Confessions of a football Traitor

[Dopeshop]

for more than 50 years ,I've tried to be a loyal and supportive fan. I've been able to get some distance this year and my mental health is better for it. I feel bad about jumping ship but I just can't invest another foot-pound of energy in the program. Other than graduation rates and nice kids ,I have had nothing to smile about---no bang for the buck,I guess.

I can pin-point two specific instances this year which clinched things for me:

1.End of first half Richmond---10 seconds to play ,no timeouts,inside the UR 20. Duke throws a 4 yard pass.Richmond wins by 2. 100 times out of 100---kick the field goal;

2.4th qtr. Wake---Up by 3,first down inside the Wake 5;Field goal .Wake wins by 1.

Wake ,like Duke is private ,has 4600 students. Duke should at least win its fair share of these games.

oh well, over the last 20 years, we're 1-19 with the heels. Maybe something will happen this week to get me back next year.

[hood7]

It's almost enough to make a Duke fan humble.

[uh_no]

1.End of first half Richmond---10 seconds to play ,no timeouts,inside the UR 20. Duke throws a 4 yard pass.Richmond wins by 2. 100 times out of 100---kick the field goal;


Disagree. 100 times out of 100 take a shot at the END ZONE then kick the field goal (a short pass is the wrong call either way). Cut was ripped to shreds in the WF(?) game when there was 8 seconds left in the first half and we were inside the 10 and kicked the FG instead of taking a shot.

[Bob Green]

Disagree. 100 times out of 100 take a shot at the END ZONE then kick the field goal (a short pass is the wrong call either way). Cut was ripped to shreds in the WF(?) game when there was 8 seconds left in the first half and we were inside the 10 and kicked the FG instead of taking a shot.

Yes, but in the spirit of full disclosure, it is important to note Wake Forest had a 17-0 lead at the time of the decision. In the Richmond game, a made field goal would have resulted in the game being tied 10-10 at the half. The two situations are different.

[uh_no]

Yes, but in the spirit of full disclosure, it is important to note Wake Forest had a 17-0 lead at the time of the decision. In the Richmond game, a made field goal would have resulted in the game being tied 10-10 at the half. The two situations are different.

Perhaps, but the expected outcome (in terms of points) in each situation should be about the same. It's a free shot at the end zone if you get someone wide open...if not, throw it away and kick the FG. If you say in the WF game that we had time to take a shot before kicking a fg, then it must also be true for the richmond game, regardless of score. We either had time or we didn't. Being down 17 doesn't make attempting a TD when there's time a wrong play. (given running a play that cost us a shot at the FG IS always the wrong play....as it would have been in the WF game if we had run the ball and the clock had expired)

[Devilsfan]

I have been going to Duke FB games since 2004 and I can say with full confidence that Coach Cut has come in and done a terrific job. We are so close. He deserves not only an extension but a raise. A CLEAN program in today's times is almost unheard of. He is first and foremost a teacher and builds character by example. And No I am Not related to him. Duke is lucky to have Cut at the helm. Look at players he has developed like Hatcher and Daniels. They could play anywhere. We need more of them that's all. That will come. Thanks for coming to Duke Coach Cut. go Devils!

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

I have been going to Duke FB games since 2004 and I can say with full confidence that Coach Cut has come in and done a terrific job. We are so close. He deserves not only an extension but a raise. A CLEAN program in today's times is almost unheard of. He is first and foremost a teacher and builds character by example. And No I am Not related to him. Duke is lucky to have Cut at the helm. Look at players he has developed like Hatcher and Daniels. They could play anywhere. We need more of them that's all. That will come. Thanks for coming to Duke Coach Cut. go Devils!
I'm with you on this one.... and I've been attending Duke football games since 1959.... a mere child then, of course! In terms of player development, look at the Killer V's.... best current tandem in The ACC and headed to best in ACC history. That sort of accomplishment is no fluke. I'd add Cooper Helfelt who's made amazing strides while a part of the team only half his career. With the arrival of Rick Petri, we've seen what an outstanding coach can do with young players.

I'm looking forward to next Saturday and I can't wait for National Signing Day and Spring Practice!

[smvalkyries]

+ I agree completely with Devilfan !

[OldPhiKap]

Not sure why there is really any question about an extension. Cut has done an admirable job trying to raise the Titanic that was Duke football. We are much improved and just need to punch through to the next level.

Let's beat the Heels and then worry about next year next year.

[Acymetric]

Well considering Cut is currently contracted through 2015 I think talk of an extension is a bit premature. See what he does in 2012 and go from there.

[uh_no]

Well considering Cut is currently contracted through 2015 I think talk of an extension is a bit premature. See what he does in 2012 and go from there.

remember what happened at ND.....10 year extension after like 6 games.....not that cut is going to tank or that White was 100% behind that

[DueBlevil]

I agree that Cut should be allowed to stay at least a couple more seasons, without a doubt. I think the 5-win season a couple years ago when we felt we were so close to breaking through actually has worked against him a little because it makes it feel like the past couple years we have been on the downslope, but I don't believe that's actually the case. I'm not going to lie though, there have been moments this season that have really broken my heart and been very disappointing.

