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SCMatt33
03-20-2011, 06:11 PM
Who's everyone rooting for in this Texas-Arizona game? Arizona has the best post player in Derrick Williams, but Texas has better post depth. Both could give us trouble. Personally, I think I rather play Arizona, but just slightly seeing as we've been able to beat teams with just one post guy. That player will usually kill us, but we can hang on the boards overall because we're better than everyone else. Even with Williams, Arizona isn't a good offensive rebounding team, which should be huge for us.

Wander
03-20-2011, 06:13 PM
Arizona because it helps my bracket :)

I think the basic strategy would be have Singler neutralize Williams, and let the other guys win 4 on 4.

gofurman
03-20-2011, 07:19 PM
Who's everyone rooting for in this Texas-Arizona game? Arizona has the best post player in Derrick Williams, but Texas has better post depth. Both could give us trouble. Personally, I think I rather play Arizona, but just slightly seeing as we've been able to beat teams with just one post guy. That player will usually kill us, but we can hang on the boards overall because we're better than everyone else. Even with Williams, Arizona isn't a good offensive rebounding team, which should be huge for us.
zona' not that I know that much about either except we seem to always beat UT but they are very very talented. Arizona I don't think is as talented overll- I will always trust K to take out one great player

texas
03-20-2011, 07:25 PM
i'll say texas

Bluedog
03-20-2011, 07:27 PM
'Zona is ranked below Michigan according to ken pom. Texas has a lot of weapons that can give teams a lot of trouble when they're firing on all cylinders. I think I'd rather play Arizona. Their best win all season was UCLA (well, will be Texas if we end up playing them).

NashvilleDevil
03-20-2011, 07:30 PM
I'll say I don't care as long as it's not a team like Michigan. Honestly I would prefer Texas because with all that talent Rick Barnes is still the coach.

gofurman
03-20-2011, 07:31 PM
'Zona is ranked below Michigan according to ken pom. Texas has a lot of weapons that can give teams a lot of trouble when they're firing on all cylinders. I think I'd rather play Arizona. Their best win all season was UCLA (well, will be Texas if we end up playing them).


though zona is closer to anaheim than ut... might have a better home court advatg

BD80
03-20-2011, 07:41 PM
I root for us to play against the team with the lower "upside." I fear the opponent playing up to our level more than I fear us playing down to their average level. So I root for the team that may be more consistently good but less often great. I'm rooting for Zona.

gofurman
03-20-2011, 07:49 PM
I root for us to play against the team with the lower "upside." I fear the opponent playing up to our level more than I fear us playing down to their average level. So I root for the team that may be more consistently good but less often great. I'm rooting for Zona.same here, i hitnk zona has less "potential"

rthomas
03-20-2011, 07:52 PM
Watching the Arizona-Texas game tonight. Neither looks that good really. Neither can hit a shot. I just do not care which one we play.

Bluedog
03-20-2011, 08:02 PM
Watching the Arizona-Texas game tonight. Neither looks that good really. Neither can hit a shot. I just do not care which one we play.

Really? I'm watching and it looks like both teams are playing pretty well to my eyes...at least, in this second half, it had been back and forth with trading buckets. We're definitely going to have to bring it on Thursday. Both teams are physical and have some good athletes. Their styles couldn't be more different from Michigan, though.

A-Tex Devil
03-20-2011, 08:10 PM
I am rooting for Texas, and unfortunately have to root against them next week if they pull this out, but it's Arizona every day and six ways from Sunday. Texas was legitimately playing the best basketball in the country for stretch in January/February, and y'all can complain about Barnes all you want (I know I do), but he outcoached K two years ago and almost took Duke down as a 10 seed.

J'Covan Brown is fun to watch. He's so slow, but he always gets to where he wants to be. True old man YMCA basketball.

PSurprise
03-20-2011, 08:14 PM
I would like to see them play 1,024 overtimes and have to stay on the court from today until Thursday. But I really don't care who we play...

gumbomoop
03-20-2011, 08:18 PM
I have the same impression of Arizona as of Washington: they don't know how to win this game. They've been frittering away opportunities, have no clue as to how to guard a red-hot J'Covan Brown, and just keep fouling him, including the now-ubiquitous big-man step out at the top of the key, which so often results in a foul on the dribbler, in this case, the brilliant FT-shooting Brown.

As with foolish, inattentive UW guards, just now the Arizona dribbler walked, under no particular pressure from the defense. No focus.

