FB: Duke v Elon Postgame Thread: Duke 41, Elon 27

[loran16]

Duke defeated Elon today and basically led the entire game. Lets go over what we should take out of this victory:

Positives:

The Passing Game: Renfree stepped in for Thad without any problems today, going 31-39 with 0 INTs. The Killer Vs (Donovan Varner and Connor Vernon) both looked especially sharp, netting over a 100 yards receiving a piece. Austin Kelly was mostly invisible, but made some catches later in the game. The offensive line was for the most part functional in pass-blocking, giving Renfree time to work.

Josh Snead and Desmond Scott: Both of these guys showed great flashes of their abilities today and make a pretty good 1-2 punch. If the Offensive Line can get together and improve its run-blocking, we may not have an offense that is one-dimensional like last year.

Negatives

Run Blocking: This is still a problem. We faced an opponent today who, as a 1-AA opponent, has to be one of the smallest teams we'll face all year. It should've been an easier task to open up holes and let the RBs go crazy (like they did against NC Central last year). Instead, there were a few plays from Snead leading to the crucial fourth quarter TD, a pair of plays in the first drive leading to the Scott TD, and that's about it.

The Secondary: And here's our main problem. 20 points in non-garbage time against Elon is simply unacceptable. Time and Time again, Elon's QB (admittedly pretty good) was able to find open receivers for long gains. Johnny Williams seemed especially poor at cornerback at the moment. It makes one wonder if someone more used to the position might be better at the moment till he can better make the transition from wide-receiver.

Overall:

In the end, this wasn't a terrible start to the season and well...we looked awful against Richmond last year and we certainly improved. That said, certain things need lots of improvement, such as the Defense's performance. I expect that certain odd strategies used today, such as sending Connette in for 2 plays midway through the game, will NOT be used against real opponents. But even without such silly tactics, this team right now has a potential for turning into last year's NC-State Team: a team that is able to win in shootouts, but has problems doing so because it's D cannot stop the pass. I truely hope Cut can work his magic and improve the team so that isn't the case.

NEXT UP: Wake Forest. The winner is in good shape for a bowl. The loser...well has a tough road ahead.

[dukeblue1206]

Yeah the only glaring negative for me was the secondary. The DB's seemed to usually be in good position when in one on one but almost never had their head turned around to try and make a play on the ball.

Other than that I was pleased with the performance. The passing game looks like it will not miss a beat or may even be better. Renfree seems to have a better touch then Thad did on the short passes. Thad had a tendency to throw a 100mph ball to someone just 5 yards away.

[DU82]

Just back from the game, thought I'd post a few pluses and minuses...

The Good
Sean Renfree. He looks very comfortable out there, and sees the field, something it took Thad 3+ seasons (and two preseasons with Cutcliffe) to do. I really like his touch, and for the most part leads his receivers, so that there can be gains after the catch.
Josh Snead is quick. His TD reminded us of the Lacrosse OT goal. In before you knew what happened.
Snyderwine looks OK, better than the reports from preseason. Yes, he missed one of about 45 yards, but it was long enough, just pulled left.
The crowd. IT was an announced sellout, and unlike past years, most seats actually had bodies. IT was employee night, and many families left at half (I understand early bedtimes.) Hopefully this means WW won't be quite as crimson in two weeks as I had feared.

The Bad
DBs not looking for the ball. Johnny Williams was perhaps the worst, sometimes it looked like he thought he was still playing on offense. Hopefully, he can learn (and quickly!) A positive is that he kept up with the receivers, which has been a problem for our DBs in the past.
The defense was pretty soft, missing too many tackles. This is where losing the two linemen is going to really hurt. We don't have much size on D, and D1 teams are going to really take the ball down our throats. We didn't get much pressure on the Elon QB (who is a pretty terrific player, BTW) and that combined with what looked like very loose coverage led to far too many completions.
Running up the middle. Our RBs, especially Scott and Snead, are quick, but don't do the power running thing. Plus our line didn't open up that many holes, the "good" runs were most often to the outside.

Elon's a really good D-1AA team, but unlike past seasons, we did win, and (relatively) comfortably. We'll see if we can pull it off next week against Wake Forest.

(Edit: didn't type fast enough. Please combine with the other thread.)

[SCMatt33]

Yeah the only glaring negative for me was the secondary. The DB's seemed to usually be in good position when in one on one but almost never had their head turned around to try and make a play on the ball.

This is what I found to be the worst as well. Guys are going to get beat sometimes and since is the first game, there may be some lapses in communication and coverage, but the poor execution with one-on-one plays was not encouraging. There were a few times where the QB had to throw up pretty much a lame duck pass, and the Elon players were the only ones who went after it. There were also some bad pass interference penalties. Some were ok. I mean, if you're beat on a 40-yard route, a 15 yard penalty is better than giving up 6, but we took some penalties when guys were in good position to make a clean play.

Normally, I wouldn't care that much as it is just one unit in the first game of the year, but next week is pretty important if we want to get to 6 wins. We'll find out quickly if this was first game rust and adjusting to playing real opponents, or if we're looking at needing to simply outscore teams most of the year.

[fuse]

Apologies if this has been asked before, but what is up with the students and how they dress for games?

