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bhd28
06-22-2007, 09:30 AM
Okay... am I the only one thinking that thinks Coach K and Coach McCallie should go ahead and offer any offspring of Shelden and Candice Parker a scholarship? So it may be 20 years... if we wait until they are born, then another team might beat us to the punch. ;)

kydevil
06-22-2007, 01:52 PM
Duke gets dibs if it's a boy. Only to be fair we give the rights to Tennessee if it's a girl. :D

mgtr
06-22-2007, 06:50 PM
Of course, there will also be grandchildren. That is one reason to lock up the possible children now.

dukerev
06-22-2007, 06:52 PM
This thread actually brings up an interesting thought (to me, anyway). Coach K has been at Duke since 1982, so this'll be his 26th season (or is it 27th?). Anyway, some of those former players have obviously gotten to the point where their kids are graduating high school and choosing colleges. When will Coach K coach one of his former player's kids?

Pistonsfan13
06-22-2007, 06:56 PM
im sure he has, they just didnt make a big deal out of it.

Truth
06-22-2007, 09:32 PM
im sure he has, they just didnt make a big deal out of it.

C'mon, now... I really can't imagine the media NOT making a big deal of something like this. How many times did we see Paulus throw the same high-school TD pass, or how many times did we hear about Melchionni's father Gary being a former Duke player?

You have more confidence in media restraint than I do... if K coaches the offspring of a former player, I think we'll never hear the end of it!

kydevil
06-23-2007, 12:42 PM
If k was to coach a former players kid it would definitely be talked about. The media would kill the situation. Just like they did with Lee and Greg, I got tired of hearing about Paulus and Football and Lee's dad.

Also at least 10 times this year the broadcaster's talked about how athletic Greg's family is/was.

ArkieDukie
06-23-2007, 01:16 PM
This discussion reminds me of a drinking game that some friends and I had for watching games called by Dick Vitale. You know how drinking games go; here are the items from our list that I remember:
1. any mention of the back-to-back nat'l championships
2. Loren Woods & Chris Carrawell attended the same HS (now a bit dated)
3. The alternate possession rule doesn't reward good defense.
4. College FB should have a playoff like college BB does (a new addition)

kydevil
06-24-2007, 11:51 AM
This discussion reminds me of a drinking game that some friends and I had for watching games called by Dick Vitale. You know how drinking games go; here are the items from our list that I remember:
1. any mention of the back-to-back nat'l championships
2. Loren Woods & Chris Carrawell attended the same HS (now a bit dated)
3. The alternate possession rule doesn't reward good defense.
4. College FB should have a playoff like college BB does (a new addition)

In addition

1. Mention of the phrase "Diaper Dandy" or "PTP'er"
2 Saying "Dukies"
3. Mention's his or anyone elses's beautiful Wife.
4. Talks about someone eles's great hairstyle.

Those are just some I can also remember my friends and I using.

ArkieDukie
06-24-2007, 12:43 PM
In addition

1. Mention of the phrase "Diaper Dandy" or "PTP'er"
2 Saying "Dukies"
3. Mention's his or anyone elses's beautiful Wife.
4. Talks about someone eles's great hairstyle.

Those are just some I can also remember my friends and I using.

Ah, yes; we have the same list. We can now add:
1. Greg Paulus' brother plays football at UNC - because you know we're going to be entirely sick of that one. (like we were when Jeff Capel's brother Jason played for the Heels.)
2. What would this team be like if Josh McRoberts (for example) had stayed in school - and variations thereof. Repeated ad nauseum for any team who has lost one or more players to the NBA.
3. If we ever happen to meet up with TN, you can bet that the Shelden Williams/Candace Parker engagement will be mentioned. Heck, it probably will be anyway. AND the commentators will likely discuss what great players their kids will be.

