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View Full Version : MBB: Duke 79, Georgia Tech 57 Post-Game Thread



pfrduke
02-20-2011, 09:46 PM
Post your thoughts here.

CLW
02-20-2011, 09:51 PM
Tech is AWFUL. Their mugging/bruising style of play just makes for an awful game to watch.

Andre seems to be in a slump and his body language appeared to be off to me. Hopefully, he can turn it around.

Nolan is just on a TEAR. I'm afraid the media has already hopped on the Jimmer bandwagon though. Jimmer is a fine player but I don't think he sees the competition night in and night out.

DukieInBrasil
02-20-2011, 09:52 PM
Nolan = NPOY.
I'm worried that Nolan won't get the double crown of Points and Assist titles. Kendall Marshall had 8 vs BC and Nolan had 4 tonight, which mirrors the trend recently where KM has been dishing out more assists than Nolan. Ain't nobody gonna pass Nolan for the pts title though.
28 pts, 7 rebs, 4 assists, 2 steals. NPOY-like stats.
Props to Kyle for putting together a pretty nice game after his disaster last time out, he missed a couple of shots at the end that dragged down his FG%.
Props to Ryan (10pts 6rebs), Seth (9pts 6assists) and Mason, who nearly snagged a 2x-double with 9pts and 9rebs. Tyler had a pretty nice game too. Dre was MIA, again.

MChambers
02-20-2011, 09:53 PM
This game reminded me that I really don't like Hewitt's style of play. Always happy to not have a serious injury when playing GT. (I still blame Hewitt, among others, for Duke not winning in 2004, after Ewing got taken down by a GT player. Not that I bear grudges.)

Excellent performance by Duke, however. Smith, MP2, Kyle, Curry, Thornton, and Kelly all played well. MP1 didn't play all that much. Andre didn't play much or well, I'm sorry to see. Hope he turns it around like he did late last year.

downeastdad
02-20-2011, 09:55 PM
Any thoughts on Shumpert's forearm just before K's T? Didn't look like a foul on Thornton to me.

Wander
02-20-2011, 09:55 PM
Nolan is just on a TEAR. I'm afraid the media has already hopped on the Jimmer bandwagon though. Jimmer is a fine player but I don't think he sees the competition night in and night out.

I'm not sure Duke's schedule is even better than BYU's, honestly.

What is true though is that Nolan is a FAR better defender than Jimmer.

Dr. Tina
02-20-2011, 09:58 PM
I'm not sure Duke's schedule is even better than BYU's, honestly.

What is true though is that Nolan is a FAR better defender than Jimmer.

Preach it! Nolan is a far more complete package than the Jimmer!

SCMatt33
02-20-2011, 10:01 PM
This was quite interesting for a 22 point game. GTech really bothered us with their physicality for the first ten minutes. Duke took a couple of stupid fouls from behind jump shooter early on that helped them out, but they really called the game loosely until Coach K got the technical. Those two consecutive calls that led to it were pretty bad, but I didn't have a problem with the officiating before then in general (even if there was an individual wrong call before then). After Coach K got the technical, the whistles really tightened up and all of those borderline bumps that were let go became fouls. Once Shumpert and Rice got 2 fouls each, this game was pretty much over.

I'm not sure what to make of it yet, but this was Duke's fourth poor start in a row, getting behind Georgia Tech, Virgina, Miami, and UNC early. Only UNC got a big lead, but it's something to keep an eye on. I suspect that it's just a little lull in the middle of the semester, as we've gotten off to some great starts this year.

I don't know if the ESPN box score is right yet, but only 6 guys played ten minutes. Miles and Dre played 9 each. Tyler played 24. Who would have guessed that around new years.

dukebballcamper90-91
02-20-2011, 10:01 PM
this is kinda like adam morrison vs jj. The media hates Duke. No way Jimmer should win this over Nolan if Nolan continues playing at this level. I know the ACC is down but it is still the best basketball conference out there and Nolan is smashing the comp.

hotbutteredseoul
02-20-2011, 10:02 PM
Lots of good stuff happened this game (obviously), but Curry's development into a confident ballhandler and able distributor was really on show against the ball pressure that Georgia Tech likes to (try to) put on perimeter guys. Early in the year, Curry didn't look like he had the confidence in his handle to take any heat off Nolan against teams that pressure the ball, but today he was EXCELLENT in his dribbling and his decision making.

When Curry plays like this, Nolan doesn't have to deal with the stress of being the sole distributor and can play a more relaxed game without worrying about the balance between shooting and getting other guys involved. An efficient 9 points and 6 assists with only ONE turnover today for Curry shows the development of his all-around game that K has been pushing for all year. Great, great game.

pfrduke
02-20-2011, 10:03 PM
This was quite interesting for a 22 point game. GTech really bothered us with their physicality for the first ten minutes. Duke took a couple of stupid fouls from behind jump shooter early on that helped them out, but they really called the game loosely until Coach K got the technical. Those two consecutive calls that led to it were pretty bad, but I didn't have a problem with the officiating before then in general (even if there was an individual wrong call before then). After Coach K got the technical, the whistles really tightened up and all of those borderline bumps that were let go became fouls. Once Shumpert and Rice got 2 fouls each, this game was pretty much over.

I'm not sure what to make of it yet, but this was Duke's fourth poor start in a row, getting behind Georgia Tech, Virgina, Miami, and UNC early. Only UNC got a big lead, but it's something to keep an eye on. I suspect that it's just a little lull in the middle of the semester, as we've gotten off to some great starts this year.

I don't know if the ESPN box score is right yet, but only 6 guys played ten minutes. Miles and Dre played 9 each. Tyler played 24. Who would have guessed that around new years.

Hard to say it was loosely called when the foul on Tyler (before the 10 minute mark in the first half) was Duke's 7th.