I really hope the administration continues to push forward with improvements in the program. The indoor practice facility and other facility upgrades have been great. I hope Wallace Wade is next, but I imagine that it's hard to generate fundraising excitement off a 3-9 or 4-8 (hopefully) season. I won't belabor the WW point as I have in other threads, but I think it would be great to continue to send a message to the fans and future recruits that we are so confident in the future of Duke Football that yes, we are investing in improving and expanding the stadium.

[loldevilz]

I support Cut, but I think there may be a bit too much praise for him by a few on here. The ACC is a very very weak football conference. Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech are good programs, but they aren't ultra-talented clubs.

Virginia has already turned around their program and could end up going to a very good bowl game this year. Wake continues to beat us year in and year out, even though they are not a more attractive school for a football recruit.

Cut obviously has shown that he can field a team that will compete, but he hasn't shown that he can build a team that can win and there is a huge difference between winning and competing. Next year will be the year that we should make the jump. Renfree is a senior, Dez Scott is a senior and most of the team is returning.

The biggest problem I have is that he doesn't seem to put the killer instinct in his players. It seems like often when Duke gets some momentum it is interrupted by stupid mistakes, Boone for Renfree, bad playcalling, ect. GT made two bad turnovers last week and Duke was unable to take advantage where good teams would.

[loran16]

for more than 50 years ,I've tried to be a loyal and supportive fan. I've been able to get some distance this year and my mental health is better for it. I feel bad about jumping ship but I just can't invest another foot-pound of energy in the program. Other than graduation rates and nice kids ,I have had nothing to smile about---no bang for the buck,I guess.

I can pin-point two specific instances this year which clinched things for me:

1.End of first half Richmond---10 seconds to play ,no timeouts,inside the UR 20. Duke throws a 4 yard pass.Richmond wins by 2. 100 times out of 100---kick the field goal;

2.4th qtr. Wake---Up by 3,first down inside the Wake 5;Field goal .Wake wins by 1.

Wake ,like Duke is private ,has 4600 students. Duke should at least win its fair share of these games.

oh well, over the last 20 years, we're 1-19 with the heels. Maybe something will happen this week to get me back next year.

You've been a fan for 50 years and, after enduring multiple winless seasons under multiple coaches, a team that hasn't won less than 3 for 4 years is what knocks you out?

I won't argue Duke Football is painful. But this is not the time to quit with that type of investment you've put in.

[OldPhiKap]

I support Cut, but I think there may be a bit too much praise for him by a few on here. The ACC is a very very weak football conference. Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech are good programs, but they aren't ultra-talented clubs.

Virginia has already turned around their program and could end up going to a very good bowl game this year. Wake continues to beat us year in and year out, even though they are not a more attractive school for a football recruit.

Cut obviously has shown that he can field a team that will compete, but he hasn't shown that he can build a team that can win and there is a huge difference between winning and competing. Next year will be the year that we should make the jump. Renfree is a senior, Dez Scott is a senior and most of the team is returning.

The biggest problem I have is that he doesn't seem to put the killer instinct in his players. It seems like often when Duke gets some momentum it is interrupted by stupid mistakes, Boone for Renfree, bad playcalling, ect. GT made two bad turnovers last week and Duke was unable to take advantage where good teams would.

It is sort of a chicken-egg thing. You get the killer instinct by having experience winning at crunch time. I don't think the problem is coaching, it is having a young team that is not familiar with winning at crunch time. I always liken it to our basketball team, where the players KNOW we are going to win the close game. While that is in part a reflection on K, it is also a by-product of having players that have been there before. It's part of why this year's hoops team may have more of a rollercoaster than usual -- our guards are young and for the most part are still learning that trait.

Our football team can get there. We have gone from doormat to competitive team. I agree that "competitive" is not the ultimate goal, nor is it one that we should simple settle for. But I would submit there are few D-1 football programs who had fallen as low as we had prior to Cut getting here. We were a joke, and no one really gave a flip. And football takes much more time to build up than basketball. One hoops stud can turn a program around -- instantly. Football, you need to be three deep at every position in order to really compete. We are light years ahead of where we were when Cut got here on that point, and they are much better conditioned.

We can all point to things that we would do differently. I am a bit baffled by the tendency to pull Sean when we get to the red zone as well. But I am not in practice and do not have the depth of football knowledge that Cut and his staff have. Again, I go back to basketball -- in K's early years when we were getting pasted night in and night out, many said he should go away from the strict man-to-man and play some zone or box-1/triangle-2 (like Jimmy V was doing). And you know what? We probably would have won some more games than we did. But K had a philosophy and he was committed to it. Whether the Connette/Boone packages are part of that, or just stubborness in the face of current results, I do not know. But I DO know that the staff gives a lot more thought to it than I do.

I don't see the benefit of a "wait-and-see" approach to Cut. We should show that we are committed to him and his approach. At least, I am. And even those who are on the fence -- who do you realistically expect to bring in if Duke acts like Cut isn't good enough for us? Really?!?

I'm on the bus and staying. If we get a few more years down the road and are still struggling to get to .500, that may be a different story. But the progress I see on the field is steadier than it has been since I was in school and Spurrier was coach. And, even then, he bolted as soon as he got a better job offer.

I'm with Cut. I hope the administration shows the same.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

I don't see the benefit of a "wait-and-see" approach to Cut. We should show that we are committed to him and his approach. At least, I am. And even those who are on the fence -- who do you realistically expect to bring in if Duke acts like Cut isn't good enough for us? Really?!?