Some of it is funny, but a good bit of it borders on unsuitable for a family audience.

Can anyone explain the reasoning behind this?

[taiw93]

@Fuse: Students have "Tailgate" before games, which can be defined loosely as a drunken Halloween-themed frat party. Essentially, students go to the blue zone in ridiculous attire, drink a lot, and then (often) do not attend the game. It sounds like since Cutcliffe took over, more students have at least been going to the games afterward.

Exhibit A: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6VD7rDlcoA&feature=related

[Greg_Newton]

To elaborate on our O-line troubles... it seems like we're smart enough, we're just not strong enough. We did fine on pass protection, but we never got any push on running plays. You like to have your guys push the line back from the line of scrimmage on running plays, which hardly ever happened tonight.

[Acymetric]

I'll post some more elaborate thoughts tomorrow, but for now I just want to say that I'm now even more excited about this season than I was before. I'm a little worried about the secondary but I think that the coaches will have a lot of tape for Johnny Williams to look at between now and Saturday. His mistakes were pretty much all mental, he definitely looks to have the tools to be a top notch CB.

Oh, tried to give a shoutout to CB&B and the rest of the DBR group over by the Card lot when I marched by, if you think you heard someone yell "DBR!" when the Elon band went by...you did!

[throatybeard]

Loran mentions the secondary. It seems like this has been a huge problem for us for the better part of the last two decades. (Salt to taste longer if you've been watching longer than I have--I started in the early to mid 80s). But, even when we got a "sexy" recruit at CB, it seemed like that guy got burned a lot. Stanford and Hamilton come to mind. I think some of our sexiest CB recruits have been athletically skilled but undersized. The safeties have been a bit stronger, perhaps. Undersized probably isn't our problem against Elon.

This is a problem--like most problems--that will only be solved with at least five to seven years' worth of stable recruiting. And please God could we redshirt some good players like the big schools and Wake Forest usually do.

[peloton]

Loran mentions the secondary. It seems like this has been a huge problem for us for the better part of the last two decades.

Throaty (and Loran), unfortunately I have to heartily agree regarding our cornerbacks' play. It seems that our cornerbacks have always been pretty diminutive. Just for kicks, I checked Go.Duke.com and sure enough most of our cornerbacks are 5'11' or shorter, which is what I was thinking was the case. We do have a couple that are 6 ft but they are both redshirt freshmen (still adapting to the college game I assume.) Although many of our undersized CBs over the years have made some spectacular plays, we do seem to get burned on a regular basis by teams with good sized receivers. I think just about everyone in Wallace Wade yelled at one or two of our guys at this position at least once tonight. They'd play tough defense but even on long bombs often wouldn't turn around to face the ball and make a play for the interception. I strongly suspect that this'll be brought to their attention during film sessions (ya think? :))

All in all, a fun game to watch...for obvious reasons. Ozzie, I was indeed impressed with Josh Snead. It's going to be a treat to watch both him and Desmond improve as running backs. On a side note, it was great to see both you and Chris again at Brunchgate. Maybe next time we'll get there early enough to actually stay awhile and chat more.

[Dukeface88]

And please God could we redshirt some good players like the big schools and Wake Forest usually do.

I think there were definately a few questionable personel decisions tonight. Thompson was mentioned in the other thread as someone who we didn't really need to play; I'd add Braxton to that list. On the other hand, I didn't notice any true freshmen playing on defense; if there were they had no tackles.

[4decadedukie]

I watched on ESPN-3 (360), which was better coverage than I expected. I was generally pleased, especially with Renfree's poise, accuracy, and maturity/leadership. With this said, we have a long way to go -- but I honestly believe that, overall, we are solidly on a path that will achieve Duke's objectives within a few years. This team has an unusually difficult schedule and its young (particularly our defense). However, the passing game shows strong potential, we ran the ball with some success, and the defense -- although inconsistent -- forced a key interception that ensured our victory. In aggregate, this was a decent start, especially in comparison to years past.

[SCMatt33]

Throaty (and Loran), unfortunately I have to heartily agree regarding our cornerbacks' play. It seems that our cornerbacks have always been pretty diminutive. Just for kicks, I checked Go.Duke.com and sure enough most of our cornerbacks are 5'11' or shorter, which is what I was thinking was the case. We do have a couple that are 6 ft but they are both redshirt freshmen (still adapting to the college game I assume.)

Aren't CB's pretty short in general. They have a name for tall CB's, Wide Receivers. Seriously, even a lot of NFL corners are 6-0 and under. For example, Darrelle Revis is only 5-11. Nnamdi Asomugha is 6-2, and he's tall for a corner.

[kyriecrazy2013]

Austin Kelly was mostly invisible, but made some catches later in the game.

He didn't play in the first half.

Also a lot of you are forgetting that defense isnt a position by position thing. The LBs and defensive line need to get more pressure on the QB consistently. They started off well but there needs to be more pressure throughout the game for the CBs to do their job. That being said, the CBs do need some work.

[Genedoc]

Aren't CB's pretty short in general. They have a name for tall CB's, Wide Receivers. Seriously, even a lot of NFL corners are 6-0 and under. For example, Darrelle Revis is only 5-11. Nnamdi Asomugha is 6-2, and he's tall for a corner.
Exactly - 6'4" dudes with corner speed and great hands are WRs.

