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View Full Version : New Measurements From Amar'e Camp (Plumlees, Parker, McGary, etc.)



Greg_Newton
06-27-2011, 04:35 PM
I love this kind of stuff, so thought I'd pass it along for anyone else interested.

Official HS sheet: http://inside.nikebasketball.com/news/wp-content/themes/inside_bb/images/elite-youth/pdfs/Amare-HighSchool.pdf

Full list form UK site, including college players: http://www.allkyhoops.com/2011/06/anthony-davis-kentucky-recruits-at.html

Notables: (Height (w. shoes), weight (w/o shoes), wingspan):

Mason Plumlee 6’10 234 6’11
Miles Plumlee 6’11.5 247 7’0

^This is actually shocking to me. Mason is only 6'10 in shoes with a sub 7' wingspan??? He seems so long. And Miles is within 1/2" of being a 7-footer??? ~7' 250 is legit NBA center size, even without a 44" vertical. How is he not the freaking NPOY?

Prospects with Duke interest:

Tony Parker 6’9.5 284.6 7’0 - confirms he has legit C size - within 1/2" of 6'10, 7' wingpsan is plenty. 285 is enormous though... hopefully it's mostly good weight.

Mitch McGary 6’11/258 6’12 (<-:D) - it's amazing how well he moves for 6'11 260. Would love him to be our next Miles Plumlee-type, except less freak jumper and more natural physical post-man.

Anthony Bennett 6’7/242 7’1 - 6'7 in shoes is pretty a pretty tiny PF. Wingspan and mack-truck build helps though.

Jarnell Stokes 6’9/256 7’1 - Appears he's not actually undersized at all. Those are legit NBA PF measurables.

Landen Lucas 6’9.5/241 7’0 - About as expected.

Julius Randle 6’9/243 6’10 - Beast.

Nerlens Noel 6’11.5/201 7’3 - :eek: Considering how quick of a jumper he is, this guy is going to be an dominating force on the defensive end... even more so than Henson/Davis, IMO. Long shot, but I would absolutely love to have him along with a power scorer.

Other interesting prospects:

Robert Carter 6’8/260 7’2.5 - purportedly OSU's top target, at least up there with Tony; sounds like almost a Dejaun Blair type - 1-1.5" taller, with ~2' shorter arms.
James McAdoo 6’9 226 7’1... oof. Gonna be a good'un.
Jared Sullinger 6’10 281 7’1 - better size than I expected.

Greg_Newton
06-27-2011, 04:59 PM
More from the Amar'e camp: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=6708456

Top three scorers:

Julius Randle (Dallas/ Prestonwood Christian)

2013, PF, 6-9, 243 pounds

The athletic lefty plays in full attack mode in the post, from midrange and along the baseline. Randle has a great first step for a player his size and can initiate and score through contact with touch, body control or with a powerful above-the-rim finish. He plays with confidence, energy, urgency and he exposes defenders not ready to compete immediately.

Tony Parker (Lithonia, Ga./ Miller Grove)

2012, PF, 6-9, 284 pounds

Parker is a wide-bodied, powerful post player with great hands and touch who finishes drop-off passes above the rim. Parker can also knock down jumpers with range to the arc and score through contact in the low post with drop steps and spins along the baseline. He is hungry to score and can do it in a variety of ways.

Anthony Bennett (Brampton, Canada/ Findlay Prep)

2012, PF, 6-8, 230 pounds

He is a hungry scorer who is hard to guard, has good footwork and a fluid offensive game. In the paint, he has power and explosiveness to dunk over defenders. In transition, he fills the lane, finds the basket and finishes the play. He also can knock down 3s and works the offensive glass, always looking to score.

Saratoga2
06-27-2011, 05:01 PM
Just looking at the two Plumlee's, I would have thought Mason is taller and longer than Miles. Hope they didn't make the wrong attribution. Easy to do with two M. Plumlees. As long as they had the shoes off to weigh these guys, why didn't they just get height measurements. They give stocking feet measurements when measuring in the NBA pre-draft camp for instance.

I also wonder about guys carrying 285 at about 6'9" iin stocking feet. Sounds heavy, but Sulliger is that much and was effecting. McGary at 256 seems a little closer to the playing weight I would expect for a power forward or even a center. Still Parker would be worked into shape at Duke and that might be best for his game.