I'm sure others can add to the list. Mine has gotten so extensive that I actually prefer to see our games on FSN. A truly sad statement which has been the subject of other threads.

dukerev
06-24-2007, 02:07 PM
As annoying as Vitale can be, I actually prefer him to nearly any other espn team that does Duke games. The Tirico/Bilas team (and one other dude) from last year was good, but they never did ACC games. Every other espn pairing has been, it seems, anti-Duke. Even Mike Patrick seems to be getting in on the act. I can't believe I'm saying this, but I miss Brad Daugherty. He was objective. Len Bias-ed against Duke, er, Elmore is the worst. I couldn't agree more that I prefer FSN games now...even if their production is worse than espn. Maybe with Coach K and the rest of the sports info department getting in on the act, we'll see a little improvement. Let's face it, Duke basketball is a cash cow for espn. I'm not saying that they should show Duke some love, but at least lighten up on the hate.

kydevil
06-24-2007, 02:45 PM
I forgot to add the classic:
I truly believe that " insert player's name" is the best point guard in the nation(or any other position played)

I personally believe that Dick Vitale brings more hatred to Duke. People can't stand "Duke" Vitale as they call him which turns them even more against Duke.

I don't mind Billy Packer with his commentary! :)

Bob Green
06-24-2007, 04:32 PM
I don't mind Billy Packer with his commentary! :)

IMO, Billy Packer is the worst commentator of the whole bunch. He never has a good comment about the ACC. Billy Packer has forgotten where he came from! :mad:

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

cspan37421
06-24-2007, 05:14 PM
Anyone who watches a lot of college basketball will eventually realize that Vitale is not a Duke partisan; he is a college basketball nut who loves great play, coaches who win the right way, kids who overcome hardships to play and play well, etc. I learned this in college - the first time I heard Vitale give color commentary in a non-Duke game. I heard him get as excited and worked up as he did for Duke. At the time it was a little deflating, because I foolishly thought he was on "our" side. I was wrong - he was on the side of good college basketball, and wisely he brought that enthusiasm to other games. His big "sin"? He hasn't toned it down since Duke became nationally unpopular. He continues to sing the praises of Coach K and the Duke program, even though national sentiment has changed. Good for him, I say. Yes, he goes off on tangents too much - gets swept up in the euphoria - but better that than being a grouchy, pathetic crank. Speaking of which....

Packer - I know many people who think he is a good color guy. I disagree and one of the most obvious reasons why is this: often, when a player takes a shot and misses, Packer waits until it misses, and then declares is "a bad shot" or "a bad decision." If instead it goes in, he talks them up as having good court sense, or whatever. The point is, his evaluation of the decision to take the shot is contingent upon whether it went in. It is made post facto. I don't know the details of how Coach K coaches, but I feel pretty confident Coach K would make such a judgment before he knew whether it was going in.

This on top of all the gasoline he threw on the fire with his "Duke gets all the calls" baloney. He's also a grumpy old crank who needs to be retired. This sentiment about Packer is nothing new for Dukies: in my freshman (86-86) yearbook, there's a picture of a cardboard cutout of Al McGuire, outside Cameron at the 2nd regular season UNC game, on which was donned either a sweatshirt or headband that declared, "Packer S*cks". The other bit had a "GTHC" message on it.

mapei
06-24-2007, 05:20 PM
One of the things I dislike about Packer - and this may be getting to be the case with Patrick, too - is his obsession with officiating. He feels like it's his job to second-guess every call. Is it old-fashioned to think the athleticism on the court is more fun to focus on?

Upthread someone mentioned the Jeff/Jason Capel thing. Can someone give me the backstory on that? I've always been curious.

DevilAlumna
06-24-2007, 07:21 PM
better that than being a grouchy, pathetic crank. Speaking of which....

Packer - <snip>He's also a grumpy old crank who needs to be retired. This sentiment about Packer is nothing new for Dukies: in my freshman (86-86) yearbook, there's a picture of a cardboard cutout of Al McGuire, outside Cameron at the 2nd regular season UNC game, on which was donned either a sweatshirt or headband that declared, "Packer S*cks". The other bit had a "GTHC" message on it.