Saratoga2
02-20-2011, 10:03 PM
This was clearly a physical game with a lot of heavy bumping. It took time for our players to adjust, but adjust they did. It was another slow start for Duke.

Our lineup is becoming defined for the post season, provided of course Kyrie is not back.

Nolan just continues to play excellent ball, game after game and the good news is Kyle also played much better. I noticed he stayed away from the 3 point shot tonight, trying to get the majority of his points inside. He was much more active and played a lot smarter than against Virginia. Mason has made strides and seems capable of a double double instead of just rebounding. He is getting a few moves inside, which is part of his development. Ryan has also established himself as the second big. He has a knack for scoring and making smart plays. Miles at this time has the role of substituting for the others. Seth is also the starting point guard/shooting guard. He can score and has quick hands and has improved in every way. Tyler is pushing him, especially when the game gets tough and physical. It was great to see Tyler putting up some points tonight.

It is really too bad, but Dawkins had another subpar game. I am wondering if he can pull out of the slide he has been on. Hairston is relagated to a substitute as he develops his game, but has a lot of upside.

Nice win for 893 for coach K.

loran16
02-20-2011, 10:16 PM
FTR, for those piping the Nolan v Jimmer argument, defense is accounted for in Ken Pomeroy's player of the year formula, which is a neutral arbiter.

It has as of last weekend Fredette first, Sullinger 2, and Nolan 3. http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/the_kpoy_with_freshmen/

camion
02-20-2011, 10:17 PM
Good solid game by the team. Nolan continues to be stellar and Seth has settled nicely into a starter's role.

I just want to throw this out there like Glen Rice did. On his steal late in the game I was very impressed by the way he could take one dribble from half court and dunk the ball without walking. I only counted five steps.

SMO
02-20-2011, 10:21 PM
Hard to say it was loosely called when the foul on Tyler (before the 10 minute mark in the first half) was Duke's 7th.

The officating was just plain bad tonight. It's often inconsistent, but this was almost maliciously bad against Duke at times, then lazy in the second half. I'm glad no one got hurt after these guys swallowed the whistle on some clear fouls. They also seemed oblivious to some chippy play off the ball.

As for the game, it was good to see both Smith and Singler attacking and Mason aggressive at both ends. No one backed down to Tech's pot shots off the ball or their frequent un-called fouls in the paint. Tech is the rare bad team you don't want to play due to their physical style.

moonpie23
02-20-2011, 10:28 PM
schumpert should have been tossed from the game...his deliberate throw-down on T2 that got him his 3rd foul was only ONE of the malicious, bad sportsman plays he pulled tonight...

hewitt is a punk for not pulling him...

mapei
02-20-2011, 10:38 PM
schumpert should have been tossed from the game...his deliberate throw-down on T2 that got him his 3rd foul was only ONE of the malicious, bad sportsman plays he pulled tonight...

hewitt is a punk for not pulling him...

I agree.

On those two fouls that set K off, I can sort of see the first call, against Nolan; the guy flopped, but lots of refs miss that one. On the deliberate elbow to Tyler's throat, the Tech guy should have gotten a flagrant.

diveonthefloor
02-20-2011, 10:38 PM
schumpert should have been tossed from the game...his deliberate throw-down on T2 that got him his 3rd foul was only ONE of the malicious, bad sportsman plays he pulled tonight...

hewitt is a punk for not pulling him...

I can remember 4 distinct shoves by Shumpert on Tyler. One was called correctly.

What else can you expect from Karl Hess crew. Worst ref on this side of the Mississippi.

Nice to see K get angry enough to get the "T"....love the spirit!

OldPhiKap
02-20-2011, 10:41 PM
Lots of good stuff happened this game (obviously), but Curry's development into a confident ballhandler and able distributor was really on show against the ball pressure that Georgia Tech likes to (try to) put on perimeter guys. Early in the year, Curry didn't look like he had the confidence in his handle to take any heat off Nolan against teams that pressure the ball, but today he was EXCELLENT in his dribbling and his decision making.

When Curry plays like this, Nolan doesn't have to deal with the stress of being the sole distributor and can play a more relaxed game without worrying about the balance between shooting and getting other guys involved. An efficient 9 points and 6 assists with only ONE turnover today for Curry shows the development of his all-around game that K has been pushing for all year. Great, great game.

Yup, yup, yup.

cptnflash
02-20-2011, 10:45 PM
Any thoughts on Shumpert's forearm just before K's T? Didn't look like a foul on Thornton to me.

Was definitely a foul on Thornton, but also should have been a foul on Shumpert. In fact, Shumpert arguably could have been tossed. Regardless of what has happened prior, you can't elbow/forearm someone in the jaw/neck, which is what Shumpert did. When the whistle first blew on that play, I thought the foul was called on Shumpert and he would probably be ejected. When I found out what the actual call was... well, let's just say that if there was a ref in my living room, I would have been T'd up too.

cptnflash
02-20-2011, 10:54 PM
FTR, for those piping the Nolan v Jimmer argument, defense is accounted for in Ken Pomeroy's player of the year formula, which is a neutral arbiter.

It has as of last weekend Fredette first, Sullinger 2, and Nolan 3. http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/the_kpoy_with_freshmen/

Thank you for injecting some rationality into the POY discussion.

For those saying that there's no way Jimmer is deserving because he plays against weaker competition, I suggest you look at Duke's strength of schedule this year. Through no fault of our own, it is way below our usual standard because our "signature" non-conference opponents have turned out to be lame (I'm looking at you, Michigan State and Kansas State) and the ACC is having a down year (I think someone earlier said it's still the best conference out there, which is just obviously false). I love Nolan, and I would really love for SOMEONE from last year's national championship team to have their jersey retired, which as we all know requires winning some kind of national POY honor, but dissing Jimmer based on SoS (or anything else) is misguided. The fact is that it's a three horse race, and we're lucky to have one of the horses. But Jimmer is the truth, and unless the stats change meaningfully he will probably win because he's been slightly better than Nolan and Jared Sullinger, and it's a way better story.