Greg_Newton
06-27-2011, 05:23 PM
Just looking at the two Plumlee's, I would have thought Mason is taller and longer than Miles. Hope they didn't make the wrong attribution. Easy to do with two M. Plumlees. As long as they had the shoes off to weigh these guys, why didn't they just get height measurements. They give stocking feet measurements when measuring in the NBA pre-draft camp for instance.

I also wonder about guys carrying 285 at about 6'9" iin stocking feet. Sounds heavy, but Sulliger is that much and was effecting. McGary at 256 seems a little closer to the playing weight I would expect for a power forward or even a center. Still Parker would be worked into shape at Duke and that might be best for his game.

Yup... wasn't Boozer listed as 6'9 280 one of his first couple years here?

I wondered that too about the Plums, except the respective weights seem right as they are. Not sure what's going on there.

jimsumner
06-27-2011, 05:58 PM
I can't help but notice that McGary has a wingspan of 6'12" Hopefully, he can get that up to 7'0". :)

devildeac
06-27-2011, 06:02 PM
I can't help but notice that McGary has a wingspan of 6'12" Hopefully, he can get that up to 7'0". :)

But I thought the long-standing "tradition" was that guys did not want to be listed as a "true" 7 footer:rolleyes:.

Greg_Newton
06-27-2011, 06:25 PM
http://inside.nikebasketball.com/news/wp-content/themes/inside_bb/images/elite-youth/pdfs/Deron-HighSchool.pdf

Also... Rasheed Sulaimon could quietly be turning into a big-time recruit for us. I mean, he's 6'4.5 (in shoes), 185, 6'7 wingspan, can play either guard position, is a great 3-point shooter, is a "terrific athlete" that "finishes that flair", is an elite defender with a high motor with "active hands and good lateral foot speed" who "anticipates passing lanes" well. If that was all we knew about an uncommitted recruit, we'd be absolutely drooling over him and talking about whether we should prioritize him over Purvis/Bazz!

Anyway, Sheed was named a top 3 defender at the camp (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=6708421). Quotes are from this write-up:


Sulaimon plays with great energy and urgency. His motor never stops running, and he competes on the defensive end, especially when guarding the ball handler, as he applies constant ball pressure. His active hands and good lateral foot speed allow him to stay eye-to-eye with the ball handler. He also looks to help in the post, while doing a good job of not losing vision. Sulaimon is a terrific athlete who anticipates passing lanes well, where he shoots the gap and finishes with flare on the other end. He should fit in nicely with the Blue Devils' pressure man defense.

-jk
06-27-2011, 07:03 PM
I can't help but notice that McGary has a wingspan of 6'12" Hopefully, he can get that up to 7'0". :)

My son's birth certificate reads "8 lbs, 16 oz". Someone was asleep at the keyboard when 8 lbs, 15 and 1/2 came through. :)

-jk

devildeac
06-27-2011, 09:28 PM
My son's birth certificate reads "8 lbs, 16 oz". Someone was asleep at the keyboard when 8 lbs, 15 and 1/2 came through. :)

-jk

I'm not sure your wife would have been thrilled knowing she gave birth to a 9 pound son. Eight pounds, 16 ounces sounds like it would be a much easier time in childbirth:rolleyes:.

-jk
06-27-2011, 09:40 PM
I'm not sure your wife would have been thrilled knowing she gave birth to a 9 pound son. Eight pounds, 16 ounces sounds like it would be a much easier time in childbirth:rolleyes:.

He was the runt. His older sister was 9 lbs, 1/2 oz.

-jk

gep
06-27-2011, 11:59 PM
My son's birth certificate reads "8 lbs, 16 oz". Someone was asleep at the keyboard when 8 lbs, 15 and 1/2 came through. :)

-jk

Maybe... like those old typewriters... that actually had a 1/2 & 1/4 key (I think)... now they don't have such keys and don't know how to do a "one-half"... so 15-1/2 sounds more like 16. I find this rather humorous...

Jarhead
06-28-2011, 12:18 AM
Maybe... like those old typewriters... that actually had a 1/2 & 1/4 key (I think)... now they don't have such keys and don't know how to do a "one-half"... so 15-1/2 sounds more like 16. I find this rather humorous...

My keyboard has a ½, a ¾, and a ¼. I hit them by accident, sometimes, and spell check loses its mind.

