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JasonEvans
06-13-2007, 08:07 AM
Vote for 5... and only 5.

Please!!

JasonEvans
06-13-2007, 08:12 AM
This is the first in a series of polls I am going to try to do to keep the conversation going in the offseason. I have no idea what the others will be, but this seemed like a logical one to start with.

As always, vote and feel free to post your comments.

-Jason "I am betting we see a lot of guys get significant vote totals" Evans

Dukerati
06-13-2007, 09:53 AM
There were two hard decisions for me in this poll.

1) Four guard lineup with Singler, or a more traditional lineup with two "bigs" (i.e. Lance or Zoubek)?

I ended up going with the more traditional lineup although I do think this will be more fluid during the season. Coach K played a lot of two big starting lineups at the end of last year despite the fact that this meant Gerald or Jon had to sit (read: we did not play our five "best" players to start the game). This swayed me towards picking the traditional choice.

2) Jon or Gerald in the starting lineup?

Once I made the decision that we were going to go two bigs, I had to decide who held down the third guard spot. Ultimately I went with Jon because I haven't heard anything about Gerald's asthma and until told otherwise, I am going to assume he plays in bursts as the sixth man. This is not an indictment on Gerald (a breakout star waiting to happen) but more of an endorsement of Jon. He's a smart, tough, and yes, athletic player whose shot will only get better. In fact, I am predicting that he will have the best +/- ratio on the team.

Starting lineup:
Greg Paulus
DeMarcus Nelson
Jon Scheyer
Lance Thomas
Kyle Singler

CY_devil
06-13-2007, 11:22 AM
IMO, I do not think Scheyer will be competing with Henderson but Henderson competing with DeMarcus for the starting spot. I can see DeMarcus starting at the beginning of the season but as the season progresses, Henderson should take his spot provided that his asthma does not hold him back (I don't think it will).

My starting 5 in Mid-January is:
1.Paulus
2.Scheyer
3.Henderson
4.Singler
5.Zoubek

CY

Lord Ash
06-13-2007, 11:33 AM
It is important to consider; do you mean starters at the beginning of the year, or at the end?

JasonEvans
06-13-2007, 11:54 AM
It is important to consider; do you mean starters at the beginning of the year, or at the end?

I mean the 5 guys who will start the most games.

-Jason

mapei
06-13-2007, 12:24 PM
I went with Nelson/Paulus/Scheyer, since they had K's confidence last year, and inserted Singler and Zoubek. I'm not thrilled with Z in a fluid game, but I think K will want at least one big who is really big and plays like one. I don't have LT's vitals memorized, but he certainly didn't play convincingly as a big last year, and KS seems more like a 3 or 4 to me, certainly not a 5.

greybeard
06-13-2007, 01:19 PM
Looks like everybody believes that he makes it back. I sure hope so, but have reservations. I think Smith might well end up out there a whole lot.

Classof06
06-13-2007, 03:29 PM
Looks like everybody believes that he makes it back. I sure hope so, but have reservations. I think Smith might well end up out there a whole lot.

I'm with you sentence for sentence, greybeard. In fact, it's my reservations and uncertainties about the PG spot in general that are keeping me from coming up with a definitive starting 5 like the rest of you guys above. I have a feeling Paulus will be out there the first game, but I have no idea who will be out there in mid-January...

Zeb
06-13-2007, 03:40 PM
Paulus will start wire to wire next year. He is K's guy, like it or not.

JasonEvans
06-13-2007, 04:06 PM
I'm with you sentence for sentence, greybeard. In fact, it's my reservations and uncertainties about the PG spot in general that are keeping me from coming up with a definitive starting 5 like the rest of you guys above. I have a feeling Paulus will be out there the first game, but I have no idea who will be out there in mid-January...

Paulus will be at least an Honorable Mention All-ACC performer next year... at least. Markmy words. The folks with reservations about him are looking at the player who was playing badly injured in late December and early January, not the player Greg was late in the season (when he was easily the best Dukie on the floor most nights). Greg was hurt all year. Cut him some slack.

-Jason "personally, I am surprised at the level of support for Nelson as a starter-- I think senior deference might be some off that" Evans

DevilAlumna
06-13-2007, 04:23 PM
Only 1 person thinks he's starter material? I thought, based on some of the late March/early April posts, he was the second coming of ... well, someone better than Paulus, at least.

(GP got my love, though. He's the next Wojo, IMO.)

VaDukie
06-13-2007, 04:54 PM
I went with Singler, Nelson, Henderson, Scheyer, and Paulus.

Why four guards? Nelson can guard any college '4', and Singler can guard any big in the ACC not named Tyler. He did guard Kevin Love after all.

K coaches players, not positions. I think those are our 5 best players.

Bob Green
06-13-2007, 05:09 PM
I went with Paulus, Scheyer, Nelson, Singler, and Zoubek. It was hard for me to not place Henderson in the starting line-up but I see him being a real force as the 6th man. In Zoubek's case, I may be guilty of too much optimism but I'm thinking he will be a much improved player in his second season.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

greybeard
06-13-2007, 08:07 PM
Paulus will start wire to wire next year. He is K's guy, like it or not.

If the foot does not materially get better, I fear he might be done. If it does, I like Paulus to lead my team. Have always, from before the season last year, said that he could not play and attributed his shortcomings to the injury. Used to post as "rudra." Think that Paulus was incredibly courageous for playing well, well, well below his capabilities because the team needed him. Wish he hadn't, but was always, and remain, a big fan.

If you don't see a greatly improved player on the floor, something, imo, will be terribly wrong. He should not play again if that foot is anywhere near the problem it was last year, imo.

Troublemaker
06-13-2007, 08:25 PM
There's a 99.999% chance Greg will start all season at point guard (barring another unfortunate injury to him), and it's not even about his improved play the second half of last season. The main reason Greg will start and probably play the most minutes per game is because he's the team's captain and leader. Anybody who thinks Greg won't start all season hasn't been following the team closely or is vastly underestimating the influence of Coach K's military background and his emphasis on leadership. If you've followed the team closely over the past two years, you know that Coach K has basically been grooming Greg to become the leader of the team and K's "on-court extension" (to use a cliche) the entire time. The payoff for all this grooming should begin this season as you should begin to see Greg take control of team huddles and encourage/criticize teammates on the court and get guys in the proper position (on offense, at least). With a healthy summer after rehab, Greg is ready to put his imprint on the team as the leader, realizing Coach K's vision, and people think his job is in danger? Not bloody likely.

Besides, the key to the season (as far as the team's ceiling is concerned) is Brian Zoubek and his progression. Greg's game should compliment Z well as he's the great shooter that should help keep the defense spread for the big man to operate inside. Also, there's a good chance that the Greg-and-Kyle high screen action will be a devastating combination for Duke (with Greg using the screen for open 3-pters and Kyle picking-and-popping and rolling on occasion) and the signature offensive play of the 07-08 season. Greg has limitations but his great shooting ability complementing Brian and Kyle's games is going to be a huge key during the season.

NYC Duke Fan
06-13-2007, 08:30 PM
I believe that it was Red Auerbach who said, 'It doesn't matter who starts the game, what only matters is who finishes the game ".

