Felix not enrolling?

[vango]

I have been gone for 5 days but saw this first thing this morning?

http://duke.scout.com/2/972124.html

What happened?

[Kedsy]

I have been gone for 5 days but saw this first thing this morning?

http://duke.scout.com/2/972124.html

What happened?

Wow, if that's true it's a shame. I wonder if he's worried about playing time or if it's something else.

[wilko]

Any one care to share some info?
I was really excited to see this dude in a Duke uniform.
Really bummed (http://duke.scout.com/2/972124.html)

[CLT Devil]

What a shocker, and what a shame. I think he would have gotten plenty of time, especially as a defensive specialist. I am hearing he did not qualify, anyone else confirm this?

Oh well, not the best start to my Monday, but if something had to happen to any one of our incoming players I guess he was one of the most expendable. I really wanted to see him play for us. Bummer.

Bright side? Another scholly for 2011......

[Huh?]

Any one care to share some info?
I was really excited to see this dude in a Duke uniform.
Really bummed (http://duke.scout.com/2/972124.html)

This is a bummer, but I wonder what his role would have been? Not many players can be sold on a program if they are projected to come off the bench and be a role player and I think that was evident to him from day one...IMO.

Maybe he knows something we don't, like a certain recruit may be making his way into Durham that plays his position.

Anyone know the inside scoop on this?

[superdave]

Wow. This suprising because I'd not heard of it before right now. But it makes sense in relation to Singler's decision to stay.

[JTH]

I saw this on Foxsports.com. Is this just a bad rumor ? Has anybody heard this from any other sources?

Hope its not true.

Link:

http://community.foxsports.com/goodmanonfox/blog/2010/05/24/dillard_to_dayton;_mike_rice_fills_staff_with_van_ macon;_coach_k_wont_get_first_juco_after_all

JTH

[roywhite]

Don't think he got by admissions.

Don't know that for sure; will probably get some clarification later.

[superdave]

Don't think he got by admissions.

Don't know that for sure; will probably get some clarification later.

Seems like a great kid. I hope he lands somewhere good where he can get on the court and get his degree.

[cbnaylor]

Well I guess Singler will be playing all 40 min now. hmmmmm

[CLT Devil]

I saw this on Foxsports.com. Is this just a bad rumor ? Has anybody heard this from any other sources?

Hope its not true.

Link:

http://community.foxsports.com/goodmanonfox/blog/2010/05/24/dillard_to_dayton;_mike_rice_fills_staff_with_van_ macon;_coach_k_wont_get_first_juco_after_all

JTH

Now being reported on Rivals or Scout. Hate it for the kid, as he worked hard and this was a lifelong dream for him. He had to have met with Admissions, right? Only thing I can think it has latest semester wasn't up to snuff. While I don't think he would have seen much PT he would have made us more athletic. I envisioned him as a (slightly) more polished Olek. Defense is where he will be missed. All the best to him, and hoping he works something out...seems like it is awful late to be in the position he is, ie without a school.

[Osiagledknarf]

Probably did not have the grades to get by admissions or possibly a health issue in the family, something of the elk I would think. Though I was really looking forward to seeing him here, I don't think it is that major of a loss for this team. We have Singler and Dawkins now as our primary 3's and Carrick would have been the 3rd off the bench there. We will have Gbinje coming in for 2011 at the 3 when Singler leaves, so I don't see it as a huge issue.

So this gives us availability to have at least 3 more scholarships to work with for 2011.. We have offers out there for Marshall Plumlee, Austin Rivers and Quincy Miller at the moment. Other guys were intrested according to scout are: Quinn Cook, Michael Chandler, Amir Williams, Desmond Hubert and Tony Kimbro.

I would like to us possibly use this to get a big man in here. Michael Chandler would be a great pickup here... He is ultra athletic and could be that guy we have been looking for in the paint who can rebound and score at high frequency. Marshall seems to be leaning to go to one of the Midwestern schools such as Michigan or Indiana, and for what I have heard and seen about Amir Williams, I would stay away. He is a very soft player who has very limited offensive skills. I dont want him.

This could turn into a mega recruiting class for us.

[Osiagledknarf]

This is a bummer, but I wonder what his role would have been? Not many players can be sold on a program if they are projected to come off the bench and be a role player and I think that was evident to him from day one...IMO.

Maybe he knows something we don't, like a certain recruit may be making his way into Durham that plays his position.

Anyone know the inside scoop on this?

For the 2010 class it is HIGHLY unlikely at this point. The deadline to sign is May 28th for the 2010 season, and furthermore the well has seemed to have run dry for 2010. This move will affect 2011.

[roywhite]

Probably did not have the grades to get by admissions or possibly a health issue in the family, something of the elk I would think.

Yeah, coming from Idaho...elk can be an issue.

[monkey]

hope this isn't true. Could really use his athleticism on the wing if we're going up tempo...

[Osiagledknarf]

Yeah, coming from Idaho...elk can be an issue.

You know what I meant, but no they don't have a problem with that :rolleyes:

[DevilHorns]

I honestly don't think the issue could be admissions. Obviously don't know for sure... but just a hunch.... I think admissions would have denied him a long time ago if they were going to deny him at all.

Wish the young man best of luck in the future!

[Duke of Nashville]

I feel terrible for the kid if this is true. If it is I wish the best to him and his family.

Also, if this is true, I see some extended minutes for Ryan Kelly, which I like.

[monkey]

I honestly don't think the issue could be admissions. Obviously don't know for sure... but just a hunch.... I think admissions would have denied him a long time ago if they were going to deny him at all.

Wish the young man best of luck in the future!

Gotta think this is right - would have heard something about it before now also, no?

[Duke of Nashville]

Gotta think this is right - would have heard something about it before now also, no?

Maybe, maybe not, I would think he would have had to of had atleast a certain GPA in his final semester in order to become eligible or for credits to transfer.

[tommy]

We have Singler and Dawkins now as our primary 3's and Carrick would have been the 3rd off the bench there.

Why do so many people on the board refer to Dawkins as a "3"? The guy is 6'4" with a great outside stroke on the catch-and-shoot. That's pretty much what he showed last year. When I think of a "3" I think of a guy who is bigger than 6'4" in most instances, and can also put it on the floor, go to the bucket, slash, and then also rebound some and defend bigger guys. Didn't see any of that from Dawkins last year.

I think this is a potentially significant loss. We don't have a player like Carrick - athletic true "3" who can fill the lanes on the break but more importantly really get after it as a defensive "specialist." Of course few of us have actually seen him play, but based on reports he sounded like just the kind of "glue" guy that is so beneficial to have when building a championship team. Doesn't mean we can't win without him, of course, but still it creates a hole.

[roywhite]

Why do so many people on the board refer to Dawkins as a "3"? The guy is 6'4" with a great outside stroke on the catch-and-shoot. That's pretty much what he showed last year. When I think of a "3" I think of a guy who is bigger than 6'4" in most instances, and can also put it on the floor, go to the bucket, slash, and then also rebound some and defend bigger guys. Didn't see any of that from Dawkins last year.

I think this is a potentially significant loss. We don't have a player like Carrick - athletic true "3" who can fill the lanes on the break but more importantly really get after it as a defensive "specialist." Of course few of us have actually seen him play, but based on reports he sounded like just the kind of "glue" guy that is so beneficial to have when building a championship team. Doesn't mean we can't win without him, of course, but still it creates a hole.

Yeah, I was looking forward to his contributions.

This has got to be a downer for Nate James, who "discovered" Felix, sold him on Duke and sold Coach K on Felix. Next play, Nate, and keep up your efforts.

[ElSid]

Well, I'm still stroking the 2010 national championship tattoo i have on my neck and feeling pretty good. This is not great news but there must be a good reason that will emerge soon enough.

Rather than speculating on the reason, what do we really think the effect on the team will be? I think Tommy is right that it's potentially a big loss, but since we don't know a whole lot about Felix in general, it's hard to say. On paper, it does leave a gap between Dawkins and Singler. I think this means Singler is likely to guard Barnes, just for example. Limits our flexibility. Makes us a smaller team on average.