I hate piling on a kid, so I won't, but our corner play last night was abysmal from the very beginning.

Renfree was markedly better than the numbers look. At least 4 or 5 of his incompletions were drops that hit receivers squarely in the hands, and 2 of them would have been for TDs. Another incompletion was a throw away on a busted play. I only remember him missing 1 or 2 legitimate pass attempts all game.

My guess is that Renfree sets all sorts of records this year. Based on the way the O and the D looked, we're going to have to score 35+ regularly, mostly through the air, and we actually looked capable of scoring that much.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Loved, loved, loved our passing game! Renfree throws such a nice ball, on target, on time and easy to catch! And the Killer V's (I like that name!) and company, including our bevvy of tight ends, do a nice job of catching the ball, hanging on to it after the catch, and making extra yards - they are all tough runners!

Desmond Scott and Josh Snead are both tough, quick runners. Watching Snead in HS last year, he does NOT shy away from tough runs up the middle, although as noted he's not a big bruiser. What he excels at is breaking through the line, after contact, and taking it to the house for 40, 50, 70 yards. On a team where he handled the ball 75+% of the time, so the defense keyed on him on every play, he'd have 35 to 40 carries and 2 or 3 long runs (and rarely lost yardage, even when hit at the line).

Defensively, our corners, especially Johnny Williams, need to LOOK FOR THE FREAKING BALL http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/26.gif! Our linebackers played well, and Kromah made a beautiful interception http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/bandit.gif late in the game, catching a bullet as it didn't whiz past him! And I look for Kenny Anunike to be an impact player at DE as he grows into his roll.

A fun night, an incredible day of Brunchgating! Nice seeing Peloton and others who dropped by. :cool: No, I didn't hear Acymetric yell DBR, but that's just crazietalk anyway!

On to Wake Forest, and then the upset of the millennium! I can look past Wake, the team can't.

[mkline09]

It was an impressive showing in terms of the fan support at least up to the end of the third quarter. Granted many were Duke employees taking advantage of the employee appreciation night, still it was good to see Wallace Wade nearly full with Duke fans. Or at least Duke Blue.

[Bob Green]

There are a few stats which stick out in a positive way: 1.) We were 6 for 6 in red zone opportunities with four touchdowns. 2.) We were 9 for 14 on third down conversions. 3.) We won time of possession 36:05 to 23:55.

http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=22672&SPID=1843&DB_OEM_ID=4200&ATCLID=204988569

There is lots of room for improvement, especially on the defense, but also lots to be excited about, mostly on offense. Sean Renfree demonstrated total control of the offense, Donovan Varner and Conner Vernon were outstanding catching the ball and running for extra yards, while Desmond Scott and Josh Snead showed our running game has a pulse.

This time 12 months ago we were lamenting the loss to Richmond so my glass is definitely half full this morning.

[Olympic Fan]

Just a few additional observations:

(1) Kelly didn't play a snap in the first half, then played 80 percent of the offensive snaps in the second. Nothing was announced, but I suspect there was some kind of one-half suspension for some transgression.

He ended up with three catches for 27 yards -- including the biggest catch of the night ... when Elon closed to 27-20 early in the fourth quarter, he kept Duke's clinching drive alive with a clutch third-down catch.

Overall, the receivers would get an A for the night. I'd make it in A plus if Vernon had not dropped a TD pass in the first half. It was a bullet on a slant, but it's a play he should have made.

(2) Renfree was an A-plus. It's hard to imagine how he could have had a better night. He as 31-of-39 with two drops. At least two and maybe three of his other misses were intentional throw-aways. I can only remember one open receiver that he missed all night. He moved well -- including one nice four yard run when Juwan Thompson went the wrong way and forced him to keep it himself. I was told that he was a great leader in the huddle ... I pray this kid stays healthy ... he's going to be a great one.

(3) Four freshmen played -- Connette at QB; Snead and Thompson at TB and Braxton at WR. I've heard some comments by people that they wish one or two of those guys had not played and would redshirt. I disagree, let me address the decision behind each of those kids:

-- Connette: For better or worse, he's our backup quarterback. He clearly outperformed Schroeder in spring and preseason. If something happens to Renfree, he give us our best chance to win. If that's the case, you've GOT to get him some playing time, just in case -- so he doesn't go in cold. In addition, he does bring a dimension that Renfree and Schroeder lack -- he's an excellent runner (as he showed with his 48-yard jaunt in garbage time). There will be times this year when that comes in handy.

-- Snead and Thompson: We're going to need both of them this year. Jay Hollingsworth and Patrick Kurunwune do a lot of nice things, but neither is quick enough to be a successful runner. That leaves Desmond Scott, who does have potential ... and Snead and Thompson. That's three quality backs to carry the ball and that's why you need. Hollingsworth and Kurunwune will play, but as blockers, sometimes receivers.

-- Brandon Braxton: The most controversial decision, I agree. We appear to be deep and hugely talented at WR (and TE). So why play this kid?

