Alex Murphy Cleared to Graduate High School Early

[Bluedog]

According to Wiederer...


Only now, Murphy has apparently been cleared to graduate early from St. Mark’s School near Boston, allowing him to potentially enroll at Duke this fall, a year earlier than originally planned.

http://blogs.fayobserver.com/accbasketball/April-2011/Sixth-sense--Duke-hoping-to-add-two-more-stars-to-

He also says it is expected that Daniels commits either during or shortly after his visit. Thought this was an interesting enough topic to have its own thread so that people would see it. He doesn't definitively say Murphy will enroll at Duke early, but it would seem silly to me to graduate early at his high school and just stay there. Going to a post-grad year at IMG Academy or something like that a la Daniels would be possible, but I'd imagine if he's already committed to Duke, he'd rather go to Duke for free and train with some of the best players in the country. Interesting development!

[Starter]

That would be an incredible assortment of talent. It would also be incredibly crowded. I'd be intrigued to see which freshmen step up and play serious minutes -- guys like Daniels, Cook and Murphy may be ready to play right away, and we know Austin is. I'd also be interested to see how Gbinije and Hairston fit into the equation, if they do.

[billyj]

We will have so many freshmen coming in. How is the rotation going to work out?

[moonpie23]

That would be an incredible assortment of talent. It would also be incredibly crowded. I'd be intrigued to see which freshmen step up and play serious minutes -- guys like Daniels, Cook and Murphy may be ready to play right away, and we know Austin is. I'd also be interested to see how Gbinije and Hairston fit into the equation, if they do.

WOW..this will be SO interesting....especially if Kyrie decides to return.....

[COYS]

That would be an incredible assortment of talent. It would also be incredibly crowded. I'd be intrigued to see which freshmen step up and play serious minutes -- guys like Daniels, Cook and Murphy may be ready to play right away, and we know Austin is. I'd also be interested to see how Gbinije and Hairston fit into the equation, if they do.

If I'm not mistaken, some of the more knowledgeable posters have also indicated that Murphy may elect to redshirt for what would have been his final year of high school believing that he will improve more substantially if he spends a year practicing at Duke rather than playing high school level competition.

[adukeforduke]

If this happens we are likely to see at least one redshirt. I would think it would be Murphy or MG but both are extremely skilled so who knows. This could also mean a possible transfer. It is certain though that some very talented players may not see much time next year, Hairston, Thornton, MG, Murphy, Dawkins. Very interesting development.

[Lord Ash]

WOW..this will be SO interesting....especially if Kyrie decides to return.....

Kyrie has given no reason to think he will return. In fact, the more guys who return, the better his prospective draft spot becomes. Kyrie is not coming back.

An interesting development... we are going to be PACKED with talent.

EDIT TO ADD: Moon, dream for me too:) BTW, you are out of space in your inbox:)

[Starter]

If I'm not mistaken, some of the more knowledgeable posters have also indicated that Murphy may elect to redshirt for what would have been his final year of high school believing that he will improve more substantially if he spends a year practicing at Duke rather than playing high school level competition.

Yeah, I saw that. There's no question he'd get more improvement out of practicing at Duke than playing high school games, I just wonder whether a player of his caliber would be interested in a redshirt year. Scout and ESPN have him as the No. 2 small forward in his class, Rivals has him No. 1, and all have him ranked between 11th and 15th overall. He's been compared to Singler, who was ready to play from the day he walked onto campus.

And of course, you have this quote from the ESPN article (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=6098590) about his commitment:

Asked if Duke was prepared to take him immediately next fall he said, "Yes, they are."

I think it's far more likely Marshall Plumlee redshirts than Murphy. Plumlee is probably at Duke for the long haul, while Murphy has a decent chance to leave early. And though Plumlee surprised me in a good way in the McDonald's Game, it doesn't appear like he'd have much of a chance to play next season.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Guess practices are going to be more competitive than the actual games. Sweet.

BTW - I think we have around 6 players that can play the 3 this year. "Singler Replacement Tryouts" will be a I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this....

[wilko]

Kyrie has given no reason to think he will return. In fact, the more guys who return, the better his prospective draft spot becomes. Kyrie is not coming back.

An interesting development... we are going to be PACKED with talent.

My gut impression is that you are 100% correct. I'm not holding my breath for Kyries' return. For the long haul I'd say that Kyries' move to leave after 1 yr could help put Duke into consideration as a destination from other elite players that may have been less likely to give Duke a look in the past. I'm happy for Kyrie. Hope he gets what he wants..

But the reality is several things are out of his hands... as I understand it, The Irvings' have not yet hired an agent and his Dad is managing the affairs until that point. There is uncertainty with the CBA and a lock-out.