Doors open for Josh and Ryan to step up. Might affect what Coach K asks of Dawkins.

I was excited to see him play but when one of our biggest concerns was how to get all these kids playing time, if we had to lose someone like this, I think Felix was both the most likely and most tolerable loss...no offense to him.

[_Gary]

Why do so many people on the board refer to Dawkins as a "3"? The guy is 6'4" with a great outside stroke on the catch-and-shoot. That's pretty much what he showed last year. When I think of a "3" I think of a guy who is bigger than 6'4" in most instances, and can also put it on the floor, go to the bucket, slash, and then also rebound some and defend bigger guys. Didn't see any of that from Dawkins last year.

I think this is a potentially significant loss. We don't have a player like Carrick - athletic true "3" who can fill the lanes on the break but more importantly really get after it as a defensive "specialist." Of course few of us have actually seen him play, but based on reports he sounded like just the kind of "glue" guy that is so beneficial to have when building a championship team. Doesn't mean we can't win without him, of course, but still it creates a hole.


I completely agree with both paragraphs, Tommy. While we don't know for sure if this will be a significant loss, it certainly has the potential to be one. Not happy about this at all. :(

[cbnaylor]

Yeah, after reading and thinking about this for the past hour....this might be a blessing. It will give other players more time and opportunities to perform......remember when G Henderson left......Elliot Williams........this opened doors for Zoubek and Smith.....just saying. Maybe this will give Duke the right Chemistry. Go Duke!

[Daniel tosh]

Not to jinx us or anything,but this is like the first negative thing that has happened to us in months.I was looking forwrd to what this guy would've brought to the team,oh well.Hopefully this will give Dawkins more PT,I think he could be great player for us.

[COYS]

I think this means Singler is likely to guard Barnes, just for example. Limits our flexibility. Makes us a smaller team on average.

Doors open for Josh and Ryan to step up. Might affect what Coach K asks of Dawkins.

First, I want to wish Carrick well as say how disappointed I am that he won't suit up for Duke. I was looking forward to seeing what he had to offer and hope that everything works out for the best for him.

As far as the effect this news has on the team, I think it will actually make us a bigger team, rather than a smaller team. From the reports, it sounds like Felix has major hops and strength and could have paired with Singler in a lineup with one of Mason/Miles at the 5, Singler and Felix as hybrid 3/4, a 2 guard (Curry/Dawkins/Smith) and a pg (Kyrie, Curry, Smith, possibly Thornton). Either Singler or Felix could have guarded opposing 4's if needed in that lineup. This lineup won't be possible so I think it means that Mason and Miles stay on the floor together more and when one or the other is not on the floor, Kelly is the best bet to see even more time. I definitely agree that we will see a three guard lineup on a regular basis, but I still feel that the third and fourth big guy off the bench will see even more time without Felix on the team as Kyle will be our only 3.

[RoyalBlue08]

It seems like everyone here is assuming that Felix was going to play this upcoming season. I'm not sure that is the case. Maybe, but I would think it was less than 50/50. With Singler playing large minutes plus all the guards we need to find playing time for, it could be that he would have had to wait a year to see any significant playing time. Remember when he committed he probably thought Singler was gone. It could be that he just wants to go somewhere that he can play more immediately.

[airowe]

I honestly don't think the issue could be admissions. Obviously don't know for sure... but just a hunch.... I think admissions would have denied him a long time ago if they were going to deny him at all.

Wish the young man best of luck in the future!

I don't know the full story yet, but it appears that Carrick had some contingency items that would trigger his admission which were not met. Based on the timing, it appears that these were involving his last semester.

This is a tough blow, as Carrick would have added valuable practice defense on Kyle, been able to fill in gaps in our lineup, and really had a chance to get better for 3 years at Duke. Everything happens for a reason, and this may eventually work out for the better for all parties involved with Kyle coming back and Gbinije coming in '11. Look for us to go hard after Amir Williams/Anthony Davis and another of the multitude of '12 wings if those don't work out.

[SoCalDukeFan]

I see no reason to speculate on the reason.

Coach K and staff wanted this guy on the team. Not having him has to hurt in some way. The only good news is that it is known now well before the season and the staff has time to plan for a team without Felix.

Nate James, Next Play.

Looking forward to the season.

SoCal

[DevilWearsPrada]

Felix and His Mother were at the Duke Undergrad Admissions Office, 3-4 weeks ago, and meet with the Dean. Seems like, matric/admissions was not the issue in Felix not enrolling at Duke. Wow! I wish him the best in his college career. NEXT!!

[theAlaskanBear]

I wish Carrick well! I am heartbroken for him if it is in fact related to admissions issues...imagine you are about to embark on a dream, and then you find out you are judged inadequate to board the boat.

If it isn't admissions, then Singler staying probably convinced him he would be a practice player. Either way, good luck Felix, you are on of the most intriguing cats we never got to know!

[gus]

Am I alone in not caring or even wondering why he's not enrolling?

I realize basketball players are in a fishbowl so probably expect to endure intrusions into their lives, but it's really none of my business why (if) he isn't going to matriculate.

[uh_no]

It seems like everyone here is assuming that Felix was going to play this upcoming season. I'm not sure that is the case. Maybe, but I would think it was less than 50/50. With Singler playing large minutes plus all the guards we need to find playing time for, it could be that he would have had to wait a year to see any significant playing time. Remember when he committed he probably thought Singler was gone. It could be that he just wants to go somewhere that he can play more immediately.

that was my thought

[Kedsy]

Rather than speculating on the reason, what do we really think the effect on the team will be? I think Tommy is right that it's potentially a big loss, but since we don't know a whole lot about Felix in general, it's hard to say. On paper, it does leave a gap between Dawkins and Singler. I think this means Singler is likely to guard Barnes, just for example. Limits our flexibility. Makes us a smaller team on average.


It would have been a huge upset for Carrick to get more than 5 mpg this season. IMO, his value was mostly to have an elite athlete in practice and probably contribute in his junior and senior years. So I don't think it will be that big an effect on the 2010-11 team. Similarly, I don't think it has much of an effect on Kyle, who was always going to guard Barnes, or Andre, who has been the likely candidate to guard the other team's "3" when Kyle is on the bench. It's possible it could mean a few more minutes for Josh and/or Ryan, who if we're playing a team with a big "3" might be the guy who comes in for Kyle, but nothing major. I guess the biggest beneficiary of Carrick's departure is Tyler, who (unless he shows more than is expected) will now get all the minutes not taken up by the probable 9-man rotation.

[tbyers11]

I don't know the full story yet, but it appears that Carrick had some contingency items that would trigger his admission which were not met. Based on the timing, it appears that these were involving his last semester.



This makes the most sense to me. It would guess that players are frequently admitted on a contingency basis depending on what occurs in their final semester. I remember that Andre had to finish his one class last summer before he could enroll. Most times this seems like a formality. I guess that it wasn't in Felix's case.

Based on what I've read about Felix and the fact that he was already on campus a couple of weeks ago ready to start his Duke career, I really don't think he just decided to leave for purely basketball reasons.

Best of luck to him wherever he ends up.

[BD80]

Godman's "source" indicates it was an admissions issue.

[natedog4ever]

In my opinion, Kevin White should insert himself.

[Levon]

I'm disappointed we won't have Felix on the roster. Nevertheless, I applaud our university's unwavering commitment to academics.

[roywhite]

In my opinion, Kevin White should insert himself.

What reason is there for that?

We don't know definitely, but it appears to be an issue involving admissions. It's unfortunate, but I trust that the basketball staff and admissions staff have evaluated the situation in a fair manner.

Duke is not the right place for many student-athletes, even those that have considerable basketball talent.

[JG Nothing]

In my opinion, Kevin White should insert himself.

