MBB: VT 64, Duke 60 Post-Game Thread

[Bob Green]

Post your game thoughts here.

Edit: Please remember - no venting

[rotogod00]

6 assists. enough said

[Gthoma2a]

I am tired of seeing teams get to storm the court against us... this was so winnable that it makes me sick! I just wish we would have gone inside more instead of relying on the three when we didn't need it and failing to even get one off when we did.

Serious question, are we still a No. 1 seed without Kyrie?

I really hope we play better at UNC because I don't want them to have that moment.

[Lulu]

Poor shot selection is our downfall this year.

Which doesn't really apply to the last 23 seconds of this one I guess...

[ajgoodfella7]

I am tired of seeing teams get to storm the court against us... this was so winnable that it makes me sick! I just wish we would have gone inside more instead of relying on the three when we didn't need it and failing to even get one off when we did.

Serious question, are we still a No. 1 seed without Kyrie?

I think that would depend on how we finish the season out. If we don't win the ACC then no.

[jsimmons]

but proably the last ten minutes were the worst ten minutes from kyle this year. seth hurt us, but we went souly to a 2 man team in the second half. hope this gets out of our system.

[grossbus]

Distressing number of mistakes in the last 5 minutes. So many opportunities before that.

[RoyalBlue08]

Va Tech is celebrating like they just won some kind of championship. Quite funny.

[sporthenry]

Singler just doesn't look good this year. Not sure what has happened, but his shooting has fallen off and last year he was even injured.

Bigger question is not if we are a 1 seed, but if we aren't the favorites to win the ACC anymore? Can't be a 1 seed if UNC wins the ACC

[KShip21]

I am tired of seeing teams get to storm the court against us... this was so winnable that it makes me sick! I just wish we would have gone inside more instead of relying on the three when we didn't need it and failing to even get one off when we did.

Serious question, are we still a No. 1 seed without Kyrie?

Tonight just about lost it for us. Need to win out, and need some help.

[uh_no]

2 plays down the stretch cost us the game, IMHO:

kyle taking one of the worst 3 looks i've ever seen with about 30 seconds left and a ton of time left on the shot clock....with the way that VT was shooting free throws, I just don't understand how you can take a contested 3 from 25' with so much time left....boggles my mind

nolan missing the front end of the 1+1

nolan and kyle didn't show the senior leadership down the stretch....it was mason who made the plays....not that nolan and kyle aren't playing hard, I just think they need to realize they can't do it all themselves (taking bad shots, losing teh ball on drives..etc)

good thing we have a few more weeks

oh, and rebounding

[cbnaylor]

We had plenty of opportunities. Congrats to vt making the dance. Let's learn from this and finish strong.

[rotogod00]

I think that would depend on how we finish the season out. If we don't win the ACC then no.

probably gotta win the reg. season and the Tournament

[magjayran]

Kyle had a good game but settled for a few too many long threes. Nolan made a few mistakes late. But those guys did bring it. Mason looked ok too. Seth just needs to shake this one off. He'll get another chance against VT later in his career.

[CLW]

We got OUT HUSTLED on the glass.

We did not execute well blowing the 5 point lead late.

The streak of Ls on the road (other than UNC) ending in a storming of the court continues.

[Billy Dat]

Very tough loss because it was an extremely well played game on both sides until our side fell apart in the final 4 minutes, a time when we are usually rock solid. After not turning it over most of the game, Kyle had a walk and Nolan had a charge that were big plays. The offensive boards we gave up, especially for that late second chance 3, hurt really bad. Delaney pulling that 3 out his rear end at the end was fitting. Everyone will kill Kyle for his volume of shots and shot selection down the stretch, but he's earned the right to take at least a few of those shots. I am sure the coaches had no problem with him taking them, so we should probably accept that even though it was frustrating to watch. Nolan should have had more touches down the stretch, but he had a chance to hit some free throws. They ripped the win out of our hands...tough to take but they did. Props to Mason for his overall play, his late steal dunk, and making one of those two. Keep improving big guy. Miles, I liked your energy tonight, but next time two lay-ups will do, big fella.

[Chris Randolph]

We pretty much choked this one away. Very very surprising that Singler and Smith kind of vanished in the last 5 minutes, you expect them to step up in the end.

Gave up offensive boards, turned it over, took bad shots and didn't even get up a shot at the end.

The last 8 minutes of the game Va Tech's zone killed us. We kept running the same stinking play without any results, why we didn't make a change who knows

Very disappointing considering we are now tied with UNC for first. I imagine next Saturday night will be for the outright title which seems ridiculous considering how down the league is compared to past years

[Utley]

We gave this one away. So many chances around the 10 minute mark to just put VT away. Bad shot selection and bad execution. We have a low ceiling if Kyle doesn't find his offensive game.

If we are looking for diamonds here, Mason is really playing well. I can't remember the last time I wanted him to shoot more.

Next play - win the next two and you win the ACC and are still in a great position for a #1 seed.

[uh_no]

. Need to win out, and need some help.

we don't need any help....2 wins wins us the acc title outright...in fact the clemson game is now irrelevent....the only thing that matters is beating carolina, and we win a share

[Gthoma2a]

The thing that bothers me most about this loss is that they didn't beat us, we did it to ourselves with bad shot selection. We may not have Kyrie, but we have guys who can at least get to the middle of the zone and open things up. We were just using way too much perimeter against a team that isn't that tough on the inside.

[UrinalCake]

Kyrie, oh Kyrie, wherefore art thou Kyrie.

We are a jumpshooting team, plain and simple. When we make our shots we look awesome. When we don't, we look terrible.

[rotogod00]

Kyrie, oh Kyrie, wherefore art thou Kyrie.

We are a jumpshooting team, plain and simple. When we make our shots we look awesome. When we don't, we look terrible.

welcome to duke basketball the last few years. most of the time it works, but when it doesn't, it really doesn't

[uh_no]

When we don't, we look terrible.

when we take shots like we did today, we look terrible because they're terrible shots....and they don't go in

[Lord Ash]

Very, very strange game to watch, and not just because of the camera angles. We looked solid for most of the game, and then it sort of sputtered away. Delaney hitting that shot with a minute or two to go, you knew it was trouble...

Very, very strange game. Not the least bit enjoyable to watch. The postgame celebrations were totally and completely over the top for a regular season game between two non-rivals.

[Andre Buckner Fan]

Congrats to Virginia Tech. We dangled it out there and they took it.

[TheRob8801]

Frustrating game all around.

My gut sunk the moment Nolan drew the offensive foul against Delaney, because I kind of felt that that was the WORST possible time to toss them momentum. Again, when the 3's aren't falling the upset's come a calling. Mason and Miles both had some pretty good moments under the bucket, but I swear those two need to gain some basketball "smarts", because some of the unforced errors really cost us momentum and points (missed dunks, lazy rebounds, poor help defense).

If Mason and Miles continue to improve (and Ryan continues to show HIS excellent improvement) and we manage to develop a consistent offense underneath, then maybe in games like this where the three-ball doesn't fall consistently we can grind out points and stop the big runs. When you can put 4 or 5 grind points on the board during a 7-8 point run it really helps keep momentum balanced. The runs we've seen opponents make have been off of stupid turnovers and rebounds off of missed three pointers.

Unfortunately, I'm afraid that unless we can find an alternative to shooting MORE threes when the three-ball isn't working there's very little hope in making it back to the title game. I would be content with an Elite Eight run for this team right now, but then again, I said a similar thing last year.

[ajgoodfella7]

I think the biggest factor in this game was the stretches that Duke was just too impatient on the offensive end. In particular, I thought Kyle had a bad night, not just shooting the ball, but the actual shots he was taking. I think Duke would have been better served to try to get the ball to the rim more often then they did. Having Seth in foul trouble for the entire game was a huge factor as well because thats just one less ball-handler that can create.

34 percent (20 of 58) of Duke's shot attempts were from 3-point range, and when you only make 20 percent (4) of those, you are in for a long night.

But the bottom line for me is that, I just think we were too impatient on the offensive end.

[karmacoma]

Kyrie, oh Kyrie, wherefore art thou Kyrie.

We are a jumpshooting team, plain and simple. When we make our shots we look awesome. When we don't, we look terrible.

I agree. Had he been on the floor tonight, we would have run that team out of the gym -- no way they could have kept up with us playing an up-tempo style. I kept hoping against hope that we'd find a way to force tempo, but we played at VTech's speed, and they played a hair better in it than we did.

[LA_Bluedevil]

1. R. Kelly is being left WIDE open for shots and he is just not hitting right now. You can say Nolan and Kyle need to get other people involved, but when your passing to a guy who is open and he continously misses, then it can't be their fought.

2. Rebounds: We got destroyed on the boards tonight. We were taller than them and just as athletic (w/exception of RK athletically) across the front line and they whipped us.

3. Kyle went from shooting only 1 three against Temple to jacking them up in the 2nd half, and that last possession was horrendous.

I think it's back to the drawing board for rebounding and somehow Kyle and Ryan have to get some confidence in their shots.

[Gthoma2a]

we don't need any help....2 wins wins us the acc title outright...in fact the clemson game is now irrelevent....the only thing that matters is beating carolina, and we win a share

As I think about it, I think we need more than just winning the ACC. Kansas is above us right now, Pitt is likely above us, Ohio State is past us, and BYU may have just moved past us. We may need Texas to beat Kansas. The ACC is weak and having two losses this year will really hurt us.

[wsb3]

However, I don't know how you could be happy with this game. We were up by 5 on a 14-3 run and stopped VA Tech three straight times but did nothing offensively. I think if we expand that lead (seems there was around nine minutes left) at that point we win relatively easy. Two wide open 3's by Kyle in that sequence and then VA Tech hits a 3 and it was game on. Biggest concern for me is we did not look like an experienced team those last five minutes.

[Bluedevil114]

Singler just doesn't look good this year. Not sure what has happened, but his shooting has fallen off and last year he was even injured.

Bigger question is not if we are a 1 seed, but if we aren't the favorites to win the ACC anymore? Can't be a 1 seed if UNC wins the ACC

Singler is averaging 17.2 points per game and had 22 points tonight. Yes he did not shoot great from 3 point land. He is also coming off a 28 point game. Singler will be ok. Last year he averaged 17.7 and he had Scheyer helping with the scoring.

UNC would have to beat us to win the ACC and that is if they beat Maryland and FSU.

[ice-9]

The effort was good, the result is disappointing.

- Seth headlines with 0 points, 5 fouls, and a very, very costly turnover at the end of the game. He also had defensive lapses that led to VT baskets

- Ryan took way too many long distance shots, 0-4 from three point and 1-6 overall. While Seth was disappointing defensively, Ryan was disappointing offensively

- Kyle took too many quick shots and went 1-7 from three point range. He was good though otherwise with 12 rebounds

The only two players who had decent games were Nolan (9-18 shooting, 7 rebounds and 2 assists) and Mason (nice hooks in the post, 7 rebounds, 2 blocks).

We should have gone to Mason in the post more instead of taking so many quick 3-pointers.

Even though we were bigger, we were outrebounded by 7. If VT didn't shoot such a horrible FT rate, we would've lost by more. Our getting outrebounded is probably the critical stat -- VT just wanted it more.

The silver lining is that despite shooting 20% from 3-point range we still only lost by 4 points.

But this means winning at UNC is imperative, for both ACC and NCAA tournament implications.

Next play. Let's go Duke!

[DukeBlueHeart4]

Can we all just pretend that K threw Seth Greenburg a bone with this one so that he could finally make it to the tourney?

Sigh, if only I could believe our K would do such a thing.

Shot selection hurt us late. It almost looked like we lost focus.

[KandG]

The team scored 4 points in 9 minutes after taking a 51-45 lead. Kyle Singler took 7 jumpers, six of them 3 pointers, in the last 11 and half minutes of the game. He missed 6 of those 7 jumpers.

I hate beating up on one of my favorite Duke players ever, who'll have his final home game this coming week. But this has been a disappointing year for him offensively, and I just hope the last 11 minutes were rock bottom.

[Son of Mojo]

Probably the most bone-headed game of the year. Poor shot selection, bad TO's at the end of the game where we had so few for the duration, Seth being totally non-existant, and the jams.......or lack thereof. Had Miles and Mason not tried to dunk on a few plays and merely attempted to catch the ball and hit a layup, we get by on just enough points. Save that stuff for when we're up 15+ in a game, not when it's a struggle. Congrats to VTech though--they played hard from start to finish. Let's hope that this was something to learn from and that we might have a KI sighting in uniform soon enough. NEXT.

[_Gary]

I kept telling my daughters during the 2nd half when Duke would have a chance to go up by either 6 or more and we just kept going back and forth with VT. During one sequence I believe Kyle took 4 straight three's and missed all but the first one he took. Then Nolan forced a couple as well and we simply couldn't pull away during that stretch where VT couldn't throw it in the ocean. Bottom line, Kyle and Nolan really took it upon themselves to take just about every shot from about the 10 minute mark on, and they simply didn't look to get anyone else involved. At least that's the way I saw it.

Not at all shocked we lost this one. Discouraged, yes. Shocked, no.

If we don't get Kyrie back (and I mean effective Kyrie) then we are more than vulnerable heading into the NCAA's because we simply don't have enough offensive consistency without him. It's really just that simple. If others want to disagree, feel free. But that's what I see. Now, that doesn't mean we can't win it just like we did last year. Anything can happen. But I think we are ripe for the picking without a healthy Kyrie.

[Andre Buckner Fan]

But the bottom line for me is that, I just think we were too impatient on the offensive end.

I think the atmosphere slowly got to us. It was raucous, maybe it threw off our rhythm? Something did.

[uh_no]

As I think about it, I think we need more than just winning the ACC. Kansas is above us right now, Pitt is likely above us, Ohio State is past us, and BYU may have just moved past us. We may need Texas to beat Kansas. The ACC is weak and having two losses this year will really hurt us.

Sorry, thought you were talking about the 1 seed in the ACC tournament....which is also in serious question

[cbnaylor]

If someone was to say that this would be the last L then I will take it......does this game remind you of last year? Anybody anybody.

[Highlander]

Va Tech is celebrating like they just won some kind of championship. Quite funny.

For them, this is a championship. They just punched their ticket to the NCAA tournament, only the second time they've been there with Greenberg as coach if I heard correctly. I'd imagine a similar display of emotion if we beat them in football to get a bid to some crappy bowl game.

Winnable game, but pretty poor execution by Duke down the stretch. We quit scoring on offense and committed two incredibly costly turnovers after taking care of the ball very well for the entire game. We shut down Delaney, but their supporting cast played their tails off. We were flat outworked on the offensive glass, and settled way to much for 3's early in the shot clock. Despite all that, we still had a great chance to win, but our rock missed his FT's when it counted. I have a hard time fathoming how we couldn't even get a shot off with 20 seconds to go and 4 shooters on the court.

Va. Tech played well, and deserved to win. It's just disappointing that we let this one get away. It's the first time all year I felt like we were the better team that day and still lost.

At least #4 and #5 lost as well, so we'll likely stay on the #1 line another week.

[rotogod00]

As I think about it, I think we need more than just winning the ACC. Kansas is above us right now, Pitt is likely above us, Ohio State is past us, and BYU may have just moved past us. We may need Texas to beat Kansas. The ACC is weak and having two losses this year will really hurt us.

gotta win out (regular season and tourney) to have a shot at this point

[karmacoma]

The postgame celebrations were totally and completely over the top for a regular season game between two non-rivals.

Gotta disagree. That's four season's worth of frustration redeemed for VaTach and their fans tonight. Barring a collapse, that win ensures their seniors are going dancing for the first and only time. Good on them.

[nmduke2001]

It seemed like Kyle and Nolan forgot that there were three other teammates on the court. Each forced some shots with plenty of time on the shot clock in the last 4 minutes.

[Bob Green]

We lost because of seriously bad shot selection down the stretch!

[rsvman]

Oh, well.

Guess I'd rather lose to VT on the road than lose to Carolina next Saturday. If we beat Carolina again, I'll call the regular season a success.

Remember, we lost 5 games last year.

[ajgoodfella7]

Very, very strange game to watch, and not just because of the camera angles. We looked solid for most of the game, and then it sort of sputtered away. Delaney hitting that shot with a minute or two to go, you knew it was trouble...

Very, very strange game. Not the least bit enjoyable to watch. The postgame celebrations were totally and completely over the top for a regular season game between two non-rivals.

True, they were over the top, but I think when they become less so is when we have to start worrying. It seems like everyone in the ACC thinks we are rivals with them even if we don't consider them the same. Maybe this year we won't have to listen to Seth Greenberg whine on the selection show for an hour like he usually does.

