If you’re a real American, root for the Blue Devils

[Duke Mom]

Nice Chronicle article:

http://dukechronicle.com/article/if-you-re-real-american-root-blue-devils

The writer says about himself, "I'm technically a med student, but I like to think of myself as a college basketball columnist for The Chronicle." (Twitter)

[slower]

Thanks so much for posting this. :D

[proelitedota]

There are Math Olympians and National Merit Scholars on this Duke team? :confused:

Hell, I am Asian, and I got into Duke without being either of those, and certainly not on a sports scholarship.

For those of you who don't know, Math Olympiad is the biggest and most prestigious of all international high-school contest in the United States. Here's the wiki blurb on the selection process for a Math Olympian.

"There are certain rewards for doing well on the AMC tests. For the AMC 8, a perfect score may earn a book prize or a plaque (as it did for the students who achieved perfect scores in 2002); a list of high scoring students is also available to colleges, institutions, and programs who want to attract students strong in mathematics. This may earn a high scorer an invitation to places like MathPath, a summer program for middle schoolers. The top-scoring student in each school is also awarded a special pin.
For the AMC 10 and AMC 12, a high score earns recognition (in particular, perfect scorers' names and pictures are published in a special awards book); as with the AMC 8, a list of high-scoring students is also available to colleges, institutions, etc. The top-scoring student in each school is awarded a special pin, or a bronze, silver, or gold medal, depending on how many times he or she was the top scorer. For more information on awards, visit Awards for the AMC.
In addition, high scorers on the AMC 10 and AMC 12 qualify to take the next round of competitions, the 3-hour long American Invitational Mathematics Examination (AIME), typically held in March or April. Any student who scores in the top 1% on the AMC 10, scores in the top 5% on the AMC 12, scores at least 100 points on the AMC 12, or scores at least 120 on the AMC 10 is invited to take the AIME. The answer to each of the 15 questions on the AIME is an integer between 0 and 999 inclusive, so while it is technically a multiple-choice test, it is not one in practice.
The combined scores of the AMC and the AIME are used to determine those that will be invited back to take a 9-hour, 2-day, 6-problem session of proofs known as the United States of America Mathematical Olympiad (USAMO). Approximately thirty students are selected based on their USAMO performance to be trained at the Mathematical Olympiad Summer Program, or MOSP (better known as MOP to its participants). In addition, in 2004, twenty-five 9th grade students were selected to participate in MOSP.
During this summer camp, a series of exams are given to finally pick the 6 member US Mathematics Team. The current head coach of the US Math Team is Zuming Feng from Phillips Exeter Academy.
Major universities such as MIT are beginning to ask applying students for their AMC scores. Since the AMC tests a deeper level of math than the SAT, this can help identify students who are ready for a rigorous undergraduate curriculum. Many top students appreciate the elevated difficulty and attention given to AMC exams and take preparation courses with Art of Problem Solving, EPGY, and other specialized instructional institutions. Students even write their own mock AMC exams to challenge each other, and post them on the Art of Problem Solving website, where the mock exams get organized into the AoPSWiki."

Here's the blurb on National Merit Scholarship, another award notoriously hard to get.

