Boozer

[moonpie23]

boozer OWNING the nuggets...

22-20

[BattierD12]

boozer OWNING the nuggets...

22-20

*boozer OWNED the nuggets...

22.5/13.3/3.2
pts/rbs/asts for the series

WOW

When Jason Williams was hosting Sportnation, one question asked by an audience member was who did he think was the best Dukie in the NBA. He said Carlos Boozer, and he referenced a point in college when Boozer was shafted from something (maybe an all-ACC team?). He said that Boozer came up to him afterwards and told him he would become the greatest player to ever come from Duke to show them they made a mistake. Shafted from those honors, a 34th (?) pick in the NBA. Wow, this guy has some drive.

[theAlaskanBear]

*boozer OWNED the nuggets...

22.5/13.3/3.2
pts/rbs/asts for the series

WOW

When Jason Williams was hosting Sportnation, one question asked by an audience member was who did he think was the best Dukie in the NBA. He said Carlos Boozer, and he referenced a point in college when Boozer was shafted from something (maybe an all-ACC team?). He said that Boozer came up to him afterwards and told him he would become the greatest player to ever come from Duke to show them they made a mistake. Shafted from those honors, a 34th (?) pick in the NBA. Wow, this guy has some drive.

Boozer, when healthy, has a great case for best power forward in the NBA. He is a beast, great shooting %, 20ppg, 10+ rbs, and he passes the ball.

[AZLA]

I always felt Boozer was vastly underrated in college. And maybe a little under utilized by Duke even. I also didn't believe the Cleveland front office one bit when they hung him out to dry saying he agreed in principal to a modest contract (by NBA standards) via a "verbal" agreement over the weekend. Seriously? They were basically holding his previously contract over his head in order to get him at a below-market price for an extension. Saying, "look how nice we are to give you this chance to earn big bucks." They couldn't possibly look good paying him his previous contract salary and expect him to be a backup star to Lebron. I even thought it was amusing that his agent quit to "save face." What a joke. Boozer knew his value and long-term potential as a NBA star in his own right and he had a growing family. So he did what was in his best interest and what was good business (for him and Utah). I doubt Boozer was dubious or cunning enough to talk a GM and his own agent into canceling his previous contract without signing a new contract. If Boozer was, I'd like him to by my lawyer! And I think those other guys need to watch Jerry Maguire for a few tips on the "my word is as strong as oak" handshake. Glad to see Boozer doing well, and earning what he deserves.

[kingboozer]

I was dissapointed that his number 4 wasn't retired, although that J.J. kid ended up working out alright;). I would definately take him over any other big guy in a fantasy draft, can't wait for him to get a long deserved ring.

[davekay1971]

Huh, what? I thought Dukies never made it in the NBA. Huh, wierd...

[JasonEvans]

And yet the strange thing is that Carlos gets no love from Utah fans. He is seen as a "me-first" player who is not loyal to the franchise. He will be a free agent this summer and even though many think he and DWilliams could be the next Stockton and Malone, I doubt he stays in Utah.

I think Carlos has been the victim of some unfortunate PR and unfair contract situations. Cleveland tried to get him on the cheap and he escaped but was seen as taking advantage of them. Last summer he looked around and Utah felt he did not want to stay. The bottom line is he simply does not have a great rep among fans or owners.

But, his production is fantastic and he is a winner. It will be interesting to see who pays big money to get him.

--Jason "there is a lot of cap space around, but there are a LOT of stud free agents" Evans

[Duvall]

And yet the strange thing is that Carlos gets no love from Utah fans. He is seen as a "me-first" player who is not loyal to the franchise. He will be a free agent this summer and even though many think he and DWilliams could be the next Stockton and Malone, I doubt he stays in Utah.

I think Carlos has been the victim of some unfortunate PR and unfair contract situations. Cleveland tried to get him on the cheap and he escaped but was seen as taking advantage of them. Last summer he looked around and Utah felt he did not want to stay. The bottom line is he simply does not have a great rep among fans or owners.


Fans are so dumb. Of course Boozer is going to be looking for the best deal. That's why they call it professional basketball and not charity basketball.

[camion]

Many college players believe their press clippings and don't realize at first that it's a whole other world in the pros. One of the things that Carlos has done from the outset of his NBA career is to continually work hard to expand and improve his game. He apparently didn't need the attitude adjustment period that some require.

[moonpie23]

could see him going to miami with wade.......and if they opened up the bank, wade, boozer and the king..



wow

[theAlaskanBear]

And yet the strange thing is that Carlos gets no love from Utah fans. He is seen as a "me-first" player who is not loyal to the franchise. He will be a free agent this summer and even though many think he and DWilliams could be the next Stockton and Malone, I doubt he stays in Utah.

I think Carlos has been the victim of some unfortunate PR and unfair contract situations. Cleveland tried to get him on the cheap and he escaped but was seen as taking advantage of them. Last summer he looked around and Utah felt he did not want to stay. The bottom line is he simply does not have a great rep among fans or owners.

But, his production is fantastic and he is a winner. It will be interesting to see who pays big money to get him.