Bob Green
06-13-2007, 09:07 PM
There's a 99.999% chance Greg will start all season at point guard (barring another unfortunate injury to him), and it's not even about his improved play the second half of last season. The main reason Greg will start and probably play the most minutes per game is because he's the team's captain and leader. Anybody who thinks Greg won't start all season hasn't been following the team closely or is vastly underestimating the influence of Coach K's military background and his emphasis on leadership. If you've followed the team closely over the past two years, you know that Coach K has basically been grooming Greg to become the leader of the team and K's "on-court extension" (to use a cliche) the entire time. The payoff for all this grooming should begin this season as you should begin to see Greg take control of team huddles and encourage/criticize teammates on the court and get guys in the proper position (on offense, at least). With a healthy summer after rehab, Greg is ready to put his imprint on the team as the leader, realizing Coach K's vision, and people think his job is in danger? Not bloody likely.

Besides, the key to the season (as far as the team's ceiling is concerned) is Brian Zoubek and his progression. Greg's game should compliment Z well as he's the great shooter that should help keep the defense spread for the big man to operate inside. Also, there's a good chance that the Greg-and-Kyle high screen action will be a devastating combination for Duke (with Greg using the screen for open 3-pters and Kyle picking-and-popping and rolling on occasion) and the signature offensive play of the 07-08 season. Greg has limitations but his great shooting ability complementing Brian and Kyle's games is going to be a huge key during the season.

Great post! I nominate it for Post of the Week. I agree with everything you eloquently stated. Paulus is our floor leader and a great shooter. Zoubek is the X Factor.

I would add that our depth of talent at wing guard will be a significant factor in the team's success. Nelson and Henderson cutting back door for thunderous dunks. Smith driving down the middle. Scheyer shooting the 3-ball or midrange jumpers. All of these talents will compliment Paulus, Singler, and Zoubek.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

Waynne
06-13-2007, 09:13 PM
If you don't see a greatly improved player on the floor, something, imo, will be terribly wrong. He should not play again if that foot is anywhere near the problem it was last year, imo.

I agree; the condition of Greg's foot is the biggest question mark concerning not only his ability to play but the entire team's prospects for next season. If he recovers from the surgery he will play wire to wire because we need his passion and leadership. If he doesn't then Smith likely will be the man, with a very steep learning curve given he did not play the point at Oak Hill.

If Greg can't play we could be in for a tough season, although I bet by February the team will be playing at a high level. Hard to say who would be starting in such a scenario: my guesses are Smith, Nelson, Scheyer, Singler and Thomas, with Henderson (if healthy) and Zoubek getting big minutes off the bench.

ojaidave
06-14-2007, 12:45 AM
IMO, I do not think Scheyer will be competing with Henderson but Henderson competing with DeMarcus for the starting spot. I can see DeMarcus starting at the beginning of the season but as the season progresses, Henderson should take his spot provided that his asthma does not hold him back (I don't think it will).

My starting 5 in Mid-January is:
1.Paulus
2.Scheyer
3.Henderson
4.Singler
5.Zoubek

CY

At least I'm not the only one who thinks this is the line up. I think DeMarcus will play starter's minutes, but will come of the bench by midseason.

Dave

CY_devil
06-14-2007, 09:12 AM
"Why four guards? Nelson can guard any college '4' "

I think this is a bit of a strech. Nelson might be able to hang with the the 4's in ACC strength wise but he will give 3-4 inches at least in height which will limit his ability to guard them. Also, if he plays "4", he will need to score on the opposite end and we have all seen in the last 2 seasons what happens to him when he tries to go against a bigger guy on the inside.

I think he will rotate between "2" and "3" next season.

CY

Dukerati
06-14-2007, 10:15 AM
I am surprised at the level of support that Zoubek has been receiving. Provided Paulus comes back healthy (basketball gods willing), I see Zoubek at odds for what should be an up-tempo, open floor style of offense. We do not have particularly good inside depth but what we must assuredly have is wing depth. Miles and miles of good wing depth. I am assuming we will run and run a lot.

For this style, Lance would be a much better fit in my opinion as he could play an Amare Stoudamire-ish type role. I mention Amare specifically because Coach K did had D'Antoni as one of his assistants on the USA Olympic team if I remember correctly. There was heavy pressure to implement a Suns-type basketball system and although Coach K resisted, I have to think that he learned a lot from and was affected to some degree by the exposure to the Suns' principles. At the very least, the Suns have proven that the lack of a center is by no means crippling and the Duke lineup lends itself more favorably to that style of basketball this year more so than in years past.

JasonEvans
06-14-2007, 10:33 AM
I am surprised at the level of support that Zoubek has been receiving. Provided Paulus comes back healthy (basketball gods willing), I see Zoubek at odds for what should be an up-tempo, open floor style of offense. We do not have particularly good inside depth but what we must assuredly have is wing depth. Miles and miles of good wing depth. I am assuming we will run and run a lot.

For this style, Lance would be a much better fit in my opinion as he could play an Amare Stoudamire-ish type role. I mention Amare specifically because Coach K did had D'Antoni as one of his assistants on the USA Olympic team if I remember correctly. There was heavy pressure to implement a Suns-type basketball system and although Coach K resisted, I have to think that he learned a lot from and was affected to some degree by the exposure to the Suns' principles. At the very least, the Suns have proven that the lack of a center is by no means crippling and the Duke lineup lends itself more favorably to that style of basketball this year more so than in years past.

Well stated and precisely why I chose this lineup:

Paulus, Scheyer, Nelson, Singler, Thomas

We caught glimpses of greatness from Lance Thomas last season. I think those fleeting glanes will turn into long stares this year.

I may shoot myself for saying this, but I think this is the season we see Duke play very up-tempo and make use of our long bench. Unlike past seasons, I don't see a great dropoff from the starters to the top bench players. I think K resisted going at too quick a pace when we had studs like Shel and JJ and even Josh because he wanted to keep those guys on the floor as long as he could.

This year's team is much more balanced (as evidenced by so many guys getting reasonable votes to be starters). There is a reason I listed 11 guys as possible starters-- I think an argument can be made for at all 11 of them to play very significant minutes. We are talking about a bench of Smith, Henderson, Pocius/King, McClure, and Zoubek... damn!

--Jason "I really, really hope we turn up the pace this season... but that has not been K's inclination lately" Evans

Classof06
06-14-2007, 11:04 AM
Paulus*
Scheyer*
Nelson
Singler
Thomas


I've talked enough about Paulus, so I won't waste your time; based on my prior posts, I think you all are well aware of what that asterisk represents. I put the asterisk next to Scheyer due to the explosion I expect to see out of Gerald Henderson this year. If he provides that which he is capable of, K might not have any other choice than to put him on the floor; the asthma is another issue keeping me from putting him in starting lineup.

If, according to the general sentiment on this thread, Paulus is "99.999999"% guaranteed to start (a personal point of contention), then Nelson is 101% guaranteed to start. There is no way Demarcus doesn't start, and unlike Paulus, his overall performance (not 15 games) actually supports that notion. IMO, he was our MVP last year.

Singler's a no-brainer and I wouldn't be surprised to see him lead us in scoring to be quite honest. I'm also going to put Lance in the starting lineup because he's simply more ready to contribute than Zoubek at this time. I expect to see big strides from Lance this year, most notably an expanded offensive role and avoiding cheap fouls. He's more than capable of handling both.