Edit: For example, Arizona just had an obvious 2-for-1 with a minute remaining, but frittered, so now, even if they score, Texas gets last ball.

Edit II: No plan for a good shot, no score, Texas in driver's seat.

Edit III: I didn't count on a quick 5-second call from ref, giving Zona its winning chance. But given enough "Edits," I'm sure I can predict whom Duke will play.

simmias
03-20-2011, 08:26 PM
No foul on that last play??!?

Duvall
03-20-2011, 08:26 PM
Well, it's Arizona.

Sympathy to our Texas fans - a great season should not end like that.

1 24 90
03-20-2011, 08:26 PM
WOO HOO!!!!!

Of course, I'm the same person who really wanted to play Michigan instead of Tennessee.

billyj
03-20-2011, 08:29 PM
WOO HOO!!!!!

Of course, I'm the same person who really wanted to play Michigan instead of Tennessee.

Same here, initially wanted Michigan and Arizona.

But now looking at it, they are all good teams. And Michigan is a lot better (scary) than I thought, their 3's are daggers.

CLW
03-20-2011, 08:29 PM
Well we got Zona.

Miles/Mason are going to have to play like MEN to slow down Williams.

Bluedog
03-20-2011, 08:30 PM
Wow, there have been some ridiculous endings to games this tournament. I have re-watched the 5 second inbounds call that gave 'Zona the ball back twice in slow motion, and the ref only moved his arm with the count 4 times before the TO was called. In my mind, it shouldn't have been a 5 second call and the TO should have been granted, but I guess I'm not the ref. He definitely didn't do the sign with the arm for the fifth time, but I guess the fifth time is simply the whistle. Still, heart break for TX. Arizona will still be tough, but I'd rather play them.

A-Tex Devil
03-20-2011, 08:31 PM
Well, it's Arizona.

Sympathy to our Texas fans - a great season should not end like that.

Look, I **HATE** complaining about officiating, but:

1. Jim Burr has no business officiating the NCAA tourney after the Big East fiasco. He was atrocious for both sides today, but let's look at the end....

2. On the 5 second inbound, it's about 4 seconds from the time it's in Joseph's hand...

3. Derrick Williams THREW J'Covan to the ground on the inbounds pass. That has to be a foul especially if.....

4. That foul on Hamilton at the end is a foul. I thought it was, but go back and watch that inbounds.

5. J'Covan and Gary Johnson were both fouled at the end, but y'know, don't make those calls then after you had been making them all night?

Can't think of enough expletives. But Texas put themselves in this position, so you know, whatever.

Edited to add -- that foul on Gary Johnson was a much worse no call than the no call on Boozer in 2002. He is being fouled by 2 players when there is still time on the clock. Awful, gutless officiating. Unlike Butler/Pittsburgh refs.

billyj
03-20-2011, 08:33 PM
Wow, there have been some ridiculous endings to games this tournament. I have re-watched the 5 second inbounds call that gave 'Zona the ball back twice in slow motion, and the ref only moved his arm with the count 4 times before the TO was called. In my mind, it shouldn't have been a 5 second call and the TO should have been granted, but I guess I'm not the ref. He definitely didn't do the sign with the arm for the fifth time, but I guess the fifth time is simply the whistle. Still, heart break for TX. Arizona will still be tough, but I'd rather play them.

If I am a Texas fan, I'd feel pretty upset. They had this game all wrapped up. I think that 5 second violation is arguably the worst call in this tourney.

BD80
03-20-2011, 08:35 PM
Wow, there have been some ridiculous endings to games this tournament. I have re-watched the 5 second inbounds call that gave 'Zona the ball back twice in slow motion, and the ref only moved his arm with the count 4 times before the TO was called. In my mind, it shouldn't have been a 5 second call and the TO should have been granted, but I guess I'm not the ref. He definitely didn't do the sign with the arm for the fifth time, but I guess the fifth time is simply the whistle. Still, heart break for TX. Arizona will still be tough, but I'd rather play them.

By rule, the inbounding team cannot call a timeout after the 4 count.

rthomas
03-20-2011, 08:36 PM
Really? I'm watching and it looks like both teams are playing pretty well to my eyes...at least, in this second half, it had been back and forth with trading buckets. We're definitely going to have to bring it on Thursday. Both teams are physical and have some good athletes. Their styles couldn't be more different from Michigan, though.