Well, I would argue (and I suspect the coaches agree) that Braxton brings a dimension that none of Duke's other WRs offer -- he's a big, fast WR with the ability to catch the ball in traffic -- or in a jump-ball situation. I know we didn't see that last night, but we have in scrimmages.

And, not to be cynical, look at our receivers another way. Varner, Vernon and maybe Kelly are superior ACC receivers. But what have we got that's proven after that? The coaches think Watkins has a lot of potential, but he hasn;t show it in games yet. Foster, after two nothing years, looked great in preseason, but did nothing last night. Gattis? Tresvant?

We usually use three WRs at a time. Three great ones are not enough. You have to rotate ... you really need five or six. Who are the fourth and fifth and sixth guys in the rotation? Right now, Braxton is somewhere with Watkins and Foster in the second three -- maybe ahead of them. And, as I said, he brings something that nobody --not the Killer Vs -- can bring. He CAN be a huge factor for us THIS YEAR.

-- I'd grade the offensive line a C-plus. The plus comes from superior pass blocking. Renfree was sacked once when Bryan Morgan (of all people) got fooled on a DL twist. But one sack (and maybe 2-3 hurries) in 40 called passes is pretty darned good. The run blocking was not near that level -- it was erratic. I don't know what the reason was, but there were some bueatifully blocked plays -- and several when it looked like last year. They played a lot of people -- Coleman, Harding, Finion and Needham all played off the bench -- and hopefully the film will show the coaches something that might help figure out why things broke down so often.

Still, Duke finished with 192 yards rushing ... Duke only topped 100 yards once last season -- and that was against NCCU. Believe me, Elon is MUCH better defensively than NCCU -- they were the top defense in the Southern Conference and one of the best in the FCS last year. I know they lost some guys, but I also know they expect to be near the same level this year.

-- The secondary would get a D. Except for Lee Butler, who was very solid, coverage was disappointing. As others have pointed out, Johnny Williams REALLY struggled. Not ready to give up on him at CB, but if he doesn't get a lot better quickly, he should be moving back to WR.

I was more disappointed by Cockrell. He made a few plays (after getting very badly burned on Elon's first drive), but I thought he looked a lot better in scrimmages than he did against Elon. And he does have size -- he's a legit 6-foot CB. Matt Daniels made some plays -- including an INT, plus he was our most solid tackler against the run.

The DBs were hung out to dry a few times because in order to generate pressure, Duke did a lot of blitzing. Unfortunately, Scott Riiddle is a VERY accomplished QB and vetera passers love to attack blitzing teams.

-- The best thing about the defense is that we played a lot of people. I saw some good things from young LBs Campbell and Gamble, from DE Foxx and from S Young-Wiseman. But a lot of those guys made mistakes too.

Overall, I'd give the opener a solid B ... it's really hard to judge because we don't know for sure how good an FCS team Elon will be this year. They were picked No. 7 preseason, about where they finished last year. Our next foe, Wake Forest routed FCS Presbyterian in their opener -- Presbyterian was 0-11 last year.

Interesting in that the spread on the Duke-Elon game was 5.5 to 7.5 points -- we covered easily. Wake was a 44.5 point favorite ... and failed to cover, winning by "just" 40. So which team was the more impressive?

No matter, it was a W and after Richmond last year, that was a vital first step to keeping our season goals alive. I think the Wake game coming up this week is the key to the season -- win it and I'll be fairly confident of getting to six wins and a bowl. Lose it and it's hard to see how that happens.

[6th Man]

I couldn't agree more with all of the posts in this thread. One thing I kept thinking about last night is that while I am excited for this season, I can sense that if we can improve our defense, Duke might have a special football team by the time Renfree is a senior. Vernon and Desmond Scott will be seniors...there should be some major talent on offense. I think we have a lot to look forward to, including watching this team grow...especially and hopefully in the secondary.

[Acymetric]

Hey, could anyone who heard the postgame on the radio give a summary? I wasn't able to listen, but I would be curious to see what Cut had to say. Thanks!

[Reilly]

...
Still, Duke finished with 192 yards rushing ... Duke only topped 100 yards once last season -- and that was against NCCU. Believe me, Elon is MUCH better defensively than NCCU -- they were the top defense in the Southern Conference and one of the best in the FCS last year. I know they lost some guys, but I also know they expect to be near the same level this year. ....

Take away BC's run in the end, and Duke averaged 3.27 yards per carry.

[loran16]

(3) Four freshmen played -- Connette at QB; Snead and Thompson at TB and Braxton at WR. I've heard some comments by people that they wish one or two of those guys had not played and would redshirt. I disagree, let me address the decision behind each of those kids:

-- Connette: For better or worse, he's our backup quarterback. He clearly outperformed Schroeder in spring and preseason. If something happens to Renfree, he give us our best chance to win. If that's the case, you've GOT to get him some playing time, just in case -- so he doesn't go in cold. In addition, he does bring a dimension that Renfree and Schroeder lack -- he's an excellent runner (as he showed with his 48-yard jaunt in garbage time). There will be times this year when that comes in handy.


I just have to disagree. Listen, its important to have a backup QB. Fine. But he should be a BACKUP. Connette could be a backup and still redshirt, only burning the redshirt if necessary.