Greg_Newton
06-28-2011, 01:52 AM
I keep running across new camp measurements, so I figure I'll keep updating this thread. Things that jump out at me from this set (all heights in shoes, BTW):

-Austin Rivers is a legit 6'5 203? I like it, especially the 203 part; he must be hitting the weight room, which I've been saying he badly needs to do if he wants to finish around the rim in college. Along with a 6'7 wingspan, he should also definitely be able to defend at SF if necessary.

-Poythress has pretty much the perfect frame for a college 4 at his age (6'8/213/7'0, and so does Pollard, given his absurd hops (6'8/192/6'10. These are two players Duke is looking at at PF, but hopefully they don't awkwardly try to become wings.

-Those are great measurements for 2013 Duke target Jabari Parker. He's regarded as a wing, but he's got solid PF size.

-Semi-targets Kyle Anderson and Amile Jefferson just got a lot more intriguing to me. Anderson (6'9/7'2) is apparently NBA PF size. Same with Amile Jefferson, to a lesser extent (6'9/7'0, but he's paper-thin).

-HB is taller (6'9) and less long (6'11) than I expected.

-Terrence Jones must be jacked now; 6'9 250?

Kevin Durant Camp Measurements: (http://coast2coastrecruiting.net/2011/06/kevin-durant-nike-skills-academy-rosters/)

Players of interest:

Austin Rivers / 6-5 / 203 / 6-7
Alexander Poythress / 6-8 / 213 / 7-0
Devonte Pollard / 6-8 / 192 / 6-10
Jabari Parker / 6-8.5 / 222 / 6-11 (roster says 6'9, but note says 6-8.5)
Amile Jefferson / 6-9 / 197 / 7-0
Kyle Anderson / 6-9 / 226 / 7-2
Justin Anderson / 6-6 / 222 / 6-11
JP Tokoto / 6-7 / 185 / 6-9I'm a real wanker for saying this.
Harrison Barnes / 6-9 / 223 / 6-11
Terrence Jones / 6-9 / 249 / 7-2
Doron Lamb / 6-5 / 204 / 6-7I'm a real wanker for saying this.

RoyalBlue08
06-28-2011, 01:27 PM
I love this kind of stuff, so thought I'd pass it along for anyone else interested.



Notables: (Height (w. shoes), weight (w/o shoes), wingspan):

Mason Plumlee 6’10 234 6’11
Miles Plumlee 6’11.5 247 7’0

^This is actually shocking to me. Mason is only 6'10 in shoes with a sub 7' wingspan??? He seems so long. And Miles is within 1/2" of being a 7-footer??? ~7' 250 is legit NBA center size, even without a 44" vertical. How is he not the freaking NPOY?



I've always thought that if Miles would have been born in Europe, he would have been a lottery pick with a ton of "upside".

MChambers
06-28-2011, 03:25 PM
I've always thought that if Miles would have been born in Europe, he would have been a lottery pick with a ton of "upside".

I'm very surprised that these top level camps associated with NBA stars don't use more sophisticated metrics, such as cinder blocks.

CDu
06-28-2011, 03:48 PM
I've always thought that if Miles would have been born in Europe, he would have been a lottery pick with a ton of "upside".

Yeah, if he's really 6'11.5", he'd have been a lottery pick with his athleticism had he entered the draft as a 19 year old.

It's a shame his basketball IQ hasn't caught up with his athleticism. Hopefully he can have a breakthrough senior year.

Greg_Newton
06-28-2011, 06:50 PM
Yeah, if he's really 6'11.5", he'd have been a lottery pick with his athleticism had he entered the draft as a 19 year old.

It's a shame his basketball IQ hasn't caught up with his athleticism. Hopefully he can have a breakthrough senior year.

Doesn't it seem like they must have switched the heights/lengths for Mason and Miles though? If Mason is 6'9 barefoot with a 6'11 wingspan, that would give him an 8'10 reach... if he's lucky (for comparison, Boozer and Brand's were 9'0.5" and 9'2). That sounds about right for Miles, I don't think I buy that for Mason.

This has potential to become the mystery topic of the offseason! ;)

JimBD
06-28-2011, 07:00 PM
They should combine height and wingspan into one statistic--standing reach. Then you know how tall a player is for basketball purposes. Then look at jump reach to get an idea of how high he is capable of playing. For some reason, you seldom see what a player's standing reach is.

dcar1985
06-28-2011, 08:54 PM
If you actually watch any of Dukes games, its quite clear that Miles is taller than Mason, at least to me....I don't think thats ever been in question, until now.

sagegrouse
06-29-2011, 12:28 AM
If you actually watch any of Dukes games, its quite clear that Miles is taller than Mason, at least to me....I don't think thats ever been in question, until now.