I'm on the bus and staying. If we get a few more years down the road and are still struggling to get to .500, that may be a different story. But the progress I see on the field is steadier than it has been since I was in school and Spurrier was coach. And, even then, he bolted as soon as he got a better job offer.

I'm with Cut. I hope the administration shows the same.
For those who are wondering about the bus, we've got a new bus now. It's not that old '52 International activity bus we had for years. The new one's actually a fine motor coach... AC, luxury seats, big windows and greatly increased seating capacity.:cool:

[CameronBornAndBred]

Don't give up. As others have said, as frustrating as we have been to watch at times, it's still a better day in Durham than it was 4 years ago. We've had this discussion at our tailgates, including yesterday's. All of us under our tents have been fans for years, we were all sitting there when Wade was crowded and on days when any seat in the house was yours for the choosing. The program IS improving. The school has finally given support to what goes on the field, it needs yours as well. We've learned that gameday is what you make of it, and that win or lose we are going to show up and have fun. Sure, we have MORE fun when we win, but regardless we go home knowing that our energy was well spent. And you know what? The players see this, and need to see it. They do take notice of what happens outside the stadium, both before and after the game. We always stay for a few hours after the game as well, and just as the players appreciate our support when they walk in during the Devil's Walk, they also appreciate it when they head back to their dorms. Our case is extreme, I would never ask most people to do what we do, but the thought that now you have decided to bail is hard to comprehend, and disheartening.
Yesterday, as we were winding down, Jordan DeWalt-Ondijo and Issac Blakeney came by with another player whom I didn't catch the name of, and Ozzie told them about how we will always be there cheering for them. They said that they see what we (and others) do, and how much they appreciate it..and how much they do notice it.
On a quick side note, for those wondering why Blakeney was there since he was suspended from school this season. He is from Monroe, NC, so that's obviously close enough to check out a game. I didn't ask why he was there for the game, but he was there with the other players because they didn't believe there was a painting of him, and he brought them by to prove it..lol. According to Cut's press release about him, he said he was welcome back in January, so the fact that he was there with other players yesterday is a good sign. Here's a pic of his dad, Michael Wright, standing next to his painting last year at the Miami game.

2140

[ChillinDuke]

It is sort of a chicken-egg thing. You get the killer instinct by having experience winning at crunch time. I don't think the problem is coaching, it is having a young team that is not familiar with winning at crunch time. I always liken it to our basketball team, where the players KNOW we are going to win the close game. While that is in part a reflection on K, it is also a by-product of having players that have been there before. It's part of why this year's hoops team may have more of a rollercoaster than usual -- our guards are young and for the most part are still learning that trait.

Our football team can get there. We have gone from doormat to competitive team. I agree that "competitive" is not the ultimate goal, nor is it one that we should simple settle for. But I would submit there are few D-1 football programs who had fallen as low as we had prior to Cut getting here. We were a joke, and no one really gave a flip. And football takes much more time to build up than basketball. One hoops stud can turn a program around -- instantly. Football, you need to be three deep at every position in order to really compete. We are light years ahead of where we were when Cut got here on that point, and they are much better conditioned.

We can all point to things that we would do differently. I am a bit baffled by the tendency to pull Sean when we get to the red zone as well. But I am not in practice and do not have the depth of football knowledge that Cut and his staff have. Again, I go back to basketball -- in K's early years when we were getting pasted night in and night out, many said he should go away from the strict man-to-man and play some zone or box-1/triangle-2 (like Jimmy V was doing). And you know what? We probably would have won some more games than we did. But K had a philosophy and he was committed to it. Whether the Connette/Boone packages are part of that, or just stubborness in the face of current results, I do not know. But I DO know that the staff gives a lot more thought to it than I do.

I don't see the benefit of a "wait-and-see" approach to Cut. We should show that we are committed to him and his approach. At least, I am. And even those who are on the fence -- who do you realistically expect to bring in if Duke acts like Cut isn't good enough for us? Really?!?

I'm on the bus and staying. If we get a few more years down the road and are still struggling to get to .500, that may be a different story. But the progress I see on the field is steadier than it has been since I was in school and Spurrier was coach. And, even then, he bolted as soon as he got a better job offer.

I'm with Cut. I hope the administration shows the same.

Let me start by saying I think this post is great, and I really and truly respect and appreciate all the positivity from the loyal posters regarding the football program.

But I have lost my football fandom. And the reason is because I continually feel lied to (or at least misled as to the expectations and reality of Duke's football team). Perhaps this is more my fault, and I have to learn to temper the annual claims of improvement, best receiving corp in the ACC, budding QB ready for stardom, new depth, etc etc etc. But I sadly do feel misled. And I think I may be at my wit's end. I'm really sorry to be posting this, as I know others are staunchly in defense of the team and believe we are improving, but I may need to take a football time out.

The measuring stick for success simply cannot be "improvement", "depth", "conditioning", or many other typical party lines used to describe the rebuilding of the Duke football program. We are not winning. Period. That's the measuring stick here. Same with basketball or any sport. In basketball, we have the luxury of being a top-tier team year in and year out, and so we have the luxury to argue semantics and nitpick with things the team can do better. But the point is: in basketball, we win. A lot. Should Cook get more run? Is Austin developing well? Can Miles step up? All great questions, all fun to debate and discuss. But at the end of the day, we win. A lot more than we lose.