Given our depth, abundance of guards and an unproven post presence, I too would like to see us push the tempo. Last year we were an inexperienced team stuck in the halfcourt way too much, which was highlighted by our low scoring and blown leads throughout the course of the season. Now that we have more than one person who can run point, we need to get back to pushing the ball up the court and putting pressure on the defense. That's hard to do when, like last year, you only had an injured Paulus who was already playing 32 mpg.

cato
06-14-2007, 01:19 PM
At least I'm not the only one who thinks this is the line up. I think DeMarcus will play starter's minutes, but will come of the bench by midseason.

Dave

Insert "Singler" for "DeMarcus" and I agree with you. If (that that's a big if) Singler pans out, I think he will play roughly as many minutes as Markie, but that Markie will start more games. It is possible that K will move Markie out of the starting lineup, but not likely. The most recent example I can think of was shuffling Nate out of the starting lineup in favor of Duhon at the end of the season. Two things about that move: 1) it might be easier for a PG like Duhon to adapt to the college level than a 4 like Singler, and 2) IIRC, that move was partially in response to Boozer's injury.

K has a history of starting his Seniors, and doesn't usually start his Frosh unless he has to.

ivduke
06-14-2007, 02:22 PM
I personally thought he was hugely dissapointing last year (often invisible even). However K does prefer Senior leadership if it is available, and I believe Demarcus will benefit from that. However, DeMarcus better impress quickly, or else he become a role player and 3rd or 4th option off the bench (as opposed to the 3rd or 4th option)

SilkyJ
06-14-2007, 03:08 PM
Paulus will be at least an Honorable Mention All-ACC performer next year... at least. Markmy words. The folks with reservations about him are looking at the player who was playing badly injured in late December and early January, not the player Greg was late in the season (when he was easily the best Dukie on the floor most nights). Greg was hurt all year. Cut him some slack.

-Jason "personally, I am surprised at the level of support for Nelson as a starter-- I think senior deference might be some off that" Evans

Wow. I agree almost wholeheartedly with your first paragraph, and completely disagree with the bit about Demarcus. I don't understand how some people dont see him as the best player on our team, which he is, IMHO. I think he will improve his FT and 3pt % just a hair next year and will be 2nd team all-acc, our leading scorer, best defender, and MVP (of our team)next season.

Classof06
06-14-2007, 04:21 PM
Wow. I agree almost wholeheartedly with your first paragraph, and completely disagree with the bit about Demarcus. I don't understand how some people dont see him as the best player on our team, which he is, IMHO. I think he will improve his FT and 3pt % just a hair next year and will be 2nd team all-acc, our leading scorer, best defender, and MVP (of our team)next season.


Yeah Jason, I'm not really following you on that. You're surprised that Demarcus is seen as a starter and you think it's becuase of deference? I would say Paulus, if anyone, would be starting due to deference; he's also a Captain and he's the 2nd oldest player on the team.

Just to jog people's memory, Demarcus was our most consistent player from last year. Not only was he the team's Co-MVP, he was our best defender, our leading scorer and he is currently our leading returning rebounder. Seems like a best player to me. Call me crazy, but to think Paulus should start and Demarcus shouldn't is just backwards.

Bob Green
06-14-2007, 04:41 PM
Wow. I agree almost wholeheartedly with your first paragraph, and completely disagree with the bit about Demarcus. I don't understand how some people dont see him as the best player on our team, which he is, IMHO. I think he will improve his FT and 3pt % just a hair next year and will be 2nd team all-acc, our leading scorer, best defender, and MVP (of our team)next season.

Nelson and Paulus will both start. I expect Nelson to have a breakout Senior season. Last year, he was the CO-MVP, leading scorer, and our best defender. However, he did have a tendency to disappear offensively. He would score a lot of points during a short time span and then go cold for a long time span. In order for Nelson to have the breakout year I'm hoping for he must stay in the offensive flow every minute he is on the court. IMO, Nolan Smith playing significant minutes off the bench (defending our opponents fast guard) will alleviate significant pressure off of Nelson. The notion that Nelson will not be a major factor as a Senior is unrealistic, IMO.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

mph
06-14-2007, 05:50 PM
I went with Singler, Nelson, Henderson, Scheyer, and Paulus.

Why four guards? Nelson can guard any college '4', and Singler can guard any big in the ACC not named Tyler. He did guard Kevin Love after all.

K coaches players, not positions. I think those are our 5 best players.

I voted the same way. Four guards, plus Singler. I also think Smith will compete for substantial minutes off of the bench.

jaimedun34
06-14-2007, 07:41 PM
DeMarcus usually scored his first few baskets in the opening minutes. I'd imagine you'd get pretty tired if you had to guard the opponent's best perimeter player and go bang with post players!

I think:
Paulus
Scheyer
Nelson
Singler
Thomas

johnb
06-15-2007, 09:07 AM
Paulus is the leader, and he will likely start all year, but if he doesn't perform at a high level, we may see a lot of games in which he plays 20 minutes, with PG responsibilities handled by Scheyer during the other half of the game. My hunch is that a healthy Greg can have a Hurleyesque career, but that may be wishful thinking.

I don't see Zoubs starting. K does not start guys who are tall over guys who are better, and, unless Zoubek gets his footwork straightened out, he won't be a 25 minute/game player for us. At the same time, Nelson/Thomas/King/Singler/McClure/Zoubek are quite competitive as the inside guys against virtually all but the most elite of college teams. Singler seems the most likely star from that bunch, but the other key player is probably being determined in some gym somewhere (ie, offseason work will likely determine that last starter).

Saratoga2
06-15-2007, 10:51 AM
I think Paulus, Scheyer, Nelson, Singler and Zoubek will start at the beginning of the season but expect changes to occur as the season moves on. The possible changes in starters in my book would be Nolan Smith for Nelson, Thomas for Zoubek and Henderson for Scheyer. Frankly, Henderson would start on many teams and perhaps he will find his way into the starting lineup early.

While Nelson is a quality and experienced player, he has trouble handling the ball, is not a top notched shooter and is relatively poor from the foul line. He also has a tendency to drive into traffic and lose the possession. That's why I could see Nolan Smith getting the starting guard role over Nelson, since Nolan appears to have strengths in all the areas where Nelson is weak.

It is hard to know whether Thomas or Zoubek will have made the most progress over the summer. Zoubek has the size advantage so I list him as the starter, but it could go the other way if Thomas has really progressed.

I love Scheyer as a player and also think the same way of Henderson. The trick is who to get them both into the game together. Perhaps if Paulus sits that can happen, but it is pretty clear that Paulus will be the starting point guard and for this team that has to happen to be solid next season. Nolan can sub for Paulus or perhaps Scheyer could fill that role and play a little out of position, but that will only be for a very limited amount of time.

Perhaps by the end of the season the starters will be Paulus, Smith, Scheyer, Singler and Thomas.

rsvman
06-15-2007, 12:37 PM
I chose the same five as Dukerati, Jason Evans, and Jamiedun34. I left Henderson out of the starting lineup because of his asthma issues, and I just have to think that Lance Thomas is going to get the nod over the Z-man unless something is happening during the off-season that we don't know about.

