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NSDukeFan
07-19-2010, 03:07 PM
Since it is the summer, and I need other things to keep me occupied until the season starts, I was wondering how many of Duke's players would make one of the three all-ACC teams next year (not including freshmen of the year, or the all defensive team.)

I did a bit of research (and it would have been a lot easier if I had seen the ACC media guide online sooner http://www.theacc.com/sports/m-baskbl/0910accmbkguide.html, and as far as I can tell, there have only been 3 all-ACC teams since 1989-90.

I was looking at some of Duke's better teams and the most all-ACC players Duke has had was 5, in 1998-99 (Brand and Langdon first team, Avery 2nd team, Battier and Carrawell third team).
The 1991-92 team had 4 all-ACC players (Laettner first team, Grant Hill and Hurley 2nd team, Thomas Hill third team) as did the 2003-04 team (Duhon first team, Redick and Williams second team, and Deng third team - Ewing was honorable mention.)
Most of our other top teams have had 3 all-ACC performers, including:
1990-91 (Laettner 1st team, Hurley and T. Hill 3rd team)
2000-01 (Battier and Williams 1st team, James 3rd team - Dunleavy and Boozer honorable mention)
2001-02 (3 1st teamers Williams, Boozer and Dunleavy)
2007-08 (DMarc 1st team, Paulus and Singler 3rd team)
Another of our top teams (2005-06) had only 2 all-ACC performers, (Redick and Williams 1st team) but they were both all-American candidates.

As most are aware, Kyle (1st team) and Nolan (2nd team) are Duke's returning all-ACC players. I believe there are 5 other all-ACC players returning (Delaney-VT 1st, T.Smith-NCSt 2nd, Hudson-VT 3rd, Trapani-BC 3rd and Singleton-FSU 3rd.)

Because I enjoy any Duke basketball discussion, I thought this could be a good forum for discussing how many all-ACC players people think we will have next year.
Will this be a year where there are two dominant first team all-ACC players and nobody else making an all-ACC?
Will Kyrie be one of the few freshmen (Singler, Deng, Redick and Williams were all 3rd team from Duke since Dawkins was 2nd team in 1983) to make an all-ACC team?
Is Curry good enough to make an all conference team?
Will Miles make enough of a jump to be a dominant big man in the conference?
Will Mason make a big freshman to sophomore jump, show his great versatility and be one of the best big men in the conference?
Will Andre or Ryan make it into the discussion?
How many players from Duke's 2010-11 team will make an all-conference team?
Edit: I didn't realize I could do a multiple choice poll so I did that instead of just picking how many people you think will be all-ACC.

superdave
07-19-2010, 03:49 PM
If Kyle and Nolan play at last year's levels or better, then they are givens.

I also voted for Kyrie and Mason because I think they will have more minutes and scoring opportunities than the rest of the roster.

As for conference wide candidates, Barnes and a couple of the NCSU freshment stand a chance to make 2nd or 3rd. But 1st team is hard to pick. Delaney and T. Smith have a good shot but their teams have to win. Hmmm a young ACC this year.

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 04:04 PM
I'm surprised Miles isn't getting more votes. It's obvious he has stepped up his game since last year and the addition of Kyrie and change in style of play will only inflate his stats.

CDu
07-19-2010, 04:15 PM
I think getting three Devils on the list is a pretty safe bet, and four is not unreasonable. But I think more than four would be optimistic. I don't see any reserves making an All-ACC team - I suspect that's fairly rare. So that would likely rule out Dawkins, Kelly, and one of Miles/Mason/Curry.


As for the list, I'd suspect that Singler, Smith, and Delaney will make first team. And I think Irving will have a good shot to make at least 3rd team as he'll play PG for likely the best team in the conference. After that, perhaps one of the Plumlees or Curry if one of those guys really distinguishes himself.

Other than that, here are some guys who could make the list:
BC: Trapani, Jackson
Clemson: Stitt (that may be a reach)
Duke: Miles, Mason, Curry
FSU: Singleton, Snaer, Gibson (only because someone will replace Alabi at C)
GT: Shumpert
Maryland: Williams, ??? they're a complete question mark
Miami: Scott, Johnson
UNC: Zeller, Barnes, Drew
NCSU: Smith, Leslie, ??? (hard to know which guards will emerge)
VT: Hudson, Allen
WF: ??? (again, they're losing a LOT from last year)

I'd expect Smith and Trapani to make it again. Singleton is a tough guess - if the team tanks, his contributions may get overlooked (he's not a prolific scorer). Stitt, Jackson, Shumpert, and Scott are guys who'll have the ball in their hands a lot, so they will have a chance to put up big stats. And Allen, Williams, and Zeller are big men who'll get a reasonable chance to shine.

