrie or Austin Rivers, which is fine, but the players who want to stay a little longer have become more of our target market. I'm not bothered when we lose out on some of the top 3 or 4 recruits. They won't be around college basketball for long anyway. Just my .02

[Greg_Newton]

Good thing we're a football school now.

[Indoor66]

Maybe this thread should be merged into the general, generic recruiting thread. It speaks well for the reasoning for general recruiting threads delineated by years.

[tommy]

Just don't see Duke as a good match for kids who are pretty sure they are one-and-done.

Coach K wants them to "unpack their bags," and get involved with their studies and University life in general.

Not disagreeing with you on that. But then the question becomes: why are we on these non-bag-unpackers' lists to begin with? At one point, Randle had it down to four schools, and we were one of them, before he then re-expanded it to 10. He's known the whole time, as everyone does, that academics matter at Duke. Did he not know himself well enough to admit that he didn't want to have to deal with academics? Are these guys just flattering themselves by leading schools like Duke on, when they know they're thinking one and done, and looking to avoid academic challenge? There are tons of excellent basketball programs out there, including traditional powers, that don't force academics on their athletes. Any of these guys could create a terrific list of programs to put on their list - not just Kentucky. Why don't they just let us know early that they're not interested? A few do -- like Nerlens Noel did -- but I'm wondering why the rest don't have the . . . guts to do that.

[-bdbd]

Good thing we're a football school now.

LOL!! :rolleyes:

[johnb]

Ridiculous. How in the heck we got beat out by a few of those schools is completely and totally beyond me. Just beyond me. Pretty irritated at this news.

Well, Julius hasn't called in to discuss his choices with me (though perhaps he left a message), but they seem like a reasonable set of schools:

Kentucky, NC State, Florida, Texas, Kansas and Oklahoma

"Reasonable" in that he seems to have decided to go with a large flagship state university with a strong sports program. From Texas--where he's from--the 3 best Big XII academic/athletic schools are Texas/OU/Kansas. Florida and Kentucky are arguably the top sports schools in the SEC. Not sure the thinking behind NC State, but there's a lot of positive talk about the incoming players.

I wouldn't be too surprised... most top-level athletes go to such places (as do most straight-A high school students). Here's a list from last year: http://espn.go.com/college-sports//basketball/recruiting/playerrankings/_/view/espnu100/sort/rank/class/2012. Top players want to play with and against top players. They also want to feel comfortably socially and academically. Lots of people won't feel comfortable at Duke, for a bunch of different reasons. We'll be fine.

[Class of '94]

Well, Julius hasn't called in to discuss his choices with me (though perhaps he left a message), but they seem like a reasonable set of schools:

Kentucky, NC State, Florida, Texas, Kansas and Oklahoma

"Reasonable" in that he seems to have decided to go with a large flagship state university with a strong sports program. From Texas--where he's from--the 3 best Big XII academic/athletic schools are Texas/OU/Kansas. Florida and Kentucky are arguably the top sports schools in the SEC. Not sure the thinking behind NC State, but there's a lot of positive talk about the incoming players.

I wouldn't be too surprised... most top-level athletes go to such places (as do most straight-A high school students). Here's a list from last year: http://espn.go.com/college-sports//basketball/recruiting/playerrankings/_/view/espnu100/sort/rank/class/2012. Top players want to play with and against top players. They also want to feel comfortably socially and academically. Lots of people won't feel comfortable at Duke, for a bunch of different reasons. We'll be fine.

I get the concept of going to a school where you feel comfortable academically and socially; but if I'm correct, the current school he goes to is a "private" school with strong academics. Plus, UNC imo has just a good an environment socially and academically as NC State; and if he went to Duke, he still could go to the other campuses to socialize like many of Duke's athletes and students have done and continue to do. So I don't necessarily buy the implication that Duke wasn't a good fit socially for Randle. That said, I do get and understand it's his choice and in the end he as well as any other recruit will choose a school that he's most comfortable with and likes; and it's not always going to be Duke. I wish Randle well and appreciate the fact that he didn't string Duke along like some other recruits have done.

[Lord Ash]

I am a Duke snob. It is beyond me that anyone could pick ANY other school, given that Duke offers...

A) first class facilities
B) the best coach in the world
C) a coach who will not just coach you in basketball, but help you grow as a person better than almost any other
D) unparalleled exposure
E) a historic franchise
F) an all-time home venue
G) playing time
H) a coaching staff that has put numerous players at your approximate position into the league

I just don't get it. Florida? NC State? Sorry... I never understand why someone doesn't pick Duke, but I definitely don't understand why we wouldn't even make Randle's top six.

[blazindw]

I am a Duke snob. It is beyond me that anyone could pick ANY other school, given that Duke offers...

A) first class facilities
B) the best coach in the world
C) a coach who will not just coach you in basketball, but help you grow as a person better than almost any other
D) unparalleled exposure
E) a historic franchise
F) an all-time home venue
G) playing time
H) a coaching staff that has put numerous players at your approximate position into the league

I just don't get it. Florida? NC State? Sorry... I never understand why someone doesn't pick Duke, but I definitely don't understand why we wouldn't even make Randle's top six.

I'd rather a player eliminate us early than string us along (pulling away valuable time and resources we could use on another player) and then pull an Ebi.

[CarmenWallaceWade]

Next play.

On to Austin Nichols. Seem to recall recently reading that our coaching staff reached out to Noah Vonleh's camp, too. Maybe that happened after they got word from Randle on his plans. Though i Have heard he already has strong interest in that other school down the road.

[Faison1]

I'm starting to think the world was a better place when nobody knew anything about recruiting, nobody followed it, and we'd just start off each fall fresh, with it going something like "OK, let's see.