"PSAT/NMSQT
The NMSC uses the PSAT/NMSQT as the initial screen of over 1.5 million program entrants. In the spring of the junior year, NMSC determines a national Selection Index qualifying score (critical reading + math + writing skills scores) for "Commended" recognition, which is calculated each year to yield students at about the 96th percentile[citation needed] (top 50,000 highest scorers). Scores in the 200's and above (out of 240) often qualify for recognition, but qualifying levels change annually depending on how the top approximately 50,000 high scorers fared. Notification is mailed to school principals in April regarding students who scored at or above this level. The principals then notify their students of their status. These students are given the opportunity to identify two colleges or universities to which they would like NMSC to send their scores.
[edit]Semifinalist
Early the next September (beginning of the senior year, almost a year after the PSAT/NMSQT was taken), NMSC determines Selection Index qualifying scores for further recognition by state (including three other areas: DC, US Territories and Commonwealths, and students enrolled in schools outside the US) and US boarding schools (by geographic region). About 16,000 of the 50,000 are recognized as National Merit Semifinalists in this process. The Selection Index qualifying scores for Semifinalist standing vary from state to state and from year to year. Each state is allocated a percentage of Semifinalists based on the percentage of that state's graduating seniors out of the nation's total. The National Merit Scholarship Corporation does not release to the public the minimum qualifying score required per state. In August after the PSAT was taken, high school principals are mailed notification about their Semifinalists. Principals communicate these results to their students, though some misread the NMSC materials and do not release them until the NMSC press release, which comes in mid-September. Those not making Semifinalist are "Commended", and receive a Letter of Commendation; they do not continue in the competition for Merit Scholarship awards.
[edit]Finalist
Semifinalists must fulfill additional requirements and advance to the Finalist level of the competition to be considered for a scholarship. Approximately 15,000 of the 16,000 Semifinalists advance to Finalist standing by submitting SAT scores that confirm the earlier PSAT/NMSQT performance, having an outstanding academic record, and being endorsed and recommended by a high school official. They must also submit an application that includes high school courses and grades, extracurricular and volunteer activities, and a self-descriptive essay. The information that is collected about each Semifinalist is used later in the process to choose scholarship winners. All Finalists receive a Certificate of Merit in recognition of their outstanding performance in the competition.
[edit]Scholarships
Of the 15,000 Finalists, about 8,200 receive Merit Scholarship awards. All Finalists are considered for one of the 2,500 National Merit $2,500 Scholarships, which are awarded on a state representational basis. NMSC's own funds support the majority of these awards but corporate sponsors help underwrite these awards with grants they provide to NMSC in lieu of paying administrative fees. About 1,100 Merit Scholarship awards are provided by corporate sponsors for Finalists who meet criteria specified by the sponsor. Most of these awards are for children of the sponsor's employees, for Finalists living in a particular geographic area, or for Finalists who have career plans the sponsor wishes to encourage. These two types of awards can be used at any regionally accredited college or university in the United States. There are also approximately 4,600 college-sponsored Merit Scholarship awards for Finalists who plan to attend a sponsor college. Finalists report to NMSC their first choice college (College-Sponsored Merit Awards). In addition, about 1,500 program participants who are below the Finalist level receive Special Scholarships provided by corporate sponsors.
Before receiving an award, a Finalist must (a) notify NMSC of plans to enroll in a college or university in the United States that holds accredited status with a regional accrediting commission on higher education, and (b) plan to enroll full time in an undergraduate course of study leading to a traditional baccalaureate degree. NMSC scholarship stipends are not payable for attendance at service academies, virtual universities, and certain institutions that are limited in their purposes or training. A number of National Merit Scholars do not receive a monetary award because their educational plans or other awards preclude receipt of a monetary scholarship; however, these students may be honored as Honorary Merit Scholars, a designation that acknowledges achievement without providing any financial assistance."

That means they could have gotten into Duke or any university IN THE WORLD easily without playing basketball. How come I've never heard this. This is a big deal. Smartest NCAA basketball team in history. I doubt even Cornell's players would compare academically if this was the case.

[YourLandlord]

That means they could have gotten into Duke or any university IN THE WORLD easily without playing basketball. How come I've never heard this. This is a big deal. Smartest NCAA basketball team in history. I doubt even Cornell's players would compare academically if this was the case.

Zoubek is pretty smart (didn't he get >1500 on SAT? The old SAT, out of 1600), so perhaps he was a National Merit Semifinalist. And maybe one of the backups (or him) competed in some type of math competition in high school.

Looks like the author didn't really use the proper terminology regarding these awards. His overall point stands, though, I would say.

[CDu]

That means they could have gotten into Duke or any university IN THE WORLD easily without playing basketball. How come I've never heard this. This is a big deal. Smartest NCAA basketball team in history. I doubt even Cornell's players would compare academically if this was the case.

My first inclination is that you haven't heard it before because it's probably inaccurate. I'm not saying that it is definitely false, but you'd think it would have been brought up if one of our big-name recruits was a Math Olympian or National Merit Scholar. I don't doubt that there's a class president, NHS member, and/or class salutorian in the 9-man rotation.

If one of those guys is indeed a Math Olympian or National Merit Scholar, than that's VERY impressive.

[CDu]

Zoubek is pretty smart (didn't he get >1500 on SAT? The old SAT, out of 1600), so perhaps he was a National Merit Semifinalist. And maybe one of the backups (or him) competed in some type of math competition in high school.

Looks like the author didn't really use the proper terminology regarding these awards. His overall point stands, though, I would say.

Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if the author was a bit loose with the terminology, and perhaps maybe even was loose with the "9-man rotation" as well.

But I agree that it's the overall point rather than the fine details that is important.

[ivydevil]

I think Andre is the math whiz, and Ryan is the National Merit Scholar. Don't quote me on it, but I'm pretty sure.

[CDu]

I think Andre is the math whiz, and Ryan is the National Merit Scholar. Don't quote me on it, but I'm pretty sure.

Technically Kelly is a National Merit Semifinalist, but according to GoDuke that's probably the guy to whom the author was referring. Still, that's very impressive. And Dawkins is indeed the Math Olympian (ACSI Math Olympics).