--Jason "there is a lot of cap space around, but there are a LOT of stud free agents" Evans

When the season started, I would have said Boozer is gone, but from what I've heard is that Utah would like to lock him up. And a lot of the anger in Utah revolved around Boozers injuries. When he signed that huge deal with Utah, the first two years he only played 51 and then 33 games. Understandably the fans thought BUST. Then a great two years and another big injury.

You have to ask, who can Utah get to place him? As many great free agents there are, most are not power forwards. Chris Bosh (more of a centers game) and Amare Stoudamire are the only ones who could be as good as Boozer. Amare has had injury issues himself, and has never been as good a rebounder as Boozer. Jermaine Oneal is a shell of his former self.

Memo Okur is also a free agent, so thats 9 million right there. I think (especially with the Jazz winning without him in the playoffs) that the Jazz let Memo walk and start looking for a bigtime scorer to complete a core of Boozer, Millsap, and Williams. The guard market will be flooded, so its not unconceivable for them to pick up someone like a Joe Johnson or Rip Hamilton like player. The Jazz have the #9 pick from the knicks in the draft, so whatever they CANT do in free agency, they can do with the draft.

Anyhow, GOOOO JAZZ!

[theAlaskanBear]

could see him going to miami with wade.......and if they opened up the bank, wade, boozer and the king..



wow

Wade is gone from Miami. He has a terrible team around him.

[Indoor66]

Wade is gone from Miami. He has a terrible team around him.

Don't bet on Wade being gone. Miami is going to surround him with a better team. He will still remain the franchise in Miami.

[davekay1971]

Would LOVE to see Charlotte pick him up for an inside presence. With Henderson and Boozer there, I'd actually give a crap about the Bobcats. As it is, of course, the Bobcats have basically been run as a UNC old-timers team to attract the pastel-blue addicted Charlotte fans. With Jordan as an owner, doubt any Blue Devils will get a fair shake with the Bobcats.

So maybe instead of hoping the Bobcats pick up Boozer, I should hope they let Gerald out of jail.

[theAlaskanBear]

Don't bet on Wade being gone. Miami is going to surround him with a better team. He will still remain the franchise in Miami.

Thats the hope. I didn't realize the heat have so much cap space, but 35-38 million is a lot, but you have to resign D Wade with that money. You are right they could afford another Max player, BUT, they have sooo many roster spots open they have to fill, they might be better off signing two or three 2nd tier free agents.

If LeBron stays in Cleveland, it becomes unlikely Wade stays in Miami, because the teams that cleared room for him will want to go after Wade with a vengeance so as to not come up empty-handed.

Heres an example: The Nets. The Nets are going to look to sign a big name, to make a splash with their new owner, plus they are going to want to bring a very good team to Brooklyn when they move. The nets have a waaaay better supporting cast than the Heat, you might be like BS, but Lopez and Harris are a LEGIT center/PG combo, and the Nets could afford a 2nd tier ($10 million) dollar player on top. PLUS they have a chance to win the John Wall in the draft.

And lets not forget that the CHICAGO BULLS will have enough space to sign a max contract like Wade!

[Gthoma2a]

It was the US team (his first time trying for the men's if I am not mistaken). Boozer was upset and told Jay that. He is the best player we have produced in the NBA. People think he is forever tainted because of the reputed problems with the Cavs where he supposedly lied. He is one of the best in the NBA though, regardless of people attacking his ethics.

[kingboozer]

Would LOVE to see Charlotte pick him up for an inside presence. With Henderson and Boozer there, I'd actually give a crap about the Bobcats. As it is, of course, the Bobcats have basically been run as a UNC old-timers team to attract the pastel-blue addicted Charlotte fans. With Jordan as an owner, doubt any Blue Devils will get a fair shake with the Bobcats.

So maybe instead of hoping the Bobcats pick up Boozer, I should hope they let Gerald out of jail.

I'm gonna go with let Gerald free. The Charlotte Tar Heels mean nothing to me, the only reason they drafted Henderson was to show that they weren't partial to just Tar Heels in the draft.

[theAlaskanBear]

I'm gonna go with let Gerald free. The Charlotte Tar Heels mean nothing to me, the only reason they drafted Henderson was to show that they weren't partial to just Tar Heels in the draft.

Lol, that would make a great T-shirt to wear to a bobcats game: "SET GERALD FREE!"

[kingboozer]

Lol, that would make a great T-shirt to wear to a bobcats game: "SET GERALD FREE!"

The Bobcats might as well change their team colors to tarhole blue and white! Now what we need is to get Gerald and Booz on the same roster..

[Indoor66]

Thats the hope. I didn't realize the heat have so much cap space, but 35-38 million is a lot, but you have to resign D Wade with that money. You are right they could afford another Max player, BUT, they have sooo many roster spots open they have to fill, they might be better off signing two or three 2nd tier free agents.

If LeBron stays in Cleveland, it becomes unlikely Wade stays in Miami, because the teams that cleared room for him will want to go after Wade with a vengeance so as to not come up empty-handed.

