PDA

View Full Version : MBB: Duke v. Virginia Tech (ACCT) Pre-Game and In-Game Thread



pfrduke
03-11-2011, 11:50 PM
Let's go Devils!

jipops
03-11-2011, 11:54 PM
Does VT employ a press? It may be even tougher to generate offense tomorrow. I'm guessing we put Singler on Delaney again.

diveonthefloor
03-11-2011, 11:59 PM
Seth will get 35 minutes at the point, but I think we'll see some of Kyle bringing the ball up.

Seth can handle this role. Andre should be juiced for this game. He knows that he'll be key in this game. Fully expect him to step to the plate.

hurley1
03-12-2011, 12:09 AM
Seth will get 35 minutes at the point, but I think we'll see some of Kyle bringing the ball up.

Seth can handle this role. Andre should be juiced for this game. He knows that he'll be key in this game. Fully expect him to step to the plate.

i would love to see that.....if we have curry,singler, 2 plumlees and dawkins on the court, we can beat them.....if dawkins heats up really hot, we will blow them out and run them to death....

VaDukie
03-12-2011, 12:19 AM
I know we're all concerned about Nolan, and for good reason, but I'm very confident tomorrow with or without him.

In addition to the benefit of playing a team facing their 3rd game in 3 days, VT played 6 guys tonight. Not 6 in double figure minutes. Just 6. They had 3 guys end the game with 4 fouls. They have nothing left in the tank.

This ain't Blacksburg on Gameday. We're winning by 10+.

VaDukie
03-12-2011, 12:36 AM
PS I love Seth's opportunity for redemption tomorrow.

Kedsy
03-12-2011, 12:41 AM
Well, it's a good thing we have backcourt depth. If Nolan doesn't play, I assume the starting lineup will be MP1, MP2, Kyle, Seth, and Andre. A lot of offensive firepower but (with all due respect to Seth's fine showing tonight from the PG spot) nobody running the show to get the ball to our offensive threats. Presumably Ryan is first off the bench, followed by Tyler, and we run a 7 man rotation to VPI's 6 man rotation.

If Tyler is in the game along with the MPs, Kyle, and either Seth or Andre, our offense would be somewhat lacking. So for the first time this year I'll say I expect to go small a lot, at least when Tyler is in the game. When the backcourt is Seth and Andre, as it will be for most of the game (if Nolan is out), I think we'll go big.

Hopefully Nolan will be OK and this post will be moot.

heyman25
03-12-2011, 04:33 AM
I know we're all concerned about Nolan, and for good reason, but I'm very confident tomorrow with or without him.

In addition to the benefit of playing a team facing their 3rd game in 3 days, VT played 6 guys tonight. Not 6 in double figure minutes. Just 6. They had 3 guys end the game with 4 fouls. They have nothing left in the tank.

This ain't Blacksburg on Gameday. We're winning by 10+.

I also feel good about our next game. We can play better than the Maryland game. We need to tighten up on defense. We need much better passing. We can crash the boards even better. I just hope we can stay away from foul trouble. We gave away a lot of missed free throws to Maryland. Despite VPI's 6 guys, they will still be amped.Don't bail out missed shots by fouling.Keep Tech off the foul line. It stops the clock and gives their 6 guys rest.We want payback, but we can get it by playing our game.

SMO
03-12-2011, 06:48 AM
Does VT employ a press? It may be even tougher to generate offense tomorrow. I'm guessing we put Singler on Delaney again.

I'd be shocked if they do. 3rd game in 3 days for a very thin VPI team? They'll need to save their energy.

dukeimac
03-12-2011, 06:53 AM
Well, playing 3 games in 3 nights is not an issue these days. UConn has played 4 games in 4 nights and is going for thier 5th game in 5 nights.

The key for Duke, NO MORE 3's. Kyle was 0-4. He took two in a row and was wide open on both. Nolan was off too. Not a time for him to go cold from the outside plus his injury is a concern. They might be able to get past VT without him but no way they get past UNC without him.

The good from last nights game might be that Mason and Miles are rising to the top. We will see how they play tonight. And Duke got some real nice play from others like Kelly and Seth with Andre sprinkled in. Duke needs that the rest of thw way.

Biggest key, Seth needs to get better on defense. If he can't stop Marshall, Tyler will have to play a lot and that takes away a scorer.

4decadedukie
03-12-2011, 07:00 AM
I am sure Nolan will recover quickly and -- before next weekend -- completely. With or without him, however, I am confident we will play hard and win. Our team has something to prove, and -- on or off the court --Nolan is a big part of that. Be prepared for the most extensive display ever of Greenburg histrionics, grimaces, and pickle-faces.

CarmenWallaceWade
03-12-2011, 08:56 AM
I'm glad we are getting the chance to play Va Tech again. We were in the drivers seat to win against them two weeks ago and blew it. That's going to add even more reason for the guys to be pumped about this one and to take care of business.