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 04:22 PM
I think getting three Devils on the list is a pretty safe bet, and four is not unreasonable. But I think more than four would be optimistic. I don't see any reserves making an All-ACC team - I suspect that's fairly rare. So that would likely rule out Dawkins, Kelly, and one of Miles/Mason/Curry.


As for the list, I'd suspect that Singler, Smith, and Delaney will make first team. And I think Irving will have a good shot to make at least 3rd team as he'll play PG for likely the best team in the conference. After that, perhaps one of the Plumlees or Curry if one of those guys really distinguishes himself.

Other than that, here are some guys who could make the list:
BC: Trapani, Jackson
Clemson: Stitt (that may be a reach)
Duke: Miles, Mason, Curry
FSU: Singleton, Snaer, Gibson (only because someone will replace Alabi at C)
GT: Shumpert
Maryland: Williams, ??? they're a complete question mark
Miami: Scott, Johnson
UNC: Zeller, Barnes, Drew
NCSU: Smith, Leslie, ??? (hard to know which guards will emerge)
VT: Hudson, Allen
WF: ??? (again, they're losing a LOT from last year)

I'd expect Smith and Trapani to make it again. Singleton is a tough guess - if the team tanks, his contributions may get overlooked (he's not a prolific scorer). Stitt, Jackson, Shumpert, and Scott are guys who'll have the ball in their hands a lot, so they will have a chance to put up big stats. And Allen, Williams, and Zeller are big men who'll get a reasonable chance to shine.

I'd expect that Bullock would make it over Drew. Also, if Seth gets starters minutes as our sixth man and he produces as expected, I would say it's probable he makes All ACC. Also, Kyrie should make at least the 2nd team, there are definitely not 10 players better than KI in the ACC, that is barring injury or him not playing well, neither of which I expect (injuries obviously being unpredictable).

Duvall
07-19-2010, 04:23 PM
I'd expect that Bullock would make it over Drew. Also, if Seth gets starters minutes as our sixth man and he produces as expected, I would say it's probable he makes All ACC.

Well, that's the problem. Our expectations for Curry aren't exactly moored to reality.

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 04:34 PM
Well, that's the problem. Our expectations for Curry aren't exactly moored to reality.

I haven't really seen many unrealistic expectations for Seth, honestly. Our expectations for him are based on his performances in camps, summer leagues, etc. Also, from analysts such as Bilas. We also base them on the fact that Curry was leading scorer as a freshman (obviously, at a lower level school though), has had a year of coaching from the best living NCAA basketball coach under his belt, not to mention a year of practicing with a couple of top tier guards. Then you add in that Seth will have less attention on him in the games with our number of peremeter threats, giving him more uncontested shots and I'd say our basis for our expectations for Seth is pretty solid, therefor making them realistic.

NSDukeFan
07-19-2010, 04:35 PM
I'd expect that Bullock would make it over Drew. Also, if Seth gets starters minutes as our sixth man and he produces as expected, I would say it's probable he makes All ACC. Also, Kyrie should make at least the 2nd team, there are definitely not 10 players better than KI in the ACC, that is barring injury or him not playing well, neither of which I expect (injuries obviously being unpredictable).

I hope you are right about Kyrie, but the last Duke freshman to be a second team all-ACC selection was Johnny Dawkins in 1983.

gumbomoop
07-19-2010, 04:39 PM
My assumptions, for predictions below:

1. Voting "panel" not dominated by Duke-hate.
2. Duke finishes 14-2, followed by UNC and VT at 11-5 each.

1st team -
Singler, Smith, Irving, Barnes, Delaney

2d team -
Smith (NCS), Singleton, Scott (Miami), Williams (Md), Henson/Zeller [1 of these 2]

3d team -
Snaer, Jackson (BC), Drew, Allen (VT), MP1/MP2/Curry [1 of these 3]

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 04:41 PM
I hope you are right about Kyrie, but the last Duke freshman to be a second team all-ACC selection was Johnny Dawkins in 1983.

