MBB: Georgia Tech 68, UNC-CH 51

[left_hook_lacey]

It's obvious that both UNC and GT need a win tonight. Ed Davis is out. Zeller could be back. GT has been in a slump yet holds a 5.5 edge according to Vegas. Who do ya got?

[camion]

I usually pick the home team. Seems reasonable tonight.

[whereinthehellami]

Who is going to stop Lawal with Davis out of the lineup? UNC won their one game with their star out of the lineup, now they suffer. And I hope they suffer BIG!

[CDu]

It's a huge game for both teams. GT needs this win to have a good shot at getting to 8-8 in conference and make their tourney bid more comfortable. If they lose this one, then they'll either have to steal a road game or make a deep ACC tourney run.

For UNC, any hopes at an at-large bid rest on getting to at least 7-9 in conference (and probably 8-8). So they can't afford many more losses, especially with road games remaining against Duke and Wake, and tough home games against Md and FSU.

I assume that Zeller won't be available tonight (he just returned to practice yesterday I believe). That gives GT a huge advantage inside. If their guards don't tank, I think they win by 10 or so. If GT's guards don't show up or if their bigs get in real foul trouble, then UNC could win. But unless Zeller plays and plays really well, I have trouble seeing UNC win this one.

[Duvall]

I'm not sure wanting has much to do with it. Tech's slump has consisted mostly of playing road games; they've generally been much better at home. And Zeller's only been practicing for a day or so, he's still unlikely to play, and without him the Heels will be left to face Lawal, Favors and Peacock with Thompson, Henson and the lesser Wear. Even Wheat would consider that only a moderate frontcourt advantage for UNC.

Tech should win easily, though the Hewitt Factor can kick in at any time.

[stals]

It's obvious that both UNC and GT need a win tonight. Ed Davis is out. Zeller could be back. GT has been in a slump yet holds a 5.5 edge according to Vegas. Who do ya got?

Pomeroy predicts GT by 9 and the Sagarin predictor has GT by about 7 points.

[Osiagledknarf]

Where are you hearing that Zeller will be back tonight? I just read on ACC Blog that he maybe back Saturday, not tonight. Where are you hearing that he is coming back tonight?

I would take Tech in the point here due to there big men inside. Favors and Lawal inside will be a tough match up inside for UNC without Davis and Zeller to contain. Ed Davis had one of his best games vs. Tech with 12 rebounds and 4 blocks in there first meeting, which UNC still lost, and GT won't have to deal with that. Also, UNC will also have two bigs guys in David Wear and Jon Henson. This spells trouble for UNC inside.

It took an outstanding from Will Graves to keep it close in there last meeting, where he rallied them back from 16 points behind to tie the game and lose by 2 in the final minute. This was with Davis in the middle. He won't be there tonight.

I would take GT in the over in this game.

[CDu]

Where are you hearing that Zeller will be back tonight? I just read on ACC Blog that he maybe back Saturday, not tonight. Where are you hearing that he is coming back tonight?

I would take Tech in the point here due to there big men inside. Favors and Lawal inside will be a tough match up inside for UNC without Davis and Zeller to contain. Ed Davis had one of his best games vs. Tech with 12 rebounds and 4 blocks in there first meeting, which UNC still lost, and GT won't have to deal with that. Also, UNC will also have two bigs guys in David Wear and Jon Henson. This spells trouble for UNC inside.

It took an outstanding from Will Graves to keep it close in there last meeting, where he rallied them back from 16 points behind to tie the game and lose by 2 in the final minute. This was with Davis in the middle. He won't be there tonight.

I would take GT in the over in this game.

Yeah, all I've heard on the radio is that Zeller started practicing again yesterday and that he was possible for Saturday but out for tonight. Of course, you never know with guys coming back from injury. We'll see.

If Zeller plays, then UNC could make it a game. If he doesn't, then I don't think UNC can play with GT inside. Thompson is no match for Lawal, and Favors/Peacock is better than Henson/Wear.

Of course, the part that you omitted was that GT got a career performance from Iman Shumpert in the last UNC game. He went from 30, which is double his next-best game in 2010 (and 8 more than any other game he's ever played). That being said, they also got relatively poor scoring games from Favors and Lawal. So maybe it more than offsets.

[OldPhiKap]

Tech has bigger and better players.