Classof06
06-15-2007, 01:08 PM
Paulus is the leader, and he will likely start all year, but if he doesn't perform at a high level, we may see a lot of games in which he plays 20 minutes, with PG responsibilities handled by Scheyer during the other half of the game. My hunch is that a healthy Greg can have a Hurleyesque career, but that may be wishful thinking.

I don't think Krzyzewski went after Nolan Smith so Scheyer could handle the ball when Paulus wasn't in the game/not playing well/etc..

jaimedun34
06-15-2007, 01:41 PM
I'd love to see Paulus's minutes around 25-28 and then have Smith get the other minutes running the point. Paulus is the type of player who would play in a full body cast if given the chance... He isn't going to ask K for a breather!

I really don't want to see Jon playing the 1 unless it is in a special situation. He can bring the ball up without it getting taken away, but he's much more productive off the ball.

I think only Paulus will start every game.

SilkyJ
06-15-2007, 03:40 PM
I think only Paulus will start every game.

I'd have to add DeMarcus to that, and then say I agree. I also think no one here is giving Zou enough credit for how important he is going to be. He's our only true 5, and the assistants have talked about how critical he is going to be to this team's success. I see him as our starting center, but then again, I am banking on a lot of progression this summer...

Dukerati
06-15-2007, 03:49 PM
I'd have to add DeMarcus to that, and then say I agree. I also think no one here is giving Zou enough credit for how important he is going to be. He's our only true 5, and the assistants have talked about how critical he is going to be to this team's success. I see him as our starting center, but then again, I am banking on a lot of progression this summer...

I was burned too many times by Horvath to get my hopes up about big man progression at Duke. This is not to say that big men have not progressed. There is a long line of big men (the most recent being Boozer and Shelden) who showed clear improvement every year. However, every big man who followed this path (that I can remember) showed considerable promise during their first year on the court. I am sure the Duke historians on the board will correct me if I am wrong, but when's the last time a big man became an all-ACC level player at Duke who struggled as much as Zou did last year? Has it happened in the K era?

DukieUGA
06-15-2007, 03:49 PM
Paulus
Scheyer
Nelson
Singler
Zoubek

This is not to say that these 5 will start every game, although if healthy i think Paulus and Nelson will. I would say Scheyer starts em all as well, but i haven't seen any of the freshmen and Hendo or Marty may just get super hot at some point when Jon may be stone cold. In fact, i could see all of Duke's players except for non-Singler Fr., starting at some point. But as JE said, this poll should reflect who starts the most games. Barring injuries though, i think it might be just as valid to ask who will be starting at the end of the year, ya know, when it really matters.

mapei
06-15-2007, 04:00 PM
I think Paulus, Scheyer, Nelson, Singler and Zoubek will start at the beginning of the season but expect changes to occur as the season moves on. The possible changes in starters in my book would be Nolan Smith for Nelson, Thomas for Zoubek and Henderson for Scheyer. Frankly, Henderson would start on many teams and perhaps he will find his way into the starting lineup early.

While Nelson is a quality and experienced player, he has trouble handling the ball, is not a top notched shooter and is relatively poor from the foul line. He also has a tendency to drive into traffic and lose the possession. That's why I could see Nolan Smith getting the starting guard role over Nelson, since Nolan appears to have strengths in all the areas where Nelson is weak.

It is hard to know whether Thomas or Zoubek will have made the most progress over the summer. Zoubek has the size advantage so I list him as the starter, but it could go the other way if Thomas has really progressed.

I love Scheyer as a player and also think the same way of Henderson. The trick is who to get them both into the game together. Perhaps if Paulus sits that can happen, but it is pretty clear that Paulus will be the starting point guard and for this team that has to happen to be solid next season. Nolan can sub for Paulus or perhaps Scheyer could fill that role and play a little out of position, but that will only be for a very limited amount of time.

Perhaps by the end of the season the starters will be Paulus, Smith, Scheyer, Singler and Thomas.

Well said. I agree completely, and I think that's a very fair assessment of Nelson. The fact that he was our leading scorer last year doesn't say all that much considering the team finished the season unranked and got bounced in the first round of the NCAAs. And, BG, if he's going to have a "breakout season," he may as well do it while, you know, he still has some eligibility. ;)

DN seems somewhat polarizing. I'm in the camp that is surprised at all the love he gets, but quite obviously a lot of people are surprised that he gets criticism. K seems to like him, though, so I think he will start and play lots.

DukieUGA
06-15-2007, 04:02 PM
I generally think highly of JE's comments, but for him to say that LT showed flashes of greatness last year kinda blew my mind. I would say that LT showed flashes of good play but not one time did i ever think he played great. He looked overwhelmed much of the time and the game seemed to be moving too fast quite often. I think he'll be a good player for K and for his teammates and will eventually do some very nice things for this team. Someone else opined that he could fulfill a Amare Stoudemire type role, to which i would say, whu? can i have what you're smoking? I'm thinking an improved version, slightly taller non-3-pt shooting Carmen Wallace maybe a less powerful and less prolific Shelden Williams and they're thinking All-World thunder-dunker. Wow, at least this site has a diversity of opinion.

mapei
06-15-2007, 04:08 PM
Personally, I had high expectations for him early, when he seemed to really impress. But I learned to adjust those expectations dramatically downward as we played the conference part of the schedule. And eventually I learned to expect that he wouldn't even play that much because of constant foul trouble.

He still seems like a player with potential to me, but more to become a consistent role player than a star.

-jk
06-15-2007, 09:01 PM
I was burned too many times by Horvath to get my hopes up about big man progression at Duke. This is not to say that big men have not progressed. There is a long line of big men (the most recent being Boozer and Shelden) who showed clear improvement every year. However, every big man who followed this path (that I can remember) showed considerable promise during their first year on the court. I am sure the Duke historians on the board will correct me if I am wrong, but when's the last time a big man became an all-ACC level player at Duke who struggled as much as Zou did last year? Has it happened in the K era?

The only one I can think of is Alaa "catch, face, & shoot!" Abdelnaby (http://www.sportsstats.com/jazzyj/greats/90/abdelnaby.htm).

-jk

mapei
06-15-2007, 09:19 PM
And that was a loooooong time ago. OTOH, I don't associate Duke's style with big men much anyway. I remember that one of the things that stood out for me about Brand was that he seemed so much not like a K-type player. That's somewhat true of Shel, too, I guess, but most Duke "big men" seem not so much like true inside, powerful players and more like perimeter players who happen to be big, e.g., Ferry, Laettner, McRoberts.

Zoubek seems built to be a classic, back-to-the-basket center, and not particularly suited to the motion offense.

Fish80
06-17-2007, 11:05 AM
Paulus, Scheyer, and DeMarcus will all start when healthy. The other two spots will see a lot of different lineups, depending on matchups and who is playing better. Henderson and Thomas will see a lot of starts, giving us a relatively small starting line up.

I'm surprised at the some of the comments about DeMarcus. He was the most consistent player on the team last season, and he's a do it all type of player. I expect him to have a great senior year and be in the running for ACC player of the year. (Any Duke fan who doesn't see how much DeMarcus does is smoking crack.)

Nobody's been talking about McClure, let's not forget how good he looked when healthy. If he perfects his short jumper over the summer, look for him to compete for major minutes and to start some games.