In football, we don't win. Are we winning more than we did 4 years ago? I guess. Slightly. But is this really what our fanhood has come to? Pointing to a 2-pt loss to Richmond as improvement from an 8-pt loss two years ago? Pointing to losing close games? Pointing to a one possession loss to #15 Va Tech? In '09 a Cut-coached team lost a one possession game to #6 Va Tech too. In '07 a Roof-coached team had a 10-pt loss to unranked Miami at Miami. This year, unranked Miami on the road again, lost by 35. Is this progress? At least is this progress we can hang our hat on?

Obviously the stats I chose to list here are cherry picked. But so are most of the stats I see others using to point to our progress. You can say all you want how good our receivers are, how promising our youth is, our improved depth, our QB, our coach, our new commitment to the program.

None of that is tangible, hard evidence of an improved Duke football team. Now having said all this, have we made some strides? To me, it looks like it sometimes. But it's almost all anecdotal. We're 3-8. That's pretty darn convincing in my eyes. You can slice the numbers, tell the stories, make comparisons. 3-8 is 3-8.

I hate that I feel this way. I was so upbeat going into this year. I drank a lot of Kool-Aid. I admit that. But 3-8 is where we are.

Again, I truly appreciate OPK and other posters' views on how low Duke football was and where we are now. I still want so badly for the program to start winning. But to me: 3-8 is by far the most significant metric by which to measure this team. And it's not pretty.

- Chillin

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

Let me start by saying I think this post is great, and I really and truly respect and appreciate all the positivity from the loyal posters regarding the football program.

But I have lost my football fandom. And the reason is because I continually feel lied to (or at least misled as to the expectations and reality of Duke's football team). Perhaps this is more my fault, and I have to learn to temper the annual claims of improvement, best receiving corp in the ACC, budding QB ready for stardom, new depth, etc etc etc. But I sadly do feel misled. And I think I may be at my wit's end. I'm really sorry to be posting this, as I know others are staunchly in defense of the team and believe we are improving, but I may need to take a football time out.

The measuring stick for success simply cannot be "improvement", "depth", "conditioning", or many other typical party lines used to describe the rebuilding of the Duke football program. We are not winning. Period. That's the measuring stick here. Same with basketball or any sport. In basketball, we have the luxury of being a top-tier team year in and year out, and so we have the luxury to argue semantics and nitpick with things the team can do better. But the point is: in basketball, we win. A lot. Should Cook get more run? Is Austin developing well? Can Miles step up? All great questions, all fun to debate and discuss. But at the end of the day, we win. A lot more than we lose.

In football, we don't win. Are we winning more than we did 4 years ago? I guess. Slightly. But is this really what our fanhood has come to? Pointing to a 2-pt loss to Richmond as improvement from an 8-pt loss two years ago? Pointing to losing close games? Pointing to a one possession loss to #15 Va Tech? In '09 a Cut-coached team lost a one possession game to #6 Va Tech too. In '07 a Roof-coached team had a 10-pt loss to unranked Miami at Miami. This year, unranked Miami on the road again, lost by 35. Is this progress? At least is this progress we can hang our hat on?

Obviously the stats I chose to list here are cherry picked. But so are most of the stats I see others using to point to our progress. You can say all you want how good our receivers are, how promising our youth is, our improved depth, our QB, our coach, our new commitment to the program.

None of that is tangible, hard evidence of an improved Duke football team. Now having said all this, have we made some strides? To me, it looks like it sometimes. But it's almost all anecdotal. We're 3-8. That's pretty darn convincing in my eyes. You can slice the numbers, tell the stories, make comparisons. 3-8 is 3-8.

I hate that I feel this way. I was so upbeat going into this year. I drank a lot of Kool-Aid. I admit that. But 3-8 is where we are.

Again, I truly appreciate OPK and other posters' views on how low Duke football was and where we are now. I still want so badly for the program to start winning. But to me: 3-8 is by far the most significant metric by which to measure this team. And it's not pretty.

- Chillin
I appreciate the sort of disappointment you've shared. Life's full of it. What used to be trusted and inspirational seems colored more and more with pessimism or even delusion. Stay tuned. This story at Duke is far from over. There is more good on the horizon.

Winning as often as we do in basketball can make anything less than winning all the time seem insignificant. Teams that win 10 or more football games a season are remarkable.... look at all the attention VA Tech is getting for the string of 10 or more wins per season.

[OldPhiKap]

Let me start by saying I think this post is great, and I really and truly respect and appreciate all the positivity from the loyal posters regarding the football program.

But I have lost my football fandom. And the reason is because I continually feel lied to (or at least misled as to the expectations and reality of Duke's football team). Perhaps this is more my fault, and I have to learn to temper the annual claims of improvement, best receiving corp in the ACC, budding QB ready for stardom, new depth, etc etc etc. But I sadly do feel misled. And I think I may be at my wit's end. I'm really sorry to be posting this, as I know others are staunchly in defense of the team and believe we are improving, but I may need to take a football time out.