Heres an example: The Nets. The Nets are going to look to sign a big name, to make a splash with their new owner, plus they are going to want to bring a very good team to Brooklyn when they move. The nets have a waaaay better supporting cast than the Heat, you might be like BS, but Lopez and Harris are a LEGIT center/PG combo, and the Nets could afford a 2nd tier ($10 million) dollar player on top. PLUS they have a chance to win the John Wall in the draft.

And lets not forget that the CHICAGO BULLS will have enough space to sign a max contract like Wade!

Miami can pay Wade a max contract that exceeds any other team by a total of $29,000,000! Micky Arizon, the owner, will pay that to keep Wade and Wade loves Miami. I doubt he leaves.

[phaedrus]

Miami can pay Wade a max contract that exceeds any other team by a total of $29,000,000! Micky Arizon, the owner, will pay that to keep Wade and Wade loves Miami. I doubt he leaves.

Wade should stay in Miami, and if Lebron doesn't win a title this year, don't be too surprised to see him there too.

[SMO]

Huh, what? I thought Dukies never made it in the NBA. Huh, wierd...

No, Duke just can't develop big men that make it in the NBA. :D

[ScreechTDX1847]

Wade should stay in Miami, and if Lebron doesn't win a title this year, don't be too surprised to see him there too.

Nope. Lebron isn't going anywhere either but Cleveland may try to make a move for Bosh after this season as well (sans O'Neal). That could be a pretty scary team.

[theAlaskanBear]

Nope. Lebron isn't going anywhere either but Cleveland may try to make a move for Bosh after this season as well (sans O'Neal). That could be a pretty scary team.

The SCARY thing, is that it doesnt really matter (within certain limits) who is around LeBron. I can't wait to see him tonight against the Celtics.

Against the Bulls, 32-9-8 with over two blocks a game. 56% shooting, 54% from the 3-pt line.

James is about to enter his prime as a player, I'm talking more about the mental side of his game. My only wish for James moving forward is that he is able to play the game under a better coach and in a better system. Mike Brown is a great defensive coach, but his offensive capacity is really not up to par.

[COYS]

My only wish for James moving forward is that he is able to play the game under a better coach and in a better system. Mike Brown is a great defensive coach, but his offensive capacity is really not up to par.

This is why the curious basketball fan in me wants to see him playing in New York with D'Antoni. Can you imagine the stats he could put up in a fast-paced offense? I could see him averaging a triple double.

[Welcome2DaSlopes]

This is why the curious basketball fan in me wants to see him playing in New York with D'Antoni. Can you imagine the stats he could put up in a fast-paced offense? I could see him averaging a triple double.

As a Knicks fan, I would love to see the same thing. :)

[BattierD12]

Nope. Lebron isn't going anywhere either but Cleveland may try to make a move for Bosh after this season as well (sans O'Neal). That could be a pretty scary team.

My take on LeBron's future:

If the Cavs win the championship this year, he's staying. The organization finally allowed you to realize your dream, you've saved the city of Cleveland from their Cold War depression, and you can start building up your championship resume.

If the Cavs make it to the Finals but lose, it's a toss-up, favoring staying in Cleveland.

If the Cavs do not make it past the eastern conference semifinals or finals, he's out. He's entering his eighth year, the team has not fulfilled his wishes in the postseason, and the rest of his team is aging (Shaq, Jamison, big Z) with large contracts, so it might be a bumpy path back (a year or two maximum) to the top with the hot new young teams of the league in the Thunder and the Magic slowly growing. I think in this case, he would want to go a larger, more exciting market in New York where he would still have a bumpy path, but with the chance to start anew with a younger, talented squad and the rich legacy of NYC.

In order to keep this related to Boozer, imagine if the Cavs had given him a respectable offer back in 04. Talk about a dynasty that could have been.

[theAlaskanBear]

My take on LeBron's future:

If the Cavs win the championship this year, he's staying. The organization finally allowed you to realize your dream, you've saved the city of Cleveland from their Cold War depression, and you can start building up your championship resume.

If the Cavs make it to the Finals but lose, it's a toss-up, favoring staying in Cleveland.

If the Cavs do not make it past the eastern conference semifinals or finals, he's out. He's entering his eighth year, the team has not fulfilled his wishes in the postseason, and the rest of his team is aging (Shaq, Jamison, big Z) with large contracts, so it might be a bumpy path back (a year or two maximum) to the top with the hot new young teams of the league in the Thunder and the Magic slowly growing. I think in this case, he would want to go a larger, more exciting market in New York where he would still have a bumpy path, but with the chance to start anew with a younger, talented squad and the rich legacy of NYC.

In order to keep this related to Boozer, imagine if the Cavs had given him a respectable offer back in 04. Talk about a dynasty that could have been.

Having a scoring forward along side of Boozer would have been great for James, but lets remember part of the problem was that Silas (the Cavs coach at the time) treated Boozer like Varejao or Jamison: The didnt run offense for him, they expected him to clean up the boards and score off of putbacks. Jerry Sloans offense in Utah makes the PF the essential position right after the PG. So Sloan has been very important to Boozer's growth as a player.