You're just starting to think this?

[TexHawk]

Randle is tight with Rodney Purvis, no? That would partly explain NC State.

Randle also grew up and is very good friends with Zach Peters, freshman at KU.

[roywhite]

Next play.

On to Austin Nichols. Seem to recall recently reading that our coaching staff reached out to Noah Vonleh's camp, too. Maybe that happened after they got word from Randle on his plans. Though i Have heard he already has strong interest in that other school down the road.

Yeah, no problem.

What?.....we've run out of Plumlees to recruit?
Oh, no. :rolleyes:

[rhcpflea99]

http://zagsblog.com/articles/report-julius-randle-cuts-list-to-six/

[Cameron]

Is is not possible that Jason Jordan just mixed up Duke and Oklahoma due to their nearly identical spellings?

[Dukehky]

Son of a bee sting!!!!!!

I wanted this kid really badly. I really thought when Matt Jones signed we'd AT least be finalists. Oh well, at least I know early and he didn't break my heart like some other recent recruits. If Kentucky gets another freak class, I'm going to go on a full fledged investigation myself, enough already Calipari.

[moonpie23]

enough already Calipari.

what if state gets him?

[mo.st.dukie]

Randle is tight with Rodney Purvis, no? That would partly explain NC State.

Randle also grew up and is very good friends with Zach Peters, freshman at KU.

He's also best friends with Matt Jones, known each other all their lives, and they play on the same AAU team.

[mo.st.dukie]

Yeah, no problem.

What?.....we've run out of Plumlees to recruit?
Oh, no. :rolleyes:

Good thing we'll have at least one Plumlee on the roster until 2016 (8 years total with at least one Plumlee).

[Dukehky]

what if state gets him?

Meh, I'll let it slide, I like when State is good. North Carolina is the best basketball state in the country, might as well erase all doubt.


The Bobcats in no way count, they're a disgrace to Charlotte, North Carolina, and the sport of basketball as a whole.

[Cameron]

He's also best friends with Matt Jones, known each other all their lives, and they play on the same AAU team.

Somebody here wanted to know earlier if there would ever be a way for our staff to find out why Randle cooled on Duke. Well, this might be that window. I am sure, like many of us, Coach K and his crew are perfectionists and would like to know if there is anything that could have been done differently, something that may have went wrong along the way.

My suspicions, however, are just that Randle wanted the "hip hop" treatment from Cal and the theatrical production he is running in Lexington. And if that turns out to be the case, so be it. I am not phased by it. If these kids need Rick Ross to tuck them in at night in order to make them feel good about themselves and their abilities, then they are not the type of players we need here. Not saying this is the case -- we might have just been straight beat out for him -- but it wouldn't surprise me.

[moonpie23]

no harm no foul......Cal offers another path.....kids that take that path want something different than the duke path...

pretty simple...

[johnb]

I am a Duke snob. It is beyond me that anyone could pick ANY other school, given that Duke offers...

A) first class facilities
B) the best coach in the world
C) a coach who will not just coach you in basketball, but help you grow as a person better than almost any other
D) unparalleled exposure
E) a historic franchise
F) an all-time home venue
G) playing time
H) a coaching staff that has put numerous players at your approximate position into the league

I just don't get it. Florida? NC State? Sorry... I never understand why someone doesn't pick Duke, but I definitely don't understand why we wouldn't even make Randle's top six.


The other schools on his list will make the same claims. They'd be wrong, of course, but they can say such things with a straight face.

Example, from Wikipedia:
"Since 1986, the Gators have won twenty-three of the last twenty-six SEC All-Sports Trophies, recognizing Florida as the best overall athletics program in the SEC.[164] Florida's sports program has ranked among the top five in the nation in twenty of the past twenty-eight years, and it is the only Division I program that has ranked among the top ten athletic programs in the country in each of the last twenty-eight years.[165]

Florida has won a total of twenty-nine team national championships,[166] twenty-three of which are NCAA championships.[167] Florida is one of only two Division I FBS universities to win multiple national championships in each of the two most popular NCAA sports: football (1996, 2006, 2008) and men's basketball (2006, 2007)."

And note that as recently as 3-4 years ago, Florida's basketball program was spoken with something of the same envy/irritation as Kentucky's is now. Don't get me wrong, Duke's great, but there are other great universities. Even NC State, which is the only school on his list that isn't the premier sports university in its state, can make the same argument to recruits that Cutcliffe is making to our football recruits: we're good and getting better and you can make a difference.

[FerryFor50]

As always, at the end of the day, I'm just glad he didn't choose UNC.

[sagegrouse]

I am a Duke snob. It is beyond me that anyone could pick ANY other school, given that Duke offers...

A) first class facilities
B) the best coach in the world
C) a coach who will not just coach you in basketball, but help you grow as a person better than almost any other
D) unparalleled exposure
E) a historic franchise
F) an all-time home venue
G) playing time
H) a coaching staff that has put numerous players at your approximate position into the league

I just don't get it. Florida? NC State? Sorry... I never understand why someone doesn't pick Duke, but I definitely don't understand why we wouldn't even make Randle's top six.

I would add:

I) an academic and social environment on campus that will enable you to grow in sophisitication and confidence and prepare you to excell in life beyond basketball
J) a top-ten or higher academic experience

(J) is both a positive and a huge negative, depending on the young man. Many recruits would opt for the easy academic road rather than the hard one. I don't know if Julius Randle is in this camp or not.

sagegrouse

[rhcpflea99]

Somebody here wanted to know earlier if there would ever be a way for our staff to find out why Randle cooled on Duke. Well, this might be that window. I am sure, like many of us, Coach K and his crew are perfectionists and would like to know if there is anything that could have been done differently, something that may have went wrong along the way.