There are easily 10 guys who could start. This team is going to be a lot of fun!

jaimedun34
06-17-2007, 02:17 PM
Paulus, Scheyer, and DeMarcus will all start when healthy. The other two spots will see a lot of different lineups, depending on matchups and who is playing better. Henderson and Thomas will see a lot of starts, giving us a relatively small starting line up.

I'm surprised at the some of the comments about DeMarcus. He was the most consistent player on the team last season, and he's a do it all type of player. I expect him to have a great senior year and be in the running for ACC player of the year. (Any Duke fan who doesn't see how much DeMarcus does is smoking crack.)

Nobody's been talking about McClure, let's not forget how good he looked when healthy. If he perfects his short jumper over the summer, look for him to compete for major minutes and to start some games.

There are easily 10 guys who could start. This team is going to be a lot of fun!

McClure's importance doesn't really show up on a stat sheet, but he is a very good defender for the way Duke plays defense. He's big enough to guard some forwards in the post, but quick enough to get out in the passing lanes on the perimeter.

mepanchin
06-17-2007, 04:16 PM
McClure's importance doesn't really show up on a stat sheet, but he is a very good defender for the way Duke plays defense. He's big enough to guard some forwards in the post, but quick enough to get out in the passing lanes on the perimeter.

I think it shows up on the stat sheet pretty well! You just have to know what stats to look at.

McClure had our 2nd best offensive rebounding rate of anyone over 10 minutes a game (Thomas was slightly higher), 2nd best defensive rebounding rate (barely behind McRoberts), 2nd best block rate, and best steal rate. It just so happened that he only played 716 minutes which depressed his raw stats a bit!

Offensively, McClure has to work on free throw shooting and turnovers and he can be an asset on both sides of the floor: a severely underrated one.

mapei
06-17-2007, 04:30 PM
I thought McClure really stepped it up last year and, you're right, we do seem to have forgotten about him. Plus, he seems like a glue guy to me. At times last year he was my favorite Blue Devil.

heyman25
06-17-2007, 07:23 PM
He is a glue guy but unless its a layup or dunk,he lacks a mid range offensive game.
My starting 5
Greg Paulus
DeMarcus Nelson
Gerald Henderson
Kyle Singler
Lance Thomas
6th man
Jon Scheyer he may start some games where we need ballhandlers. DeMarcus can be a turnover waiting to happen
Nolan Smith will get decent time on the court.
Brian Zoubek will play a lot in the right matchup. I feel Lance and Brian will be the most improved. Of course they had better be. I get the feeling Lance was probably embarassed of his freshman season. And has a lot to prove.

David McClure will get as much time as Zoubek if Zoubek's improvement is marginal.

Martynas Pocius, the only player that I have met in person was great against VCU. But his 1st 2 years must be embarassing to him like Lance must feel about his 1st year. In the right moments he will get some pt. I think he will see more action if he is 100% recovered from his foot related injuries. I bet he will have several games in double figure scoring.

Taylor King he could be a big surprise. Playing on Mater Dei means he has great coaching. They won the State Championship.In all star games he was a little slow,but he didn't shy away in contact in the Paint. He has potential in scoring if he shoots a high percentage from the field.He may have moments that will remind Duke fans of Mike Dunleavey's 3 pt barrage against the Arizona Wildcats.
I am hoping that this team will be unique that if we get into foul trouble we won't miss a beat from the bench.I agree with Jason Evans that all 11 scholarship players should be playing and not cheerleading from the pine.

mepanchin
06-17-2007, 07:42 PM
DeMarcus can be a turnover waiting to happen

David McClure will get as much time as Zoubek if Zoubek's improvement is marginal.



1. Odd, because Nelson's rate of turning it over was one of the better ones on the team. In fact, Scheyer was the only player who really wasn't a problem turning it over. Paulus, McClure, Zoubek and Thomas were turnover problems. Nelson really wasn't (but he wasn't great).

2. McClure was our best defensive player last year when he was healthy. His game suffered after he hurt his surgically repaired knee. If he's in good health this coming year, he will get a lot of PT.

mgtr
06-17-2007, 08:04 PM
We will have a lot of good players next year, and certainly for the first few months we will see a lot of different lineups. However, I voted for Paulus, Nelson, Singler, Henderson, and Zoubek. This may be a little optimistic on Zoubek, but I certainly didn't see much from LT last year that would put him in front. Maybe they will go small, with McClure in place of Zoubek. I like McClure a lot. This leaves a lot of very good players on the bench, but I think we will see a rotation of more than 7 players for most of the year. I wil guess that there won't be many players getting an average of 30 minutes or more this year.

mgtr
06-17-2007, 08:06 PM
Okay, I left out an important part -- just about four months to first practice! I am excited!

mepanchin
06-17-2007, 11:04 PM
I think there is some reason to be optimistic about Zoubek.

He only played 235 minutes this year (17.6% of total playable) so his numbers will not be entirely representative. That being said, they are still encouraging. He grabbed 31 offensive rebounds, for instance, in 235 minutes. Josh McRoberts grabbed 69 offensive rebounds in 1164 minutes. Lance Thomas grabbed 37 offensive rebounds in 463 minutes. McClure grabbed 52 in 716 minutes. Zoubek had by far the highest rate of offensive rebounding - but obviously he is unlikely to carry the same rate over next year with greater responsibility and more minutes. He also had a great rate of rebounding defensively.

Also encouraging is that while he attempted 63 field goals, he took 48 free throws, for a FT Rate even higher than Hansbrough's. Again, the rate will likely be lower given greater minutes, but it is still encouraging.

But Zoubek needs to show severe improvement in taking care of the ball and fouling less. He had 37 turnovers, which is estimated to mean that he turned it over on 33.2% of his personal possessions. This is something I anticipate can improve pretty steadily. Other big men (such as Hibbert and Aaron Gray) struggled with turnovers early in their careers too. Hibbert (who might be a freak in terms of development) only turned it over on 13.8% of personal possessions this year. If Zoubek had a TO rate like that this year, his individual offensive rating would have increased to 115 from 89 (estimated points scored per 100 possessions - over 110 is good, over 120 is excellent). We should expect a big improvement here, or at least a noticeable one.

He also had 37 fouls. All things considered, this fouling rate is not terrible: actually, it's pretty similar to Shelden's his freshman year (though Shelden played more minutes) and certainly much better than Lance Thomas. Most big men improve in this area with experience and added defensive skill.

All in all, I'm pretty optimistic. I think he should have played more this year for the experience, but a year of weight training and practice should have a big effect on him. With some more game experience, I bet his turnovers go down and he becomes a pretty great asset to have on the court.

Troublemaker
06-18-2007, 01:50 PM
I don't think Duke will be an uptempo team this season. Being a running team has a lot more to do with having the right personnel to play that style than it does with depth (since the prevailing thought seems to be -- Duke will be deeper, so we'll run more). Look at the Suns, the team that many folks want Duke to play like. Phoenix isn't deep at all but they can run, run, run because they have a speedy, Hall-of-fame level PG, two explosive big men in Amare and Marion, and several three-pt threats. Duke really only has the latter.