[COYS]

Having a scoring forward along side of Boozer would have been great for James, but lets remember part of the problem was that Silas (the Cavs coach at the time) treated Boozer like Varejao or Jamison: The didnt run offense for him, they expected him to clean up the boards and score off of putbacks. Jerry Sloans offense in Utah makes the PF the essential position right after the PG. So Sloan has been very important to Boozer's growth as a player.

This is true. His numbers might not be quite as gawdy and Boozer would probably have to play better defense, as well. That being said, it's not like his numbers in Cleveland were anything to sneeze at, especially as a young player. He averaged 15.5 and 11.5 as a second year player and posted PER's of 16+ and 20+ in his first two seasons, respectively . . . by his second season he was already in the top 10 of all PF in the league and certainly one of the top young PF's in the game . . . and this is coming from a second round draft pick. The whole dump on Boozer charade paraded about by the Cavs front office was a joke. The guy was clearly on a path to become an All-Star or at least be very close to an All-Star. His production during his second year is something that the Cavs haven't even come close to matching from the power forward position ever since and, as I'm sure they are fully aware, was certainly worth a larger contract . . . ESPECIALLY for a player that was signed on the cheap as a second round pick. Maybe he would never have averaged in the 20's simply because James would (and should) have taken the ball out of his hands more, but Boozer would have been a very productive side-kick for James.

[toooskies]

As both a native Clevelander and Duke '04 alum, I paid attention closer than most to the Boozer situation. You can't say that Cleveland would've released him if they didn't think he was going to re-sign for the Cavs. The Cavs simply didn't realize that Carlos would go-- in other words, the Cavs were either stupid for not knowing other teams could offer more monoey, or stupid for believing Carlos' loyalty to the team outweighed his personal interests. But that doesn't change the fact that Carlos didn't appreciate the fact the Cavs did him a huge favor by releasing him. That's the basis for the "joke" of Cleveland releasing him: the Cavs could've paid him a less-than-a-million-a-year contract for another year and then approached things fairly afterwards, but they released him so they could pay him more.

It's unclear how the negotiations played out-- if he had a handshake deal that he got out of, it would've been against NBA rules anyway-- but whether Carlos duped Cleveland or not is only known by a few people who know better than to talk about it.

Carlos hasn't built a fan base in Utah for acting much like he did towards Cleveland-- actively seeking his own self-interest rather than being part of a team. When asked mid-season about whether he'll test free agency when he had an option year, he pretty much said "absolutely"; then changed his mind because the economy was looking down. Telling your fans that you don't have any loyalty to the team is a sure-fire way to kill off any loyalty they had towards you. His injuries have meant that he's been a "bust" overall, and even with his great statistical output, the team hasn't faltered when he has been out.

In other words, while Carlos is a talent, on the professional level he hasn't taken an interest in putting down roots or doing anything other than claiming rewards for his talent. Otherwise, he'd have re-signed with Cleveland to win championships (they'd have had a great chance in 2007 with Boozer), or try to build some loyalty from Utah.

So to me, I regard him as a typical NBA player. No real sense of loyalty to team or fans, only himself. I hope for and expect a little more out of a Duke player than loyalty to money, but I can't say I'd make a different decision.

[Poincaré]

Just one thing. Thank god Boozer left Cleveland. Paul Silas called him a see-you-next-Tuesday to the press. Seriously, that alone is a good reason to run and never come back. They never considered him to be more than a role player. That's why they let him become a free agent. They didn't think another team would offer Boozer a lot more money. After how their organization kept on dumping on Boozer behind the scenes, they surely could not have expected significant loyalty. Plus Utah recruited him with the message that they wanted him to be the next Karl Malone. Boozer has stated that this was a big part of why he chose Utah. The Jazz viewed him as the potential successor to the greatest power forward ever, while his coach in Cleveland viewed him as a see-you-next-Tuesday. That was not a difficult choice to make in my mind, even without money figuring into the equation.

[hedevil]

I was happy to see Boozer get out of Cleveland. It was too hard to root FOR him and AGAINST Lebron at the same time.:)

I think being in James' shadow held Boozer back. In Utah he has proven to be a beast.

[AZLA]

Maybe if Boozer stayed at Duke another year and not opted to jump after his junior year, he would have been a first round draft pick. Then the Cleveland fiasco would be moot.

Legal question: Is it not possible to set up a contingency contract, whereby an organization can cancel a contract ONLY if an enhanced contract is signed before hand? Or does that go against the rules? If that were the case, what business in its right mind would release a great player on the open market on an alleged handshake? C'mon, those guys are much smarter than that.

My theory is that Cleveland The Organization LIKED Boozer enough, but he was quite dispensable to them and with Lebron's salary (including Lebron's looming contract renewal), they never intended to pay Boozer what the open market would bear. Plus, they would look like misers if they held him to another year at $695k.

Problem was, Cleveland fans LOVED Boozer and his NBA underdog story, and the organization realized they needed a clever way to save face and their bottom line simultaneously. And not just with the fans, but with "The King" of Cleveland too.

