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Vasherized
03-16-2010, 04:45 PM
I'm from Big 12 country.

I've suffered watching Texas this year pretty much every day since late December save for one decent win on the road against an average Okie State squad. #1 to unranked in three short months. A steady decline without any answers. Perhaps we should relocate to the DC area? :)

After beating Baylor 24 times in a row for eight years, Texas lost three times to the Bears this year.

Why?

Because we found out that Texas isn't very good but we also found out this isn't your average Baylor team.

Acy and Udoh are plus athletes in the paint that really attack the glass on both ends, block shots, and manufacture buckets. Dunn and Carter are great shooters, they can take any guard off the dribble and always manage to keep the big guys involved. They're experienced, hit free throws, and enjoy the pressure. Drew has done a hell of a job taming what once was a frenetic, undisciplined team into one capable of making a deep tourney run.

So assuming Duke beats A&M or Siena to make it to the Elite 8 (both dangerous in their own right) and Baylor can get past Notre Dame and Nova why do 96% of you feel Duke is going to make it to the Final Four?

Is this really one of those special Duke teams? I'm impressed with what Coach K has done with the three-headed monster but can't get that Georgetown game out of my head.

Can Duke Get Through The Dirty South? (http://marchtomarch.fantake.com/2010/03/16/bracket-analysis-the-south-is-a-bear-of-a-bracket/)

dukelifer
03-16-2010, 04:59 PM
I'm from Big 12 country.

I've suffered watching Texas this year pretty much every day since late December save for one decent win on the road against an average Okie State squad. #1 to unranked in three short months. A steady decline without any answers. Perhaps we should relocate to the DC area? :)

After beating Baylor 24 times in a row for eight years, Texas lost three times to the Bears this year.

Why?

Because we found out that Texas isn't very good but we also found out this isn't your average Baylor team.

Acy and Udoh are plus athletes in the paint that really attack the glass on both ends, block shots, and manufacture buckets. Dunn and Carter are great shooters, they can take any guard off the dribble and always manage to keep the big guys involved. They're experienced, hit free throws, and enjoy the pressure. Drew has done a hell of a job taming what once was a frenetic, undisciplined team into one capable of making a deep tourney run.

So assuming Duke beats A&M or Siena to make it to the Elite 8 (both dangerous in their own right) and Baylor can get past Notre Dame and Nova why do 96% of you feel Duke is going to make it to the Final Four?

Is this really one of those special Duke teams? I'm impressed with what Coach K has done with the three-headed monster but can't get that Georgetown game out of my head.

Can Duke Get Through The Dirty South? (http://marchtomarch.fantake.com/2010/03/16/bracket-analysis-the-south-is-a-bear-of-a-bracket/)
Most here hope that Duke gets to the FF. Most any team can beat any team on a good night. If Baylor gets that far they will be on a roll- but this is a team that has never been there and done that- So you will just need to wait and see.

Vasherized
03-16-2010, 05:02 PM
Good point. Baylor hasn't made it past the first round since, oh, never?

It's hard to hold much stock in a team without any skins going against a HOF coach with a few rings.

But just looking at the matchups, if Baylor got that far the monkey is presumably off their back already.

InSpades
03-16-2010, 05:04 PM
So assuming Duke beats A&M or Siena to make it to the Elite 8 (both dangerous in their own right) and Baylor can get past Notre Dame and Nova why do 96% of you feel Duke is going to make it to the Final Four?


This is a Duke site... do you really expect Duke fans not to think their #1 seeded Duke team is going to make the final four? A better question is why the other 4% don't think Duke is going to make it!

Of course Baylor can beat Duke, they are a #3 seed for a reason. Of course Duke is a #1 seed for a reason too.

mgtr
03-16-2010, 05:05 PM
Right, but as they say, that is why they play the game.

Kedsy
03-16-2010, 05:09 PM
Good point. Baylor hasn't made it past the first round since, oh, never?

It's hard to hold much stock in a team without any skins going against a HOF coach with a few rings.

But just looking at the matchups, if Baylor got that far the monkey is presumably off their back already.

