PDA

View Full Version : Duke Directors' Cup Standings - Spring Championships



Mike Corey
04-30-2011, 07:49 PM
The final winter standings are in, and Duke comes in 8th place:

The top 10:


Stanford
Ohio State
Penn State
North C*rolina
M*chigan
Oklahoma
Florida State
Duke
Wisconsin
California


Best of luck to Duke's spring sports athletes. It's quite a feat whenever we can achieve a top 10 finish in these standings.

duke09hms
05-01-2011, 12:31 AM
This is awesome, especially for a small academically-elite private school that doesn't offer the full complement of sports nor the funds to offer scholarships to many athletes.

Hopefully golf, tennis, and lacrosse can finish strong enough in the postseason. Go duke!

anon
05-01-2011, 02:28 AM
Now if only they'd factor in academics!

brevity
05-01-2011, 08:01 AM
The top 10:

4. North C*rolina
5. M*chigan


Mods? Need a ruling here. Not sure if this kind of filthy language should be allowed, even with the asterisks.

roywhite
05-01-2011, 08:09 AM
This is awesome, especially for a small academically-elite private school that doesn't offer the full complement of sports nor the funds to offer scholarships to many athletes.

Hopefully golf, tennis, and lacrosse can finish strong enough in the postseason. Go duke!

Agreed, and there are also some good performers in track and field, men and women. There's a chance of picking up some points in these areas.

uh_no
05-01-2011, 02:10 PM
Agreed, and there are also some good performers in track and field, men and women. There's a chance of picking up some points in these areas.

While both teams have great performers even on a national level, I'm not sure either could pick up enough points at ncaas for it to factor into directors cup (which I thought was just ncaa championship performance)

roywhite
05-01-2011, 02:22 PM
While both teams have great performers even on a national level, I'm not sure either could pick up enough points at ncaas for it to factor into directors cup (which I thought was just ncaa championship performance)

If I read this chart from the Director's Cup rules explanation (http://www.nacda.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/nacda/sports/directorscup/auto_pdf/dcscoring) correctly, Track and Field is a "non-bracket" sport that awards points for team scoring in the NCAA championships, and does so pretty far down the list.

I believe both Duke's men and women's teams have some athletes that can score points in the national championships. The events include the throwing events and middle to long distance, and also possibly decathlon with Curtis Beach.

uh_no
05-01-2011, 09:07 PM
If I read this chart from the Director's Cup rules explanation (http://www.nacda.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/nacda/sports/directorscup/auto_pdf/dcscoring) correctly, Track and Field is a "non-bracket" sport that awards points for team scoring in the NCAA championships, and does so pretty far down the list.

I believe both Duke's men and women's teams have some athletes that can score points in the national championships. The events include the throwing events and middle to long distance, and also possibly decathlon with Curtis Beach.

The women's 4x8 (who just won the penn relays...congratulations!) has a chance to score, curtis beach is probably the favorite in the decathlon. Curtis Beach is one of the favorites in the steeplechas

https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ustfccca.org%2Fassets% 2Frankings%2Fdiv1%2F2011-otf%2FNCAAD1_2011_outWk4_TF_NationalRankingsTop25. pdf

neither the men's nor women's team is ranked top 25 nationally.

roywhite
05-01-2011, 10:32 PM
The women's 4x8 (who just won the penn relays...congratulations!) has a chance to score, curtis beach is probably the favorite in the decathlon. Curtis Beach is one of the favorites in the steeplechas

https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ustfccca.org%2Fassets% 2Frankings%2Fdiv1%2F2011-otf%2FNCAAD1_2011_outWk4_TF_NationalRankingsTop25. pdf

neither the men's nor women's team is ranked top 25 nationally.

Well, not exactly:
The 4 x 800 relay is not contested in the NCAA championship, though 1 or 2 of the women have a chance in the 800 meters
Curtis Beach is coming on in the decathlon, but finished 3rd in the ACC, so he has plenty of competition
Ryan McDermott is the steeplechase runner, and he can definitely score in the NCAA meet

Here's the article from goduke.com on the team's results at the Penn Relays (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22490&SPID=1835&ATCLID=205145433&DB_OEM_ID=4200)

uh_no
05-01-2011, 10:49 PM
Well, not exactly:
The 4 x 800 relay is not contested in the NCAA championship, though 1 or 2 of the women have a chance in the 800 meters
Curtis Beach is coming on in the decathlon, but finished 3rd in the ACC, so he has plenty of competition
Ryan McDermott is the steeplechase runner, and he can definitely score in the NCAA meet

Here's the article from goduke.com on the team's results at the Penn Relays (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22490&SPID=1835&ATCLID=205145433&DB_OEM_ID=4200)

Thanks for the clarifications! I wish I had more time to follow the team more closely.

OZZIE4DUKE
05-02-2011, 11:12 AM
north c*rolina

NEVER capitalize north carolina. It is a sign of disrespect. I have made the appropriate correction to your quoted selection.

roywhite
05-08-2011, 07:25 AM
Tough tournament for the Duke women's golf team, as they failed to advance from the regionals to the NCAA tournament, breaking a great streak of team appearances in the finals. They have normally been a big producer of points in the Director's Cup, also.

Lindy Duncan advances as individual (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205148376&DB_OEM_ID=4200)


Unfortunately as a team, the Blue Devils missed advancing for the first time since 1997 -- breaking an incredible 13-year streak guided by Head Coach Dan Brooks. Duke finished ninth as a team and four strokes behind the final eight spot held by Atlanta Coast Conference (ACC) foe Wake Forest.