You cannot be serious. The Athetic Director has no business telling the Office of Admissions how to do its job. I am sure the Office of Admissions was fulling informed about Carrick's record and qualifications before making a decision.

[uh_no]

In my opinion, Kevin White should insert himself.

in the place of johnson?

[MChambers]

What reason is there for that?

Think your sarcasm detector is not working.

[roywhite]

Think your sarcasm detector is not working.

It wouldn't be the first time. Since you mention it, I hope the original comment was not made seriously.

[BD80]

In my opinion, Kevin White should insert himself.

Maybe he wasn'r asked to. Felix committed before Kyle anounced he was coming back. We have also received commitment from Tyler Adams since then and possibly a violent gerbil from Austin.

I'm not saying Felix was booted, but if there was an academic issue, perhaps it was the best choice to pursue other options, which seem very bright, rather than to force the academic issue.

[airowe]

There are some short term memories here from some long time posters. Natedog, hilarious post. Too bad the people on the inside didn't get the inside joke.

[SMO]

In my opinion, Kevin White should insert himself.

LMAO! If Kevin White only knew how often people suggested he do this:p

[Kewlswim]

Hi,

I imagine the Athletic Department will put out a release saying something. There is too much interest in the Duke program not to. I am sorry, if it is true, he isn't coming. :(

GO DUKE!

[Azdukefan]

I have said it multiple times, I live within an hour of where Carrick played HS basketball and can tell you he wouldn't have cracked the lineup in three years. The kid is good but not Duke good. In the state of AZ I can count on five fingers the number of kids that could play at Duke (i.e., Alarie, Jefferson, Bibby, Bayless, and Elliott). All but one (Alarie) ended up UA. While I would have liked to have the body for practice, I am sold Carrick was never going to be a real contributor. Some may see this as sour grapes but check my posts on the subject, I have never waivered. Good luck wherever he ends up but I'm glad The Duke University wasn't the end result.

[Kewlswim]

I have said it multiple times, I live within an hour of where Carrick played HS basketball and can tell you he wouldn't have cracked the lineup in three years. The kid is good but not Duke good. In the state of AZ I can count on five fingers the number of kids that could play at Duke (i.e., Alarie, Jefferson, Bibby, Bayless, and Elliott). All but one (Alarie) ended up UA. While I would have liked to have the body for practice, I am sold Carrick was never going to be a real contributor. Some may see this as sour grapes but check my posts on the subject, I have never waivered. Good luck wherever he ends up but I'm glad The Duke University wasn't the end result.

Hi,

Thanks for the post. Don't some kids get better over time? Maybe the Duke coaching staff saw that Carrick would be one of those that improves with time? Zoubs sure didn't start off like a world beater and see how he finished his career. Then again, I never saw him play and he might be so far behind the curve as to take his recruitment into question. I have a lot of confidence in the Duke coaching staff, particularly after last year. If they say the kid is good, the kid is probably good or going to be good.

GO DUKE!

[AZLA]

I was looking forward to having Felix on the team, especially when Duke wanted to push the tempo and run. I think he would have seen some meaningful playing time. It would have depended on the match-up. Any time Duke puts resources towards recruiting a student athlete, signing him, and then that person can't be a part of the team, should be viewed as a missed opportunity (for both parties). I don't see how it can be spun any other way.

[should_be_working]

There's a good bit of info here.

http://bluedevilnation.net/2010/05/the-facts-on-carrick-felix-and-his-decision-to-reopen-his-recruitment/

[rotogod00]

There's a good bit of info here.

http://bluedevilnation.net/2010/05/the-facts-on-carrick-felix-and-his-decision-to-reopen-his-recruitment/

"didn’t think he could accomplish his goals at Duke with concerns to college basketball"

like getting on the court this year with singler returning. sounds like a PT thing to me.

[CameronDuke]

To me, it seems like Carrick Felix didn't think he could accomplish his personal athletic goals as a player at Duke University. Frankly, I would suggest that he didn't think he could get enough playing time in Duke's system to prosper and show NBA scouts his potential. I do not think that his departure from this program is academic related. He had brought his GPA up considerably while attending junior college in Idaho and I'm fairly confident Nate James would not have recruited him if Felix was a slouch in the classroom.

I certainly wish Felix the best in his future endeavors and hope he lands a spot on roster where he thinks he can best showcase his skills on the court. Duke still has a plethora of talent to choose from given the departure of Felix - (Singler, Smith, Miles Plumlee, Mason Plumlee, Curry, Dawkins, Irving, Kelly, Thornton, and Hairston). That is ten players from which Coach K can use to best carry out his plan. I think we have more than enough talent left to win lots of basketball games next season. I also think we will now go after another target in the class of 2011, a class which is now shaping up to by absolutely dynamite.

[BD80]

There's a good bit of info here.

http://bluedevilnation.net/2010/05/the-facts-on-carrick-felix-and-his-decision-to-reopen-his-recruitment/

Not unless you are a premium member.

I wonder if Felix's coach was told: "talk to me so I can get people to pay ME to read what you said."

I guess some will find the link of interest.

[AtlDuke72]

Sorry to see him go. It reminds me somewhat of Billy McAfery (sp?) deciding to leave to get more playing time after the 1991 championship. If he had stayed we might have won back to back . . .

[should_be_working]

Not unless you are a premium member.

I wonder if Felix's coach was told: "talk to me so I can get people to pay ME to read what you said."

I guess some will find the link of interest.

I'm not a member and there are a few paragraphs that anyone can read, which for me was more info than what others are speculating.

[CLW]

I was looking forward to seeing what Felix could do. Hopefully, he signs on elsewhere.

ESPN Insider is indicating Washington may be interested (they missed out on Jones and his former JUCO teammate is signed to play there).

http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/features/rumors#2070

[Biscuit King]

Sorry to see him go. It reminds me somewhat of Billy McAfery (sp?) deciding to leave to get more playing time after the 1991 championship. If he had stayed we might have won back to back . . .

This is exactly like the McCaffrey situation, except that McCaffrey was not a JUCO transfer, he had already played a significant role on the 91 championship team and had All-American type talent, he had a father who was pushing him to showcase his talents at another position and he was an offensive-oriented player.

[hedevil]

Man! I just got on the board and saw this.

First off, I wish Carrick the best in the future.

I can see why he would opt out of Duke (if he indeed did), simply by having to play behind Kyle this year. Remember that this kid knows that Duke might land Miller, and Duke already has Gbinije for 11'. Two guys who could very well take away any possibility for him to see significant minutes at the 3 after Kyle's gone.

[yancem]

I'm disappointed we won't have Felix on the roster. Nevertheless, I applaud our university's unwavering commitment to academics.

Since academics now doesn't seem to be an issue I should probably ignore this post but I can't help myself. Yes, Duke should maintain a commitment to academics and should enforce the high standards that have made it the prestigious institution that it is today. That being said, Felix was offered a scholarship and also met with admissions. At that point, he must have been told he was accepted academically or why else would have he committed and made plans to enroll for summer school? To then change course to a deny his application is simply inappropriate. Now if the case were, as Airowe alluded to, a conditional acceptance and then Felix failed to live up to those conditions then that is another story. But to accept and then say sorry, lacks integrity IMO.


Not unless you are a premium member.

I wonder if Felix's coach was told: "talk to me so I can get people to pay ME to read what you said."

I guess some will find the link of interest.

It's a free article. Not sure what your complaint is.

[ThePublisher]

Carrick signed up with Duke as a security blanket in case Singler decided to go to the association. Since he is staying, I really don't see Felix having played that much this season. Just occasionally to give someone some rest.
Like everyone is saying, if we go small Dawkins will be at the 3, big and Hairston can play the 3 as Singler's backup. I doubt Felix would have beaten either of these guys for PT.
From what I've seen Felix was highly athletic, but unpolished and probably not ultra competitive at the ACC level.