And the running QB thing i find is totally bull unless they're Tim Tebow. When Connette comes on, the opposing team knows to watch for the run, negating its effectiveness. And i find it hard to believe he can pass better than Renfree. Thus putting him in is more or less WORSENING our offense for one or two drives a game.

Seems silly to me.





-- Snead and Thompson: We're going to need both of them this year. Jay Hollingsworth and Patrick Kurunwune do a lot of nice things, but neither is quick enough to be a successful runner. That leaves Desmond Scott, who does have potential ... and Snead and Thompson. That's three quality backs to carry the ball and that's why you need. Hollingsworth and Kurunwune will play, but as blockers, sometimes receivers.

Umm, hate to say this, but Hollingsworth in particular is going to get plenty of carries. Kurunwune may not. So with 2 running backs already (if we ignore kurunwune) there was no need to burn BOTH Thompson and Snead's redshirts.

[Olympic Fan]

I just have to disagree. Listen, its important to have a backup QB. Fine. But he should be a BACKUP. Connette could be a backup and still redshirt, only burning the redshirt if necessary.

And the running QB thing i find is totally bull unless they're Tim Tebow. When Connette comes on, the opposing team knows to watch for the run, negating its effectiveness. And i find it hard to believe he can pass better than Renfree. Thus putting him in is more or less WORSENING our offense for one or two drives a game.

Seems silly to me.


I guess we'll just have to disagree.

What happens if we get off to a 4-3 start this season and Renfree goes down in a tie game with Navy? You're going to play Connette cold? You're going to ask a freshman who has never played a snap to step in a save the two games -- Navy and Virginia the next week -- that we have to win to be a bowl team?

Connette isn't Tim Tebow, but he isn't Zack Asack either. Yeah, he's a threat to run, but if defenses are stacked for that, he can and will throw.

The point is not to play him so much as a change of pace, but to prepare him for a situation where he might have to salvage our season if Renfree gets hurt, You might not think that's of value -- but I do (and apparently so do the coaches).

Besides, we're redshirting Anthony Boone, who probably has more promise that Schroeder. If you redshirt Connette, that means you have the second and third best QBs in your program in the same class. This way, they'll be a year apart in eligibility.

As for the running backs, all I can say is wait. as the season wears on, both Snead and Thompson will get more carries than Hollingsworth -- more effective carries. The two freshmen and Scott are our future at running back and we're going to need all three.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

I guess we'll just have to disagree.

What happens if we get off to a 4-3 start this season and Renfree goes down in a tie game with Navy? You're going to play Connette cold? You're going to ask a freshman who has never played a snap to step in a save the two games -- Navy and Virginia the next week -- that we have to win to be a bowl team?

Connette isn't Tim Tebow, but he isn't Zack Asack either. Yeah, he's a threat to run, but if defenses are stacked for that, he can and will throw.

The point is not to play him so much as a change of pace, but to prepare him for a situation where he might have to salvage our season if Renfree gets hurt, You might not think that's of value -- but I do (and apparently so do the coaches).

Besides, we're redshirting Anthony Boone, who probably has more promise that Schroeder. If you redshirt Connette, that means you have the second and third best QBs in your program in the same class. This way, they'll be a year apart in eligibility.

As for the running backs, all I can say is wait. as the season wears on, both Snead and Thompson will get more carries than Hollingsworth -- more effective carries. The two freshmen and Scott are our future at running back and we're going to need all three.

I think you're right on point. This program is still going through a rather long transition to becoming strong again. Wake faced the same thing for the first few years and had to play many they wanted to redshirt. We've got to increase the number of wins during this transition and that makes for a very tenuous balance between playing now and saving for later.

In addition to the observations made earlier about the game, I'm looking for a greater intensity to develop as the younger guys gain experience. Wallace Wade used to say he could see it in the players' eyes.

Another point about yesterday, the game day atmosphere was the best in years. There was a sense of real excitement and energy returning to campus.

[devildeac]

Exactly - 6'4" dudes with corner speed and great hands are WRs.

I hate piling on a kid, so I won't, but our corner play last night was abysmal from the very beginning.

Renfree was markedly better than the numbers look. At least 4 or 5 of his incompletions were drops that hit receivers squarely in the hands, and 2 of them would have been for TDs. Another incompletion was a throw away on a busted play. I only remember him missing 1 or 2 legitimate pass attempts all game.

My guess is that Renfree sets all sorts of records this year. Based on the way the O and the D looked, we're going to have to score 35+ regularly, mostly through the air, and we actually looked capable of scoring that much.

I think the only "bad" ball he threw all night was the one he threw behind one of the Vs in the end zone near the end of the 1st half. Yes, he got his hands on it but it was behind him and would have been a tough catch for the TD. Quite a debut.

[devildeac]

Loved, loved, loved our passing game! Renfree throws such a nice ball, on target, on time and easy to catch! And the Killer V's (I like that name!) and company, including our bevvy of tight ends, do a nice job of catching the ball, hanging on to it after the catch, and making extra yards - they are all tough runners!

Desmond Scott and Josh Snead are both tough, quick runners. Watching Snead in HS last year, he does NOT shy away from tough runs up the middle, although as noted he's not a big bruiser. What he excels at is breaking through the line, after contact, and taking it to the house for 40, 50, 70 yards. On a team where he handled the ball 75+% of the time, so the defense keyed on him on every play, he'd have 35 to 40 carries and 2 or 3 long runs (and rarely lost yardage, even when hit at the line).