Merlindevildog91
02-20-2011, 10:55 PM
made me long for Dick Paparo.

I would hope Hank Nichols (he is still the head honcho of ACC officiating, right?) will show the time up until the technical as a primer as to how NOT to officiate. The call on Thornton was the last straw for Coach K, but there were lots of terrible calls and no-calls in this one.

That being said, I think Kyle is coming around. Nolan played his usual terrific game. Ryan Kelly continues to make the big plays that don't show always show up in the box score. Seth looked good. I am very happy as to his confidence level in all aspects of his game. Now Andre needs to get his stroke back. When he gets his stroke back, the rest of his game will follow. (Yes, I know he should play defense and be confident and make good passes, etc., whether or not he is hitting his shot, but he hasn't gotten to that stage yet.)

rthomas
02-20-2011, 11:01 PM
made me long for Dick Paparo.


I think you mean Lenny Wertz.

Merlindevildog91
02-20-2011, 11:05 PM
I think you mean Lenny Wertz.

Well, actually, no. I meant Dick Paparo, the only ref I can remember who had his own specific cheers.

But I'm not sure either of them would have been any worse tonight than Karl Hess.

taiw93
02-20-2011, 11:06 PM
In my opinion, the play right before the T should have been a foul on Tyler, and a technical foul on Shumpert. Either way, though, I'm happy the technical happened. It changed the tide of the officiating (and, most importantly, the game), and demonstrated why K is such a great basketball psychologist. And though Shumpert was overly rough on Tyler throughout the game, I do hope that his finger is OK. It looked like a dislocation to me (just based on the replay and his reaction to the injury), and those hurt A LOT.

Overall, I thought Duke played very well today. Nolan was, as usual, stellar (man, he's spoiling us), Kyle had another solid, workmanlike performance, Seth put together another fantastic all-around game (he's looking like our starting PG next year, IMO - he has great court vision), Tyler played great D and facilitated well, and Mason played well also. This team is steadily improving as a unit.

cspan37421
02-20-2011, 11:16 PM
Well, actually, no. I meant Dick Paparo, the only ref I can remember who had his own specific cheers.

But I'm not sure either of them would have been any worse tonight than Karl Hess.

a) "Lenny, you're the Wirtz!"
b) see Valentine, Ted

Merlindevildog91
02-20-2011, 11:17 PM
a) "Lenny, you're the Wirtz!"
b) see Valentine, Ted

I didn't say there weren't other cheers, just that Mr. Paparo's stuck in my mind to the exclusion of all others. I am a Crustie at this juncture, after all.

Acymetric
02-20-2011, 11:18 PM
FTR, for those piping the Nolan v Jimmer argument, defense is accounted for in Ken Pomeroy's player of the year formula, which is a neutral arbiter.

It has as of last weekend Fredette first, Sullinger 2, and Nolan 3. http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/the_kpoy_with_freshmen/

To be fair, Ken admits (http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/introducing_the_kpoy/) that the formula (Dean Oliver's stops method) isn't perfect.



The drawback is that it’s difficult to measure defensive value. But the work on the preseason ratings indicates that the “stops method” is better than ignoring defense altogether, and that’s a start.

Whether the defensive talents that don't show up in the current method would account for the gap in their ratings is pretty much impossible to determine, but the possibility can't be discounted.

If your goal is to point out that Freddette is a legit contender to those who seem to think he isn't you're spot on (because he is), but it is a bit misleading to promote the defensive aspect of the kPOY rating without acknowledging that the defensive component isn't as proven and all-inclusive as the offensive component (meaning that advantages in defensive performance are not accounted for as well as advantages in offense are).

Merlindevildog91
02-20-2011, 11:20 PM
I echo some other posters who are singing the praises (here and elsewhere) of Seth Curry. Seth did a fine job when Nolan was on the bench of bringing the ball up court and passing to the open man. He has improved a lot from the beginning of the year with ball skills, with defense, with positioning, and in just about every way. Even when he was struggling mightily with his shot, he worked hard at the rest of his game.

SCMatt33
02-20-2011, 11:56 PM
Looking at the official box score, I was amazed at how we dominated the glass until the last 5 minutes. After that point, Mason fouled out and Duke was just trying not to foul and send them to the line.

For the game, Duke had 15 off rebounds and 41 total, while GTech had 16 offensive and 37 total. That translates to a 41.7% offensive rebounding for Duke and 38.1% offensive rebounding for GTech. The caveat is that in the last 5 minutes, which is a good approximation of garbage time for a game like this, GTech won the boards 12-3, including 7 offensive boards to just 1 for Duke. Before this time Duke was rebounding offensively at 46.7%, while holding GTech to just 27.3% for GTech. If that isn't owning the boards, I don't know what is.

hotbutteredseoul
02-21-2011, 12:05 AM
I echo some other posters who are singing the praises (here and elsewhere) of Seth Curry. Seth did a fine job when Nolan was on the bench of bringing the ball up court and passing to the open man. He has improved a lot from the beginning of the year with ball skills, with defense, with positioning, and in just about every way. Even when he was struggling mightily with his shot, he worked hard at the rest of his game.

I think the emergence of Seth as a playmaker is especially important given that the Plumlees (Mason in particular) only really thrive in the halfcourt offense when receiving feeds off the drive with the defense rotating. Until recently, though, we haven't been able to get the consistent penetration since Nolan was our only guy who could really get into the lane off the bounce. Defenses keyed in on that aspect of the offense (leading to those ugly occasions when we pass the ball around the perimeter for 25 seconds and then hoist a three). But with Seth willing to push the ball and force defensive rotations, that opens up a LOT of the opportunities for Mason in particular to catch the ball moving through the paint, where he is really successful because of his good hands and great ups. This is what made us such a juggernaut when Kyrie was handling the ball a lot. It's GREAT to see us get back to that beautiful offense, and it's largely due to Seth's confidence as a ball-handler.