I would say this is a blessing really. We don't need the insurance policy for Singler anymore, so this give us a scholarship for a top level guy for 2011, when we loose at least Smith and Singler, not to mention anyone who decides to go pro early (mason is projected as a first round pick next year, curry). Felix would likely get low PT for his whole career at Duke, I'd rather see the scholarship go to someone who will contribute more.

[airowe]

Since academics now doesn't seem to be an issue I should probably ignore this post but I can't help myself. Yes, Duke should maintain a commitment to academics and should enforce the high standards that have made it the prestigious institution that it is today. That being said, Felix was offered a scholarship and also met with admissions. At that point, he must have been told he was accepted academically or why else would have he committed and made plans to enroll for summer school? To then change course to a deny his application is simply inappropriate. Now if the case were, as Airowe alluded to, a conditional acceptance and then Felix failed to live up to those conditions then that is another story. But to accept and then say sorry, lacks integrity IMO.


You probably won't see anything from Duke publicly on this as FERPA rules will not allow them to comment on a student's (or prospective student it appears) grades, but there were a few benchmarks that Carrick had to pass before he could be officially admitted into Duke. Unfortunately for him and Duke, he did not.

[91_92_01_10_15]

It's a free article. Not sure what your complaint is.

Not on my computer it isn't. watzone will usually post here when he publishes a free article.

[airowe]

Not on my computer it isn't. watzone will usually post here when he publishes a free article.

I like your change in username. ;)

[airowe]

http://www.newsobserver.com/2010/05/24/498612/juco-transfer-felix-asks-duke.html

[sundown]

Best of luck to him. I'm glad Duke has the scholarship open again; in time it'll go to a better player than Felix.

[Hermy-own]

You probably won't see anything from Duke publicly on this as FERPA rules will not allow them to comment on a student's (or prospective student it appears) grades, but there were a few benchmarks that Carrick had to pass before he could be officially admitted into Duke. Unfortunately for him and Duke, he did not.

Airowe, what is your source for this information? The N&O article was clearly speculating that he was more concerned about playing time than academics. I'm not a BDN member, but the first 2 paragraphs of that story also suggested that playing time was the issue.


"didn’t think he could accomplish his goals at Duke with concerns to college basketball"

like getting on the court this year with singler returning. sounds like a PT thing to me.

[airowe]

Airowe, what is your source for this information? The N&O article was clearly speculating that he was more concerned about playing time than academics. I'm not a BDN member, but the first 2 paragraphs of that story also suggested that playing time was the issue.

I'm hearing this info from people close to the program. I don't expect any of the public information to back this up honestly and I can't provide a link for it, as it was from telephone and text message conversations. I completely understand if you don't believe me, or if DBR wants to strike my info from the thread, but it comes from reliable sources...

I expect the Duke staff to take the high road and make everything much easier for Carrick to move forward with his basketball career, and therefore don't expect them to dispute any of the info Carrick, his family, or his coaches are putting out there.

[Turtleboy]

I expect the Duke staff to take the high road and make everything much easier for Carrick to move forward with his basketball career, and therefore don't expect them to dispute any of the info Carrick, his family, or his coaches are putting out there.What about the info Matt Plizga is putting out there? According to the N&O article it's Felix who asked to be released.

[airowe]

What about the info Matt Plizga is putting out there? According to the N&O article it's Felix who asked to be released.

I'm certainly in no position to dispute anything Matt Plizga says. I'm just reiterating what was told to me...

[CEF1959]

His PT next year would have been fine, and then two more years of eligibility after that. It wouldn't surprise me if Duke is just being gracious in allowing him to ask to be released. What do they care, esp. if it makes it easier on CF? It's like allowing someone to resign "for personal reasons" in lieu of being canned. In most situations (and this is one), it doesn't cost a thing to be nice about it that way.

Either way, I'm bummed. He reminds me a bit of Chris Carrawell. And I wish him well where ever he goes.

[roywhite]

It wouldn't surprise me if Duke is just being gracious in allowing him to ask to be released. What do they care, esp. if it makes it easier on CF? It's like allowing someone to resign "for personal reasons" in lieu of being canned. In most situations (and this is one), it doesn't cost a thing to be nice about it that way.



You would think so, but witness the handling of the recent departure of the Wear twins from Chapel Hill. Coach K is not a "throw 'em under the bus" kind of guy.

[Azdukefan]

Hi,

Thanks for the post. Don't some kids get better over time? Maybe the Duke coaching staff saw that Carrick would be one of those that improves with time? Zoubs sure didn't start off like a world beater and see how he finished his career. Then again, I never saw him play and he might be so far behind the curve as to take his recruitment into question. I have a lot of confidence in the Duke coaching staff, particularly after last year. If they say the kid is good, the kid is probably good or going to be good.

GO DUKE!

I have the utmost respect and belief in the staff. However, they have been wrong on an occassion and unless the kid improved leaps and bounds he wouldn't have seen the court. Him not attending pretty much spells that PT was an issue. FWIW Garf stated Z coming out of high school would end up being a "Duke great." Too me thats much higher a compliment than Northern Arizona University recruiting you. The Z comparison is apples and oranges. I appreciate the response but IMHO Carrick was never going to be much more than a practice player.

[AZLA]

Carrick signed up with Duke as a security blanket in case Singler decided to go to the association... he insurance policy for Singler anymore, so this give us a scholarship for a top level guy for 2011, when we loose at least Smith and Singler, not to mention anyone who decides to go pro early (mason is projected as a first round pick next year, curry). Felix would likely get low PT for his whole career at Duke, I'd rather see the scholarship go to someone who will contribute more.

Good points. I was caught up in the junior college to Duke underdog story and was excited to see what Felix could accomplish at Duke. I still think from a recruiting perspective these type of last second decisions to bail out are a waste of time and resources and remind me of Humphries and Livingston to some extent. I know they're not the best comparisons, but it felt like Humphries and Livingston took advantage of the Duke recruitment spotlight to push their own agendas. I'm not saying Felix has done that, I just don't understand how he passes up a great opportunity to join a National contender. Okay, I'm over it now. The positive side is I'm much more interested in watching Dawkins, Curry and Kelly get lots of PT.

[G man]

Did he sign a LOI? If he did is he eligible to play next year?

[BD80]

Did he sign a LOI? If he did is he eligible to play next year?

Duke granted a release, so he should be able to play next year. It would be like a high school senior asking for a release.

[Devil07]

Duke granted a release, so he should be able to play next year. It would be like a high school senior asking for a release.

I think the only caveat to that would be that he now can't sign with another ACC school unless he's willing to sit out a year. Other than that, since he never started attending class, he's free to go anywhere.

[MChambers]

If Ol' Roy was the Duke coach (a horrible thought), I think he'd be issuing a statement about how surprised he was that Felix wasn't joining Duke and bemoaning the fact that he didn't have a backup 3 and would have to work hard to find another at this late date. :D

[bluedevil2012]

Man, this is disappointing. I was really looking forward to seeing Carrick play. But I guess you gotta look for a silver lining. Sometimes too much talent is a bad thing. Less of a log jam would allow our existing talent shine more. Also, it frees up a scholarship for next year I guess... :o

[BD80]

I think the only caveat to that would be that he now can't sign with another ACC school unless he's willing to sit out a year. ...

Ooooh. I'll bet that chafes ol' roy's wheat.

[superdave]

Is Felix likely to return to his previous list of suitors to find a home? Guess it may be too early to tell but I hope he's not left hanging for too long.

[sandinmyshoes]

Somehow I think we'll be okay.

[dcdevil2009]

Does anyone know what would happen eligibility-wise if it was an admissions issue? Would he still need a release if the reason he didn't/couldn't honor his LOI was because he couldn't get into Duke, but still met NCAA minimums? It seems to raise some interesting questions about what a school "owes" a signee once he accepts a scholarship.

[MrBisonDevil]

Carrick signed up with Duke as a security blanket in case Singler decided to go to the association. Since he is staying, I really don't see Felix having played that much this season. Just occasionally to give someone some rest.
Like everyone is saying, if we go small Dawkins will be at the 3, big and Hairston can play the 3 as Singler's backup. I doubt Felix would have beaten either of these guys for PT.
From what I've seen Felix was highly athletic, but unpolished and probably not ultra competitive at the ACC level.