Tech has a much worse coach.

Could be a nail-biter if Tech doesn't play with a lot of passion.

[CDu]

Tech has bigger and better players.

Tech has a much worse coach.

Could be a nail-biter if Tech doesn't play with a lot of passion.

GT certainly has the best player on the court (Lawal). They could potentially have the second-best player on the court if he shows up (Shumpert). If Shumpert plays one of his better games, I think GT wins comfortably. If he struggles and/or if UNC's guards step up, they could make this a game.

[Chitowndevil]

GT is the play here, easily. GT is 12-1 at home with wins over Duke, Clemson, and Wake. Their sole home loss was Florida State - in overtime, and on December 20th. Carolina is 1-6 on the road, including a 19 point loss at Clemson and a 21 point loss at Maryland. In both Carolina's lone road win, against N.C. State, and their near loss to GT at home, Ed Davis went for 12 points and 9/8 rebounds. On paper, there is virtually no way Carolina stays in this game.

[left_hook_lacey]

Where are you hearing that Zeller will be back tonight? I just read on ACC Blog that he maybe back Saturday, not tonight. Where are you hearing that he is coming back tonight?

I haven't. I was just going off talk from earlier this weekend that he had started some practice. I haven't read/heard anything either way.

[left_hook_lacey]

Yeah, all I've heard on the radio is that Zeller started practicing again yesterday and that he was possible for Saturday but out for tonight. Of course, you never know with guys coming back from injury. We'll see.

If Zeller plays, then UNC could make it a game. If he doesn't, then I don't think UNC can play with GT inside. Thompson is no match for Lawal, and Favors/Peacock is better than Henson/Wear.

Of course, the part that you omitted was that GT got a career performance from Iman Shumpert in the last UNC game. He went from 30, which is double his next-best game in 2010 (and 8 more than any other game he's ever played). That being said, they also got relatively poor scoring games from Favors and Lawal. So maybe it more than offsets.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Shumpert lost his mind, especially from 3 in first half that last game, and he hasn't shot that well from beyond the arc since. But at the same time, Favors nor Lawal had the kind of games you would expect. I reall think this is going to be an intersting game for many different reasons. You know how GT likes to bang also, so look for this one to get a little pushy. (Couldn't think of a better word to describe contact, but I'm sick hearing that it's getting "chippy".)

[left_hook_lacey]

Tech has bigger and better players.

Tech has a much worse coach.

Could be a nail-biter if Tech doesn't play with a lot of passion.

That's what I'm getting at with this post. We'll see what kind of heart these two teams have tonight. Carolina's tournament hopes on basically hinging on this game barring some sort of ACC tournament miracle. But I have a weird feeling that GT is going to come out slow and just go through the motions. I do not want UNC to get another win and gain any kind of confidence, but a win tonight could do just that.

[CDu]

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Shumpert lost his mind, especially from 3 in first half that last game, and he hasn't shot that well from beyond the arc since. But at the same time, Favors nor Lawal had the kind of games you would expect. I reall think this is going to be an intersting game for many different reasons. You know how GT likes to bang also, so look for this one to get a little pushy. (Couldn't think of a better word to describe contact, but I'm sick hearing that it's getting "chippy".)

Yeah, that's another point of concern. GT's bigs like to bang/push/shove. If the officials "let them play," then GT should win comfortably. If the officials call a tight game (like we saw at Duke), then GT's bigs could get in foul trouble. If Favors and Lawal are in serious foul trouble, I think UNC has a chance to get the upset. Hopefully the GT bigs can stay out of foul trouble.

[blueprofessor]

GT is the play here, easily. GT is 12-1 at home with wins over Duke, Clemson, and Wake. Their sole home loss was Florida State - in overtime, and on December 20th. Carolina is 1-6 on the road, including a 19 point loss at Clemson and a 21 point loss at Maryland. In both Carolina's lone road win, against N.C. State, and their near loss to GT at home, Ed Davis went for 12 points and 9/8 rebounds. On paper, there is virtually no way Carolina stays in this game.

...whose winning percentage at Tech is about 54%.
He just may find a way.:D

Best--Blueprofessor:)

[oldnavy]

GT should win this game by double figures. They have the advantage at every position... they just need to play like it.

