PDA

View Full Version : ESPN attempts to rank top 500 NBA players



superdave
11-28-2011, 12:41 PM
I thought this was pretty cool, and a good way to start discussing the NBA again considering the he said she said lockout was atrocious and the free agents are not that exciting (Nene! Kris Humphries!). Needless to say I'll have some opinions on this. (5 players better than Durant!?)

Here's the link to #1 (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7116977/nba-player-rankings-1). I'll list the top 25, along with other notables:

1. LeBron
2. Dwight Howard
3. Wade
4. Paul
5. Dirk
6. Kevin Durant
7. Kobe
8. Derrick Rose
9. Deron williams
10. Blake Griffin
11. Pau Gasol
12. Carmelo
13. Stoudemire
14. Nash
15.Russell Westbrook
16. Kevin Love
17. Rajon Rondo
18. Manu
19. Duncan
20. Zach Randolph
21. Pierce
22. Garnett
23. LaMarcus Aldridge
24. Chris Bosh
25. Al Horford

Guys who can move up:
29. Joakim Noah
36. Danny Granger
38. Steph Curry
39. Eric Gordon
40. John Wall
51. Brook Lopez
52. Al Jefferson
56. Serge Ibaka
58. James Harden
64. Tywan Lawson
70. Nicholas Batum
82. DeMarcus Cousins
83. Jrue Holiday
99. Javale McGee
103. Taj Gibson
109. Mike Beasley
114. DeAndre Jordan
132. Greg Monroe
138. Derrick Favors
140. Kyrie
156. Omer Asik
157. Eric Maynor
171. Evan Turner
184. Greg Oden (23 years young)
187. Jeff Teague
194. Eric Bledsoe

Guys who might be over-rated:
26. Marc Gasol
32. Joe Johnson
41. Monta Ellis
59. Brandon Roy's knees
65. Mike Conley
97. Metta World Peace (I really just wanted to type that out)

Duke guys:
46. Deng
50. Boozer
62. Brand
67. Grant
98. Battier
140. Kyrie
141. Dunleavy
143. Redick
145. Kris Humphries (jk you guys!)
162. Maggette

Super "I stopped at 200. Gotta go to work." Dave

sagegrouse
11-28-2011, 12:54 PM
type that out)

Duke guys:
46. Deng
50. Boozer
62. Brand
67. Grant
98. Battier
140. Kyrie
141. Dunleavy
143. Redick
145. Kris Humphries (jk you guys!)
162. Maggette

Super "I stopped at 200. Gotta go to work." Dave

Applying higher math, it looks like Duke has about 5 percent of the top 200. (5.6 % = 9/162; 4.5% = 9/200).

sage

OldPhiKap
11-28-2011, 01:06 PM
Somehow, I thought Jimi Hendrix would be the top of this list. He seems to lead all "Top 500" lists these days.

Hard to see how Kyrie is #140 given that he has never played a pro game and only played a handful of college games. But SI needs to sell magazines, so . . . .

juise
11-28-2011, 01:12 PM
But SI needs to sell magazines, so . . . .

I'll be interested to see how SI uses ESPN's list to sell magazines. :)

OldPhiKap
11-28-2011, 01:17 PM
I'll be interested to see how SI uses ESPN's list to sell magazines. :)

You mean I've been watching ESPN, waiting for the swimsuit edition, for nothing?!?

There goes a year of my life I'll never get back.

superdave
11-28-2011, 01:33 PM
1. LeBron
2. Dwight Howard
3. Wade
4. Paul
5. Dirk
6. Kevin Durant
7. Kobe
8. Derrick Rose
9. Deron williams
10. Blake Griffin
11. Pau Gasol
12. Carmelo
13. Stoudemire
14. Nash
15.Russell Westbrook
16. Kevin Love
17. Rajon Rondo
18. Manu
19. Duncan
20. Zach Randolph
21. Pierce
22. Garnett
23. LaMarcus Aldridge
24. Chris Bosh
25. Al Horford


It's really hard to argue the top 2 picks, but it gets dicey after that. I'd move Durant up to #3 - he's better than Dwyane Wade at this point. Wade has some mileage. I'd move Dirk up to #4 even though I expect this to be his last top 5 year (33 years old, 1,000 career games), Wade to #5 and Rose up to #6 and Paul down to #7. Paul has some looming knee issues that could him this season or next season or just simply cut his career short by a few seasons. That's too big an uncertainty to rank him ahead of Rose.