"If you actually watch any of Duke's games".... WTF is that supposed to mean? Here's the roster data from the official source:



5 Mason Plumlee F 6-10 240 So. Warsaw, Ind. (Christ School [N.C.])
21 Miles Plumlee F 6-10 245 Jr. Warsaw, Ind. (Christ School [N.C.])


Looks like there is a plausible case that the two are the same height.

sagegrouse
'Of course, I come from the era of the incredible shrinking big men. Jay Buckley enrolled at 6'11". Hack Tison was 7'0" as a freshman. By the time both were on varsity in 1962-63 they were listed as 6'10". That was either Bubas's mind game or a reflection of the time when excess height was seen as an affliction. Or maybe they shrank.'

uh_no
06-29-2011, 12:45 AM
Having seen both walking around campus quite a few times, I guess I was always of the perception that mason was taller....seeing these numbers doesn't really suprise me, I guess, though because miles is much, IDK, thicker.....he seems to have broader shoulders, definitely a wider head, and I think that makes him SEEM shorter than the more narrow mason.

This brings me back to last year when the video of kyrie tyler and josh came out and everyone here was arguing who was taller.

Saratoga2
06-29-2011, 08:38 AM
"If you actually watch any of Duke's games".... WTF is that supposed to mean? Here's the roster data from the official source:



5 Mason Plumlee F 6-10 240 So. Warsaw, Ind. (Christ School [N.C.])
21 Miles Plumlee F 6-10 245 Jr. Warsaw, Ind. (Christ School [N.C.])


Looks like there is a plausible case that the two are the same height.

sagegrouse
'Of course, I come from the era of the incredible shrinking big men. Jay Buckley enrolled at 6'11". Hack Tison was 7'0" as a freshman. By the time both were on varsity in 1962-63 they were listed as 6'10". That was either Bubas's mind game or a reflection of the time when excess height was seen as an affliction. Or maybe they shrank.'

Final resolution won't come until the NBA pre-draft camp. I think a lot of the fans have a reasonable understanding of the guys sizes relative to each other and there are a lot of questions relative to the listed measurements. This is aa good subject for June/July when not much else is happening.

sagegrouse
06-29-2011, 08:58 AM
Final resolution won't come until the NBA pre-draft camp. I think a lot of the fans have a reasonable understanding of the guys sizes relative to each other and there are a lot of questions relative to the listed measurements. This is aa good subject for June/July when not much else is happening.

It's hard to get the cinderblocks in play inside paneled CIS, but here's a link to the photo evidence (http://goduke.statsgeek.com/basketball-m/seasons/roster.php?season=2010-11) in last year's team photo. I don't think anything is "obvious" about the relatives sizes of MP1, MP2, and RKelly.

sagegrouse

uh_no
06-29-2011, 09:16 AM
It's hard to get the cinderblocks in play inside paneled CIS, but here's a link to the photo evidence (http://goduke.statsgeek.com/basketball-m/seasons/roster.php?season=2010-11) in last year's team photo. I don't think anything is "obvious" about the relatives sizes of MP1, MP2, and RKelly.

sagegrouse

Certainly not. But it IS clear that Miles is certainly not SHORTER than either of the other two.

RoyalBlue08
06-29-2011, 09:31 AM
For what it is worth, I always thought Miles was about an inch taller than Mason, and probably had longer arms too. That was just my impression from watching them on the court together.

devildeac
06-29-2011, 10:13 AM
It's hard to get the cinderblocks in play inside paneled CIS, but here's a link to the photo evidence (http://goduke.statsgeek.com/basketball-m/seasons/roster.php?season=2010-11) in last year's team photo. I don't think anything is "obvious" about the relatives sizes of MP1, MP2, and RKelly.

sagegrouse

Cinder blocks be damned! We can get the engineers here involved and use the wood paneling that separates the Crazies from the Crusties as our new measuring standard!:rolleyes:

dcar1985
06-29-2011, 10:16 AM
"If you actually watch any of Duke's games".... WTF is that supposed to mean? Here's the roster data from the official source:



5 Mason Plumlee F 6-10 240 So. Warsaw, Ind. (Christ School [N.C.])
21 Miles Plumlee F 6-10 245 Jr. Warsaw, Ind. (Christ School [N.C.])