The player matchups aren't as good for Baylor as it might appear. Duke this season has had trouble when the other team's 4 is a perimeter threat (and I haven't seen Baylor, but from what I've read that's not them). Otherwise, Duke wins when it defends better than its opponent (which so far has been most of the time). According to Pomeroy, Baylor isn't an elite defensive team, so if this game happens (and it's what I picked in my pool) it should be a good, close game but I'd give Duke the edge because of their defense. Having said that, the wildcard might be the pseudo-home team advantage for Baylor.

Vasherized
03-16-2010, 05:10 PM
I was actually surprised the 96% number was so low.

What has befallen Blue Devil Nation? Where is the faith?

wacobluedevil
03-16-2010, 05:15 PM
I'm from Big 12 country.

I've suffered watching Texas this year pretty much every day since late December save for one decent win on the road against an average Okie State squad. #1 to unranked in three short months. A steady decline without any answers. Perhaps we should relocate to the DC area? :)

After beating Baylor 24 times in a row for eight years, Texas lost three times to the Bears this year.

Why?

Because we found out that Texas isn't very good but we also found out this isn't your average Baylor team.

Acy and Udoh are plus athletes in the paint that really attack the glass on both ends, block shots, and manufacture buckets. Dunn and Carter are great shooters, they can take any guard off the dribble and always manage to keep the big guys involved. They're experienced, hit free throws, and enjoy the pressure. Drew has done a hell of a job taming what once was a frenetic, undisciplined team into one capable of making a deep tourney run.

So assuming Duke beats A&M or Siena to make it to the Elite 8 (both dangerous in their own right) and Baylor can get past Notre Dame and Nova why do 96% of you feel Duke is going to make it to the Final Four?

Is this really one of those special Duke teams? I'm impressed with what Coach K has done with the three-headed monster but can't get that Georgetown game out of my head.

Can Duke Get Through The Dirty South? (http://marchtomarch.fantake.com/2010/03/16/bracket-analysis-the-south-is-a-bear-of-a-bracket/)

As a Duke grad (and therefore diehard Duke fan) and a faculty member of Baylor, I can say that the Bears would present a similar challenge to Duke that Miami did (beginning with a troublesome zone that is not at all passive), plus an experienced starting five (two seniors, two juniors and a sophomore), real fire power in Dunn, Carter and Udoh, and a team that is healthy and playing its best ball right now.

ChicagoCrazy84
03-16-2010, 05:24 PM
As a Duke grad (and therefore diehard Duke fan) and a faculty member of Baylor, I can say that the Bears would present a similar challenge to Duke that Miami did (beginning with a troublesome zone that is not at all passive), plus an experienced starting five (two seniors, two juniors and a sophomore), real fire power in Dunn, Carter and Udoh, and a team that is healthy and playing its best ball right now.


Baylor is a very good team and I have them going to the Elite 8 with us. They would be an amazing challenge for Duke, but I like Duke to go to the FF. Someone had mentioned this sounds like a Duke/LSU from '06 which was an awful matchup for us, but I think our team is built much differently and better for this type of matchup. That team was so reliant on Williams and Redick and no one else was ever willing to step up. We have 3 great scorers this year and we have Zoubs playing great ball and a much deeper front line to make sure our strengths stay as our strengths.

RaineyDevil
03-16-2010, 05:24 PM
Easy answer: yes they can. Will they? Probably not...

SCMatt33
03-16-2010, 05:26 PM
I think that a Duke-Baylor match-up would be a very interesting one. I have to say that I haven't seen much of Baylor this year, but from what I heard, they don't defend the three point line very well (they rank 157 in 3P% defense according to Pomeroy) which could be a big problem against Duke, especially since they also only rank 309 in creating turnovers on Pomeroy. Controlling the ball and making 3's are two things that Duke does very well. They also are mediocre (110th) at sending teams to the line, which would work in Duke's favor since Baylor defends the 2 pointer well and Duke doesn't shoot the two pointer well.

On the other end of the floor, Baylor has balanced scoring, both in terms of player contributions, and in terms of scoring 2's, 3's, and FT's, ranking in the middle of the country in percentage of points from all three. This will work heavily in Baylor's favor. In all 5 Duke losses, Teams were able to shoot and make 3's early, which opened up easy baskets inside or vice versa. Duke's defense tries to force teams to play an offensive game that they don't want to play. Since Baylor is so balanced, it would be tough for Duke to force them into an uncomfortable situation.