Johnboy
02-21-2011, 12:17 AM
In my opinion, the play right before the T should have been a foul on Tyler, and a technical foul on Shumpert. Either way, though, I'm happy the technical happened. It changed the tide of the officiating (and, most importantly, the game), and demonstrated why K is such a great basketball psychologist. .

The second Shumpert elbowed Thornton in the throat, I said to my friend "Georgia Tech is dead. They are about to be utterly destroyed." I was recalling the Clemson game years ago in which Trajan Langdon was hit (and had to leave the game for a while). We went on an absolute tear and dismantled Clemson in that game.

Tonight, Coach K stood up for his player and team, got the tech, and the players did the rest. I'm not saying every Duke team is capable of doing this to an opponent or even that this team is capable of doing it to anyone - but Georgia Tech should know better than to incite this team at home when they had everything going for them up to that point. I think we win this game anyway, but after the technical, it was all Duke, with gusto.

Olympic Fan
02-21-2011, 12:47 AM
made me long for Dick Paparo.

I would hope Hank Nichols (he is still the head honcho of ACC officiating, right?) will show the time up until the technical as a primer as to how NOT to officiate. The call on Thornton was the last straw for Coach K, but there were lots of terrible calls and no-calls in this one.



You are confusing Hank Nichols with John Clougherty (who replaced Fred Barakat as the ACC director of officials after 2005).

Nichols was one of the all-time great ACC officials, who later served for many years as the NCAA director of officials (which meant he oversaw the NCAA Tournament, but had little input in regular season officiating -- the conferences ove5rsee that).

BTW, Nichols was just nominated for the Naismith HOF this past week (the same nomination list that stiffed Reggie Miller while listing the stiff Dennis Rodman).

Bad crew tonight -- I had a flashback to the 2004 Duke-Tech game in Cameron where Karl Hess T'd up K and helped the Jackets win. Hess didn't call the T tonight, but he was part of the problem.

The first thing I did when I got home was to go to the DVR and check out the sequence that set off K. I diagreed with the charge call on Nolan, but I'm biased and I can see where you can argue the call.

But the "foul" on Tyler that drew the T -- and happened directly in front of Coach K -- was unbelievable. Shumpert delivered a forearm shiver to Thornton's head and the foul was on Tyler!

Worse was Tim Brando's commentary. As he's calling the play realtime, he responds to the whistle by calling it an offensive foul on Shumpert (which it clearly was). When he realizes that the foul is on Thornton he sounds surprised -- but when they show the replay, he decides that the foul is on Tyler after all. From that point on, he claims that K wasn't upset about the Shumpert/Thornton foul, but got the technical because he was still mad about the charge on Nolan at the other end of the floor.

My other favorite part was the halftime paeon to Sundat night's in Cameron (this is the last year Fox Sports has the package) and how great they are and how everybody looks forward and loves the Sunday night games.

Then postgame, Coach K goes on a tirade about how awful Sunday night games are and how the players and the fans hate them! He argued that the games ought to be played on Saturday.

It was great.

Greg_Newton
02-21-2011, 12:49 AM
"It just happened so fast. ... They got a couple of breakaways and the crowd got into it," Miller said. "Then we got a couple of silly fouls, and the next thing you know they were up 20. It's a good thing to keep fighting, but it's highly unlikely that you'll come back on a Duke team when you're down by 20."

Amen!:D

Nolan is a the greatest, Mason is getting better every game. Good stuff.

Kedsy
02-21-2011, 12:59 AM
I think the emergence of Seth as a playmaker is especially important given that the Plumlees (Mason in particular) only really thrive in the halfcourt offense when receiving feeds off the drive with the defense rotating. Until recently, though, we haven't been able to get the consistent penetration since Nolan was our only guy who could really get into the lane off the bounce. Defenses keyed in on that aspect of the offense (leading to those ugly occasions when we pass the ball around the perimeter for 25 seconds and then hoist a three). But with Seth willing to push the ball and force defensive rotations, that opens up a LOT of the opportunities for Mason in particular to catch the ball moving through the paint, where he is really successful because of his good hands and great ups. This is what made us such a juggernaut when Kyrie was handling the ball a lot. It's GREAT to see us get back to that beautiful offense, and it's largely due to Seth's confidence as a ball-handler.

Well, I thought Seth played a good game, but I didn't notice him penetrating all that much. Nor did Mason thrive tonight because of passes from Seth, who assisted on only one of Mason's four baskets (the other three were assisted by Andre, Kyle, and Tyler). Four of Seth's six assists were on jumpers by Kyle or Nolan (and one was on a Nolan layup).

Seth has improved his confidence and his ballhandling, but he doesn't drive very much, and his style doesn't seem anything close to Kyrie's. I can't help but think your comments are more wishful thinking than reality.

Kedsy
02-21-2011, 01:05 AM
But the "foul" on Tyler that drew the T -- and happened directly in front of Coach K -- was unbelievable. Shumpert delivered a forearm shiver to Thornton's head and the foul was on Tyler!

I think the foul on Tyler came before the forearm. On the replay, it certainly looked like Tyler bumped Shumpert a couple times before Shumpert raised his arm. I'm also not at all convinced the forearm was intentional, and my guess is there was at least some acting on Tyler's part.

From my perspective, K drew the T on purpose to (a) cow the officials a little bit (which if true, seemed to work); and (b) to fire up the team (ditto).

-bdbd
02-21-2011, 02:27 AM
I think the foul on Tyler came before the forearm. On the replay, it certainly looked like Tyler bumped Shumpert a couple times before Shumpert raised his arm. I'm also not at all convinced the forearm was intentional, and my guess is there was at least some acting on Tyler's part.

From my perspective, K drew the T on purpose to (a) cow the officials a little bit (which if true, seemed to work); and (b) to fire up the team (ditto).