Arizona shot 44%, Texas shot 45%. Arizona shot 57% from three, but only 64% from the three point line. So I would say neither shot the ball particularly well.

wilson
03-20-2011, 08:37 PM
He definitely didn't do the sign with the arm for the fifth time, but I guess the fifth time is simply the whistle.This is correct.

Newton_14
03-20-2011, 08:41 PM
By rule, the inbounding team cannot call a timeout after the 4 count.

Correct. I was wondering if anyone else picked up on that. They put that rule in several years ago.

I do feel bad for Texas though. I thought Brown got fouled on his drive to the basket.

Bluedog
03-20-2011, 08:42 PM
By rule, the inbounding team cannot call a timeout after the 4 count.

Wait, really? I did not know that rule. So you can call a timeout from 0-4 seconds, but the last second you must inbound or you get a five second call? Oh, ok. My mistake. I definitely didn't know that. In that case, it was the correct call. I don't really understand the point of that rule though, I must admit. Thanks for the clarification though. The foul calls on the other hand...I didn't really see a good angle. He definitely got knocked down but I couldn't see if it was a grab of the arm or simply ball.

texas
03-20-2011, 08:42 PM
well that was fun. j'covan cleared got knocked on his arse on the last shot with no foul call. i rarely complain about officiating but we got hosed.

Atlanta Duke
03-20-2011, 08:48 PM
Correct. I was wondering if anyone else picked up on that. They put that rule in several years ago.

I do feel bad for Texas though. I thought Brown got fouled on his drive to the basket.

Bad luck for Texas the Pitt-Butler crew was not calling the game

Saratoga2
03-20-2011, 08:49 PM
Wow, there have been some ridiculous endings to games this tournament. I have re-watched the 5 second inbounds call that gave 'Zona the ball back twice in slow motion, and the ref only moved his arm with the count 4 times before the TO was called. In my mind, it shouldn't have been a 5 second call and the TO should have been granted, but I guess I'm not the ref. He definitely didn't do the sign with the arm for the fifth time, but I guess the fifth time is simply the whistle. Still, heart break for TX. Arizona will still be tough, but I'd rather play them.

The ref cannot accept a TO after 4 seconds. It's the rule

77devil
03-20-2011, 08:50 PM
well that was fun. j'covan cleared got knocked on his arse on the last shot with no foul call. i rarely complain about officiating but we got hosed.

Not only was Brown not fouled, but he literally walked up the court on the last play with less than 10 seconds leaving him no choice but to throw up a prayer.

texas
03-20-2011, 08:51 PM
Not only was he not fouled, but he literally walked up the court on the last play with less than 10 seconds leaving him no choice but to throw up a prayer.

you must be blind. watch it again. he got knocked down.

A-Tex Devil
03-20-2011, 08:53 PM
Not only was Brown not fouled, but he literally walked up the court on the last play with less than 10 seconds leaving him no choice but to throw up a prayer.

J'Covan was fouled, but we can agree to disagree. I'll start with him getting wacked in the head. Gary Johnson definitely was, and despite what Seth Davis says he was getting fouled with 0.3 left on the clock before he went back up. It's the exact same thing that happened to Boozer in 2002.

All that being said, you are right. J'Covan, as well as he played, brain farted by not allowing time for a tip in/put back. And Gary needs to be trying to tip it in, not grab it.

Texas allowed for this to happen. It's just a shame that Jim Burr is even allowed to ref the tourney this year. There is no accountability, and if gets to officiate any games next week, that just reinforces it.

NashvilleDevil
03-20-2011, 08:59 PM
By rule, the inbounding team cannot call a timeout after the 4 count.

Didn't Butler call TO around the 4 second count towards the end of the title game last year?

_Gary
03-20-2011, 09:01 PM
The ref cannot accept a TO after 4 seconds. It's the rule

Right, and you'd think a guy like Kenny "I'm a major UNC homer" Smith would know that. But instead he went on and on and on about how horrible that call was, and I have to believe in part it's because he wanted to see Duke face Texas (believing, like most of us, that the Longhorns would be the much tougher match up for us). Yet he was the "refs got it right" poster-child for the earlier game with UNC. Just saying.

I didn't think the calls in the Texas/Arizona game were as egregious as the one at the end of the UNC/UW game. But whatever. At least I admit to my bias. :p

Guess this might should go in the Commentators thread instead. If the mods want to move it feel free.

jipops
03-20-2011, 09:03 PM
I'm relieved to play Arizona. Obviously we could still very well lose to them but Texas posed an extremely difficult match up with their great defense and experience. Arizona doesn't have the experience of Texas and isn't the defensive monster Texas is.