Now if they lean something "alarming" about those developments and have a change of heart about early entry there is a SLIM possibility he could return IF an agent has NOT been inked by that time, correct?

Now as I said to start, I'm not holding my breath over that. I expect there is enuff $ to go around and the deal will get worked out. But until the door is closed and locked ... its still open.

[timmy c]

The news that Murphy could arrive early makes me suspicious that Mason is on his way to the 2011 NBA draft. I hope that this is just paranoia on my part. :(

[Duvall]

The news that Murphy could arrive early makes me suspicious that Mason is on his way to the 2011 NBA draft. I hope that this is just paranoia on my part. :(

They play different positions, so it's probably not related.

[Kedsy]

Now as I said to start, I'm not holding my breath over that. I expect there is enuff $ to go around and the deal will get worked out. But until the door is closed and locked ... its still open.

Well, except if Murphy comes early and Daniels signs, I'm not sure we have a scholarship left for Kyrie. ;)

[AlaskanAssassin]

I don't see him enrolling early for a couple of reasons. 1) As many have pointed out, our backcourt would be too crowded. 2) He's good enough to be in these All-Star events next year. Dawkins mentioned that was something he wished he could be apart of. Also, that was one of Mcadoo's reasons last year.

[J4Kop99]

The news that Murphy could arrive early makes me suspicious that Mason is on his way to the 2011 NBA draft. I hope that this is just paranoia on my part. :(

Maybe it's just me but I think you are reading way too much into this.

I don't think there's a chance that mason leaves.

[yancem]

I don't see him enrolling early for a couple of reasons. 1) As many have pointed out, our backcourt would be too crowded. 2) He's good enough to be in these All-Star events next year. Dawkins mentioned that was something he wished he could be apart of. Also, that was one of Mcadoo's reasons last year.

But he wouldn't be able to be in the McD's game because he would be a post graduate. He could play in the Jordan game and some of the other all star games though.

[jimrowe0]

Well, except if Murphy comes early and Daniels signs, I'm not sure we have a scholarship left for Kyrie. ;)

Kyrie has signed with an agent, he is GONE!

That would be an amazing amount of young talent and the battle for starting positions would be intense. That would only benefit us in the long run.

[Kedsy]

Kyrie has signed with an agent, he is GONE!

Unless he signed with an agent yesterday he has not done so. He merely announced he was going to sign with an agent, which is not the same thing.

And I wasn't suggesting he might come back. I do not entertain any such notion. A few other posters mentioned that possibility and I was just trying (apparently unsuccessfully) to be clever.

[meloveduke]

Kyrie has signed with an agent, he is GONE!

That would be an amazing amount of young talent and the battle for starting positions would be intense. That would only benefit us in the long run.

Do you have a link to back this up? I cant find anything online that say he has hired one, everything says he will hire one.

[jimrowe0]

Unless he signed with an agent yesterday he has not done so. He merely announced he was going to sign with an agent, which is not the same thing.

And I wasn't suggesting he might come back. I do not entertain any such notion. A few other posters mentioned that possibility and I was just trying (apparently unsuccessfully) to be clever.

Looking back, it appears Kedsy is correct. He announced his intention to sign with an agent, but has yet to do so. Kyrie isn't coming back, but at this point it isn't 'official'.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Very surprising and pleasing development, given how (supposedly) opposed his high school was to early graduations. Now the question is will he enroll in time to attend the second summer session and make the trip to China, and gain all that extra practice and game time with the team? That will go a LONG way to determine who, if anyone, will decide to redshirt this season and who won't. Playing time will be fluid all season, as it is every season. Best examples from last season are Andre Dawkins and both Plumlee's, each of whose status went from MOTM (well, Dre and Mason's anyway) to residents in the doghouse to solid contributors in the ACCT and NCAAT. I'll let the coaching staff sort out playing time and roles as the season progresses. Won't it be fun! :cool:

And no, I'm not worried if Kyrie doesn't come back. Our cupboard is pretty well stocked either way! http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/4.gif

[airowe]

Kyrie's not coming back, Mason's not going anywhere.

We should have some very crowded practices next year! The competition will be intense.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Looking back, it appears Kedsy is correct. He announced his intention to sign with an agent, but has yet to do so. Kyrie isn't coming back, but at this point it isn't 'official'.
Kyrie said he won't sign with an agent until after May 8th, which I said was curious. Not that I'm curiously optimistic, just curious... because it does leave doors open. Not that I expect him to walk through that door. But he is a teenager and stranger things have happened. So it's just one of life's curiosities at this point.