I just watched the replay of that sequence a couple times on the DVR and, as G-man points out, very often it is actually the preceding play/call that leads to the technical. K had reacted angrily to the charge call against Smith (note: it wasn't the first time in the first 10 minutes that that same ref had a couple "close" calls go against Duke). But it looked like K said something at the ref on that side as they came back up the court. It could have been just as easily that the the REF made the Thornton call that was either (A) A statement aimed at K, or (B) He made an emotional call (against Duke, in the person of Tyler) after being angry at K.

In any event, while I won't deny the possibility, I'm not big on "conspiracy" theories and it appeared on the replay that K was just simply spontaneously angry at a pair of lousy calls by a certain ref. It also would seem like an odd time to "intenionally" get a T, to supposedly fire up your own team -- right after they just made a big comeback to get back into a close game -- though the 4 FT's suddenly put Tech back in charge, albeit fairly briefly.

I thought that a foul could have been called on Tyler as he struggled to wedge himself in front of the screen. But it wasn't. The whistle came after a brief pause and then Shumpert re-initiated contact - probably out of anger/frustration at TT - with a forearm to the neck area. At any rate, Tyler clearly had two feet firmly planted at contact and there's just no defense of a foul call on TT at that point. Good thing that it ultimately didn't matter.

Nice little gut-check for Duke tonight. Now, I can't wait to see those polls come out!


P.S. Brando really is bad. He just misses so many obvious things, or just plain contradicts himself seconds apart... I can almost hear Gminski cringe sometimes as he tries to figure out how he's going to bail the guy out yet again. G-man sure has a load to carry with that dolt at the mike beside him...

Reilly
02-21-2011, 07:04 AM
"Smith is averaging 21.7 points per game this season. Only Danny Ferry (1989) and J.J. Redick (2005, 2006) have had higher averages during Krzyzewski’s tenure."

Nolan 21.7 out of 83 points per game for Duke = 26%
JJ 06 26.8/81.1 = 33%
JJ 05 21.8/78.2 = 28%
DF 89 22.6/86.5 = 26%

I was surprised to see the 1989 team scored as much as it did ... I was thinking Danny's percentage of overall team points would have been higher.

cascadedevil
02-21-2011, 08:21 AM
I was at the game last night, and the Crazies continue to be in fantastic, loud and jubilant form. I offer my congratulations to the students who have really stepped up this year.

All of the board discussion about how physical the game was does not even do justice to what I saw in the first half. A number of ACC teams take physical play to the edge (e.g. Florida State), but there were at least 5 plays in the first half where it looked like the GT players were trying to injure Kyle or Nolan (e.g. the shove to Kyle's back under the basket that sent him flying and was not even called for a foul).

That being said, I could not figure out how Shumpert hurt his hand. It looked like he was just standing on the perimeter being guarded by Thornton and then all of a sudden he was on the floor in obvious pain. Was anyone able to see on replay what happened?

Papa John
02-21-2011, 08:27 AM
That being said, I could not figure out how Shumpert hurt his hand. It looked like he was just standing on the perimeter being guarded by Thornton and then all of a sudden he was on the floor in obvious pain. Was anyone able to see on replay what happened?

He jammed his finger on Thornton's hand while making a pass; the kind of play I like to call 'karmic justice'. The basketball gods were watching Shumpert's antics all game, and were clearly not pleased when his elbow to Tyler's face resulted in a personal on Tyler and a technical on our bench, so late in the second half they came calling to settle the debt. ;)

SMO
02-21-2011, 08:36 AM
My other favorite part was the halftime paeon to Sundat night's in Cameron (this is the last year Fox Sports has the package) and how great they are and how everybody looks forward and loves the Sunday night games.

Speaking of the coverage, did anyone else enjoy the commentary about how this is the last Sunday night game on FSN? The only thing that topped it was the pop-up Al Horford heads in the middle of one of the graphics.

DevilWearsPrada
02-21-2011, 08:38 AM
He jammed his finger on Thornton's hand while making a pass; the kind of play I like to call 'karmic justice'. The basketball gods were watching Shumpert's antics all game, and were clearly not pleased when his elbow to Tyler's face resulted in a personal on Tyler and a technical on our bench, so late in the second half they came calling to settle the debt. ;)

Thats the Law of Sewing and Reaping (Galatians chapter 6)

I still cant believe the foul was called on Tyler and Shumpert got the FTs, and Bryan Kersey calling the "T" on Coach. 4 points ...Bumble Bees can thank ref Kersey for that. Then Shumpert jammed his finger, and was doubled over in pain, in the 2nd half. Shumpert was a dirty player, and in the first half, the refs let him get by it. He sewed Bad Seeds, and received a Harvest in the 2nd half.

NEXT Play, NEXT game!

Go Duke!

RoyalBlue08
02-21-2011, 08:40 AM
I for one will not miss FSN what so ever. The production quality of these games is far inferior to ESPN or CBS. And I agree with Coach K as far as Sunday night games in general are concerned. Not great for the student athletes, not great for the fans. Let's get rid of 'em!

sdotbarbee
02-21-2011, 08:56 AM
First off let me say the charge called on Nolan was a terrible call, he didn't push off or extend his arm like the ref claimed. You can argue the foul the next play was on Tyler earlier in the play but WHEN the foul was called was when Tyler had just taken the forearm to the chest and was laying on the floor. With all of this being said I have really been impressed with Curry and it is not just his scoring, he has a great knack for getting the ball and has some extremely quick hands. I like his on the ball defense out top and when a player tries to cross over he just takes the ball.:D

stillcrazie
02-21-2011, 08:59 AM
Thats the Law of Sewing and Reaping (Galatians chapter 6)

I still cant believe the foul was called on Tyler and Shumpert got the FTs, and Bryan Kersey calling the "T" on Coach. 4 points ...Bumble Bees can thank ref Kersey for that. Then Shumpert jammed his finger, and was doubled over in pain, in the 2nd half. Shumpert was a dirty player, and in the first half, the refs let him get by it. He sewed Bad Seeds, and received a Harvest in the 2nd half.