[KShip21]

As I think about it, I think we need more than just winning the ACC. Kansas is above us right now, Pitt is likely above us, Ohio State is past us, and BYU may have just moved past us. We may need Texas to beat Kansas. The ACC is weak and having two losses this year will really hurt us.

Thank you, this is exactly what i meant by help. All 4 of these teams win out, I think we're left at a 2.

[taiw93]

Have to say, this is the most disappointing loss of the season thus far, since I think we outplayed the Hokies for the first 35 minutes of this game. I was very upset with Kyle's shot selection - since I felt he forced way too many threes or long-range twos early in the shot clock. I can't blame him for missing shots, but I wish we wouldn't take so many quick, contested ones. Never thought I'd say it, but we really needed to get Mason the ball more - he and Nolan were our two best offensive players tonight, and he just did not get the ball. I also would have liked to see Dre get more touches.

I understand that sometimes players have off nights - and so I cannot fault Seth, Ryan or Kyle for missing shots. However, I would have liked to see better game-management and shot selection from our entire team in the waning minutes. We just looked plain disorganized and confused in our last few possessions.

However, there were a few positives to take from this game:
1. Miles' defense is much improved
2. Mason is turning into a BIG asset. He was out-of-his-mind clutch tonight, and almost single-handedly saved us from defeat with his big steal and big rebound.
3. Nolan and Kyle played excellent defense. Nolan totally shut down Delaney.
4. Tyler Thornton is not extremely physically gifted, but he is one hell of a basketball player.
5. Andre's shot is coming around (though he did force one towards the end that positively enraged me).

We need a lot of work on game management. That remains the biggest thing I miss about Kyrie - kid has a gift for managing basketball games. All in all though, we're still a good team, and we still are among the best in the country. However, I do not think we will get a #1 seed anymore.

[uh_no]

If someone was to say that this would be the last L then I will take it......does this game remind you of last year? Anybody anybody.

we were never out of control down the stretch last year, even in the loss to maryland..... simply missing shots is different from taking terrible shots....

[ns7]

Time to not overreact too much. It was an average performance against a team with their backs to the wall. Remember, VaTech hit at least 4 anomalous 3's from Jeff Allen and Erick Green--you should expect at most 1 of those to go in. That in itself is a 9 point swing.

A few observations:
1) Kelly has not shot well lately; need him to hit open shots for him to be a contributor on the floor.
2) VaTech dominated the offensive boards. They are not a strong O-rebounding team, this was concerning.
3) Singler did a great job drawing fouls and getting to the line. His shot will come back, I'd rather have him struggle now vs. in the tournaments.

Hopefully the rebounding is a one game issue. If so, the team is in great shape.

[dukestheheat]

Duke as a team didn't seem too ready to play tonight, strangely. We came out flat, emotionally, and just couldn't find the defense when we really needed it. I don't see it often, but we didn't bring our effort. I know we rebound very well after a loss and hopefully we can right the ship before we face the holes next weekend, but Duke is going to need to bring effort for two halves and on both ends of the court.

dth.

[Andre Buckner Fan]

Thank you, this is exactly what i meant by help. All 4 of these teams win out, I think we're left at a 2.

If they actually make BYU a 1 seed, I think a 16 may have a decent shot at beating a 1.

[g-money]

Tough way to lose a game. I thought we did a great job of matching Virginia Tech's physicality in the first half, but then we became way too comfortable shooting threes when we had a chance to put them away in the second half.

Also, it was disappointing to see uncharacteristic offensive/ballhandling miscues by our star seniors as the pressure ratcheted up near the end.

The plus side: We'll have a great chance to redeem ourselves - and prove that we have more mental and physical toughness under pressure than we exhibited tonight - next Saturday in Chapel Hill. (NOT looking past Clemson; just saying that the level of pressure will be highest on the road.)

[rotogod00]

If they actually make BYU a 1 seed, I think a 16 may have a decent shot at beating a 1.

BYU would still be a 20-pt favorite

[gam7]

If someone was to say that this would be the last L then I will take it......does this game remind you of last year? Anybody anybody.

The timing is similar, but the games themselves were not very much like each other. In last year's Maryland game, they were throwing up ridiculous shots that really had no business going in. It was one of those games where you had to say to yourself, "geez, if those types of shots are going to go in, then there's really not too much you can do."

This game was absolutely ours for the taking.

[jhole]

I agree w/ most everything so far but would add that I think it was a mistake to put Curry back in at the end of the game. He had been sitting for a good while, was out of the flow, and had proven he was not having a good night.

Also, we need to start driving the ball inside (ie. Kyle vs. Temple) early and hitting higher percentage shots/drawing fouls rather than fall behind and have to come back - that's getting old.

[6th Man]

Ryan Kelly had a key defensive rebound right in his hands and let a Va. Tech guy come take it. More than missed shots that was aggrevating to see. You gotta want it a little more than that.

[Andre Buckner Fan]

BYU would still be a 20-pt favorite

I'm not saying it's at all likely. But I'm saying they'd be one of the weakest one seeds in recent memory, and therefore it's more likely. If they're a one seed, I'd love to be a two seed in their bracket, let's say...

[Utley]

I think its way too early to panic about the #1 seed. There's a lot of basketball to be played between now and the seedings - I expect others to lose as well.

I don't think a 2 seed is the end of the world if it plays out that way. You just need to get hot at the right time. We lost a game near the end of the last year and that worked out well.

[rotogod00]

I'm not saying it's at all likely. But I'm saying they'd be one of the weakest one seeds in recent memory, and therefore it's more likely. If they're a one seed, I'd love to be a two seed in their bracket, let's say...

more likely, yes. but "decent", not so sure. but yes on the #2

[Bob Green]

Virginia Tech did not win, Duke lost. We blew this game the last four minutes with poor shot selection.

[camion]

I am disappointed with the loss. We had multiple chances to win it and let it slip away. Va Tech had much more riding on this game than we did and it showed. The home team got a boost from the crowd and that was enough to be the difference tonight.

Now we need to beat Clemson and UNC and do well in the ACC tourney. Tough, but doable.

[Highlander]

One other thing - I wish Miles Plumlee would stop trying to be cute with the lobs and putbacks. Missing two "gimmies" turned out to be the difference in the game tonight.

[Delaware]

oh, and rebounding

Biggest play I think was a weak Def Rebound by Kelly when we were up 5 (I think) with about 5-6 minutes left...

We gave up three offesnsive rebounds in 4 possession from when we were up 53-47....one led to a Jeff Allen 3 (unreal he hit two tonight) and one other was a put back dunk by Davila.

[OZ]

Kelly + Curry + Dawkins + Tyler + Miles = three points in second half (if my memory is correct).

We really need someone to step up on a CONSISTENT basis.

Andre had a couple of good games and we got all excited - then Kelly - then Seth - Tyler has had some good moments as has Miles. But so far, other than Mason, no one has stepped up consistently to help Kyle and Nolan. No one else has had anything close to a season where you feel confident in their game.

[wgl1228]

Tyler Thornton should shoot more. I am not kidding either! He has a good shot.

[jv001]

Bad shot selection, Terrible rebounding, Kyle forcing shots when he had open guys on the wing, missed freethrows in clutch situations. A game that we surely should have won when VT shoots fts like they did. And the end of game play could not have been as Coach K drew it up. Nolan really stepped up in the first half, but he needed some help. It sure looked like Kyle was gassed at the end of the game. Go Duke!

[UrinalCake]

VT's zone in the second half was really effective against us. We just didn't know how to attack it. Typically we'll use Kelly to knock down shots around the free throw line, but he had already missed so many threes that I think he was reluctant to shoot any more. Teams are going to continue to double off of him and leave him open until he proves he can hit some shots.

As a positive, we totally shut down Delaney, at least until his big three at the end.

[Billy Dat]

Duke as a team didn't seem too ready to play tonight, strangely. We came out flat, emotionally, and just couldn't find the defense when we really needed it. I don't see it often, but we didn't bring our effort. I know we rebound very well after a loss and hopefully we can right the ship before we face the holes next weekend, but Duke is going to need to bring effort for two halves and on both ends of the court.

dth.

I didn't see it this way. I thought we played the first 33 minutes like maestros. They were playing great, but could not shake us. We eventually got the lead, had a few chances to shake them, and then Kyle hit the big 3 to put us up 6 with ~6:45 left. That's when we fell apart. Had we kept that lead at 6 for another minute, we hand the ball to Nolan and go 1-4 and put that game on ice. Instead, Kyle kept thinking he was going to hit that next 3, we start commiting turnovers, and things changed quickly.

This one hurts, but I am happy for V Tech. Despite their typical thuggery (not tonight) they have been a tortured NCAA deprived team and this should put them in. Seeing Greenberg and his daughters should show everyone how much this game meant to them...good for him.

[moonpie23]

duke looked out of sync....almost like........they were waiting on something.....

[Saratoga2]

In general this was not one of our best games. We got outrebounded, we had low assists, etc. There were a fair number of open looks given up. Offensively, we fell in love with the 3, with such players as Kelly and Singler taking a bunch and only hitting one between them. Seth had a poor game on both sides of the ball, and Miles couldn't make close in shots at all, which is his typical problem.

What really stood out is that we had the advantage and let it slip away with very poor end of game management. Singler traveled, Smith charged, three point shots, we seemed rattled. It appeared that Singler and Smith wanted to take every shot, even if they had to force them.

Only in the last desperate minute did we go inside. We had Mason and Ryan inside plus Singler and we didn't really try to take advantage of those size mismatches. Tyler and Andre looked to be possible slashers and shooters, but there was only one shot between them in the second half.

We didn't look like a #1 team or even a top team the way we gave this game away.

Our normal path to success is to have Nolan and Kyle provide 40+ points, while our bigs provide 15+ and our other guards contribute 15+. Tonight Nolan and Kyle had 40, Mason had 9 but Kelly only 2 and Miles 0, while Andre had 6, Tyler 3 and Seth 0.

Not good at all.

[Spy]

After Allen hit his second three, I knew it was their night and it just wasn't happening.

I honestly don't mind losing this game, but I do mind the fact that when they ratcheted up their defense,(their defense was amazing) we (mostly Kyle) folded and just resorted to threes. We can't just keep banging our heads against the wall when they're not falling. Mason was playing well in the post, so why not get him the ball? I just don't get it.

The game is tied if Miles just lays in those failed dunks.

Nightmare game for Seth... Literally nothing was going his way tonight.

If this game was at a neutral site, I'm fairly confident we win it. I'm still not sure how we lost this. If you told me before the game that Delaney would only have 11pts, they would shoot 39%, and shoot 42% free throws, I would have thought we would have won by 20+. Luckily Texas lost too, so our #1 seed hopes weren't hurt too badly. Next Game

[DMV2434]

I think we should have gotten Andre some more shots from 3 especially when they were in the zone. I thought he looked really confident with his stroke tonight.

[Chris Randolph]

I disagree with the notion we were not ready to play. We were, it was a huge game and we knew that, we just blew it

Mason Plumlee, kudos to you my friend. You wanted this bad and played like it for the full 40 minutes. For a guy who doesn't get many offensive touches, I thought his tenacity and will were terrific tonight. If Mason keeps it up and our all americans play like all americans, we will very very good in the tourney

[BleedsP287]

It's more than bad shot selection. We aren't moving well on offense to create the open looks. It's been going on all year off and on, this bit where we throw it around a few times on the outside and jack it up. We need more of an inside out game, and we need to move better without the ball. That's where the open looks we aren't getting come from. Then again, tonight we missed a good number of open shots too.

[Bob Green]

Kelly + Curry + Dawkins + Tyler + Miles = three points in second half (if my memory is correct).

Well it is hard for Dawkins to score when the ball isn't sent his way even though he is wide open. We forced shots when we didn't have to down the stretch.

[ns7]

I'm not saying it's at all likely. But I'm saying they'd be one of the weakest one seeds in recent memory, and therefore it's more likely. If they're a one seed, I'd love to be a two seed in their bracket, let's say...

Not sure I agree. Memphis and Villanova were just as weak in 2006. Washington in 2005 and Stanford in 2004 were jokes. Texas got a 1 in 2003 with 7(!) losses.

[Billy Dat]

Interesting K move to go with Seth in the last 2 minutes. I get it, he's a better shooter and defender than (insert whomever lost the minutes...Tyler or Andre...I am not sure), but it wasn't his night. I guess if he'd made some plays, K succeeds in boosting his low morale and getting him past his nightmare outing. As it is, he turns it over on our final chance to tie the game. Shake it off, Seth.

[jv001]

Unless Kyle get's his perimeter shot back we are going to struggle. We had the big two, but now we have the big 1. I never say anything about tired legs or too many mins, but something is wrong with Kyle. I know he had 28 pts against Temple but most of those were inside. The opposition is going to give him the open 3 until he shows them he can hit it. Let's hope he get's it back in the next two games. Go Duke!

[dukepsy1963]

What a loser tonight. Lots of dumb moves and "dumb" shots. Nolan, what were you thinking toward the end? Jeez....
We could not run with them tonight, and should not have tried. ...they played a great game and we did not.

Kyle has gone away this year.

I have some serious doubts about the rest of the year. We have to win games like this one if we are to have any chance at anything.

And their crowd outdid the crazies tonight. Wow!!

Sorry to be so down...but really.....I mean really.

I seriously hope they drop us to 10. That's about where we belong.

[GrantIsMyHero]

Too many jump shots. Need to learn how to box out (rebounding involves both effort AND skills). And we freaked out at the end (Nolan was pushing too hard and ended up with that charge. Kyle took that long three way too early in the possession with 30 secs left). Frustrating, but we are constantly learning. Plus, all these 9:00 games for TV are probably wearing the team down some...they are students too after all.

[DukeDevilDeb]

I have been worried about this game all week. Knowing that Game Day was there and that the Hokies have had some success against us in the past really made me nervous. When we went in at half time down only 2, I was thrilled! Came back out (usually our biggest momentum changing time) and, at the first media time out, we were only down 1. Not a huge step, but we did with that 4 minute segment!

Many of the players seemed to use bad judgment, but the coaches did as well. Nolan played a steady game until he started to try to take over at the end. I absolutely LOVE Kyle Singler, but after his third missed three, Coach K or Wojo should have taken him out of the game for a moment and told him that what had worked was driving, taking high percentage shots. Ryan had one play where he was behind the three-point line, used a ball fake, then drove to the bucket and scored! It was great, and he never tried it again. Andre had his best game, but I thought he didn't play enough in the second half. Thornton too... after all he was one of the only players to actually hit a three in the first half.

Low points:

1. Miles missing 2 slams. One, it happens. But again, where was the coaching staff in saying, Miles, take it up strong with two hands, or try a layup or something.

2. Mason randomly swatting at the balls and hitting several of them back to VT players for offensive rebounds and scores.

3. No seeming adjustment at half time that really made a difference.

4. My biggest gripe with the coaches, however, was putting Seth Currey back in the game for the last few seconds. The kid, who is a gem, obviously had a really bad night... 0 points, 4 fouls... Yes, they wanted three-point shooters out there, but Tyler had more success at that than Seth tonight.


This is so frustrating for fans and, I'm sure, for the team. We had that game won... and we lost it.:(

[jv001]

Well it is hard for Dawkins to score when the ball isn't sent his way even though he is wide open. We forced shots when we didn't have to down the stretch.

You are so right my friend. Toward the end of the game after Kyle had missed about 5 or 6 shots in a row, he drove the middle and had Dre wide open on the wing. He forced it and got stripped or missed. I know I was fuming after that play. Go Duke!

[mkline09]

Virginia Tech did not win, Duke lost. We blew this game the last four minutes with poor shot selection.

I agree with this for the most part with one exception. I think Va. Tech did win this game. Duke choked this one away but has come close before, the other teams just weren't good enough to take advantage. The Hokies are certainly good enough, especially in their own house to take advantage of Duke's mistakes. Poor shot selection from key player, poor, rebounding, and weak defensive effort at times one guy who got wide open looks. Just one of those games next play, but this one hurts.

[Chris Randolph]

What a loser tonight. Lots of dumb moves and "dumb" shots. Nolan, what were you thinking toward the end? Jeez....
We could not run with them tonight, and should not have tried. ...they played a great game and we did not.

Kyle has gone away this year.

I have some serious doubts about the rest of the year. We have to win games like this one if we are to have any chance at anything.

And their crowd outdid the crazies tonight. Wow!!

Sorry to be so down...but really.....I mean really.

I seriously hope they drop us to 10. That's about where we belong.

Talk about super over reaction. Kyle has been our best defender and is averaging as many points this year as last. He had 22 tonight, 28 Wednesday. Sure he didn't step up in the end, but nobody (minus Mason) did. Their crowd was silent for over half of the 2nd half, which the Crazies never are. You might want to sit the next few plays out to quote Ron Burgundy

[Channing]

couple thoughts:

(a) I love Kyle and his D has been stellar ... BUT, his shooting percentage is really starting to hurt us. I mean, aside from Temple he cant be shooing much more than 30% for the last 4 or 5 games ... thats really bad.