[meloveduke]

the next few weeks should be really interesting.......

[magjayran]

Am I the only one that thinks he should stick around high school and get another full season of HS, AAU, and various camps in before he comes to Duke? I'd hate to see someone transfer as a result of the logjam of talent we have this year.

[meloveduke]

Am I the only one that thinks he should stick around high school and get another full season of HS, AAU, and various camps in before he comes to Duke? I'd hate to see someone transfer as a result of the logjam of talent we have this year.

no, but I think he is better off come in and redshirting at Duke.

[Bluedog]

Am I the only one that thinks he should stick around high school and get another full season of HS, AAU, and various camps in before he comes to Duke? I'd hate to see someone transfer as a result of the logjam of talent we have this year.

Well, maybe he'd redshirt. I think he'd improve more practicing and training at Duke for free than he would going to various camps with other high schoolers (which I assume costs money). He would have access to the best facilities, trainers, and coaches in the country at Duke even if he doesn't play in any games. Now, if he wants to be a high school senior and participate in the All-Star games, etc. I see nothing wrong with that and that's his choice. You're only a kid once. But I can see the argument for going to Duke early even if it means he plays very little during actual games or even not at all.

[monkey]

Hmmm...

"[Player X] should not [declare early for the NBA] - (1) he is not ready and too young to be on the road with grown men, (2) he can develop more by playing regularly in [college] than sitting on the bench in [the NBA], (3) you're only young once - he should stay in [college] and enjoy the experience...."

Just sayin' - not that the two situations are completely comparable, but I'm not sure it's 100% beneficial to be grabbing folks early out of high school -and some folks who think similarly about the NBA raiding college players before their time so to speak, might consider whether they feel the same in this situation with someone jumping to college.

[dukelifer]

Hmmm...

"[Player X] should not [declare early for the NBA] - (1) he is not ready and too young to be on the road with grown men, (2) he can develop more by playing regularly in [college] than sitting on the bench in [the NBA], (3) you're only young once - he should stay in [college] and enjoy the experience...."

Just sayin' - not that the two situations are completely comparable, but I'm not sure it's 100% beneficial to be grabbing folks early out of high school -and some folks who think similarly about the NBA raiding college players before their time so to speak, might consider whether they feel the same in this situation with someone jumping to college.

what do you mean "jumping to college". The kid is not 13 and- and has finished 4 years of high school- so he will be with his peer group. A lot of his HS friends will be out of school as well. I do not see the issue here. Get a head start academically- play with much better players- learn the system- all sounds like a win-win.

[monkey]

what do you mean "jumping to college". The kid is not 13 and- and has finished 4 years of high school- so he will be with his peer group. A lot of his HS friends will be out of school as well. I do not see the issue here. Get a head start academically- play with much better players- learn the system- all sounds like a win-win.

Oh, I'm just being argumentative and playing devil's advocate and making the point that the same arguments about growing up too fast and getting playing time and experience may apply here as well, especially if we are as crowded for PT as people expect and given the demands that must be put on our student-athletes (frequently performing on television, thousands of peoplle who have never met you suddenly hating you, e.g.). Honestly, I haven't followed enough of Alex Murphy's career to say whether this is a win or a loss for him (and I'm sure he wouldn't care if I did...)

[rotogod00]

Telep's take in his just comlpeted chat:

Q: If Duke adds Alex Murphy a year early and DeAndre Daniels could they jump UK and St Johns as the best recruiting class?

Telep: "... there's a chance that Alex Murphy will enroll a year early at Duke. Is it a done deal? Nope. BUT, the possibility does in fact exist. I don't know the dates for summer school at Duke but I imagine we'd hear a few weeks prior. I don't think he'd play AAU this summer, skip summer school and then enroll. If he's going to do it, my guess is he jumps in with two feet."

[Herbie]

With the late full court press on Daniels, along with this news, the skeptic in me is concerned this may signal that Mason might, in fact, be headed out the door. It would certainly make sense that if Mason were to leave, there'd be more potential room/need for Murphy and his size.

[NashvilleDevil]

With the late full court press on Daniels, along with this news, the skeptic in me is concerned this may signal that Mason might, in fact, be headed out the door. It would certainly make sense that if Mason were to leave, there'd be more potential room/need for Murphy and his size.

Per airowe


Kyrie's not coming back, Mason's not going anywhere.

We should have some very crowded practices next year! The competition will be intense.

[Duke: A Dynasty]

Kyrie's not coming back, Mason's not going anywhere.

We should have some very crowded practices next year! The competition will be intense.

Airowe you are the one solitary guy I trust on this site and when you put that it made me lose almost all of my hope for Kyrie returning. I have not lost hope completely but im only hanging by a thread now.