As for Nolan, I feel confident we win even if he doesn't play. As I said before last night's game, if we could get production from Mason, Ryan, and Andre, it's less pressure on him and Singler to carry us this weekend. Nolan had an off night and we still were in control thanks to the other guys stepping up. Their production also allowed Kyle to get in his own groove. And that gives us momentum going in to today. If it had been just Nolan, Kyle, and Seth carrying us, I would be nervous. But after seeing these guys along with Miles play very well, I think we are in a good position. As much as I hate to see injuries, they can help a team grow. If everyone contributes their share and plays their best defense, we are deep enough in the back court to still win this tournament.

Bob Green
03-12-2011, 09:17 AM
The key for Duke, NO MORE 3's.

Andre Dawkins was 2-5 on 3s with one of his misses halfway down before it popped out of the basket. Forty percent success which could have been 60% is pretty darn good so I can't agree with "no more 3s" but I do agree we need to make the extra pass for a better shot rather than attempt an early 3-pointer. We did a great job last night moving the ball around. Our offense looked good.

hurley1
03-12-2011, 09:23 AM
Andre Dawkins was 2-5 on 3s with one of his misses halfway down before it popped out of the basket. Forty percent success which could have been 60% is pretty darn good so I can't agree with "no more 3s" but I do agree we need to make the extra pass for a better shot rather than attempt an early 3-pointer. We did a great job last night moving the ball around. Our offense looked good.

i absolutely agree......i would start dawkins and leave him in there and let him get into the flow of the game.....dawkins is the best 3 point shooter on the team when he is on.....

PumpkinFunk
03-12-2011, 10:27 AM
If you're going to be in Greensboro, be loud. The Duke fans were quieter than the Maryland fans, and with Carolina fans likely to be sitting, waiting for VT to take a lead and cheer against us, the crowd noise will be especially important.

As for the actual game, I worry if Nolan is out. While we have the ability to get them in foul trouble and tire them out with a fast pace, we have to be able to shut down Delaney and absolutely need to shut down Allen/Green better than we did 2 weeks ago. If we get any of those 3 into foul trouble, things get a tiny bit easier since Greenberg has majorly shortened his rotation in this tournament. This isn't an unfavorable matchup for us on paper, but the question here is motivation and mindset. As with 2 weeks ago, Seth and the Hokies are sure that yesterday's win got them into the tournament. Does that mean that they don't play hard and they let this off the hook? Likewise, without Nolan (which I would say is fairly likely... I doubt that Coach K will let him play much, if at all, today if he's not near-100%) can we get into the right mindset? He's our leader.

With Nolan, we shouldn't have much trouble. If he's out, then I'm not so sure that we can or will win. I will say that last night does encourage me, as Nolan had a relatively bad game and the rest of the team played amazingly well.

dukeimac
03-12-2011, 10:30 AM
Andre Dawkins was 2-5 on 3s with one of his misses halfway down before it popped out of the basket. Forty percent success which could have been 60% is pretty darn good so I can't agree with "no more 3s" but I do agree we need to make the extra pass for a better shot rather than attempt an early 3-pointer. We did a great job last night moving the ball around. Our offense looked good.

First, I never mentioned Andre, he was respectable 2-5. But do you realize Duke was 3 of 15? Kyle is about 16 for 100 in the last 16 or so games. Nolan was not very good either in the UNC game and last night he was 0-4.

Next, make an extra pass? Every shot Kyle took from 3 last night he was wide open. I'm not sure looking for someone to pass to is the option, more of take it to the basket. The guy had 29 points and none from 3 land, that tells me his game is going to the hole and not shoting the 3's.

Seth had a nice night, 11 points. But he was 3-11, 0-1 from 3 land.

These guys need to take it to the basket and get the easy shots or foul shots. Duke doesn't need the 3 if they take it to the basket and play good defense. They need to play with a lot of intensity like they did last night when Nolan went down.

Live by the 3 die by the 3, we have seen Duke go through that before and ask ND, they died by the 3 last night against 'ville.

Bob Green
03-12-2011, 10:38 AM
The key for Duke, NO MORE 3's.


First, I never mentioned Andre...

These two post are contradictory as Dawkins plays for Duke. Therefore when you say "NO MORE 3's" you imply Dawkins shouldn't attempt 3-point shots.

We will have to agree to disagree here. But I guarantee Duke will attempt some 3-pointers today against Virginia Tech.

cptnflash
03-12-2011, 10:56 AM
I know we're all concerned about Nolan, and for good reason, but I'm very confident tomorrow with or without him.

In addition to the benefit of playing a team facing their 3rd game in 3 days, VT played 6 guys tonight. Not 6 in double figure minutes. Just 6. They had 3 guys end the game with 4 fouls. They have nothing left in the tank.

This ain't Blacksburg on Gameday. We're winning by 10+.

Agree 100%. And this time around, we have more to play for than they do. They're in the tournament at this point, which is all they wanted. We still have a shot at a #1 seed, but probably have to win out to get it.

DukeDevilDeb
03-12-2011, 10:59 AM
The key for Duke, NO MORE 3's. Kyle was 0-4. He took two in a row and was wide open on both. Nolan was off too. Not a time for him to go cold from the outside plus his injury is a concern. They might be able to get past VT without him but no way they get past UNC without him.