I would say this is a blessing really. We don't need the insurance policy for Singler anymore, so this give us a scholarship for a top level guy for 2011, when we loose at least Smith and Singler, not to mention anyone who decides to go pro early (mason is projected as a first round pick next year, curry). Felix would likely get low PT for his whole career at Duke, I'd rather see the scholarship go to someone who will contribute more.

We should be careful about making negative statements directed at kid who was about to be admitted into Duke University.

The kid earned a Duke basketball scholarship offer not only because of his ability/potential to play but also because he passed an initial character and culture fit test. As an alumnus of Duke University, I am much more concerned about character & culture fit than athletic ability and contributions to a sport. It is not a blessing to see any kid miss out on the Duke University experience regardless if he started or stayed on the end of the bench. Also, the kids who are on the bench usually end up being fan favorites. No need to disrespect these kids for earning a scholarship. Sometimes, the scholarship allows them to contribute more on campus than on the court.

GO DUKE! GTHC!

[mo.st.dukie]

Why do so many people on the board refer to Dawkins as a "3"? The guy is 6'4" with a great outside stroke on the catch-and-shoot. That's pretty much what he showed last year. When I think of a "3" I think of a guy who is bigger than 6'4" in most instances, and can also put it on the floor, go to the bucket, slash, and then also rebound some and defend bigger guys. Didn't see any of that from Dawkins last year.


J.J. Redick started at the 3 during the 04 season and at other points during his career. It was Duhon, Ewing, and Redick, pretty small backcourt. Redick was 6'4, catch-and-shoot, with little driving/slashing abilities his sophomore year. This isn't the NBA where you have a prototype for each position. In college, you can afford to have a 6'4 playing the 3 just like you can afford having a 6'7 guy playing the 5.

IMO, Carrick was insurance in the event that Kyle left early and also in case there was an additional unexpected departure. The staff did not want to have to deal with the same situation they were in last off season even though it turned out great.

It's pretty difficult to imagine Kyle, Nolan, Kyrie, Seth, and Andre NOT getting the majority of the minutes at the 1-3 next year. That's just a ton of talent with other guys like Kelly and Hairston who may be able to play the 3 as well. Carrick likely would not have seen much PT this year and with MG and possibly Rivers coming in '11, he would be primarily a backup his junior year as well.

[gep]

Man, this is disappointing. I was really looking forward to seeing Carrick play.

I know you probably mean "seeing Carrick plan as a DUKE player". But, I'm sure we'll have some chance to see Carrick play next year... especially with the "hype" of "turning down" DUKE...:rolleyes:

[Cisco]

Per Yahoo! Sports,

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/news?slug=rivals-377033


Reports surfaced early Monday morning that College of Southern Idaho star Carrick Felix has not been admitted into Duke University. Sources have since confirmed this information with Devils Illustrated, stating that Felix has now reopened his recruitment.
what is this??

[brevity]

what is this??

It's a 5-page thread on the first page of this forum.

[cbnaylor]

http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21388

[UrinalCake]

Yeah, and also, we landed on the moon!

[gumbomoop]

Yeah, and also, we landed on the moon!

I'd have thought the various studies and investigations have pretty clearly disproved this malicious fabrication. To give but a single, albeit definitive, example:

"In the 1992 movie Sneakers, the Mother character, played by Dan Aykroyd, mentions 'It's the same technology that NASA used to fake the Apollo Moon landings, so it shouldn't give us any trouble.'"

So there.

CF to UW, maybe? Or maybe WU? Somewhere. I am sorry things didn't work out for him here, as he gave every indication a few months back of being ecstatic to get a chance to come to Duke.

[BD80]

Yeah, and also, we landed on the moon!


I'd have thought the various studies and investigations have pretty clearly disproved this malicious fabrication. To give but a single, albeit definitive, example:

"In the 1992 movie Sneakers, the Mother character, played by Dan Aykroyd, mentions 'It's the same technology that NASA used to fake the Apollo Moon landings, so it shouldn't give us any trouble.'"

So there.

...

But on "The Big Bang Theory" the guys bounced a laser beam off of the parabolic mirrors left on the moon by Neil Armstrong, proving that a sentient species did indeed visit the moon in the '60s. Of course, Penny's date responded: "Cool! Which species?"

[roywhite]

But on "The Big Bang Theory" the guys bounced a laser beam off of the parabolic mirrors left on the moon by Neil Armstrong, proving that a sentient species did indeed visit the moon in the '60s. Of course, Penny's date responded: "Cool! Which species?"

And don't forget OJ Simpson's contribution to the faked space flight theme.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/5872384/Apollo-11-moon-landing-moon-movies.html

[BlueandWhite]

Why do so many people on the board refer to Dawkins as a "3"? The guy is 6'4" with a great outside stroke on the catch-and-shoot. That's pretty much what he showed last year. When I think of a "3" I think of a guy who is bigger than 6'4" in most instances, and can also put it on the floor, go to the bucket, slash, and then also rebound some and defend bigger guys. Didn't see any of that from Dawkins last year.

I think this is a potentially significant loss. We don't have a player like Carrick - athletic true "3" who can fill the lanes on the break but more importantly really get after it as a defensive "specialist." Of course few of us have actually seen him play, but based on reports he sounded like just the kind of "glue" guy that is so beneficial to have when building a championship team. Doesn't mean we can't win without him, of course, but still it creates a hole.

It is too bad that he won't be able to attend Duke and join the team, whatever the reason. However, to characterize this as a "potentially significant loss" is really overreaching given the team we'll have next year. Are you serious? Singler, Smith and Irving will be on the court for at least 100 of the 200 combined minutes per game. How many minutes per game, realistically, was Carrick Felix going to play? Duke's "glue" guy next season will be Kyle Singler - he will actually be on the court for nearly all of Duke's games.

I guess that this now leaves all the rest of Duke's "unathletic" players, such as Mason Plumlee and Andre Dawkins, to fill the "hole" that remains because Felix won't be at Duke.

[UrinalCake]

I'd have thought the various studies and investigations have pretty clearly disproved this malicious fabrication.

In case anyone missed it, my post was a reference to this scene (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-f_DPrSEOEo) from Dumb and Dumber, in response to the guy who posted about Felix a day late, when a thread had already been started. Just poking a little fun at ya.

Regarding Dawkins, I think a lot of people are envisioning him playing some 3 simply because we have so much depth at guard and not so much at the "wing" position, so the natural assumption is that the tallest of these guys will sometimes play the role of a 3 in order to get them all in the game as much as possible.

[91_92_01_10_15]

I like your change in username. ;)

Thanks. I like it, too. A lot.

-jk actually deserves the credit. He saw that I had created the new user name, and he contacted me to offer to merge the accounts.

This is a cool place.

[wilko]

I think Felix is a significant loss.

I am not going to argue from the standpoint of what he may or may not have done on the floor, I'm not really qualified or have insight to address that...

But in the battle of Public Perception its a key loss.
To me, Felix represented the biggest departure from the "business as usual" mentality in Duke recruiting. I for one was pleased to see this approach to identifying prospects and bringing them to Duke especially after a series of high profile whiffs. This Juco signing was novel approach to address an ever-changing recruiting landscape. A lot of positives to be gleaned from it.

I would hope that Duke taking a Juco player would get attention, in a positive way, from prospects who had previously not considered or dismissed Duke as a destination.

The talk about him possibly not making the cut academically is bad form.
Why encourage other Jucos to take the Duke option off the table by posturing to be too difficult an institution to navigate? Does us no good.

I'm sorry to see him go and wish him well.
Hope it works out for him and us.

[formerdukeathlete]

I think Felix is a significant loss.

I am not going to argue from the standpoint of what he may or may not have done on the floor, I'm not really qualified or have insight to address that...