Defensively, our corners, especially Johnny Williams, need to LOOK FOR THE FREAKING BALL http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/26.gif! Our linebackers played well, and Kromah made a beautiful interception http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/bandit.gif late in the game, catching a bullet as it didn't whiz past him! And I look for Kenny Anunike to be an impact player at DE as he grows into his roll.

A fun night, an incredible day of Brunchgating! Nice seeing Peloton and others who dropped by. :cool: No, I didn't hear Acymetric yell DBR, but that's just crazietalk anyway!

On to Wake Forest, and then the upset of the millennium! I can look past Wake, the team can't.

What made Kromah's INT even more impressive was that the ball was behind him and he still made the pick. Very nice.

[devildeac]

Take away BC's run in the end, and Duke averaged 3.27 yards per carry.

Which is a move in the right direction, better than the ~2.2 yards/carry we averaged last year.

http://crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/devil9f.gif

[CameronBornAndBred]

Not much to add to what has been said. I was hoping to see Connette earlier, but our defense never really let that happen (specifically the CB's..but it's been well noted so far). I was sure Connette was just going to come in and take a knee, so to see him bust out that run was loads of fun. Thanks to all who stopped by the crazietalk tent, it was great putting new faces to old names and seeing old faces once again. The whole day was an 18 hour blast.

[Devilsfan]

I have been going to Duke games since the middle of the decade and whether it was Ted's soldiers or Cut's we have never had a true BCS defensive backfield. Cut (I wouldn't trade him for any coach in the country including Sabin) has given us more speed but they need to start looking for the ball. They are so small that we might be in a bit of trouble down the road when we start playing real college FB teams. It didn't take elon long to realize their #3 was a great match up against Williams. As for the O line, they pass block better but they can't seem to consistently open holes for our backs who at first seemed a little impatient and didn't seem to wait for plays to develop. We did end up with almost 200 yards on the ground even if 50 were on a late in the game run by our back up QB. Renfree, and Varner were truely excellent on the positive side.

[jimsumner]

I just have to disagree. Listen, its important to have a backup QB. Fine. But he should be a BACKUP. Connette could be a backup and still redshirt, only burning the redshirt if necessary.



But if it's necessary, that means Renfree is injured. If Renfree is injured, wouldn't you prefer replacing him with a QB who has some game experience under his belt as opposed to a QB who had no game experience?

Preparing your back-up to take the field if necessary seems very basic to me.

[Acymetric]

But if it's necessary, that means Renfree is injured. If Renfree is injured, wouldn't you prefer replacing him with a QB who has some game experience under his belt as opposed to a QB who had no game experience?

Preparing your back-up to take the field if necessary seems very basic to me.

I also feel comfortable assuming that we will have recruited another good QB by the time Connette leaves. Having him for an extra year would be nice, but having a legit backup with actual game experience this year is so much more important. We have zero margin for error this year, and I really think its important that we turn a corner NOW. If we do, recruiting will start to pick up (and that includes new QBs). Playing Connette is absolutely the right call...particularly if he can rip off a few plays like the final play of the game every once in a while.

[Olympic Fan]

I have been going to Duke games since the middle of the decade and whether it was Ted's soldiers or Cut's we have never had a true BCS defensive backfield. Cut (I wouldn't trade him for any coach in the country including Sabin) has given us more speed but they need to start looking for the ball. They are so small that we might be in a bit of trouble down the road when we start playing real college FB teams.

All I can say is be patient. The young guys DO have BCS size and speed. But they are young -- Ross Cockrell (6-0, 170), Garrett Patterson (6-0, 180), Anthony Young-Wiseman (6-1, 200) and Walt Canty (6-1, 205). Jordan Byas is 6-2, 215 ... Quan Stevenson (redshirtinjg this year) is 6-1, 210 -- that's bigger as a group than Virginia Tech's secondary or the one UNC thought it would have before the suspensions (their two veteran corners, Brown and Burney, are 5-10 and 5-9, respectively). The guys Cut is working in have ACC-quality speed to go with their size.

What they don't have is experience. Chris Rwabukamba is playing because he's a smart experienced back, but he does not have top-level ACC physical gifts. The new guys do and when they develop later this year or the next, you see a secondary that's as big and has fast as any on the ACC.

The same thing is happening at LB. The second year guys are top-level BCS athletes -- more than Tauiliili or Rey or Kromah ever were. Auggie Campbell is 6-3, 225 and has run a 4.37 40 (he's consistently in the 4.4s). Austin Gamble and Kevin Rojas are in the 220 range and they consistently run 4.5 40s. Glover isn't quite that fast, but he's 240 pounds and benches 400-plus. Again, they've got to learn, but they have FSU linebacker size and speed -- the FSU defense of the '90s. I can't wait to see what Kelby Brown, CJ France and Isaac Blakeney (6-6, 215 as a freshman) develop into.