First, you're jumping way ahead. Let's think about VT (hasn't been VPI for a long, long time) and win the game today. Then we can worry about Marshall (or maybe not if the Orange Crush is working!)

Do you really mean no more threes? Want to take away Seth and Andre last night? Kyle isn't going to stop shooting 3s, but I do think he'll be smart and try to drive and get fouled as he did last night.

And to those who said Seth didn't show leadership, I beg to differ! I thought he was a great leader both by action and by word after Nolan went down. Seth had 0 (ZERO) turnovers last night in 31 minutes of play; Nolan had 5 in the same number of minutes.

Do I want Nolan back and healthy? Of course I do. But if he has to miss today's game or even (hoping we win today) tomorrow's, I feel good with Seth in there.

Nolan, we don't want to do this without you. Heal (not Heel) quickly!

Go DUKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Utley
03-12-2011, 11:53 AM
What do we think is an effective number of 3 point shots? We shot 15 last night. I really liked the way we attacked the hoop against MD and worked for higher quality shots. After watching last night I would prefer that trend and don't think I'd want more than 15. Thoughts? I totally appreciate there is some game to game variability here.

Any feel for what we averaged last year - especially towards the end of the season? Last night's shot selection reminded me of last year's run.

Kedsy
03-12-2011, 11:54 AM
First, I never mentioned Andre, he was respectable 2-5. But do you realize Duke was 3 of 15? Kyle is about 16 for 100 in the last 16 or so games. Nolan was not very good either in the UNC game and last night he was 0-4.

Next, make an extra pass? Every shot Kyle took from 3 last night he was wide open. I'm not sure looking for someone to pass to is the option, more of take it to the basket. The guy had 29 points and none from 3 land, that tells me his game is going to the hole and not shoting the 3's.

Seth had a nice night, 11 points. But he was 3-11, 0-1 from 3 land.

These guys need to take it to the basket and get the easy shots or foul shots. Duke doesn't need the 3 if they take it to the basket and play good defense. They need to play with a lot of intensity like they did last night when Nolan went down.

Live by the 3 die by the 3, we have seen Duke go through that before and ask ND, they died by the 3 last night against 'ville.

Well, I understand what you're saying, but it's obvious the coaching staff doesn't agree with you. Duke will continue taking open threes when we get them, and that includes Kyle. Personally, I think that's a good thing, but whether you agree or not, we're all going to have to just live with it.

Kedsy
03-12-2011, 11:59 AM
What do we think is an effective number of 3 point shots? We shot 15 last night. I really liked the way we attacked the hoop against MD and worked for higher quality shots. After watching last night I would prefer that trend and don't think I'd want more than 15. Thoughts? I totally appreciate there is some game to game variability here.

Any feel for what we averaged last year - especially towards the end of the season? Last night's shot selection reminded me of last year's run.

We averaged 19.55 three point attempts per game last year (32.9% of our shots). I'm too lazy to break it down further than that. We average 20.38 three point attempts per game this year (34.9% of our shots)

ns7
03-12-2011, 12:01 PM
First, you're jumping way ahead. Let's think about VT (hasn't been VPI for a long, long time) and win the game today.

Actually their official name is Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University, hence the VPI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech

dukeimac
03-12-2011, 12:11 PM
Here is what I'm talking about...

Kyle
All 32 games 15-174 or 32.8%
Last 16 games 17-75 or 22.7%
Last 7 games 2-23 or 8.7%
Last 2 games 0-9 or 0.0%

Team
All 32 games 258-687 or 37.6%
Last 16 games 108-327 or 33.0%
Last 7 games 39-128 or 30.5%
Last 2 games 9-42 or 21.4%

When Duke plays a UNC 30% isn't bad unless you take 20+ 3's becasue that is 6 of 20.

Losses to VT and UNC Duke was 10 of 47.

This is highlighted by the fact that Duke does not do a good job with offense rebounding, about middle of the pack.

mgtr
03-12-2011, 12:21 PM
Actually their official name is Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University, hence the VPI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech

And hence the Va Tech. Look, if I were in a bar, and told the guy next to me that I went to VPI&SU, he would probably make some pun on the initials, and move down to the other end of the bar! Who could blame him?

OldPhiKap
03-12-2011, 12:33 PM
Watch the press conference from last night (www.the.acc.com and follow links). Kyle GUARANTEED that his shot is going to start falling. So I don't expect the team to go away from a style K has used for years. He wants his shooters to keep taking shots.

LGD!!!!!!

NSDukeFan
03-12-2011, 12:36 PM
First, I never mentioned Andre, he was respectable 2-5. But do you realize Duke was 3 of 15? Kyle is about 16 for 100 in the last 16 or so games. Nolan was not very good either in the UNC game and last night he was 0-4.

Next, make an extra pass? Every shot Kyle took from 3 last night he was wide open. I'm not sure looking for someone to pass to is the option, more of take it to the basket. The guy had 29 points and none from 3 land, that tells me his game is going to the hole and not shoting the 3's.

Seth had a nice night, 11 points. But he was 3-11, 0-1 from 3 land.

These guys need to take it to the basket and get the easy shots or foul shots. Duke doesn't need the 3 if they take it to the basket and play good defense. They need to play with a lot of intensity like they did last night when Nolan went down.