[proelitedota]

I think Andre is the math whiz, and Ryan is the National Merit Scholar. Don't quote me on it, but I'm pretty sure.

Any prospective Duke basketball recruit with 2100 or higher on the SATs is near a National Merit Scholar lock.

I doubt Andre was a math Olympian though, that would mean he was top 30 in the country in Math, and a potential member of the 6 man United States math team. In reality, I doubt any of our basketball players would be able to pass a 100 level or above math class. Those classes are no joke.

EDIT: Not to knock on Andre's achievements, but ACSI Math Olympics is not even close to the AIMEs. The author should have been more specific.

[Magnolia888]

The bios of Ryan Kelly and Casey Peters list them as semifinalists for the National Merit Scholarship Program. That isn't quite the same thing as a National Merit Scholar (which means a scholarship award under the program) but it's close and many people use the terms interchangeably.

ETA: Ah, I see I'm too late. But even though they aren't technically National Merit Scholars, it's an impressive achievement to be a semifinalist for the National Merit Scholarship. It doesn't mean a "guaranteed" admission even to Duke, though, because plenty of National Merit Scholars are denied admission.

[Duke Mom]

From the Duke Team Roster:

Andre Dawkins - Took honors and AP courses throughout high school
Honor roll member for all four years of high school
Enrolled in Johns Hopkins Center for Talented Youth
Passed Algebra 1 high school assessment as a seventh grader
Posted a first and fourth place finish in the ACSI Math Olympics

Steve Johnson - Three-year member of the student council and principal’s honor roll
An economics major

Ryan Kelly - Member of the National Honor Society and the honor roll
Semifinalist National Merit Scholar (high SAT)
National Latin exam magna cum laude (very impressive)

Casey Peters - Two-year member of the National Honor Society
National Honor Society president as a senior
National Merit Scholar semifinalist
Scored a perfect 800 on the math SAT
A double major in economics & environmental sciences and policy

Mason Plumlee - Wetmore Scholar and judiciary member of the Honor & Disciplinary Board at Christ School

Miles Plumlee- Member of the National Honor Society

Nolan Smith - Student government president:) in 2006-07
Member of the National Honor Society

Lance Smith - n honor roll student in high school

[CDu]

Any prospective Duke basketball recruit with 2100 or higher on the SATs is basically a National Merit Scholar lock.

I doubt Andre was a math Olympian though, that would mean he was top 30 in the country in Math, and a potential member of the 6 man United States math team. In reality, I doubt any of our basketball players would be able to pass a 100 level or above math class. Those classes are no joke.

I suspect there different types of Math Olympics. According to Dawkins's bio, he competed in the ACSI Math Olympics (and finished 1st and 4th). I'm guessing that's a different contest than what some others are describing as the math Olympics.

And as has been discussed, Kelly was a National Merit Semifinalist. That's still really impressive for a top-tier D-1 basketball recruit.

[CDu]

From the Duke Team Roster:

Andre Dawkins - Took honors and AP courses throughout high school
Honor roll member for all four years of high school
Enrolled in Johns Hopkins Center for Talented Youth
Passed Algebra 1 high school assessment as a seventh grader
Posted a first and fourth place finish in the ACSI Math Olympics

Steve Johnson - Three-year member of the student council and principal’s honor roll
An economics major

Ryan Kelly - Member of the National Honor Society and the honor roll
Semifinalist National Merit Scholar (high SAT)
National Latin exam magna cum laude (very impressive)

Casey Peters - Two-year member of the National Honor Society
National Honor Society president as a senior
National Merit Scholar semifinalist
Scored a perfect 800 on the math SAT
A double major in economics & environmental sciences and policy

Mason Plumlee - Wetmore Scholar and judiciary member of the Honor & Disciplinary Board at Christ School

Miles Plumlee- Member of the National Honor Society

Nolan Smith - Student government president:) in 2006-07
Member of the National Honor Society

Lance Smith - n honor roll student in high school

Technically, the doubt was warranted, as we don't actually have a National Merit Scholar on the team (one semifinalist in the 9-man rotation). And the Math Olympics guy, while technically true, is somewhat misleading in terms of what Math Olympics we're talking about.

So the author was in fact playing fast and loose with terminology, as suspected. Still, the author's overall point stands, and these kids are impressive academically.

[proelitedota]

I suspect there different types of Math Olympics. According to Dawkins's bio, he competed in the ACSI Math Olympics (and finished 1st and 4th). I'm guessing that's a different contest than what some others are describing as the math Olympics.