"We clearly dug ourselves into too deep of a hole the second day," commented Brooks. "We had a decent day today. It was good but that hole was too deep. It was unfortunate we didn't quite make it but we put ourselves into too deep of a hole yesterday."

bluepenguin
05-08-2011, 07:34 AM
Now if only they'd factor in academics!
Stanford would still be no. 1

roywhite
05-15-2011, 10:30 PM
Good weekend for some of the spring sports teams, as Men and Women's Lax advance, and Men and Women's Tennis advance.

Special shout out to our track teams, with wins by both the men and women in the IC4A championships, a first ever double win for Duke. Here's the writeup from goduke.com (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205151544&DB_OEM_ID=4200) This achievement does not directly provide Director's Cup points, but does indicate that the track teams could score some points in the NCAA meet.

A particularly outstanding performance was turned in by Duke freshman Tanner Anderson who cleared 7'4.25" in the high jump, a school record and one of the best marks in the country so far this season. Well done.

4decadedukie
05-16-2011, 02:16 PM
Continued Director's Cup great news for 2011. Only two non-public schools listed, both academically distinguished and relatively small, which certainly demonstrates that superior academics and outstanding intercollegiate athletics are not mutually exclusive.

duke09hms
05-20-2011, 04:06 PM
Congrats to Duke Women's Tennis for advancing past Georgia Tech to the Elite Eight!

Tough 4-3 win today.

Men unfortunately fell to Georgia in their Sweet 16 match 4-1.

MCFinARL
05-21-2011, 04:57 PM
Women's lacrosse upsets Florida in Gainesville this afternoon to reach the Final Four. :)

duke09hms
05-21-2011, 05:45 PM
Congrats to the Lady Laxers on their Final Four! I believe they play top seed Maryland next week.

Two big Elite Eight games tomorrow for Women's Tennis against UCLA and Men's Lacrosse against Notre Dame in a rematch of last year's championship game.

Let's Go Duke!!

chrishoke
05-21-2011, 05:58 PM
Congrats to the Lady Laxers on their Final Four! I believe they play top seed Maryland next week.

Two big Elite Eight games tomorrow for Women's Tennis against UCLA and Men's Lacrosse against Notre Dame in a rematch of last year's championship game.

Let's Go Duke!!

One of my favorite times of year - a chance to make three final fours this weekend. And men's golf is looking good tyo advance to the finals weekend.

roywhite
05-21-2011, 10:24 PM
One of my favorite times of year - a chance to make three final fours this weekend. And men's golf is looking good to advance to the finals weekend.

Yeah, in a big way!

Blue Devils claim team title at East Regional (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205153765&DB_OEM_ID=4200)

Eight under for the final round....excellent.

devildeac
05-21-2011, 11:25 PM
Yeah, in a big way!

Blue Devils claim team title at East Regional (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205153765&DB_OEM_ID=4200)

Eight under for the final round....excellent.

Awesome! Great info in the link. More Director Cup points:cool:.

And they did it without duketaylor (are you reading, Chuck?);).

SCMatt33
05-22-2011, 02:23 AM
With the Women's Lax win as well as Men's Golf earning a spot in the championship, Duke is now guaranteed to cross the 1000 point mark for the first time since 2005. Congrats to the entire athletic department for that accomplishment and hopefully we can add to it in the coming days and weeks.

MCFinARL
05-22-2011, 08:15 PM
Men's lax now in Final Four as well, so more points for Duke!

uh_no
05-22-2011, 08:51 PM
Men's lax now in Final Four as well, so more points for Duke!

so what do we have:

mens lax final 4
womens lax final four
womens tennis elite 8
mens golf finals
any track points left

this right?

Bluedog
05-22-2011, 09:35 PM
so what do we have:

mens lax final 4
womens lax final four
womens tennis elite 8
mens golf finals
any track points left

this right?

Not really the "finals". At least, that word to me suggests the final two. Just the NCAA championships. Does ever team that makes it get points? For that matter, do all 68 schools that make the bball tourney get points? Overall, though, great year for Duke athletics. Let's keep it up! Go Duke!

uh_no
05-22-2011, 09:43 PM
Not really the "finals". At least, that word to me suggests the final two. Just the NCAA championships. Does ever team that makes it get points? For that matter, do all 68 schools that make the bball tourney get points? Overall, though, great year for Duke athletics. Let's keep it up! Go Duke!

right.....I think its still finals, as opposed to regionals

SCMatt33
05-23-2011, 12:15 AM
Not really the "finals". At least, that word to me suggests the final two. Just the NCAA championships. Does ever team that makes it get points? For that matter, do all 68 schools that make the bball tourney get points? Overall, though, great year for Duke athletics. Let's keep it up! Go Duke!

The NCAA refers to it as the "Finals" so that name is correct. In golf, every single team that makes even the regional round scores points. For bracket sports like basketball, every single team in the bracket scores points. In general, as long as your team qualifies for the NCAA championship, in whatever form that it takes place, you score directors cup points.

The notable exceptions are individual sports, like swimming, wrestling, and track, where the "team" doesn't qualify or not, only individuals on the team. In those sports, at least one individual must score "team points" and the team places at the event for the team to score directors cup points. The threshold for this varies for each sport. In wrestling, somebody simply has to win a match at some point to score points. It could range from championship bracket matches (which score more) to the last place consolation match (which scores less). In track and swimming, somebody must place in the top 8 of their event to score points. This is a much tougher threshold. There have been many years where Duke has sent representation to the championship events, but no one places and Duke scores no directors cup points.