I know it's tough to say be patient after all these years, but it's coming -- the DB will be ACC quality very soon. The LBs will be the class of the league very soon. The WRs are already ACC quality. Renfree is going to be a stud for the next three years. The OL is almost there -- the four redshirt freshmen and the two that are redshirting this year (Tomlison and Cofield) are all ACC quality size and strength and agility.

Still work to the be done on the DL, although a lot of promise at the end. We'll have to see if Ingram, Sink, Hood and/or Bryant are ACC-quality tackles.

But it's coming ... don't doubt it.

[CameronBornAndBred]

For anyone wanting to put faces to some posters' names, check here for a bunch of shots from yesterday.
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=214936&l=3aba81295f&id=330893144629

[Bob Green]

All I can say is be patient. The young guys DO have BCS size and speed....What they don't have is experience. Chris Rwabukamba is playing because he's a smart experienced back, but he does not have top-level ACC physical gifts. The new guys do and when they develop later this year or the next, you see a secondary that's as big and has fast as any on the ACC.

This season has been described as a transition year where we are between the players Coach Cutcliffe inherited and those he recruited. The team is young and this season is going to be frustrating at times. I present as Exhibit A the angst over the secondary's performance in yesterday's win.

I agree with OF and others in the thread that us Duke fans are going to have to have patience this season. There is certainly going to be a lot to be excited about (Renfree/Vernon/Varner for starters and Scott/Snead hopefully) and there will be lots to fret about (secondary). In the end, it is important that the team show progress toward developing into an ACC and BCS contender, and that progress cannot be graded by wins and losses exclusively. Duke fans are going to have to utilize qualitative analysis to truly understand the degree we are progressing. There is more to progress than the number of wins recorded in a season.

But, and this is a big but, I still fully expect this team to win at least six games. Next week at Wake Forest will go a long way toward demonstrating if my expectations are realistic.

Finally, in regard to Connette, I agree with Coach Cutcliffe's decision to play him. Coach Cutcliffe is a QB maestro so it is really folly to disagree with his decisions in that area.

[Merlindevildog91]

Can we stop talking about needing BCS-caliber players? We are in the FBS (Football Bowl Subdivision), aka Division I. Elon is in the BCS (Bowl Championship Subdivision), aka Division I-AA.

FWIW, our corners have a bit of work to get up to BCS level, much less FBS level.

[Acymetric]

Can we stop talking about needing BCS-caliber players? We are in the FBS (Football Bowl Subdivision), aka Division I. Elon is in the BCS (Bowl Championship Subdivision), aka Division I-AA.

FWIW, our corners have a bit of work to get up to BCS level, much less FBS level.

No, Elon is FCS (Football Championship Subdivision). Bowls have absolutely nothing to do with Elon's division of play. BCS (Bowl Championship Series) is the combination of the 4 major bowls and the championship game for the FBS teams. Saying BCS level players means that we want players ready to compete in the BCS conferences (Big Ten, Big East, ACC, Big 12, SEC, and Pac 10).

[Merlindevildog91]

No, Elon is FCS (Football Championship Subdivision). Bowls have absolutely nothing to do with Elon's division of play. BCS (Bowl Championship Series) is the combination of the 4 major bowls and the championship game for the FBS teams. Saying BCS level players means that we want players ready to compete in the BCS conferences (Big Ten, Big East, ACC, Big 12, SEC, and Pac 10).

Sorry. Got in too late from the game to have any oxygen to my brain today. I'm unfortunately far too familiar to the pundits talking about BCS and how screwy it is. I guess I'm just trying to forget how messed up the Div I championship system is.

[Dev11]

Some friends and I were thinking about it, and one idea we passed around regarding Connette is that we gave Wake just a little bit of film for them to have to fret over this week. Surely their staff went into the film room Friday and was just thinking about Renfree and our explosive passing game, but now they have to get a game plan together for the added freshman running ability of Snead AND Connette. A potential headache, I say. Connette is going to be a special player, and if Renfree plays like he did yesterday, he likely won't be around his full 5 years (this is year 3). Connette may get 2 full years in the starting role, if we're being optimistic about Renfree.

[peloton]

Olympic Fan, you're not helping my situation at all I must say. With my enthusiasm for Duke football this season already close to being off the charts, your positive and confidence inspiring post re:some of our more recent additions at the linebacker and cornerback positions is just like throwing gasoline on a fire :D. That's very encouraging and great to hear. Add one more reason why I should be even more optimistic about the future of Duke football.

Chris, enjoyed seeing the photos from yesterday. Hopefully my sons will have fond memories of Dad taking them to Duke games (just as I do of mine when he did the same for me all those years ago.) I really like the picture of Cut high fiving fans along the route of the Devil Walk.

Bob, I can only speak for myself but believe me, after being a Duke fan for 40+ years I'm very patient when it comes to Duke football. I confess that like Ozzie, I'm the eternal optimist. I think (or at least hope) that most true Duke football fans will be patient with Coach Cutcliffe and the team knowing full well what we've been through the last few decades. I realize that the program was down for so many years that it'll (still) take some time to recover and for the patient to be pronounced "strong and healthy". But, we are obviously already seeing progress in so many areas - recruiting, results on the field compared to recent head coaches, facilities improvements, and the list goes on. I for one am very excited about the future of Duke football, will remain patient, and will thoroughly enjoy watching as this team (and future teams) mature and improve. Bring on the Demon Deacs - I believe we're ready for the next challenge.