NEXT Play, NEXT game!

Go Duke!

Not to nitpick, but it's "sow." If you reap what you sew, you get a needle in your finger.

camion
02-21-2011, 09:05 AM
Not to nitpick, but it's "sow." If you reap what you sew, you get a needle in your finger.

And sew he did. ;)

KyDevilinIL
02-21-2011, 09:07 AM
1. This team really needs to do away with the "practice" period of 10-15 court minutes that it chooses to open seemingly every game with these days. The next four games is the toughest stretch of our season so far, and at some point against better competition the slow, raggedy starts are going to put us in a hole we can't recover from.

2. I respect that some people enjoy the Brando/G-man broadcast team, but I can't stand the trash-heap production of FSN. It's been nice to have access to several more ACC games each year here in Kentucky, but it's just such an annoying experience on that network. Adios, Fox.

3. I feel sorry for the kids who make the U19 national team this summer and then have to be coached by Paul Hewitt.

Kfanarmy
02-21-2011, 09:08 AM
... given that the Plumlees (Mason in particular) only really thrive in the halfcourt offense when receiving feeds off the drive with the defense rotating. .... not sure I agree with this statement. Everyone was lauding the impact KI was having on Mason's game in particular because of the uptempo offense. I think the offense the staff has implemented subsequent to the KI injury may be giving some fans a false sense of what players can/can't do. I actually think Mason and Miles are more well suited to the uptempo offense...

lmb
02-21-2011, 09:25 AM
What is up with the time clock in Cameron? Seriously, it seems like there's an issue at every home game. Is it mechanical or operator-error? Annoying!


On the game, Curry is proving to be indispensable. Ryan Kelly is my husband's favorite and he's had a lot to cheer about in the past few games. This team showed a lot of guts last night.

Billy Dat
02-21-2011, 09:43 AM
Our lineup is becoming defined for the post season, provided of course Kyrie is not back. Nolan just continues to play excellent ball, game after game and the good news is Kyle also played much better. I noticed he stayed away from the 3 point shot tonight, trying to get the majority of his points inside. He was much more active and played a lot smarter than against Virginia. Mason has made strides and seems capable of a double double instead of just rebounding. He is getting a few moves inside, which is part of his development. Ryan has also established himself as the second big. He has a knack for scoring and making smart plays. Miles at this time has the role of substituting for the others. Seth is also the starting point guard/shooting guard. He can score and has quick hands and has improved in every way. Tyler is pushing him, especially when the game gets tough and physical. It was great to see Tyler putting up some points tonight. It is really too bad, but Dawkins had another subpar game. I am wondering if he can pull out of the slide he has been on. Hairston is relagated to a substitute as he develops his game, but has a lot of upside.


I shared a lot of these thoughts as we pushed the lead to 20+ in the second half. I kept waiting for Andre and Miles to get more PT since the game was out of reach, and then it dawned on me that K is starting to go longer with the players he trusts, and Tyler seems to be pushing Andre further from the center.

RE: Slow start
I actually thought our energy was really good from the start, but I thought our defense was out of sync. If you read K's presser comments, Tech came out with a small line-up which completely flummoxed us as we prepared a completely different defensive strategy - thus all the wide open looks from 3 that Tech got in that first 5-10 minutes. We also missed some easy shots, how often do you see Nolan miss a point blank lay-up? I think that had more to do with the close score for most of the first half. Plus, I though Tech looked really good and was playing hard. A physical game is good for us to face. I thought Kyle, especially, was on his game from the jump. He chased down a couple offensive boards that made him seem like a man possessed.

A couple of things I saw that no one had mentioned:

-Mason really impressed me with his passing in this game. Two plays stand out, he caught the ball on the wing, actually drove toward the land and when the defense collapsed, hit Seth on the opposite wing for a 3. I had never seen him do that before. Also, in the second half, he had the ball near midcourt as Tech applied 3-quarter court pressure, Ryan broke to the hoop and Mason threw a half court laser to Ryan for a lay-in. Plus, a few of his strange looking spin-away-from-the-hoop moves actually went in. I am excited about where his game is right now.

-How about that nice little runner in the lane that Tyler had, plus his no-hesitation 3 pointer? The 3 missed, but I liked that he is getting an offensive ego, and he nailed all his free throws. The meritocracy under K continues - prove yourself with your performance and you will play.

-I think Miles' lack of PT had more to do with Tech playing a small line-up than anything else. But, it is pretty clear that Mason and Ryan are going to get the lion's share of the PT if they stay out of foul trouble.

We have a nice little run of games to end the year. The pieces are starting to knit together nicely, the smell of March is starting to waft in...let's keep our eye on that ACC Regular Season crown.

sandinmyshoes
02-21-2011, 09:58 AM
On the call against Nolan, I didn't think it was a foul, but from some angles I could see how the ref might think it was.

On the Shumpert/Tyler situation. I thought Tyler fouled him, but Shumpert then fouled. I would have thought it a double foul. I'm not sure how the rules work, but it would have been a foul on Thornton, and a flagrant on Shumpert.

But, in the end, I'm just glad that Coach K's T got the team fired up.

sdotbarbee
02-21-2011, 10:11 AM
On the call against Nolan, I didn't think it was a foul, but from some angles I could see how the ref might think it was.

On the Shumpert/Tyler situation. I thought Tyler fouled him, but Shumpert then fouled. I would have thought it a double foul. I'm not sure how the rules work, but it would have been a foul on Thornton, and a flagrant on Shumpert.

But, in the end, I'm just glad that Coach K's T got the team fired up.