(b) Kelly is killing us on offense. Either he can make 3s or he cant. He is bricking wide open look after wide open look, killing offensive possessions.

(c) Glad to see Dawkins knock two down. I don't know why we didn't attach the zone through the free throw line and kicks to a shooter like Dawkins on the other side.

(d) Offense in general was totally stagnant today. Probably had something to do with the abysmal shooting, but there was little movement.

(e) The last possession looked like nothing more than mass chaos. From Nolan over dribbling before the time out to Seth looking for Mason(?????) at the three point line with time running down before throwing it away.

[Devilsfan]

There was too much pressure on Seth tonight. Kyle needs to remember where the shots came from on the court when he scored 28 and if we can just win our next 11 games everything will be fine.

[wgl1228]

A few bad decisions in the final minutes. That's all it comes down to. The crowd was wild and VT responded. A third member of this team must step up though.

[rotogod00]

Talk about super over reaction. Kyle has been our best defender and is averaging as many points this year as last. He had 22 tonight, 28 Wednesday. Sure he didn't step up in the end, but nobody (minus Mason) did. Their crowd was silent for over half of the 2nd half, which the Crazies never are. You might want to sit the next few plays out to quote Ron Burgundy

yeah, but pts per shot down a bit to 1.23 from 1.30, 1.29, and 1.29

[verga]

Kyle has been off for most of the new year, i have no idea what it is. His shot selection is poor and he fumbles so many balls that you normally would think he would catch. Both he and Nolan after we got the 6 point lead really never had any type of control on their game. Speaking of the 6 point lead, why not continue to pressure Va. Tech. they were dead tired and their subs were few. Maybe we can learn from this, i know coach K will try and figure out what the problem is. I just don't understand why, when you have the best team you pull the ball out and then jack up a 3, it's beyond me, i guess that's why i'm not a coach.

[jv001]

After beating Temple, Coach said that it was a good win against the kind of opponent we will face in the 2nd round of the tournament. Well if we face a team like VT in the
2nd round will we have the same result as tonight? I'm off to bed, as I've already said more negative things than I have all year. Go Duke!

[dukestheheat]

duke looked out of sync....almost like........they were waiting on something.....

So to me, at least, the point for growth from this one is to go back to work and develop a paint game and let the offense flow off of THAT; let the offensive game begin there and flow outward. We seemed fully resigned again to jack it up and if they're going in we look like we can beat an NBA team but when they're not..........

Let's work to make a couple extra passes and set up a better shot!

Next play and I am confident, based on history, that Duke will rebound from this loss and be more than ready to play Clemson and the holes to round it out.

dth.

[Delaware]

We forced shots when we didn't have to down the stretch.

Bob, this is about the third time you said this and you are of course correct!

I was looking at this game as a test of our mental toughness and togetherness as a team and I think we failed. We had very few assists. We did not trust each other down the stretch. We were not patient when they went zone. We gave up offensive rebounds by not focusing. We had poor shot selection and forced shots down the stretch.

I was looking for "growth" from the FSU game which I looked at as a very similar type game. Hostile environment, slow, low scoring game, etc.... we did not grow. The box score will look very similar I think. Low assists, givign up offensive rebounds, poor three point shooting, etc.

[Vincetaylor]

No one should be surprised we lost this game. It was a must win for them and we haven't proven we can beat good teams on the road. Duke should be an underdog at UNC too, even though Vegas will probably incorrectly favor us.

[Devilsfan]

We just showed our empathy for Seth Greenburg and decided to let him in the big dance for a game or two. Just kidding.

[Gthoma2a]

If someone was to say that this would be the last L then I will take it......does this game remind you of last year? Anybody anybody.

I have to honestly say no. This was nothing like the Maryland game. The Maryland game was a brilliant effort by a great player overtaking a superb effort by a team that did play with discipline on top of effort. Tonight the discipline was off. We played hard, and we are a good team, but we didn't play with poise at the end...

[Ultrarunner]

We lost because of seriously bad shot selection down the stretch!

...and an inability to hit the open player, be it Mason or Dawkins, with a timely pass.

[NashvilleDevil]

What a loser tonight. Lots of dumb moves and "dumb" shots. Nolan, what were you thinking toward the end? Jeez....
We could not run with them tonight, and should not have tried. ...they played a great game and we did not.

Kyle has gone away this year.

I have some serious doubts about the rest of the year. We have to win games like this one if we are to have any chance at anything.

And their crowd outdid the crazies tonight. Wow!!

Sorry to be so down...but really.....I mean really.

I seriously hope they drop us to 10. That's about where we belong.

Wow. Just, wow.

[Devilsfan]

Kyrie get in shape real soon.

[ajgoodfella7]

No one should be surprised we lost this game. It was a must win for them and we haven't proven we can beat good teams on the road. Duke should be an underdog at UNC too, even though Vegas will probably incorrectly favor us.

I'm not really surprised, but the fact remains that Duke was in perfect position to close this game out and we just let it slip through our hands because of self-inflicted mistakes IMO. But I am still much more surprised that we lost than I would have been if we had won.

[Chris Randolph]

yeah, but pts per shot down a bit to 1.23 from 1.30, 1.29, and 1.29

Good stat. I think it is safe to say this is because we don't have a consistent 3rd scorer which forces Kyle to take some difficult shots at times. Last season he could get better looks because of the scoring capability of Scheyer and Smith. If Irving was healthy, this would not be an issue

Nobody complains about Jimmer Fredette going 8 of 23 or 6 of 17 and scores 20+

[weezie]

I am unable to really put a finger on this one. Just all at sixes and sevens.
We had them on the ropes....then gave them a hand back into the ring.

Very frustrating. Poor Seth. I know K will help him tough this one out but gee whiz :(

[loldevilz]

I have no problem with players not hitting shots like Kyle over the last while and the occasional bone-headed play, but I do have a problem with players NOT COMPETING. This is what happened tonight. We lost this game not because we were cold from 3, but because the bigs especially Kelly and for most of the game Mason were simply not trying hard enough.

For instance, Kelly had a rebound come directly to him. Instead of approaching and securing the rebound, he simply let the Hokie grab it away from him. It was the worst thing I've seen in quite some time. It was capped off by a tip jam right over Mason because he failed to block out and get position.

I think at the end Mason showed some desire, but it was too late.

[rotogod00]

Just looked at Singler's season numbers and the one thing that sticks out at me is he's going to foul line much less than the past 2 years. His FTA/FGA:

'08-'09: .37
'09-'10: .38
'10-'11: .28

Just not getting the freebies as often as in the past.

[pkw]

This was a disappointing game in a lot of ways, but if we would have hit a few of the open threes down the stretch that we typically make or hit a few free throws then we walk out of VT with a closely fought win.

I'm not going to hang my head today though because the last two games you can see the fire in Kyle again. This is a team with a lot of experience and we are lucky to have a few more games with these seniors. Imagine this team if Kyle or Nolan had decided to leave after last season.

Virginia Tech played a great game today but we've seen similar losses in the past that we've moved past (see Maryland last year). Let them enjoy their big win of the year and lets move on and support this team that has given us so much over the years.

[ajgoodfella7]

Good stat. I think it is safe to say this is because we don't have a consistent 3rd scorer which forces Kyle to take some difficult shots at times. Last season he could get better looks because of the scoring capability of Scheyer and Smith. If Irving was healthy, this would not be an issue

Nobody complains about Jimmer Fredette going 8 of 23 or 6 of 17 and scores 20+

I think tonight though he was taking shots that he didn't have to take. He was taking long, semi-contested shots early in the clock when I think better shots could have been available with a little work. Our half-court offense was virtually non-existent for the last 6 or 7 minutes. I'm am kind of in shock how off they were down the stretch tonight.

[Greg_Newton]

After beating Temple, Coach said that it was a good win against the kind of opponent we will face in the 2nd round of the tournament. Well if we face a team like VT in the
2nd round will we have the same result as tonight? I'm off to bed, as I've already said more negative things than I have all year. Go Duke!

Really? I don't think was a bad loss at all. VT would have beaten most teams tonight.

Honestly, that was just a great, vintage ACC game. I hate it when Duke loses, but that was a great effort by VT in a great environment tonight.

[-bdbd]

Ryan Kelly had a key defensive rebound right in his hands and let a Va. Tech guy come take it. More than missed shots that was aggrevating to see. You gotta want it a little more than that.

'was thinking the same thing. He'll certainly see that replay several times in the next few days from the coaches. I DO wish he were more assertive sometimes. Bad night for Ryan.


One other thing - I wish Miles Plumlee would stop trying to be cute with the lobs and putbacks. Missing two "gimmies" turned out to be the difference in the game tonight.

Miles had more than one not-so-smart play, missing a rebound/dunk in traffic when a tip-in wouls have been sufficient (This wasn't the first game where that happened either - trying to make the dramatic play. UGH!) And those lob passes. Eck! Just not his ideal style of play.


I'm not saying it's at all likely. But I'm saying they'd be one of the weakest one seeds in recent memory, and therefore it's more likely. If they're a one seed, I'd love to be a two seed in their bracket, let's say...

Not worried about the seeds. Right now we'll still be in the top-4 (and likely a #1 seed), given that two other top-5 teams lost today. So I highly doubt that we drop beyond #3 or #4 ranking. Can't really afford to drop another and expect a #1 seed though.


Virginia Tech did not win, Duke lost. We blew this game the last four minutes with poor shot selection.

Being Duke fans, we are always going to be Duke-centric in our observations. Give VPI some props -- in the last ten minutes they seemed to want it more. They were very assertive on the boards and their D certainly disrupted our offense. Their crowd, I believe, played a role in this one too. It sounded LOUD there, which appeared to affect our play.


I am disappointed with the loss. We had multiple chances to win it and let it slip away. Va Tech had much more riding on this game than we did and it showed. The home team got a boost from the crowd and that was enough to be the difference tonight.
Now we need to beat Clemson and UNC and do well in the ACC tourney. Tough, but doable.

Wouldn't want to be Clemson on Wed. night...
Heck, this COULD work out for the best if it gets us fired up heading into the Kerlina game too. Maybe get a roll going now (now that we got that out of our system)!


Kelly + Curry + Dawkins + Tyler + Miles = three points in second half (if my memory is correct). ...We really need someone to step up on a CONSISTENT basis. ...Andre had a couple of good games and we got all excited - then Kelly - then Seth - Tyler has had some good moments as has Miles. But so far, other than Mason, no one has stepped up consistently to help Kyle and Nolan. No one else has had anything close to a season where you feel confident in their game.

True dat. Can't wait for Kyrie to reappear as a consistent third go-to guy. Though I think this was an aberration for Seth at his dad's alma mater... 'was just too pumped and had a few bad breaks early.


I didn't see it this way. I thought we played the first 33 minutes like maestros. They were playing great, but could not shake us. We eventually got the lead, had a few chances to shake them, and then Kyle hit the big 3 to put us up 6 with ~6:45 left. That's when we fell apart. Had we kept that lead at 6 for another minute, we hand the ball to Nolan and go 1-4 and put that game on ice. Instead, Kyle kept thinking he was going to hit that next 3, we start commiting turnovers, and things changed quickly.

This one hurts, but I am happy for V Tech. Despite their typical thuggery (not tonight) they have been a tortured NCAA deprived team and this should put them in. Seeing Greenberg and his daughters should show everyone how much this game meant to them...good for him.

Yes, in spades. We didn't close it out when we had the chance, and once VPI got on a roll, well the crowd really helped the momentum. This helps VPI (and the ACC) much more than it hurts Duke. Not too worried about this one. We didn't play terrible. And we'll bounce back strong versus Clemson. Count on it. Next play!!
:(

[Chris Randolph]

I think tonight though he was taking shots that he didn't have to take. He was taking long, semi-contested shots early in the clock when I think better shots could have been available with a little work. Our half-court offense was virtually non-existent for the last 6 or 7 minutes. I'm am kind of in shock how off they were down the stretch tonight.

I touched on it in my first post about the game, but we kept running the same play that wasn't working. Mason sets a screen for nolan, nolan drives the middle, the defender collapses leaving kyle space to shoot a 3. If Kyle has a fairly open look, Coack K and anyone honestly would want him to take it, which he was doing but not making. Therefore I was questioning the actual design of the play (maybe put Dawkins where Singler was) or why we didn't do much of anything else

[Andre Buckner Fan]

I'm going to be a Pollyanna and look for some silver linings on a game we choked away.

a) K can use this to our advantage.
b) More experience in that kind of atmosphere can't hurt us in tourney time.
c) The Freshmen and Sophmores need more losses to show them to stop taking plays off. (The mental mistakes by our seniors are far more distressing.)
d) All's well that ends well. If we beat UNC, this loss doesn't hurt us too much. A one seed isn't everything. And we still might be in line for one (but I'd rather have a two seed closer to home than the last one seed that ships out west or somewhere).
e) Kyle's slump is very similar to Scheyer's last year. The board wanted him to sit or at the very least stop taking shots... but Jon came around in the ACC Tourney. Kyle could too.

[Dr. Tina]

Bob, this is about the third time you said this and you are of course correct!

I was looking at this game as a test of our mental toughness and togetherness as a team and I think we failed. We had very few assists. We did not trust each other down the stretch. We were not patient when they went zone. We gave up offensive rebounds by not focusing. We had poor shot selection and forced shots down the stretch.



I completely agree! I thought we were playing a lot of one-on-one basketball instead of playing as a FIST. We weren't sharing the ball well and our ball movement was pretty stagnant. The fact we only had about 6 assists tells you that.

Nolan and Kyle either wanted to take the shots themselves or give the ball to each other, and neither of them made good decisions for the last 8 minutes or so...traveling, an offensive foul, jacking up 3's (that were NOT falling!) with plenty of time on the shot clock repeatedly, etc. etc. They weren't getting other guys involved at all, and I didn't feel they showed very good poise or leadership given all the experience they have in these situations.

Kyle frustrated me tonight because he seemed to totally forget what made him effective in his last game. Before the Temple game, he was routinely putting up jumpshots (many from 3) that were not falling. He changed his tactics completely in the Temple game and was way more effective. So, why he decided to go back to his pre-Temple game ways is beyond me. I know K always gives Kyle and Nolan the green light from 3, but when they're not falling....DO SOMETHING ELSE! Also, I think at least 10 of his points were from the line tonight, and they were a result of him driving to the basket.

Seth was a trainwreck, and I think it was a horrible decision to have him in at the end of the game. He had been on the bench for so long. Dre or Tyler would have been a better substitution.

Speaking of Dre and Tyler, I was pleased with them. Dre was 2-4 and Tyler was 1-1 from 3. They probably should have been the only ones taking 3's with the way Nolan and Kyle were missing. Dre still needs to move around more, and I wish Tyler had been a bit more aggressive instead of passing off to Nolan most of the time.

Mason played really hard and should have gotten the ball A LOT more! He made 2 great hook shots, and I think he could have gotten more going if they'd find a way to get him the ball. I'm pleased with his performance.

However, our Big Guys - Mas, Miles, and Ryan - were not going up strong for rebounds and that really hurt us on the offensive end. Sometimes they were out of position because it was a long rebound (a result of a missed 3!), but other times, they were just batting it around like a volleyball or getting it ripped from them.

Ryan needs to start making those 3's or just give up the ball.

Basically, I think we beat ourselves in this game. I was resigned that we'd lose the FSU game because we'd been behind the whole time. I didn't witness the St. John's game, but I largely look at it as akin to the GTown game from last year. This game reminds me of how I felt with the MD loss last year. I was really mad because I knew we were right there and had many opportunities to win that game. That's how I feel right now! Only...this time...we had THE LEAD...and blew it.

Very disappointing game tonight....

[sagegrouse]

I've read only half the posts above, so pardon me if everything below has already been said.

The first thirty minutes were like so many Duke games this year -- trailing early but coming on strong. Good tough game that went awry in the last several minutes. Not enough poise on offense -- how many times did we have the chance to put these guys away? Our defense was excellent, but we weren't tough enough on the boards the last few minutes. While they got some O rebounds off of bricked shots, I thought the VT guys were tougher inside than we were at the end.

Mason seemed to be unstoppable against VT. Wasn't he part of the game plan? Why did he get only five shots? Hey, Miles, to quote the Wizard of Westwood, "Be quick but don't hurry." Those two misses on a jam and a layup meant four points.

Answers to questions from the pre-game thread (your guesses may be a lot better than mine):

1.Who guards Nolan? Erick Green.