Baylor will need to hope that Duke misses open 3's and that the refs call a loose game on the offensive end, but if they play their game and don't try to force things against Duke's D, they will have a chance to score points. If this match-up occurs, I see this being one of the Duke games that is played in the 70's rather than the 50's and that gives Baylor a better chance. I'll repeat that I haven't watched Baylor play that much and I could be wrong, but I'm going by what the stats tell me.

Edit: Forgot to mention this, but rebounding will be very important. Both teams are very good at rebounding the offensive glass and second chance points could be an important stat in this match-up.

YourLandlord
03-16-2010, 05:29 PM
I just gotta say how incredible it is for Baylor that they are a #3 seed just a few years after all that scandal. Pretty impressive.

Tim1515
03-16-2010, 05:47 PM
are you going around posting this question on every Duke board?

shoutingncu
03-16-2010, 06:07 PM
...but this is a team that has never been there and done that- So you will just need to wait and see.

Which team are you talking about?

(Sorry, still have the bitter taste of an NIT Tipoff in a couple hours)

Cavlaw
03-16-2010, 06:34 PM
Looking ahead much? We won't even know who Duke's first opponent is for another 2 hours or so, let alone who Duke may play if our team is fortunate enough to reach the Elite Eight.

hq2
03-16-2010, 06:48 PM
The previous post got it right. Let's just do this one (maybe two) games at a time (we should win the first one; no #1 seed has lost to a #16, ever). Then we have to play Louisville, a top 30 team who will give us serious backcourt problems. If we get by them, we can worry about Baylor. We'll worry about it then.

Duvall
03-16-2010, 06:53 PM
The previous post got it right. Let's just do this one (maybe two) games at a time (we should win the first one; no #1 seed has lost to a #16, ever). Then we have to play Louisville, a top 30 team who will give us serious backcourt problems.

Top 30 of what?

Kedsy
03-16-2010, 06:57 PM
The previous post got it right. Let's just do this one (maybe two) games at a time (we should win the first one; no #1 seed has lost to a #16, ever). Then we have to play Louisville, a top 30 team who will give us serious backcourt problems. If we get by them, we can worry about Baylor. We'll worry about it then.

Well, actually we'll have to play the California/Louisville winner. Cal is ranked significantly higher than Louisville in RPI, Sagarin, and Pomeroy. (And Louisville is considered a "top 30" team by none of those systems, nor by either major poll, in which they received exactly zero votes.)

If we beat the Cal/Louisville winner, we'll play Purdue/Texas A&M/Utah State/Siena, and if we beat them we can worry about Baylor, if they happen to be next.

mgtr
03-16-2010, 08:04 PM
Top 30 of what?

Top 30 of Kentucky. They have their own special basketball rules there.

Rudy
03-16-2010, 11:00 PM
If Baylor gets that far they will be on a roll- but this is a team that has never been there and done that- So you will just need to wait and see.
No one on the current Duke team has been there and done that either, although its head coach and associate coach have.

Vasherized
03-17-2010, 10:46 AM
At least according to this Kentucky writer. Baylor is one of them.

Beakers and Bears (http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100316/COLUMNISTS01/303160023)

Here is the profile of a national championship team over the past 21 seasons:

Qualify as a one, two or three seed. Average at least 77.3 points. Shoot 48 percent or better from the field and 37 percent or better from the three-point line. The telling number at the free-throw line is 68 percent.

Kedsy
03-17-2010, 11:29 AM
At least according to this Kentucky writer. Baylor is one of them.

Beakers and Bears (http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100316/COLUMNISTS01/303160023)

Here is the profile of a national championship team over the past 21 seasons:

Qualify as a one, two or three seed. Average at least 77.3 points. Shoot 48 percent or better from the field and 37 percent or better from the three-point line. The telling number at the free-throw line is 68 percent.


It's kind of a silly article. He just goes back and data fits.

CDu
03-17-2010, 11:41 AM
It's kind of a silly article. He just goes back and data fits.

Not only that, but it data fits on select parameters that exclude defense and rebounding. So basically the article suggests that all that matters is offense.

Reddevil
03-17-2010, 12:15 PM
Does Elmer Fudd have problems with the letter R?
Do the Walton's take way too long to say goodnight?