If anyone is curious about this in more detail, here is the official scoring system from their website. (http://www.nacda.com/directorscup/nacda-directorscup-scoring.html) It doesn't really explain who gets points any better than I did, but it does explain how many points are allotted based on what kind of finish a team gets.

In response to uh_no's original inquiry about spring points remaining, those are correct in addition to a sweet 16 for men's tennis, and a T-25 for women's golf. They did not qualify for the finals, but as I mentioned earlier, you only have to make regionals to score in golf. The women finished one spot out of qualifying for the finals, and there were 24 teams who did qualify so they will share 25th with the teams from other regions that finished one spot out. Currently, based on the lax win today, if both lax teams lose in the semis, men's golf finishes dead last, and no track points are scored, Duke will score 1034 points which will be the highest total ever for the school, eclipsing the 1021.25 points from 2004-5, although it should be mentioned that the current scoring system was adopted in 2002-3, before which it was more difficult to score points.

burnspbesq
05-23-2011, 08:07 PM
Alas, women's tennis lost to UCLA in the quarters. So we only have five opportunities left to increase our point total.

SCMatt33
06-02-2011, 04:44 PM
The third round of the men's golf championship is streaming live right now (http://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/files/external/liveplayer/champplayer/player.html?gameId=2011_MGO-1_101). As I type this, Duke is on it's second nine, tied for 13th at +25, six shots out of 8th place. 8th is important because the top eight teams after today "make the cut" and move on to the match play portion starting tomorrow. BTW six shots is much less in team golf than it is in individual golf, so Duke still has a chance, not a great one, but a chance, to earn a spot in match play.

MCFinARL
06-02-2011, 06:44 PM
The third round of the men's golf championship is streaming live right now (http://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/files/external/liveplayer/champplayer/player.html?gameId=2011_MGO-1_101). As I type this, Duke is on it's second nine, tied for 13th at +25, six shots out of 8th place. 8th is important because the top eight teams after today "make the cut" and move on to the match play portion starting tomorrow. BTW six shots is much less in team golf than it is in individual golf, so Duke still has a chance, not a great one, but a chance, to earn a spot in match play.

Now in 10th, 2 shots behind two teams tied for 8th. But Duke is on the last couple of holes and those teams have several more to play--so we have to hope those are tough holes that the teams ahead will struggle on.

dpslaw
06-02-2011, 07:36 PM
Now in 10th, 2 shots behind two teams tied for 8th. But Duke is on the last couple of holes and those teams have several more to play--so we have to hope those are tough holes that the teams ahead will struggle on.

In the clubhouse at +25, currently tied for seventh!

JasonEvans
06-02-2011, 08:50 PM
In the clubhouse at +25, currently tied for seventh!

Currently in 8th place, but it looks like we will advance. The only team with any chance to catch us is Iowa. They are still on the course with a few players on 17 and 18 and the Iowa team is in 10th at +28. They would need a phenomenal closing to get to +25. I think we are safe to be the #8 team.

-Jason "the team shot +5 on the day, best of any team in the entire tourney" Evans

SCMatt33
06-02-2011, 08:56 PM
Currently in 8th place, but it looks like we will advance. The only team with any chance to catch us is Iowa. They are still on the course with a few players on 17 and 18 and the Iowa team is in 10th at +28. They would need a phenomenal closing to get to +25. I think we are safe to be the #8 team.

-Jason "the team shot +5 on the day, best of any team in the entire tourney" Evans

They actually only update the full leader board intermittently. According to Iowa's score card page, They have only one guy left on the course, with everyone else parring the last. Unless he hit a double eagle and it hasn't posted yet, Duke will move on and face 2nd ranked UCLA tomorrow.

EDIT: BTW, Duke's +5 team score was tied with Michigan for the best round of the day. This was pretty remarkable when you consider it took Duke having the best round of the day to move on by 1 shot.

EDIT 2: Didn't feel like a new post, but they just posted the final score for Iowa and Duke will officially move on to tomorrow!!!!!

roywhite
06-02-2011, 09:16 PM
They actually only update the full leader board intermittently. According to Iowa's score card page, They have only one guy left on the course, with everyone else parring the last. Unless he hit a double eagle and it hasn't posted yet, Duke will move on and face 2nd ranked UCLA tomorrow.

EDIT: BTW, Duke's +5 team score was tied with Michigan for the best round of the day. This was pretty remarkable when you consider it took Duke having the best round of the day to move on by 1 shot.

EDIT 2: Didn't feel like a new post, but they just posted the final score for Iowa and Duke will officially move on to tomorrow!!!!!

Hey, good news; thanks.

How does it work from here on out?
#8 vs #1, #7 vs #2, etc. in team play?
Or something else?

dpslaw
06-02-2011, 10:28 PM
Hey, good news; thanks.

How does it work from here on out?
#8 vs #1, #7 vs #2, etc. in team play?
Or something else?

That's correct. Duke (8) vs. UCLA (1) in match play tomorrow.