[Chitowndevil]

...whose winning percentage at Tech is about 54%.
He just may find a way.:D

Best--Blueprofessor:)

Oh, I am no fan of Hewitt as a game coach. But I really do struggle to find any rationale for picking UNC in this game.

BTW the current title of this thread, "UNC-CH (-5.5)..." implies that Carolina is favored by 5.5 points. I am assuming this is not the case (if it is, I have a few calls to make).

[left_hook_lacey]

Oh, I am no fan of Hewitt as a game coach. But I really do struggle to find any rationale for picking UNC in this game.

BTW the current title of this thread, "UNC-CH (-5.5)..." implies that Carolina is favored by 5.5 points. I am assuming this is not the case (if it is, I have a few calls to make).

I had originally titled it something like, Carolina @ GT tonight. Who wants it most?"

I think the mods changed it. Maybe my thread title wasn't protocol?

[uncwdevil]

I won't rest easy about UNC until they get their 10th loss in the ACC and get knocked out of the ACCT.

Here's hoping they pick up number 8 tonight.

Seems like GT should control this game, but Hewitt is their coach and they aren't exactly the most disciplined team in the world...

[RoyalBlue08]

You would need to give me about 8 or 9 pts before I would consider Carolina. GT's got better players, is at home, and has more to play for.

[Greg_Newton]

You would need to give me about 8 or 9 pts before I would consider Carolina. GT's got better players, is at home, and has more to play for.

That may be, but you can't ignore how strong Carolina's chairs are.

[GODUKEGO]

Carolina looks like a good High School team. The 14 turnovers with 2 minutes left in the first half have got to be giving Roy and ulcer.

[Newton_14]

Tech's playing bad and kerlina is playing worse.. very ragged game thus far.. kerlina is lucky to only be down 10..

[arnie]

Henson may have the worst skills for a "can't miss" recruit I've ever seen. No ability to hit inside shots further than 8-inches away from the basket, can't really handle the ball and his free throws are laughablly off line. I love it!

[SupaDave]

Anyone else notice that Hewitt took the names off the backs of the jerseys?

[arnie]

Anyone else notice that Hewitt took the names off the backs of the jerseys?

I wondered about that - noticed it and couldn't remember if they had done it before?

[GODUKEGO]

Could not agree more. His range is a dunk!!

[borodevil16]

How many times can Henson throw the ball of one of his teammates heads for a turnover? So far.....2

[Newton_14]

Anyone else notice that Hewitt took the names off the backs of the jerseys?

I noticed that as well. Thought maybe they were wearing throwback jersey's or something? Or is he sending a message....

[msdukie]

Anyone else notice that Hewitt took the names off the backs of the jerseys?

They are wearing the 1960 throwback again tonight.

[GODUKEGO]

15 turnovers in the half...

[Indoor66]

Carolina on a 1 point run and cut the lead to 20. Almost half time - 41 - 21 GT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

[Newton_14]

Carolina on a 1 point run and cut the lead to 20. Almost half time - 41 - 21 GT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

21 points, 15 TO's. A top 10 team would have them down 30+ the way they played that half. They are in terrible foul trouble too. Thompson has 3, Strickland has 3, Wear has 3. Could get a lot uglier in the 2nd half if GT plays decently.

And the odd thing is they did a really good job on Lawal in that half. He only scored 3 points.

[arnie]

Carolina on a 1 point run and cut the lead to 20. Almost half time - 41 - 21 GT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

If not for the truly pitiful pack of nstate - the Heels would have one ACC win this year. Bring back the Doh!

[jv001]

unc is just a terrible team this year. They play a helter-skelter style bb(if that's a style). Seen better high school teams. The best thing about it is ole roy's look on the bench. I wonder if Shumpert is in Hewitt's doghouse? Not much action tonight. Go Duke!

[roywhite]

unc is just a terrible team this year. They play a helter-skelter style bb(if that's a style). Seen better high school teams. The best thing about it is ole roy's look on the bench. I wonder if Shumpert is in Hewitt's doghouse? Not much action tonight. Go Duke!

Prediction for tonight:

The defending National Champs will lose to a long-time rival on the road, and the fans there will not rush the court at the end. Some may even leave early to beat the traffic since the game will be decided well before the end.

This may be the worst I've seen the Heels look since the 8-20 season (or it may be worse than that).

Lousy shooting, bad ball handling, bad defense, just totally clueless.