It will be interesting to see if some of the younger guys in the top 25 - namely Westbrook, Love, Rondo, LaMarcus, Horford - ever make a 1st team All-NBA. Westbrook was 2nd and Aldridge was 3rd last year. It will be hard to take a forward spot away from James and Durant, but Blake Griffin will get in there a few times. Love and Aldridge could get classified as centers, but wont be leaping past Dwight Howard anytime soon (about to turn 26).

superdave
11-28-2011, 01:40 PM
6. Kevin Durant
15. Russell Westbrook
56. Serge Ibaka
58. James Harden
157. Eric Maynor


Plus
95. Kendrick Perkins
115. Nick Collison
134. Thabo Sefolosha

I expect Harden and Ibaka to both make significant jumps in the next few years, like into the 25-35 range. If Perk and Collison can stay healthy, and Westbrook can channel his inner Chris Paul, the Thunder can win some titles. There's some discussion of Battier signing here. Or Grant Hill could be a great addition as well.

ChillinDuke
11-28-2011, 03:09 PM
Are there even 500 active players in the NBA at any one time?

Aren't squads 12 deep? And 30 teams? 12x30 = 360 players.

Even with 15 per team that's 450 players.

How the heck did they find 500 players? They do know Herb Williams retired, don't they? :D

- Chillin

NSDukeFan
11-28-2011, 03:26 PM
Are there even 500 active players in the NBA at any one time?

Aren't squads 12 deep? And 30 teams? 12x30 = 360 players.

Even with 15 per team that's 450 players.

How the heck did they find 500 players? They do know Herb Williams retired, don't they? :D

- Chillin

Herb Williams was ranked 47 places after Robert Parish, whose shot still can't be blocked, though he doesn't get up and down the floor quite as quickly since his 50th birthday.

devildeac
11-28-2011, 03:35 PM
I thought this was pretty cool, and a good way to start discussing the NBA again considering the he said she said lockout was atrocious and the free agents are not that exciting (Nene! Kris Humphries!). Needless to say I'll have some opinions on this. (5 players better than Durant!?)

Here's the link to #1 (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7116977/nba-player-rankings-1). I'll list the top 25, along with other notables:

1. LeBron
2. Dwight Howard
3. Wade
4. Paul
5. Dirk
6. Kevin Durant
7. Kobe
8. Derrick Rose
9. Deron williams
10. Blake Griffin
11. Pau Gasol
12. Carmelo
13. Stoudemire
14. Nash
15.Russell Westbrook
16. Kevin Love
17. Rajon Rondo
18. Manu
19. Duncan
20. Zach Randolph
21. Pierce
22. Garnett
23. LaMarcus Aldridge
24. Chris Bosh
25. Al Horford

Guys who can move up:
29. Joakim Noah
36. Danny Granger
38. Steph Curry
39. Eric Gordon
40. John Wall
51. Brook Lopez
52. Al Jefferson
56. Serge Ibaka
58. James Harden
64. Tywan Lawson
70. Nicholas Batum
82. DeMarcus Cousins
83. Jrue Holiday
99. Javale McGee
103. Taj Gibson
109. Mike Beasley
114. DeAndre Jordan
132. Greg Monroe
138. Derrick Favors
140. Kyrie
156. Omer Asik
157. Eric Maynor
171. Evan Turner
184. Greg Oden (23 years young)
187. Jeff Teague
194. Eric Bledsoe

Guys who might be over-rated:
26. Marc Gasol
32. Joe Johnson
41. Monta Ellis
59. Brandon Roy's knees
65. Mike Conley
97. Metta World Peace (I really just wanted to type that out)

Duke guys:
46. Deng
50. Boozer
62. Brand
67. Grant
98. Battier
140. Kyrie
141. Dunleavy
143. Redick
145. Kris Humphries (jk you guys!)
162. Maggette

Super "I stopped at 200. Gotta go to work." Dave

I think you need to include these guys in with the "Duke" players, too:

F/C 4 Boozer, Carlos 26 - November 20, 1981 6 ft 9 in (2.06 m) Utah Jazz United States
PG 5 Kidd, Jason (C) 35 - March 23, 1973 6 ft 4 in (1.93 m) Dallas Mavericks United States
SF 6 James, LeBron 23 - December 30, 1984 6 ft 8 in (2.03 m) Cleveland Cavaliers United States
PG 7 Williams, Deron 24 - March 24, 1984 6 ft 3 in (1.91 m) Utah Jazz United States
SG 8 Redd, Michael 28 - August 24, 1979 6 ft 6 in (1.98 m) Milwaukee Bucks United States
SG 9 Wade, Dwyane 26 - January 17, 1982 6 ft 4 in (1.93 m) Miami Heat United States
SG 10 Bryant, Kobe (C) 29 - August 23, 1978 6 ft 6 in (1.98 m) Los Angeles Lakers United States
F/C 11 Howard, Dwight 22 - December 8, 1985 6 ft 11 in (2.11 m) Orlando Magic United States
F/C 12 Bosh, Chris 24 - March 24, 1984 6 ft 10 in (2.08 m) Toronto Raptors Canada
PG 13 Paul, Chris 23 - May 6, 1985 6 ft 0 in (1.83 m) New Orleans Hornets United States
SF 14 Prince, Tayshaun 28 - February 28, 1980 6 ft 8 in (2.03 m) Detroit Pistons United States
SF 15 Anthony, Carmelo 24 - May 29, 1984 6 ft 8 in (2.03 m) Denver Nuggets United States

;)

nmduke2001
11-28-2011, 03:49 PM
I thought this was pretty cool, and a good way to start discussing the NBA again considering the he said she said lockout was atrocious and the free agents are not that exciting (Nene! Kris Humphries!). Needless to say I'll have some opinions on this. (5 players better than Durant!?)

Here's the link to #1 (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7116977/nba-player-rankings-1). I'll list the top 25, along with other notables:

1. LeBron
2. Dwight Howard
3. Wade
4. Paul
5. Dirk
6. Kevin Durant
7. Kobe
8. Derrick Rose
9. Deron williams
10. Blake Griffin
11. Pau Gasol
12. Carmelo
13. Stoudemire
14. Nash
15.Russell Westbrook
16. Kevin Love
17. Rajon Rondo
18. Manu
19. Duncan
20. Zach Randolph
21. Pierce
22. Garnett
23. LaMarcus Aldridge
24. Chris Bosh
25. Al Horford

Guys who can move up:
29. Joakim Noah
36. Danny Granger
38. Steph Curry
39. Eric Gordon
40. John Wall
51. Brook Lopez
52. Al Jefferson
56. Serge Ibaka
58. James Harden
64. Tywan Lawson
70. Nicholas Batum
82. DeMarcus Cousins
83. Jrue Holiday
99. Javale McGee
103. Taj Gibson
109. Mike Beasley
114. DeAndre Jordan
132. Greg Monroe
138. Derrick Favors
140. Kyrie
156. Omer Asik
157. Eric Maynor
171. Evan Turner
184. Greg Oden (23 years young)
187. Jeff Teague
194. Eric Bledsoe

Guys who might be over-rated:
26. Marc Gasol
32. Joe Johnson
41. Monta Ellis
59. Brandon Roy's knees
65. Mike Conley
97. Metta World Peace (I really just wanted to type that out)

Duke guys:
46. Deng
50. Boozer
62. Brand
67. Grant
98. Battier
140. Kyrie
141. Dunleavy
143. Redick
145. Kris Humphries (jk you guys!)
162. Maggette

Super "I stopped at 200. Gotta go to work." Dave

This list clearly illustrates why the NBA needs to contract several teams. Hypothetically, if every player was available in a draft, Rondo, Noah, Bosh and Manu would be the first players chosen for 4 teams. There is no way those guys should be the best player on any team. Guys like Eric Gordon and Al Jefferson become number 2 guys on teams. Not good.

BTW, Durant would be my first pick.

superdave
11-28-2011, 04:33 PM
This list clearly illustrates why the NBA needs to contract several teams. Hypothetically, if every player was available in a draft, Rondo, Noah, Bosh and Manu would be the first players chosen for 4 teams. There is no way those guys should be the best player on any team. Guys like Eric Gordon and Al Jefferson become number 2 guys on teams. Not good.