OZZIE4DUKE
06-02-2011, 10:56 PM
That's correct. Duke (8) vs. UCLA (1) in match play tomorrow.
It's always fun to beat UCLA. Will their pot plant be following the team around the course rooting them on? :cool:

devildeac
06-02-2011, 11:26 PM
It's always fun to beat UCLA. Will their pot plant be following the team around the course rooting them on? :cool:

Not sure if they have a Jelani playing for them or wear they might be.;)

burnspbesq
06-02-2011, 11:57 PM
It's always fun to beat UCLA. Will their pot plant be following the team around the course rooting them on? :cool:

Unclear why the Stanford mascot would be cheering for da Brooinz. Hopefully the sight of weak blue will inspire our guys. Pretend it's Carolina, and act accordingly!

Olympic Fan
06-03-2011, 03:27 PM
With today's 3-2 upset of No. 1 seed UCLA, Duke reaches the semifinals.

That's the Final Four, right?

Not sure how many points that is in the Director's Cup, but I'm sure it's enough to guarantee that Duke will finish with its best score since the scoring system was changed. It makes it pretty likely that we can hang on to a top 5 finish in the final standings.

I know we're getting no points for baseball. Is there anything else out there? Is track and field over? I know we qualified a few athletes for the nations. Can we get any points there?

Frybay
06-03-2011, 04:47 PM
http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205156971&DB_OEM_ID=4200

According to GoDuke.com

OZZIE4DUKE
06-03-2011, 05:33 PM
It's always fun to beat UCLA. Will their pot plant be following the team around the course rooting them on? :cool:


Unclear why the Stanford mascot would be cheering for da Brooinz. Hopefully the sight of weak blue will inspire our guys. Pretend it's Carolina, and act accordingly!
Don't they have some sort of palm tree mascot that travels with them? I'm pretty sure they had that thing at MSG when they beat us when Jason Williams & Co. were freshman. And no, I wasn't smokin' (or drinking) anything.

roywhite
06-03-2011, 06:19 PM
With today's 3-2 upset of No. 1 seed UCLA, Duke reaches the semifinals.

That's the Final Four, right?

Not sure how many points that is in the Director's Cup, but I'm sure it's enough to guarantee that Duke will finish with its best score since the scoring system was changed. It makes it pretty likely that we can hang on to a top 5 finish in the final standings.

I know we're getting no points for baseball. Is there anything else out there? Is track and field over? I know we qualified a few athletes for the nations. Can we get any points there?

Track and field nationals are next weekend, from June 9-11. Duke qualified 10 athletes between the men and women's teams, which is a record number. Some chance to score points with McDermott in men's steeplechase and women's middle distances; the freshman high jumper Tanner Anderson, who set the school record with a 7' 4.25" jump, one of the best in the nation, didn't make it through regionals. Curtis Beach in the decathlon could also score. Nice to see the programs getting better.

Looks like men's golf will go against Georgia in the semifinals; ACC champion Ga Tech fell in the quarterfinals.

SCMatt33
06-03-2011, 06:27 PM
With today's 3-2 upset of No. 1 seed UCLA, Duke reaches the semifinals.

That's the Final Four, right?

Not sure how many points that is in the Director's Cup, but I'm sure it's enough to guarantee that Duke will finish with its best score since the scoring system was changed. It makes it pretty likely that we can hang on to a top 5 finish in the final standings.

I know we're getting no points for baseball. Is there anything else out there? Is track and field over? I know we qualified a few athletes for the nations. Can we get any points there?

Duke had actually done enough to have it's highest raw score ever just by making the finals in golf, let alone making and winning in match play. The caveat is that 2005 would have been higher if the current scoring system was implemented back then. With golf's win today, Duke is guaranteed at least 82.5 points for the event and 1074 points on the year. The only other points out there for Duke are indeed track points. In order to earn them, someone will have to finish 8th or better in his or her respective event. Only the top 8 in each event score points towards the team standings, and a team must score at least one point in order to place and score director's cup points. There are 10 athletes who are represented Duke (6 women, 4 men) but only a couple will have realistic expectations of competing for the top 8.

shoutingncu
06-03-2011, 08:34 PM
Now if only they'd factor in academics!

I thought they did...


In addition, four Atlantic Coast Conference schools are ranked in the top 10 - North Carolina (3rd; 1,070.25 points), Duke, Virginia (9th; 828.50 points) and Maryland (10th; 807.50 points) while Florida State sits in 11th place (794.50 points).


(from the goduke article linked)

77devil
06-03-2011, 08:46 PM
Don't they have some sort of palm tree mascot that travels with them? I'm pretty sure they had that thing at MSG when they beat us when Jason Williams & Co. were freshman. And no, I wasn't smokin' (or drinking) anything.

Ozzie:

I think you were doing something and are confusing the Stanford tree.
http://www.insidesocal.com/tomhoffarth/archives/2006/08/no-treehugging.html

Born and raised in LA, and while there were plenty of trees and weed in Westwood, the only UCLA mascot was/is the bruin bear.

SCMatt33
06-08-2011, 07:34 PM
The NCAA track and field championships are underway. There is currently a live stream on NCAA.com (http://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/files/external/liveplayer/champplayer/player.html?gameId=2011_XTO-1_101), though it is not full production quality, just cameras and in stadium audio. So far, Cydney Ross has qualified for the women's 800m final, finishing 7th in the prelims. Since there are only 8 qualifiers, she is guaranteed to be an All-American and will score team points for Duke, which means that the Duke women will appear in the final standings and score at least some Director's cup points. She ran a 2:04.79 today, which I believe is her personal best and a Duke record. The NCAA preview article on Go Duke stated that her personal best (and the Duke record) coming in was 2:05.32.

In Men's Javelin, John Austin threw 69.79m to finish 14th.

Curtis Beach is currently 5th in the Decathlon after 4 events. He will be running in the 400m very soon.