Well, seeing as Duke will most likely be top ranked throughout the year and with Kyrie as talented as he is, he will get much exposure. Then you factor in that other then us and maybe VT, UNC and NCST, it's a pretty watered down ACC and you have to believe Kyrie has a good shot at making the 2nd team.

CameronBornAndBred
07-19-2010, 04:44 PM
I said Kyle, Nolan, Mason, Kyrie and Seth.
R.O.Y. is gonna be an interesting battle between Kyrie and Barnes. I'm sure others will be in the mix, but those are the two I'll be watching.

Bluedog
07-19-2010, 05:01 PM
I said Kyle, Nolan, Mason, Kyrie and Seth.
R.O.Y. is gonna be an interesting battle between Kyrie and Barnes. I'm sure others will be in the mix, but those are the two I'll be watching.

When was the last time a non-starter made first, second, or third team All-ACC? I'm saying this because according to Coach K, as of right now, one of those five you listed won't be starting. That lineup would obviously necessitate playing Nolan at the 3 (all 6'2" of him) and Kyle at the 4. While that would be a good defensive ball pressure lineup, rebounding might be a bit of an issue. And based on last year, we all know how important rebounding can be. Scheyer was one of the top sixth men in the country in 2007-08 (averaged third most minutes on the team) and didn't even get All-ACC honorable mention.

Edit: Marvin Williams was honorable mention in 2005, but still didn't make one of the top three teams.

CDu
07-19-2010, 05:51 PM
I'd expect that Bullock would make it over Drew. Also, if Seth gets starters minutes as our sixth man and he produces as expected, I would say it's probable he makes All ACC. Also, Kyrie should make at least the 2nd team, there are definitely not 10 players better than KI in the ACC, that is barring injury or him not playing well, neither of which I expect (injuries obviously being unpredictable).

I'm avoiding putting expectations on players who haven't played a single game for Duke. I think there's a very reasonable chance for Irving to make 2nd team. And as PG for likely the top team in the conference, he should at least make 3rd team.

As for Curry, I will be VERY surprised to see four wing players from the same team make All-ACC. That has to be extraordinarily rare. And there is almost never a shortage of wing options for the All-ACC list, even on the bad teams. Hence, I think that Curry has a fairly decent hurdle to climb. He can be a perfectly solid contributor and still just not have the touches needed to make All-ACC. It's very hard for four wing players to get enough touches to earn the votes. And it's very very rare for a 6th man to make All-ACC (even if he gets starter's minute).

Let's just say that if we have four wings make the All-ACC team, it should be an amazing regular season for us.

Duke of Nashville
07-19-2010, 06:00 PM
I am surprised Miles is not getting more love. Break out year for the big man.

CDu
07-19-2010, 06:08 PM
I am surprised Miles is not getting more love. Break out year for the big man.

I'm hopeful that both Plumlees make big strides this season. I could see either of them making All-ACC if things play out right. The concern would be that the combine for great numbers together, but split their good games such that neither quite makes the All-ACC list.

But yes, with his size and athleticism, there's no reason he can't have a breakout year.

CDu
07-19-2010, 06:18 PM
My assumptions, for predictions below:

1. Voting "panel" not dominated by Duke-hate.
2. Duke finishes 14-2, followed by UNC and VT at 11-5 each.

1st team -
Singler, Smith, Irving, Barnes, Delaney

2d team -
Smith (NCS), Singleton, Scott (Miami), Williams (Md), Henson/Zeller [1 of these 2]

3d team -
Snaer, Jackson (BC), Drew, Allen (VT), MP1/MP2/Curry [1 of these 3]

I think that's a pretty reasonable guess. My only hesitation would be Irving and Barnes on the 1st team. But it's certainly possible. Let's hope Irving makes it and Barnes doesn't.

CEF1959
07-19-2010, 06:27 PM
I am surprised Miles is not getting more love. Break out year for the big man.

My thoughts exactly.

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 06:32 PM
I'm avoiding putting expectations on players who haven't played a single game for Duke. I think there's a very reasonable chance for Irving to make 2nd team. And as PG for likely the top team in the conference, he should at least make 3rd team.