So, they offered Boozer a decent contract, not spectacular, and stood firm on it: $39 mil over 6. And please don't think for a second they made this offer without clearly researching with inside sources at other organizations on what Boozer was actually worth.

Then they went to Boozer and his agent Pelinka and said, hey, we will pay you this and stood firm. And because we're so nice, we will cancel the old contract with the gentleman's expectation you will sign it on Monday (wink, wink).

This put the decision solely and decisively in Boozer's hands and gave the Cavs a win-win scenario of either two outcomes:

Win 1. Boozer accepts the "generous" offer and the Cavs get a star player for mid-range salary.

Win 2. Boozer rejects the offer for more money and gets painted as selfish. The Cavs get to tell their fans, hey, it wasn't us the big corporation. Boozer was just someone who wasn't who we all thought he was. Heck, he even shook our hands and made us a pinky promise! We outed him and stereotyped him in category of "greedy professional athlete." You're welcome, Cavs fans!

But just to cement Boozer's newly defined negative image, the Cavs then strong-armed Pelinka by promising they would never work with him again and they would do everything in their power to influence colleagues at other organizations to follow suit. Pelinka had to cut ties with Boozer.

So, Boozer earned what he was really worth -- a whopping $70 mil over six instead. Better for him to the tune of 31 million more (with opportunity to make more based on his performance as a legitimate NBA star in SLC and not as a sidekick in Cleveland). What's wrong with that? However, the long term implications are even more profound. The net effect of Boozer staying in Cleveland could conceivably have cost him as much as 75 million or more over his overall career, depending on how his next contract shakes out.

Boozer made the right choice.

Heck, even Lebron harbored no ill will and wished Boozer well.

By the way, guess who came back to represent Boozer for his next contract negotiations?

Yep...

Pelinka.

[theAlaskanBear]

Jazz lost a nailbiter at LA. 99-105. Boozer had a good game, 18 and 12, but a tough one. In particular, I thought he got fouled going to the rim on the last couple of plays where the refs swallowed their whistles and let the Lakers off the hook.

[kinsman_bob]

I was reminded this afternoon about why I hate the NBA. It was clear at the end of the Jazz/Lakers game that the officials(and David Stern) were not going to let a small market team beat a big market team. The NBA playoffs are set up to be Lakers and Cavs. Stern will not let it be any other way.

When does the NCAA season start? I can't watch this 'rigged' basketball.

[cspan37421]

I heartily agree. Now, Stern will say, ah, but why has S.A. won 3 times in Duncan's tenure?

What I would say is this: I don't believe the outcomes are predetermined a la pro wrestling. It's not that bad. But is it sometimes 5 on 8? Sure seems like it.

[cspan37421]

Oh, and one more very telling thing. When the Donaghy situation broke, you may recall the NBA conducted an internal investigation (a.k.a., investigated itself). I recall Stern announcing ahead of time that Donaghy's case was an isolated incident. Right then, it seemed to me, the conclusion had already been decided upon, before the investigation took place. And that's all I have to say about that.

[ElSid]

Geography and market seem to play a part. The NBA also has preferred player. Remember when Dwayne Wade won? He got every single call. Every one. A commentator said, man, he's getting calls that Michael Jordan would have gotten. And the other guy said, are you kidding, Michael Jordan wouldn't have gotten that call.

The Jazz lack a compelling, uber-marketable star. It may sound like a wing nut conspiracy theory. Maybe now we sort of know what it's like not to be a Duke fan and to imagine that the whole tournament is rigged for Duke.

Late game scenarios they just don't call fouls much. The refs are extremely hesitant to be seen as unfairly affecting the outcome with action vs. inaction (see the Durant hack from earlier this season that was a no call).

[cspan37421]

NBA Entertainment, Inc. supplies sports television and Internet programming. The company manages the NBA's, WNBA's, and NBDL's television, film, Internet, publishing, photos, consumer products, marketing partnerships, media properties, and event relationships in the United States and internationally. It also produces various weekly television shows.

http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=5525113

[theAlaskanBear]

Geography and market seem to play a part. The NBA also has preferred player. Remember when Dwayne Wade won? He got every single call. Every one. A commentator said, man, he's getting calls that Michael Jordan would have gotten. And the other guy said, are you kidding, Michael Jordan wouldn't have gotten that call.

The Jazz lack a compelling, uber-marketable star. It may sound like a wing nut conspiracy theory. Maybe now we sort of know what it's like not to be a Duke fan and to imagine that the whole tournament is rigged for Duke.

Late game scenarios they just don't call fouls much. The refs are extremely hesitant to be seen as unfairly affecting the outcome with action vs. inaction (see the Durant hack from earlier this season that was a no call).

This last sentence is so completely true. I dont think its conspiracy as posters above said. Its not "Stern" or "The League" -- its just refs, of whom their perception is imperfect. Players who develop a reputation as aggressive slashing scorers who get fouled a lot will get a lot of 50/50 and a few miscalls go their way. A player like Boozer who has a reputation of being bothered by the length of the Lakers will not get the benefit of the doubt when he goes inside on Gasol Odom and Bynum.