O and in other news I agree with whoever said Marshall redshirts not Murphy.

[Jackson]

I would be extremely happy if Murphy can come early. I have been as excited about him as I have been about any recruit in a long time. I believe he would be in line right away to start at the 3 over Dawkins, Kelly or Gbinije as well as Daniels. I just wonder why Daniels would be the priority that he is if Murphy is able to enroll a year early. They basically would play the same spot, either the 3 or 4 depending upon the lineup.

[ACCBBallFan]

Well, maybe he'd redshirt. I think he'd improve more practicing and training at Duke for free than he would going to various camps with other high schoolers (which I assume costs money). He would have access to the best facilities, trainers, and coaches in the country at Duke even if he doesn't play in any games. Now, if he wants to be a high school senior and participate in the All-Star games, etc. I see nothing wrong with that and that's his choice. You're only a kid once. But I can see the argument for going to Duke early even if it means he plays very little during actual games or even not at all.It also makes sense from an academic standpoint.

Any 5th year of HS credits are for naught, versus earning college credits toward the Jason Williams 3 year to graduate plan. The difference between paying rent and earning equity.

Also if he instead stays 5 years with the red-shirt and 4 years of PT, Alex could carry 80% of the academic workload and manage his time better.

So he gets the social adjustment to college out of the way, learns the Duke system on both ends of the floor, has access to much better Strength & Conditioining, and practices against ACC calinber guys.

No way Alex would not be a much more impactful player in 2012 than if he instead made the AAU circuit. In some ways AAU reinforces habits that have to be broken once gets into a team oriented college game like Duke's.

There is no down side whether Alex and his parents want the 5 years of paid Duke education or have earleir NBA aspirations.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

It also makes sense from an academic standpoint.

Any 5th year of HS credits are for naught, versus earning college credits toward the Jason Williams 3 year to graduate plan. The difference between paying rent and earning equity.

Also if he instead stays 5 years with the red-shirt and 4 years of PT, Alex could carry 80% of the academic workload and manage his time better.

So he gets the social adjustment to college out of the way, learns the Duke system on both ends of the floor, has access to much better Strength & Conditioining, and practices against ACC calinber guys.

No way Alex would not be a much more impactful player in 2012 than if he instead made the AAU circuit. In some ways AAU reinforces habits that have to be broken once gets into a team oriented college game like Duke's.

There is no down side whether Alex and his parents want the 5 years of paid Duke education or have earleir NBA aspirations.
Or, like many of our 5th year players, take graduate (Masters) classes. That's what Nick Horvath did when he had to redshirt due to injury.

[gam7]

Am I the only one that thinks he should stick around high school and get another full season of HS, AAU, and various camps in before he comes to Duke? I'd hate to see someone transfer as a result of the logjam of talent we have this year.

By coming to Duke with the Class of 2011, he would start the clock on his time out of high school, which may be important to him, particularly if the next CBA extends the one-and-done rule to two-and-done.

I have a question - if the NBA locks out its players and no CBA is in effect for a period of time, is the one-and-done rule currently in effect? If it is not, can high school players go straight to the NBA until there is a new CBA? The timing of the expiration seems to make it unlikely unless a lockout extends for a year. In the same vein, though, can recently college-committed high school football players (like Jadaveon Clowney) forego college and declare for the NFL draft? I'm guessing the answer is no because no one has done it, but does anyone know?

[mgtr]

If all these guys do come to Duke, and they take courses in SS1, can they then practice with the team and make the China/Dubai trip? If the answer is yes, can one or more of them then redshirt next year?

[superdave]

If all these guys do come to Duke, and they take courses in SS1, can they then practice with the team and make the China/Dubai trip? If the answer is yes, can one or more of them then redshirt next year?

Would Alex have to take Senior English in what would be Duke's summer school 1st session? If I recall, that's what Andre did.

I think Alex would get better practicing with Duke than he would with another year of high school, although an AAU summer is a pretty good laboratory for improving youself.

[tylervinyard]

O and in other news I agree with whoever said Marshall redshirts not Murphy.

Why couldn't they both redshirt?

[Bluedog]

Would Alex have to take Senior English in what would be Duke's summer school 1st session? If I recall, that's what Andre did.

I think Alex would get better practicing with Duke than he would with another year of high school, although an AAU summer is a pretty good laboratory for improving youself.