BTW, Durant would be my first pick.

Back in the 1980s, there were 23-24 teams. Look at the final standings from 1985 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984%E2%80%9385_NBA_season) to see how small the league feels in retrospect. The Lakers top players that year were Magic, 39-year old Kareem, Worthy, Cooper, Rambis, Byron Scott. The Celtics roster that year featured Bird, McHale, Parish, Ainge, Maxell and Dennis Johnson. You'd have to combine two pretty good teams these days to amass that much talent.

The NBA added Charlotte and Miami in 1988, Minnesota and Orlando in 1989, and Vancouver and Toronto in 1995. New Orleans appears to be in a lot of financial trouble as do Charlotte and Sacramento. Perhaps 26 teams would work better for quality of play. I'd argue that a beefed up NBDL would also work wonders for quality of play, but it probably wont work without necessary resources.

A good way to make the DL work would be to split it up into a Vegas pre-season where teams play against the incoming rookie and 2nd-year players, then have a 40 game NYC-based season to cut down on travel expenses. You could even go barn-storming with DL guys to places like Raleigh, Austin and do a big week-long tournament and All-star event in LA. I'm not sure an NBA minor league works well, but if you got creative and had them tour vs. foreign teams, Calipari led teams and the Vegas pre-season teams, it could be interesting.

phaedrus
11-28-2011, 05:14 PM
This list clearly illustrates why the NBA needs to contract several teams. Hypothetically, if every player was available in a draft, Rondo, Noah, Bosh and Manu would be the first players chosen for 4 teams. There is no way those guys should be the best player on any team. Guys like Eric Gordon and Al Jefferson become number 2 guys on teams. Not good.

BTW, Durant would be my first pick.

But arguably, Manu was the best player on a championship team (2007) and Rondo on a team that was one game from a championship (2010).

nmduke2001
11-28-2011, 08:27 PM
But arguably, Manu was the best player on a championship team (2007) and Rondo on a team that was one game from a championship (2010).

2007 is a long time ago in NBA years. In my opinion, Rondo needs good talent around him to be good himself. He could never be THE man on a team.

CrazieDUMB
11-28-2011, 08:35 PM
Duke guys:
46. Deng
50. Boozer
62. Brand
67. Grant
98. Battier


I just don't see how Duke can get around the perception that all they do is churn out 3s, 4s, and 5s. When are we finally going to recruit a good point or someone that can hit a three?

superdave
11-28-2011, 08:41 PM
I just don't see how Duke can get around the perception that all they do is churn out 3s, 4s, and 5s. When are we finally going to recruit a good point or someone that can hit a three?

Wellllllllll, this group committed in 2003, 1999, 1997, 1990, and 1997 respectively. That's four guys from last century. Recruiting news has a half-life of 15 minutes.

duke96
11-28-2011, 08:49 PM
Somehow, I thought Jimi Hendrix would be the top of this list. He seems to lead all "Top 500" lists these days.

Hard to see how Kyrie is #140 given that he has never played a pro game and only played a handful of college games. But SI needs to sell magazines, so . . . .

Having to speculate based on little info .... I'd guess that ranking is way too far down the list! I guess we'll see soon enough.

superdave
11-28-2011, 10:17 PM
Having to speculate based on little info .... I'd guess that ranking is way too far down the list! I guess we'll see soon enough.

I'd argue that based on only 8 games at Duke, Kyrie is ranked too high here. Additionally, even if he's ranked appropriately he cannot do it all by his lonesome in Cleveland. That roster consists of role player Varejao, Hickson, Jamison and Boobie Gibson, not mention Baron Davis and his tummy.

He'll move up this list eventually, but it might take 3-4 years. You cant make lemonade out of pooh.

throatybeard
11-28-2011, 10:29 PM
Back in the 1980s, there were 23-24 teams. Look at the final standings from 1985 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984%E2%80%9385_NBA_season) to see how small the league feels in retrospect.

Word. I had forgotten how farcical a 16-team playoff was when the league had 23 teams. Phoenix made the playoffs at 36-46?