My suspicions, however, are just that Randle wanted the "hip hop" treatment from Cal and the theatrical production he is running in Lexington. And if that turns out to be the case, so be it. I am not phased by it. If these kids need Rick Ross to tuck them in at night in order to make them feel good about themselves and their abilities, then they are not the type of players we need here. Not saying this is the case -- we might have just been straight beat out for him -- but it wouldn't surprise me.

I think Kansas and Kentucky just offer a better one and done option than Duke. At Duke you might not even see the floor if you can't play defense.

[roywhite]

I think Kansas and Kentucky just offer a better one and done option than Duke. At Duke you might not even see the floor if you can't play defense.

If you're just talking basketball, I'll disagree with you; other schools have good programs and coaches, but none better than Coach K and his approach, even for a one-and-done player.

Proof?
Ask Kyrie about his preparation and experience.
Ask Doc Rivers about the improvement he saw with Austin and the overall experience at Duke.
Ask members of the USA teams who have played for Coach K about the quality of the coaching.

As noted elsewhere in this thread, there are academic, social, and other considerations involved in choosing a school, and plenty of reasons why some very talented players go elsewhere.
But passing on Duke to go where less is demanded of them on the court, like not having to bear down on defense? No, that's not good preparation for the NBA.

[crimsonandblue]

If you're just talking basketball, I'll disagree with you; other schools have good programs and coaches, but none better than Coach K and his approach, even for a one-and-done player.

Proof?
Ask Kyrie about his preparation and experience.
Ask Doc Rivers about the improvement he saw with Austin and the overall experience at Duke.
Ask members of the USA teams who have played for Coach K about the quality of the coaching.

As noted elsewhere in this thread, there are academic, social, and other considerations involved in choosing a school, and plenty of reasons why some very talented players go elsewhere.
But passing on Duke to go where less is demanded of them on the court, like not having to bear down on defense? No, that's not good preparation for the NBA.

You and the previous poster can have whatever argument you'd like over whether Duke is a good place for one-and-dones. I'd just interject that the notion that Cal or Self won't be as demanding on the court as K, particularly on defense, is pretty much indefensible. Cal's had his teams (at Memphis and now Kentucky) in the top 10 of defensive efficiency (with one slip to 15) for each of the last five years. Self's had KU in the top 10 each of those years. Duke is usually there in the top 10, but fell last year to, what, 70?

On the academic side of things, if you're truly looking one and done, I can see Duke being at a disadvantage, because why subject yourself to the academic rigors of Duke if you're not really going to try and reap the benefits from the educational experience. But from a basketball perspective, I don't imagine any of the top schools expect less of the kids on either end of the court or off it in terms of conditioning, practice, etc.

[Kedsy]

But passing on Duke to go where less is demanded of them on the court, like not having to bear down on defense? No, that's not good preparation for the NBA.

While I agree with your statement, Roy, I'm not sure how relevant it is to the Randle situation, assuming Kentucky is the front-runner. We may not like Cal, but his teams generally play pretty good D.

Frankly, I don't understand the original statement which prompted you to post the above. Julius Randle would be starting and playing good minutes at any school he decided to attend, including Duke. That isn't the issue here.

For the people who can't understand why any kid would choose another school if they had the opportunity to play for Duke, I believe your perceptions are colored by your own desires and history and decision-making processes. If a kid doesn't want to come to Duke, why can't we just accept that? Why does it have to be either a fault of the program/coaching staff or a fault of the kid? Assuming the report is accurate, I'd say Julius Randle would rather play his one year of college ball elsewhere. End of story.

[sagegrouse]

For the people who can't understand why any kid would choose another school if they had the opportunity to play for Duke, I believe your perceptions are colored by your own desires and history and decision-making processes. If a kid doesn't want to come to Duke, why can't we just accept that? Why does it have to be either a fault of the program/coaching staff or a fault of the kid? Assuming the report is accurate, I'd say Julius Randle would rather play his one year of college ball elsewhere. End of story.

The other factor is that there are 20-30 schools that can be highly competitive for the best players. These include, not only the 5-6 bluebloods, but others like State and Maryland, UCLA and Washington, Texas and Baylor, Florida, and a whole raft of Big Ten and Big East schools.

It is unrealistic to hinge one's recruiting hopes on just one or two players. Duke plays really good team basketball and can make a wonderful team out of many different kinds of ingredients. That said, the worst is when Duke or anyone has to function without (a) a good big man, (b) good wing players, or (c) a point guard. And those cases turn up often in college hoops because the lead time for getting players is about two years. But this is another topic entirely.

sagegrouse

[Cameron]

I think Kansas and Kentucky just offer a better one and done option than Duke. At Duke you might not even see the floor if you can't play defense.

This is true and probably something that lingers in the mind of a lot of recruits. Good points. At Duke, there is a culture of excellence that, as you say, starts on defense, and it mandates that you work for every minute you get. End of discussion. While this is probably mostly true of many other places, I concur completely that there is a perception, whether entirely accurate or not, that if you sign up to play at a place like Kentucky or Baylor, all you have to bring is shoes. The rest will be given to you. That basketball factory mentality is tough to compete with when you are aiming to usher in the services of elite 17-year-old kids who have NBA blinders on and are already treated like gods. Why work for it when it’s already there for the taking?

This is just my off-the-cuff opinion of things. I am by no means saying that Kentucky and Baylor kids do not work hard. But there is no question that at Duke there is no such thing as coasting.