Andre did not enroll in Duke's summer session. At least, definitely not the first one (maybe the second one, though). The vast majority of incoming recruits participate in summer session, but since Andre had a last minute change, he was unable to do so since he had to take Senior English at his high school over the summer. It appears that Murphy is on track to have all the requirements in place by his high school graduation in June, so he wouldn't have to take summer school at his HS. If you don't enroll in summer classes at Duke before your freshman year, you aren't eligible to participate in any summer trips. So, if Murphy went the Andre route (i.e. still needed credits over the summer for high school), I don't think he'd be able to go to China and Dubai with the team.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

If all these guys do come to Duke, and they take courses in SS1, can they then practice with the team and make the China/Dubai trip? If the answer is yes, can one or more of them then redshirt next year?
If an incoming freshman can take classes in Summer Session 2, they can practice with the team and make the trip to China. That is how the coaches explained it to us at the Blue Devil Club and that is their plan. That would have no impact on their being able to redshirt for the upcoming season.

[hughgs]

Also if he instead stays 5 years with the red-shirt and 4 years of PT, Alex could carry 80% of the academic workload and manage his time better.

Duke only allows students to underload for 2 semesters.

http://trinity.duke.edu/academic-requirements?p=course-load-1

[Duke: A Dynasty]

Why couldn't they both redshirt?

I think Murphy starts if we do not get DeAndre. If we do get him then I could see Murphy redshirting

[airowe]

I think Murphy starts if we do not get DeAndre. If we do get him then I could see Murphy redshirting

That's quite the dramatic difference based on adding one player. Starting to redshirting?

Remember, Alex could play in a certain number of games before the redshirt decision needs to be made.

[mattman91]

That's quite the dramatic difference based on adding one player. Starting to redshirting?

Remember, Alex could play in a certain number of games before the redshirt decision needs to be made.

I was thinking about this. When would that decsion have to be made? Is it after a certain number of game? Before the end of the first semester?

[tbyers11]

Remember, Alex could play in a certain number of games before the redshirt decision needs to be made.

Are you sure that's the case? I thought that playing in a certain percentage of games affected your eligibility only for a medical redshirt. Any decisions on a redshirt for non-medical reasons must be made before game one and that appearing in any game disqualified you from redshirting.

[DukeGirl4ever]

Are you sure that's the case? I thought that playing in a certain percentage of games affected your eligibility only for a medical redshirt. Any decisions on a redshirt for non-medical reasons must be made before game one and that appearing in any game disqualified you from redshirting.

That's a good question. I remember when I was in college (97-01), a friend of mine who played at VT got injured after 10 games and she was able to receive a medical redshirt for the year. I had assumed that would be the case for a non-medical redshirt, but now that you bring it up, I kind of think the opposite.

[roywhite]

Are you sure that's the case? I thought that playing in a certain percentage of games affected your eligibility only for a medical redshirt. Any decisions on a redshirt for non-medical reasons must be made before game one and that appearing in any game disqualified you from redshirting.

Yeah, I think you're on the right track.

Here's some info from an NCAA website (http://www.ncaa.org/wps/portal/ncaahome?WCM_GLOBAL_CONTEXT=/ncaa/NCAA/Legislation+and+Governance/Eligibility+and+Recruiting/Faqs/eligibility_seasons.html)


Each student is allowed no more than four seasons of competition per sport. If you were not a qualifier, you may have fewer seasons of competition available to you. You should know that NCAA rules indicate that any competition, regardless of time, during a season counts as one of your seasons of competition in that sport. It does not matter how long you were involved in a particular competition (for example, one play in a football game, one point in a volleyball match); you will be charged with one season of competition.



A medical redshirt is a different thing. I believe it is available in cases of injury so long as the player has played in less than 30% of the contests and none after mid-season, but I don't have the chapter and verse from NCAA regs.

[Dev11]

Duke only allows students to underload for 2 semesters.

http://trinity.duke.edu/academic-requirements?p=course-load-1

Yes, but he could fill spring semesters (basketball semesters) with more easy classes and take harder classes for his major (if he plans on sticking around long enough) during the summers. With only 4 years, it is harder to do that.

As for some of the other questions, he cannot enroll in Summer 1 as it starts in May and he will still be in high school.

According to the Wikipedia page (you can Google "ncaa redshirt rule basketball" like I did), you can only get the redshirt after playing in some games if you get it for medical purposes, so we couldn't play Alex against MSU and in Maui before taking him out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redshirt_(college_sports)

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Yeah, I think you're on the right track.

Here's some info from an NCAA website (http://www.ncaa.org/wps/portal/ncaahome?WCM_GLOBAL_CONTEXT=/ncaa/NCAA/Legislation+and+Governance/Eligibility+and+Recruiting/Faqs/eligibility_seasons.html)



A medical redshirt is a different thing. I believe it is available in cases of injury so long as the player has played in less than 30% of the contests and none after mid-season, but I don't have the chapter and verse from NCAA regs.
This is from memory, but I believe the medical redshirt limit is 20% of the games, not 30%.