Live by the 3 die by the 3, we have seen Duke go through that before and ask ND, they died by the 3 last night against 'ville.
ND, who has won 12 of 14 and lost in OT to #14 ranked Louisville will likely not change their extremely efficient offense (Pomeroy rates them 3rd in the country) because they may have missed some shots against a good team.

Yes, if a team misses a whole bunch of threes, they may lose, but overall the 3-point shot is a very efficient way to score points and most (if not all) of the top offenses, use it. I strongly disagree that Duke doesn't need the 3. Duke's strength is its perimeter and that includes some great 3-point shooters, though some have struggled lately. I don't think Duke is going to win all of its games by ignoring its very good 3-point shooters. I can agree that the team does need a balance of interior and exterior passing and scoring to play its best.

I was also very impressed with Seth last night and thought he did an outstanding job taking more control of the offense once Nolan went out.

Here is what I'm talking about...

Kyle
All 32 games 15-174 or 32.8%
Last 16 games 17-75 or 22.7%
Last 7 games 2-23 or 8.7%
Last 2 games 0-9 or 0.0%

Team
All 32 games 258-687 or 37.6%
Last 16 games 108-327 or 33.0%
Last 7 games 39-128 or 30.5%
Last 2 games 9-42 or 21.4%

When Duke plays a UNC 30% isn't bad unless you take 20+ 3's becasue that is 6 of 20.

Losses to VT and UNC Duke was 10 of 47.

This is highlighted by the fact that Duke does not do a good job with offense rebounding, about middle of the pack.

So, what you are talking about is that Kyle hasn't shot well from 3-point land lately and Duke doesn't shoot well when it loses? I agree completely.
Just as a reminder, 33% 3 point shooting corresponds to 50% effective field goal % and 30% corresponds to 45%.
I hope Duke continues to use its very good perimeter players to get good shots and that the team continues to use the 3-point shot as an effective weapon even if the team hasn't shot as well recently as they have at other times.

DukeBlueHeart4
03-12-2011, 01:18 PM
1. We shouldn't just assume this is a win. VT has proven how pesky they can be if given the proper motivation.

2. I hope Nolan Smith is not only better but comes back ready ready to rain on VT. I also hope he doesn't do anything during this game to aggravate his toe and make it worse.

3. How will Seth handle this game? He looked fantastic after Nolan left during the MD game but can he keep that up, especially against this team? He's gotta be looking for some redemption after the visit to VT.


An afterthought: Is there anywhere I can stream the game online? I will be at my sister's house and she doesn't even own a tv....crazy hippie...:D

HorvathsGhost
03-12-2011, 01:20 PM
www.theacc.com/live works great

Indoor66
03-12-2011, 01:25 PM
Actually their official name is Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University, hence the VPI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech

But they call themselves Virginia Tech. In my world they can brand themselves and I respect that (except unc).

Chris Randolph
03-12-2011, 01:31 PM
Some of the discussion under this topic is brutal and pointless. Focus on Va Tech and the game......

With Nolan being questionable, I think Delaney will have an opportunity to have a nice scoring game. That being said the key to this game in my opinion is to stop the "other" guys for Va Tech. Allen is tough and he always plays well against us, but we cannot allow the likes of Green and Davilla to have good games. Offensive rebounds, poor transitions D in Blacksburg allowed them to get easy buckets

I think the fact that Va Tech played a physical game, late into the night and played only 6 players could cause them to get tired legs in the final 10 minutes, which is perfectly fine by me :) I know that Kyle played all 40 last night, but he has been doing that for years in the tourneys, he has that experience, Va Tech not so much

DukeDevilDeb
03-12-2011, 01:56 PM
Actually their official name is Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University, hence the VPI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech

If you go on the Internet and search for VPI, the first thing that comes up is VPI Pet Insurance!:\:) If you search for VT, you come up with Virginia Tech.

I have collaborated with faculty from Virginia Tech for years, and we used to use the abbreviation "VPI" all the time. However, about 8 years ago, we received a fiat from their president's office telling us never to darken their door with VPI again. On their website everything is VT. That's all.

What a great way to waste time until 3 pm!

bluepenguin
03-12-2011, 02:30 PM
I hope Nolan Smith is not only better but comes back ready ready to rain on VT. I also hope he doesn't do anything during this game to aggravate his toe and make it worse.

Mike Gminski just announced in the Clemson-UNC game that xrays of Nolan's toe were negative - i.e. not broken. That's good news.

DukeBlueHeart4
03-12-2011, 02:58 PM
www.theacc.com/live works great

Thanks! :D

riverside6
03-12-2011, 04:00 PM
live tempo-based stats for the game here, starters posted

http://www.scacchoops.com/ViewHDGame.asp?hSchedule=10177

lotusland
03-12-2011, 04:02 PM
No doubt Dre will get minutes today but Tyler is probably going to get 20+. If Nolan isnt full strength he should probably sit today

lotusland
03-12-2011, 04:03 PM
Nevermind Nolan is starting

lotusland
03-12-2011, 04:05 PM
Zone?

sporthenry
03-12-2011, 04:09 PM
I think starting both Plumlees might be the nice little tinkering that gives Duke a little extra momentum going into the tournament. Having 2 legit post threats might open up the perimeter a bit more.
And then Kelly can come off the bench at full speed and catch some open looks.