To me, Greg is much more of a half-court PG. He can spread the court with his shooting ability and make the occasional drive when his defender is playing too close in fear of his shot. But Greg doesn't the quickness and speed to push the ball up the court in transition to create easy opportunities for his teammates. That by itself will make Duke a halfcourt team, but we also don't have the several explosive players who can finish reliably in traffic that you need to be able to run. We have Hendo, who's probably going to be a 25 to 30 min/gm player. Okay, but who else? Nelson? Unless there's a clear path to the basket, we've seen him struggle to finish throughout his career due to his lack of size. Pocius? Maybe, but he's probably going to play 10 min/gm max. Smith? He's just a freshman -- is he strong enough? Is he going to play enough? Who else? Overall, Duke just doesn't have the personnel to play uptempo.

What Duke DOES have is a lineup that can potentially be very, very good in the halfcourt. We should have the ability to put 4 good three-pt shooters on the court at all times to keep the defense spread, and if Zoubek can score one-on-one against the man guarding him (and 90% of the time, that man will be smaller than him), it will be pretty tough to stop us. As I mentioned before, I also anticipate that the Paulus-Singler high-screen combo will be very difficult to defend as well.

Duke has been an uptempo team before and I think one day Duke will be uptempo again, but for 07-08, I don't think we have the personnel to be a running team, which is fine. If all goes well, we'll bludgeon people in the halfcourt, and there's nothing wrong with that.

mapei
06-18-2007, 03:09 PM
When was the last time we were an uptempo team? Jason was certainly an uptempo player, but would it be fair to characterize his teams that way?

Maybe 98-99? That team was certainly high-scoring. It sure seems like a long time ago.

mepanchin
06-18-2007, 04:24 PM
When was the last time we were an uptempo team? Jason was certainly an uptempo player, but would it be fair to characterize his teams that way?

Maybe 98-99? That team was certainly high-scoring. It sure seems like a long time ago.

Uhh, our teams in 00-02 were faster than our teams in 98-99 (75.9 poss. a game in 02 is one of our fastest teams ever - in 99 we averaged 73.8). Since 02, we've slowed down but we've been over 70 possessions a game most years (which is pretty fast). In 04, 05 and 07 we were our slowest, but we were almost 72 in 06, and a little over 71 in 03. In 07 we were at like 66.8 or something really slow. We'll speed up this year, I hope.

mapei
06-18-2007, 04:39 PM
Hmmm, sounds like last year was super-slow, but that Jason/Chris/Dun's teams were really fast. Thanks for the stats.

dukerev
06-21-2007, 11:20 AM
I wouldn't be surprised to see only two or three of the starters at the beginning of the year starting at the end of the year. That, however, does not mean that those players won't have significant impact throughout. For example, seeing Nelson and/or McClure start at the beginning of the year because of their experience, but then moving to a 6th/7th man role as the season wears on would make a lot of sense, especially if the freshmen and sophomores continue to develop over the course of the season.

I fully expect LT to become what we were all so excited about when he announced for Duke over Rutgers about 14 months ago. No, he's not going to be Amare (that dude is a freak!), but as he gets used to the speed and physical nature of the college game, the talent is obviously there. Foul trouble was what kept him from being more productive last year, not a lack of talent.

Barring injury, Greg will be in the starting lineup all year. I think the other four spots are up for grabs with edges going to Nelson, Scheyer, LT, Singler and Henderson. But there will be a deep rotation this year because the sophs will have another year under their belts.

SilkyJ
06-21-2007, 11:37 AM
As I mentioned before, I also anticipate that the Paulus-Singler high-screen combo will be very difficult to defend as well.


I dont know why I hadn't really thought about that, but with Singler's midrange game you are absolutely correct. And if Greg is a little quicker this year with a healed foot then that will be a lethal combo, especially if Greg can be the passer we all know he can be. Let's hope they watche some Steve Nash/Amare tape and Deron Williams/Boozer tape...

Clipsfan
06-21-2007, 12:28 PM
Paulus will be at least an Honorable Mention All-ACC performer next year... at least. Markmy words. The folks with reservations about him are looking at the player who was playing badly injured in late December and early January, not the player Greg was late in the season (when he was easily the best Dukie on the floor most nights). Greg was hurt all year. Cut him some slack.

-Jason "personally, I am surprised at the level of support for Nelson as a starter-- I think senior deference might be some off that" Evans

I agree with you on Paulus, as I really think that people were unfairly hard on him last season and I think that he will be too important to our team this year for the league not to recognize his play. He'll probably average 15+ points and increase his assists from last year, which would put him up there as one of the best offensive PGs in the league as long as he cuts down his TOs. I think that he'll be much stronger with the ball, which should help on that front.

As for Nelson, I think that it is partially senior deference, but it is more than that. He is one of our best defenders, and a great rebounder. He has some issues which we would love to see him sort out, but he's still way ahead of the younger players in that regard. He needs to work on his shooting some more (a little more arc on the outside shot, some confidence on the FTs as he supposedly shoots FTs well in practice) and finding a floater or pull-up rather than always going all the way to the rack. However, he is still one of our top 3 guards and has the ability to play even bigger than the 3 when called upon.

ACCBBallFan
06-21-2007, 07:06 PM
We will have a lot of good players next year, and certainly for the first few months we will see a lot of different lineups. However, I voted for Paulus, Nelson, Singler, Henderson, and Zoubek. This may be a little optimistic on Zoubek, but I certainly didn't see much from LT last year that would put him in front. Maybe they will go small, with McClure in place of Zoubek. I like McClure a lot. This leaves a lot of very good players on the bench, but I think we will see a rotation of more than 7 players for most of the year. I wil guess that there won't be many players getting an average of 30 minutes or more this year.

I voted for the same 5, but agree good arguments can be made for LT, Scheyer, and McClure at beginning of season. Not likely Pocius, King or Smith challenge for first 5, but they too can make a contribution, especially as quality practice competition, and capable reserve for a few minutes.

beltwayBD
07-01-2007, 04:06 PM
I know Coach K. likes to mix up the starting five for the first few weeks (usually through non-conference play), but I've been engaging in some internal speculation about the starting 5, 6th man, go-to guys on the bench, and finally the guys that will only see serious playing time in the event of injuries.

Naturally, I'll kick things off.

Probable Starting 5:

DeMarcus Nelson -- no brainer here. Duke's most reliable player, and scorer. Also the only senior if I'm not mistaken.

Greg Paulus -- despite the challenges of his sophomore season, he will still be on point. I expect him to rise to the occasion this season.

Jon Scheyer -- another no brainer here. I expect to see even more refined three-point and field goal shooting from him. I also expect that he will become the next target for Duke-haters a la JJ.

Kyle Singler -- the real stand-out in the Duke recruiting class.

Lance Thomas -- in my mind, the most underwhelming of the returning players (he had 1 assist and 43 turnovers last season...), but we are sorely lacking at the forward/center position, and I see Thomas getting it over Taylor King purely on the experience front.

"6th Man"

Toss up between Gerald Henderson and David McClure. I think McClure is still too injury-prone to get a starting spot, but he plays with a real intensity and is impressive on the defensive rebound. Gerald Henderson, on the other hand, could really deliver this season. As long as he stays away from Tyler Hansbrough's nose, that is...

Go-To Bench

Martynas Pocius -- came on very strong at the end of the season, despite our ultimate loss to VCU. Hocus Pocius, I say.

Our other impressive recruit, Taylor King should get a fair amount of time off the bench at the Forward position.