Thats not a huge issue though, no different than in baseball where great pitchers get the benefit of the doubt. The problem is when the refs swallow their whistles because they dont want to be "noticed" at the end of the game.

[kinsman_bob]

I think that the reason San Antonio beats Dallas is because Stern 'hates' Mark Cuban. Stern would let his dog win to stick to Cuban. Cuban is a breath of fresh air in a league that is more about entertainment than about basketball Thank God, Stern doesn't run the NCAA or Butler would have lost in the second round and we would have been denied one of the great basketball games of our lives.

[moonpie23]

based on that, i'd have to say that it would have been Duke vz UK for the title...


now THAT's high drama...

[cspan37421]

Thank God, Stern doesn't run the NCAA or Butler would have lost in the second round and we would have been denied one of the great basketball games of our lives.

He wouldn't have to ... he'd just make each round a best of 7 and the underdog would almost never prevail. Definitely no '83 Wolfpack or '85 (?) Villanova. But also no Valpo, George Mason, Santa Clara, Murray State, Ohio U., Northern Iowa, etc.

And that's what makes it March Madness.

[jammsb]

This might just be the musings of a paranoid mind, but I've always felt that of all the wonderful players who have played at Duke over the years that Carlos had to be the least appreciated while he was here. IMO he never reached the star status that others of comparable or even lesser ability attained. To some degree, I think that this might have had something to do with his being chosen as late in the draft as he was. All or most of the hype was given to Jason Williams. I always had the feeling that he wasn't particulary happy while he was here and that he was anxious to pursue an NBA career as quickly as he could.

[doctorhook]

I think that the reason San Antonio beats Dallas is because Stern 'hates' Mark Cuban. Stern would let his dog win to stick to Cuban. Cuban is a breath of fresh air in a league that is more about entertainment than about basketball Thank God, Stern doesn't run the NCAA or Butler would have lost in the second round and we would have been denied one of the great basketball games of our lives.

There is no question that officials seem to favor certain players, but teams? As others have stated, I do not buy the conspiracy stuff. As for Cuban, a breath of fresh air? The air I would liken him to is not of the fresh variety, but rather of the hot air emanating from a bowel. He is the most egotistical owner who would rather see himself on tv than his players, not to mention his interjection of politics into the sports world.

[sagegrouse]

Maybe if Boozer stayed at Duke another year and not opted to jump after his junior year, he would have been a first round draft pick. Then the Cleveland fiasco would be moot.

....

My theory is that Cleveland The Organization LIKED Boozer enough, but he was quite dispensable to them and with Lebron's salary (including Lebron's looming contract renewal), they never intended to pay Boozer what the open market would bear. Plus, they would look like misers if they held him to another year at $695k.

Problem was, Cleveland fans LOVED Boozer and his NBA underdog story, and the organization realized they needed a clever way to save face and their bottom line simultaneously. And not just with the fans, but with "The King" of Cleveland too.

So, they offered Boozer a decent contract, not spectacular, and stood firm on it: $39 mil over 6. And please don't think for a second they made this offer without clearly researching with inside sources at other organizations on what Boozer was actually worth.



Here is the Wikipedia page, which seems to be factual:


"After the 2003–04 NBA season, the Cavaliers had the option of allowing him to become a restricted free agent, or keeping him under contract for one more year at a $695,000 salary. The Cavaliers claim to have reached an understanding with Boozer and his agent on a deal for approximately $39 million over 6 years, which he would sign if they let him out of his current deal.

"Cleveland then proceeded to release him from his contract making him a Restricted Free Agent. During this period, a few teams were also interested in signing Boozer, and Utah ended up offering a 6 year $70 million dollar contract that Cleveland chose not to match, since it would take them far over the salary cap.

"Carlos Boozer signed with the Utah Jazz on July 24th, 2004."

As a result of being a second round pick, Boozer was making chump change in the NBA -- $700K per year. Cleveland had the club option to enforce a contract for the third year, even though Boozer was obviously worth far, far more to the Cavs and other NBA teams. In 2004, for example, he had averaged 15.5 and 11.4 for the Cavs, starting 75 games. Moreover, a career-ending injury would have meant he had zip to show for his NBA career.

Carlos appeared to play the system for all it was worth. I have always credited his wife CeCe for the business maneuvering -- she was a Fuqua grad and was older than Carlos. A straightforward approach would have been for Carlos to simply refuse to play for the contracted salary. It was blatantly unfair and the product of a one-sided contract for entering players. (It should be evident that the Players' Association cares mostly about the veterans.)

Before it got to that stage the Cavs offered to release Carlos and resign him at a much higher salary. The only problem is that Carlos would be a restricted free agent during the interim -- so it can be winked at but not rigged. At the session with the Cavs management Carlos's agent Pelinka even went so far as to read a statement that Carlos had no obligations to sign with the Cavs. This was not sincere but was self-serving and protected the Cavs.

When Carlos was released, however, he entertained other offers, signing with the Jazz for far more than Cleveland was offering. Cavs management felt used; Pelinka resigned as his agent; and the Cleveland fans were furious.