IF they meet, both teams will be pretty hot. Yeah, Baylor CAN beat Duke, but in a one and done situation anything CAN happen. Like V said - survive and advance. This year's tourney is gonna be crazy. It's almost here ladies and gents!

jipops
03-17-2010, 12:51 PM
Let's just get far enough to find out.

noyac
03-17-2010, 01:54 PM
Have we all forgotten about Baylor being on probation because the Coach helped cover up the murder of player that was murdered by a former teammate?

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/2005-06-23-baylor-ncaa_x.htm?POE=SPOISVA

This was a tragedy and no one seems to talk about it. In the 2005-2006 season they didn't even play one game out of conference. I am impressed (sarc) that the program has rebounded so quickly.

Olympic Fan
03-17-2010, 02:40 PM
Kind of a silly thread, but I understand that it's provoked by the pundits out there making Baylor a fashionable upset pick.

Let me respond by answering the original question posed in the title of this thread ... "Can Baylor Beat Duke" ... obviously they CAN. This Duke team has lost to NC State and Georgia Tech and neither of them is as good as Baylor.

But .. it might be fair to ask, "Will Baylor and Duke meet in the Elite Eight"? That's a much tougher question to answer. It's a long way down the road -- three wins for each team.

As a Duke fan who has seen Duke flame out in the Sweet 16 six times in the this century, I'd be pretty happy if we get that far-- it would be our first Elite Eight appearance since 2004.

If Duke reaches the regional finals, I'd kind of expect to face somebody pretty tough at that level. I mean, you can't expect to get there and find Morgan State or Vermont waiting for you. If you're going to win this thing -- or even go deep -- you're going to have to beat somebody pretty good at some point.

How good is Baylor?

I've seen them several times and they have some quality players -- a huge frontline and a couple of excellent guards in Dunn and Carter.

On the other hand, there's nothing in their resume that scares me. Hard to fathom why they are such a popular pick. I mean the best thing on their resume is three wins over a Texas team that is in collapse. Baylor is 0-3 against the two best teams in the Big 12 and 2-2 against the next two best (Texas A&M and Oklahoma State) -- in both cases winning at home and losing on the road.

Out of conference, they have a quality win over Xavier, but a "bad" loss to Alabama. They also have a "bad" in-conference loss to Colorado.

Again, I'm not knocking them -- on paper, their resume looks a lot like Clemson, Florida State, Wake Forest (without the late-season collapse) and Georgia Tech (in terms of quality wins). Those are all solid teams that would have a chance to beat us on a neutral court too.

But I got to be honest, when you look at who else we could be playing in the Elite Eight, well, I'd take my chances with Baylor instead of Kansas State, Ohio State, West Virginia, Villanova or Georgetown -- other No. 2 and No. 3 seeds that we MIGHT have drawn.

That's IF we both get that far.

PS I don't worry too much about playing Baylor in Houston. There will be some Baylor fans there, but these aren't like Kentucky fans who will pack the place and turn it into Waco-East. If we get Texas A&M in the regional semifinals, I'd expect their fanatic fans to be out in force ... but remember, this is basketball and in Texas, that ain't as big a deal as spring football.

pfrduke
03-17-2010, 02:48 PM
Have we all forgotten about Baylor being on probation because the Coach helped cover up the murder of player that was murdered by a former teammate?

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/2005-06-23-baylor-ncaa_x.htm?POE=SPOISVA

This was a tragedy and no one seems to talk about it. In the 2005-2006 season they didn't even play one game out of conference. I am impressed (sarc) that the program has rebounded so quickly.

Um, plenty of people are talking about this. Baylor completely cleaned house after that whole tragic mess, and the current coach has nothing to do with the cover-up committed by the former regime (led by Dave Bliss). They absolutely paid their penance, and to have rebuilt from that disaster in just 4 short seasons to arguably the best season that the Bears have had in the history of their program is extremely impressive.

wacobluedevil
03-17-2010, 04:21 PM
Um, plenty of people are talking about this. Baylor completely cleaned house after that whole tragic mess, and the current coach has nothing to do with the cover-up committed by the former regime (led by Dave Bliss). They absolutely paid their penance, and to have rebuilt from that disaster in just 4 short seasons to arguably the best season that the Bears have had in the history of their program is extremely impressive.

Thank you for making this point clear. What Dave Bliss did, both with respect to this mishandling of the program, and his part in the cover-up of the murder, was a tragedy of the first order, but Scott Drew, who was brought in to clean up after Bliss has done a first-rate job (and ruffled a few recruiting feathers of coaches such as Rick Barnes and Bobby Knight in the process). Everyone always liked Baylor so long as they could count on a W after playing them. Now they can't do that.