[TexHawk]

This is true and probably something that lingers in the mind of a lot of recruits. Good points. At Duke, there is a culture of excellence that, as you say, starts on defense, and it mandates that you work for every minute you get. End of discussion. While this is probably mostly true of many other places, I concur completely that there is a perception, whether entirely accurate or not, that if you sign up to play at a place like Kentucky or Baylor, all you have to bring is shoes. The rest will be given to you. That basketball factory mentality is tough to compete with when you are aiming to usher in the services of elite 17-year-old kids who have NBA blinders on and are already treated like gods. Why work for it when it’s already there for the taking?

This is just my off-the-cuff opinion of things. I am by no means saying that Kentucky and Baylor kids do not work hard. But there is no question that at Duke there is no such thing as coasting.

Hate to repeat what C&B already said, but it blows my mind that people see Calipari as a high-level recruiter only, who just rolls the ball out and takes a nap. I despise the man, but he can flat out coach, especially defense. I know it's easy to think he just had Anthony Davis back there, but every year he gets Top 5 recruits to buy into that side of the floor. The only year his team's haven't been in the Top 15 in AdjD was his first year at Kentucky, with Gillespie's players. While Derrick Rose will never be mistaken for Bruce Bowen in the NBA, he absolutely bought into Calipari's defense at Memphis (they finished #4 in AdjD).

[TexHawk]

I think Kansas and Kentucky just offer a better one and done option than Duke. At Duke you might not even see the floor if you can't play defense.

Bill Self has had two one-and-done in 9 years** at Kansas (X.Henry and J.Selby). And Selby got some bad advice, he was injured and not even close to a traditional one-and-done player. If anything, one-and-done players have been put off by that track record. Read a KU board sometime, Self has whiffed on almost every high-level recruit he's gone after in the last 3 years. Perry Ellis was his first McDAA in over 2 years, and he grew up in Kansas. The results on the court have been outstanding, but for those that follow recruiting closely, it's a bit mind-boggling that he can't close a Top 10 recruit. KU has had a player picked in the lottery every year since 2009, and 12 Self KU players are currently on NBA rosters.

**K has had two in two years.

[Cameron]

Hate to repeat what C&B already said, but it blows my mind that people see Calipari as a high-level recruiter only, who just rolls the ball out and takes a nap. I despise the man, but he can flat out coach, especially defense. I know it's easy to think he just had Anthony Davis back there, but every year he gets Top 5 recruits to buy into that side of the floor. The only year his team's haven't been in the Top 15 in AdjD was his first year at Kentucky, with Gillespie's players. While Derrick Rose will never be mistaken for Bruce Bowen in the NBA, he absolutely bought into Calipari's defense at Memphis (they finished #4 in AdjD).

I completely agree with you and C&B re: Cal being a very good defensive coach. As I said before, I am not trying to imply that kids aren't required to work hard at Kentucky, even if my post seemed to contradict that. You can't argue with results, and UK has plenty of those.

More to my point is the idea that certain high-profile recruits coming out of high school may look at the experiences of some the recent elite scorers, yet less heralded defenders, who chose to go to Duke (e.g. Taylor King or Andre Dawkins) and ended up playing sparingly their first season and not having as big an impact as their recruiting rankings would have suggested due to their ineffectiveness on the other end of the floor. As with any player who doesn't think he's getting enough time, there are normally valid reasons for the way things are. In King's case, there seems to have been many. But that might not stop the perception that Coach K seems to really cool on guys who do not bring it on D and relegate them to the bench for the rest of the year for being in his "dog house."

That perception is even prevalent here. We hear the same talk every year. It is true? Does Coach K just have it in for certain guys? Of course not. Once again, there is usually a reason for lack of playing time. But for whatever reason, we seem to hear even announcers carry on about how players like Andre Dawkins are sitting on the bench and not seeing the floor. Mike Patrick is notorious for pointing this out during Duke games. He has done it regarding Andre, he did it for King, Greg Paulus before that, Marty Pocius, etc.

[johnb]

...
More to my point is the idea that certain high-profile recruits coming out of high school may look at the experiences of some the recent elite scorers, yet less heralded defenders, who chose to go to Duke (e.g. Taylor King or Andre Dawkins) and ended up playing sparingly .. ...

And there are other offensive-minded players who got lots of PT despite being better at scoring than at defending. JJ and Austin Rivers come to mind.

As stated above, we're among the top cluster of defensive teams (and offensive teams and programs and schools that graduate players), but we don't own any patents on these laudatory qualities.

[Billy Dat]

I write the following without knowing whether or not Randle will wind up at Kentucky, but Cal's approach is so polarizing, yet effective, that I wonder if we are missing an obvious reason for its success?

Here are the reasons we have discussed, and that I think are extremely compelling:
-His track record of sending guys to the NBA after one year, particularly the lottery
-His now proven formula for sending one-and-done teams the Final Four
-His NBA connections to guys like Worldwide Wes and players like Lebron (presumably relationships driven by Wes)
-His hip hop connections (a relatively new wrinkle that, also, is fueled by Uncle Wes)

The thing I think is missing is tied to his "I want you in the NBA" sales pitch. Despite the value of a college education, we know that many college athletes feel exploited. They know that their skills and effort are making the head coach rich and making lots of money for the school, far beyond the value of their $500K scholarship. Along comes Cal, who is basically flipping the script and saying "I want YOU to exploit KENTUCKY". In other words, he's created a launching pad where the kid can leverage the Kentucky brand, built over decades, to go from high school star to NBA millionaire in 10 months. The fallback, 22 months. Worst case scenario, they get a degree if they are willing to do the work. I think that messages must really ring out to the kid, and especially to his parents and family. Forget all the rhetoric about building young men and the value of school. He's telling kids that they should be allowed to go right to the NBA, but since they aren't, he's the next best game in town - and that's OK because the system works both ways. The kid is prepping for a pro career, the sooner the better. The school and its fanbase get crazy good teams year after year, and Cal gets bigger and bigger contracts. If a kid isn't good enough, he can dedicate himself to the classroom and earn a degree and probably work in Kentucky for the rest of his life due to the alumni network. My point is, there is no attempt to spin the illusion of the recruitment being about school - it's about the kid, his teammates, the coach and the school making money, the more the better and the sooner the better. Maybe the approach wouldn't hold water without Wes to endorse it, but Cal has seemed to earn the trust of the community, and it's not by taking the approach of "I don't promise playing time, I am a builder of men, I value education" etc. It's, basically, "We're in a billion dollar business - I'm getting mine, and so should you".