SCMatt33
03-12-2011, 04:10 PM
Good New: Nolan's toe doesn't look like an issue

Bad News: His offense is about the same as it was before he got hurt yesterday.

Chris Randolph
03-12-2011, 04:10 PM
Nolan looking much like yesterday to start. He is off shooting and he looks to be lacking the confidence/swagger that has made him a legit NPOY candidate. I don't like this for the NCAA's at all....

muzikfrk75
03-12-2011, 04:19 PM
Nolan looking much like yesterday to start. He is off shooting and he looks to be lacking the confidence/swagger that has made him a legit NPOY candidate. I don't like this for the NCAA's at all....

The swagger has returned.

NashvilleDevil
03-12-2011, 04:20 PM
Nolan looking much like yesterday to start. He is off shooting and he looks to be lacking the confidence/swagger that has made him a legit NPOY candidate. I don't like this for the NCAA's at all....

2 minutes in and you're writing him off. Nice.

FellowTraveler
03-12-2011, 04:20 PM
I have absolutely no concern about Nolan's confidence, or his swagger.

That foul call on Dawkins sure looked like a hook from here.

sporthenry
03-12-2011, 04:20 PM
That ball might have woken up Dre. Honestly, that didn't look on purpose but it also didn't appear he tried to avoid hitting him in the head. It wasn't like he was facing the stands, he stared Dre down, then threw it off his head.

But Dre seems a bit fired up.

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 04:25 PM
Finally a 3 goes down! And from Nolan, no less! Let's go DUKE!!!
\

YourLandlord
03-12-2011, 04:25 PM
Git sum n dot

SCMatt33
03-12-2011, 04:25 PM
Nolan heating up, though you have to think that open drive would have been a dunk without the toe injury.

Son of Mojo
03-12-2011, 04:28 PM
Long as it ended in 2 points I'm happy.

FellowTraveler
03-12-2011, 04:29 PM
Honestly, that didn't look on purpose but it also didn't appear he tried to avoid hitting him in the head. It wasn't like he was facing the stands, he stared Dre down, then threw it off his head.

It looked bad. Very bad. Not only was he looking directly at Andre's face when he threw the ball, he wasn't falling -- both feet were on the floor, and he was no longer moving forward. It was a very ugly looking play.

That said, I tend to assume things like this are inadvertent, particularly when they are out of the blue. Basketball is a fast-moving game, and there are going to be innocent plays that look bad. I found the rush to condemn Gerald Henderson for the incident in Chapel Hill distasteful, and I give the VT player the benefit of the doubt in this case.

dairedevil
03-12-2011, 04:36 PM
happy that Nolan is able to play - seems to be without any ramifications from the toe - and his offense has returned :-)

glad to see that the ball bounced off his face has not affected Andre - just got a 3 :-D

Kyle hasn't scored - yet - is it time to start roasting him for his lack of offense?

JohnGalt
03-12-2011, 04:39 PM
Nolan is saying:

"Hey, Harrison. Anything you can do, I can do better."

Classic.

davekay1971
03-12-2011, 04:40 PM
Liking just about everything I'm seeing today. Not everything is falling, but guys like Andre, Seth, and Ryan are looking for opportunities; Nolan is Nolan; Kyle just dropped a 3; our defense is looking focused; we're doing well on the boards. We fell momentarily into settling for 3s, but overall we're doing a better job looking to penetrate and get points inside.

Keep it going, guys, put this away.

El_Diablo
03-12-2011, 04:42 PM
It looked bad. Very bad. Not only was he looking directly at Andre's face when he threw the ball, he wasn't falling -- both feet were on the floor, and he was no longer moving forward. It was a very ugly looking play.

That said, I tend to assume things like this are inadvertent, particularly when they are out of the blue. Basketball is a fast-moving game, and there are going to be innocent plays that look bad. I found the rush to condemn Gerald Henderson for the incident in Chapel Hill distasteful, and I give the VT player the benefit of the doubt in this case.

Um, how could it possibly be inadvertent? It's not like he flipped it backwards or was off-balance. He fired the ball off Andre's face from two feet away, while looking right at him.

EDIT: Okay, maybe he was trying to throw it off Andre's neck and simply missed...

El_Diablo
03-12-2011, 04:50 PM
At least it fired Nolan up though. He came right back, attacked the rim, and drew the foul. You could see in his body language that he was angry as we stalked up to the free throw line.

Chris Randolph
03-12-2011, 04:50 PM
Nolan looking much like yesterday to start. He is off shooting and he looks to be lacking the confidence/swagger that has made him a legit NPOY candidate. I don't like this for the NCAA's at all....

I'm an idiot

arnie
03-12-2011, 04:54 PM
Um, how could it possibly be inadvertent? It's not like he flipped it backwards or was off-balance. He fired the ball off Andre's face from two feet away, while looking right at him.

EDIT: Okay, maybe he was trying to throw it off Andre's neck and simply missed...