Will Sit on the Bench if They Don't Demonstrate Improvement

I want to like Zoubek so much, and think he's really got a lot of passion. But he makes a lot of mistakes, travels, and is hesitant to shoot and take it to the basket despite his size advantage. Could be a real threat if he develops some maturity.

Duke has no problem at the Guard positions, so I don't expect to see much of Nolan Smith without injuries or some impressive pre-ACC play.

The rest of the bench sort of blurs together in my mind. Boykin got a lot of play time in 05-06, but not last year, so I can't remember what kind of presence he has.

Overall Thoughts:

Without any significant threats under the basket, I think Duke will continue to struggle to take advantage of its excellent guards. Last year their defense always fell apart when things got stressful. McClure will be their leading blocker without McRoberts, and Scheyer, McClure and Nelson are tops with steals. I don't know who will step up or how the defensive dynamic will shake-out, but I'm optimistic we'll see some more cohesive and mature play this season.

Love to hear other thoughts and predictions. First DBR post, long lurker.

Best,
a beltway alumni

ACCBBallFan
07-01-2007, 04:56 PM
Jamal Boykin first had mono and then transferred to Cal around the Christmas break if I recall.

Though there have already been many of these threads and it is still too early to tell until we see the 3 newbies and the improvement of the others ...

Early in the season everybody will play but at ACC crunch time and in the tournament, the rotation always shortens.

I agree with Nelson, Paulus, Scheyer and Singler.

I am expecting big things out of Zoubek to be the only true center on the team. He is foul prone and turnover prone but will improve, out of necessity.

I also expect improvement from Lance who would back up Zoubs not because he is a post player, but because no one else is any better at it.

Henderson would be 6th man but average as many minutes as the other non PG, non-centers with Nelson, Scheyer, Singler and Henderson each playing about 30 minutes.

Nolan Smith will probably back up Paulus as Offensive PG while backing up Nelson as defensive PG. If he is not ready, Scheyer will be the backup PG.

At end of season, I expect McClure, Pocius, Smith and King will only see spot duty. My suspicion is that Taylor King's defense may hold him back the first year as it did Marty, unless King can be a smaller Pittsnoggle and defend the post but shoot the 3.

There are good arguments for leveraging McClure's experience, that Marty Pocius would have played more last year were it not for the ankle injury, that Nolan Smith is needed for his defense and ability to drive to the basket, Taylor King for his 3, ...

The big plus though is there are 11 ACC caliber guys on the roster and every day, Duke can conduct a bona fide 5 vs 5 practice even if one guy is nicked up with an ankle sprain or whatever hopefully minor injury.

Should be a fun team to watch grow and K has too many options at the wing spots and not enough at PG or center, but will find a creative way to compete every game.

Saratoga2
07-01-2007, 05:27 PM
There were many posts earlier on this same subject. There was talk of starters at the beginning of the year and those that would start later in the year. I tend to agree with your picks early on with

Nelson
Scheyer
Paulus
Singler

But I think Zoubek will get the nod over Thomas. It is really hard to rell without being privy to the development of these players and others.

At the end of the year, I believe that Henderson and Smith will possibly start over Scheyer and Nelson respectively. That will depend a lot of how each develops and whether the early starters will have improved their games.

beltwayBD
07-01-2007, 05:33 PM
Fair points all -- apologies for not reading the last few pages of posts more thoroughly.

I would really like to see Zoubek mature -- I think he would be a tremendous asset. If he can draw the occasional double-team, I think Scheyer will be very dangerous.

It will definitely be enjoyable to watch the team grow. Last season was often tough to watch, but at least we knew they had youth on their side.

mgtr
07-01-2007, 06:21 PM
Rereading the posts in this thread suggest that there is not a lot of question about four players, but the questions are immense in regard to Zoubek, Thomas, and Henderson. It is arguable that as these three play, so goes the team. If they play to their potential, we will have a fabulous seven man rotation. Heres hoping for a great season!

Channing
07-01-2007, 07:13 PM
I know its been mentioned - but I get really bummed out when I see it taken for granted that Marty is out of the rotation. During that NC State game there wasnt even a question that he was the best offensive player on the court for us. The knock against Duke last year was that we couldn't put the ball in the bucket - and Marty showed a really keen knack for doing just that. I just hope he isnt written off this season!

dukerev
07-01-2007, 07:28 PM
If Marty is healthy, he'll be in the rotation. It was evident last year, especially during the tournament(s) that when healthy he is a factor. His defensive awareness has improved and with two good wheels, he'll be on the floor.

I'm also excited to see what happens with our post play this season. There seems to be a lot of angst that the Devils have "good guard play" but weak post play. I think that we'll see improvement. LT showed great flashes, but couldn't stay out of foul trouble. Zoubek couldn't stop giving the ball to the other team, but also showed flashes. I don't think that these are uncorrectable problems: with repetition and practice, especially with a summer of hard work, both of these guys will show remarkable improvement for the coming year. Both will factor in the rotation.

mapei
07-02-2007, 12:17 PM
Count me in the group that wants more Marty on the floor. He's fun to watch.

whereinthehellami
07-02-2007, 12:33 PM
I also liked what Marty brought to the table and felt that he was given a very short leash. I tried to watch him when he was in the game and I think the effort on defense was there but that his lateral speed was an issue. You could tell that the other teams knew when he was in the game because they would immediately go after him which made it tough for him to build his confidence. I wish he had a longer leash and didn't feel the need to look over at the bench after making a mistake, its really hard to get into a ryhthym when you feel like you're going to get yanked after every bad play.

bhd28
07-02-2007, 01:04 PM
I got to see some pick-up last night (they are playing tonight at 9pm, too, I believe - at Cameron), and Nolan Smith and Talyor King both really impressed me. King looked like the best shooter on the floor (and JJ was there playing!). I know he will have some off nights, and he didn't put the ball on the floor basically all night, but he is a GREAT shooter when he is on (and he was last night)... so I really hope he gets some minutes. Nolan was beating Nelson regularly and getting into the lane for pull up jumpers, spin mooves with a fall-away, and dishes to Zoubek. He is SKINNY, but he was a much better point that I expected... he didn't shoot outside basically at all, though. Singler looked really good as well (but I expected that, so he didn't surprise me at all). He had great post moves, with fakes/spins/etc... He hit the only 3 he took, took and made several from mid-range (including a couple of beautiful off glass shots) and took T.King to the hoop several times. He also used a pick and roll regularly... and he runs it really well. Hopefully that will be incorporated more. It will be interesting to see if he 'takes over' games, as it doesn't seem his personality to do so... but hopefully if needed, he will. Lance showed an improved jumper, making several from just inside the 3-pt line. He showed a LOT more willingness to shoot it, and it went in pretty often. Unfortunately, Gregg and Gerald didn't play. Everyone else was basically par (what you would expect/saw from last year) so far. Lots of work to do this summer, but I was definitely encouraged on leaving.