EDIT: Curtis absolutely destroyed the 400m winning it with a run of 46.90 which is a personal best by .8 seconds. There was only one other competitor who even broke 48 seconds. That win vaults Beach up to second in the overall standings after day 1.

MCFinARL
06-08-2011, 10:27 PM
Julie Bottorff just won the women's 10000 meters, making her (according to the commentators) the first Duke champion in history in NCAA outdoor track. The race was fantastic--she stayed with the lead pack throughout and then just took off in the last lap and a half. Awesome!

SCMatt33
06-08-2011, 10:39 PM
Julie Bottorff just won the women's 10000 meters, making her (according to the commentators) the first Duke champion in history in NCAA outdoor track. The race was fantastic--she stayed with the lead pack throughout and then just took off in the last lap and a half. Awesome!

Just beat you by a minute posting the new thread.

Anyway, In addition to the 10000, Ryan McDermott finished 6th in his heat to earn the final automatic qualifying spot in the Finals for the steeplechase. Here's a quick recap of Duke's awesome Day 1 at the meet:

Curtis Beach: 2nd overall after 5 of 10 events in the Decathlon including a win in the 400m
John Austin: 14th place in the Men's Javelin final
Cydney Ross: Qualified 7th of 8 for the Women's 800m final
Ryan McDermott: Qualified 13th of 14 overall for Men's 3000m Steeplechase final
Carly Seymour: DNF Women's 10000m final
Juliet Bottorff: Women's 10000m National Champion!!!!!

MCFinARL
06-09-2011, 09:01 PM
Kate Van Buskirk has qualified for the final in the women's 1500 meters--but she will have to pick up the pace to score as she has the eleventh of the 12 qualifying times.

yancem
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
Just went to the NACDA web site and Duke is currently 4th with 991.50 points. The ACC has 4 teams in the top 10: unc (3), Duke (4), UVA (9) and MD (10). Pretty good showing by both Duke and the ACC.

http://www.nacda.com/

Olympic Fan
06-10-2011, 04:36 PM
Just went to the NACDA web site and Duke is currently 4th with 991.50 points. The ACC has 4 teams in the top 10: unc (3), Duke (4), UVA (9) and MD (10). Pretty good showing by both Duke and the ACC.

http://www.nacda.com/

Those are the June 2 standings. They don't include men's golf (where Duke will get a boatload of points after finishing in the Final Four) or either men's track or women's track -- Duke is sure of getting some points in both of those sports. It also doesn't include baseball, where Duke is not going to score.

I think it's now pretty likely that Duke will finish fourth ... I can't see the Devils overtaking No. 3 UNC (79 points ahead with points still coming in baseball, at least); or dropping below No. 5 Penn State (102 points behind).

SCMatt33
06-10-2011, 05:02 PM
Now that the decathlon is in the books, there are a few things to update on the director's cup front. The first is now that both the Men's and Women's teams have put points on the board, Duke will earn cup points in 20 sports this year. That is actually significant in that it is the maximum allowed by director's cup rules. If any other sport had scored, the lowest score for that gender would have been removed, so that's pretty cool. It also beats the previous Duke record of 17 sports set in 2001, 2008, and 2010.

After the previous official update, where Duke had 991.5 points, the Men's Golf team secured third place at this year's championship, which will raise the total to 1074. Based on the last few years of track results, Duke will finish at least in the mid to low 20's for Women's track, and in the mid thirties for Men's track. This will likely add up to between 80 and 90 cup points (assuming that other Duke athletes don't score points which they aren't guaranteed). This will raise Duke's point total somewhere north of 1150 for the year.

Coming into this year, Duke's best year was 2005, when they scored 1024.25 points. Prior to 2007, school's could only score points in indoor OR outdoor track for each gender. Also, the scoring system for fencing was slightly different, costing Duke a few points. Had the current scoring system been in place, Duke would have scored 1095.25 points. What does that mean? At least by director's cup standards, this will be Duke's best season ever. That is of coarse far from a accurate standard, as it doesn't account for most Duke fans caring about certain sports more than others, and National Championships are only given slightly more points than other good finishes, even though they mean a lot more in most fans' hearts.

As far as Duke's final place, they are currently in fourth, and even with the great golf and track results, will not have enough to push in front of anyone ahead of them, and will be pretty close with Florida coming from behind, but I would think that there is a very good chance that Duke will finish in the top 5 for just the second time ever.

JaMarcus Russell
06-10-2011, 10:16 PM
I'm curious if anyone knows which sports aren't fully funded by the Duke Athletic Department. I am pretty sure track, swimming, and rowing are not, while lacrosse, soccer, basketball, baseball, and football are.

How is the situation at other ACC schools like UNC and UVA? Seems like Duke is doing an amazing job getting top notch student-athletes with all things considered.

devildeac
06-10-2011, 10:58 PM
I'm curious if anyone knows which sports aren't fully funded by the Duke Athletic Department. I am pretty sure track, swimming, and rowing are not, while lacrosse, soccer, basketball, baseball, and football are.

How is the situation at other ACC schools like UNC and UVA? Seems like Duke is doing an amazing job getting top notch student-athletes with all things considered.