2. Who guards Kyle? Seemed like Bell and Allen drew the heaviest duty.

3. Assuming Delaney gets guarded by a committee, who guards Jeff Allen? Well, Nolan handled Delaney perfectly well as a committee of one and still had a strong offensive game. Allen was guarded by committee, esp. Ryan on the wing and Mason (?) inside.

4. Run at Delaney to get him in foul trouble and tire him out? Nah, you can't run at him because he doesn't play much defense.

5. Mason's continued mastery of the boards? Not so much, but a good offensive game for Mason.

6. Game Day a plus or a minus for Tech? Your guess is as good as mine.

Next play!

sagegrouse

[Dr. Tina]

Just looked at Singler's season numbers and the one thing that sticks out at me is he's going to foul line much less than the past 2 years. His FTA/FGA:

'08-'09: .37
'09-'10: .38
'10-'11: .28

Just not getting the freebies as often as in the past.

Kyle has also been settling for 3's and fadeaway jump shots A LOT more this year than taking it inside like he has in the past.

[Billy Dat]

I know it sounds weird, but I didn't see this as a "live by the 3 die by the 3 game". I have thought that many times in the past, but that was usually because our offense couldn't create anything but a contested 3. Tonight, down the stretch, I actually thought we had great spacing and potential to get either better 3s, or other high percentage shots, but Kyle must have been feeling it.

My only worry about a game like this for Kyle is that he clearly wanted to be the man down the stretch and it came out all wrong. He was playing great up until then. For those who are criticizing him for not getting to the line, he went 9-10 from the line tonight, he just chose to jack 3s down the stretch. I think hitting the 3 to put us up 6 with 11 to go got him in the mindset that he was going to carry us to the end. Whatever...he couldn't buy one. Here's how we came down the stretch on offense from when Kyle hit that 3:

-Kyle miss 3
-Kyle miss 3
-Nolan miss jumper
-Kyle miss 3
-Kyle makes 2 FTs
-Kyle turnover (walk)
-Nolan runner
-Nolan charge
-Nolan miss inside
-Nolan miss 3
-Miles miss dunk
-Kyle miss jumper
-Nolan miss jumper
-Kyle turnover
-Kyle makes lay-up
-Andre miss 3
-Kyle miss lay-up and tip in
-Mason steal and dunk
-Kyle miss 3
-Nolan miss front end of 1-1
-Mason goes 1 for 2 on FTs
-Curry turnover
-BALLGAME

Rough last 10 minutes. We went down with Kyle and Nolan, you have to like our odds to win in that scenario...usually.

[elvis14]

Tough game tonight and a big loss for Duke. We will lose our #1 ranking, our #1 seed and we've given UNC@CH a chance to win the ACC regular season title. Bummer x 3.

I hate to say it but if Kyle can't hit a jump shot of any kind consistently, we are not an elite team. Lots of people on this thread have pointed to poor shot selection as the culprit. Outside of the last 30 minutes the problem wasn't poor selection it was that Kyle missed a bunch of wide open 3 point shots. Everyone is pointing to the 28 he had last game where he was being guarded by a 6'3" player and scored a bunch of layups. Against bigger teams we need him to hit jump shots either midrange (like all the ones he missed in the first half) or 3's (like all the ones he missed in the second half). Until Kyle can hit a jumper, we aren't a contender and I hate that.

I love Ryan Kelly but he needs to either start hitting some of those open 3's or start taking the ball to the hole. I would have liked to see us work get Andre some more shots tonight when VT started playing so much zone. Our offense just didn't look good tonight.

I'd discuss the last 30 seconds but it's kinda obvious that it was all bad.

Someone want to explain to me how Nolan only get's on FT attempt in a VERY physical game?

[rotogod00]

I know it sounds weird, but I didn't see this as a "live by the 3 die by the 3 game". I have thought that many times in the past, but that was usually because our offense couldn't create anything but a contested 3. Tonight, down the stretch, I actually thought we had great spacing and potential to get either better 3s, or other high percentage shots, but Kyle must have been feeling it.

My only worry about a game like this for Kyle is that he clearly wanted to be the man down the stretch and it came out all wrong. He was playing great up until then. For those who are criticizing him for not getting to the line, he went 9-10 from the line tonight, he just chose to jack 3s down the stretch. I think hitting the 3 to put us up 6 with 11 to go got him in the mindset that he was going to carry us to the end. Whatever...he couldn't buy one. Here's how we came down the stretch on offense from when Kyle hit that 3:

-Kyle miss 3
-Kyle miss 3
-Nolan miss jumper
-Kyle miss 3
-Kyle makes 2 FTs
-Kyle turnover (walk)
-Nolan runner
-Nolan charge
-Nolan miss inside
-Nolan miss 3
-Miles miss dunk
-Kyle miss jumper
-Nolan miss jumper
-Kyle turnover
-Kyle makes lay-up
-Andre miss 3
-Kyle miss lay-up and tip in
-Mason steal and dunk
-Kyle miss 3
-Nolan miss front end of 1-1
-Mason goes 1 for 2 on FTs
-Curry turnover
-BALLGAME

Rough last 10 minutes. We went down with Kyle and Nolan, you have to like our odds to win in that scenario...usually.

not a criticism, just the facts. and my bad, he's up to 29% after tonite's 10/19 ratio

[lotusland]

Hard fought game that was well played by both teams until the wheels kinda came off for Duke at the end. Conference road game in a very hostile environment so a close loss isn't the end of the world. Most of Kyle's 3's were open looks that we need him to take and make but tonight they just weren't falling. The last one was a bad shot taken too quickly but if it had fallen, of course, there would be no complaints. On the positive side, Mason is becoming very solid and his confidence is showing. If Kyle gets his 3 ball back Duke should be ready for the tournaments with or without Kyrie.

[elvis14]

For those who are criticizing him for not getting to the line, he went 9-10 from the line tonight, he just chose to jack 3s down the stretch.

We are not criticizing Kyle for not getting to the line. He's getting hammered and it's not being called. We are criticizing the way the game is being called in regards to Kyle,

[jipops]

Let's see, a crushing loss somewhere in mid-late February. Don't we see this movie pretty much every year? It's just how it goes.

So the synopsis seems to be poor shot selection and game management did us in on this one. Kind of sounds like a team that is operating without a point guard doesn't it?

I still think this a very good team, but for quite a while we have been a team with glaring weaknesses that are going to bite us from time to time as well, especially on the road. Think about the fact that we have no pg and very little offensive threat in the post, yet we are still challenging for an ACC title. Sure I know we have 2 of the best players in the conference but with those glaring holes there a lot of teams that would have tripped up more frequently, kind of like the one last year a few miles down the road. The talking heads will say "hey, Duke didn't have a pg last year either", well... we did have a guy who produced an insane assist/TO ratio and managed the game like a master. We don't have that in our personnel this year.

Again, I still think we have a very good team that has some potential to make a good run. Our perimeter guys are in a position where they have to work hard to get their shots.

[Dr. Tina]

We are not criticizing Kyle for not getting to the line. He's getting hammered and it's not being called. We are criticizing the way the game is being called in regards to Kyle,

I'm criticizing Kyle for abandoning the style of play that was helping him get to the line so he could go 9 for 10. Higher percentage shots with a chance to draw a foul and go to the line would have been A LOT more helpful.

[strawbs]

First off I want to say thanks to just about everyone posting in this thread for keeping things in perspective for the most part.
I was looking at the devils den postgame thread and the stuff being posted made me ashamed to call some of those people fans of the duke basketball team. It's a loss and it wasn't a loss that ended our season, it's not the end of the world. We are still in position to win the acc regular season title. And without Kyrie i still think we have a team capable of winning the acc tourney and ncaa tourney. Will we win the tournament? who knows. But we are definitely still one of the best 6-7 teams in the country and have as good of a chance as anyone.

I have two questions about the game tonight:
1) did anyone else think that kyle's traveling call was iffy? When i was watching the game i thought it was probably a travel and didn't question it. However, is it just me or does kyle do the exact same thing every time he flashes out to the wing and receives a pass? He gathers himself and when he turns to face the basket, it seems like he changes his pivot foot all the time. I didn't question whether the call tonight was in fact a travel, because i thought it was; i did question why it was called though, because imo he could be called for that 10 times a game. And it's not just him, players all over the country consistently do the same thing. Either call it every time or not at all. It just seemed like a random call to me. I could be wrong though.

2) What were we trying to do on the last possession? Obviously we needed to take a time out when we did with about 10 seconds left. But what was drawn up coming out of the timeout? It seemed like we had no movement and no one knew what they were doing. On top of nobody moving, everyone seemed lost. Was it tech's defense busting up the play, poor execution, or something else? It was definitely frustrating that we couldn't get a clean look and give ourselves a chance.

Lastly, I'm proud of the guys, they played hard. Obviously the result wasn't what everyone was hoping for, but if we had to lose one last game this season that was the one to lose. Hopefully the guys bounce back and take it to clemson wednesday night!

[Billy Dat]

not a criticism, just the facts. and my bad, he's up to 29% after tonite's 10/19 ratio

Good job with the stats, I can't refute them. I just feel like with him getting to the line 5 times for 9 points tonight, it wasn't the reason we lost tonight. If anything, I wish he'd passed more instead of jacking all those 3s in the last 10 minutes. He clearly thought he was going to lead us to the promised land...he was like Strap in the State Semis in Hoosiers but he kept missing.

[DevilYouthCoach]

duke looked out of sync....almost like........they were waiting on something.....


I agree. Clearly VT wanted the game a lot more than we did, and that usually makes the difference. I actually thought that Coach K seemed out of touch a bit tonight. When K's fire is not brightly lit, our team is often sluggish too. It takes a lot of mental toughness to play super hard every game, and K usually supplies a lot of the energy. Tonight he did not seem to really be into it. Maybe he thought a properly timed loss could be a motivator? Whatever the reason, I felt that K's demeanor contributed to the team's lack of rebounding effort, disorganized offense, carelessness around the rim, etc. A rather poor showing, particularly the last 7-8 minutes when we usually put people away! Next Game please!

[Saratoga2]

1) did anyone else think that kyle's traveling call was iffy? When i was watching the game i thought it was probably a travel and didn't question it. However, is it just me or does kyle do the exact same thing every time he flashes out to the wing and receives a pass? He gathers himself and when he turns to face the basket, it seems like he changes his pivot foot all the time. I didn't question whether the call tonight was in fact a travel, because i thought it was; i did question why it was called though, because imo he could be called for that 10 times a game. And it's not just him, players all over the country consistently do the same thing. Either call it every time or not at all. It just seemed like a random call to me. I could be wrong though.


!

I tend to agree that Kyle changes his pivot foot most of the time and doesn't get called. Perhaps the difference here was that he was being closely guarded when he did it.

[Chris Randolph]

It is comical how some people seem to put it all on Kyle..... Ignorance is bliss

Use your brain and think about what he has done for this team and his whole career at Duke. Sure, I'd have love for him to hit 2 more threes tonight (think about that, just 2 and everyone is calling his game great) but he still does so much for this team. I understand that not everyone has a "basketball mind" and just watches the ball during games so that is where some of this idiotic reaction comes from.

This team is not a national title contender without Kyrie, its not an excuse, just a fact. A fact that Coach K knew when he changed our style of play for Kyrie cuz he knew he was the one to lead us to a title. I really really hope I am wrong but I don't think I am. I thought from February on last year we had a great shot to win it because we had 3 legit players/scorers and great leadership/character. This year we have 2 legit players and the leadership/character is good but not great

[loldevilz]

I just thought I'd mention that Duke lost another game in which only 2 reached double-figures. Sadly enough this is two games in a row. I simply cannot understand why there is no effort to get a third scorer established early in the game.

Mason in particular showed a some nice jump hooks, but they didn't make an effort to get him the ball. Instead of Mason having a breakout game, he had a

The other mistake I thought was not giving Miles enough time. I have said this before, but Miles has the best +/- per minute and is the best interior defender on the team.

[Andre Buckner Fan]

It takes a lot of mental toughness to play super hard every game, and K usually supplies a lot of the energy. Tonight he did not seem to really be into it. Maybe he thought a properly timed loss could be a motivator? Whatever the reason, I felt that K's demeanor contributed to the team's lack of rebounding effort, disorganized offense, carelessness around the rim, etc.

I noticed that too. Even Homer nods... or maybe Coach K was trying to test his team in a tough environment. See if they could stand on their own and let Nolan or Kyle be a leader on the court. A win teaches better but a loss can teach a lot too.

For whatever reason (feeling bad for Seth Greenberg getting screwed three years running?) Coach K was not the spark plug he often is.

[Devilsfan]

If you wpould have told me that if Seth and Ryan hit a combination of 2 threes we win I woulsd have said it's a can't miss.

[Saratoga2]

One additional question is why the coaches didn't try to make corrections when the game appeared to be going VT's way. I know coach K has done marvels in the past, but the lack of moves, other than to put Cully in, seemed unlike his style.

[Billy Dat]

I noticed that too. Even Homer nods... or maybe Coach K was trying to test his team in a tough environment. See if they could stand on their own and let Nolan or Kyle be a leader on the court. A win teaches better but a loss can teach a lot too.

For whatever reason (feeling bad for Seth Greenberg getting screwed three years running?) Coach K was not the spark plug he often is.

He may not have been outwardly carrying on, but he was involved in a major chess match and was making lots and lots of moves. The last 10 minutes, Greenberg went zone to lure us into shooting 3s in the hopes that he would get run outs. K kept countering by alternating big and small line-ups...Always Nolan and Kyle but then either Tyler, Dre, Mason or Ryan, Mason, Miles. One group would click but then a V Tech offensive rebound barrage would make K go big again or a V Tech run out would make him go small again. Neither line-up could quite plunge the dagger. I have to say, though, our inability to get off a shot to tie the game in the last sequence was really a bummer...I felt like if we could have hit one there, we'd have ripped their hearts out and won in OT.

[dairedevil]

A few thoughts......

While this loss hurts (they all do), it's not like they played awful the entire game. I don't know that this is the best team in the land, but I do think they are very good. It wouldn't have taken a lot for there to be a different outcome tonight.

VT had balanced scoring - 5 guys in double figures. When Delaney wasn't scoring, the others stepped up.
Duke had 2 guys with 22 and 18 points, then a few others with a basket or two.
I can't put all the blame on Singler and Smith when they were the ones carrying the team. A few baskets by some other guys - Miles' missed dunks, Ryan's 3's, Seth not getting 2 quick fouls, and scoring a bucket or two


Game wouldn't have been this close if VT hits free throws - they shot 44% - 8 for 18..that's a minimum of 10 pts they could have had. Don't know how many were front ends of 1 & 1. (btw, Duke was 10-13, so we had great ft shooting tonight). Fouls were about even until the very end.

3 pt shots...Duke was 4 for 19, 21%. How far below season average is that? Seems like VT was killing us, however they were only 6 for 19, 31%. If one of Kelly's wide open shot goes in, and one more of Kyles', then we're talking a different game.

Fatigue could have been a factor, and led to some poorer decisions on the court late in the game. It was the third game in less than a week. I'm not talking about K's rotation...even the announcers made a comment about both VT and Duke looking winded late in the game and needing a timeout.

It's a lot easier and more restful to me to watch a Duke blowout. But a hard fought, tight game against a really determined opponent - even if they lose - got to prepare them better for tough tournament games. Even K said it felt like a tournament game.

Looking forward to the last 2 regular season games...(biting nails, wringing hands, worrying......) NEXT PLAY!!!!!

[Gewebe14]

its time to bench singler

[Kewlswim]

its time to bench singler

Hi,

A shooters mentality is to keep shooting because the next one is going to go in the hoop. The problem is that some nights a guy is just "off." I believe we would be better served to go to bucket more because of nights just like this one.

I was really excited about Mason's progress. If Miles is able to dunk Nolan's pass or if Nolan isn't called for charging...who knows what the outcome would have been?

I have four words for everyone, "Better Now Than March."

GO DUKE!

[johnny2001]

I don't have a problem with putting the blame on a player and in this case singler deserves much of it. A players legacy or whatever at duke has nothing to do with the outcome of any one game. There are only so many possesions in a game. If you take as many shots as he does you have to make a good percentage. It's a massive opportunity cost to the team to watch singler jack errant 3s and long off balance 2s. Let those be nolans shots please. Getting better is about acknowledging mistakes and tonights mistakes in the end had a ton to do with Kyle thinking he's the shooter on the team. He currently is not a good jump shooter. Pass the ball and get closer looks. I can't figure out why more screens and sets aren't lined up for Dawkins. He CAN make the shots Kyle can't.

[Kedsy]

I was very upset with Kyle's shot selection - since I felt he forced way too many threes or long-range twos early in the shot clock.