As for Curry, I will be VERY surprised to see four wing players from the same team make All-ACC. That has to be extraordinarily rare. And there is almost never a shortage of wing options for the All-ACC list, even on the bad teams. Hence, I think that Curry has a fairly decent hurdle to climb. He can be a perfectly solid contributor and still just not have the touches needed to make All-ACC. It's very hard for four wing players to get enough touches to earn the votes. And it's very very rare for a 6th man to make All-ACC (even if he gets starter's minute).

Let's just say that if we have four wings make the All-ACC team, it should be an amazing regular season for us.

I will not ever underestimate a Curry. Steph was underestimated in college and the NBA and we know what he is doing while Seth was underestimated as a Frosh in college and we know what he did. I think Seth has a good chance at making All ACC, that's my opinion and the opinion of a good portion of those here on DBR.

As for the bolded part, let's just say that's not out of the realm of possibilities either.

ACCBBallFan
07-19-2010, 07:24 PM
I think getting three Devils on the list is a pretty safe bet, and four is not unreasonable. But I think more than four would be optimistic. I don't see any reserves making an All-ACC team - I suspect that's fairly rare. So that would likely rule out Dawkins, Kelly, and one of Miles/Mason/Curry.


As for the list, I'd suspect that Singler, Smith, and Delaney will make first team. And I think Irving will have a good shot to make at least 3rd team as he'll play PG for likely the best team in the conference. After that, perhaps one of the Plumlees or Curry if one of those guys really distinguishes himself.

Other than that, here are some guys who could make the list:
BC: Trapani, Jackson
Clemson: Stitt (that may be a reach)
Duke: Miles, Mason, Curry
FSU: Singleton, Snaer, Gibson (only because someone will replace Alabi at C)
GT: Shumpert
Maryland: Williams, ??? they're a complete question mark
Miami: Scott, Johnson
UNC: Zeller, Barnes, Drew
NCSU: Smith, Leslie, ??? (hard to know which guards will emerge)
VT: Hudson, Allen
WF: ??? (again, they're losing a LOT from last year)

I'd expect Smith and Trapani to make it again. Singleton is a tough guess - if the team tanks, his contributions may get overlooked (he's not a prolific scorer). Stitt, Jackson, Shumpert, and Scott are guys who'll have the ball in their hands a lot, so they will have a chance to put up big stats. And Allen, Williams, and Zeller are big men who'll get a reasonable chance to shine.

Your list looks pretty complete except for the other Scott, Mike Scott from 12th ACC team UVA.

CameronBornAndBred
07-19-2010, 07:58 PM
When was the last time a non-starter made first, second, or third team All-ACC? I'm saying this because according to Coach K, as of right now, one of those five you listed won't be starting. That lineup would obviously necessitate playing Nolan at the 3 (all 6'2" of him) and Kyle at the 4. While that would be a good defensive ball pressure lineup, rebounding might be a bit of an issue. And based on last year, we all know how important rebounding can be. Scheyer was one of the top sixth men in the country in 2007-08 (averaged third most minutes on the team) and didn't even get All-ACC honorable mention.

I love watching "never-been-done's" finally be done. :)

Duvall
07-19-2010, 08:13 PM
Your list looks pretty complete except for the other Scott, Mike Scott from 12th ACC team UVA.

Why? I see no reason why any player from next year's UVa squad should warrant All-ACC consideration.

Duvall
07-19-2010, 08:16 PM
I will not ever underestimate a Curry. Steph was underestimated in college and the NBA and we know what he is doing while Seth was underestimated as a Frosh in college and we know what he did.

Yes. But Seth isn't Stephen.

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 08:18 PM
Yes. But Seth isn't Stephen.

Never said he was, but he is a Curry and like I said, I will never underestimate a Curry.

jipops
07-19-2010, 08:33 PM
I just don't see Seth getting enough minutes to actually warrant an All-ACC selection. I'm not saying he won't make an immediate and serious impact, I feel quite confident he will. But I think we're going to be seeing a kid adjust to a totally different level of competition on a consistent basis. There will be a few games he drops double figures and makes nice plays. There will also be a lot of games where he contributes very little in the box score. Not that this is of ultimate importance but it is very relative to All-ACC selections.

For '11-'12 I'm sure my opinion will be different.

gumbomoop
07-19-2010, 08:40 PM
I think that's a pretty reasonable guess. My only hesitation would be Irving and Barnes on the 1st team. But it's certainly possible. Let's hope Irving makes it and Barnes doesn't.