I didn't think from any angle that it looked like Nolan cleared out with is arm. If Thornton fouled Shumpert then call it when it happened because they didn't foul each other at the same time and when the foul was called was when TT was on the floor from the forearm to his chest.

uh_no
02-21-2011, 10:12 AM
1. This team really needs to do away with the "practice" period of 10-15 court minutes that it chooses to open seemingly every game with these days. The next four games is the toughest stretch of our season so far, and at some point against better competition the slow, raggedy starts are going to put us in a hole we can't recover from.

Would you like to provide any suggestions on how to do this?

DevilWearsPrada
02-21-2011, 10:12 AM
I agree with you Sand!

The "T" got everyone fired up. The Crazies (and some Crusties) were chanting the REF cheer (Blind, Deaf).

You can view Coach K, getting the Technical on WRALblog, (without words), because you can READ his mouth! He was calling Ref Kersey, ever name (bleep bleep bleep). But it worked. View the video, and look at all the reactions from the fans, sitting behind the Duke bench! I know we were "Bleeping" upstairs in the Crustie Section!

DallasDevil
02-21-2011, 10:23 AM
not sure I agree with this statement. Everyone was lauding the impact KI was having on Mason's game in particular because of the uptempo offense. I think the offense the staff has implemented subsequent to the KI injury may be giving some fans a false sense of what players can/can't do. I actually think Mason and Miles are more well suited to the uptempo offense...

For what it's worth, I don't think he was saying they don't do well in an uptempo offense or on the break, but that in the halfcourt their strength is in receiving feeds off penetration as opposed to creating their own offense in the post.

KyDevilinIL
02-21-2011, 10:25 AM
Would you like to provide any suggestions on how to do this?

K needs to be T'd up 30 seconds into every game.

OZZIE4DUKE
02-21-2011, 10:27 AM
He jammed his finger on Thornton's hand while making a pass; the kind of play I like to call 'karmic justice'. The basketball gods were watching Shumpert's antics all game, and were clearly not pleased when his elbow to Tyler's face resulted in a personal on Tyler and a technical on our bench, so late in the second half they came calling to settle the debt. ;)
Thanks for the explanation. The way he was bending over, for several minutes we couldn't tell if he had hurt his hand or had gotten hit in his privates. Good thing Julius Hodge wasn't playing in the game... :eek:

DukeDevilDeb
02-21-2011, 10:28 AM
I agree with you Sand!

The "T" got everyone fired up. The Crazies (and some Crusties) were chanting the REF cheer (Blind, Deaf).

You can view Coach K, getting the Technical on WRALblog, (without words), because you can READ his mouth! He was calling Ref Kersey, ever name (bleep bleep bleep). But it worked. View the video, and look at all the reactions from the fans, sitting behind the Duke bench! I know we were "Bleeping" upstairs in the Crustie Section!


Can't read his mouth any more! They have a "little black box" covering it when he uses unacceptable words. K is a master of knowing when a technical might have a positive impact. You can see that he keeps keeping on with the yelling beyond what even he does usually. Good T, Coach!

DevilWearsPrada
02-21-2011, 10:31 AM
Thanks for the explanation. The way he was bending over, for several minutes we couldn't tell if he had hurt his hand or had gotten hit in his privates. Good thing Julius Hodge wasn't playing in the game... :eek:

I had my radio and earplugs on Duke Radio during the game! So much easier to follow along with Bob Harris, calling the game. It makes me more focused on watching everything on the court, vs all the distractions in Cameron.

Then you share, what Bob Harris says, with the people around you. Love the voice of the Blue Devils, Bob Harris "How Sweet it Is."

B-well
02-21-2011, 11:14 AM
Ritalin time

weezie
02-21-2011, 11:23 AM
Yeah, uhhhh, I forgot what I was going to say with all the emphasis on spelling bees and fashion this morning....oh now I have it: Bryan Kersey is a terrible, lame, fire-tempered ref. When Mysterious Karl becomes the figure of rationality in a game, well, then you know you have issues.
I wonder where dear old Playcaller is these days?

DevilWearsPrada
02-21-2011, 11:36 AM
ESPN is showing the highlights from the game. Thornton was elbowed or pushed, and it should have been a flagrant foul. I am glad our team, didnt back down.

Refs, Dr Karl Hess, and Bryan Kersey were horrible during most of the first half. They whistled so much, it messed up the timing equipment. lol

If that gets Duke going, and a technical wakes them up, than do it every game. The T on coach, got everyone more spirited and passionate in Cameron, Crusties included.

Saratoga2
02-21-2011, 11:48 AM
I didn't think from any angle that it looked like Nolan cleared out with is arm. If Thornton fouled Shumpert then call it when it happened because they didn't foul each other at the same time and when the foul was called was when TT was on the floor from the forearm to his chest.

I noticed Shumpert has a habit of flailing out with his arm to relieve pressure when he is dribbling. Much more noticeable than when Nolan went to the basket. It was hard to see Nolan's arm extension, since it was so minor.

-jk
02-21-2011, 11:59 AM
I noticed Shumpert has a habit of flailing out with his arm to relieve pressure when he is dribbling. Much more noticeable than when Nolan went to the basket. It was hard to see Nolan's arm extension, since it was so minor.

I think the issue for Nolan's charge was not using the arm, but rather that the two of them were moving parallel and in tandem (thus a legally established guarding position), and Nolan cut into him driving into the basket. The ref saw that as Nolan initiating the contact.

I won't go into how much contact was allowed on one end that was called on the other - that inconsistency, I think, was the crux of K's complaint.

-jk

sdotbarbee
02-21-2011, 12:10 PM
I think the issue for Nolan's charge was not using the arm, but rather that the two of them were moving parallel and in tandem (thus a legally established guarding position), and Nolan cut into him driving into the basket. The ref saw that as Nolan initiating the contact.

I won't go into how much contact was allowed on one end that was called on the other - that inconsistency, I think, was the crux of K's complaint.