Classof06
07-02-2007, 01:24 PM
I got to see some pick-up last night (they are playing tonight at 9pm, too, I believe - at Cameron), and Nolan Smith and Talyor King both really impressed me. King looked like the best shooter on the floor (and JJ was there playing!). I know he will have some off nights, and he didn't put the ball on the floor basically all night, but he is a GREAT shooter when he is on (and he was last night)... so I really hope he gets some minutes. Nolan was beating Nelson regularly and getting into the lane for pull up jumpers, spin mooves with a fall-away, and dishes to Zoubek. He is SKINNY, but he was a much better point that I expected... he didn't shoot outside basically at all, though. Singler looked really good as well (but I expected that, so he didn't surprise me at all). He had great post moves, with fakes/spins/etc... He hit the only 3 he took, took and made several from mid-range (including a couple of beautiful off glass shots) and took T.King to the hoop several times. He also used a pick and roll regularly... and he runs it really well. Hopefully that will be incorporated more. It will be interesting to see if he 'takes over' games, as it doesn't seem his personality to do so... but hopefully if needed, he will. Lance showed an improved jumper, making several from just inside the 3-pt line. He showed a LOT more willingness to shoot it, and it went in pretty often. Unfortunately, Gregg and Gerald didn't play. Everyone else was basically par (what you would expect/saw from last year) so far. Lots of work to do this summer, but I was definitely encouraged on leaving.

I don't know if you plan on going to any more pickup games, but if you do, I would love to hear more of what you saw....

bhd28
07-02-2007, 01:46 PM
Going to try to go tonight. I will do my best to update... though I am far from an expert. If there are particular players people want me to try to watch, please just let me know.

Bob Green
07-02-2007, 07:53 PM
Going to try to go tonight. I will do my best to update... though I am far from an expert. If there are particular players people want me to try to watch, please just let me know.

I would love to hear your take on Brian Zoubek. His production in the post will be very important.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

dukestheheat
07-02-2007, 08:01 PM
I still think that Smith will play the most minutes at the end of this upcoming season than any other guy at our coveted PG position.

dth.

bhd28
07-03-2007, 09:39 AM
I would love to hear your take on Brian Zoubek. His production in the post will be very important.

Bob Green
Yokosuka, Japan

Hey Bob, I posted under the link "How's Zoubek doing?"

Basically, he still has a lot of work to do. That said, he was fouled >60% of the time he was in scoring position with the ball, so it is a bit hard to tell. He had improved footwork and didn't walk but once or twice in 2 days, but he hasn't shown marked improvement since the season.

That said, Greg looked GREAT last night. He was smooth, under control, and he is our second best shooter (see King, Taylor). Every time he shoots it, you expect it to go in. Kyle had an off night, but the guy is going to be a great player (not as athletic as I hoped, but smart and skilled... he does everything well... good form on his shot as well), and Nolan Smith and Taylor King both absolutely blew me away both nights. Much better than I expected, and I could see both being big contributors this year (though not necessarily as starters). Last night, a team of Nolan, Marty, Taylor, McClure and BZ went 2 and 2 (actually, I think it was 3 and 2) against Greg, Nelson, Kyle, Scheyer, and Lance. In the the first win, TK had like 3-3s and in the last one, 4-3s. He doesn't put the ball on the floor well, but he is an insane shooter either from 3 or mid-range (coming off screens in mid-range). He hit one fall away-3 from about 25+ feet... and you can see when he starts to feel it. His energy picks up and he runs all over the place ala JJ. Hopefully he learns to do that the whole time he is in there rather than just when he is 'hot'. Nolan got to the rim (on either Greg or Nelson) at whim, and he showed much better PG skills than I expected, though mainly when he was able to break things down by penetrating. His outside shot was... meh... but he had a good mid-range game and was great at getting to the hoop. His vision isn't as good as Greg's, but when he penetrates, good things usually happened. Scheyer was the usual Scheyer. He hit open shots and played very smart both offensively and defensively. He hasn't increased the speed of his release yet, so hopefully that will be where he works this summer. Overall, I hope to see more out of Kyle and BZ, but everyone else, I am pretty happy with their development. (Oh, and I haven't seen Gerald yet... though after the article about him at the Kobe camp, I am psyched to see him).

Classof06
07-03-2007, 12:13 PM
Hey Bob, I posted under the link "How's Zoubek doing?"

Basically, he still has a lot of work to do. That said, he was fouled >60% of the time he was in scoring position with the ball, so it is a bit hard to tell. He had improved footwork and didn't walk but once or twice in 2 days, but he hasn't shown marked improvement since the season.

That said, Greg looked GREAT last night. He was smooth, under control, and he is our second best shooter (see King, Taylor). Every time he shoots it, you expect it to go in. Kyle had an off night, but the guy is going to be a great player (not as athletic as I hoped, but smart and skilled... he does everything well... good form on his shot as well), and Nolan Smith and Taylor King both absolutely blew me away both nights. Much better than I expected, and I could see both being big contributors this year (though not necessarily as starters). Last night, a team of Nolan, Marty, Taylor, McClure and BZ went 2 and 2 (actually, I think it was 3 and 2) against Greg, Nelson, Kyle, Scheyer, and Lance. In the the first win, TK had like 3-3s and in the last one, 4-3s. He doesn't put the ball on the floor well, but he is an insane shooter either from 3 or mid-range (coming off screens in mid-range). He hit one fall away-3 from about 25+ feet... and you can see when he starts to feel it. His energy picks up and he runs all over the place ala JJ. Hopefully he learns to do that the whole time he is in there rather than just when he is 'hot'. Nolan got to the rim (on either Greg or Nelson) at whim, and he showed much better PG skills than I expected, though mainly when he was able to break things down by penetrating. His outside shot was... meh... but he had a good mid-range game and was great at getting to the hoop. His vision isn't as good as Greg's, but when he penetrates, good things usually happened. Scheyer was the usual Scheyer. He hit open shots and played very smart both offensively and defensively. He hasn't increased the speed of his release yet, so hopefully that will be where he works this summer. Overall, I hope to see more out of Kyle and BZ, but everyone else, I am pretty happy with their development. (Oh, and I haven't seen Gerald yet... though after the article about him at the Kobe camp, I am psyched to see him).

That's pretty promising that Greg showed such good stuff when he was cleared to play by doctors not even two weeks ago. If this is a sign of things to come, then we'll be in good shape. It's also good to see the freshmen haven't wasted time in fitting in, as they will be integral parts of this team next year. Thanks for the updates, bhd. Keep em comin' if you can...

ACCBBallFan
07-03-2007, 07:15 PM
Last night, a team of Nolan, Marty, Taylor, McClure and BZ went 2 and 2 (actually, I think it was 3 and 2) against Greg, Nelson, Kyle, Scheyer, and Lance.
That could very well be the starting lineup losing to the reserves.

Had not read the post when I proposed similar lineups (given Gerald Henderson was not there) as potentials for K to use if he opts for the platoon system he used on Team USA.

Paulus-Nelson-Henderson-Singler-Lance
Smith-Scheyer-Pocius-King-Zoubek

with McClure filling in on whichever team is short a player due to illness,injury, or foul trouble. Sounded like Nelson was doubling on Zoubek, probabl by shading off of Mcclure.

Would be interested in hearing how well Nolan and Marty and Dave and Taylor were at feeding the ball into the post. I assume with his height and weight advantage Brian could set up wherever he wanted, but does no good unless someone gets him the ball on time and on spot.

Only bad thing is Lance does not need to get into the habit of fouling any more than he already does, but Zoubs will learn to deal with contact as he apparently had to do last year with Boykin during pickup games.