What Carlos did was perfectly legal, if a bit disingenuous. In fact, a "secret handshake" with the Cavs was against the NBA rules. But Carlos was a highly regarded college player forced to sign a one-sided, multi-year contract if he were to play in the NBA. Moreover, as a practical matter, there was no way Carlos was going to play for the Cavs for $700K in 2005.

With Carlos the NBA seems to be primarily a business. It is, and therefore, his actions are fine with me.

sagegrouse

[DevilWearsPrada]

I love watching Carlos play. I don't particularly care for NBA basketball. But I love watching the Jazz and seeing Carlos.. Boozer Boozer Boozer !!!

[UrinalCake]

Maybe if Boozer stayed at Duke another year and not opted to jump after his junior year, he would have been a first round draft pick. Then the Cleveland fiasco would be moot.

Perhaps, but it's hard to argue that he made a mistake by going when he did. He might have sacrificed in salary the first two years, but his second contract started a year earlier which should more than make up for it. In fact, you could almost argue that had he been drafted LOWER, he could have wound up doing even better since he wouldn't have been bound by a rookie contract after his first year.


Legal question: Is it not possible to set up a contingency contract, whereby an organization can cancel a contract ONLY if an enhanced contract is signed before hand?

One analysis that I read basically stated that what Cleveland accused Boozer of doing - verbally agreeing to sign with the team if they nullified his existing contract - was in fact illegal, i.e. in violation of the NBA's Collective Bargaining Agreement. toooskies's comment seems to support this. It's somewhat unfortunate that Boozer has spent almost his entire career on the trading block. Signing with Utah was supposed to bring some stability, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

[sagegrouse]

... It's somewhat unfortunate that Boozer has spent almost his entire career on the trading block. Signing with Utah was supposed to bring some stability, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

OTOH he is just completing a six-year contract paying $11.5 million per year and will sign another one of equal or greater value for the next 5-6 years. He has made a couple of All-Star teams and been on two Olympic teams, winning one gold medal.

I am not sure he is feeling any angst about his current situation.

sagegrouse
'And BTW icons Grant and Elton generated some unhappiness in their last career changes'

[toooskies]

Moreover, as a practical matter, there was no way Carlos was going to play for the Cavs for $700K in 2005.

With Carlos the NBA seems to be primarily a business. It is, and therefore, his actions are fine with me.

sagegrouse

Well, as far as I knew, there was no threat from Carlos that he wouldn't play for his previous contract. And really, I've never heard of anyone in the NBA ever doing that. In addition, here's the pre-release link from ESPN on the story:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=1839369

The Cavs weren't "evil" for not offering a higher contract for Carlos.
"Boozer feels a loyalty to the Cavaliers, who drafted him in the second round (No. 35 overall) in the 2002 draft. They see him -- along with James -- as cornerstones of their future.

"I'm thankful for everything the Cavs have done for me," Boozer said. "A lot of teams didn't think I was worth it and let me slide into the second round. But they were the ones who gave me a chance and let me play as a rookie."

Everyone in Cleveland had every intention of believing Carlos was loyal to their team and fans. Two weeks later...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=1839369

Cleveland offered him a 1-year deal so they could escalate more in the next year. They simply couldn't re-sign him for more than they offered without cutting or trading someone else. And you simply can't make that happen overnight, as Cleveland was just emerging from the dark years where they lost 60 games a year and had a lot of untradeable contracts on the roster. Add Lebron's upcoming free agency, and you can understand how they couldn't make a move.

The only thing Cleveland might have done ethically wrong is under-value Carlos' theoretical long-term value. (In reality, his injuries over the years have left Utah thinking they overpaid.)

[moonpie23]

there's nothing unethical about trying to low-ball someone, and that's exactly what Paxon did. They underestimated Boozer's worth as perceived by other teams out there and it bit em in the butt...

they were playing the "hey we know how to play this game better than you do son" and Boozer and his agent played the "oh really?".....


the way it got churned in the press about him spurning cleveland was the sad part...


lebron WANTED boozer on his team.....imagine what that team would be like now....

[David]

An unfortunate story regarding Carlos' younger brother Charles:

"Iowa State Cyclones reserve guard Charles Boozer was arrested over the weekend after a woman told police he slapped and kicked her."

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5157777

[Big Pappa]

An unfortunate story regarding Carlos' younger brother Charles:

"Iowa State Cyclones reserve guard Charles Boozer was arrested over the weekend after a woman told police he slapped and kicked her."

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5157777

It looks like he is leaving the team according the AP:

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/36915439/ns/sports-college_basketball/

[gep]

With Carlos the NBA seems to be primarily a business. It is, and therefore, his actions are fine with me.

sagegrouse

While I agree that the NBA is a business... and therefore Carlos is perfectly justified in his business decisions... I'm sorry, but this is why the NBA has become less enjoyable for me. Give me back the days of the 80's and earlier, and the early 90's... when players played for teams and not for business (at least, that's what it appeared to me). I could watch the NBA year after year, and it was more like the NCAA, where you knew pretty much what the teams would look like year after year. Also, I don't recall much talk of trades, free-agencies (if they were even existing), etc. Ahhhh... those "happy days"...:rolleyes:

[theAlaskanBear]

As others have mentioned, when Cleveland tried to get Boozer to agree to a contract as a condition of releasing him, they violated NBA rules. Then Utah comes knocking with a $70 million dollar contract. After making 700k his first two years...well who the hell is going to turn that down? Cleveland was offering something like $5 mill a year, no? Utah came at him with a strong offer, AND offered him a chance to be the next Karl Malone. When healthy, he approaches those numbers.