And thank you to prfduke and the vast majority of posters on this board for refusing to stoop to such crass ad hominem comments.

Oh, yes, Go Duke, and GTHC!

Classof06
03-17-2010, 08:55 PM
Q: Can Baylor beat Duke?

A: The only possible way Duke and Baylor can meet is in the Elite Eight. In the Elite Eight, any team you face is capable of beating you.

JohnGalt
03-17-2010, 08:59 PM
Q: Can Baylor beat Duke?

A: The only possible way Duke and Baylor can meet is in the Elite Eight. In the Elite Eight, any team you face is capable of beating you.

Amen. The more important point is that both Cal and Louisville CAN beat Duke...

-bdbd
03-17-2010, 09:18 PM
Does anyone with ties to Baylor ot A&M know how well they travel as fan bases? If we win our first two, I'd be concerned that we'd play two "home" teams in the 3rd/4th rounds. Having lived in Texas 20 years ago, I recall the A&M is a huge school and following, not all that far from Houston. I think Baylor is a little further, a little smaller and the fanbase isn't known to be quite so fierce. Is any of this a misperception. How intimidating a welcome would Duke face in Houston, should we make it that far, against these two schools and their fans? :confused:

Thanks.

Dukeface88
03-18-2010, 01:11 AM
No one on the current Duke team has been there and done that either, although its head coach and associate coach have.

I believe the previous poster is refering to the fact that these Baylor players have never won a game in the tournament (although that wouldn't be true any more if we play them). Other than the frosh, Duke has indeed been there and done that.

AZLA
03-18-2010, 03:36 AM
Knowing a few close Baylor friends, I get the sense (though they won't admit it) Duke basketball serves as a template for emulation -- private; great alumni base; relatively younger coach known for high character standards and effective recruiting skills. And of course beating Duke would be an important benchmark for their program (next to getting to the Final Four or winning it all). Perhaps that explains why Baylor has become a thread? I don't think the tragedy that transpired in '03 is lost on anyone here. I just assume people are more interested in admiring the positive turnaround for their program and not looking past the first few rounds for Duke. That and no doubt if Baylor goes long in the Tourney, which they have the talent to do so, the press will be sure to remind everyone of the scandal from 7 years ago.

Saratoga2
03-18-2010, 06:24 AM
During the year, many of us want our team to develop and we see them play a lot and offer mostly constructive criticism towards the gradual improvement of the team. That of course means talking about player and coach shortcomings if any are perceived.

We tend to forget that all the other teams out there have significant shortcomings that Duike can exploit. On any given night, there are teams that could beat us of course, but we have the edge over many of these, including Baylor.

flyingdutchdevil
03-18-2010, 06:33 AM
It's kind of a silly article. He just goes back and data fits.

What? Isn't that how trends and stats work? With a forum obsessed with stats and numbers, I'm a little surprised that this isn't taken with a little more insight. What analyst doesn't look at data and infers something?

I see his point and certainly believe that Kansas is, by far, the most likely team to win it all. Baylor is a good team, but experience in the tourney counts for a lot (unless your last name is Carmelo) and Baylor just doesn't have that.

Spret42
03-18-2010, 07:01 AM
What? Isn't that how trends and stats work? With a forum obsessed with stats and numbers, I'm a little surprised that this isn't taken with a little more insight. What analyst doesn't look at data and infers something?

I see his point and certainly believe that Kansas is, by far, the most likely team to win it all. Baylor is a good team, but experience in the tourney counts for a lot (unless your last name is Carmelo) and Baylor just doesn't have that.

I am searching through my mental archives for someone whose last name was Carmelo. What was this person's first name. ;)

flyingdutchdevil
03-18-2010, 07:13 AM
I am searching through my mental archives for someone whose last name was Carmelo. What was this person's first name. ;)

I believe his full name is Anthony Carmelo. He played with McNamara Gerry ;)

Btw, Carrick Felix's name will not go down well with commentators and journalists in his first year (like Carmelo Anthony).

J_C_Steel
03-18-2010, 09:56 AM
A lot of teams could beat Duke. In the South Region, that list includes Cal, Louisville, Siena, Texas A&M, Villanova, Notre Dame and Baylor.