The measuring stick for success simply cannot be "improvement", "depth", "conditioning", or many other typical party lines used to describe the rebuilding of the Duke football program. We are not winning. Period. That's the measuring stick here. Same with basketball or any sport. In basketball, we have the luxury of being a top-tier team year in and year out, and so we have the luxury to argue semantics and nitpick with things the team can do better. But the point is: in basketball, we win. A lot. Should Cook get more run? Is Austin developing well? Can Miles step up? All great questions, all fun to debate and discuss. But at the end of the day, we win. A lot more than we lose.

In football, we don't win. Are we winning more than we did 4 years ago? I guess. Slightly. But is this really what our fanhood has come to? Pointing to a 2-pt loss to Richmond as improvement from an 8-pt loss two years ago? Pointing to losing close games? Pointing to a one possession loss to #15 Va Tech? In '09 a Cut-coached team lost a one possession game to #6 Va Tech too. In '07 a Roof-coached team had a 10-pt loss to unranked Miami at Miami. This year, unranked Miami on the road again, lost by 35. Is this progress? At least is this progress we can hang our hat on?

Obviously the stats I chose to list here are cherry picked. But so are most of the stats I see others using to point to our progress. You can say all you want how good our receivers are, how promising our youth is, our improved depth, our QB, our coach, our new commitment to the program.

None of that is tangible, hard evidence of an improved Duke football team. Now having said all this, have we made some strides? To me, it looks like it sometimes. But it's almost all anecdotal. We're 3-8. That's pretty darn convincing in my eyes. You can slice the numbers, tell the stories, make comparisons. 3-8 is 3-8.

I hate that I feel this way. I was so upbeat going into this year. I drank a lot of Kool-Aid. I admit that. But 3-8 is where we are.

Again, I truly appreciate OPK and other posters' views on how low Duke football was and where we are now. I still want so badly for the program to start winning. But to me: 3-8 is by far the most significant metric by which to measure this team. And it's not pretty.

- Chillin

And I think that is a reasonable and well-stated response.

Winning is certainly the ultimate yardstick. The question is, what is the reasonable time one should expect to get there? That to me is the big difference between basketball and football. K brought in a great class in '82-'83 that, by the time they were seniors, put K on the map. So K was what, six years into his tenure before really hitting it? Football takes even longer because one or two players cannot make that much of a difference. You need to be strong and deep at every position. It just takes longer.

I agree that moral victories ain't victories. I agree that the result in the win-loss column is disappointing. I just think it takes longer to turn around a football program in general, and ours faced particular challenges when Cut got here.

I share your disappointment and hoped this was the year we would turn the corner. The corner seems closer, but we're not there yet. I think we've got the right guy to get us there, though. Hang in there, we'll all get there together.

[Sixthman]

David Cutcliff is a world class Carnival Barker, who, faced with the task of promoting the unpromotable, has made an understandably shell shocked adult fan base, believe again, without much basis. He has clearly caught the attention of his own players, who are playing at a higher level, without, IMO, materially more talent than their predecessors. It also seems that he has caught the attention of a few other communities, most notably the high school football coaches in North Carolina, whom Cut has cultivated with substance, skill and dedication, and who have the power to populate his camps and recruiting pipeline with players who may make a difference in the future. He has also caught the attention of those within the Duke administration who control the short term economic fate of the program. They will support him, and continue to fund the program at the higher level which came into place with the arrival of Coach Cut. Even with his promotional and motivational skills, he has failed to meaningful engage the student body. They could be a significant factor in making the Wallace Wade environment more fun and exciting (it is often neither). Good luck with that, it's a problem that spans generations. IMO, Coach Cutcliff is a great leader. Really great. We are lucky to have him. He is the perfect man for an unbelieveably challenging situation. We got a world class Carinaval Barker when that was the first thing we needed. What he has not done is get the results he has publically proclaimed to be his expectation onf the field. We need to get better on Saturday, and we need more and better players to do it. It is debateable whether he has recruited players of significantly higher talent. He has asked us to believe that he has a plan to recruit players who are better than the "experts" understand and that his emphasis on speed will make us competative. It's a good pitch, and I hope it's right. However, it requires a lot of faith -- perhaps event the suspension of reason -- to believe that this coaching staff understands talent in a way those against whom they compete in recruiting do not, or that players of high talent will pass on going places where they know they will win for the opportunity to play at Duke. The thing about turning a football team around is that it takes twenty or thirty or more better players to field a significantly more talented team. You're not going to turn that many in one class. So it takes five years of recruiting so you can get five or six difference makers every year. So, here's where I am: I'll follow the man whereever he wants to go, and stand up for him any time he needs it. He's not just our best hope, he is the man who will get this job done. I've seen Duke's defense and special teams make more tackles the other guy will member for awhile (or can't remember at all) this season than in the previous ten combined. We are starting to play football like we mean it. And for those of you who believe in luck, if we have as much good luck next year as we've had bad luck this year, we'll win six games without even getting better. And if we get better, we'll win even more. And when we do, it will be a story for the ages, and the beginning of something special.

[CLT Devil]

Nice summary - I didn't know if the 'Carnival Barker' was implying something negative but after reading the post I think it fits Cut's position and role as Duke's HC pretty well. I've been going to games since before I can remember, over 30 years now, and Wally Wade was and continues to be a place where I will run into lifelong friends, make new friends and have memories to treasure forever.