Don't forget - Greenburg is the coach and VPI is the school - what else would you expect.

moonpie23
03-12-2011, 04:55 PM
Don't forget - Greenburg is the coach and VPI is the school - what else would you expect.

i'm not so sure about this......he's had some thugs playing for him yes, but i don't think he coaches it or approves of it.....

devilsadvocate85
03-12-2011, 04:56 PM
That ball might have woken up Dre. Honestly, that didn't look on purpose but it also didn't appear he tried to avoid hitting him in the head. It wasn't like he was facing the stands, he stared Dre down, then threw it off his head.

But Dre seems a bit fired up.

If you don't think so, you haven't seen Jeff Allen and his antics for his entire career. He looked right at him and hit him in the head with the ball. Andre was just standing there doing nothing.

COYS
03-12-2011, 04:57 PM
It looked bad. Very bad. Not only was he looking directly at Andre's face when he threw the ball, he wasn't falling -- both feet were on the floor, and he was no longer moving forward. It was a very ugly looking play.

That said, I tend to assume things like this are inadvertent, particularly when they are out of the blue. Basketball is a fast-moving game, and there are going to be innocent plays that look bad. I found the rush to condemn Gerald Henderson for the incident in Chapel Hill distasteful, and I give the VT player the benefit of the doubt in this case.

I strongly disagree here. Dre was so close and he had to throw the ball quickly (hence, with a lot of force) before he fell out of bounds that it would have been difficult to extend his arms and get the ball below Andre's waist at his feet (a more legitimate target). He had a split second to look and see where Dre was, but that was about it. In high school I turned around in a similar situation and fired a ball with all my might right into the opposing player's . . . um . . . well, you get where I am going. I had just enough time to gather myself to put some force behind the throw, which made it look like I was sizing up where to throw it. However, I had absolutely no intention of hitting the player there. It just happened. The refs agreed, especially since the opposing player and I had no previous history of hard fouls during the game, and just ran over to make sure the opposing team's bench didn't start something. I felt bad, but I had no intent to harm. It's just part of the game. 'Dre seemed to know that, too.

ncexnyc
03-12-2011, 04:59 PM
I'm an idiot

Don't feel bad. I was worried the way Nolan started the game and I'm sure we had some company as well, they just won't fess up.

CBDUKE
03-12-2011, 05:01 PM
I strongly disagree here. Dre was so close and he had to throw the ball quickly (hence, with a lot of force) before he fell out of bounds that it would have been difficult to extend his arms and get the ball below Andre's waist at his feet (a more legitimate target). He had a split second to look and see where Dre was, but that was about it. In high school I turned around in a similar situation and fired a ball with all my might right into the opposing player's . . . um . . . well, you get where I am going. I had just enough time to gather myself to put some force behind the throw, which made it look like I was sizing up where to throw it. However, I had absolutely no intention of hitting the player there. It just happened. The refs agreed, especially since the opposing player and I had no previous history of hard fouls during the game, and just ran over to make sure the opposing team's bench didn't start something. I felt bad, but I had no intent to harm. It's just part of the game. 'Dre seemed to know that, too.

He threw the ball off Andre's face and he never did fall out of bounds. So why did he need to throw it???

stillcrazie
03-12-2011, 05:03 PM
If you don't think so, you haven't seen Jeff Allen and his antics for his entire career. He looked right at him and hit him in the head with the ball. Andre was just standing there doing nothing.

Did you also notice how Allen decked Kyle right after Nolan made his up and under move?

oldnavy
03-12-2011, 05:04 PM
He threw the ball off Andre's face and he never did fall out of bounds. So why did he need to throw it???

He never was falling out of bounds. Kudos to our guys they have a lot more discipline than I would.

FellowTraveler
03-12-2011, 05:05 PM
I strongly disagree here.

I'm pretty sure we don't actually disagree. You don't think it was intentional or dirty; I wrote that I give the VT player the benefit of the doubt and assume it was inadvertent. We appear to be in vigorous agreement.

dairedevil
03-12-2011, 05:06 PM
Just noticed that Nolan doesn't have the same shoes on today - but Kyle has the sparkly blue ones on...

House G
03-12-2011, 05:11 PM
Refs seem to have swallowed their whistles.

Dukegbw3
03-12-2011, 05:12 PM
Good timeout by K. Someone please tell the bigs not to start the crap they did at VaTech. Tech is absolutely going to try and kidney punch us while crashing the boards. We have got to box out...

ajgoodfella7
03-12-2011, 05:16 PM
I love how frustrated Delaney looks with Nolan guarding him... And I love even more how Nolan doesn't care one bit.

deezl
03-12-2011, 05:23 PM
Allen has been a dirt bag all game.

fisheyes
03-12-2011, 05:23 PM
Foul on Singler? You're kidding me!

davekay1971
03-12-2011, 05:24 PM
Wow, yeah, Duke definitely gets all the calls. Singler's face brutally impeded the progress on Allen's elbow right there. Should have been an intentional on Kyle.

SMO
03-12-2011, 05:24 PM
I love how frustrated Delaney looks with Nolan guarding him... And I love even more how Nolan doesn't care one bit.