I am not endorsing the approach, but it works. I don't think Duke can or should attempt to copy it, but I have no ethical issues with it.

Or maybe the kids just want to meet Drake and Beyonce?

[roywhite]

I write the following without knowing whether or not Randle will wind up at Kentucky, but Cal's approach is so polarizing, yet effective, that I wonder if we are missing an obvious reason for its success?

Here are the reasons we have discussed, and that I think are extremely compelling:
-His track record of sending guys to the NBA after one year, particularly the lottery
-His now proven formula for sending one-and-done teams the Final Four
-His NBA connections to guys like Worldwide Wes and players like Lebron (presumably relationships driven by Wes)
-His hip hop connections (a relatively new wrinkle that, also, is fueled by Uncle Wes)

The thing I think is missing is tied to his "I want you in the NBA" sales pitch. Despite the value of a college education, we know that many college athletes feel exploited. They know that their skills and effort are making the head coach rich and making lots of money for the school, far beyond the value of their $500K scholarship. Along comes Cal, who is basically flipping the script and saying "I want YOU to exploit KENTUCKY". In other words, he's created a launching pad where the kid can leverage the Kentucky brand, built over decades, to go from high school star to NBA millionaire in 10 months. The fallback, 22 months. Worst case scenario, they get a degree if they are willing to do the work. I think that messages must really ring out to the kid, and especially to his parents and family. Forget all the rhetoric about building young men and the value of school. He's telling kids that they should be allowed to go right to the NBA, but since they aren't, he's the next best game in town - and that's OK because the system works both ways. The kid is prepping for a pro career, the sooner the better. The school and its fanbase get crazy good teams year after year, and Cal gets bigger and bigger contracts. If a kid isn't good enough, he can dedicate himself to the classroom and earn a degree and probably work in Kentucky for the rest of his life due to the alumni network. My point is, there is no attempt to spin the illusion of the recruitment being about school - it's about the kid, his teammates, the coach and the school making money, the more the better and the sooner the better. Maybe the approach wouldn't hold water without Wes to endorse it, but Cal has seemed to earn the trust of the community, and it's not by taking the approach of "I don't promise playing time, I am a builder of men, I value education" etc. It's, basically, "We're in a billion dollar business - I'm getting mine, and so should you".

I am not endorsing the approach, but it works. I don't think Duke can or should attempt to copy it, but I have no ethical issues with it.

Or maybe the kids just want to meet Drake and Beyonce?

Well stated. As pointed out here and elsewhere, I think Cal is a terrific coach in addition to his recruiting ability. This most recent Kentucky team, put together in a short period of time, shared the ball, played defense, and competed hard.

My main issue with your assessment is that perhaps there is more to his approach than meets the eye -- his past record indicates that he stretches or breaks the rules. Who knows whether these players are getting paid while at Kentucky? Maybe not, and some would not have an issue with it if they are being paid. Has he found a great approach to getting players and winning games that works for him, his players, and Kentucky? Yes. But he may also be cheating.

[Kedsy]

More to my point is the idea that certain high-profile recruits coming out of high school may look at the experiences of some the recent elite scorers, yet less heralded defenders, who chose to go to Duke (e.g. Taylor King or Andre Dawkins) and ended up playing sparingly their first season and not having as big an impact as their recruiting rankings would have suggested due to their ineffectiveness on the other end of the floor.

I don't know. I strongly doubt any "elite scorer" thinks of himself as Taylor King. Especially top 10 recruits like Randle. I'd be very surprised if K's reputation for insisting on defense is why we miss on some of these guys.

[Billy Dat]

But he may also be cheating.

True, but 'may' is the key word. The issues that led to his Final Fours being vacated may not have had anything to do with him. Camby took money from an agent and Rose had someone else take his SAT...those are basically cliches in modern college hoops. It reminds me of the two girls everyone knew in high school/college...they both slept with many different people, one was labeled a slut and one was considered the coolest girl around, and the difference was all in the way they carried it. It may be a bad analogy, but it occurs to me that there are scores of programs who have had players cheat on their SAT and had players taking agent money...do we assume that Cal's teams must have a dozens more undiscovered infractions because he's been caught a few times?

Now I am defending Cal, which I know, Roy, you didn't want to make me do. I guess with the Lance Thomas Bling-gate still simmering, I am not quick to point the finger. People hate Cal, the same way they hate K, so I have to assume if there's dirt to be dug up, it will be. Only time will tell. If his recruiting success is all do to cheating, no one will be happier than me. Until that day, I have to give him credit while maintaining that I don't think Duke should attempt the same approach (nor am I delusional to think Duke could if it wanted to, you have to stay in your lane after all).

[Kedsy]

People hate Cal, the same way they hate K, so I have to assume if there's dirt to be dug up, it will be. Only time will tell. If his recruiting success is all do to cheating, no one will be happier than me.