Looks like there is a plausible case that the two are the same height.

sagegrouse
'Of course, I come from the era of the incredible shrinking big men. Jay Buckley enrolled at 6'11". Hack Tison was 7'0" as a freshman. By the time both were on varsity in 1962-63 they were listed as 6'10". That was either Bubas's mind game or a reflection of the time when excess height was seen as an affliction. Or maybe they shrank.'

It means exactly what I said, if you watch the games and see them in comparison Miles looks clearly taller....heights listed on a team roster usually aren't 100% accurate whether its taller or shorter....its the same as being able to tell that Austin is a legit 6'5 and that Mike G is clearly taller than 6'6 even though it keeps getting doubted

dcar1985
06-29-2011, 10:18 AM
It's hard to get the cinderblocks in play inside paneled CIS, but here's a link to the photo evidence (http://goduke.statsgeek.com/basketball-m/seasons/roster.php?season=2010-11) in last year's team photo. I don't think anything is "obvious" about the relatives sizes of MP1, MP2, and RKelly.

sagegrouse

That your opinion...in my opinion I think its obvious, no big deal

johnb
06-29-2011, 11:24 AM
But I thought the long-standing "tradition" was that guys did not want to be listed as a "true" 7 footer:rolleyes:.

I recall that both Gminski and Laettner chose to be listed at 6'11" rather than 7', presumably because 7' could sound plodding. I also recall plenty of things inaccurately, so I welcome clarification.

gwlaw99
06-29-2011, 11:57 AM
More from the Amar'e camp: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=6708456

Top three scorers:

Julius Randle (Dallas/ Prestonwood Christian)

2013, PF, 6-9, 243 pounds

The athletic lefty plays in full attack mode in the post, from midrange and along the baseline. Randle has a great first step for a player his size and can initiate and score through contact with touch, body control or with a powerful above-the-rim finish. He plays with confidence, energy, urgency and he exposes defenders not ready to compete immediately.

Tony Parker (Lithonia, Ga./ Miller Grove)

2012, PF, 6-9, 284 pounds

Parker is a wide-bodied, powerful post player with great hands and touch who finishes drop-off passes above the rim. Parker can also knock down jumpers with range to the arc and score through contact in the low post with drop steps and spins along the baseline. He is hungry to score and can do it in a variety of ways.

Anthony Bennett (Brampton, Canada/ Findlay Prep)

2012, PF, 6-8, 230 pounds

He is a hungry scorer who is hard to guard, has good footwork and a fluid offensive game. In the paint, he has power and explosiveness to dunk over defenders. In transition, he fills the lane, finds the basket and finishes the play. He also can knock down 3s and works the offensive glass, always looking to score.

Following that link, neither Miles nor Mason are in the top three in points, rebounding or blocks.

Nevermind: I think those were only among high school kids

PADukeMom
06-29-2011, 01:48 PM
Miles looks taller to me as well. Anyway I look-up at it, all 3 are at least 1 & 1/2 foot taller than I am...with heels.:cool:

BD80
06-29-2011, 03:09 PM
Miles looks taller to me as well. Anyway I look-up at it, all 3 are at least 1 & 1/2 foot taller than I am...with heels.:cool:

But they can't wear heels on the court!

They can walk on heels two, often three, times a year.

devildeac
06-29-2011, 03:52 PM
But they can't wear heels on the court!

They can walk on heels two, often three, times a year.

But, the Wears were heels for about a year. I think that's when (and wear[sic]) we walked on them;) .

sagegrouse
06-29-2011, 03:56 PM
That your opinion...in my opinion I think its obvious, no big deal

Dear Dcar1985: I won't prolong any disagreement over such trifles, but the use of the term "obvious" always calls to mind math courses where the prof would say, "The proof is obvious." And I would go through the following thought process: "Yep, it is obvious. Uh, now why is that? Oh, I see. No, that's not right. Urr... why the heck is this obvious?"

sagegrouse

jimsumner
06-29-2011, 03:58 PM
I recall that both Gminski and Laettner chose to be listed at 6'11" rather than 7', presumably because 7' could sound plodding. I also recall plenty of things inaccurately, so I welcome clarification.