I can not disagree more with those who are saying Kyle's shot selection was poor. Granted, the shot he took in the last minute was probably ill-advised, but the four 3-pointers he missed around midway through the second half were all wide open shots taken in rhythm that looked good coming out of his hand. If he gets 100 of those shots he should take every single one whether they go in or not.

A good shot taken by a good shooter should not be judged on whether it went through the hoop. (And Kyle is a good shooter, whether he has been in a slump lately or not.)


However, I do not think we will get a #1 seed anymore.

If we win our last two games and win the ACC tournament, I'm confident we will be a #1 seed in the NCAAT. If we lose another game then I agree we won't be.


Unless Kyle get's his perimeter shot back we are going to struggle. We had the big two, but now we have the big 1.

Kyle was our leading scorer tonight with 22 points. I think that performance still counts as being part of a "big two," even if his percentage wasn't as high as we all would have liked.


Maybe we can learn from this, i know coach K will try and figure out what the problem is.

"The problem"? We lost a game. Why does the most recent game color so many people's perceptions of the team's performance to date and/or potential for the future?



This game was lost because of Kyle! Terrible shooting. I hope the guy does not take a 3 point shot for the rest of the season. * * * He is not close to being clutch from 3 point land and should not consider shooting them any more.

Oh, puhlease. Kyle shot 32% tonight, which I grant you is not ideal. But here's a fun fact: Did you know that including the ACC tournament, last year Jon Scheyer played 19 games against ACC competition and shot 33% or worse in 10 of them? Plus in three others he shot between 35% and 40%, meaning he only shot better than 40% in six out of 19 games? That's all shots, but he had plenty of stinkers from 3-point range as well. Should he have considered not shooting any more?


This team is not a national title contender without Kyrie, its not an excuse, just a fact.

I know a lot of people disagree with me, especially after a loss, but I believe this year's team, without Kyrie, is a better team than last year's team. That doesn't mean we'll win the title this year, because you need a lot of luck as well as skill to do that, but we're certainly contenders.

With Kyrie we're obviously better, but we're one of the top five teams in the country without him, so in my opinion your "fact" is more like fiction.

[fgb]

The postgame celebrations were totally and completely over the top for a regular season game between two non-rivals.

come on, guys, let's lay off va tech as far as the celebrating goes. they just beat the number one team in the nation, and probably just secured themselves a tourny birth. this was a huge win for them, by any standard.

[Kewlswim]

Hi,

I think Duke looked really good for most of the game against Maryland last year. However, I imagine if you went through what most people wrote after that game it wasn't all that positive. I think things worked out well last year and I hope things work out well this year too. I refuse to throw in the towel:

1. I think we are two wins away from a regular season ACC Championship. (right?)
2. I feel we are in good position to win the ACC Championship (with Kyrie playing?)
3. Should be a fun NCCA Tournament for us and I am not going to give an inch and I know Coach K won't either.

GO DUKE!

[Chris Randolph]

Last year: 3 reliable scorers/defenders/winners in Smith, Scheyer, Singler

This year: Not so much

Big difference when trying to match up against that

[ncexnyc]

This is definitely a tough loss. If you've followed the various PHASE threads I'm sure you'll remember that in several of them one of the questions asked is, "Can we develop a killer instinct?" We had Tech reeling and down by 6 points, with Uncle Mo definitely in our corner and suddenly the game turns into New Jack City II. Three ball after three ball gets launched and then a series of boneheaded plays.

Nolan had an excellent game. He played solid, lockdown D on Delaney and was very efficient on the offensive end. I can forgive him a couple of bad plays near the end as the kid isn't perfect.

Kyle picked up right from where he left off in the Temple game and was playing like the MOTM. Unfortunately he forgot what got him there and now poster are calling him something else.

Ryan had a tough game on both ends of the court. Defensively he got out late on a couple of 3's and he was no match for Allen under the basket. On the offensive end he couldn't make some wide open 3's, which hurt. He did have one really niffty move on a pumpfake, but we needed a lot more than that.

Miles had those two misses on thunder slam attempts. He also seemed to get pushed under the basket way to often, which was surprising.

Mason had a solid game. He's becoming a lot more aggressive on the offensive end and while at times he looks awkward we'll have to take that if we want him to continue his growth as a scoring option downlow. He too, got pushed around down low, but he also got jobbed on one block.

Seth was a non-factor and it really hurt. Hopefully he won't fold due to one bad game. We need him on the court.

Tyler had another decent game. He's a steady player who won't put up monster numbers, but he looking more and more like our future glue guy.

Andre continues to show signs of life. Hopefully this will continue.

Let's move on. We played a hungry team who wanted this game a little bit more than we did.

[tele]

Tight rims...Duke starters only had one made 3, by Singler. Not going to win many games shooting like that from long range. Vt didn't shoot all that much better from 3land either. And I didn't think the shot selection or the number of attempts was off, just the number of made shots. Similar to the St Johns game coincidently.

I'd be more concerned about the number of assists, 6 total and just 2 by your starting guards. That, and also getting outrebounded by a smaller team. The offensive rebounds really hurt in a hard fought tough defensive game like this one. Oh, who led the team in rebounds with 12, and offensive rebounding? Singler was working his tail off on defense too. Most of his shots were open looks, and no one else was exactly lighting it up. So even though Kyle wasn't making many threes, he was still taking the teams best shot, which is what you want your senior leader to do isn't it?

anyway, hopefully this is Duke's last loss.

[moonpie23]

thanks for the reality check ked, it's always tuff after a loss.....but you put things in perspective so well... :)

[ncexnyc]

Tight rims...Duke starters only had one made 3, by Singler. Not going to win many games shooting like that from long range. Vt didn't shoot all that much better from 3land either. And I didn't think the shot selection or the number of attempts was off, just the number of made shots. Similar to the St Johns game coincidently.

I'd be more concerned about the number of assists, 6 total and just 2 by your starting guards. That, and also getting outrebounded by a smaller team. The offensive rebounds really hurt in a hard fought tough defensive game like this one. Oh, who led the team in rebounds with 12, and offensive rebounding? Singler was working his tail off on defense too. Most of his shots were open looks, and no one else was exactly lighting it up. So even though Kyle wasn't making many threes, he was still taking the teams best shot, which is what you want your senior leader to do isn't it?

anyway, hopefully this is Duke's last loss.
I believe most people are very well aware the Kyle was our leading scorer tonight. What has so many people upset is that he went away from what got him those points.

[Gthoma2a]

I just want for us to start looking inside when outside shots might not be falling. Make a few chip-ins and the rim seems bigger.

[loldevilz]

I know a lot of people disagree with me, especially after a loss, but I believe this year's team, without Kyrie, is a better team than last year's team. That doesn't mean we'll win the title this year, because you need a lot of luck as well as skill to do that, but we're certainly contenders.

With Kyrie we're obviously better, but we're one of the top five teams in the country without him, so in my opinion your "fact" is more like fiction.

I'm sorry but how on earth do you think this years team is better than last years? They are worse in almost every statistical category than last year's team. They are more inexperienced, have fewer scoring options, they rebound the ball worse, and are much worse offensively. Since Kyrie went down this team has lost every major prime time game it has played except the UNC game which they would have lost except for some incredibly hot shooting by Seth Curry and a nice choke job by the tar heels.

The truth is a lot of people feel exactly as that poster does that this team simply cannot score the ball well enough to be a serious title contender. It doesn't have any player like Kyrie or Zoubek that can make the offense run at the highest level of efficiency. As was clear tonight, and has been shown before, this team can really struggle to score.

[Kedsy]

Last year: 3 reliable scorers/defenders/winners in Smith, Scheyer, Singler

This year: Not so much

Big difference when trying to match up against that

Well, I would shape the discussion a different way. Last year we had three guys who did pretty much all of our scoring. Two guys didn't need to be guarded at all. This year we usually have five guys on the floor who are all offensive threats and need to be guarded. If you look at it that way, we are more difficult to match up against this year.

[tele]

I believe most people are very well aware the Kyle was our leading scorer tonight. What has so many people upset is that he went away from what got him those points.

That is somewhat puzzling, since some of his made mid range shots were much tougher than the open 3's he was missing. The 3's were mostly better looks, just weren't falling.

[tele]

I believe most people are very well aware the Kyle was our leading scorer tonight. What has so many people upset is that he went away from what got him those points.

oh, just realized you were probably responding to Kedsy's post not mine, since I didn't mention Kyle was the leading scorer with 22 points in my post. But that is certainly a good to point out, nothing to sneeze at in a tough road game, when some of the other players maybe are not having their best shooting nights either, to put it kindly.

[Kedsy]

I'm sorry but how on earth do you think this years team is better than last years? They are worse in almost every statistical category than last year's team.

This is simply untrue. We are about the same in most statistical categories, except significantly worse in offensive rebounding and significantly better in eFG%.


They are more inexperienced, have fewer scoring options, they rebound the ball worse, and are much worse offensively.

Actually we have many more scoring options than last year. Last season we had four players who scored 20 or more points in a game, and one of them was Andre who hardly played once the ACC season began. This year we have had seven players score 20 or more points in a game, and they're all important parts of our rotation (except Kyrie, of course, who will be if he comes back). Or, put another way (and as I said in an earlier post), last year three guys scored pretty much all our points and this year we usually have five guys on the floor who are offensive threats.

Our defensive rebounding is actually a little better than last year. It's true that our offensive rebounding is worse than last year, but our shooting is much better, so that more or less evens out.

According to Pomeroy, our offensive rating (pre-NCAAT) last year was 121.5. This year it's 119.9 (going into the VPI game). I would not call that "much worse offensively."


Since Kyrie went down this team has lost every major prime time game it has played except the UNC game which they would have lost except for some incredibly hot shooting by Seth Curry and a nice choke job by the tar heels.

What is your definition of a "prime time game"? If it's a game against a nationally ranked opponent, then we're 2-0 since Kyrie went down. If it's a tough road game, then I'd say we're 2-3. If it's a game on TV, then we're something like 18-3.


The truth is a lot of people feel exactly as that poster does that this team simply cannot score the ball well enough to be a serious title contender.

According to Pomeroy our offense is the 5th best in the country. So if people think that we can't score well enough to be a serious contender then those people are wrong.

[JohnGalt]

Last year: 3 reliable scorers/defenders/winners in Smith, Scheyer, Singler

This year: Not so much

Big difference when trying to match up against that

This is, perhaps, the most interesting post I've ever read. If only because:

(1) 2 of those 3 "reliable scorers/defenders/winners" suited up last evening [and combined for a more than respectable 40 points].
(2) 1 of those 3 "reliable scorers/defenders/winners" is positively in the running for NPOY.
(3) 1 of those 3 "reliable scorers/defenders/winners" is positively in the running for an All-American team even despite the fact his numbers are [I]slightly down, which I'd argue is largely attributable/a function of his 3pt shooting.
(4) The 2009-2010 squad - at this very point in the year - had 4 losses [with a 5th shortly to come], to 2010-11's 3. I believe 2009-2010 was still rewarded a #1 seed, as well.
(5) [I'll stop for brevity's sake]

I think, Chicken Little, it advisable to temper your pessimism. I, for one, plan to heed the great Satchel Paige's advice:

Sometimes I sits and thinks, and sometimes I just sits.

[loldevilz]

This is simply untrue. We are about the same in most statistical categories, except significantly worse in offensive rebounding and significantly better in eFG%.

Actually we have many more scoring options than last year. Last season we had four players who scored 20 or more points in a game, and one of them was Andre who hardly played once the ACC season began. This year we have had seven players score 20 or more points in a game, and they're all important parts of our rotation (except Kyrie, of course, who will be if he comes back). Or, put another way (and as I said in an earlier post), last year three guys scored pretty much all our points and this year we usually have five guys on the floor who are offensive threats.

Our defensive rebounding is actually a little better than last year. It's true that our offensive rebounding is worse than last year, but our shooting is much better, so that more or less evens out.

According to Pomeroy, our offensive rating (pre-NCAAT) last year was 121.5. This year it's 119.9 (going into the VPI game). I would not call that "much worse offensively."


Our offense is worse if you look at the post-tournament data instead of the pre-tournament data when we were still adjusting to Zoubek being in the lineup. I don't know why on earth you would use pre-tournament since Duke made a pretty big change in its lineup. Also, I would expect a substantial drop in offensive efficiency after today. I suppose those numbers make sense if you are expecting some miraculous improvement in offensive efficiency like last year. Of course, I do not see it happening without Irving.

I also would like to respond to the idea that Duke has all these players that can score. Duke doesn't have a bunch of scorers. It has 2 scorers (Smith and Singler), some shooters ( Dawkins, Kelly, and Curry) and some finishers (Plumlees). I would like to see Mason become a reliant scorer, but he hasn't demonstrated that yet (although you seem to believe so). In every loss Duke has had only 2 players score in double figures. That is what I mean by a lack of offensive options.

[JohnGalt]

Also, I would expect a substantial drop in offensive efficiency after today.

1 game in 29 would have to be pretty horrendous in order to cause a "substantial" drop in offensive efficiency. We weren't that bad. Sheesh.


I also would like to respond to the idea that Duke has all these players that can score. Duke doesn't have a bunch of scorers. It has 2 scorers (Smith and Singler), some shooters ( Dawkins, Kelly, and Curry) and some finishers (Plumlees). I would like to see Mason become a reliant scorer, but he hasn't demonstrated that yet (although you seem to believe so). In every loss Duke has had only 2 players score in double figures. That is what I mean by a lack of offensive options.

To use one of the phrases DBRers seem to love...you're grasping at straws, my friend. After all, our "shooters" [as you've labelled them] were a combined 3-12 from the field. Scoring is scoring, no matter how you label it and a few of our guys had an off night.

No biggie.

[Greg_Newton]

On a more positive note - and keeping an eye on the big picture - I thought our bigs continued to show flashes of improvement, especially early in the game.

Mason's jump hook is beginning to look more and more like a legitimate move. He made two of them today, and one of them on a legit, iso, two-dribble power move in the lane against Allen. I remember hearing a commentator mention a couple weeks ago that he had started working on only that with Wojo (rather than that fadeaway jumper), and you can tell he's learning fast. I just don't see why they haven't been doing that since day 1.

I was also very impressed at how they controlled the paint and protected the rim early in the game, against a front line that is a bit undersized but also fairly intimidating in some ways. Miles in particular had some dominating blocks, but both Mason and Ryan were protecting the rim to the extent that I noticed guys pulling up for jump shots instead of taking open lanes to the rim a couple times.

Obviously, VT's energy overtook us at some point in the second half and they started getting every loose ball and 50/50 rebound, which was a big reason we lost. But that's easily fixable, and had as much to do VT's maniacal surge of intensity that it did us. In the grand scheme of things, I've been very happy with how our trio of bigs have settled into their respective roles, gotten comfortable, minimized their mistakes, and have begun to show sustained stretches of focused and effective play.

[sporthenry]

Yes, Singler is averaging 17.2/game but he was averaging more last year and I expected him to put it all together this year. His FG% is up from 41.5% to 43.4% but his 3's have dropped from 39.9% to 35.5%. And last year, he went through the stretch with his injured wrist. This was the year he was supposed to impress the scouts with his ability to hit the 3, instead, he has shown a lot of flaws in his game.
Maybe I'm wrong but he just reminds me of McBobs sophomore year when he just takes it to the lane, forces a bad shot and hopes a bail out foul is called. The last 3 was definitely forced but the others he just missed.
Without KI, we will only go as far as Kyle takes us. Nolan will get his but if Singler isn't hot, Duke might be a bit lucky to get to the sweet 16.

[sporthenry]

However, I really like Duke as the underdog. If they can get a 2 seed in BYU's bracket (which they should being #5 on the S-curve, than I'm still happy). As other people have said, Mason's post moves are developing, but he needs to have his back to the basket, he can't use his spin move dribble to finish a play.
Not winning the ACC would be a huge disappointment, so the game @UNC pretty much defines most of this regular season and if we drop to a 3 seed, I don't think we have the horses to win it all, of course it all depends on matchups.
We will be a tough out with the likes of Kelly stretching the court, Dawkins and Curry shooting, TT's intensity, etc, but without KI, I just fear us going on another huge scoring drought in the tourney which will end us. We have no easy way to get baskets, and it kills us.

[hsheffield]

I disagree with the notion we were not ready to play. We were, it was a huge game and we knew that, we just blew it

Mason Plumlee, kudos to you my friend. You wanted this bad and played like it for the full 40 minutes. For a guy who doesn't get many offensive touches, I thought his tenacity and will were terrific tonight. If Mason keeps it up and our all americans play like all americans, we will very very good in the tourney

agree, Chris. how about Mason's free throws in the clutch?

who WAS that Plumlee? IMHO, the best surprise in a sad game. he kept his focus and executed.