As to whether my guesses are reasonable, I'm thinking most posters will agree with your second sentence, which does raise a perfectly reasonable doubt about predicting first-team status for Irving and Barnes.

To be honest - and possibly logical - we could probably guess that Barnes has a somewhat better chance than Irving at nipping into the first team. For Barnes is surely likely to be UNC's best player. Zeller might blossom, or Henson, or even Drew, but Barnes has got it. So if - that's if - UNC manages a 2d-place finish, then their best player would be a 2d team cinch, and 1st team likely. Whereas KI will have lots of competition for notice on a team that should comfortably win the conference. [I do understand this assumes things. Yes, I do assume such things. Duke should comfortably win the conference. Now, should any of the players act as if the other teams will just roll over and let Duke win easily, I'm confident K will bust their chops. K will counsel them not to listen to overconfident predictions of their future successes.]

Irving as 1st team is not so reasonable, but I'd insist to major skeptics that it's not wacky, either. I'm just wowed by him, and by Barnes. The ACC obviously has many players with more experience. Still, there just aren't many special, special talents in the ACC right now. Singleton? Nope. Tracy Smith? Nope. Durand Scott? Nope. Delaney? Nope. Kyle and Nolan? Well, special enough to see them as cinch preseason 1st team ACC, but not yet so special [as "talents"] to NBA guys. But these 2 frosh are ultra-talented. So even if KI "only" makes 2d team, he'll have had a first-rate season.

Greg_Newton
07-19-2010, 08:41 PM
I don't really see Seth having any type of adjustment period. I mean, he practiced every day with the national championship team last year, and he excelled at camps with 10-20 of the top guards in the country this summer. I think the latter is an important point - not only was he not out of place among the country's top guards, he was one of the best and highest scoring of them. That's not easy.

...It also probably doesn't hurt having an older brother on the US national team to play one on one with!

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 08:45 PM
I just don't see Seth getting enough minutes to actually warrant an All-ACC selection. I'm not saying he won't make an immediate and serious impact, I feel quite confident he will. But I think we're going to be seeing a kid adjust to a totally different level of competition on a consistent basis. There will be a few games he drops double figures and makes nice plays. There will also be a lot of games where he contributes very little in the box score. Not that this is of ultimate importance but it is very relative to All-ACC selections.

For '11-'12 I'm sure my opinion will be different.

It seems that you are doubting the Curry.
As I stated, Seth already has a year of collegiate ball under his belt AND a year of coaching under K and going up against elite guards in practices. Also, he has a soon to be elite NBA guard to practice with often in Stephen. While yes, there will probably be a little adjusting, I think that will be of little worry with the experience (on and off the court he already has). Also, yes, he will have a few game where he contributes little in the box score (as does EVERY player) but I don't think there will be as many as you say. All I am saying is don't doubt Seth, I have learned plenty of things in my life, and one of them is to never doubt a Curry.

:)

NSDukeFan
07-19-2010, 08:55 PM
It seems that you are doubting the Curry.
As I stated, Seth already has a year of collegiate ball under his belt AND a year of coaching under K and going up against elite guards in practices. Also, he has a soon to be elite NBA guard to practice with often in Stephen. While yes, there will probably be a little adjusting, I think that will be of little worry with the experience (on and off the court he already has). Also, yes, he will have a few game where he contributes little in the box score (as does EVERY player) but I don't think there will be as many as you say. All I am saying is don't doubt Seth, I have learned plenty of things in my life, and one of them is to never doubt a Curry.

:)

What about Eddy?

MisterRoddy
07-19-2010, 08:57 PM
What about Eddy?

Different bloodline, different story.

ACCBBallFan
07-19-2010, 09:40 PM
Why? I see no reason why any player from next year's UVa squad should warrant All-ACC consideration. Maybe because it is an individual award and not a team award.

Mike Scott was second best player for UVA last year and as a senior captain he will be the go to guy without Landesburg

His metrics are in same impressive ballpark as fifth year senior Joe Trapani, senior Jeff Allen and junior Chris Singleton

http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=40974

http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=32851

http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36117

http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=31599

Along with high potential guys like Mason Plumlee (or Singler at PF on occasion), Ryan Kelly and John Henson plus either Richard Howell or CJ Leslie PF is the position with most ACC talent.