Dean Smith argued that 7-0 was seen as some kind of magic number and that fans would place unrealistic expectations on seven-footers. So he fudged downward a tad, when necessary.

I believe Brad Daugherty was 6-11 15/16. :)

devildeac
06-29-2011, 04:04 PM
Dean Smith argued that 7-0 was seen as some kind of magic number and that fans would place unrealistic expectations on seven-footers. So he fudged downward a tad, when necessary.

I believe Brad Daugherty was 6-11 15/16. :)

He was correct. 7-0 was a magic number, especially when it was the half-time score of a Duke-unc MBB game;).

Greg_Newton
06-29-2011, 07:14 PM
It means exactly what I said, if you watch the games and see them in comparison Miles looks clearly taller....heights listed on a team roster usually aren't 100% accurate whether its taller or shorter....its the same as being able to tell that Austin is a legit 6'5 and that Mike G is clearly taller than 6'6 even though it keeps getting doubted

I watch every game and had come to the exact opposite conclusion as you, so I wouldn't call it "obvious" by any means. For one thing, Mason just plays taller; whether that be the point at which he releases jump hooks, how high he reaches in his straight-up post defense, or the point in the trajectory at which he grabs rebounds (very high).

This kind of "effective height" can be affected by 1) vertical jump, and 2) standing reach, which is basically a combination and height and wingspan. According to these numbers, Miles should have a higher standing reach, and according to numbers from last summer, he also has a higher vertical.

So then, why is Mason the lottery pick out of the two who grabs sky-high rebounds and regularly gets his head at rim level? Something doesn't add up...

The great summer debate rages on! :p

jimsumner
06-29-2011, 09:30 PM
I watch every game and had come to the exact opposite conclusion as you, so I wouldn't call it "obvious" by any means. For one thing, Mason just plays taller; whether that be the point at which he releases jump hooks, how high he reaches in his straight-up post defense, or the point in the trajectory at which he grabs rebounds (very high).

This kind of "effective height" can be affected by 1) vertical jump, and 2) standing reach, which is basically a combination and height and wingspan. According to these numbers, Miles should have a higher standing reach, and according to numbers from last summer, he also has a higher vertical.

So then, why is Mason the lottery pick out of the two who grabs sky-high rebounds and regularly gets his head at rim level? Something doesn't add up...

The great summer debate rages on! :p

Perhaps vertical leap isn't the only variable. There's hand-eye coordination, vision, balance, strength, ball skills and others. More importantly, there's the ability to translate all of this into consistent on-court performance. I've said this before, but it's not a track meet.

Newton_14
06-29-2011, 11:03 PM
I watch every game and had come to the exact opposite conclusion as you, so I wouldn't call it "obvious" by any means. For one thing, Mason just plays taller; whether that be the point at which he releases jump hooks, how high he reaches in his straight-up post defense, or the point in the trajectory at which he grabs rebounds (very high).

This kind of "effective height" can be affected by 1) vertical jump, and 2) standing reach, which is basically a combination and height and wingspan. According to these numbers, Miles should have a higher standing reach, and according to numbers from last summer, he also has a higher vertical.

So then, why is Mason the lottery pick out of the two who grabs sky-high rebounds and regularly gets his head at rim level? Something doesn't add up...

The great summer debate rages on! :p

I have seen every game that both Miles and Mason have played in their Duke careers, and a fairly good portion of those in person, plus seeing them in practice and at summer league games at Central. I have always felt that Mason had more length than Miles and they appear to me to be very close in height. Maybe it is an allusion, but that is my impression. Miles has the better vertical by far, but he just does not seem to have the length that Mason has. That is 100% eyeball test, not numbers.

I always felt that length was an advantage Mason had over Miles, and if Miles had Mason's length it would greatly help him. Would love to know for sure if Mason's arms are longer than Miles, because it sure appears that way to me.

UrinalCake
06-29-2011, 11:50 PM
Just to throw in my two cents, I always thought that Miles was a tad taller. Mason has a reputation for being a better leaper, but I would guess that Miles can jump just as high but perhaps doesn't have quite as much coordination. Keep in mind we're still talking about 20-ish year old kids who are potentially still growing and developing.

JMarley50
06-30-2011, 02:10 PM
The thing that intrigues me most about those measurements is the fact that Mason is 3 lbs lighter than last season, at least when compared to the roster. I was really hoping to see him beef up a little.