But in the battle of Public Perception its a key loss.
To me, Felix represented the biggest departure from the "business as usual" mentality in Duke recruiting. I for one was pleased to see this approach to identifying prospects and bringing them to Duke especially after a series of high profile whiffs. This Juco signing was novel approach to address an ever-changing recruiting landscape. A lot of positives to be gleaned from it.

I would hope that Duke taking a Juco player would get attention, in a positive way, from prospects who had previously not considered or dismissed Duke as a destination.

The talk about him possibly not making the cut academically is bad form.
Why encourage other Jucos to take the Duke option off the table by posturing to be too difficult an institution to navigate? Does us no good.

I'm sorry to see him go and wish him well.
Hope it works out for him and us.

I disagree with just about everything you have posted, and I think you are wrong in your assertions. A "departure from the 'business as usual,' " in this instance, it may not have been well advised. K has tremendous leeway academically, nonetheless, qualification out of high school, and in fact being better than NCAA minimum qualified may be a better predictor of the likelihood of academic success at Duke (without struggling and being too limited in course selection), than grades at a non-competitive junior college. It is my understanding and I think almost universally acknowledged that top high school prospects (potentially suitable at Duke's elite Program level) almost never attend junior college unless they were not NCAA qualified out of high school. Once in a blue moon, maybe someone goes out for basketball his senior year high school, and wants junior college rather than walking on at a 4 year school. But, if the late starter were academically qualified and motivated, he would tend not to choose the long shot late start late bloom basketball prospects over attending a superior 4 year institution. Jucos are not likely to offer much to Duke.

Football is another matter, particularly the California juco league, http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=4200&ATCLID=204858970 , where Duke obtained a tight end who went to Hopkins a year on a Lacrosse scholarship but decided Football was more his calling. No question about academic qualifications here as one of Helfet's choices out of high school was to play Football at Harvard.

K's process of recruiting academically motivated and qualified top prospects is indeed the right kind of business as usual for Duke. We are afterall an elite educational institution first, and a top Basketball program second.

[roywhite]

From the local newspaper in the area of College of Southern Idaho:

http://www.magicvalley.com/sports/article_f6c32e9a-6829-11df-adf6-001cc4c002e0.html


Former College of Southern Idaho star Carrick Felix told the Times-News Tuesday morning that he left Duke for personal reasons.

"Duke's a good school. I'm not going to say I wasn't happy going there, but I just felt in my heart that it wasn't the right choice for me," said Felix, who received a release from his Duke scholarship Tuesday morning. "It wasn't the right road God had for me. I just had to follow my heart on this one because I tend to be a people pleaser sometimes and do what other people say."

[OldPhiKap]

I wish him the best of luck. I would have enjoyed having him on the team, but he has to follow his own heart and path.

Good luck, Felix, and hope it works out best for all concerned.

[ChicagoCrazy84]

Sounds to me like he was afraid of getting homesick? Duke is not going to be for everyone. Hell, it might not even be a school that I would have been able to spend 4 years at :D (I went to Arizona). I think that once the offer came his way and everyone was jumping on him because of it, he couldn't turn it down, but once he got to Durham he probably realized that he wasn't all that comfortable there. Going from a JUCO school in Idaho to Duke would not be easy for anyone and coupled with the fact that he may have received 5 min a game next season, it started to weigh on him a bit too much.

It sucks, Im sad he won't be here because he would be a fun player to watch and probably would have become a crowd favorite. I'll tell you what though! Ryan Kelly and Josh Hairston probably aren't too sad about it. It'll free up more time for these guys because Kyle, while may come close, will not be playing 40 min. Let's not forget that Josh Hairston has just as much potential and will be a very good player. He could end up benefitting the most out of this. Im excited for him.

[wilko]

I disagree with just about everything you have posted, and I think you are wrong in your assertions. A "departure from the 'business as usual,' " in this instance, it may not have been well advised. Jucos are not likely to offer much to Duke.

That's fine. I respect your opinion.
Since he ain't coming, its hardly worth arguing about further.


K's process of recruiting academically motivated and qualified top prospects is indeed the right kind of business as usual for Duke.

I want to agree with this. I really do. But today's recruiting landscape seems far different than it was even just a few short years ago.

I offer UK and WWW as exhibit 1. - These kids aren't "fans" they are players and they want the best deal that will get them a paycheck. This "express lane" approach will ultimately fail as more copycats dilute the available talent pool away from any given school, but having to compete against that in the meantime is difficult to woo recruits.

You could extrapolate that and say its the same at UConn, L'ville and UNC to differing degrees. Having Pics of a Star player partying with Hot Babes isn't going to hurt recruiting. Even the ones that aren't League ready want to have a good time. Where is the crazy, sexy, hip, wow factor for us?

Granted a Juco player doesn't solve that all by itself, but its an approachable entry point. It makes Duke seem less unattainable.


We are afterall an elite educational institution first, and a top Basketball program second.

What we?
Im a FAN. Handing other schools their heads is far more important to my ego and self-esteem than the teams graduation rates. Dont get me wrong its fun to say "Hey UNC, we beat ya by 32 AND that other graduation stuff"..

But to be on the receiving end of a 20pt loss and say "Our graduation rates are better"... well maybe its due to my limited trash-talk abilities, but I have a tuff time making that work for me.

I've been a lurker here for a long time. I've seen you make a lot of good points in the past.

[DoubleDuke Dad]

Thanks. I like it, too. A lot.

-jk actually deserves the credit. He saw that I had created the new user name, and he contacted me to offer to merge the accounts.

This is a cool place.

You do realize that you are going to have to change your name again next year, don't you? :D

[DukeSean]

We are afterall an elite educational institution first, and a top Basketball program second.



What we?
Im a FAN. Handing other schools their heads is far more important to my ego and self-esteem than the teams graduation rates. Dont get me wrong its fun to say "Hey UNC, we beat ya by 32 AND that other graduation stuff"..

But to be on the receiving end of a 20pt loss and say "Our graduation rates are better"... well maybe its due to my limited trash-talk abilities, but I have a tuff time making that work for me.


I suppose that all depends on your point of view. If you're at Duke to be a typical student, then yes I would say we are an elite educational institution first and a top basketball program second. But, if you're at Duke to play basketball, you're going to be far more concerned that we are a top basketball program first and an elite educational institution second.

But having been an alum for a little bit now, I have to side with Wilko on this. I love the fact that we're the top basketball program more than I love Duke's academic reputation. It's what makes being a Duke fan so much better than say, being a Penn or Harvard fan. Who wears Penn or Harvard shirts and hats whenever they can?

[DukeSean]

To get back on topic, though, I didn't see much playing time for Felix since Singler decided to return. Sure, he'd be great for practice, a big body to bang and potentially a guy to take some fouls in certain situations, but if he was looking for PT, I think he'd have been disappointed. In the end, maybe it's best for both parties to part company, and Felix can go somewhere else having gotten his name some more recognition.

[CEF1959]

To get back on topic, though, I didn't see much playing time for Felix since Singler decided to return. Sure, he'd be great for practice, a big body to bang and potentially a guy to take some fouls in certain situations, but if he was looking for PT, I think he'd have been disappointed. In the end, maybe it's best for both parties to part company, and Felix can go somewhere else having gotten his name some more recognition.

He would have gotten PT next year, but that misses the point. He'd have only been a sophomore next year, with two full years of eligibility after Singler leaves. And how much more recognition do you need than playing on a NC caliber team for three years with more TV time than Oprah?

No, I'm not buying the "not enough PT with Kyle coming back" story.

[Orange&BlackSheep]

Who wears Penn or Harvard shirts and hats whenever they can?

No one ever willingly wears a Penn shirt.

[Kedsy]

No one ever willingly wears a Penn shirt.

Hey, I went to Penn Law School and I'd proudly wear a Penn shirt. Although having said that, I don't think I actually own such a shirt. But I would wear it. Honest.