WILL one of those teams beat Duke?

Based on the toughness this team has displayed, combined with their ability to overcome bad shooting nights, I'm going to say no.

Here's hopin'...

Devilfam
03-18-2010, 10:17 AM
Does anyone with ties to Baylor ot A&M know how well they travel as fan bases? If we win our first two, I'd be concerned that we'd play two "home" teams in the 3rd/4th rounds. Having lived in Texas 20 years ago, I recall the A&M is a huge school and following, not all that far from Houston. I think Baylor is a little further, a little smaller and the fanbase isn't known to be quite so fierce. Is any of this a misperception. How intimidating a welcome would Duke face in Houston, should we make it that far, against these two schools and their fans? :confused:

Thanks.

As someone who grew up in the shadow of Texas A&M (and a Duke alum) and now lives in Houston, I can say that A&M will has a huge following here in Houston and will very likely show up in droves to a South Regional game. The campus is only 100 miles north of Houston. The Reliant Stadium venue will not be familiar to the A&M team (their only game in Houston this year was at the Toyota Center) but the crowd support for them will be large and loud.

theAlaskanBear
03-18-2010, 11:14 AM
THe problem with the original post and editorial is that the stats the man uses are selective and not a great predictor. He says 15/21 championship teams met the criteria and won. so thats a 66% percent chance. The last 5 champs have all met that criteria, but still...

...Duke meets all but ONE: FG%

The tourney is less about stats, and more about matchups. Who can guard who, pacing, etc.

Baylor does scare me though, because they are a high scoring team, with a coupld of players shooting 40% from 3. Anyone know how they look defensively?

wacobluedevil
03-18-2010, 11:21 AM
Does anyone with ties to Baylor ot A&M know how well they travel as fan bases? If we win our first two, I'd be concerned that we'd play two "home" teams in the 3rd/4th rounds. Having lived in Texas 20 years ago, I recall the A&M is a huge school and following, not all that far from Houston. I think Baylor is a little further, a little smaller and the fanbase isn't known to be quite so fierce. Is any of this a misperception. How intimidating a welcome would Duke face in Houston, should we make it that far, against these two schools and their fans? :confused:

Thanks.

Baylor fans tend to be of the fair-weather type; when their team is doing well (as in the case of the 2005 national champion women's team), they can show up in significant numbers, plus the Houston area is replete with Baylor alums. But no, they don't have the numbers that the Aggies do.

wacobluedevil
03-18-2010, 11:23 AM
Knowing a few close Baylor friends, I get the sense (though they won't admit it) Duke basketball serves as a template for emulation -- private; great alumni base; relatively younger coach known for high character standards and effective recruiting skills. And of course beating Duke would be an important benchmark for their program (next to getting to the Final Four or winning it all). Perhaps that explains why Baylor has become a thread? I don't think the tragedy that transpired in '03 is lost on anyone here. I just assume people are more interested in admiring the positive turnaround for their program and not looking past the first few rounds for Duke. That and no doubt if Baylor goes long in the Tourney, which they have the talent to do so, the press will be sure to remind everyone of the scandal from 7 years ago.

Actually, there are some Baylor fans who will admit as much.

wacobluedevil
03-18-2010, 11:26 AM
THe problem with the original post and editorial is that the stats the man uses are selective and not a great predictor. He says 15/21 championship teams met the criteria and won. so thats a 66% percent chance. The last 5 champs have all met that criteria, but still...

...Duke meets all but ONE: FG%

The tourney is less about stats, and more about matchups. Who can guard who, pacing, etc.

Baylor does scare me though, because they are a high scoring team, with a coupld of players shooting 40% from 3. Anyone know how they look defensively?

They play an active match-up zone that extends fairly far out. If the opposing team is patient and sharp with its passes, you can open up holes at the free thrown line and in the corners, and you can sometimes drive the baseline from the corners, though penetration up high is more difficult.

Duke of Nashville
03-18-2010, 02:46 PM
Can Baylor Beat Sam Houston State?

airowe
03-18-2010, 03:32 PM
Can Baylor Beat Sam Houston State?

;) I'm hoping they can't.

YourLandlord
03-18-2010, 03:51 PM
Can Baylor Beat Sam Houston State?

dang, i just came in here to post that.