Bob Green
06-30-2011, 08:46 PM
He was correct. 7-0 was a magic number, especially when it was the half-time score of a Duke-unc MBB game;).

Okay, I've fallen behind in my reading the past few days, but this post earns props as the funniest I've read during my catching up efforts.

Bob Green
06-30-2011, 08:58 PM
Mason has a reputation for being a better leaper...

This is news to me as Miles was the better high jumper in high school. Now for basketball you can argue about timing, positioning, and aggressiveness amongst other traits, but when talking pure hops, Miles is superior to Mason.

uh_no
06-30-2011, 09:21 PM
This is news to me as Miles was the better high jumper in high school. Now for basketball you can argue about timing, positioning, and aggressiveness amongst other traits, but when talking pure hops, Miles is superior to Mason.

High jumping ability does not necessarily correlate to ones vertical

edit: well to a degree of course it does, but it takes a lot more proper form to get the HJ right

Newton_14
06-30-2011, 09:36 PM
This is news to me as Miles was the better high jumper in high school. Now for basketball you can argue about timing, positioning, and aggressiveness amongst other traits, but when talking pure hops, Miles is superior to Mason.

Miles vertical leap is in fact superior to Mason's. The guy is a freak in that regard. Mason is no slouch and gets up well for a big guy too, but big brother has him covered with vertical leaping ability.

Bob Green
06-30-2011, 09:58 PM
Miles vertical leap is in fact superior to Mason's. The guy is a freak in that regard. Mason is no slouch and gets up well for a big guy too, but big brother has him covered with vertical leaping ability.

Thanks for the confirmation!

devildeac
06-30-2011, 10:28 PM
He was correct. 7-0 was a magic number, especially when it was the half-time score of a Duke-unc MBB game;).


Okay, I've fallen behind in my reading the past few days, but this post earns props as the funniest I've read during my catching up efforts.

Thanks. And Jim Sumner gets the "dime" for a perfect set-up line on the 7-0 magic number bit:D.

Greg_Newton
07-01-2011, 01:00 AM
Perhaps vertical leap isn't the only variable. There's hand-eye coordination, vision, balance, strength, ball skills and others. More importantly, there's the ability to translate all of this into consistent on-court performance. I've said this before, but it's not a track meet.

Huh? Vision plays into effective height?

I'm not sure if you misread my post, but I wasn't talking about overall performance. I was saying that Mason seems to play taller than Miles on the court, which runs contrary to the suppositions that Miles is taller, longer and a better leaper.

UrinalCake
07-01-2011, 10:15 AM
I think we're all mostly in agreement here. On paper Miles is slightly taller, and can jump over a bar that is slightly higher compared to Mason. But on the court Mason uses his physical tools a little better as far as getting him up in the air in an optimal manner basketball-wise.

There's also the slouch factor. Mason stands pretty upright (to me) on the court, while Miles slouches a little bit. That can change our perception of their heights.

jimsumner
07-01-2011, 12:13 PM
Huh? Vision plays into effective height?

I'm not sure if you misread my post, but I wasn't talking about overall performance. I was saying that Mason seems to play taller than Miles on the court, which runs contrary to the suppositions that Miles is taller, longer and a better leaper.

I was referencing the part of your post where you seemed to be wondering why Mason was the lottery pick, when Miles was the better jumper.

And yes, vision is a variable in rebounding. Helps in determining the direction and angle of a potential missed shot.

Greg_Newton
07-02-2011, 05:22 PM
I was referencing the part of your post where you seemed to be wondering why Mason was the lottery pick, when Miles was the better jumper.

And yes, vision is a variable in rebounding. Helps in determining the direction and angle of a potential missed shot.

Ahhh, gotcha. That was really just a throwaway comment to the main point of my post, so I misinterpreted your response. Still though, I think a large part of why Mason has been consistently projected so high is his length and athleticism; I doubt the pros are fawning over his refined post moves, strength, consistent performance, etc.

But that vision plays into rebounding isn't really counter to anything I've said; I asked if you thought vision played "effective" height", which I had described as being defined by in part "the point in the trajectory at which [one] grabs rebounds". You wouldn't say that the fact that Dennis Rodman and Kevin Love had/have brilliant rebounding vision makes them "play taller"... just that it makes them better rebounders.