All that said, the losing does really hurt and I wouldn't really expect anyone more than a dedicated, devoted, life long fan to be able to attend nearly every game and listen to/watch every minute of every game like I try to do. Maybe it's because I am close family friends with half of Duke's FBall radio crew and listening every single week is a sort of shared misery that we go through together. Like a moth to the flame, if one has been following Duke Fball for the last 20+ years you pretty much know how the current play you're watching is going to go, then how the drive is going to end, and then how the game will ultimately end up and then how the season, the Thad Lewis era, the Roof/Franks/Goldsmith eras and so on are most likely going to end up - disappointing. I, as a fan in general, want my team to win more than anything. However, if Duke doesn't win a big game or have a season better than the last it doesn't affect the love and passion I have for my team. Sure, it's a heck of a lot harder to make plans and drive from Charlotte to Durham for a game if you know your team is going to lose, but I go anyway. That's what you do if you are a fan. There are varying degrees of fandom, and trust me when I say that Duke has it's share of fans who will be there for every brutal moment that has come to define a program. And we'll be back next game, next year - just as long as there is something, anything to look forward to in the future. It might not show up in wins and losses just yet but Cut has changed this program for the better, and he's trying to build a program just like K did when Tom Butters stood up for him after a few rough years.

The Duke team I have seen since Cut took over does have a different feel around it. Whether measurable or not by way of wins or losses, there most certainly is something to feel good about when it comes to the Duke Football Program. In the end, unless it's just in your blood for generations like my family and the other insufferable fans who show up every week regardless, we need wins to feel good about and to celebrate and to fondly remember.

I'm not here to defend the program or tell anyone they need to keep waiting because things are turning better or to tell them they are not true fans for giving up after yet another brutal loss - I just want others to know that there are plenty of us out there who make the drive on Saturdays to tailgate with friends and to watch football and root for their team. If we can't be there we listen on the radio to the whole game, check the score during the wedding ceremony, sit in the one seat at the bar who has the Duke game on, etc.

In the end I think there is something to be said about loyalty when it finally pays off with what fans have been wanting for years - a competitive program. When (not if!) that day comes I will be absolutely giddy and will likely call all of my Duke fan pals who I don't talk to often and celebrate Duke Football. Until then...I'll keep my season tickets, clear out Saturdays when there are home games so I can go, make sure there is a radio to listen to games I can't make and follow recruiting in the hopes that next year will be better than the last...maybe it's insanity.

[captmojo]

Good title for this thread.

I'm not one.
I will never be one.
I think all are entitled to their own opinion about if they wish to be one.
All that goes around, comes back around.

Winning is a staged process. Success will not come to any losing program in less than one recruiting class. At least, a program that will be able to maintain that success. Lots of Nick Sabans can come and go, but keeping them around will make the difference. Recruits want to attend a school and team that has a chance to win. Constant coach changing isn't a way to keep any consistancy. Lots of you see the evidence of keeping a good pilot at the helm, doing things the right way and what can be acheived by staying on that path when you look at the basketball program. Football's not that different.

Oh. By the by, Houston Nutt's available. Maybe some might think a couple of seasons here can turn things around for the better.:rolleyes: Quitters. Maybe, if we were all show as much patience as they do at Ol'Miss and MS State, we could be at their level of winning acheivement and coach retention and fan satisfaction.

Oooh! Butchie-boy is free of employment. We all know he's a big proponent of doing things with a staff that equally believes in the 'Right way'. ;)

[killerleft]

Nice summary - I didn't know if the 'Carnival Barker' was implying something negative but after reading the post I think it fits Cut's position and role as Duke's HC pretty well. I've been going to games since before I can remember, over 30 years now, and Wally Wade was and continues to be a place where I will run into lifelong friends, make new friends and have memories to treasure forever.

All that said, the losing does really hurt and I wouldn't really expect anyone more than a dedicated, devoted, life long fan to be able to attend nearly every game and listen to/watch every minute of every game like I try to do. Maybe it's because I am close family friends with half of Duke's FBall radio crew and listening every single week is a sort of shared misery that we go through together. Like a moth to the flame, if one has been following Duke Fball for the last 20+ years you pretty much know how the current play you're watching is going to go, then how the drive is going to end, and then how the game will ultimately end up and then how the season, the Thad Lewis era, the Roof/Franks/Goldsmith eras and so on are most likely going to end up - disappointing. I, as a fan in general, want my team to win more than anything. However, if Duke doesn't win a big game or have a season better than the last it doesn't affect the love and passion I have for my team. Sure, it's a heck of a lot harder to make plans and drive from Charlotte to Durham for a game if you know your team is going to lose, but I go anyway. That's what you do if you are a fan. There are varying degrees of fandom, and trust me when I say that Duke has it's share of fans who will be there for every brutal moment that has come to define a program. And we'll be back next game, next year - just as long as there is something, anything to look forward to in the future. It might not show up in wins and losses just yet but Cut has changed this program for the better, and he's trying to build a program just like K did when Tom Butters stood up for him after a few rough years.

The Duke team I have seen since Cut took over does have a different feel around it. Whether measurable or not by way of wins or losses, there most certainly is something to feel good about when it comes to the Duke Football Program. In the end, unless it's just in your blood for generations like my family and the other insufferable fans who show up every week regardless, we need wins to feel good about and to celebrate and to fondly remember.