I have no idea whether Cal cheats or not, but I do know that the stories of him cheating go all the way back to his UMass days. I have several friends who are big Temple fans and they accused him of a lot of bad stuff way back before Camby. So the dislike for Cal isn't just because he's been successful. There has been an awful lot of smoke.

[Faison1]

Is there a chance any of the following affected his decision:

1. Amile Jefferson looks like he is going to be good at PF next year

2. We have quite a few PF's on the squad next year

3. We still can't quite seem to get over the hump of landing a top-5 PF....since Shelden Williams

[SupaDave]

Somebody here wanted to know earlier if there would ever be a way for our staff to find out why Randle cooled on Duke. Well, this might be that window. I am sure, like many of us, Coach K and his crew are perfectionists and would like to know if there is anything that could have been done differently, something that may have went wrong along the way.

My suspicions, however, are just that Randle wanted the "hip hop" treatment from Cal and the theatrical production he is running in Lexington. And if that turns out to be the case, so be it. I am not phased by it. If these kids need Rick Ross to tuck them in at night in order to make them feel good about themselves and their abilities, then they are not the type of players we need here. Not saying this is the case -- we might have just been straight beat out for him -- but it wouldn't surprise me.

Hip hop treatment? Please expound cause Cal is FAR from hip hop... Blame anything I guess.

[mo.st.dukie]

Bill Self has had two one-and-done in 9 years** at Kansas (X.Henry and J.Selby). And Selby got some bad advice, he was injured and not even close to a traditional one-and-done player. If anything, one-and-done players have been put off by that track record. Read a KU board sometime, Self has whiffed on almost every high-level recruit he's gone after in the last 3 years. Perry Ellis was his first McDAA in over 2 years, and he grew up in Kansas. The results on the court have been outstanding, but for those that follow recruiting closely, it's a bit mind-boggling that he can't close a Top 10 recruit. KU has had a player picked in the lottery every year since 2009, and 12 Self KU players are currently on NBA rosters.

**K has had two in two years.

***K has had four in 32 years.

[MartyClark]

Hip hop treatment? Please expound cause Cal is FAR from hip hop... Blame anything I guess.

SupaDave-

I, of course, don't know the guy but agree with you. He' s not hip hop but does a really good job of appearing hip and connected with the young guys who are hip hop. At what point does he become the creepy old guy, pretending to be hip, but just making kids uncomfortable?

[Cameron]

I don't know. I strongly doubt any "elite scorer" thinks of himself as Taylor King. Especially top 10 recruits like Randle.

While Julius Randle and Taylor King aren't very comparable when set side by side -- Randle is more than likely a one-and-done while King was obviously not -- King was at various points during his high school career considered to be the best player in his whole class. I've read enough of your posts to know that you are not one of these people, but I think many forget just how special of a talent Taylor was as a prep. The kid verbaled to UCLA in the eighth grade. En route to concluding his career at Mater Dei as one of the top five leading scorers in California schoolboy history, King became a McDonald's All-American and signed with Duke. That's the curriculum vitae of an elite scorer.

Now, in fairness to what you were saying, I agree that by the end of his prep career nobody any longer viewed King as a top ten or even top 15 prospect. But he was certainly still a vaunted threat with the ball in his hands because of his outstanding long-range shooting, one of the absolute best in that 2008 class. Things just turned out differently than I assume Taylor would have hoped.


I'd be very surprised if K's reputation for insisting on defense is why we miss on some of these guys.

In all honesty, I would be too. It was just a theory. Probably not one with a lot of weight, but not completely out of the realm of possibility. Andre's case, in particular (although highly complicated due to the events of his freshman year), might scare some top prospects who are noted scorers but maybe at a disadvantaged defensively due to whatever reason (speed, size, etc.) Again, just a thought.

[Cameron]

SupaDave-

I, of course, don't know the guy but agree with you. He' s not hip hop but does a really good job of appearing hip and connected with the young guys who are hip hop. At what point does he become the creepy old guy, pretending to be hip, but just making kids uncomfortable?

This is kind of what I was getting at, SupaDave. The "I know Jeezy" line is really getting tiring.

Simply put, I just don't care for the way Calipari does things. It's a charade. But is it genius, as another poster suggested earlier in this thread? Yeah, it seems so, because Kentucky is raking in the blue chips. So, as long as Cal is operating under the scope of the rules, props to him.

[Kedsy]

While Julius Randle and Taylor King aren't very comparable when set side by side -- Randle is more than likely a one-and-done while King was obviously not -- King was at various points during his high school career considered to be the best player in his whole class.

I guess I wasn't clear. My point had nothing to do with how good Taylor King was (or wasn't). I was talking about perception and self-perception. There's not a prospect today (outside of perhaps Taylor King's family or kids going to the same high school) who would compare themselves to Taylor King, or think that in a million years whatever happened to Taylor King is relevant to them. Frankly, I expect it's the same for Andre Dawkins. The good prospects all think they're going to be stars -- that confidence is part of what makes them good players -- they're not looking at bench players and saying "that could happen to me." The only exception, possibly, would be if someone couldn't get off the bench at Duke but then became an NBA star, but really has that ever happened?

[slower]

Hip hop treatment? Please expound cause Cal is FAR from hip hop... Blame anything I guess.

Yeah, but don't act like that's some ludicrous statement to make. It's only SI's top CBB story:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/rob_dauster/10/02/John-Calipari-Jay-Z-recruiting/index.html?sct=cb_t11_a0

[Kedsy]

Is there a chance any of the following affected his decision:

1. Amile Jefferson looks like he is going to be good at PF next year

2. We have quite a few PF's on the squad next year

3. We still can't quite seem to get over the hump of landing a top-5 PF....since Shelden Williams

Personally, I'd be shocked if anything like that affected Randle's decision. He knows he's going to start and play big minutes no matter where he goes. According to that article, K said Randle would be the star of the class. There's little chance Randle would see Amile Jefferson as direct competition for minutes.