Derrick Williams will be a load. He'll most likely get his points and rebounds in bunches against us. We'll just need to make sure nobody else hurts us and that all our bigs don't foul out trying to defend him.

A-Tex Devil
03-20-2011, 09:03 PM
Another good point made by the studio analysts -- if Jordan Hamilton stays square on that last basket, he probably gets the call. It was absolutely a foul the way he turned away, but he had position and if he stays square he **should** get the call.

Just an effort/hustle/focus issue that great teams avoid.

mr. synellinden
03-20-2011, 09:03 PM
Wow, there have been some ridiculous endings to games this tournament. I have re-watched the 5 second inbounds call that gave 'Zona the ball back twice in slow motion, and the ref only moved his arm with the count 4 times before the TO was called. In my mind, it shouldn't have been a 5 second call and the TO should have been granted, but I guess I'm not the ref. He definitely didn't do the sign with the arm for the fifth time, but I guess the fifth time is simply the whistle. Still, heart break for TX. Arizona will still be tough, but I'd rather play them.

Agreed - I watched it several times and it is clear to me that the Texas player called time out just after the fourth arm movement by the ref. Maybe he lost count, seriously. Because that was not a five second count.

I keep hearing a foul's a foul no matter when it occurs - especially in the context of the Pitt - Butler game. Well, there seemed to me to be some uncalled fouls at the end of the Texas - Arizona game. That is a horrible way to lose. I feel for Texas.

mr. synellinden
03-20-2011, 09:05 PM
Look, I **HATE** complaining about officiating, but:

1. Jim Burr has no business officiating the NCAA tourney after the Big East fiasco. He was atrocious for both sides today, but let's look at the end....

2. On the 5 second inbound, it's about 4 seconds from the time it's in Joseph's hand...

3. Derrick Williams THREW J'Covan to the ground on the inbounds pass. That has to be a foul especially if.....

4. That foul on Hamilton at the end is a foul. I thought it was, but go back and watch that inbounds.

5. J'Covan and Gary Johnson were both fouled at the end, but y'know, don't make those calls then after you had been making them all night?

Can't think of enough expletives. But Texas put themselves in this position, so you know, whatever.

Edited to add -- that foul on Gary Johnson was a much worse no call than the no call on Boozer in 2002. He is being fouled by 2 players when there is still time on the clock. Awful, gutless officiating. Unlike Butler/Pittsburgh refs.

I agree with everything but your last point. I am not certain the "foul" on Johnson occurred before the clock read 0.00.

sporthenry
03-20-2011, 09:08 PM
I didin't really think there was a foul on Brown. Maybe he got hit on his head but he initiated contact. There was a foul on Johnson but it was close as to whether time was out.

But really, I have no sympathy b/c Brown literally did the same thing down the floor where he just ran into people and drew fouls, it looked like an NBA game. I guess he gets credit but I just hate when people run into the defender and just throw it up and that was Texas' offense in the second half.

Newton_14
03-20-2011, 09:09 PM
Another good point made by the studio analysts -- if Jordan Hamilton stays square on that last basket, he probably gets the call. It was absolutely a foul the way he turned away, but he had position and if he stays square he **should** get the call.

Just an effort/hustle/focus issue that great teams avoid.

I saw it the exact same way. He had an easy charge there by staying square and taking the hit. Not only did he turn, he also lunged and threw his left shoulder into Williams. Terrible defensive play there at the worst possible time.

77devil
03-20-2011, 09:13 PM
you must be blind. watch it again. he got knocked down.

I did, several times in slow motion. Hardly blind, just objective. Take off the burnt orange glasses.

SCMatt33
03-20-2011, 09:14 PM
Didn't Butler call TO around the 4 second count towards the end of the title game last year?

No, I just watched it twice. Hayward called the TO just as the ref was moving his arm for the fourth time. The way I see it, he called it at exactly 4, not after. One important difference I noticed, however, was that the ref in the title game gave him the ball with his right hand and then started his 5 count. Today, the ref gave Texas the ball with his left hand and simultaneously started the 5 count with his right. It seems that without the delay by using the same hand "one" actually happens at zero and "four" happens at the start of the fourth second, and "five" happened at the start of the 5th second, not the end, normally I don't listen to Charles Barkley (and neither does anyone else), but he was trying to make this point on the post-game show and everyone ignored him. I don't know if one way is correct, but it definitely didn't work in Texas' favor.

texas
03-20-2011, 09:51 PM
here's a good view


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AY4WHS-n1w&feature=player_embedded

uh_no
03-20-2011, 09:56 PM
here's a good view


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AY4WHS-n1w&feature=player_embedded

he screwed up royally. no doubt about it....and counting is close to his only duty there...