[jv001]

If I were ole roy, this team would make me cry. drew gets into the lane and can't hit a basket, throws it away or a player fumbles it out of bounds. Go Duke!

[OldSchool]

That may be, but you can't ignore how strong Carolina's chairs are.

Ol' Roy might want to put the chairs out on the court and leave the players on the sidelines. The chairs would probably take better care of the ball.

[arnie]

The IC board is great tonight - GT game thread - much more fun than this board.

[Greg_Newton]

I love watching Henson. I think he'll become a very effective player in a bizarre kind of way, but right now he's just such a strange specimen of a human being that doesn't really know how to play basketball very well. He's so obscenely long that he ends up doing good things sometimes, but you just never know what you're going to get when he tries to do things with his body.

[OldSchool]

If Thompson picks up another foul early in the second half and has to sit it could get really, really ugly for the holes.

[Cameron]

Anyone have a link to a Triangle stream of this game? Our games are always found on ESPN the Triangle, but apparently Carolina's are not. Weird.

Any help is appreciated. I'd like to listen the Heels slow death while watching Kentucky, hopefully, stumble in Starkville.

[Newton_14]

If Thompson picks up another foul early in the second half and has to sit it could get really, really ugly for the holes.

No need to wait for the foul. The genius coach they have just sat Thompson at the 17:00 minute mark to get Wear in....

[jv001]

I hate watching players like Rice that loaf on defense and then reach in. Then they look at the ref with a what did I do look. If I was coaching against GT, I'd go right at that guy. Go Duke!

[Newton_14]

Anyone have a link to a Triangle stream of this game? Our games are always found on ESPN the Triangle, but apparently Carolina's are not. Weird.

Any help is appreciated. I'd like to listen the Heels slow death while watching Kentucky, hopefully, stumble in Starkville.

Go to Raycom.com. They normally stream the games they are airing.

Here is the link to the game: http://raycom.swarmcast.com/login/id/764EEEE21A4611DF9FED003048C1E168

[moonpie23]

Anyone have a link to a Triangle stream of this game? Our games are always found on ESPN the Triangle, but apparently Carolina's are not. Weird.

Any help is appreciated. I'd like to listen the Heels slow death while watching Kentucky, hopefully, stumble in Starkville.

http://atdhe.net/index.html

[ChicagoHeel]

Oh, this is just awful. It's one thing to watch the Heels struggle against teams that are good or playing well, but GT is playing poorly and still doubling us up.

[IBleedBlue]

It was funny how some posters on IC were talking about a impending turnaround from this UNC team after their win over state. They were giving all sorts of reasons like... by law of averages, their guards are due for a strong shooting night; if they could contain Lawal and Iman, no one on gtech team could score...
really...this to me is optimism to the extent of being silly and funny...

[roywhite]

I love watching Henson. I think he'll become a very effective player in a bizarre kind of way, but right now he's just such a strange specimen of a human being that doesn't really know how to play basketball very well. He's so obscenely long that he ends up doing good things sometimes, but you just never know what you're going to get when he tries to do things with his body.

Watch him play defense inside. He's putting both hands on the Tech offensive players and pushing them; the refs apparently feel sorry for him being overmatched physically and aren't bothering to call fouls.

I don't think UNC will get to 50 points this game, and I'm wondering if they'll make 40 points.

[Cameron]

Thank you for the link, moonpie.

[Cameron]

Thanks for your advice, too, Boozer. But I'd rather watch this walk to the non-Tournament happen:)

[weezie]

It was funny how some posters on IC were talking about a impending turnaround from this UNC team after their win over state.

Ugh, I had to have dinner with a couple of hole fans Sat night after their uber-triumph over state. The holes were simply giddy with joy, almost to the point of needing a slap to snap out of it. I hope gtech can deliver a resounding belt to the chops.

[DevilHorns]

Oh, this is just awful. It's one thing to watch the Heels struggle against teams that are good or playing well, but GT is playing poorly and still doubling us up.

Got to give you credit for being a true Heels fan and still watching the game. Most of the Heels I know have long switched channels.

[Cameron]

Got to give you credit for being a true Heels fan and still watching the game. Most of the Heels I know have long switched channels.


That's more admirable than some of my Heel "fan" friends. They've switched teams.