I'm not here to defend the program or tell anyone they need to keep waiting because things are turning better or to tell them they are not true fans for giving up after yet another brutal loss - I just want others to know that there are plenty of us out there who make the drive on Saturdays to tailgate with friends and to watch football and root for their team. If we can't be there we listen on the radio to the whole game, check the score during the wedding ceremony, sit in the one seat at the bar who has the Duke game on, etc.

In the end I think there is something to be said about loyalty when it finally pays off with what fans have been wanting for years - a competitive program. When (not if!) that day comes I will be absolutely giddy and will likely call all of my Duke fan pals who I don't talk to often and celebrate Duke Football. Until then...I'll keep my season tickets, clear out Saturdays when there are home games so I can go, make sure there is a radio to listen to games I can't make and follow recruiting in the hopes that next year will be better than the last...maybe it's insanity.

Thanks for that post, CLT Devil! I am positive that you have put into words exactly how a lot of us feel about Duke Football. I wouldn't call us special, even if I think we are. We are different, that's for sure. Is it a personality glitch? Should we be proud of it? Ashamed? It doesn't matter. Some people are just hardwired to stick with things until they are finished, or until things get better.

There used to be more folks like us out there, but times have changed. Some people switch teams or sides like the blowing wind changes. I compare long-time Duke Football fans (in a more lighthearted manner, of course) to the folks who stayed in the Prairie Belt throughout the Dustbowl years. We know things will get better, we're just not sure when.

And when it happens, I can be that old man who has stories to tell about the 'good-ole days'. Those who have stuck with Duke through good and bad will understand that there have definitely been some fine days, that the won-lost records don't tell the whole tale. Maybe it's all the hard work the players and coaches have put in despite the records... maybe it's just showing up and looking down into the classic horseshoe stadium for the first time each year...

But something calls us back. And I've always felt like it was a good thing to do. I don't want, need, or deserve a gold star for it. That's just part of who I am. A Duke Football fan.

[VaDukie]

My feelings on this are complicated.

I think Cutcliffe is improving the program. I think things are much better than they were in the Roof years. I don't think that firing him makes any sense because as others have said, this is not a program where we can bring in a top coach.

However, I'm exhausted trying to care. I admire those of you who do but I've seen too many close losses, missed opportunities, and plain dumb luck to take any comfort in symbolic victories. We are 3-8. In Cutcliffe's 4th year, that's a disappointment. Period. I find it agonizing enough watching close loss after close loss on my couch every Saturday and can't even imagine how some of you make it out to Wallace Wade week after week.

As much as a UNC win would pick up my spirits and build momentum for next year I can't even let myself think it's possible.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

Thanks for that post, CLT Devil! I am positive that you have put into words exactly how a lot of us feel about Duke Football. I wouldn't call us special, even if I think we are. We are different, that's for sure. Is it a personality glitch? Should we be proud of it? Ashamed? It doesn't matter. Some people are just hardwired to stick with things until they are finished, or until things get better.

There used to be more folks like us out there, but times have changed. Some people switch teams or sides like the blowing wind changes. I compare long-time Duke Football fans (in a more lighthearted manner, of course) to the folks who stayed in the Prairie Belt throughout the Dustbowl years. We know things will get better, we're just not sure when.

And when it happens, I can be that old man who has stories to tell about the 'good-ole days'. Those who have stuck with Duke through good and bad will understand that there have definitely been some fine days, that the won-lost records don't tell the whole tale. Maybe it's all the hard work the players and coaches have put in despite the records... maybe it's just showing up and looking down into the classic horseshoe stadium for the first time each year...

But something calls us back. And I've always felt like it was a good thing to do. I don't want, need, or deserve a gold star for it. That's just part of who I am. A Duke Football fan.
As this discussion has moved along, some very interesting points have emerged.

Loyalty can power behavior for a long time.

At the center of the discussion of the Duke football program are the players over the years. As alumni go, they are among the most loyal groups. I remember reading some information from Alumni Affairs (I think) which indicated that as an "affinity group," former football players gave more money to Duke than any other group and former football players had held a disproportionately high number of alumni leadership positions over the years. If participation in sports has intrinsic value, surely how our football players live their lives after Duke is testimony of sorts.

[fitimi1]

I argued back prior to Coach Cut's hiring, when there was lots of discussion about the type of program we wanted, that I would always rather have a 3-8 team (this year's record to date) than compromise our Duke values. One does not have to look far this year to see examples of non-Duke values in running a football programs and the fallout to the institutions involved.

Having been a loyal fan, a season ticket holder and seeing as many games as possible, either in person or on TV, my observations are as follows:

The defense seems to be much improved with this year's new scheme. Very pleasantly surprised considering how young the starters were.

The offensive line after several injuries certainly played as well as expected, at least to me.

The kicking game suffered with dealing with injuries as well, especially Will's ankle injury. (I suspect that led to some of the criticized decisions mentioned by others.)