Not quite sure what you mean by "fully funded." I'll guess only WBB, MBB and FB fit that definition and not LAX, soccer, baseball and many others like wrestling, VB, golf and tennis in that X# of schollies are available for each sport and are divided among the varsity athletes as "partials" or full scholarships.

roywhite
06-10-2011, 11:14 PM
Not quite sure what you mean by "fully funded." I'll guess only WBB, MBB and FB fit that definition and not LAX, soccer, baseball and many others like wrestling, VB, golf and tennis in that X# of schollies are available for each sport and are divided among the varsity athletes as "partials" or full scholarships.

Perhaps the more specific question is where Duke stands on scholaships given in certain sports vs the maximum allowable by the NCAA.

Here's a list of the maximum scholarships by sport (http://www.hsbaseballweb.com/scholarships_by_sport.htm)

For example, in wrestling, Duke could give a total of 9.9 scholarships, and they can be split up; and in track in field, 12.6 scholarships, and they also can be split up. But does Duke approach these total scholarship numbers? I don't think the numbers are public, but probably not.

Stanford, I believe, fully funds the maximum number of scholarships in each varsity sport in which it participates. Very few schools do. UNC and UVa are probably ahead of Duke in the number of scholarships given.

All this makes the Directors' Cup results this year (and others) even more impressive. Duke has some very talented athletes and coaches.

MCFinARL
06-10-2011, 11:31 PM
Perhaps the more specific question is where Duke stands on scholaships given in certain sports vs the maximum allowable by the NCAA.

Here's a list of the maximum scholarships by sport (http://www.hsbaseballweb.com/scholarships_by_sport.htm)

For example, in wrestling, Duke could give a total of 9.9 scholarships, and they can be split up; and in track in field, 12.6 scholarships, and they also can be split up. But does Duke approach these total scholarship numbers? I don't think the numbers are public, but probably not.

Stanford, I believe, fully funds the maximum number of scholarships in each varsity sport in which it participates. Very few schools do. UNC and UVa are probably ahead of Duke in the number of scholarships given.

All this makes the Directors' Cup results this year (and others) even more impressive. Duke has some very talented athletes and coaches.

In this sense I think the Duke lacrosse teams are at or near "full funding" as I think they have 10-12 scholarships that they spread among the players. I believe someone elsewhere in this thread (or maybe the Curtis Beach thread) said Duke men's track has only 3-4 scholarships, so that would be well below the maximum allowable.

From SCMatt's post (sorry, I don't know how to double quote): "At least by director's cup standards, this will be Duke's best season ever. That is of coarse far from a accurate standard, as it doesn't account for most Duke fans caring about certain sports more than others, and National Championships are only given slightly more points than other good finishes, even though they mean a lot more in most fans' hearts."

I'm not sure what you mean when you say this is "far from an accurate standard"--it's completely accurate by the principles governing the Directors Cup, which emphasize success in a broad range of sports, including the ones played for love rather than for fan adulation and/or the hope of a professional career. It may not be the standard that reflects most fans' interests, for sure--but that would cut both ways for Duke, where our consistently good basketball performances would be offset by our football performances. If you are more interested in very high finishes in "major" sports, the Capital One Cup might be more your cup of tea--but you won't find Duke doing nearly so well there--they are currently 16th in the men's standings and 12th in the women's.

SCMatt33
06-11-2011, 12:09 AM
I'm not sure what you mean when you say this is "far from an accurate standard"--it's completely accurate by the principles governing the Directors Cup, which emphasize success in a broad range of sports, including the ones played for love rather than for fan adulation and/or the hope of a professional career. It may not be the standard that reflects most fans' interests, for sure--but that would cut both ways for Duke, where our consistently good basketball performances would be offset by our football performances. If you are more interested in very high finishes in "major" sports, the Capital One Cup might be more your cup of tea--but you won't find Duke doing nearly so well there--they are currently 16th in the men's standings and 12th in the women's.

That's pretty much what I meant in terms of reflecting fan interest. The directors cup is kind of like the old NASCAR championship in the pre-chase era. It was based entirely on consistency, and while winning was rewarded, it was not rewarded to the extent that it is today. In the director's cup, it is far more important to score in many sports and do pretty well (top 10-20) rather than do really well in any of them. I would imagine that when asked what Duke's best year was as an athletic department, you would be hard pressed to choose one when there were no national champs or runner's-up. It's not to say that either way is wrong, because there is no definitive way to quantify this. When I said "far from accurate," I really meant "far from definitive" as opposed to "inaccurate."

As far as the Capital One cup, I think it is a load of BS that overemphasizes which sports are more important, and uses somewhat dubious means of determining which ones go where. While Men's lacrosse is very important to Duke fans, it is entirely a regional sport with little participation outside the Northeast, especially compared to sports like golf and tennis, which aren't as popular in a single spot, but have much better participation. Lacrosse, though, gets a better spot on the scoring list largely because there's a big ESPN contract and Lacrosse needs to be promoted more. Even if this wasn't the case, the system still stinks because it only awards points to the top 10 in a given sport, and winning a title in a high end sport is enough on its own merits to garner a high overall finish. Take the current Men's rankings. Eastern Washington did absolutely nothing this year as a program other than win the FCS football title. That alone, however, has them in second place in the standings. There still has to be some award for consistency as an overall athletic department, and not just give the title to a single sport.

My personal preference is something similar to what the directors cup had immediately prior to the current scoring system, which still gave points to all who made a tournament, and gave them significant points to make an impact, but making Final Fours was important. I think that the current system is a bit backward in that making a 64 team tournament garners 25 points, and winning a first round game gets another 25 (for a total of 50), but winning a championship game only gives a team 10 points (100 for champ, 90 for second)? That doesn't make sense to me that a first round game is 2.5 times more important than the title game. Those numbers should be reversed.