[AsiaMinor]

Just WOW all of you. K always says "win as a team, lose as a team" and I am a little shocked at the very direct "calling out" of each player. Probably because I'm new here.
In my muddled little mind (continuing the Team analogy) the "fist" didn't show up tonight, five individuals did. The team had a bad game. It happens. I hate seeing Duke lose, but VT won that game. Parsing the fault seems a bit over the top in some of the posts to me. But again, I'm new and not nearly as knowlegeable about basketball as you guys are.

[Jderf]

I see a lot of posts in this thread saying that last night we learned that we're not a title contender without Kyrie. I disagree. Obviously, Kyrie would help, but I think we're still a top tier team without him. Toe-rehab notwithstanding, what we really learned last night was not the importance of Kyrie, but rather the importance of Seth.

Consider: In the five games before last night -- five games in which Duke won by an average of 14 points and by all means looked like one of the best teams in the country -- Seth averaged 36.2 mpg, 12.6 ppg, and 3.8 apg. 36 minutes! That's more than either Kyle or Nolan are averaging this season, and I think that says something about how important K thinks Seth is for this team. Granted, his numbers aren't quite Kyrie's, but clearly #30 had established himself as the critical third cog in a well-oiled machine.

Against Va Tech, however, Seth fouled out in 15 minutes, with 0 points and 0 assists. He may has well have been sitting next to Kyrie the whole time. After all, he did that for a majority of the game anyway. Without Seth on the floor, we were missing the second part of what has become our two-headed point guard; we were missing his ball-handling, his distribution, and, of course, the extra spacing that his shooting touch provides. It's not a coincidence that one of the team's lowest assist totals of the season came in a game where Seth laid an egg. I would argue that, if Seth had the game we have all come to expect, the game we all should expect, the game he himself should expect, then last night's matchup wouldn't have even been close.

Essentially, what I'm saying is this: Last night's game didn't expose any flaws, unless you consider it a flaw that we rely on our best players.

Next play, next game. Seth, we'll see you there.

[MChambers]

I guess I can understand that this is the annual meltdown post-game thread, because this was such a frustrating loss, but let's keep things in perspective. Most of the game we outplayed VT on the road. Only some very poor decisions down the stretch kept us from a big win.

This team has had a pretty great year when you consider we lost our most talented player in early December. If you had asked me back then if I'd have taken having only 3 losses by the end of February, I'd have said absolutely.

I do think this loss makes it unlikely we'll get a number 1 seed, but that's not the end of the world.

[dukelifer]

This loss felt like one of those tourney losses over the last few years- Duke did not play their best and wilted at the end despite having chances. This was not a game where Tech played great- Duke just did not execute and knock them out when they had the chance. When Duke was making their run and were up by 6- they had two maybe three chances to break Tech and they just missed shots. When Tech weathered that - hit a few shots- their crowd lifted the team and that was the ball game. Duke had the whole arena on the ropes and just could not knock them out. Singler is usually a much better shooter in those situations but the shot did not fall.

Several observations. Last night, Andre looked like he was ready to explode. Duke did not look for him enough. Several times Nolan tried to go one on five and Andre was wide open and there was never a glance in his direction. Duke has a few players who need to see their jumper go down to play well. Andre is definitely one but Curry is another. He did not respond well to the pressure of the moment- but that was more personal and less about the particular game. That may not repeat itself. Kelly had some wide open looks- but he was not on and led to some break outs by Tech. When he misses it is usually a long rebound. He is a capable three point shooter but is not a great shooter when he is going fast- and needs to play a bit closer to the basket.

Mason's little hook was strong tonight. It would have been nice if Duke had figured a way to get him the ball more in good position. That is definitely a weakness of this team. The bigs are not getting the ball where they need it to be most effective.

Can't really sugar coat it. This was a game Duke had and gave away. They just failed to execute in critical moments. This was as close to a tourney game that Duke has had all year. The hope is that they will review tape and figure some things out. There is no fundamental flaw on this team- but execution is what separates champions from everyone else.

[Saratoga2]

Bobby Knight has said that a foul given is sometimes worse than a turnover. Seth fouled out in 15 minutes and he had difficulty staying with his man. He also was no offensive threat. Perhaps the opponents last night were too much for him to handle.

So that left us with Tyler as the second point guard. He came into the game and that seemed to lift the team when he came in. Whether it was coaching instructions, Tyler feeling inadequate or the seniors feeling they had to do more, Tyler was not trying to penetrate and shoot or dish. He has shown signs that he can do more offensively and has been an excellent foul shooter in the last several games. Why not encourage him to try.

Mason also seems to be more of a factor offensively and yet he only took a few shots (was it 5?). Clearly with both Kelly and Mason inside, we had a resource we weren't using. Ryan's outside shooting was all arms and legs and he really was bricking those shots. Would love to see him return to his form of mid season, but when it is not happening, you need to look elsewhere. Kyle is also a force inside and that could have and that facet should have been explored more. Miles is clearly not an offensive presence and is primarily a defensive player who can come in and spell either Mason or Ryan.

Andre is starting to shoot well again from outside. Knowing that, why not run screens for him and let him take a larger share of the outside shots.

A fair share of people on the board think criticism of Kyle or Nolan is unjustified. I agree Nolan played excellent defense and his offense was excellent as usual. Kyle also played very solid defense, rebounded well and got 22 points. The only criticism I have of their play is that they took the whole load on themselves, particularly at the end of the game.

Clearly that resulted in a spate of missed threes and turnovers that led to the loss. If they don't learn from what happened last night, they will be bound to repeat it.

[Matches]

Eh, it's one game. Next play and all that.

The only thing that really bothered me, and that I hope can be corrected, is that we essentially gave the game away at the end with poor shot selection and ball-handling. Failing to get off a shot when we had the ball down 3 with :25 left, especially after a timeout, is disturbing, particularly from a veteran team (and I do consider us a veteran team so long as Kyle & Nolan are on the floor). That whole last possession was really ragged, and it seemed to have more to do with us than with anything VT was doing defensively.

[HDB]

Tough loss last night --- no doubt about it. Now as I start to think about the ACC regular season title potentially slipping through our grasp I grow frustrated that our competition for the title did not have to play on the road in 2 of the most difficult road environments in the league (VT, UMD). I guess we'll just have to take care of business in Chapel Hill.

[sagegrouse]

I'm sorry but how on earth do you think this years team is better than last years? They are worse in almost every statistical category than last year's team. They are more inexperienced, have fewer scoring options, they rebound the ball worse, and are much worse offensively.

FWIW I think this year's team stacks up well compared to last year's.

Bigs:
2010 - Two really experienced defensive players inside but no scoring among the four bigs.
2011 - Mason is a strong rebounder, if not on a par with Z. Defense by the bigs continues to improve, esp. in swatting shots. This year's advantage -- more scoring potential inside from Mason and Ryan.

Wing: Same -- Kyle vs. Kyle

Guards:
2010: All-American quality but only two players, with selective contributions from Andre. This was the miracle of 2010. Duke won a NC with only two experienced guards, in a game where the guards are the most important players.

2011: Nolan 2011 is the best player in the country and better than Nolan 2010. We miss Jon, but instead have Seth, Andre and Tyler. Three quality players to replace a second team A-A. Not as much brilliance, but depth is a wonderful thing in basketball.

Overall assessment:

Defense: Last year's defense was wondrous except for our inability to match up with teams with two quick guards. This year's defense is very good, if not quite at the level of 2010.

Offense: 2010 had three scorers, an incredible luxury in college BB. This year, there are two proven scorers, who contribute 15 or more nearly every single night, but there are four others who are capable of big nights.

Record: This year's record is better year-to-date than last year's, but "All's Well That Ends Well," sayeth the Bard, and -- I suppose -- the converse is true.


Since Kyrie went down this team has lost every major prime time game it has played except the UNC game which they would have lost except for some incredibly hot shooting by Seth Curry and a nice choke job by the tar heels.



Uhhh, all statisticians find a reason to throw out outliers, but you threw out Maryland (a win) but kept in St. John's (a loss) that was played in the afternoon, not prime time, and then proceeded to rationalize an epic comeback against UNC as a "nice choke job by the tar heels." This last is, truthfully, really bad form for a DBR poster.

But I'm not happy with losing a game that was there for the taking. Next time there will be a different result, I expect.

sagegrouse

[bgibbs1001]

I know it sounds weird, but I didn't see this as a "live by the 3 die by the 3 game". I have thought that many times in the past, but that was usually because our offense couldn't create anything but a contested 3. Tonight, down the stretch, I actually thought we had great spacing and potential to get either better 3s, or other high percentage shots, but Kyle must have been feeling it.

My only worry about a game like this for Kyle is that he clearly wanted to be the man down the stretch and it came out all wrong. He was playing great up until then. For those who are criticizing him for not getting to the line, he went 9-10 from the line tonight, he just chose to jack 3s down the stretch. I think hitting the 3 to put us up 6 with 11 to go got him in the mindset that he was going to carry us to the end. Whatever...he couldn't buy one. Here's how we came down the stretch on offense from when Kyle hit that 3:

-Kyle miss 3
-Kyle miss 3
-Nolan miss jumper
-Kyle miss 3
-Kyle makes 2 FTs
-Kyle turnover (walk)
-Nolan runner
-Nolan charge
-Nolan miss inside
-Nolan miss 3
-Miles miss dunk
-Kyle miss jumper
-Nolan miss jumper
-Kyle turnover
-Kyle makes lay-up
-Andre miss 3
-Kyle miss lay-up and tip in
-Mason steal and dunk
-Kyle miss 3
-Nolan miss front end of 1-1-Mason goes 1 for 2 on FTs
-Curry turnover
-BALLGAME

Rough last 10 minutes. We went down with Kyle and Nolan, you have to like our odds to win in that scenario...usually.

Don't post too often on here, but the above caught my eye. To me it says only 5 times did someone not named Singler or Smith get involved on offense the last 10 minutes. We can debate the reasons for that, but one thing is certain, 2 against 5 doesn't usually win basketball games. And in that debate I tend to come down on the side that says Singler and Smith need to share the ball more with the rest of the team. Sadly though, I do not see that happening.

[BlueHeaven]

Just WOW all of you. K always says "win as a team, lose as a team" and I am a little shocked at the very direct "calling out" of each player. Probably because I'm new here.
In my muddled little mind (continuing the Team analogy) the "fist" didn't show up tonight, five individuals did. The team had a bad game. It happens. I hate seeing Duke lose, but VT won that game. Parsing the fault seems a bit over the top in some of the posts to me. But again, I'm new and not nearly as knowlegeable about basketball as you guys are.

I totally agree with AsiaMinor. This is a psychological problem for K to figure out, not a basketball fundamentals problem. They got in our heads and didn't play as a team. Tough road game, electric environment, VT desperate to win to get into the Tournament--did you see the three crying women hug Seth Greenberg at the end? This had more to do with psychology than skill. Our fearless leader will figure it out.

[RoyalBlue08]

Wow, one loss on the road to a very motivated team and this board becomes indistinguishable from IC. I hope some people have woken up this morning with a little perspective.

[elvis14]

Wow, one loss on the road to a very motivated team and this board becomes indistinguishable from IC. I hope some people have woken up this morning with a little perspective.

I disagree. What I see a lot of here are guys pointing to what actually happened (Seth not showing up, Ryan 0-4 on wide open 3's, Kyle 1-7 on threes) and guys pointing out that without Kyle being able to hit a jump shot and without a 3rd scoring option we have issues. For us, "issues" means things that'll keep us from winning the ACC and the NCAA tournament. Nothing wrong with examining this team to those standards is there?

That's not IC material. Nobody's calling for the coaches to be fired. Nobody is claiming that the refs cost us the game (I mean after all, Nolan did get a FT), nobody is saying that player X sucks, etc.

[diveonthefloor]

I am firmly in the camp of "next play"

There is no way that K doesn't use the VPI game as teaching and motivational material to direct our final push to a championship this year.

I know a back to back title is rare. But imo, last night's result made it more likely, not less.

[Devilsfan]

It all depends on our match-ups.

[DukieInBrasil]

the thing that I thought was a fatal flaw was that we ended up settling for jumpers. It wasn't a fatal flaw b/c they weren't falling, although that didn't help, but b/c VT has no depth and we needed to get them in foul trouble.
Kyle was doing great at getting to the line and converting and got a couple of their guys in trouble, but then he stopped going inside and settled for contested 3s. That was what cost us the game.
Nolan did a great job of getting inside, and he tried to draw fouls but they weren't fouling him (or at least weren't getting called). He ended up shooting well from the floor, but only got 1 FTA, if he had concentrated more on getting to the rim maybe he would have gotten a few more FTs.
Kelly also settled for those long jumpers, largely cuz they stopped buying his shot fakes, but his one FG came from going inside. Had he driven into the lane perhaps he would have found some nice short shots to take or found a good passing lane to an open teammate or drawn a foul.
Settling for jumpers late rather than trying to draw fouls by going inside is what cost us the game.

[gumbomoop]

I take the liberty here to restate my own view of, "What does it take for Duke to win close games?" Back on Jan. 1, I posited the following as keys to winning, including close games.


Duke will win almost [and probably] all close games in which:

a. either Kyle or Nolan is superb, and
b. either Seth or Andre scores 12-15 points and plays good D, and
c. either Ryan or Mason or Miles gets near a double-double [or, as an alternate, collectively they produce, say, 18 and 18, with 3-4 blocks], and
d. Duke plays every play on D


I guess last evening's loss could be said either to validate or invalidate my hypothesis. Let's go through a-d to check things out.

a. nope - The best player on the floor last eve was Jeff Allen.
b. nope - nowhere close
c. not quite - the 3 bigs got 6 blocks, but only 11 pts and 12 rbds
d. no - because of the maddening problem of lousy block-outs


So, what to conclude? Well, I could claim that since really none of my 4 criteria were met, we lost, as predicted. But then I think, wait, if only any 2, possibly even just 1 [!!] of the 4 had been fulfilled, we'd have won, so my hypothesis must be badly flawed, if only any 2 of them suffice to win the close ones. Alas, I conclude that while my criteria may be unnecessarily high to win a close one over a merely decent, if inspired, VaTech, I think I'll stick with these when it comes to even tougher opponents, in the even more pressure-packed, one-done NCAAT.

I'm always surprised when Duke loses, was unpleasantly surprised by our guys' play in the last 5 minutes, found Miles' thunder-slam attempts earlier really, really irritating, and am always dismayed when the opponent exhibits relentless intensity, and our guys do not.

Like virtually all of you, I will be disappointed if Duke does not win this season's NC. Like, I assume, a somewhat [......] lesser proportion of you, I expect Duke to win it. Duke will be one of 4 or 5 co-favorites. No guarantees. [The prospect of a "near-guarantee" with Kyrie hangs over our (fans') collective heads, and messes with us.]

I expect Kyle to make a couple more of those open 3s, I expect Seth to have no more such games the remainder of the season, I think Andre is gradually emerging from his slump, that Mason is coming along, actually, quite nicely, that Tyler is a valuable contributor, that Nolan will dominate a few more games, that Ryan will continue to surprise opponents with blocks, and that Miles will be required to view on film, repeatedly, blown thunder-dunks. Kyrie? I got no idea what to expect.

An exciting week beckons. Md has revived its hopes with 2 wins, and comes into CH with an intriguing combination of confidence and desperation. They know they're fighting with Clemson and BC for a possible 5th ACC spot in the NCAAT. Clemson will come to Durham also revived and desperate. I'm guessing Duke will be 13-2 going to CH next Sat, and the Heels will be either 13-2, or 12-3. [A bit harder to see the Heels losing to both MD and at FSU than winning both, so 13-2 or 12-3 seems logical for the Heels before the Duke game.]

As for #1 ACC and NCAA seed, Duke needs to win out. I'll be keeping an eye on Pitt at UL today, and KU at Mizzou and Texas at Baylor next week. I was impressed with BYU, and wonder whether they might be in good shape for a #1. Great, great play yesterday v. SDSU.

Go Terps? Absolutely. Derwin Kitchen for President? Sure.

[House G]

I am amazed that we almost won this game shooting as poorly as we did. This game reminded me in some respects of the regional final game last year against Baylor. Duke was playing before a hostile crowd and trailed at half by 3 points. Kyle was 0-10 from the field and 0-5 from 3-point range. Duke easily could have lost that game were it not for the amazing shooting of Smith, Scheyer, and Dawkins (11-18 from beyond the arc). Three point shooting remains a big part of our offense and we won't beat many good teams shooting 4-20. Although Kyrie only played in 8 games, Duke shot 42.2% from 3-point range with him in the lineup and 36.8% since he went down. Draw your own conclusion--my guess is that this is one of many areas where he makes our team better.

[Kedsy]

I don't know why on earth you would use pre-tournament since Duke made a pretty big change in its lineup.