[oldnavy]

Hmmm...

"[Player X] should not [declare early for the NBA] - (1) he is not ready and too young to be on the road with grown men, (2) he can develop more by playing regularly in [college] than sitting on the bench in [the NBA], (3) you're only young once - he should stay in [college] and enjoy the experience...."

Just sayin' - not that the two situations are completely comparable, but I'm not sure it's 100% beneficial to be grabbing folks early out of high school -and some folks who think similarly about the NBA raiding college players before their time so to speak, might consider whether they feel the same in this situation with someone jumping to college.

Not that I do not see your logic, and you make a good argument, but just to play devil's advocate:
1. Murphy would be with his peer group and not mixed in with a group of men 10 years his senior
2. I KNOW that Murphy would receive better coaching at Duke than he would at ANY high school or AAU program in the nation, so he would actually benefit from learning under K and the staff for a year.
3. I am not so sure that his transferring to a post-graduate high school academy would be the same socially as staying in high school.

Now, if we were talking about him leaving after his sophomore or junior season of high school, I think all of your point would be right on the money. Plus the move from high school to college doesn’t have a financial benefit (in most cases) like going to the NBA. The financial gain is probably the most alluring thing about the NBA for these kids, and there is nothing similar to this when moving to college “early” from high school.

[Duke: A Dynasty]

That's quite the dramatic difference based on adding one player. Starting to redshirting?

Remember, Alex could play in a certain number of games before the redshirt decision needs to be made.

Redshirting is not meant to sound like he is not good. I just figured it would be better that way if one of them redshirt (Murphy or Daniels) and I said Murphy because to me it would make more sense than Daniels.

[dcdevil2009]

I have a question - if the NBA locks out its players and no CBA is in effect for a period of time, is the one-and-done rule currently in effect? If it is not, can high school players go straight to the NBA until there is a new CBA? The timing of the expiration seems to make it unlikely unless a lockout extends for a year. In the same vein, though, can recently college-committed high school football players (like Jadaveon Clowney) forego college and declare for the NFL draft? I'm guessing the answer is no because no one has done it, but does anyone know?

The issue, at least in the NFL, is that teams can't sign free agents or make trades without a CBA being in place. Even though there will still be a draft, I don't think drafted players can sign with the team that drafted them until a new CBA is reached. It helps if you think of drafted rookies as a type of restricted free agent. Even though there would be no CBA and therefore no rule against underclassmen, drafted players couldn't sign until there was a CBA. Presumably, a new CBA would have the minimum age rule and prevent underclassmen from signing contracts in the NFL until they were of age.

The NBA on the other hand seems to have been smarter with the NFL with their scheduling. As the NBA's current CBA doesn't expire until July and the draft is June 23, the draft will take place under the current CBA and include it's age minimum. As others have said on this site, teams will probably wait to sign their draft picks until a new CBA is in place instead of before the current one expires. However, I'd assume that if the CBA expires before a new deal is reached, there would be a freeze on signing free agents and making trades similar to the one in the NFL.

[airowe]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe a player can play in exhibition games and not use up his eligibility.

[COYS]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe a player can play in exhibition games and not use up his eligibility.

Does anyone remember if Curry played in exhibitions prior to the 09-10 season?

[Cell-R]

I'm pretty positive that he's not coming...

[Dev11]

Does anyone remember if Curry played in exhibitions prior to the 09-10 season?

He didn't. Box scores from those games:

http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22726&SPID=1845&DB_OEM_ID=4200&ATCLID=204826845

http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22726&SPID=1845&DB_OEM_ID=4200&ATCLID=204820496

But that might not matter, as Curry's situation wasn't a redshirt season. I can't think of recent college basketball players who redshirted without medical reasons, but those are the box scores you want.

[hughgs]

Yes, but he could fill spring semesters (basketball semesters) with more easy classes and take harder classes for his major (if he plans on sticking around long enough) during the summers. With only 4 years, it is harder to do that.

Why would it be harder? If you're substituting summer classes for spring classes an extra year doesn't make any difference. It's not like the summer semesters are cancelled.

[johnb]

Why would Murphy have continued to pursue the early graduation if he didn't intend to come early to Duke? Would they have even announced it if he weren't at least seriously considering starting this summer?

If I'm a fan of the St. Mark's basketball team, I might suggest Murphy stay an additional year and enjoy being top dog for a while.