Duke of Nashville
03-18-2010, 04:06 PM
Can Baylor Beat Sam Houston State?

Well I guess so, and as my dad likes to say (if you are reading this I am sure you are proud), "A blind squirrel finds an acorn now and again."

G man
03-18-2010, 05:34 PM
Does anyone with ties to Baylor ot A&M know how well they travel as fan bases? If we win our first two, I'd be concerned that we'd play two "home" teams in the 3rd/4th rounds. Having lived in Texas 20 years ago, I recall the A&M is a huge school and following, not all that far from Houston. I think Baylor is a little further, a little smaller and the fanbase isn't known to be quite so fierce. Is any of this a misperception. How intimidating a welcome would Duke face in Houston, should we make it that far, against these two schools and their fans? :confused:

Thanks.

I was skiing in Colorado yesterday and ended up sitting next to a gentlemen on the chair lift from Baylor. He was so excited about the tournament, but something he said to me stood out. He said that Baylor never has any expectations as a fan base. They are happy with whatever happens. If that is the case I doubt many have already made plans to travel for late tournament games.

Indoor66
03-18-2010, 08:05 PM
A lot of teams could beat Duke. In the South Region, that list includes Cal, Louisville, Siena, Texas A&M, Villanova, Notre Dame and Baylor.

WILL one of those teams beat Duke?

Based on the toughness this team has displayed, combined with their ability to overcome bad shooting nights, I'm going to say no.

Here's hopin'...

Well, ND won't!

chrisheery
03-18-2010, 08:08 PM
If Duke gets a chance to beat Baylor, I'll be happy. I think if they do play, Duke can and will win. I love this team, but the tournament has proven to be tough for many teams. We are not exempt from that. I'm trying to keep my expectations down and enjoy the ride.

gus
03-19-2010, 09:28 AM
I'm trying to keep my expectations down and enjoy the ride.

Not me.

We're a one seed. I will merely be content if we make the final four and mildly pleased if we win make the final game. Only a championship is enough to make me happy. If Duke fails to make the final four, I will be sure to excoriate our players for being too slow or too weak, K for being past his prime, his assistants for being poor recruiters, Wojo for being too short to coach big men, and the fan base for being too unimaginative and too passive at the games. And I may sprinkle in some opprobrium for the refs and perhaps Billy Packer*.




* Yes, I know. But hating Clark Kellogg just isn't the same.

-bdbd
03-19-2010, 11:03 AM
Not me.

We're a one seed. I will merely be content if we make the final four and mildly pleased if we win make the final game. Only a championship is enough to make me happy. If Duke fails to make the final four, I will be sure to excoriate our players for being too slow or too weak, K for being past his prime, his assistants for being poor recruiters, Wojo for being too short to coach big men, and the fan base for being too unimaginative and too passive at the games. And I may sprinkle in some opprobrium for the refs and perhaps Billy Packer*.




* Yes, I know. But hating Clark Kellogg just isn't the same.



Hey, you should fit right in!!

;)

Kewlswim
03-24-2010, 12:51 PM
Hi,

In the SF Bay Area they have this show called "Chronicle Live" where they talk about sports. One of the guests on the show was a portly sports writer by the name of "Ray Ratto." He followed Cal to Jacksonville where he saw Duke play.

Anyway, he picks Baylor to win this Region. That's fine, he can pick whomever he wants. What was weird was how he made statements totally discounting Coach K's coaching ability and exalting Baylor's staff. He spoke about the Baylor interior and then totally disregarded Duke's strengths in firing off the 3-ball. Certainly if Duke played the same style it did against Cal against Baylor (if both teams got that far) it could be problematic. However, I think Duke would go more to its "normal" strengths because Baylor isn't as short as Cal's team. What this left me wondering was if either Ratto had some sort of a bone to pick with Coach K or (most probable) he just didn't know what he was talking about because he had the "old" Duke in his mind and not this particular team? I can't get over his thinking that Duke only plays one style and won't be readily able to change game plans because Coach K has shown over the years to be innovative and doing things that are needed to win. In Ratto's defense the most recent teams, not this one, didn't have a lot of flexibility. Not in Ratto's defense his statements sound like someone who hasn't done a lot to watch Duke play this season or someone who has some sort of bone to pick. Maybe he is bitter over the Cal loss? He went ahead and picked St. Mary's to get pasted by Baylor. Interesting.