[SupaDave]

Yeah, but don't act like that's some ludicrous statement to make. It's only SI's top CBB story:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/rob_dauster/10/02/John-Calipari-Jay-Z-recruiting/index.html?sct=cb_t11_a0

So forget Worldwide Wes hunh? Blame anything I guess...

Hood is a HUGE Big Krit fan. He came to Duke. Most of you have no idea who that is - neither does Coach K. Hood still came to Duke.

[Cameron]

I guess I wasn't clear. My point had nothing to do with how good Taylor King was (or wasn't). I was talking about perception and self-perception. There's not a prospect today (outside of perhaps Taylor King's family or kids going to the same high school) who would compare themselves to Taylor King, or think that in a million years whatever happened to Taylor King is relevant to them. Frankly, I expect it's the same for Andre Dawkins. The good prospects all think they're going to be stars -- that confidence is part of what makes them good players -- they're not looking at bench players and saying "that could happen to me."

That makes sense and I think I would tend to agree with you. As I've stated several times, the thoughts expressed in my original post merely constituted a suggestion.


The only exception, possibly, would be if someone couldn't get off the bench at Duke but then became an NBA star, but really has that ever happened?

Admittedly, I cannot think of a case and it would seem unlikely for that to happen.

[slower]

So forget Worldwide Wes hunh? Blame anything I guess...

Hood is a HUGE Big Krit fan. He came to Duke. Most of you have no idea who that is - neither does Coach K. Hood still came to Duke.

No, don't forget WWW, but don't dismiss Cameron's point out of hand. If it is the top story on SI's CBB section, then obviously SOMEBODY who knows CBB thinks there's something to it.

Yeah, Hood came to Duke. He's one guy. That doesn't automatically nullify the point of Cameron's statement or the SI article. UK has a different vibe than Duke. It is what it is.

And of course it's more than just Drake and Jay-Z (and Worldwide Wes - who is the probably the most important name in this whole equation), but it DOES mean something to these guys.

[wilko]

Lotta chatter about a guy who isnt coming here...

Good for him he knows what he wants. Good luck until he plays us is all I can say.

I LIKE that he cut us early. We now have time to regroup and get involved on another guy, as opposed to coming up short and having our hearts broken at the 11th hour. If he doesn't wanna be here fine, at least UNC isn't getting him either. I can live with that!

Lotta angst over KY.
Look at what the NCAA is doing right now. They are AFRAID to mess up the cash flow. It seems like a lot of the comments here should be under a thread entitled "Everybody else is cheating and getting away with it; shouldnt we?"

This has become less about Randle and more about the state of college athletics.
College athletics has become a real turn-off quite frankly.

[plimnko]

Lotta chatter about a guy who isnt coming here...

Good for him he knows what he wants. Good luck until he plays us is all I can say.

I LIKE that he cut us early. We now have time to regroup and get involved on another guy, as opposed to coming up short and having our hearts broken at the 11th hour. If he doesn't wanna be here fine, at least UNC isn't getting him either. I can live with that!

Lotta angst over KY.
Look at what the NCAA is doing right now. They are AFRAID to mess up the cash flow. It seems like a lot of the comments here should be under a thread entitled "Everybody else is cheating and getting away with it; shouldnt we?"

This has become less about Randle and more about the state of college athletics.
College athletics has become a real turn-off quite frankly.

SUCKS!!! How "pro like" college athletics has become. Aca what??? What's next.....paid little leaguers?

[MCFinARL]

Lotta chatter about a guy who isnt coming here...

Good for him he knows what he wants. Good luck until he plays us is all I can say.

I LIKE that he cut us early. We now have time to regroup and get involved on another guy, as opposed to coming up short and having our hearts broken at the 11th hour. If he doesn't wanna be here fine, at least UNC isn't getting him either. I can live with that!

Lotta angst over KY.
Look at what the NCAA is doing right now. They are AFRAID to mess up the cash flow. It seems like a lot of the comments here should be under a thread entitled "Everybody else is cheating and getting away with it; shouldnt we?"

This has become less about Randle and more about the state of college athletics.
College athletics has become a real turn-off quite frankly.

I so agree with this--last year, for whatever reasons, some recruits kept Duke on their lists to the bitter end, long after many people had concluded they were almost certainly going elsewhere. Possibly part of this has to do with the difficulty of saying no to Coach K, whom most recruits respect highly and describe as someone they really enjoy talking to. But if you know Duke isn't the right place for you, cutting it from your list shows more respect for Coach K and the program than leaving it on if you are not really considering it any more. Julius Randle is a very exciting player I would have loved to see in a Duke uniform, but if it's not for him, that's fine, good luck to him wherever he goes (except if his team is playing Duke).

[Billy Dat]

Lotta angst over KY.
Look at what the NCAA is doing right now. They are AFRAID to mess up the cash flow. It seems like a lot of the comments here should be under a thread entitled "Everybody else is cheating and getting away with it; shouldnt we?"


I am mostly interested in the way recruiting techniques evolve over time. I like the way Duke does it and wouldn't want it to change. It will have to change when K steps down because K won't be the closer anymore, but I think the Duke pitch will always center on a combination of developing players for the pros (NBA or elsewhere), a great academic institution, an amazing basketball program and school-wide alumni network, and being part of something bigger than yourself. But, I do appreciate what Cal has built, if he's done it honestly. If he's cheating, then he cheated and he deserves no credit. But, he's really cracked the code in a new way and I wonder if he'll be able to keep it rolling.