[DukeSean]

He would have gotten PT next year, but that misses the point. He'd have only been a sophomore next year, with two full years of eligibility after Singler leaves. And how much more recognition do you need than playing on a NC caliber team for three years with more TV time than Oprah?

No, I'm not buying the "not enough PT with Kyle coming back" story.

Fair enough. Both sides have been sufficiently defended. It's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[DukeSean]

Hey, I went to Penn Law School and I'd proudly wear a Penn shirt. Although having said that, I don't think I actually own such a shirt. But I would wear it. Honest.

But you'd wear a Penn LAW shirt, right? Not just Penn? :p

[Kedsy]

But you'd wear a Penn LAW shirt, right? Not just Penn? :p

Actually, I'd probably wear just Penn. I'd hate to advertise that I was ever a lawyer. ;)

I went to all the football games and the basketball games when I was there. The Palestra is a great place to watch basketball, not as great as Cameron, but it's up there on the list of top college arenas. And for their level, the Penn football team was a lot more successful and fun to watch than the Duke football team was during my undergrad years.

Nevertheless, the OP on this subject is right. I own enough Duke gear to open my own shop and I don't think I have one thing that says Penn on it. Whether it's because you have more of an allegiance to your undergrad school or because of Duke basketball I can't say for certain.

[Orange&BlackSheep]

Whether it's because you have more of an allegiance to your undergrad school or because of Duke basketball I can't say for certain.

I am certain you don't have one because you would not want to announce publicly such a shameful allegiance. The Palestra is an amazing place to watch basketball -- especially a Penn loss. Something I sadly have not yet witnessed due to a general feeling of it being too much effort to drive and park since I got old.

[77devil]

Actually, I'd probably wear just Penn. I'd hate to advertise that I was ever a lawyer. ;)

I went to all the football games and the basketball games when I was there. The Palestra is a great place to watch basketball, not as great as Cameron, but it's up there on the list of top college arenas. And for their level, the Penn football team was a lot more successful and fun to watch than the Duke football team was during my undergrad years.

Nevertheless, the OP on this subject is right. I own enough Duke gear to open my own shop and I don't think I have one thing that says Penn on it. Whether it's because you have more of an allegiance to your undergrad school or because of Duke basketball I can't say for certain.

Having experienced both venues countless times I can say that the Palestra was every bit as loud, maybe louder, than CIS because the opposing teams' fans each occupied half the venue. And the teams were all nationally competitive and periodically great during that period. Big 5 games were a big deal at the time.

As an aside, the same architectural firm for CIS designed the Palestra first.

[miramar]

No one ever willingly wears a Penn shirt.

Do they still have the "Not Penn State" shirts? Or the ones with Harvard, Yale, and Princeton crossed out, and then "What the hell, Pennsylvania"?

I spent one semester in grad school at Penn back in 1978, but after someone was shot in front of where I lived, and another person was beaten by a 2 X 4 inside the building (by the security guard, no less) I left for Austin.

I hope things are better now.

[roywhite]

Do they still have the "Not Penn State" shirts? Or the ones with Harvard, Yale, and Princeton crossed out, and then "What the hell, Pennsylvania"?

I spent one semester in grad school at Penn back in 1978, but after someone was shot in front of where I lived, and another person was beaten by a 2 X 4 inside the building (by the security guard, no less) I left for Austin.

I hope things are better now.

So that was you that we sent up to West Philadelphia in trade for Eugene "Tinkerbell" Banks?

Thanks, appreciate it. :)

[Kedsy]

I am certain you don't have one because you would not want to announce publicly such a shameful allegiance. The Palestra is an amazing place to watch basketball -- especially a Penn loss. Something I sadly have not yet witnessed due to a general feeling of it being too much effort to drive and park since I got old.

Well, my undergrad school was Duke, so I'm not sure what's supposed to be shameful in this scenario.

As far as Penn basketball is concerned, it has a long and proud history of playing well and winning, the last couple of years notwithstanding. I haven't attended much since I moved to the suburbs, but I still try to get down to the Palestra occasionally.

[CampbellBlueDevil]

"Ha kyle [Singler] was not the reason y people I just didn't want to gooo how hard is it to understand lol my heart wasn't feeling it" -- Carrick Felix

It wasn't the playing time according to Felix

[dukestheheat]

So with the information we have at hand, it's probably too complex to pinpoint exactly why he's not coming. Keep in mind that he probably won't divulge the exact reason(s) for the change of direction. Physicians will tell you that some patients will not directly spell out why they're there to see the physician; the doctor has to look at the 2nd or sometimes even the 3rd complaint to discern the true reason for the visit.

He could have any of 300 reasons for wanting the release, and at least from his perspective, all are great reasons; I don't think this reflects poorly at all on Duke and while I'd love to see him here, he wasn't going to be happy with the whole deal.

Duke is going to be just fine and so is he, going forward.

dth.

[77devil]

Im a FAN. Handing other schools their heads is far more important to my ego and self-esteem than the teams graduation rates. Dont get me wrong its fun to say "Hey UNC, we beat ya by 32 AND that other graduation stuff"..

But to be on the receiving end of a 20pt loss and say "Our graduation rates are better"... well maybe its due to my limited trash-talk abilities, but I have a tuff time making that work for me.

I would conjecture that most alums disagree. Duke was an outstanding academic institution long before the K era. While I enjoy the success of the basketball program as much as anyone, Duke's academic reputation is far more important to me. Furthermore, I am confident that the basketball program can continue to thrive while maintaining a superior admissions standard than almost all of its D-1 competitors.

If the past year doesn't convince you, so be it. But if you are not an alumnus, in my opinion, you don't get to vote.

[wilko]

If the past year doesn't convince you, so be it. But if you are not an alumnus, in my opinion, you don't get to vote.

For real?
Some days its hard to be a Duke fan.

THE MOST common question I get when I tell folks Im a Duke fan is "When did you graduate?" I find that to be pretty irratating.

It assumes that only students are fans, which is dead wrong. My sons and I counted 7 Duke banners between our house and their grandmothers house on a 15 min ride here in the triangle. And I KNOW alot of those folks as I grew up around them didnt attend the university.

How many UK, Alabama, UT Fla or UNC fans get that question on a weekly basis?

To get attitude here on this board which bills itself as "Fan Site" is disappointing.

Im not begruging you your opinion, but save it for your Iron Dukes rally or Alumni chapter meeting.

[DevilHorns]

For real?
Some days its hard to be a Duke fan.

THE MOST common question I get when I tell folks Im a Duke fan is "When did you graduate?" I find that to be pretty irratating.

It assumes that only students are fans, which is dead wrong. My sons and I counted 7 Duke banners between our house and their grandmothers house on a 15 min ride here in the triangle. And I KNOW alot of those folks as I grew up around them didnt attend the university.

How many UK, Alabama, UT Fla or UNC fans get that question on a weekly basis?

To get attitude here on this board which bills itself as "Fan Site" is disappointing.

Im not begruging you your opinion, but save it for your Iron Dukes rally or Alumni chapter meeting.

Wilko, though I don't agree with your overall point (we won the holy grail last year with our limited recruiting practices and have done fine in the past obviously, and so I don't mind not having to urgently expand our net to JUCO players etc)....

I do agree with you that the previous post was a little bit of a low blow. I don't think you have to defend yourself as a Duke fan simply because you didn't go to Duke. I honestly think thats why some of the general public is sour towards Duke. We're seen as an exclusive uppity group of fans. Let's not feed them their image of us.

[SupaDave]

I would conjecture that most alums disagree. Duke was an outstanding academic institution long before the K era. While I enjoy the success of the basketball program as much as anyone, Duke's academic reputation is far more important to me. Furthermore, I am confident that the basketball program can continue to thrive while maintaining a superior admissions standard than almost all of its D-1 competitors.

If the past year doesn't convince you, so be it. But if you are not an alumnus, in my opinion, you don't get to vote.