GO DUKE!

slower
03-24-2010, 01:01 PM
Hi,

In the SF Bay Area they have this show called "Chronicle Live" where they talk about sports. One of the guests on the show was a portly sports writer by the name of "Ray Ratto." He followed Cal to Jacksonville where he saw Duke play.

Anyway, he picks Baylor to win this Region. That's fine, he can pick whomever he wants. What was weird was how he made statements totally discounting Coach K's coaching ability and exalting Baylor's staff. He spoke about the Baylor interior and then totally disregarded Duke's strengths in firing off the 3-ball. Certainly if Duke played the same style it did against Cal against Baylor (if both teams got that far) it could be problematic. However, I think Duke would go more to its "normal" strengths because Baylor isn't as short as Cal's team. What this left me wondering was if either Ratto had some sort of a bone to pick with Coach K or (most probable) he just didn't know what he was talking about because he had the "old" Duke in his mind and not this particular team? I can't get over his thinking that Duke only plays one style and won't be readily able to change game plans because Coach K has shown over the years to be innovative and doing things that are needed to win. In Ratto's defense the most recent teams, not this one, didn't have a lot of flexibility. Not in Ratto's defense his statements sound like someone who hasn't done a lot to watch Duke play this season or someone who has some sort of bone to pick. Maybe he is bitter over the Cal loss? He went ahead and picked St. Mary's to get pasted by Baylor. Interesting.

GO DUKE!

He's a Bay Area homer. Probably just bitter that his boys got beat and now he wants to pout.

weezie
03-24-2010, 01:13 PM
Gottlieb was subbing for Colin Herd today. He said that Duke was a very physical team....but still waffled a bit on picking a winner in the bracket. The dweeb.

My thought was how can "we" be physical if we aren't athletic?

Gottlieb! Go buy a clue!

Saratoga2
03-24-2010, 01:22 PM
Baylor can beat us and we can beat Baylor. The premise of the thread doesn't add a lot of value. Lets beat Purdue and take this one at a time.

Kewlswim
03-24-2010, 01:27 PM
Gottlieb was subbing for Colin Herd today. He said that Duke was a very physical team....but still waffled a bit on picking a winner in the bracket. The dweeb.

My thought was how can "we" be physical if we aren't athletic?

Gottlieb! Go buy a clue!

He Weezie,

Maybe he was thinking of the fat bully down the street who used to steal lunch money by beating up kids who were generally smaller and slower? No wait, my bad, if that was the case he would have been describing the UNC basketball team. I have no idea what that dude meant.

GO DUKE!!

weezie
03-24-2010, 01:37 PM
I have no idea what that dude meant.

GO DUKE!!

And I, my friend, have no idea how Dougie G has a job at all.

CDu
03-24-2010, 02:19 PM
Gottlieb was subbing for Colin Herd today. He said that Duke was a very physical team....but still waffled a bit on picking a winner in the bracket. The dweeb.

My thought was how can "we" be physical if we aren't athletic?

Gottlieb! Go buy a clue!

Physical and athletic don't necessarily go hand in hand. For example, the late-80s/early-90s Bulls were generally more athletic than their Pistons/Knicks counterparts. But the Pistons and Knicks gave the Bulls a challenge (in the Pistons case, they actually beat the Bulls a number of times) by being more physical. The terms (as used in the parlance of our times) refer to different things.

Of course, you can certainly be athletic and physical (see Villanova, UConn in years past, etc). But you don't have to be a highly athletic team to be a physical team. By the standard convention, we're not a super explosive athletic team (though we aren't alarmingly unathletic either). But we are definitely a physical team.

-jk
03-24-2010, 02:21 PM
OK, we'll unlock this one if we actually get to play Baylor. Time to focus on Purdue.

Discuss Baylor generally in the South thread.

-jk

Jderf
03-28-2010, 06:24 PM
see response title.

Welcome2DaSlopes
03-28-2010, 06:25 PM
Yes we CAN!!!! Yes we DID!!!!!

Andre Buckner Fan
03-28-2010, 06:25 PM
Not today, baby!!!! :D

kestrel
03-28-2010, 06:31 PM
Apparently not. And I'm OK with that. ^_^

JBDuke
03-28-2010, 06:32 PM
I think we've conclusively answered this one for today. I'm CLOSING this thread.