But I'm not. As a Duke fan, I hear we may be getting Murphy and Daniels to go along with Gbinje and Andre, and I rub my hands. I wouldn't know who would start at the wing spot, but odds are that one or more of those high school All Americans would star as a freshman (or that Andre would consistently come into his own). OTOH, if I'm one of those 4 guys--or guys like Curry, Thornton, or Cook who might want to play some 3 guard offense or guys like Kelly, Hairston, or a P who might like to play 3 bigs with 2 guards--I might like that position to be a little less crowded.

And if I'm ranked among the top 25 high school players in the country, I would be considering the concept of redshirting only in relation to how it might apply to other guys on the team. We get a little blase about the quality of our recruits, but we should remember that almost all of our recruits over the past 25 years have been more highly rated than any of our football recruits, and while we fans can try to put ourselves in their shoes, I'm not sure how accurately we can assess the perspective of a 17 year old who has had to look really hard to find games in which he is not head and shoulders better than everybody at the gym since he was about 12.

[JimBD]

Why would anyone expect Murphy to redshirt? To get another year of eligibility? I doubt very seriously that he will be at Duke for five years. I just hope that he stays for four years and makes a major contribution to Duke's program.

[yancem]

Why would anyone expect Murphy to redshirt? To get another year of eligibility? I doubt very seriously that he will be at Duke for five years. I just hope that he stays for four years and makes a major contribution to Duke's program.

People expect him to red shirt because that has been the scuttle ever since the possibility of early graduation came up. I assume that he reclassified early in high school, like many prep players do, in order to give his body more time to develop before entering college. This is why he is ahead academically enough to graduate early. The extra year of high school/physical development helps a lot of kids either get a scholarship or get a scholarship at a better school (see Daniels). My guess is, that he still wants the year for his body to mature but already has a scholarship to Duke, so he thinks that he can develop even more by coming to college and red shirting.

[airowe]

I'm pretty positive that he's not coming...

I am 100% positive he hasn't made that decision yet. Talked to him yesterday.

[JimBD]

People expect him to red shirt because that has been the scuttle ever since the possibility of early graduation came up. I assume that he reclassified early in high school, like many prep players do, in order to give his body more time to develop before entering college. This is why he is ahead academically enough to graduate early. The extra year of high school/physical development helps a lot of kids either get a scholarship or get a scholarship at a better school (see Daniels). My guess is, that he still wants the year for his body to mature but already has a scholarship to Duke, so he thinks that he can develop even more by coming to college and red shirting.

So are you saying he will redshirt for one year and then stay at Duke for four more years of eligibility? If he does not stay the additional four years, what's the point of redshirting the first year? If he doesn't redshirt, he will still have the opportunity to develop his body his first year at Duke, but he might also have the opportunity to play his first year at Duke.

[Newton_14]

So are you saying he will redshirt for one year and then stay at Duke for four more years of eligibility? If he does not stay the additional four years, what's the point of redshirting the first year? If he doesn't redshirt, he will still have the opportunity to develop his body his first year at Duke, but he might also have the opportunity to play his first year at Duke.

It has nothing to do with eligibility. He is simply weighing, spending next year as a red-shirt developing both his body and his game and then starting his playing career on his normal timeline with the Class of 2012, vs spending next year in High School or a post-grad school like IMG. It appears to be about how best to spend that year of development.

The only caveat, is he is also weighing the option of coming in early to play. If he feels he is not quite ready, and needs one more year of development, he will choose one of the development options.

If he decides he needs one more year of development, it makes perfect sense to me, to spend that year at Duke getting acclimated to the college environment, the academics, culture, etc, all while developing his body and game with the best possible resources available to him.

It would make perfect sense to spend that development year at Duke

[yancem]

So are you saying he will redshirt for one year and then stay at Duke for four more years of eligibility? If he does not stay the additional four years, what's the point of redshirting the first year? If he doesn't redshirt, he will still have the opportunity to develop his body his first year at Duke, but he might also have the opportunity to play his first year at Duke.

At this point I don't think he or anyone else knows if he will use all 4 years of eligibility. By red shirting he gives himself the best chance to maximize his potential before he enters the draft. Who would have thought that Singler would have been a 4 year player? If he came to Duke next season and played but wasn't ready to make much of a contribution then he would have burned a year of eligibility. Since he was originally planning on being in HS next year, he doesn't loose anything by red shirting. Also, as has previously been mentioned, red shirting will give him time to adjust to the college work load (both academically and athletically). I think that it is a fairly well reasoned plan. Maybe more cautious than some other players would play things but I don't see anything wrong with that.

[Jackson]

I am 100% positive he hasn't made that decision yet. Talked to him yesterday.