-jk

It looked to me that when the ref called it he motioned with his arm that it was a clear out with the off arm, if it was a true charge he would have just made the normal call and motion with his arm pointing the other way and a bent arm behind his head. I could be wrong but either way, whether it was a push off/clear out or a charge he called it wasn't the right call.

BD80
02-21-2011, 12:18 PM
Oh! How easily we are distracted from the matter at hand!
Ritalin time

Well, we ain't ever been well-heeled!

Feel free to use the word devilish

Dev11
02-21-2011, 12:36 PM
1. This team really needs to do away with the "practice" period of 10-15 court minutes that it chooses to open seemingly every game with these days. The next four games is the toughest stretch of our season so far, and at some point against better competition the slow, raggedy starts are going to put us in a hole we can't recover from.

My father pointed out after the game how in this game, like in our other games this year against opponents who come in outmatched against us, we played our normal game throughout while the opponent played totally up to potential for the first 8 or 10 minutes, but playing to that level wears you down, and inevitably ties halfway through the first half become 15-point leads after halftime. I don't think its a huge cause for concern as long as we play hard for 40 minutes. Let the other team max out early.

TruBlu
02-21-2011, 01:52 PM
I don't know if this was shown on TV, or if many of the people actually at the game noticed this:

In the second half, Mason was summoned off the bench to enter the game. In his haste to run to the scorer's table he hit some moisture in front of the bench and took a nasty fall right at Coach K's feet. (Fortunately he wasn't hurt and jumped up immediately and proceeded to check into the game). As the crew was mopping up the moisture, one of the refs . . . I think it was Hess . . . indicated a tripping foul at the Duke bench, then crossed his arm indicating that it was intentional.

I could not see the Duke bench's reaction, but it cracked me up.

sandinmyshoes
02-21-2011, 03:39 PM
I didn't think from any angle that it looked like Nolan cleared out with is arm. If Thornton fouled Shumpert then call it when it happened because they didn't foul each other at the same time and when the foul was called was when TT was on the floor from the forearm to his chest.

In one replay, Nolan made a quick motion with his arm. It did not make what I would call anything like serious contact. But, if the ref was shielded partially by the defender, I could see him making that call. It would be a wrong call, but I could see it.

Thornton, I though, definately held Shumpert as he was trying to move around a screen. Then Shumpert pushed him. I too thought the call, for the hold, was late. If that's what the ref called. If he called Shumpert for the "foul" that sent TT to the floor, then it was just a wrong call period, rather than one good call and a bad no call.

weezie
02-21-2011, 04:24 PM
I could not see the Duke bench's reaction, but it cracked me up.

They all laughed and K and Collins were shaking their heads and I think K yelled at one of the coaches to pick up the gosh-darned towels already.. Mason slipped on a towel and went kaboom. As he approached the foul line-up, he was laughing and blushing and Miles must have said something across the lane because the two of them started laughing again. I always take my binoculars :)
BTW, I do love the "Mason in for Miles" announcement and am looking forward to next year and the "Mason in for Miles/Marshall" or any combo of the aforesaid.

Greg_Newton
02-21-2011, 04:40 PM
I really liked how well Singler was attacking the rim yesterday. He executed a well-controlled spin move a few times that was pretty exciting - if he can reliably pull that off, it adds a completely new dimension to his offense. He's a "power wing" so he's not going to blow by anybody, but he's big enough that a shoulder to the chest around the elbows/lane followed by a spin will get him some separation IF he can keep his dribble and momentum. He did that against Rice several times yesterday with nice results.

If Kyle can actually create some offense for us and break down some defenses going forward - rather than just hitting shots - it would be huge.

hq2
02-21-2011, 06:03 PM
If Kyle can actually create some offense for us and break down some defenses going forward - rather than just hitting shots - it would be huge.

Yes, it would help. That was a nice left handed layup in traffic too. As I recall, that was what got him going more late last year; he stopped shooting jumpers and started attacking the bucket more. Kyle actually is a decent driver; him getting to the rim more will help our offense a lot; it gives a needed added dimension to our inside game.

DukieinSoCal
02-21-2011, 07:14 PM
Kyle actually is a decent driver; him getting to the rim more will help our offense a lot; it gives a needed added dimension to our inside game.

Kyle may be decent driving to the hoop but struggles to finish. It seems like he gets stuffed near the rim about 2-3 times a game. Unless he has a clean look, I'd almost rather seem him keep his dribble alive or look for a cutter.

Anyone worried about Kyle or have thoughts about how to get him going offensively?

Neals384
02-21-2011, 07:34 PM
OK, I replayed the Thornon foul in slo-mo. The correct call was not a foul on Thornton, nor on Shumpert, but a moving pick on Storrs. He moved into Tyler's path three time in succession. Shumpert escalated things by not going around the illegal pick but instead pinning Thornton to Storrs. The ref watched the whole thing, and while moving picks off the ball are a frequent no-call, he should have seen the situation escalating and blown the whistle long before Shumpert's flagrant forearm. I didn't see Thornton hold Shumpert.

Does the ACC have any process for evaluating refs over the course of the season and weeding out the bad ones?

Mcluhan
02-21-2011, 08:23 PM
Anyone worried about Kyle or have thoughts about how to get him going offensively?

Frankly, no. His motor is so good, and his focus possession to possession is so good, that I trust that good things will happen with him in the game. Whether shooting poorly or great, Kyle always seems to do good Kyle things that help us win.

The only exception to this is the period last year and also early this year when we weren't running him off screens. Receiving the ball in standing position doesn't seem to work that well for him. But as long as he's coming off screens to either take a jumper or attack the rim, I'd like to keep feeding him the ball.

PADukeMom
02-22-2011, 11:23 AM
ESPN is showing the highlights from the game. Thornton was elbowed or pushed, and it should have been a flagrant foul. I am glad our team, didnt back down.


Like I said earlier GT plays football instead od basketball.