I lost all respect for the man when he verbally dressed down a couple Duke Coeds guarding a door in Cameron; one didn't recognize him and asked to see his ID badge before she would let him pass. His response was extremely rude and sexist, and I think in this Imus age, could have gotten him fired.

Aha, from the Chronicle archives: http://media.www.dukechronicle.com/media/storage/paper884/news/2000/03/03/UndefinedSection/Billy.Packer.Derided.Women.At.St.Johns.Game-1451446.shtml

cspan37421
06-24-2007, 08:34 PM
One of the things I dislike about Packer - and this may be getting to be the case with Patrick, too - is his obsession with officiating. He feels like it's his job to second-guess every call. Is it old-fashioned to think the athleticism on the court is more fun to focus on?

Upthread someone mentioned the Jeff/Jason Capel thing. Can someone give me the backstory on that? I've always been curious.

This NBA playoffs found Dan Patrick interviewing David Stern on the heels (pardon the expression) of the suspension of some PHX Suns who left the bench to check on a potential altercation - I think Nash got body-checked into the boards by Horry.

Patrick made the point that officials should have some discretion about suspending them b/c they obviously weren't heading out to participate or contribute to a fight. Of course that's not how the rule is written. Yet Stern couldn't have been a bigger jerk about it in the interview - snide, sarcastic, rude, etc. He was technically right and Patrick was obviously stirring up ratings, but he (Stern) handled it so poorly. He should have sympathized a bit before conceding that he really couldn't change the application of the rule after the fact, that it could only be changed for the future, and then, only if the teams want it that way.

Long way of saying I agree, Packer and Patrick and a lot of color guys love to second guess the refs - it makes for good ratings, rivalries, legends, myths, stories, etc.

w/r/t the Capels, I'm not sure what else to say. The fact that Jason Capel played for the Heels got mentioned nearly every time Jeff Capel was on TV as a player, and half the time as a coach.

But we shouldn't blame the color guys entirely for their schtick. They get their talking points right out of each school's media guide. Without those, they'd never have enough trivia to throw in at the right time.

cspan37421
06-24-2007, 08:48 PM
I guess I should correct my Capel remark. Since Jeff went to college first (IIRC) it was only after Jason committed to or played for UNC that it was mentioned. It would be a bit like Troy Smith having a younger brother who went to Michigan. Casual fans find it odd that they'd be on opposite sides of a rivalry but to the players I think they're just choosing among great schools in their sport, some of which are rivals.

dukerev
06-24-2007, 09:17 PM
cspan: I was referring to Mike Patrick, the play-by-play guy for most of the ACC games espn does (and who is their headliner along with Vitale). I can't really complain about Dan Patrick vis a vis Duke. Mike Patrick on the other hand has increasingly bought into the "Duke gets all the calls" theory.

kydevil
06-24-2007, 09:46 PM
Bob, I was joking about the Packer thing. I can't stand Billy Packer, as mentioned all ready he always goes on about officiating(which means he is usually implying that Duke gets all the calls.)
However I can't remember what it had to do with this year he actually took Duke's side on an arguement, not that it matters.

IMO I don't think Vitale honestly shows favoritism towards Duke. He is very passionate and loves being around the crazies. I think people believe he is a Duke lover because of all the Duke games he calls. They don't remember that it's not Vitale's fault, if they want to get mad they should be upset with Espn for putting Duke on T.V.

Bob Green
06-24-2007, 09:52 PM
Bob, I was joking about the Packer thing. I can't stand Billy Packer,

Sorry! You went right over my head. :) Once I reread your post it was pretty obvious you were joking around.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

mapei
06-24-2007, 09:57 PM
I was referring to Mike Patrick as well.

And, as an aside, I think Stern mishandled those NBA suspensions egregiously, and then was an arrogant jerk about it. I stopped watching the NBA after that and don't know when I'll bother to watch again. I certainly don't think this year's playoffs fairly determined a champion.