Newton_14
03-20-2011, 10:04 PM
he screwed up royally. no doubt about it....and counting is close to his only duty there...

Actually, the video proves the ref got it right. As was mentioned earlier in the thread, the player is not allowed to call timeout once the count gets to 4. The count clearly got to 4 there. The only mistake I see is rather than just ignoring the timeout request and making the 5th arm motion, the ref immediately calls the 5 second count. But even with that, the Texas player was not going to beat the count.

uh_no
03-20-2011, 10:14 PM
Actually, the video proves the ref got it right. As was mentioned earlier in the thread, the player is not allowed to call timeout once the count gets to 4. The count clearly got to 4 there. The only mistake I see is rather than just ignoring the timeout request and making the 5th arm motion, the ref immediately calls the 5 second count. But even with that, the Texas player was not going to beat the count.

I'd call calling a 5 second violation after 4 seconds to be a pretty big screwup....as well as counting 1 after 0 seconds....

Newton_14
03-20-2011, 10:19 PM
I'd call calling a 5 second violation after 4 seconds to be a pretty big screwup....as well as counting 1 after 0 seconds....

You are missing the point. By rule he cannot grant the timeout there. He got to 4 using his method of counting. If there is a rule that dictates when he can start the count, then fine, but that is not clear. What is clear is that he got to 4 and correctly denied the timeout request. The only mistake I see is not making the 5th count, but like I said, there is no way the Texas kid gets the ball inbounded before the ref gets to the 5th count because he had abandoned his attempt to get it inbounds at that point.

Bluedog
03-20-2011, 10:23 PM
Not that I necessarily trust Doug Gottlieb but...

http://twitter.com/gottliebshow


Vet move is this, Cory Joesph can learn from it, go to the ref b4 inbounds and tell him if it goes to 4 we want a TO. Yes that is done.

You can tell the ref you want a TO at four seconds before you attempt to inbounds it? Huh? You can actually do that? This day has really been a lot of clarification or rules. When the clock stops (whistle vs. ball out of bounds), not being able to call TO after 4 seconds, questionable over and back, etc.

tbyers11
03-20-2011, 10:26 PM
You are missing the point. By rule he cannot grant the timeout there. He got to 4 using his method of counting. If there is a rule that dictates when he can start the count, then fine, but that is not clear. What is clear is that he got to 4 and correctly denied the timeout request. The only mistake I see is not making the 5th count, but like I said, there is no way the Texas kid gets the ball inbounded before the ref gets to the 5th count because he had abandoned his attempt to get it inbounds at that point.

The rule that you can't call a timeout after the 4 second mark has been off the books for a long time now. You can call a timeout all the way to the end of the 5 seconds.

uh_no
03-20-2011, 10:27 PM
You are missing the point. By rule he cannot grant the timeout there. He got to 4 using his method of counting. If there is a rule that dictates when he can start the count, then fine, but that is not clear. What is clear is that he got to 4 and correctly denied the timeout request. The only mistake I see is not making the 5th count, but like I said, there is no way the Texas kid gets the ball inbounded before the ref gets to the 5th count because he had abandoned his attempt to get it inbounds at that point.

i take back all that I said.....the timeout was called at about the 4.57 second mark.... and the 5 second call was at about 4.86 seconds (which is a little quick, as the count usually gives the benefit of the doubt to the passer)

edit: in reference to the previous post, apparently the ref was not correct if that rule is in fact off the books

sporthenry
03-20-2011, 10:29 PM
The rule that you can't call a timeout after the 4 second mark has been off the books for a long time now. You can call a timeout all the way to the end of the 5 seconds.

Yes, Seth Davis is reporting that you can call the timeout at any time up to the 5 second call. So another bad call. Man, I know these refs come under additional scrutiny but they are anticipating way too many calls and almost want to go out blowing their whistle so another BE tourney doesn't happen.

Bluedog
03-20-2011, 10:31 PM
Seth Davis:


My earlier tweet was incorrect. A player can call a time out up until the ref counts to five. Rule changed several years ago. Apologies.

REF FAIL! Twice today...how can refs not know the rules?!?!