And as has been discussed, Kelly was a National Merit Semifinalist. That's still really impressive for a top-tier D-1 basketball recruit.

It is indeed. Our basketball team is notches above any other team academically in Div I, there is no doubt about that.

[phaedrus]

In reality, I doubt any of our basketball players would be able to pass a 100 level or above math class. Those classes are no joke.


This is baseless. Of course, anyone without the proper calculus background would have trouble with these classes, but suggesting that almost an entire department at Duke is beyond the intellectual capacity of the entire basketball team is utterly unfair.

On a lighter note, is anyone surprised about who the school president was?

[Jderf]

Lance Smith - n honor roll student in high school

Who is this new Lance Smith kid? Haven't seen him on the bench. :D

[slower]

On a lighter note, is anyone surprised about who the school president was?


ndotsmitty is THE MAN!

And it may be too early to say this, but I think Kyrie may be cut from the same cloth.

And gotta be impressed by Casey Peters going Affleck on the SAT math section. :)

[CDu]

And gotta be impressed by Casey Peters going Affleck on the SAT math section. :)

Wouldn't that be Damon?

[proelitedota]

This is baseless. Of course, anyone without the proper calculus background would have trouble with these classes, but suggesting that almost an entire department at Duke is beyond the intellectual capacity of the entire basketball team is utterly unfair.


***Speaking in the vein of it would be near impossible for them to play DVI I basketball and maintain performance in 100 + levels math classes. There is no doubt that some of the team members can if they were purely students.

[slower]

Wouldn't that be Damon?

I always heard it was Affleck who got 800 on the SAT Math.

From Yahoo:

Affleck was an admittedly unfocused student, though he was a voracious reader with nearly perfect SAT scores. Damon’s good grades, on the other hand, got him into Harvard,

[CDu]

I always heard it was Affleck who got 800 on the SAT Math.

In reality? Wow. I was just going with the "Good Will Hunting" reference.

[slower]

In reality? Wow. I was just going with the "Good Will Hunting" reference.


he WAS smart enough to marry Jennifer Garner! :D

That's better than perfect SAT scores in my book.

[Indoor66]

he WAS smart enough to marry Jennifer Garner! :D

Yeah, she of the Bucky Beaver teeth.

[DevilHorns]

***Speaking in the vein of it would be near impossible for them to play DVI I basketball and maintain performance in 100 + levels math classes. There is no doubt that some of the team members can if they were purely students.

Eh,

Nick Horvath was an English and Physics double major if I remember correctly.

Miles began at Duke in Pratt, not sure if he switched after 1 year or 1 semester, but Im guessing he took Math 104.

Im sure Dawkins, Kelly, or Peters could take Math 103 and do fine even with the time commitment for basketball given the listed description of their high school accomplishments.

[Duke Mom]

Who is this new Lance Smith kid? Haven't seen him on the bench. :D


Sorry, my error....the one, the only, the force to be reckoned with..."Lancelot" Thomas.

[CDu]

Eh,

Nick Horvath was an English and Physics double major if I remember correctly.

Miles began at Duke in Pratt, not sure if he switched after 1 year or 1 semester, but Im guessing he took Math 104.

Im sure Dawkins, Kelly, or Peters could take Math 103 and do fine even with the time commitment for basketball given the listed description of their high school accomplishments.

This is nitpicky, but if Plumlee switched after one year or one semester, it's very likely that he didn't take Math 104. Unless you have credit for Math 31, you would take Math 31 and 32 in your first year. If he switched out after his first semester, then I can almost guarantee that he didn't take Math 104 unless he really was a glutton for punishment.

[Duke Mom]

I really like the way Fanaroff ended the article,

"These Duke players are not mercenaries, not Duke students in name only. They are student-athletes, coached by a man who restored American basketball to its rightful place at the pinnacle of world hoops, who enjoy playing with one another and take pride in putting on their school’s jersey. If that’s what passes for a villain in college basketball today, then here’s one man’s hope that Duke is never loved."


The truth sounds pretty sweet.

Getting so psyched! Need a smiley face biting it's nails.

[DevilHorns]

This is nitpicky, but if Plumlee switched after one year or one semester, it's very likely that he didn't take Math 104. Unless you have credit for Math 31, you would take Math 31 and 32 in your first year. If he switched out after his first semester, then I can almost guarantee that he didn't take Math 104 unless he really was a glutton for punishment.

Almost all the Pratt kids I knew came into Duke with Calc I and Calc II credit, and thus started with a harder math. That was my impression at Duke, and frankly of all my friends, I can remember 1 who took Calc 32 as a freshman. Everyone else placed out.

[brevity]

he WAS smart enough to marry Jennifer Garner! :D

That's better than perfect SAT scores in my book.