Tell me they are looking at the tape of Singler being elbowed.

SMO
03-12-2011, 05:25 PM
Tell me they are looking at the tape of Singler being elbowed.

And Goonberg is complaining!!!

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:26 PM
Every time we look like we're about to take control, we make some DUMB turnover. That was not a good decision by Kelly. Gotta know time and score dude!

El_Diablo
03-12-2011, 05:27 PM
Our bigs are keeping VT in this.

MartyClark
03-12-2011, 05:27 PM
I love how frustrated Delaney looks with Nolan guarding him... And I love even more how Nolan doesn't care one bit.

Nolan is playing incredibly good defense on Delaney while remaining in complete control of his emotions. He is having a great game, bad toe and all.

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:27 PM
Way to go Miles!!! Where has he been for the last month or so? Glad to see him coming on lately though.

DukeGirl4ever
03-12-2011, 05:32 PM
I love how frustrated Delaney looks with Nolan guarding him... And I love even more how Nolan doesn't care one bit.

Quote of the day! I may steal this for my Facebook status! :)

FellowTraveler
03-12-2011, 05:32 PM
Not wild about the way we've been feeding the post in the 2nd half, which is 1) rarely and 2) with risky passes into triple-teams and poorly-thrown lobs.

But mostly, this is the kind of game that can't end soon enough.

fisheyes
03-12-2011, 05:32 PM
Every time we look like we're about to take control, we make some DUMB turnover. That was not a good decision by Kelly. Gotta know time and score dude!

I take offense...the band had nothing to do with it! :)

Son of Mojo
03-12-2011, 05:32 PM
I know, for some reason, there are some on here very sensitive to using the word thug (though that's exactly how I think of VT), there's certainly some rhapscalious play out there by them...........

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:38 PM
Well, we look like we are trying to give this game to VT just like we did up in Blacksburg. C'mon Duke!!!

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:40 PM
I say we just alley-opp it for the rest of this game! Yeah BABY!!!

pfrduke
03-12-2011, 05:41 PM
Not wild about the way we've been feeding the post in the 2nd half, which is 1) rarely and 2) with risky passes into triple-teams and poorly-thrown lobs.

But mostly, this is the kind of game that can't end soon enough.

Those are better post feeds!

stillcrazie
03-12-2011, 05:41 PM
Not wild about the way we've been feeding the post in the 2nd half, which is 1) rarely and 2) with risky passes into triple-teams and poorly-thrown lobs.

But mostly, this is the kind of game that can't end soon enough.

Better?

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:42 PM
See ya Jeff!!!

House G
03-12-2011, 05:42 PM
Allen: "who, me?"

SMO
03-12-2011, 05:43 PM
I say we just alley-opp it for the rest of this game! Yeah BABY!!!

Followed by a Goonberg whiny face. I love it. Allen fouls out! VPI losing their composure.

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:46 PM
Some of these calls are just ridiculous. How is that a foul on Andre? Give me a break!!!!

ajgoodfella7
03-12-2011, 05:46 PM
The elbow to the chin... Are you kidding me? It was part of his damn shot!!!!!

RoyalBlue08
03-12-2011, 05:46 PM
That might be one of the worst calls I have ever seen.

muzikfrk75
03-12-2011, 05:46 PM
Jeff Allen isn't even in the game anymore and he's still affecting it. Smh

ajgoodfella7
03-12-2011, 05:47 PM
HE GOT A TECHNICAL FOR SHOOTING A RUNNER? I thought I had seen it all.

DukeFanNJ
03-12-2011, 05:47 PM
What a freakin joke this game has become

House G
03-12-2011, 05:47 PM
Unreal. Where is The Playcaller?

juise
03-12-2011, 05:48 PM
HE GOT A TECHNICAL FOR SHOOTING A RUNNER? I thought I had seen it all.

I'm at a loss for words. Stunned.

Dukegbw3
03-12-2011, 05:48 PM
what a crock of doo-doo. Dawk deserved an and-1. I hope Atkins has a bottle for all that milking he was doing.

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:48 PM
I want to DESTROY this VT team. Here's hoping we win by 20!

SMO
03-12-2011, 05:49 PM
Someone explain to me how a guy is supposed to shoot with his elbows at his side.

FellowTraveler
03-12-2011, 05:49 PM
Those are better post feeds!

Indeed.

RoyalBlue08
03-12-2011, 05:49 PM
what a crock of doo-doo. Dawk deserved an and-1. I hope Atkins has a bottle for all that milking he was doing.

I don't blame Atkins. He got legitimately hit in the face. But he got hit while fouling a shooter. And 1. No doubt about it.

pfrduke
03-12-2011, 05:49 PM
The refs have managed this game poorly.

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:49 PM
Singler's 4th with 5:00 to go...ugh!

Bluedevil114
03-12-2011, 05:50 PM
That was the worst call I have ever seen against Dawkins. That was not intentional.

sporthenry
03-12-2011, 05:50 PM
So how are you supposed to shoot in that situation? But gotta love Andre's new intesnity and I'm sure K will tell him to keep driving

ChrisP
03-12-2011, 05:51 PM
That was a charge on Nolan but...what about the TWO fouls that occurred before that where the VT guy bumped him all the way across the lane?