[tommy]

Lotta chatter about a guy who isnt coming here...

Good for him he knows what he wants. Good luck until he plays us is all I can say.

I LIKE that he cut us early. We now have time to regroup and get involved on another guy, as opposed to coming up short and having our hearts broken at the 11th hour.

Early? We've been recruiting this guy hard for about a year and a half, and we've been on his short list (later expanded to less short) the whole time. Until very recently, he was planning to announce in the fall. That's like, now. Then he pushed it back to the spring, but still, we have put in a ton of resources and a ton of time into recruiting this guy, and it's a big blow.

As far as getting involved with another guy, we're pretty much down to Nichols and Parker. Marcus Lee, our backup plan on the bigs, eliminated us a few weeks ago. Not sure who else of quality you think we can get in on at this late date.

[wilko]

Early? We've been recruiting this guy hard for about a year and a half, and we've been on his short list (later expanded to less short) the whole time. Until very recently, he was planning to announce in the fall. That's like, now. Then he pushed it back to the spring, but still, we have put in a ton of resources and a ton of time into recruiting this guy, and it's a big blow.

As far as getting involved with another guy, we're pretty much down to Nichols and Parker. Marcus Lee, our backup plan on the bigs, eliminated us a few weeks ago. Not sure who else of quality you think we can get in on at this late date.

It is a blow. I wont deny that. Buts its not a heartbreaking embarrassment of a guy skyping his announcement either. Nor is it finishing as a runner up to a U of M. I get OH SO tired of the drama and disappointment around those types of things.

I'm not a recruiting guru so I wont pretend to be trying to rattle off guys names. I'm sure the staff is in tune with current commitments and guys that may be soft on their current school selections (Hi Seth, Hi Austin) We got late momentum with Jefferson and secured his services.

I find it refreshing that Semi knew what he wanted and pulled the trigger. I'd rather see dudes LIKE THAT than a punch in the gut over a 1 and done guy. I no longer have any stomach for drama. I'm sorry we didn't get Randle - but you never know who may be fired that will change a circumstance and cause him to revisit his school selections.

It seems the best way to curtail KY's recruiting is to pull the plug on the 1 and done rule.
Just let em go..

[mdj]

So forget Worldwide Wes hunh? Blame anything I guess...

Hood is a HUGE Big Krit fan. He came to Duke. Most of you have no idea who that is - neither does Coach K. Hood still came to Duke.

i dont think the point was that no fan of (insert random rapper's name here) would come to Duke but when Cal arranged fro his players to meet Jay Z he did it for a reason. To think this has no effect on a kids decision doesn't make sense. It may not be the overriding factor but it has to have some influence. When I was deciding on schools if I knew that Dave Matthews or whoever liked to hang out with the BME majors it might have had some effect on my decision.

[Cameron]

I agree with many of the posters above in reference to SupaDave's comments in his "WWW" post. Really, I think this is just a case of SupaDave misinterpreting my original post as anything more than just a way to sneak in a shot at the ridiculous land of make-believe that Cal has created in Lexington in trying to promote himself as some sort of player in the rap game. Cal's shoutout to Jay-Z about "bailing him out" from the law is all you need to know. The guy has put a serious investment into building connections with people in the hip-hop world and, essentially, using that as an additional -- and major, I might argue --branding tool to lure in impressionable young ballers who have grown up idolizing that culture. And it is working brilliantly for him.

Look, I am sure Iceberg Slim also has some other very effective -- or very shady, depending on how you perceive things -- approaches to recruiting, but there is no doubt that the "Come here if you want Waka Flocka Flame to come watch you play and then let you hold his chains in the lockeroom afterwards" technique is having an appreciable effect.

[superdave]

I LIKE that he cut us early. We now have time to regroup and get involved on another guy, as opposed to coming up short and having our hearts broken at the 11th hour.

I agree with this. I want to get Austin Nichols. The coaches have made him the priority, and that's enough for me. But we also have time to look for a plan b. There's plenty of uncommitted 4/5 guys on here for class of 2013. Anyone know of any targets we could be reaching out to this fall?
http://www.rscihoops.com/

[Greg_Newton]

Hood is a HUGE Big Krit fan. He came to Duke. Most of you have no idea who that is - neither does Coach K. Hood still came to Duke.

This strikes me as a complete non-sequitur and an apparent excuse to show off personal knowledge about one of our players. :confused:

Like... "James McAdoo is a fan of Kobe and Lebron. However, he went to UNC, whose coach has never coached the Olympics. Therefore, coaching the Olympics does not factor into Coach K's recruiting." Not even a remotely logical argument.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

This is starting to look pretty clear to me. Kentucky will likely have Wiltjer and Noel in '13, maybe Poythress, and has now received verbals from the Harrison twins.

Randle is said to be a one and done, no doubt.

Wouldn't you want to play there your one year?

His decision is not a diss to Duke, or coach K, or Roy and UNC for that matter. It's about him and what he thinks will be good for his career.

I'll be shocked if I'm wrong and it's not UK, and look forward to seeing his game after all the hype.

[Kedsy]

This is starting to look pretty clear to me. Kentucky will likely have Wiltjer and Noel in '13, maybe Poythress, and has now received verbals from the Harrison twins.

Why do you think Noel will still be there in '13-'14?

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Why do you think Noel will still be there in '13-'14?

It's a guess, for sure. I've never seen him play, but what I read is he's mainly a shot blocker and still pretty raw offensively. Also I see he's only still about 215lbs at 6'11".

Just seems like he's the kind of kid that will need two years at least, but granted it's all a guess theses days.

[-jk]

I think it's time to close this one down and take the discussion to other recruiting threads.

It's wandering far from a Randle discussion.

-jk