Well, first of all, last season Duke made a change in its starting lineup on February 13. The pre-tournament stats I cited included 10 games of the "new" lineup. Not only that, I wouldn't characterize the change as "pretty big" -- Z was a rotation player averaging around 15 minutes a game before K inserted him into the starting lineup.

Finally, I used pre-tournament numbers because it is pre-tournament now. Using numbers from a championship run sort of begs the question, doesn't it?

My point is we are better off now than we were a year ago. After the Maryland loss last year, I had very similar discussions with posters who thought our team stunk and had no chance to get past the Sweet 16.


They gave us a tremendous game with the exception of Malcom Delaney who was off, but the other players more than picked up his slack.

I don't think Delaney was off so much as Nolan played one of the best defensive games of the year. From a defensive standpoint, he dominated the person most feel is the 2nd best player in the conference. And for some reason, people around here aren't giving Nolan enough credit for that.


Kyle was doing great at getting to the line and converting and got a couple of their guys in trouble, but then he stopped going inside and settled for contested 3s. That was what cost us the game.

I don't think this is a fair assessment. Other than his very last attempt, I thought Kyle's outside shots were totally uncontested. As I said in an earlier post he should take that shot every time. And personally, I don't think a few missed shots cost us the game.


Tyler was not trying to penetrate and shoot or dish.

Tyler has rarely tried to penetrate and shoot or dish this season. It doesn't appear to be a comfortable part of his game yet.


The only criticism I have of their play is that they took the whole load on themselves, particularly at the end of the game.

This is exactly right, the key to the loss. The one consistency we have seen in the Florida State, St. Johns, VPI, and UNC-first-half is the players all trying to do everything themselves, acting as individuals and not as a team. Trying to hit the "five run homer," as they say in baseball.

I had hoped we learned the lesson after the St. Johns loss and UNC win (where we snapped out of it and played like a team in the 2nd half), but this was a very intense game and we seemed to revert a little to the individualism.

I'm sure K will mention this to the team, if he hasn't already. In emphatic terms. Hopefully this time the lesson will stick.

[ncexnyc]

"I don't think Delaney was off so much as Nolan played one of the best defensive games of the year. From a defensive standpoint, he dominated the person most feel is the 2nd best player in the conference. And for some reason, people around here aren't giving Nolan enough credit for that."

I think the vast majority of people on this board know that Nolan did an outstanding job on Delaney. As for the comment about some people thinking Delaney was the 2nd best player in the conference, I believe that was challenged in the pre-game thread.

I also believe you can't have it both ways, like some on this board try to do. If a player has a great game those fans want to heap praise upon praise on that player, but should said player falter, suddenly those fans want to hide their heads in the sand and make as though everything is ok.

Enough with the Kyrie excuses. Yes, he's an extremely dynamic player, but the team has had plenty of time to adjust to life without Kyrie.

I wasn't going to talk about last year, but since a number of people want to compare teams let's go for it. At the close of last year we started 5 upper classmen, this year 2. That's a big drop off experience wise. Last year we had 3 constants scoring wise in Jon, Kyle, and Nolan. This year we have only 2 in Kyle and Nolan. Yes, I am aware that others have played the 3rd scorers role throughout the year, but we can't seem to find a consistent hot hand. Seth seemed to be filling that role, but after last night we will have to wait and see. At the close of last year both Brian and Lance had found their roles not only on defense, but on offense as well. Brian finally started making his put backs and even starting hitting his hook shot. Lance had developed a short jumper. While both were never a threat to hit 20 points on any given night, they became constants game in and game out. Last year we had Lance, the defensive stopper supreme. Many poohoed his value at the start of the season, but now that task often falls to Kyle and who honestly can say it doesn't hurt him on the offensive end of the court. I do believe this year's team has better depth, but until the players become dependable game in and game out it's really hard to say this year's current version is better than the team that won a Championship.

[oldnavy]

Well, first of all, last season Duke made a change in its starting lineup on February 13. The pre-tournament stats I cited included 10 games of the "new" lineup. Not only that, I wouldn't characterize the change as "pretty big" -- Z was a rotation player averaging around 15 minutes a game before K inserted him into the starting lineup.

Finally, I used pre-tournament numbers because it is pre-tournament now. Using numbers from a championship run sort of begs the question, doesn't it?

My point is we are better off now than we were a year ago. After the Maryland loss last year, I had very similar discussions with posters who thought our team stunk and had no chance to get past the Sweet 16.



I don't think Delaney was off so much as Nolan played one of the best defensive games of the year. From a defensive standpoint, he dominated the person most feel is the 2nd best player in the conference. And for some reason, people around here aren't giving Nolan enough credit for that.



I don't think this is a fair assessment. Other than his very last attempt, I thought Kyle's outside shots were totally uncontested. As I said in an earlier post he should take that shot every time. And personally, I don't think a few missed shots cost us the game.



Tyler has rarely tried to penetrate and shoot or dish this season. It doesn't appear to be a comfortable part of his game yet.



This is exactly right, the key to the loss. The one consistency we have seen in the Florida State, St. Johns, VPI, and UNC-first-half is the players all trying to do everything themselves, acting as individuals and not as a team. Trying to hit the "five run homer," as they say in baseball.

I had hoped we learned the lesson after the St. Johns loss and UNC win (where we snapped out of it and played like a team in the 2nd half), but this was a very intense game and we seemed to revert a little to the individualism.

I'm sure K will mention this to the team, if he hasn't already. In emphatic terms. Hopefully this time the lesson will stick.

No slight meant towards Nolan, but Delaney did look a little out of sorts. Even some of his open looks were missing everything. Nolan did play a great defensive game against him, but my point was that the rest of the VT role players stepped up and played really well to compensate for MD's lack of production.

[JohnGalt]

"I don't think Delaney was off so much as Nolan played one of the best defensive games of the year. From a defensive standpoint, he dominated the person most feel is the 2nd best player in the conference. And for some reason, people around here aren't giving Nolan enough credit for that."

...I do believe this year's team has better depth, but until the players become dependable game in and game out it's really hard to say this year's current version is better than the team that won a Championship.

Although you didn't use the Quote function, it appears you're pointing this toward the previous post. If I'm incorrect, I apologize; however, I think it's important to be fair in that the previous post said "we're better off now than we were one year ago", not: this team is better than last year's team. Small difference in words, large difference in meaning...even this late in the year.

Also, as some have pointed out, Mason is definitely starting to develop that little hook and Kelly certainly has his own repertoire of post moves. Miles is no slouch on the offensive end either, that is, when he's making his dunks. :o Right now though, I think the biggest discrepancy between this team's frontcourt and last year's frontcourt is day-in and day-in consistency. I think by this time last year we more or less knew what we were going to get out of Lance and Zoubs, whereas with MP1, MP2, and Kelly it's a little bit more of an unknown quantity. Any one of those 3 may go off for 15 and 10 or foul out with 0 and 2. But even that may be hypocritical from my perspective (if you dig up old posts...gulp). :confused:

[Duke4life92]

Originally Posted by AsiaMinor
Just WOW all of you. K always says "win as a team, lose as a team" and I am a little shocked at the very direct "calling out" of each player. Probably because I'm new here.
In my muddled little mind (continuing the Team analogy) the "fist" didn't show up tonight, five individuals did. The team had a bad game. It happens. I hate seeing Duke lose, but VT won that game. Parsing the fault seems a bit over the top in some of the posts to me. But again, I'm new and not nearly as knowlegeable about basketball as you guys are.


I totally agree with AsiaMinor. This is a psychological problem for K to figure out, not a basketball fundamentals problem. They got in our heads and didn't play as a team. Tough road game, electric environment, VT desperate to win to get into the Tournament--did you see the three crying women hug Seth Greenberg at the end? This had more to do with psychology than skill. Our fearless leader will figure it out.


Agree,just disgusting to see posters dog out our team this way.To call out kyle is just ridiculous.Look at what this great team player has done for our program over the last 4 yrs.Nolan will also look back at this and see he was trying to do too much as it looks like he feels it is all on him and trying to take on too much.Geesh these young guys (and they are kids)will learn and move on.Lets have more class than those posters over at that other shade of blue's site,come on guys.Also do you think we can expect to bring in real elite inside scorers like tony parker when you consistently dog out our ability to "not" get the bigs involved in the games.If mason showed a consistent inside game(and he is far from that)then i could understand but he is still learning and is'nt quite there to comand the ball as much as some would like.JMO and always GO DUKE!!!

[wilko]

I was pretty disappointed last night and still today I'm a bit out of sorts.

Duke lost, but we werent outplayed. We had some bad bounces, but we were right there and had chances to pull it out.

Random Notes:

Ryan - Yer a Soph - yer name aint Kyle... after all those 3pt shots clanked off the rim do more dirving and shot faking. Recognize when something isnt working. Good D however, so I'll cut you *some* slack

Miles - Great block! Dont think about the shot so much - just play!

Mason - He should be on a milk carton. No one was really looking for him when he had it working and he had some NICE moves. Then in crunch time he stopped calling for the ball. Still made some nice passes tho.

Andre' - Good to see you again my friend. Way to pick up some of the slack from Seth.

Seth - Emotionally charged eve. for him. I suppose it proves it he still has some growing to do. I will contine to back and support him. This young man will learn and grow from this..

[RockyMtDevil]

It's funny how things change so fast in the ACC. Two months ago UNC was on the bubble and Duke looked like a force and now UNC is going to win the freakin league and we appear to be limpin into March with 2 scorers and not a viable third option on a nightly basis.

I can't believe Carolina can win the league with a win over us on Saturday, makes me want to vomit.

[lotusland]

I am firmly in the camp of "next play"

There is no way that K doesn't use the VPI game as teaching and motivational material to direct our final push to a championship this year.

I know a back to back title is rare. But imo, last night's result made it more likely, not less.

Why is VT called VPI on this board? I've tried but I can't figure it out.

[Acymetric]

Why is VT called VPI on this board? I've tried but I can't figure it out.

Virginia Tech is short for Virginia Polytechnic Institute.

[loldevilz]

My point is we are better off now than we were a year ago. After the Maryland loss last year, I had very similar discussions with posters who thought our team stunk and had no chance to get past the Sweet 16.

Really you had similar discussions with posters about how we don't have a third scorer, and how our big man lacked toughness on the boards? Of course that wouldn't happen because we were good on the boards last year and had a reliable third scorer.

As a matter of fact, I wasn't mad about the Maryland loss last year. And I still think this team has very good chance to get back on track. If Singler stops slumping, Mason gets more touches, and Kyrie Irving comes back I think we are good to go.

[NashvilleDevil]

It's funny how things change so fast in the ACC. Two months ago UNC was on the bubble and Duke looked like a force and now UNC is going to win the freakin league and we appear to be limpin into March with 2 scorers and not a viable third option on a nightly basis.

I can't believe Carolina can win the league with a win over us on Saturday, makes me want to vomit.

Let's not hand it to Carolina just yet. Maryland always seems to play UNC tough in Chapel Hill. And i think Duke bounces back in a big way in next week's games.

[Dopeshop]

After decades of living with the wonders of duke bball, i thought i had mastered the necessity of "next play " ,"turn the page " and other survival skills. But i can't shake last night's fold job.

I've heard 4 interviews during the past week in which the theme is the improvement duke is making with each game and practice. Last night was a huge step backwards----pick your stat--seth,nolan- 2 assists, ryan's misses, unable to get a shot in the last minute, delaney's poor game ,the other team shooting 40% on ft's ,stuck on 51 forever and unable to increase the lead in 4 tries,and on it goes.

Also ,kyle "is" in a slump ,compared to his marvelous abilities we've been treated to for 4 years . He seems unsure and fumbles the ball on a regular basis.

I am a huge fan of coach k's devotion to senior leadership---how about thomas ,zoubs and scheyer for example . Last night our seniors were woeful on leadership.

This team will be back and after a prozac or two,so will i.but folks this one is hard.st john's was easy compared to what i'm feeling as the ides of march approach.things weren't helped by dozens of vt shirts at the gym this morning ,all with a smart retort.

[lotusland]

Virginia Tech is short for Virginia Polytechnic Institute.

Thanks I had never heard that and I have a friend who is a VT grad.

[MCFinARL]

Thanks I had never heard that and I have a friend who is a VT grad.

If I'm not mistaken, it used to be called VPI by most folks. But the university has worked in recent years to promote the Virginia Tech name, probably as a branding thing. (Maybe it was too easy to confuse VPI and VMI?)

[Delaware]

agree, Chris. how about Mason's free throws in the clutch?

who WAS that Plumlee? IMHO, the best surprise in a sad game. he kept his focus and executed.

Free throws in the clutch? he made one of two and if he had made the second one, it would have made it a 1 point game... then when we foul even if they make both, we can tie with a 3 and go to overtime.

I think we need to feed Mason more and he can score inside, but he is a liability at the line of almost Henson proportions at the end of games if we are in the lead or trying to catch up.

[MChambers]

If I'm not mistaken, it used to be called VPI by most folks. But the university has worked in recent years to promote the Virginia Tech name, probably as a branding thing. (Maybe it was too easy to confuse VPI and VMI?)

Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University

The official name, taken from the website.

http://www.vt.edu/

[Chris Randolph]

This is, perhaps, the most interesting post I've ever read. If only because:

(1) 2 of those 3 "reliable scorers/defenders/winners" suited up last evening [and combined for a more than respectable 40 points].
(2) 1 of those 3 "reliable scorers/defenders/winners" is positively in the running for NPOY.
(3) 1 of those 3 "reliable scorers/defenders/winners" is positively in the running for an All-American team even despite the fact his numbers are [I]slightly down, which I'd argue is largely attributable/a function of his 3pt shooting.
(4) The 2009-2010 squad - at this very point in the year - had 4 losses [with a 5th shortly to come], to 2010-11's 3. I believe 2009-2010 was still rewarded a #1 seed, as well.
(5) [I'll stop for brevity's sake]

I think, Chicken Little, it advisable to temper your pessimism. I, for one, plan to heed the great Satchel Paige's advice:

There is a big difference in having 2 all american caliber players as opposed to 3, very big difference as a matter of fact

1) you are right, 2 of those 3 suited up last night. The one who didn't was an All American and had a player of the year season in the ACC a year ago. That makes 3 all americans on a team as compared to 2

2) exactly. That guy (although he wasn't as good a year ago, but was still very good) played last year

3) most outstanding player in the tourney a year ago so obviously he was playing at a very high level (higher than what he is playing now)

4) overall tougher schedule last year (ACC was tougher last year)

And to quote Ricky Bobby who was quoting the late great Colonel Sanders "I'm too drunk to taste this chicken."

My point all year has been since Kyrie was known to be out for good is that last years team is better than this years. As stated above we had 3 All American caliber players as opposed to 2. That is very unique and very difficult to defend and score against. I WOULD RATHER HAVE 3 GUYS I KNOW CAN SCORE THAN 2 GUYS AND MAYBE A DIFFERENT 3RD SCORER (consistency). And it is not just the scoring of the 3 players, its how they understood to play off each other and play the game. They all 3 were winners and been apart of many many games. I've stated that the experience, character and maturity of last year's team gives them an advantage. Zoubek and Thomas were better defenders (blocking shots is not all of post defense) and rebounders (offensive and defensive). Also, think about Miles blown putbacks last night, Zoubs and LT don't do that stuff, they find the most efficient way to finish. Little things like that add up to big things. All those things combined with 3 all american caliber players, a great coach and some luck add up to a national championship :)

[Kedsy]

It's funny how things change so fast in the ACC. Two months ago UNC was on the bubble and Duke looked like a force and now UNC is going to win the freakin league and we appear to be limpin into March with 2 scorers and not a viable third option on a nightly basis.

Oh, come on. UNC may have a chance to win the "freakin league," but our chances are still a lot better.

On a national level Duke is still a force and, frankly, if there is such a thing as a bubble in December, UNC wasn't really on it.

We've won 7 of our last 8 games coming into March. If that's what you define as "limpin," then perhaps you need to consult a dictionary.

And finally, I'm tired of hearing about how we don't have a "viable third option." Where is it written that the scoring has to be distributed that way? Last year we had three big scorers and nobody else contributed much at all, and so many posters here complained that we were playing "3 on 5," and how we'd never be able to compete in the NCCAT unless our bigs started scoring. But now, when our scoring is more evenly distributed from our third through sixth scorers, that's a bad thing?

Last season, our third through sixth scorers totaled 33.0 points per game, on average. This year (not counting Kyrie), our third through sixth scorers total 31.6 ppg. So what are you complaining about?


Really you had similar discussions with posters about how we don't have a third scorer, and how our big man lacked toughness on the boards? Of course that wouldn't happen because we were good on the boards last year and had a reliable third scorer.