The one area where I thought we really did not improve, in fact, thought we were not as good as in previous years, was the offensive play calling. It got to the point where it became so predictable that my buddy and I had a prediction rate of over 50 percent, particularly inside the "red zone." If we could do it, I suspect that opposing defensive coaches could do it even better. The one thing that always made me "ill" was running a play for a first down that only had a chance of success if the opposing team made a mistake. (Example: numerous short yardage passing plays when we needed long yardage.)

Bottom line, we will all be happier if we win this week.

And I am one that thinks that Coach Cut needs an extension.

[davekay1971]

I've found this season more frustrating than any since Cut got here, but for good reasons: we SHOULD be winning some of the games we're losing.

Think about that, right there. That's a huge difference compared to the pre-Cut years. We SHOULD be winning games now. It's been brutal to see us in the position to win games 3 times and lose them on kicking issues and small errors. We're basically a kicking game away from being 6-5 right now. Yes, it is the small things that separate good teams from bad teams, but where we were before Cut was MONUMENTALLY large things making us downright awful.

I can put up with frustration knowing we should be winning some games we're losing, rather than going back to being thrilled that we win any games at all.

[DueBlevil]

We're basically a kicking game away from being 6-5 right now.

If only we could've had last year's kicking game with this year's team...

If there is such a thing as football karma, just imagine how amazing our team will be when we start cashing in on that. I'm thinking back-to-back-to-back national titles.

[OldPhiKap]

I can put up with frustration knowing we should be winning some games we're losing, rather than going back to being thrilled that we win any games at all.

You have summed up part of what I have been trying to say, and done it much better than I could. Bravo.

Let's beat UNC and end on a strong note!

[RelativeWays]

I sympathize with Chillin's post as I tend to side more with his viewpoint than some of the others here. This season has been an eye opener in some respects and a lot of it, not good.

First, I think Cut has done a lot of very good things for Duke Football. He's improved football awareness on campus and in the region, he's helped improve facilties, we've gotten some better athletes, we are certainly more competitive, the football fundamentals are better (but can still be improved). But to me, thats where it ends.

I'm not sold on Cut as a coach. His switching of Renfree to Connette/Boone in the middle of a drive is baffling and I think its impacted Sean negatively. He has no faith in our improved running game opting to sneak Boone/Connette when Thompson and Scott are more than capable. We run really stupid pass plays, we don't stretch the defense, we seldom go past the sticks on 3rd down. We look clueless in end of game situations where we have the ball and need a score to WIN!!!!!!

Probably the most damning to me is I don't think Cut is a very good motivator. It was sobering to realize that Richmond went 0-8 in the CAA this year, a team that was below average and had embarrassed us twice at home, we should have destroyed them worse than Tulane. And yet the team was timid, apprehensive and scared to lose, I think the staff was the same. Unacceptable. I want someone that realizes that the Richmond Spiders are the punchline to the joke that is Duke football and wants to make them pay. I want someone that would rather clean the bathrooms in Grand Central Station with his tongue than lose to Wake Forest again. I want someone who sees the number 12 team in the nation reeling at our home stadium and goes in for the kill. I want someone who tells out players to run through a granite wall, and they DO IT, with a crazed smile on their faces. Thats what this team needs, and I don't think its Cut.

I thought a couple of weeks ago that it would be great for Everett Withers to run his mouth about our team like he did NCSU so we'd be motivated to beat them. Then I remembered I have absolutely no faith in anyone on our staff to do something about it so he'd probably get away with it.

[Bob Green]

Let's beat UNC and end on a strong note!

I second this recommendation, but whether we win and finish 4-8 or lose and finish 3-9, I'll be back next year as a loyal Duke fan cheering on our football team. As frustrating as this season has been to date, for some reason, I am oddly optimistic about our prospects for success in 2012. I'm a glass half full guy, and always optimistic about Duke football, but the optimism usually arrives with the start of Spring Training not in the midst of a winless November.

[throatybeard]

Oh. By the by, Houston Nutt's available. Maybe some might think a couple of seasons here can turn things around for the better.:rolleyes: Quitters. Maybe, if we were all show as much patience as they do at Ol'Miss and MS State, we could be at their level of winning achievement and coach retention and fan satisfaction.

Interesting you mention these schools. Ole Miss's quick trigger is how Duke got Cutcliffe in the first place, ultimately. State, well that was a different scenario. You have the iconic coach in recent times (Sherrill) retiring after three putrid seasons. Then the Croom hire. I always felt Croom didn't get the chance he should--they said they'd give him four years after the Sherrill sanctions ended, or, seven years. They basically admitted his first three years were hamstrung by the sanctions resulting from the assistant coach paying peeps, so those three weren't on Croom's clock.. Croom looked to turn the corner in year four (8-5, bowl win) but when the team stepped back in 2008, they fired him in year five, even though the initial (oral?) agreement would seem to indicate they'd give him through 2010. Now there's Dan Mullen, who succeeded with Croom's senior recruits in 2009 and 2010, even winning the Gator Bowl in 2010(-11). And he was the hero, and everyone was scared Florida would poach him when they instead hired Will Muschamp. But mow this season is a step back and the natives are mildly restless. Doesn't take long.

If I'm the AD, no matter how frustrating crap like the Richmond game is, I give Cutcliffe about eight years. Maybe seven. But what's to lose? We fired Goldsmith on a knee jerk. At some point, you have got to say, this is our guy, we believe in him, and we're gonna poo on the pot with him.