You do know her college team affiliation (http://www.wqbe.com/programs/the-morning-show/jennifer-and-leo-make-mountaineer-fans-proud), right? Her CIA code name on Alias was "Mountaineer." She grew up in Charleston, WV.

[ambitiouspear]

Miles also was Class salutatorian. Lots of information on go duke.com

http://www.goduke.com/SportSelect.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=4200&SPID=1845&SPSID=22727

A very talented group of students AND athletes!

[slower]

You do know her college team affiliation (http://www.wqbe.com/programs/the-morning-show/jennifer-and-leo-make-mountaineer-fans-proud), right? Her CIA code name on Alias was "Mountaineer." She grew up in Charleston, WV.

I did not know that.

[hughgs]

Almost all the Pratt kids I knew came into Duke with Calc I and Calc II credit, and thus started with a harder math. That was my impression at Duke, and frankly of all my friends, I can remember 1 who took Calc 32 as a freshman. Everyone else placed out.

From my experience with Duke athletes and engineering it seems to be about 50/50 on taking MTH 103/32 in the second semester of their freshmen year. That implies that only about 50% of the engineering athletes placed out of Calc I. And, from my experience, very few athletes take 103 their first semester (which is the only way that I would know if they placed out of 31 and 32). I suspect those numbers are very different than the general engineering population.

[SeattleIrish]

The author also states "Smith" parks his car close to others so as to block the driver's-side door.

It's John who does that.

s.i.

[CDu]

Almost all the Pratt kids I knew came into Duke with Calc I and Calc II credit, and thus started with a harder math. That was my impression at Duke, and frankly of all my friends, I can remember 1 who took Calc 32 as a freshman. Everyone else placed out.

I was a Pratt kid that came in without credit for Calc I or II. I wasn't the norm, but they do exist. Note as well that while I wasn't the norm, D-1 athletes are also not the norm in Pratt either. Most of my Pratt colleagues took Math 32 in their first semester. I definitely wouldn't say that "most" came in with credit for Math 31 AND 32, though there were indeed several. The ones that did almost certainly had stronger resumes coming in than Miles did. That's not a knock on Miles, but rather a compliment to the strength of the average student in Pratt.

If Miles transferred out of Pratt after the first year, then there is a chance that he took Math 103, though I'd say it is small. If he transferred out after the first semester, I'd say it's VERY unlikely.

[Kewlswim]

It is indeed. Our basketball team is notches above any other team academically in Div I, there is no doubt about that.

Hi,

I love Duke more than any other team, but I imagine that Tommy's team at Harvard or maybe the kids at Cornell are at least equivalent to Duke academically. :D

GO DUKE!

[greybeard]

I really like the way Fanaroff ended the article,

"coached by a man who restored American basketball to its rightful place at the pinnacle of world hoops."




I'm as in the bag for K as anyone but this statement is nuts. Colangelo put together the team, the team played four summers together and barely squeeked out Olympic gold. K can hardly be credited with the team's success, which was far from the resounding victory that might have supported the notion that the US somehow had proved that it was "restored "at the pinnacle of world hoops."

Whatever the International game is, its similarity to the game that is worshipped in the States is remote at best. we have always been and remain without peer in the American game of basketball, which is to say the game of basketball.

It would be way cool if the US could change the dimension of a soccer field, change the rules dramatically, outplay the world at that game on such a field and then claim to be the best at soccer. It don't work that way in soccer and it shouldn't in basketball.

[Johnboy]

The author also states "Smith" parks his car close to others so as to block the driver's-side door.

It's John who does that.

s.i.

John?

[Kewlswim]

John?

Didn't John Smith play for the Devils in c. 1987 ? :p

GO DUKE!

[Duke Mom]

Went back to the original article in the student newspaper to see if there were any interesting "comments."

A Duke hater posted. Apparently this guy has his own "conservative" web site (a.k.a. has time on his hands to complain) and has decided that what he considers offensive Duke campus politics will force him to root for WV.

My first reaction was to write an opposing comment, but then thought, no, why give this guy any undeserved attention, after all, attention is what he really wants. So, I am remaining mute (except on here). Then I went to his web site to read what he wrote about Duke. My thinking is, he's entitled to his opinions, but surely if he delved into any of the WV campus politics he might discover objectionable issues there, too. But no, he won't do that because it's so much easier to hate on Duke, why make even the slightest attempt at even handedness? Not going to comment on his site either. My silence will speak for itself. Sorry to digress from the point of the thread...which is how impressive our guys are, academically and athletically. So proud!

Good luck today, fellas! There's a sea of blue behind you! Go Duke!