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Dr. Tina
03-06-2010, 07:50 PM
I'll be running my office pool at work. We're exploring two options on how to run the pool right now. In the past, we have had 32 participants, with each participant being drawn a first round game. The winner of the 1st round game was that person's team for the remainder of the tournament. The people at my workplace seem to like this a lot because not all of them follow college b-ball and find filling out a bracket of their own overwhelming.

However, I am thinking about changing it up and making it a pool where my coworkers fill out the entire bracket. People may feel more invested in it throughout the course of the tournament that way. So, here are my questions...

1. Does anyone know of an online service that would allow me to enter in each person's bracket and keep track of the pool that way? It'd make it easier to tabulate points and whatnot.

2. How do I convince novice hoops participants that choosing their own bracket would be a good idea? What sort of pointers should I give them for filling out their bracket that would make the process easier and less overwhelming for them?

3. Any other suggestions for running the pool that you can think of....

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

brevity
03-07-2010, 04:35 AM
3. Any other suggestions for running the pool that you can think of....

I've been toying with an idea for the past few weeks: the sight-unseen tournament pool. It's incredibly simple, though it takes a bit of an explanation.

Basically, you would have each participant rank a list of teams most likely to win a championship, regardless of where they appear on a bracket. (Preferably, you would do this BEFORE Selection Sunday, but it would theoretically work after the brackets are announced as well. So long as everyone did it before Selection Sunday or everyone did it after, to ensure all participants had equal information.)

Then you (the pool commissioner) would fill out the participants' brackets after Selection Sunday, driven by their ranked preferences. Their #1 pick would be their champion. Their #2 pick would go as far as it could until it faced their #1 pick. Their #3 pick would go as far as it could until it faced their #1 or #2 pick. And so on. Then you would complete the rest of the bracket by chalk (i.e. the higher seed advances).

So, for example, let's make up 3 entries for the 2009 men's tournament (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_ncaa_tournament), and see how they do in the later rounds.

Entry A
1. Louisville
2. UNC
3. Michigan State
4. Syracuse
5. Duke
6. Villanova
7. Pittsburgh
8. Oklahoma
9. Kansas
10. Connecticut

Entry B
1. Connecticut
2. Memphis
3. Villanova
4. Duke
5. Pittsburgh
6. Michigan State
7. Louisville
8. UNC

Entry C
1. UNC
2. Connecticut
3. Duke
4. Oklahoma
5. Cornell
6. Missouri

Entry A is picking Louisville to go all the way. But notice that its #3 pick, Michigan State, can only make it to the Elite Eight because it's in the same region as their #1 pick Louisville. Their #4 pick, Syracuse, suffers the same fate in its region, falling to #2 pick UNC. As it turns out, their Final Four is #1 Louisville, #2 UNC, #5 Duke, and #10 Connecticut (two of which turn out to be correct). It also gets points for UNC making the final, but no more points after that because it picked Louisville to win the title.

Entry B, if you notice, gets the Final Four correct: #1 Connecticut, #3 Villanova, #6 Michigan State, and #8 UNC. But it scores no points after that because it picks a Connecticut-Villanova final.

Entry C is a bit perverse. Its Final Four is incomplete -- #1 UNC, #2 Connecticut, and #3 Duke -- because it picked no teams placed in the Midwest Regional. And despite ranking eventual Elite Eight team Missouri #6, it would receive no points for that because the Tigers' first round opponent, Cornell, is ranked #5. But Entry C still gets massive points for picking 2 Final Four teams and the champion.

Note that the S-Curve is incredibly relevant here. If a pair of top seeded teams (or 2 seeds, or 3 seeds, etc.) play each other in the Final Four, you need to know which team the Selection Committee considers the "higher" seed. The CBS selection show will provide the exact hierarchy of the top seeds; last year it was Louisville, then Pittsburgh, then UNC, then Connecticut. The S-curve forms from there.

As you can see from the example above, the length of each person's list is irrelevant -- they could rank all 64/65/300+ teams, or maybe just write down "#1. Duke" and be done if they wanted.

Once you grasp the concept, you can see how this kind of pool would be advantageous. People who can't be bothered to fill out a whole bracket could just pick a few teams to go as far as possible. Others, who are more hardcore, might try to think about what teams would go in which region so that their favorites would be more likely to be spread apart. Another benefit is that you can invite entries the entire week (or more) before Selection Sunday, rather than the small time frame from Selection Sunday night to Thursday at noon EST.

G man
03-07-2010, 04:09 PM
I'll be running my office pool at work. We're exploring two options on how to run the pool right now. In the past, we have had 32 participants, with each participant being drawn a first round game. The winner of the 1st round game was that person's team for the remainder of the tournament. The people at my workplace seem to like this a lot because not all of them follow college b-ball and find filling out a bracket of their own overwhelming.

However, I am thinking about changing it up and making it a pool where my coworkers fill out the entire bracket. People may feel more invested in it throughout the course of the tournament that way. So, here are my questions...

1. Does anyone know of an online service that would allow me to enter in each person's bracket and keep track of the pool that way? It'd make it easier to tabulate points and whatnot.

2. How do I convince novice hoops participants that choosing their own bracket would be a good idea? What sort of pointers should I give them for filling out their bracket that would make the process easier and less overwhelming for them?

3. Any other suggestions for running the pool that you can think of....

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

yahoo makes it easy to create and manage groups not sure if you wanted to do that, but it is worth looking at.

Bluedog
03-07-2010, 04:18 PM
Basically, you would have each participant rank a list of teams most likely to win a championship, regardless of where they appear on a bracket. (Preferably, you would do this BEFORE Selection Sunday, but it would theoretically work after the brackets are announced as well. So long as everyone did it before Selection Sunday or everyone did it after, to ensure all participants had equal information.)

Then you (the pool commissioner) would fill out the participants' brackets after Selection Sunday, driven by their ranked preferences.

Unique idea, but it really makes no sense whatsoever because many of the games are about the particular matchup. I may think a team is the #15 team in the country, but that doesn't mean I'd think they'd beat #16-65. Let's say the #20 team has a tough zone D that negates #15s offensive strengths and thus I think they'll struggle. Then, I'd choose #20 to beat #15 even though I "rank" the other higher. Perhaps with people who know very little about the game and are just doing this for some entertainment might be okay with this concept, but for somebody like me who actually watches games and pays attention, I'd find it completely nonsensical since it's all about who you play. You can't just rank teams 1-65.

There are several websites that automatically keep track of brackets. The most popular ones are Yahoo, ESPN, and CBSSporsline.

Fish80
03-07-2010, 04:46 PM
I run a pool that is a little complicated and a lot fun. Once the brackets are set, we auction off the teams in two rounds of silent bidding. After round one, the participants see all the bids. Then round 2 bids are due before the tournament starts. Highest bid owns that team. Ties are decided by time of bid.

We create a "bag" for all the teams that aren't bought individually. And we bid on the bag. You don't know who will be left in the bag while bidding on the bag. Sometimes the bag has a couple of good teams. The "holder of the bag" owns all those teams.

All the bid money is paid out by formula. The winner each round gets a share of the pool, with the shares increasing by round.

We buy and sell teams during the tournament. Some wild and crazy trades happen.

The stakes are modest. Typically a one seed goes for $20-$30, and the total pool is about $300. Minimum bid is $1.

Great fun. And I always own Duke. :)