I'm Boozer, I take that deal every time.

[Indoor66]

$5 million a year vs $11.6 million a year? Who was snookering whom?

[JasonEvans]

My take on 'Los and Cleveland has always been that Cleveland got Carlos for a ridiculous, absurd bargain for his first couple seasons. They then released him because they thought they could get him for antoher ridiculous bargain for the next several seasons (signing him to a $5 mil/season deal when he was clearly worth twice that much).

Some may argue that they did not have to set him free a year early, but if they had not done something to give him a big raise they would have earned a lot of bad credit with Carlos and would have lost him for sure the next season when he became an unrestricted free agent.

Carlos and his agent were very clear about what it meant when Cleveland set him free. What's more, I have always heard that Carlos came back to Cleveland after the Utah offer and told them what he had been offered. He wanted to renegotiate in the hope Cleveland could come closer to Utah's offer (they made it clear they could not match), but Cleveland's management was so angry that Carlos has pursued his options they told him to take the half-price deal they had originally offered or leave. He, of course, chose to leave.

Then, Cleveland mounted a massive anti-Carlos campaign in the media. I know some sportswriters who say they have never seen a team take such an active role in sculpting and promoting a negative story about a player.

--Jason "I think Carlos will get a not-quite-max deal from one of the Chris Bosh suitors who miss on Bosh" Evans

[greybeard]

While obviously driven by dollars, it is hard to believe that Boozer is not much better off playing for Utah than Cleveland. In my opinion, the two places I'd least like to play in the NBA, in order of worst to next worst--Miami and Cleveland. If I liked watching a star who occupied the ball, and took what they gave me, sure, either of those teams would have been great. Only, they call such people fans, not players.

Carlos is playing in an offensive system that, but for the fact that it is in Utah, which can take the wind out of the sails of just about anything, is one of the best in the league--it allows smart and talented players to grow and perform; in Cleveland Carlos and everyone else can only be a sideshow.

Good for Carlos on all levels, imo.

BTW, thanks for those, especially SG, who provided the skinny about how this thing unfolded. Very interesting. This joint, that is the board, is full of surprises, pleasant ones. Interesting read.

[muzikfrk75]

Boozer is currently chatting on espn.com:

http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/32847/jazz-f-carlos-boozer

[flyingdutchdevil]

NBA speculation is awesome. It's definitely one of the best parts about the college bball off season.

And considering that Carlos is the best Duke player in the NBA with an upcoming contract ahead of him, the off season is particularly interesting.

I personally see the Booz going to Miami or Chicago. No way he goes back to Utah, especially with the amount that Millsap is getting. The Clippers already have a future PF All-Star, the Nets are going after fish that are too big, the Knicks are doing the same, and Cleveland is putting all of its eggs in one basket. That really leaves Miami and Chicago. Miami is intriguing because Carlos has a house there and a Wade / Boozer pair up would be fantastic (now if only there was a PG they could draft). Chicago is also fascinating because Carlos would be the best player on a very, very good team next year (Rose, Deng, Noah, Boozer). He's the low post scorer that Chicago has been craving since Elton left.

I think it's a toss up for Carlos.

[COYS]

NBA speculation is awesome. It's definitely one of the best parts about the college bball off season.

And considering that Carlos is the best Duke player in the NBA with an upcoming contract ahead of him, the off season is particularly interesting.

I personally see the Booz going to Miami or Chicago. No way he goes back to Utah, especially with the amount that Millsap is getting. The Clippers already have a future PF All-Star, the Nets are going after fish that are too big, the Knicks are doing the same, and Cleveland is putting all of its eggs in one basket. That really leaves Miami and Chicago. Miami is intriguing because Carlos has a house there and a Wade / Boozer pair up would be fantastic (now if only there was a PG they could draft). Chicago is also fascinating because Carlos would be the best player on a very, very good team next year (Rose, Deng, Noah, Boozer). He's the low post scorer that Chicago has been craving since Elton left.

I think it's a toss up for Carlos.

I like the idea of him in Chicago, too, as I think the defensive minded forwards who are already there (Noah, in particular) will complement Boozer's offense and help make up for his so-so defense. I think Chicago will be going after the big fish first, though, as well, so the roster may change a bit before it's all said and done.

I would think that Boozer would be a great complement to any of the top tier free agents available this summer, except possibly Bosh. He's got enough range on his jumper that he can keep the lane open for Wade and Lebron. Plus, he provides a great 2nd option on offense and is a great rebounder. There are a lot of teams that have much to gain or lose this summer. I hope Boozer ends up on one of the teams that comes out on top.