Newton_14
03-20-2011, 10:32 PM
i take back all that I said.....the timeout was called at about the 4.57 second mark.... and the 5 second call was at about 4.86 seconds (which is a little quick, as the count usually gives the benefit of the doubt to the passer)

edit: in reference to the previous post, apparently the ref was not correct if that rule is in fact off the books

If the rule has been taken out, then I apologize. I knew the rule went in, I have never heard though that it was done away with. If that is the case, then the timeout should have been granted and the ref did screw up.

tbyers11
03-20-2011, 10:38 PM
Seth Davis:



REF FAIL! Twice today...how can refs not know the rules?!?!

3 times actually. Andy Glockner's twitter (@aglock) is all over the fact that the refs screwed up a backcourt violation call off an inbounds pass against Syracuse in a tie game with under a minute left. Gus and Len never questioned the call during the game but it seemed wrong to me.

sporthenry
03-20-2011, 10:42 PM
3 times actually. Andy Glockner's twitter (@aglock) is all over the fact that the refs screwed up a backcourt violation call off an inbounds pass against Syracuse in a tie game with under a minute left. Gus and Len never questioned the call during the game but it seemed wrong to me.

So how long until K has a red flag in his sock?

tbyers11
03-20-2011, 10:46 PM
So how long until K has a red flag in his sock?

Probably not that long. Doesn't seem like K would like that rule much, though. I think he would make Chris Collins put it in his sock :)

NashvilleDevil
03-20-2011, 10:50 PM
Gus and Len never questioned the call during the game but it seemed wrong to me.

But we all know that Len would be screaming from the mountain if that happened to Syracuse against Duke.

sporthenry
03-20-2011, 10:51 PM
Probably not that long. Doesn't seem like K would like that rule much, though. I think he would make Chris Collins put it in his sock :)

I was thinking that although I think he would enjoy it like Bellichick and make it a spectacle every time he reaches for it. It is amazing to think of how much K has had to learn by way of the game changing in the past 20 years between players leaving early to the physicality of the game.

But it will be interesting to see how basketball evolves with this b/c it is probably the hardest game to implement these things b/c it is a constant game unlike football where the play is dead every 7 seconds.

Neals384
03-20-2011, 11:04 PM
i take back all that I said.....the timeout was called at about the 4.57 second mark.... and the 5 second call was at about 4.86 seconds (which is a little quick, as the count usually gives the benefit of the doubt to the passer)

edit: in reference to the previous post, apparently the ref was not correct if that rule is in fact off the books

I also timed it with a stopwatch and the timeout request was made at about 4.45 seconds - peretty close to your 4.57. And I checked the rulebook - there is nothing about a 4 second limit.

Conclusion - Texas got hosed.

Lesson learned for Duke - no more close games...when you're up 15, close 'em out!

texas
03-20-2011, 11:18 PM
ok now that we have that settled can you do us just one little favor? please pummel arizona into the ground. thanks.

uh_no
03-21-2011, 01:06 AM
3 times actually. Andy Glockner's twitter (@aglock) is all over the fact that the refs screwed up a backcourt violation call off an inbounds pass against Syracuse in a tie game with under a minute left. Gus and Len never questioned the call during the game but it seemed wrong to me.

I was pretty sure it was wrong when called, he caught the ball in the air and landed on the line, and thus was not yet established in the front court...given he then traveled...so the right team ended up with the ball....but where you take off from is irrelevent, and an in bounds pass can go to the backcourt, which it legally did

hurley1
03-21-2011, 01:12 AM
The rule that you can't call a timeout after the 4 second mark has been off the books for a long time now. You can call a timeout all the way to the end of the 5 seconds.

the head of referees for the ncaa was on t.v. and he said the ref was 100% correct.....no timeout is granted after the 4 count....that's the rules.....

uh_no
03-21-2011, 01:31 AM
the head of referees for the ncaa was on t.v. and he said the ref was 100% correct.....no timeout is granted after the 4 count....that's the rules.....

it appears that the head of refereeing disagrees with the rulebook



Section 12. Timeouts Not Granted
Art. 1. No timeouts shall be granted:
a. To the opponents of the throw-in team after the throw-in starts.
b. During an interrupted dribble.
c. To a player or coach when an airborne player’s momentum is
carrying him/her out of bounds or into the backcourt.
d. Unless there is player control by the requesting team. Exception:
Rule 5-12.1.c.
e. Until after the jump ball that begins the game and the conditions as
described in Rule 5-10 are in effect
I could find no provision as listed