RoyalBlue08
03-12-2011, 05:51 PM
Does anyone know if these refs are also working the game tomorrow?

Lulu
03-12-2011, 05:51 PM
My god, I've never seen such a technical.

Pantone #287
03-12-2011, 05:51 PM
That is truly perhaps the worst call I have ever seen. While I understand the need to dampen the physicality of the play, that was part of Andre's natural shooting motion - a textbook example of how to take it to the hoop aggressively. As Coach K clearly said, "Unbelievable."

dairedevil
03-12-2011, 05:52 PM
I'm all for preventing injuries, especially to the head...but something about calling that a foul just doesn't look right.. ..and, it's okay to throw a ball into someone's face when they are standing out of bounds? weird and crazy rules.

johnny2001
03-12-2011, 05:52 PM
i've never seen a more ridiculously officiated game. acc officials are horrible. watching this game must be awful in person. it's like a funeral parlor in there. i see more carolina fans watching a duke game than duke fans! where are our people! pathetic duke fan showing and support in greensboro. we better bring some enthusiasm to tomorrow's game vs unc because i'm shocked by how weak the support is there today.

SMO
03-12-2011, 05:54 PM
That is truly perhaps the worst call I have ever seen. While I understand the need to dampen the physicality of the play, that was part of Andre's natural shooting motion - a textbook example of how to take it to the hoop aggressively. As Coach K clearly said, "Unbelievable."

What make it worse it that they reviewed it and still decided it was a technical!

jdj4duke
03-12-2011, 05:54 PM
The call against Dawkins was the worst in the history of basketball.

And then Nolan was fouled before the contact on the charge.

Poor. Very poor. Does Tech ever stop yapping?

MChambers
03-12-2011, 05:55 PM
Some of these calls are just ridiculous. How is that a foul on Andre? Give me a break!!!!

Andre = Shav

DukeFanNJ
03-12-2011, 05:55 PM
Duke just doesn't seem to have that killer instinct this year. I know they played a game yesterday but they should have put this game away by now. If VT hits a couple 3's then it will be deja vu.

juise
03-12-2011, 05:55 PM
Tempted to watch Harvard instead of finishing this. Refs are making this unwatchable.

Son of Mojo
03-12-2011, 05:56 PM
Join in on the dog pile--horrendous officiating. Horrible technical on Dre and we still can't get a foul called right now against them when we're driving. Let's hope these clowns aren't calling the game tomorrow.

Chris Randolph
03-12-2011, 05:57 PM
Shulman and Dickie V keep making light of the poor tempo and lack of environment in the arena.... Well that can be fully put on the officials. Geez, brutal officiating for both teams

Expect it to be much better for the championship game

muzikfrk75
03-12-2011, 05:58 PM
Up 13 and complaining? We need to get over it. Revenge game tomorrow.

FellowTraveler
03-12-2011, 05:58 PM
If you have a rule that requires calling a T on an offensive player simply for using a natural shooting motion, you need a new rule.

ajgoodfella7
03-12-2011, 05:59 PM
Wow, tough loss for Amaker and Harvard on a last second shot by Princeton.

DukeFanNJ
03-12-2011, 06:01 PM
Not complaining. Just saying we can't keep letting teams hang around.

obsesseddukefan
03-12-2011, 06:02 PM
Let's hope the officials get some calls right tomorrow against UNC. Go Duke!

LouisianaDukeFan
03-12-2011, 06:02 PM
That was the worst call I have ever seen against Dawkins. That was not intentional.

Did you guys notice Greenberg & K just look at each other and shrug their shoulders when the refs called them together for the 2nd technical? Just awful calls...

DukeGirl4ever
03-12-2011, 06:03 PM
Duke just doesn't seem to have that killer instinct this year. I know they played a game yesterday but they should have put this game away by now. If VT hits a couple 3's then it will be deja vu.

Please explain to me how you have a killer instinct in a game that has been officiated like this?

Both teams were unable to get in to any rhythm.

House G
03-12-2011, 06:03 PM
If you have a rule that requires calling a T on an offensive player simply for using a natural shooting motion, you need a new rule.

Maybe shooters need to tuck their elbows in--we can call it the tuck rule. . . sorry.

El_Diablo
03-12-2011, 06:04 PM
i've never seen a more ridiculously officiated game. acc officials are horrible. watching this game must be awful in person. it's like a funeral parlor in there. i see more carolina fans watching a duke game than duke fans! where are our people! pathetic duke fan showing and support in greensboro. we better bring some enthusiasm to tomorrow's game vs unc because i'm shocked by how weak the support is there today.

The Duke section is in the back left corner. UNC's is center court, and it's bigger. But there is still a lot of Duke blue on camera, so it looks like we are taking advantage of the secondhand market...

El_Diablo
03-12-2011, 06:06 PM
Did you guys notice Greenberg & K just look at each other and shrug their shoulders when the refs called them together for the 2nd technical? Just awful calls...

Greenberg said "Well, you gotta call that on both ends, Mike." As if it were a perfectly reasonable call.