[jv001]

Well they caught henson with one of his pushes. Will the heels hit the 40pt mark? Go Duke!

[superdave]

That's more admirable than some of my Heel "fan" friends. They've switched teams.

Most unc fans I know of deny 8-20 ever happened. It most definitely happened, just like how we'll look back and see that 15-16 happened in 2010!

[CameronBlue]

Got to give you credit for being a true Heels fan and still watching the game. Most of the Heels I know have long switched channels.

There's this nice little Frontline documentary on the airline industry on PBS you can watch...I recommend adult diapers for either..

[OldSchool]

I would say this might end up being the worst defeat in the Roy Williams era, except that Tech seems to get sloppier as the game wears on.

[Newton_14]

Thanks for your advice, too, Boozer. But I'd rather watch this walk to the non-Tournament happen:)

Are the Raycom streams bad? I have never watched a game there just knew that they streamed games. Sorry if I sent you to them if their streaming is poor.

[dukemsu]

It is simply amazing that Carolina is this bad.

They are absolutely awful.

dukemsu

[weezie]

There's this nice little Frontline documentary on the airline industry on PBS you can watch...I recommend adult diapers for either..

:D:D:D Ol'huck might be needing a pacifier and some dipes after this one....

[Cameron]

Boozer:

Oh, no. You're fine. My mistake. I read your first post too quickly and thought you were talking about a radio stream.

I'm not sure about Raycom, but ATDHE online works pretty well. Which is good because I haven't been able to get justin.tv to work well recently.

This Carolina action is GREAT!

[snowdenscold]

I like the IC comment:

"i still say we shave [Hansblahblah's] head and try to pass him off as a wear twin."

[strawbs]

LDII has 8 to's with 9 minutes still to play. With the hatred I have for carolina i hope he hits double figures and the heels lose by 40. To unc's TRUE fans i do actually feel sorry for them this season. No one should have to watch a team play so poorly and underachieve so much.

[AlaskanAssassin]

If only tech made their free throws!

[strawbs]

don't know how this works, but i just checked the box score of the game on espn for the first time since my last post. I was hoping LDII would have gotten two more to's to get him into double digits, but they actually took two of his away and credited him with 6. Disappointing!

[RainingThrees]

UNC losses again, pleasantly this is not a surprise and has become the norm this season. Final score was 68 to 51 Ga Tech. It could have been worse if tech didn't let off the gas, final score could have been 10 more points for the jackets.

[sagegrouse]

don't know how this works, but i just checked the box score of the game on espn for the first time since my last post. I was hoping LDII would have gotten two more to's to get him into double digits, but they actually took two of his away and credited him with 6. Disappointing!


One reason is that the boxscore was the halftime score, which is still up -- even though the game ended a few minutes ago.

sagegrouse

[OldSchool]

I would bet UNC at Wake Forest is going to be a slaughter the likes of which Ol' Roy has never seen. I can see the holes getting up for and playing us tough in the last game, but I will be very surprised if UNC brings it against Wake. And if they don't, Wake will have no mercy.

[dukelifer]

I am surprised by how poorly they played. Roy will have nothing to say-he may be done with these guys after tonight.

[RainingThrees]

I would bet UNC at Wake Forest is going to be a slaughter the likes of which Ol' Roy has never seen. I can see the holes getting up for and playing us tough in the last game, but I will be very surprised if UNC brings it against Wake. And if they don't, Wake will have no mercy.

With all my heart I hope you're right!!!! I hope Wake breaks the Holes spirits so bad that they don't even get up for us and we give them a thrashing that will be talked about for years to come. Wake will go to town on that weak and diminished frontcourt.

[alteran]

Got to give you credit for being a true Heels fan and still watching the game. Most of the Heels I know have long switched channels.

And hanging out here. Seriously ChicagoHeel, kudos. Your intestinal fortitude is amazing.

[alteran]

Wow. The heels up and quit in the first half. I'm just shaking my head.

These guys may have gotten used to losing, and found out that they don't mind it so much.

[roywhite]

Wow. The heels up and quit in the first half. I'm just shaking my head.

These guys may have gotten used to losing, and found out that they don't mind it so much.

Coach Roy has "lost" this team.

Actually, this happens sometimes even to great coaches. I follow Penn State football closely and I know Joe Paterno has admitted that he "lost" teams in two seasons. The players and coach can't seem to get on the same wavelength.