On the Capels, I understand that the announcers mentioned it a lot. What I was asking is why Jason elected to go to his brother's hated rival school. Was he recruited by Duke? Was there bad blood about it? I'm sure this is very old news to many of you, but I've never heard the full story, if there is one.

pfrduke
06-24-2007, 10:25 PM
However I can't remember what it had to do with this year he actually took Duke's side on an arguement, not that it matters.

During the RJ/JPN broadcast of Duke-UNC at UNC, Packer repeatedly said that the Henderson elbow was unintentional, and he didn't understand why he was ejected. Which brings the tally over 30+ years of broadcasting to "in favor of Duke" = 1; "against Duke" = thousands.


On the Capels, I understand that the announcers mentioned it a lot. What I was asking is why Jason elected to go to his brother's hated rival school. Was he recruited by Duke? Was there bad blood about it? I'm sure this is very old news to many of you, but I've never heard the full story, if there is one.

One of the underlying rumors about this story is the Jeff Capel booing incident in Cameron. I can't for the life of me remember which game it was, but for a very brief moment during a home game in his senior season, Jeff Capel was booed by some members of the Cameron crowd. The rumor is that he didn't want his brother to go to Duke after that happened to him. I want to emphasize that this is a rumor, and that I haven't heard anything about Jeff Capel having any bad blood or any grudge against Duke, Coach K, or the basketball program.

cspan37421
06-25-2007, 07:30 AM
Sorry for the Patrick confusion. It is interesting, though, since Dan really has been questioning NBA officiating lately.

On the Capel incident: I've read on DBR (forget who) one explanation of the incident that went to considerable effort (in terms of mental gymnastics) to excuse the crowd's apparent booing. I think it involved a claim that they were booing K's decision to put Jeff back in, not Jeff himself. Uh, yeah, whatever. Anyway it seemed like a weak attempt to whitewash a situation that was embarrassing to the Duke (un)faithful.

Why Jason decided on UNC-CH I don't know. I'd be surprised if it was so simple as retribution against the Crazies for booing K for putting back in a struggling Jeff. That'd be the tail wagging the dog. IIRC the dad of both kids was coaching at NCCU or NCA&T nearby, so it could have been a geography thing as much as anything, picking the two best hoop schools in an area. But if he had picked Kentucky, would that have seemed like a spite of Duke? How about Kansas, Michigan, Arizona ... other out of conf. rivals? I don't buy it.

Now, if it was merely claimed Jason ruled out Duke because of what happened to Jeff, that seems more plausible. It was a rough stretch of Duke basketball and there aren't many crowd favorites from that era.

Carlos
06-25-2007, 09:20 AM
Add one more to the Dick Vitale Drinking Game: I've only got one good eye and I could see that.

As for commentators the best was Rick Majerus because you never knew what was going to come out of his mouth. Packer may be the most negative man on earth and he's hard to stomach, but at least every now and then he comes up with something meaningful. Everyone else dumbs it down so much to play to the widest possible audience that they become almost painful to listen to.

The absolute worst in that regard is Dan Bonner who tries to make the mundane sound like it's the most interesting thing ever discussed. If I have to hear him hyperventilating his way through a detailed discussion of an inbounds pass one more time I may end up sticking knitting needles through my eardrums.

Finally, on Capel - the game was Florida State in 1997, Capel's senior year. My recollection of the moment wasn't that he was booed, but more like subjected to the sound of 9000 people collectively groaning when he came back into the game.

johnb
06-26-2007, 09:05 AM
Vitale is enthusiastic about everyone and evrything, but he is a bit of a homer in regards to Duke. He has other biases--he also loves Catholic coaches and players, for example--but he does go overboard with us. I assume that's a reason that K asked V not to mention K when he is doing other games.

Packer is grumpy, but he does know basketball as well as anybody.