JaMarcus Russell
06-11-2011, 02:25 AM
Perhaps the more specific question is where Duke stands on scholaships given in certain sports vs the maximum allowable by the NCAA.

For example, in wrestling, Duke could give a total of 9.9 scholarships, and they can be split up; and in track in field, 12.6 scholarships, and they also can be split up. But does Duke approach these total scholarship numbers? I don't think the numbers are public, but probably not.

Stanford, I believe, fully funds the maximum number of scholarships in each varsity sport in which it participates. Very few schools do. UNC and UVa are probably ahead of Duke in the number of scholarships given.

This is exactly what I meant by fully-funded. I remember reading a while back that one of Kevin White's goals was to get each varsity sport fully funded, much like Stanford. I was just curious if the numbers were public for each sport.

From my time at Duke, I know that swimming for example was nowhere near being fully funded from in the mid-2000s. I noticed that fencing isn't listed in that link. Is that an oversight or does Duke (and every other D-1 program) really not give any scholarship money to people like Becca Ward? That's really surprising, but I guess I can see fencing being even lower on the NCAA hierarchy than water polo.

hughgs
06-11-2011, 04:29 AM
This is exactly what I meant by fully-funded. I remember reading a while back that one of Kevin White's goals was to get each varsity sport fully funded, much like Stanford. I was just curious if the numbers were public for each sport.

From my time at Duke, I know that swimming for example was nowhere near being fully funded from in the mid-2000s. I noticed that fencing isn't listed in that link. Is that an oversight or does Duke (and every other D-1 program) really not give any scholarship money to people like Becca Ward? That's really surprising, but I guess I can see fencing being even lower on the NCAA hierarchy than water polo.

I believe that volleyball uses their full allocation of scholarships. I was also under the impression that baseball used their full allocation.

MCFinARL
06-11-2011, 10:28 AM
That's pretty much what I meant in terms of reflecting fan interest. The directors cup is kind of like the old NASCAR championship in the pre-chase era. It was based entirely on consistency, and while winning was rewarded, it was not rewarded to the extent that it is today. In the director's cup, it is far more important to score in many sports and do pretty well (top 10-20) rather than do really well in any of them. I would imagine that when asked what Duke's best year was as an athletic department, you would be hard pressed to choose one when there were no national champs or runner's-up. It's not to say that either way is wrong, because there is no definitive way to quantify this. When I said "far from accurate," I really meant "far from definitive" as opposed to "inaccurate."

As far as the Capital One cup, I think it is a load of BS that overemphasizes which sports are more important, and uses somewhat dubious means of determining which ones go where. While Men's lacrosse is very important to Duke fans, it is entirely a regional sport with little participation outside the Northeast, especially compared to sports like golf and tennis, which aren't as popular in a single spot, but have much better participation. Lacrosse, though, gets a better spot on the scoring list largely because there's a big ESPN contract and Lacrosse needs to be promoted more. Even if this wasn't the case, the system still stinks because it only awards points to the top 10 in a given sport, and winning a title in a high end sport is enough on its own merits to garner a high overall finish. Take the current Men's rankings. Eastern Washington did absolutely nothing this year as a program other than win the FCS football title. That alone, however, has them in second place in the standings. There still has to be some award for consistency as an overall athletic department, and not just give the title to a single sport.

My personal preference is something similar to what the directors cup had immediately prior to the current scoring system, which still gave points to all who made a tournament, and gave them significant points to make an impact, but making Final Fours was important. I think that the current system is a bit backward in that making a 64 team tournament garners 25 points, and winning a first round game gets another 25 (for a total of 50), but winning a championship game only gives a team 10 points (100 for champ, 90 for second)? That doesn't make sense to me that a first round game is 2.5 times more important than the title game. Those numbers should be reversed.

Well, I completely agree with you about the Capital One Cup, which seems completely market/promotion driven. And, as you explain your position here, I agree with you about the Directors Cup too. It's good to recognize a larger number of teams and a larger number of sports--but there probably should be a bigger difference between the top and bottom levels of rewarded performance than there is now. If you look at most scoring systems for sports like track and swimming, where multiple participants score in each event, there are premiums for the top performances. For example, in the NCAA track championship going on now, the first three places are scored 10-8-6, and the next five places are scored 5-4-3-2-1, so the top two finishes get extra points. Something similar might make sense for the Directors Cup.

SCMatt33
06-11-2011, 01:27 PM
Kate Van Buskirk just took 3rd in the 1500, having a great kick after another slow paced race. Congrats to Kate! That will do a lot for the women's team in the standings.

EDIT: After looking at some past results, having 17 team points instead of 11 should be enough to place Duke in the mid-teens as opposed to the mid twenties for the event.

MCFinARL
06-11-2011, 01:39 PM
Kate Van Buskirk just took 3rd in the 1500, having a great kick after another slow paced race. Congrats to Kate! That will do a lot for the women's team in the standings.

EDIT: After looking at some past results, having 17 team points instead of 11 should be enough to place Duke in the mid-teens as opposed to the mid twenties for the event.

I hope so. According to the NCAA website, Duke is in 13th after the 1500. The team currently in 20th has 11 points. Most likely they will slip some as some teams behind them have sprinters or relays that are likely to score. But this is a very good showing. Van Buskirk ran a very smart race and very nearly came in second. And who knows where Cydney Ross would have finished in the 800 if she hadn't lost her shoe--apparently she was running near the middle at the time.