Well, the discussions I had were about us playing "3 on 5" and getting no offense from our bigs. And how our shot selection was poor and how we always threw up contested threes when the game was on the line and how one of our top guys was in a shooting slump and shouldn't be jacking up all those threes (although in that case it was Jon they were talking about, not Kyle). And how after the loss we had no chance at a #1 seed and might even slip to a #3.

And about countering negative posts like:


I'm glad everyone's so philosophical. I'm not. If we were a No. 1-type seed as pages of speculation on this BB have maintained, we should have won. Period. We have a lousy record on the road this year, and while tournament games are not road games, they aren't home games either. This was a real disapointment.

Its back to reality, and my original goal not to flame out before the Sweet Sixteen.

So, while I didn't literally have the exact same conversation after the Maryland game, the conversations were similar, which is what I said.


As a matter of fact, I wasn't mad about the Maryland loss last year.

Oh? Here is what you actually said after the game:


just the worst...that's all I can say.

[Kedsy]

My point all year has been since Kyrie was known to be out for good is that last years team is better than this years. As stated above we had 3 All American caliber players as opposed to 2. That is very unique and very difficult to defend and score against. I WOULD RATHER HAVE 3 GUYS I KNOW CAN SCORE THAN 2 GUYS AND MAYBE A DIFFERENT 3RD SCORER (consistency). And it is not just the scoring of the 3 players, its how they understood to play off each other and play the game. They all 3 were winners and been apart of many many games. I've stated that the experience, character and maturity of last year's team gives them an advantage. Zoubek and Thomas were better defenders (blocking shots is not all of post defense) and rebounders (offensive and defensive). Also, think about Miles blown putbacks last night, Zoubs and LT don't do that stuff, they find the most efficient way to finish. Little things like that add up to big things. All those things combined with 3 all american caliber players, a great coach and some luck add up to a national championship :)

It can also add up to a Sweet 16 or Elite Eight loss. If a couple of our late threes had rimmed out against Baylor, would you be singing the praises of last year's configuration so loudly? I can't say about you, in particular, but a great many posters spent the majority of the season complaining about last year's team and finding fault with the very qualities that you say are so critical now.

Each team is different, and in my opinion you shouldn't judge a team solely on its last game (good or bad). Unfortunately, too many posters around here do just that.

And while you make it quite clear what you would rather have, speaking for my own preference I think a team where any of five people can score is preferable to a team where only three out of five can.

[bird]

Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University

The official name, taken from the website.

http://www.vt.edu/

Here in the Old Dominion, "VPI" is sometimes used with irony as a commentary on VaTech's rebranding effort. VaTech has in fact been upgrading all the way around, and the implicit put-down, while fun, is weak as a factual matter. VaTech is a strong institution in many specific areas with a history of providing opportunity and a justifiably loyal alumni base.

[Chris Randolph]

It can also add up to a Sweet 16 or Elite Eight loss. If a couple of our late threes had rimmed out against Baylor, would you be singing the praises of last year's configuration so loudly? I can't say about you, in particular, but a great many posters spent the majority of the season complaining about last year's team and finding fault with the very qualities that you say are so critical now.

Each team is different, and in my opinion you shouldn't judge a team solely on its last game (good or bad). Unfortunately, too many posters around here do just that.

And while you make it quite clear what you would rather have, speaking for my own preference I think a team where any of five people can score is preferable to a team where only three out of five can.

Fair enough, if last years season ends against Baylor or without a title then maybe my opinion isn't so strong. But the fact that it did end with a national title speaks to the quality of last year's team (and like I said some luck)

I understand your preference of 5 over 3 but the problem with our 5 is they are inconsistent and limited offensively (minus Nolan and Kyle). You knew with the three S's what you were going to get each night. I can't stress having 3 really really good players being huge. You can't stop all 3 (see Baylor). If Kyle shoots like that in a game in this years tourney, our chances of winning are so slim because we don't have that 3rd versatile, consistent scorer.

[diveonthefloor]

Hey, y'all....

Do you realize how many college hoops fans would give their right hand, left hand, legs, eyesight, and just about anything else to have a team which is 26-3, approaching a great seed in the NCAA, doing almost all of this without their best playmaker, and expecting said best playmaker back from injury any time now????:confused:

Holy cow, I LIKE OUR SPOT!!!!
:cool:

[Kedsy]

Fair enough, if last years season ends against Baylor or without a title then maybe my opinion isn't so strong. But the fact that it did end with a national title speaks to the quality of last year's team (and like I said some luck)

I understand your preference of 5 over 3 but the problem with our 5 is they are inconsistent and limited offensively (minus Nolan and Kyle). You knew with the three S's what you were going to get each night. I can't stress having 3 really really good players being huge. You can't stop all 3 (see Baylor). If Kyle shoots like that in a game in this years tourney, our chances of winning are so slim because we don't have that 3rd versatile, consistent scorer.

I hear you, but obviously having three big scorers doesn't guarantee a victory in every game, either.

Please don't misunderstand me -- I am not putting down the quality of last year's team. I spent most of last season arguing with the naysayers and telling them we had a really good team. I predicted in the 2009 off-season that our 2009-10 team would be going to the Final Four and stuck to that prediction the entire season.

But I still like where we are right now better than I did a year ago at this time.

[Chris Randolph]

I hear you, but obviously having three big scorers doesn't guarantee a victory in every game, either.

Please don't misunderstand me -- I am not putting down the quality of last year's team. I spent most of last season arguing with the naysayers and telling them we had a really good team. I predicted in the 2009 off-season that our 2009-10 team would be going to the Final Four and stuck to that prediction the entire season.

But I still like where we are right now better than I did a year ago at this time.

Well your prediction worked last year so I'm going to trust that you are going to be right again :)

[Neals384]

If only Miles had made that half-courter at the end of the first half...no sure why but his desperation heave doesn't show up as a missed 3 pointer in the stats, so he is still perfect fror his career.

[mgtr]

Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University

The official name, taken from the website.

http://www.vt.edu/

Yes, I was a grad student there when they changed it. The most ridiculous of all the possible changes. The reason Virginia Tech is pushed (and was used before I was there) is that VPI&SU is just silly! Funny story: There was some parade, perhaps in Roanoke, and Nixon was there. A band went by and some aide handed him an ID card, probably scribbled and probably saying Virg Poly Inst, and Nixon said "Virginia Poly isn't it?" Maybe he was dyslexic. Or something.

[SMO]

I've had a good many hours to stew on the loss and I've got to say my frustration comes down to a few things:

1. The flow the of the game seemed to favor Duke. They had weathered the storm, took a good 6pt lead...then made a bunch of poor plays and decisions over the final 6 mintues.
2. Speaking of poor decisions, why didn't Kyle continue to attack and drive the paint and force more fouls on VPI? I understand shooting open or semi-open threes but he had so much success drawing fouls on the drive you'd think he might have gone back to that at least once or twice.
3. Why didn't anyone feed Mason for a post-up on Allen? Mason had proved he could score on the hook shot over Allen. Allen was most of VPI's offense, so why not force him to spend energy defending or get him in more foul trouble?

Weird game really, but if our guys make good decisions the rest of the way there's no reason they can't be as good a team as least year. That said, some of the criticism on the board is unreal. You'd think it was 2007 or worse. 26-3 is pretty good!

[Neals384]

Here in the Old Dominion, "VPI" is sometimes used with irony as a commentary on VaTech's rebranding effort. VaTech has in fact been upgrading all the way around, and the implicit put-down, while fun, is weak as a factual matter. VaTech is a strong institution in many specific areas with a history of providing opportunity and a justifiably loyal alumni base.

They may be re-branding, but when you graduate, you send your uncle one of these:
1880

Congratulations, Nephew Judd!

[dukelifer]

It's funny how things change so fast in the ACC. Two months ago UNC was on the bubble and Duke looked like a force and now UNC is going to win the freakin league and we appear to be limpin into March with 2 scorers and not a viable third option on a nightly basis.

I can't believe Carolina can win the league with a win over us on Saturday, makes me want to vomit.

Yep- things change very fast. And UNC could lose their point guard tonight on a freak injury. Stuff happens. Duke can only take care of their business. They beat UNC once- they have a shot to do it again. If UNC wins the league-so be it. With the unbalanced schedule - not even sure what it means anymore.

[DukeWarhead]

Sitting here sulking over a disappointing loss only made worse by seeing Maryland fail miserably in Chapel Hill has me stupidy angry.
Angry at whom? I dunno. All I know is that I this week will be a tense one for me, just hoping that our boys are as determined, angry, and focused as I hope they are - because if we don't clobber the baby blues I might pull my hair out.

How did I get wrapped so tightly around college basketball? Do I need to get a life - maybe so. But I guess its better to be passionate about something than not at all.

Seeing Kyrie back on the court would go a long way to subdue the anger.. I think.

You guys angry too? Worried? Excited?

Maybe I need to sequester myself until selection sunday. :mad:

[dukestheheat]

I am firmly in the camp of "next play"

There is no way that K doesn't use the VPI game as teaching and motivational material to direct our final push to a championship this year.

I know a back to back title is rare. But imo, last night's result made it more likely, not less.

.....and is the way we should all choose to look at this loss. Certainly its disconcerting to see the team go down the way it went down, but again based on history, Duke is going to rebound very well and bounce off of this one! I did say the same thing right after our St. John's loss and look at what we did to Maryland at Maryland! and then to the six other teams in a row.

Duke is poised and they will rise up!

SUPERMAN will keep us going! LET'S GO!

dth.

[moonpie23]

you wouldn't be in here on this board if you weren't passionate about duke bb.....that said, i know how you feel... :( i get so immersed in the season and the team's every step and misstep.,... for me, it's made worse by my hatred for unc...i'm trying to shake that...i don't watch their games anymore, i don't get the alerts on them, and i try not to go to IC at all..

last year was manna from heaven......i knew that unc would be better this year, even tho i wanted them to fail.....that was an unrealistic expectation on MY part... :(

they are back....we're not quite what everyone was envisioning with Kyrie from the first few games......sigh..

guess we'll have to just wait it out and see what happens...

i love this team tho.... GO DUKE...

[brianl]

Did anybody get a good laugh out of the Tech player who they showed in the pregame huddle dancing around like a bench player.

Same guy after the game runs on the court and gives a camera (not ESPN) a face full.

The funny part is the guy never took his shooting shirt off the whole night.

Gotta love it.

[uh_no]

Did anybody get a good laugh out of the Tech player who they showed in the pregame huddle dancing around like a bench player.

Same guy after the game runs on the court and gives a camera (not ESPN) a face full.

The funny part is the guy never took his shooting shirt off the whole night.

Gotta love it.


team win. We talk on here about how seth was important to last year's team. No reason a bench guy on another team can't share in his team's success.

[elvis14]

Sitting here sulking over a disappointing loss only made worse by seeing Maryland fail miserably in Chapel Hill has me stupidy angry.
Angry at whom? I dunno. All I know is that I this week will be a tense one for me, just hoping that our boys are as determined, angry, and focused as I hope they are - because if we don't clobber the baby blues I might pull my hair out.

How did I get wrapped so tightly around college basketball? Do I need to get a life - maybe so. But I guess its better to be passionate about something than not at all.

Seeing Kyrie back on the court would go a long way to subdue the anger.. I think.

You guys angry too? Worried? Excited?

Maybe I need to sequester myself until selection sunday. :mad:

I always have different reactions to Duke games (both wins and losses) and like you I have asked myself tough introspective questions. I used to live and die by baseball games, Redskins Games and Duke games. I hardly watch baseball any more (still play softball), I still love my Redskins but I'm not passionate about them like I used to be. With Duke Basketball, however, I seem to be getting more passionate as I get older (I'm 43). I literally have had to tell myself to relax and enjoy the games. Like you, however, for some reason anger is the reaction I have to this loss. It's just pissing me off more than it should. A win over my alma mater (Clemson) and UNC@CH will help ease my anger nicely.

[dukelifer]

Sitting here sulking over a disappointing loss only made worse by seeing Maryland fail miserably in Chapel Hill has me stupidy angry.
Angry at whom? I dunno. All I know is that I this week will be a tense one for me, just hoping that our boys are as determined, angry, and focused as I hope they are - because if we don't clobber the baby blues I might pull my hair out.

How did I get wrapped so tightly around college basketball? Do I need to get a life - maybe so. But I guess its better to be passionate about something than not at all.

Seeing Kyrie back on the court would go a long way to subdue the anger.. I think.

You guys angry too? Worried? Excited?

Maybe I need to sequester myself until selection sunday. :mad:

Angry? No. I know that I am one of the luckiest fans in the world as I root for a team that has won it all several times and is often in the mix. If I was a fan of Clemson or Wake or Tech or BC or Miami or many, many others I would not be able to say that. Regardless of how Duke does in the regular season, you are only going to really remember the postseason and Duke could get on a roll- you never know- they have done it before and with less talent.

[tele]

Sitting here sulking over a disappointing loss only made worse by seeing Maryland fail miserably in Chapel Hill has me stupidy angry.
Angry at whom? I dunno. All I know is that I this week will be a tense one for me, just hoping that our boys are as determined, angry, and focused as I hope they are - because if we don't clobber the baby blues I might pull my hair out.

How did I get wrapped so tightly around college basketball? Do I need to get a life - maybe so. But I guess its better to be passionate about something than not at all.

Seeing Kyrie back on the court would go a long way to subdue the anger.. I think.

You guys angry too? Worried? Excited?

Maybe I need to sequester myself until selection sunday. :mad:

Well, I don't think you want to miss the upcoming games winding up the regular season and the ACC tournament do you? Enjoy the ride and getting to watch a uniquely talented coach trying to get his team ready to win Championships. This team still has a ways to go but one thing is for certain, this team still hasn't yet played it's best basketball. I'm very much looking foreward to seeing that and just how far they can go. And that will be fun to watch, if you are a Duke Fan.

[oldnavy]

Anybody else think this loss may actually be a good thing?? I like the idea now that the regular season comes down to the last game against UNC. I think that the pressure is going to be on the heels more so than us for these reasons:

- redemption of last year (although a ration fan base would agree that they have done this already)
- do not want to get swept by us
- potential to play into a 2 seed, and maybe even a 1 seed if they win the ACCT... don't laugh, they could have a strong argument depending on how the other conference tournaments shake out...
- no seniors really to speak of, but could be Henson or Barnes or boths last game at UNC-CH

I am just rambling on, but does this make any sense to anyone else? If not I will go back to work and shut up...

And for the benefit of Kong and the other UNC fans who post here, I am going on the record as saying that I think Roy has done a fine job this year both on the court an off. Although he will never be a favorite of mine, I do not mind giving the devil his due, he did a good job with this team. I do not think he should be coach of the year or anything considering that he has a ton of talent, but since I ragged on him so much last year when he stunk, I thought I would give him a nod for doing a decent job. I really do try to be relevant and somewhat objective.

[ncexnyc]

Anybody else think this loss may actually be a good thing?? I like the idea now that the regular season comes down to the last game against UNC. I think that the pressure is going to be on the heels more so than us for these reasons:

- redemption of last year (although a ration fan base would agree that they have done this already)
- do not want to get swept by us
- potential to play into a 2 seed, and maybe even a 1 seed if they win the ACCT... don't laugh, they could have a strong argument depending on how the other conference tournaments shake out...
- no seniors really to speak of, but could be Henson or Barnes or boths last game at UNC-CH

I am just rambling on, but does this make any sense to anyone else? If not I will go back to work and shut up...

And for the benefit of Kong and the other UNC fans who post here, I am going on the record as saying that I think Roy has done a fine job this year both on the court an off. Although he will never be a favorite of mine, I do not mind giving the devil his due, he did a good job with this team. I do not think he should be coach of the year or anything considering that he has a ton of talent, but since I ragged on him so much last year when he stunk, I thought I would give him a nod for doing a decent job. I really do try to be relevant and somewhat objective.

Don't we have a game Wednesday night?

[oldnavy]

Don't we have a game Wednesday night?

Guess I am just looking a little ahead to the regular season "championship" game. Probably should have waited until Thursday to post....

[ncexnyc]

Guess I am just looking a little ahead to the regular season "championship" game. Probably should have waited until Thursday to post....

No biggie. We're probably all thinking a bit ahead of ourselves. Hopefully the team isn't.

[oldnavy]

No biggie. We're probably all thinking a bit ahead of ourselves. Hopefully the team isn't.

I think most of the fans probably are, at least I know that I am (I am being honest here).

I doubt the team is.

The Clemson game could be a trap game with UNC and the "Championship" game being next, but since it is Nolan and Kyle's last game, I doubt that the players will have a problem focusing on the Tigers.

God, I hate to see those two kids go!! Both at one time or the other have been my FAVORITE Duke player, and even now it is hard for me to say which one I have enjoyed watching the most. Guess I'll call it a draw!