Doesn't mean they won't be good next year, but this year's model is broken.

[jipops]

Coach Roy has "lost" this team.

Actually, this happens sometimes even to great coaches. I follow Penn State football closely and I know Joe Paterno has admitted that he "lost" teams in two seasons. The players and coach can't seem to get on the same wavelength.

Doesn't mean they won't be good next year, but this year's model is broken.

And no one seems to be more lost than Ginyard. What has been going on with this guy this season? Though not a great player, he's got a very nice offensive game and is a defensive stalwart as well as a 5th year senior. Yet tonight was another poor showing going 0-2 from the floor. I know he has been nagged by some injuries, but this just seems like a guy Roy lost a long time ago.

[CDu]

And no one seems to be more lost than Ginyard. What has been going on with this guy this season? Though not a great player, he's got a very nice offensive game and is a defensive stalwart as well as a 5th year senior. Yet tonight was another poor showing going 0-2 from the floor. I know he has been nagged by some injuries, but this just seems like a guy Roy lost a long time ago.

This is the key. He actually has a very limited offensive game. He can hit wide open set shots, but he can't do much of anything off the dribble and can't create for others.

Ginyard was a perfect role player for the good UNC teams. He could defend on the perimeter could run with Lawson and get fast break buckets, and would occasionally hit an open 3. But he was never asked to do anything of substance offensively. This year, the bar was set higher, and he just hasn't been able to reach it.

I also suspect that his confidence is shot by virtue of struggling in the expanded role, which is compounding the problem.

[CameronBornAndBred]

It is simply amazing that Carolina is this bad.

They are absolutely awful.

dukemsu
They are almost taking the joy out of relishing their misery. Almost.:D

[duke4life32182]

I love it.

[whereinthehellami]

I DVRd it last night. Looking forward to watching the game tonight. An appetizer to the Duke game. UNC basketball is like watching a sitcom with Roy and Henson as the main characters. Kind of like Dumb and Dumber meets the White Shadow.

[davekay1971]

That was a spectacular game for the first half. In the second half, you could tell that Tech didn't even care that much any more...they knew they could take the foot off the gas, because this sorry Tarhole team didn't have enough fight to possibly mount a comeback.

In the second half my wife and I started flipping back and forth between the Olympics and the Tech game. The Olympics featured men's figure skating...which got me thinking: who would win in a pickup game: the 2009-2010 UNC Men's Basketball team, or a pick 5 of men's figure skaters? I'm willing to bet the figure skaters would play harder and outmuscle Carolina on the boards...

[CameronBornAndBred]

I'm willing to bet the figure skaters would play harder and outmuscle Carolina on the boards...
If the holes are playing in their blue uni's, then the figure skaters would also look more manly.

[ChicagoCrazy84]

This is pretty funny and to think they were actually preseason top 5!!

Has their ever been a team that was preseason top 5 and ended up not making the field of 65? I am assuming Carolina won't be makin any kind of miralce run.

[gumbomoop]

And no one seems to be more lost than Ginyard. What has been going on with this guy this season?.... [T]his just seems like a guy Roy lost a long time ago.

Snowball effect, all bad: (1) More nagging injuries, which have made him a shadow of his former self on D. (2) Role player asked to do more than he's anywhere near capable of on O. (3) Either couldn't, or didn't, provide vet leadership to talented-but-flawed new guys. (4) Most important, IMO, as things started to go south, Ginyard got hit with "what-might-have-been-itis," specifically, his lost NC year. His buddies got their NC, and he missed out. Mentally/emotionally/psychologically he's in a nightmare.

I wonder whether he'd get a bit more sympathy here, had he not made disparaging, if vague, comments preseason re unnamed Devils.

[RepoMan]

I wonder whether he'd get a bit more sympathy here, had he not made disparaging, if vague, comments preseason re unnamed Devils.

No Sympathy Ever

[CDu]

Snowball effect, all bad: (1) More nagging injuries, which have made him a shadow of his former self on D. (2) Role player asked to do more than he's anywhere near capable of on O. (3) Either couldn't, or didn't, provide vet leadership to talented-but-flawed new guys. (4) Most important, IMO, as things started to go south, Ginyard got hit with "what-might-have-been-itis," specifically, his lost NC year. His buddies got their NC, and he missed out. Mentally/emotionally/psychologically he's in a nightmare.