If he isn't sure that he will enroll early, why would he pursue early graduation from High School? I would be very excited if he does come. I think he would be penciled in as the starter at sf unless Daniels comes and shows something extraordinary. Murphy is a consensus top 10 recruit and it seems that Daniels is significantly lower rated.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Has everyone given up on Dawkins? Does no one think Baby Face is good enough to start at the 3? Am I am the only thinking that Dawkins will start for the the vast majority of games next season?

As has been mentioned countless times here, Coach K values experience and Dawkins is one of 4 players who have more than a year of experience under Coach K (along with MP1, MP2, and Kelly). Sure - Dawkins has a lot to learn, but doesn't everybody on this current team?

I'd be very surprised if either Daniels (if he commits) or Murphy (if he enrolls early) start over Dawkins. I just don't see that happening. Dawkins' shooting, coupled with his improved defense and added 'good' weight, will allow him to play the 3 successfully next year.

[Kedsy]

Has everyone given up on Dawkins? Does no one think Baby Face is good enough to start at the 3? Am I am the only thinking that Dawkins will start for the the vast majority of games next season?

Actually at least half, if not more, of the posters weighing in on this issue have stated they think Andre is going to start. It's just that the ones who don't think so are a lot louder.

At this point it's all conjecture, at least until practice starts in October. It is absolutely true, however, that based on history upperclassmen have a much better chance of starting than freshmen, and that non-top 10 freshmen have a fairly low probability of starting more than a few games.

[gam7]

If Dawkins plays with the defensive intensity he showed towards the end of last season, then he'll have an opportunity to start. But, I'd wager good money that we'll see (1) lots of instances of guys on the bench getting "starter minutes" and guys starting seeing "non-starter minutes" and (2) lots of different starting lineups over the course of the season, much like we saw last season. The only guy I have trouble envisioning coming off the bench at all is Mason (and maybe Rivers).

[InSpades]

Has everyone given up on Dawkins? Does no one think Baby Face is good enough to start at the 3? Am I am the only thinking that Dawkins will start for the the vast majority of games next season?

As has been mentioned countless times here, Coach K values experience and Dawkins is one of 4 players who have more than a year of experience under Coach K (along with MP1, MP2, and Kelly). Sure - Dawkins has a lot to learn, but doesn't everybody on this current team?

I'd be very surprised if either Daniels (if he commits) or Murphy (if he enrolls early) start over Dawkins. I just don't see that happening. Dawkins' shooting, coupled with his improved defense and added 'good' weight, will allow him to play the 3 successfully next year.

You left out Seth Curry as having more than 1 year under Coach K...

I'm very high on Andre and had him in my starting 5... but I think sometimes people value experience too much. If we do in fact have 6 freshman coming in then I think more than just Austin will leap frog some of the existing players in the rotation. These are some very highly rated recruits... as are the guys we already have obviously. Some will work out better than others, it's just very hard to predict in advance (aside from exceptional talents like Kyrie).

[flyingdutchdevil]

You left out Seth Curry as having more than 1 year under Coach K...

I'm very high on Andre and had him in my starting 5... but I think sometimes people value experience too much. If we do in fact have 6 freshman coming in then I think more than just Austin will leap frog some of the existing players in the rotation. These are some very highly rated recruits... as are the guys we already have obviously. Some will work out better than others, it's just very hard to predict in advance (aside from exceptional talents like Kyrie).

Thanks - forgot about Seth's practice year.

You must remember that Andre was a top 20 player his junior year. He was a five star-rated prospect known for his athleticism and range. Coming out of high school, I'd say he was more well-regarded in his junior class than any of our recruits in their senior year this year not named Austin Rivers. This isn't a dis towards any of our players. Rather, it shows that Andre was a highly regarded player during his junior year.

Any while experience doesn't always matter (like Nolan over Paulus a few years back), it generally accounts for a lot under Coach K. Dawkins, for the majority of this year, was in the rotation as the 6-7 player. With added incentive in both Kyle and Nolan graduating (leaving a lot of minutes for Andre on the table), I have a feeling that he will absolutely blow up next year.

[airowe]

If he isn't sure that he will enroll early, why would he pursue early graduation from High School? I would be very excited if he does come. I think he would be penciled in as the starter at sf unless Daniels comes and shows something extraordinary. Murphy is a consensus top 10 recruit and it seems that Daniels is significantly lower rated.

I've heard that he's not too incredibly happy at St. Mark's, but I've never heard that from him directly. Could be a reason. :confused:

[oldnavy]

I've heard that he's not too incredibly happy at St. Mark's, but I've never heard that from him directly. Could be a reason. :confused:

Why come to college early?? Two words.... co-eds!