[4decadedukie]

. . . I'm very patient when it comes to Duke football. I confess that like Ozzie, I'm the eternal optimist. I think (or at least hope) that most true Duke football fans will be patient with Coach Cutcliffe and the team knowing full well what we've been through the last few decades. . . . But, we are obviously already seeing progress in so many areas - recruiting, results on the field compared to recent head coaches, facilities improvements, and the list goes on. I for one am very excited about the future of Duke football, will remain patient, and will thoroughly enjoy watching as this team (and future teams) mature and improve.

Absolutely right! Duke is developing football the correct way -- no short-cuts, addressing all the key areas, and maintaining Duke behavioral and academic standards -- so our long-term prognosis is good. We should not be discouraged by the gradualness of our progress. Further, we should expect occasional setbacks, while remembering just how far we have come (for example, consider the number of win-less seasons in the recent past). Our football program requires strong fan and alumni support throughout this journey, and the eventual reward will be an enduring football program that represents Duke with the same excellence that characterizes the University in so many other areas.

[PDDuke85]

First- Thanks for posting your pictures CBAB
Nice for this long distance fan, frequent DBR reader and occasional smart a#@*% poster to put faces to names.

Second, what a treat it was for myself and Mrs PD to arrive at 4:15 PM and NOT be able to park in our per usual lot as it was full. What a great tribute to the current state of Duke football to not be able to arrive 2 hours before kick off and waltz into good parking and a 50 yard seat. As we missed The Walk, we will plan on leaving the low country earlier in the morning for the Army game presuming a 7:00 PM start.

Troisième: How awesome was it to see WW full, full of blue, and Mick Jagger nowhere to be seen!

I have no sage football tidbits to add as the strengths and weaknesses of the game have been dissected by folks of greater football IQ. That said, isn't it great to pick apart glaring mistakes after a 41-27 victory? Gone are the days looking to take away a positive after a 35-0 defeat. Glad to have buried those days.

Next game for us, Army.

GO DUKE!

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

Just a few additional observations:

(1) Kelly didn't play a snap in the first half, then played 80 percent of the offensive snaps in the second. Nothing was announced, but I suspect there was some kind of one-half suspension for some transgression.

He ended up with three catches for 27 yards -- including the biggest catch of the night ... when Elon closed to 27-20 early in the fourth quarter, he kept Duke's clinching drive alive with a clutch third-down catch.
My understanding was that Austin was plagued by a hamstring injury during the pre-season camp and thus didn't work into becoming a starter for the first game.

Is there more background to support some sort of disciplinary action against Austin?:confused:

[Acymetric]

My understanding was that Austin was plagued by a hamstring injury during the pre-season camp and thus didn't work into becoming a starter for the first game.

Is there more background to support some sort of disciplinary action against Austin?:confused:

I recall hearing that he was late to a team dinner...1 half suspensions are usually for minor things like that. I would find it extremely unlikely that it was just because he hadn't worked his way up to being a starter since he played none in the first half and played a ton in the second. Its nothing to worry about though, pretty sure the coaches and AK have already forgotten (though Austin is probably disappointed he didn't get to start his first game of his senior year, he and the rest of the team have bigger things to worry about).

ETA: I think I read that in this thread, so whoever posted that...the credit is all yours. Unless I read it somewhere else. ;)

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

I recall hearing that he was late to a team dinner...1 half suspensions are usually for minor things like that. I would find it extremely unlikely that it was just because he hadn't worked his way up to being a starter since he played none in the first half and played a ton in the second. Its nothing to worry about though, pretty sure the coaches and AK have already forgotten (though Austin is probably disappointed he didn't get to start his first game of his senior year, he and the rest of the team have bigger things to worry about).

ETA: I think I read that in this thread, so whoever posted that...the credit is all yours. Unless I read it somewhere else. ;)

My comment was based on what Coach Cutcliffe had to say.

[devildeac]

My understanding was that Austin was plagued by a hamstring injury during the pre-season camp and thus didn't work into becoming a starter for the first game.

Is there more background to support some sort of disciplinary action against Austin?:confused:

The first part of this is true. He did not remove the "do not hit/non-practicing/black jersey" until Thursday or Friday last week. Don't know about "didn't work into becoming a starter." Any talk of disciplinary action was not part of a discussion I had last PM. It still could be true but it wasn't mentioned during my conversation.

[Greg_Newton]

The first part of this is true. He did not remove the "do not hit/non-practicing/black jersey" until Thursday or Friday last week. Don't know about "didn't work into becoming a starter." Any talk of disciplinary action was not part of a discussion I had last PM. It still could be true but it wasn't mentioned during my conversation.

FWIW, in his postgame comments, Cut said it was because Austin missed camp and he wanted to reward the work his replacement (I forget his name) did during that time.

[Acymetric]

FWIW, in his postgame comments, Cut said it was because Austin missed camp and he wanted to reward the work his replacement (I forget his name) did during that time.

Thanks! Thats the first I've heard of this (wasn't able to listen to the postgame myself). That explains it then (although I'm still confused why he didn't play a snap in the first half at all).