This is the kind of post that other folks immediately try to prove wrong - and they CAN find examples. We understand but be easy - please. As a brief note, college is about much more than academics. And does spending 4 or so years at a University and getting a piece of paper at a University REALLY vest you anymore than say, Oscar the Janitor? He gets to meet recruits ya know...

[77devil]

For real?
Some days its hard to be a Duke fan.

THE MOST common question I get when I tell folks Im a Duke fan is "When did you graduate?" I find that to be pretty irratating.

It assumes that only students are fans, which is dead wrong. My sons and I counted 7 Duke banners between our house and their grandmothers house on a 15 min ride here in the triangle. And I KNOW alot of those folks as I grew up around them didnt attend the university.

How many UK, Alabama, UT Fla or UNC fans get that question on a weekly basis?

To get attitude here on this board which bills itself as "Fan Site" is disappointing.

Im not begruging you your opinion, but save it for your Iron Dukes rally or Alumni chapter meeting.

Way to quote the comment out of context.

All fans are welcome as far as I am concerned. Nevertheless, when it comes to opinions regarding university priorities, a fan who is not an alumnus doesn't have the same vested interest. I don't care that basketball success is more important for your ego(you wrote it). You didn't spend four years of hard work to earn a Duke diploma.

[77devil]

As a brief note, college is about much more than academics. And does spending 4 or so years at a University and getting a piece of paper at a University REALLY vest you anymore than say, Oscar the Janitor?

In my opinion, and I venture to say the opinions of employers of Duke graduates, yes.

[ChicagoCrazy84]

Way to quote the comment out of context.

All fans are welcome as far as I am concerned. Nevertheless, when it comes to opinions regarding university priorities, a fan who is not an alumnus doesn't have the same vested interest. I don't care that basketball success is more important for your ego(you wrote it). You didn't spend four years of hard work to earn a Duke diploma.


Now hold on, this is basketball we're talking about. You may have a diploma from Duke, but it doesn't mean you get to tell us how much interest we can have and come across like you know what is best for Duke. Duke knows what is best for Duke. I just don't want you to think that just because you have a piece of paper that says you graduated from Duke, it entitles you to a bigger pedestal on the fan front.

[sagegrouse]

Now hold on, this is basketball we're talking about. You may have a diploma from Duke, but it doesn't mean you get to tell us how much interest we can have and come across like you know what is best for Duke. Duke knows what is best for Duke. I just don't want you to think that just because you have a piece of paper that says you graduated from Duke, it entitles you to a bigger pedestal on the fan front.

Now since this entire page of posts fails to mention Carrick Felix even once, can we assume that we are over his failure to show up at Duke?

It is amusing to see that a discussion about academic and athletic priorities at Duke has devolved to one about who has the standing to voice an opinion on the topic. Hunh? Uh, should we have several classes of membership on DBR, with different levels of privilege: Duke fan, Duke fan who went to Duke, Duke fan who graduated from Duke, etc.?

sagegrouse

[RelativeWays]

Now hold on, this is basketball we're talking about. You may have a diploma from Duke, but it doesn't mean you get to tell us how much interest we can have and come across like you know what is best for Duke. Duke knows what is best for Duke. I just don't want you to think that just because you have a piece of paper that says you graduated from Duke, it entitles you to a bigger pedestal on the fan front.

Well technically it does. All Blue Devil athletic teams represent the University, the student body and the alumni first and foremost, this is not in question. I've always maintained that students/ alumni, anyone directly associated with the university should have a special bond with the athletic teams of said school, if they do not, then something is wrong. That does not mean that Duke and its teams do not value general fan support from non alumni, every college and university would love to have the appeal that Duke basketball does. David Cutcliffe cannot fill WW to capacity on undergrads, grads and area alumni alone, he needs area fan support. K has appealed for area fan support especially in Durham, where he feels the Duke brand is undervalued (in NC, it is undervalued). General fan support helps to generate interest, revenue and relevance in the sports they compete and it promotes the university. Duke students/alumni and general fans have important roles to play in the success of Duke's athletic teams, neither should be undervalued.

That being said, Duke's standing as an academic institution is far more important than the performance or prestige of the teams. I'm not a Duke alumni myself, but I don't think this point is really debatable. I'm not sure how Carrick Felix truly jeopardizes that reputation the way FormerDukeAthlete/SouthFloridaDevil/ILoveStanford/TrevorWorthingtonIII (call him Tripp) insists.

[allenmurray]

Nevertheless, when it comes to opinions regarding university priorities, a fan who is not an alumnus doesn't have the same vested interest.


And does spending 4 or so years at a University and getting a piece of paper at a University REALLY vest you anymore than say, Oscar the Janitor?


In my opinion, and I venture to say the opinions of employers of Duke graduates, yes.

So 77Devil, you are saying that your four years here makes you more invested in the program than folks who have worked for the university and lived in this community since before you were born? Folks who literally save lives at the hospital, or who fight fires, or teach classes, or make the place safe, or research diseases, or prepare meals and clean up after folks who are so entitled that they think they are the "real" fans because they spent four years here. Wow. I guess you are a greater fan than even Coach K (who didn't earn a Duke degree after all).

[77devil]

So 77Devil, you are saying that your four years here makes you more invested in the program than folks who have worked for the university and lived in this community since before you were born? Folks who literally save lives at the hospital, or who fight fires, or teach classes, or make the place safe, or research diseases, or prepare meals and clean up after folks who are so entitled that they think they are the "real" fans because they spent four years here. Wow. I guess you are a greater fan than even Coach K (who didn't earn a Duke degree after all).

Well that is just a bit of a hyperbolic exaggeration. No, what I wrote was in response to another poster who expressed that lesser academic standards for recruits and basketball results were more important to him/her than Duke's academic reputation. I still maintain that such a position from a non alum(Duke employee or not), who has no vested interest in the reputation of a Duke diploma, is superfluous in this context. My comments had nothing to do with defining who is a real fan nor would I ever be so presumptuous to try.

Let's move on or keep mischaracterizing what I wrote if you prefer.

[allenmurray]

Well that is just a bit of a hyperbolic exaggeration. No, what I wrote was in response to another poster who expressed that lesser academic standards for recruits and basketball results were more important to him/her than Duke's academic reputation. I still maintain that such a position from a non alum (Duke employee or not), who has no vested interest in the reputation of a Duke diploma, is superfluous in this context. My comments had nothing to do with defining who is a real fan nor would I ever be so presumptuous to try.

Let's move on or keep mischaracterizing what I wrote if you prefer.

In context that makes a bit more sense. But there are many non-alums who have an incredible stake in the value of a Duke diploma and the reputation of the university. Many incredibly distinguished faculty at Duke (the overwhelming majority of whom are not alumni) are just as invested in the academic reputation of this university as are the alumni - perhaps even more so. In fact the very reputation of the university is dependent on their work. So they have just as much of a stake n the university's reputation, from an emotional, financial, and career perspective, as you do (and a greater role in keeping it that way).

[Memphis Devil]

In context that makes a bit more sense. But there are many non-alums who have an incredible stake in the value of a Duke diploma and the reputation of the university. Many incredibly distinguished faculty at Duke (the overwhelming majority of whom are not alumni) are just as invested in the academic reputation of this university as are the alumni - perhaps even more so. In fact the very reputation of the university is dependent on their work. So they have just as much of a stake n the university's reputation, from an emotional, financial, and career perspective, as you do (and a greater role in keeping it that way).

You seem to be ignoring what 77Devil is saying: a non alum (Duke employee or not), who has no vested interest in the reputation of a Duke diploma. Obviously, the distinguished faculty at Duke has a vested interest in the academic reputation of the university. Therefore, their vote would count unlike someone like myself who did not attend Duke but is a huge fan of the basketball program first and the academic reputation second.

[JBDuke]

It appears that we are done discussing Felix and the fact that he won't be coming to Duke this fall, as we've devolved into a discussion over who has a vested interest in Duke's academic rep.

Time to CLOSE this thread.