ACC voting does not go by position. After Tracy Smith and Jordan Williams at center , perhaps Reggie Johnson, and after Kyle and Barnes at WF, these positions are fairly weak relative to past years.

Similarly fall off at PG after Delaney and Kyrie and perhaps Durand Scott, and at SG after Nolan, Dorenzo Hudson, Iman Shumpert.

I agree UVA and some of the other bottom feeders would not get two All ACC players, but see no reason they cannot get one.

NSDukeFan
07-20-2010, 08:38 AM
Maybe because it is an individual award and not a team award.

Mike Scott was second best player for UVA last year and as a senior captain he will be the go to guy without Landesburg

...

I agree UVA and some of the other bottom feeders would not get two All ACC players, but see no reason they cannot get one.

Hopefully, Duke will have 5 players that are seen as more deserving of all-ACC recognition than any UVA player, not saying that Duke will get 5 players recognized. I am optimistic that 4 players may, however.

CDu
07-20-2010, 10:16 AM
What about Eddy?

[CDu cringes angrily...]

NSDukeFan
07-20-2010, 10:20 AM
[CDu cringes angrily...]

Are you saying after your experience with #1 overall picks in Chicago, that it is possible to doubt a Curry?

ACCBBallFan
07-20-2010, 10:22 AM
Hopefully, Duke will have 5 players that are seen as more deserving of all-ACC recognition than any UVA player, not saying that Duke will get 5 players recognized. I am optimistic that 4 players may, however.You are correct. With only 15 spots to spread across 12 ACC teams, for Duke to get that many, some of the underlings have to be shut out.

A lot depends on who finishes in top three of ACC. Duke is a favorite and VA Tech has an extremely favorable ACC unbalanced schedule plus three experienced stars. So I would not be surprised to see each of them get three and then the other top ACC team probably UNC getting two.

Duke - Irving, Smith, Singler [Curry or a Plumlee or Kelly]
Va Tech - Delaney, Hudson, Allen [Tyrelle Bell or J T Thompson]
UNC - Barnes, Zeller [Henson or Drew II or Bullock]
BC - Trapani [Jackson or Paris or Raji or Josh Southern]
NC St - Tracy Smith [CJ Leslie, Scott Wood, Ryan Harrow or Lorenzo Brown]
FSU - Singleton [Michael Snaer or Derwin Kitchen]
Md - Jordan Williams [Mosley]
Ga Tech - Shumpert
Clemson - Stitt ??
UVA - Mike Scott ??
Miami - [Durand Scott, Reggie Johnson]
Wake - [Woods]

I was pretty sure about 13 of them and then picked Stitt and Mike Scott as best guys on their teams. I see Miami and Wake having less of a chance to get an All ACC guy than UVA or Clemson only because of the caliber of the players, not necessarily their team placement, but there is no rule that each team has to have at least one like there is in major league baseball all-star teams.

first Team - Delaney, Nolan Smith, Singler, Barnes, Tracy Smith,
second team - Irving, Hudson, Shumpert, Allen, Trapani,
third team - Jordan Williams, Singleton, Zeller plus two from below

Honorable mention - Seth Curry, Corey Raji, Larry Drew II, Josh Southern, Reggie Bullock, JT Thompson or Tyrelle Bell, Demontez Stitt, Mason Plumlee, Andre Dawkins, Reggie Jackson, Sean Mosley, Mike Scott, Javi Gonzales, John Henson, Biko Paris, Durand Scott, or whichever center does best among Jerai Grant,, Victor Davilla, Reggie Jackson, Miles Plumlee, Ty Walker or Xavier Gibson

Alternates from one of those would come from someone who surfaces whether that be Ryan Kelly for Duke, CJ Leslie, Scott Wood, Ryan Harrow or Lorenzo Brown from NC St, Michael Snaer or Derwin Kitchen from FSU, Sammy Zieglinski from UVA, Dino Gregory from MD or Tony Woods from Wake.

CDu
07-20-2010, 10:25 AM
Are you saying after your experience with #1 overall picks in Chicago, that it is possible to doubt a Curry?

Yes. A thousand times yes. And it's possible to doubt a Krause as well.

CDu
07-20-2010, 10:26 AM
Your list looks pretty complete except for the other Scott, Mike Scott from 12th ACC team UVA.