MCFinARL
06-11-2011, 03:09 PM
Duke women finish in 16th place; men in a three-way tie for 34th.

If I understand the scoring system correctly, that will give Duke 58.5 points for the women's finish and somewhere around 40 for the men's (not sure what the impact of the tie is).

SCMatt33
06-11-2011, 03:59 PM
Duke women finish in 16th place; men in a three-way tie for 34th.

If I understand the scoring system correctly, that will give Duke 58.5 points for the women's finish and somewhere around 40 for the men's (not sure what the impact of the tie is).

Ties score the average of the tied teams. 34, 35, and 36th score 40, 39, and 38 points, which means that the men will score 39 points for the event.

Adding those points to the 82.5 that the men's golf team scored for a two way tie for third (men's golf is a non bracket sport even if the match play part has a bracket feel to it) as well as the 991.5 point that Duke had after the first spring release, which included women's golf, both tennis teams and both lacrosse teams, Duke will finish the year with 1171.5 points, besting it's previous best by 150 points. Adjusted for the current system, Duke will beat it's previous best by about 75 points.

As for place, Duke is currently in 4th, but despite better than expected finishes in yet to be counted sports, they do not have enough to pass anyone in front of them and will be passed by Florida and California no matter what happens the rest of the way with baseball. I haven't fully checked, but I doubt that any of the other teams below them will catch up, so as long as all of my calculations are correct, Duke will finish in 6th place overall.

SCMatt33
06-11-2011, 07:20 PM
Sorry for the double post, but my calculations from earlier today were incomplete. I forgot to factor in the maximum number of sports for each school. The director's cup has a rule that a school can only score points in 10 men's sports and 10 women's sports. Coed sports default to women, but can score in either gender depending on space available. I had mentioned in an earlier post that Duke's track performance means that they will reach this maximum for the first time, with 10 women's, 9 men's, and 1 coed sport scoring.

While Florida and Cal both come in at or under this mark, there is a school ahead of us that will have to cut two scores...UNC! As of the the first spring update, they had scored points in 10 women's sports, 8 men's sport, and 1 coed sport. Before the end of the year, they will add points in men's and women's outdoor track as well as baseball. As of the last update, they had scored 1070.25 points. They scored a 40th place finish in mens track worth 34 points. This brings their total to 1104.25. Women's track finished in a 6 way tie for 54th worth 17.5 points, but as this is the lowest women's score of the year, and they had already scored in 10 women's sports, UNC won't get those points. Their baseball team will score a good number of point no matter what happens from this point on, so to make room, they will need to get rid of their low scoring sport. Since fencing can be moved to either gender, it can be any sport at all. This happens to be men's indoor track, at 21.5 points. Those points were already counted and must be subtracted, giving UNC 1082.75 before baseball is counted.

We already know that Duke will finish with 1171.5 points, meaning that UNC will need to score more than 88.75 points in baseball to finish ahead of Duke. The only way to do that is to finish 1st or 2nd, so UNC will have to hold on to it's super regional (which it is 3 outs away from doing in a rain delay) and qualify for the championship series at the CWS in order to beat Duke. UNC has a very good baseball team so there is a good chance of that happening, but Duke actually has a chance to move up to 5th overall, and more importantly, finish ahead of UNC in the director's cup.

roywhite
06-18-2011, 11:00 AM
Duke Moves to Third in Director's Cup Standings (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205161331&DB_OEM_ID=4200)

Great job by the Blue Devil athletes and coaches.

I'll defer to Matt for the final scoring analysis; I assume UNC could still surpass us, based on the final results of the College World Series.

SCMatt33
06-18-2011, 11:29 AM
Duke Moves to Third in Director's Cup Standings (http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&ATCLID=205161331&DB_OEM_ID=4200)

Great job by the Blue Devil athletes and coaches.

I'll defer to Matt for the final scoring analysis; I assume UNC could still surpass us, based on the final results of the College World Series.

I'm pretty sure that my earlier analysis is correct for the final standings. All three teams directly behind us are in the CWS, which guarantees them at least 73 points (if they go 0-2). All are within 50, but only Florida and Cal will add the full amount of points. UNC will lose 39 points to counter whatever they gain, because they are over the limit for number of sports. To earn enough net points to pass Duke, they must come in at least second at the CWS.

MCFinARL
06-22-2011, 09:51 PM
UNC eliminated by Vanderbilt. SCMatt--does that mean Duke finishes 5th?

PS--I feel so old--last out a fly ball caught by Carl Yastrzemski's grandson.

pfrduke
06-22-2011, 10:03 PM
UNC eliminated by Vanderbilt. SCMatt--does that mean Duke finishes 5th?

PS--I feel so old--last out a fly ball caught by Carl Yastrzemski's grandson.

I think UNC had to eliminate Florida to pass us, but I'll defer to the experts.

SCMatt33
06-22-2011, 11:52 PM
UNC eliminated by Vanderbilt. SCMatt--does that mean Duke finishes 5th?

PS--I feel so old--last out a fly ball caught by Carl Yastrzemski's grandson.

Yes, this should be correct. UNC has 1121.75 right now. They will gain 78 points from baseball for finishing in a two way tie for 5th (with the loser of Virginia/Cal) bringing them to 1199.75 points. Since they have scored in 22 sports (with 20 as the max), they will lose 17.5 points from Women's outdoor track and 21.5 points from Men's indoor track. This should drop them to 1160.75, just 10.75 points shy of Duke's 1171.5.