Yeah, I debated on whether or not to include him. I'm interested to see if he improves or suffers as he becomes (in theory) more of a focus after Landesburg's departure.

CDu
07-20-2010, 10:28 AM
Hopefully, Duke will have 5 players that are seen as more deserving of all-ACC recognition than any UVA player, not saying that Duke will get 5 players recognized. I am optimistic that 4 players may, however.

I think we can have an absolutely amazing season, and still only get three guys on the All-ACC team (simply by virtue of available stat opportunities). I think three (or even four) is a pretty good bet. I think getting five on the team would involve everything playing out just right.

As you note - the All-ACC teams don't always go to the top-15 players in the conference. There are certainly cases in which a deserving player doesn't get so honored. It may very well be that we have 5-6 guys deserving, but only get 3-4 due to players from lesser programs getting bigger numbers.

NSDukeFan
07-20-2010, 11:03 AM
I think we can have an absolutely amazing season, and still only get three guys on the All-ACC team (simply by virtue of available stat opportunities). I think three (or even four) is a pretty good bet. I think getting five on the team would involve everything playing out just right.

As you note - the All-ACC teams don't always go to the top-15 players in the conference. There are certainly cases in which a deserving player doesn't get so honored. It may very well be that we have 5-6 guys deserving, but only get 3-4 due to players from lesser programs getting bigger numbers.

I agree completely that it the team could have a great year and still only have 3 players recognized as all-ACC. I am also hopeful that your second paragraph will come to fruition with maybe even our 5th, 6th and 7th players being better players than some of the top players on other teams, though they will not have the same opportunities to put up all-conference stats. That's my dream anyway.

jipops
07-20-2010, 11:19 AM
It seems that you are doubting the Curry.
As I stated, Seth already has a year of collegiate ball under his belt AND a year of coaching under K and going up against elite guards in practices. Also, he has a soon to be elite NBA guard to practice with often in Stephen. While yes, there will probably be a little adjusting, I think that will be of little worry with the experience (on and off the court he already has). Also, yes, he will have a few game where he contributes little in the box score (as does EVERY player) but I don't think there will be as many as you say. All I am saying is don't doubt Seth, I have learned plenty of things in my life, and one of them is to never doubt a Curry.

:)

Oh I'm not doubting him. If he were to not to earn All-ACC honors it probably wouldn't be because he had a bad season or didn't contribute very much. There may end up being other guys more deserving.

CDu
07-20-2010, 11:26 AM
Oh I'm not doubting him. If he were to not to earn All-ACC honors it probably wouldn't be because he had a bad season or didn't contribute very much. There may end up being other guys more deserving.

Or at the very least, guys who end up with better stats. There's a difference between saying "so-and-so will make the All-ACC team" and "so-and-so will be one of the top-15 players in the ACC." That's the distinction I was trying to make. I don't think it'll be talent that keeps Curry from the All-ACC list this year. I think it'll be stats (more specifically, the availability of top-player stats on other teams).

Duvall
07-20-2010, 12:08 PM
I agree UVA and some of the other bottom feeders would not get two All ACC players, but see no reason they cannot get one.

Except that Scott isn't good enough to warrant All-ACC consideration on a bad team. His numbers might be sufficient if he were playing for a winning team, or even an average team, but to make it from a terrible team you need more. Guys like Allen and Singleton will have an edge with voters due to playing for teams near the top of the standings, instead of at the bottom.

CDu
07-20-2010, 01:10 PM
Except that Scott isn't good enough to warrant All-ACC consideration on a bad team. His numbers might be sufficient if he were playing for a winning team, or even an average team, but to make it from a terrible team you need more. Guys like Allen and Singleton will have an edge with voters due to playing for teams near the top of the standings, instead of at the bottom.

Right, the votes usually go to the top contributors on good teams and then either really prolific players on bad teams or major contributors on good teams. So Scott will have to step his production up a lot to make All-ACC on a bad UVa team. It's not clear whether the departure of Landesburg will result in a big boost in numbers for Scott (due to more touches) or minimal change (due to teams focusing more on him).

That said, I also wouldn't consider FSU to necessarily be near the top of the ACC this year. They lose two key contributors in their frontcourt in Alabi and Reid. And Singleton isn't a guy with eye-popping stats. Maybe he makes the leap this year, but he's a borderline guy depending upon his improvement and the team's ability to reload.