I think this sums it up, although I think that talent is the biggest factor. He was just never good enough offensively to be anything more than the 5th/6th guy on the team. Asking him to lead the team was probably too much.

But all of the things you list probably are playing a role. Along with (4), I'd add (4a): he's a fifth-year senior whose classmates all left. The last three years were basically the same group of guys hanging together. This year, he and Thompson are the "old men" on a team with an entirely different personality. That's tough as well.

[roywhite]

Ginyard was a perfect role player for the good UNC teams. He could defend on the perimeter could run with Lawson and get fast break buckets, and would occasionally hit an open 3. But he was never asked to do anything of substance offensively. This year, the bar was set higher, and he just hasn't been able to reach it.

I also suspect that his confidence is shot by virtue of struggling in the expanded role, which is compounding the problem.

Same type deal for Deon Thompson. As a 4th or 5th option on last year's team, he was pretty effective; could score around the basket, convert some good passes from Lawson, and get some rebounds. Now, he doesn't have as much room to operate; he doesn't create his own shot very well and the guards aren't getting the ball to him much anyway.

Nor is he a vocal guy who is looked at as a leader. So the senior class of UNC (Thompson and Ginyard) vs the senior class of Duke (Scheyer, Lance, and Zoubs all stepping up in a major way) is a total mismatch in Duke's favor.

[OldPhiKap]

Ginyard = Jason Capel. Deon Thompson = Kris Lang. Good complimentary players; not go-to guys who can carry the load of the team.

That's not a slam by the way -- they is simply being asked to fill a role they are not currently capable of handling.

[-bdbd]

Best parallel is that Duke '95 season. After years of dominance, a very steep and sudden drop-off. Their fans have long held that over our heads -- attributing a (ridiculous assertion of a K meltdown over a terrible team). Kinda funny to see ole Roy's various meltdowns THIS year (as an actual result of their performance apparently). It shows you his capabilities when confronted with merely "good" talent... Never forget that there are a bunch of Parade and McD AA's on this Kerlina squad. So, what's the problem...Roy??

BTW, my favorie moment in the game last night vs GT was with 5 minutes to go in the first half, on TV, during a pause in the action, they are panning at court level across the court and zooming in on a arms-folded, sorta sour-looking Roy, as GT is starting to pull away (12 point margin at that juncture). And the announcer just happens to start into one of their promo spots.... "Want to get away? Well, Southwest Airline is having a promotion..." I almost spit out the beverage I was drinking on seeing that! :eek:

[left_hook_lacey]

And no one seems to be more lost than Ginyard. What has been going on with this guy this season? Though not a great player, he's got a very nice offensive game and is a defensive stalwart as well as a 5th year senior. Yet tonight was another poor showing going 0-2 from the floor. I know he has been nagged by some injuries, but this just seems like a guy Roy lost a long time ago.

I had wondered how Ginyard's season would go this year. Deep down I wondered if he would feel like "his" team is gone, and feel a little out of place on this team. I mean, he was housemates with Hasnbrough and Bobby Frasor.

It has to be as frustrating for Ginyard as it is for Williams.

Ginyard has played in this system for 5 years now, you have to think he could play in this offense/defense with his eyes closed. He's played with it hitting on all cylinders with the likes of Hansbrough, Lawson, and Ellington surrounding him all the way to the pinnacle of college basketball. He probably feels like his Caddillac's in the shop, and they gave him a Hyundai that spits and sputters as a rental.

He probably knows where everyone is supposed to be on the floor at any time, and with this group, he probably looks around during any particular play and goes "damn!", what the hell are they doing. Same story on defense.

Ginyard has never been an offensive juggernaut, so the added pressure to score is not helping him any. I feel sorry for the guy a little. He's been plagued by injuries his whole career, so the NCAA gives him an extra year, and this awkward, sloppy, Carolina team is his reward. Gotta feel for the guy a little.

[CDu]

Ginyard = Jason Capel. Good complimentary player; not a go-to guy who can carry the load of the team.

That's not a slam by the way -- he is simply being asked to fill a role he is not currently capable of handling.

I don't think that's a really fair comparison for Capel. He was a top-level recruit. Capel also was a much better player than Ginyard. And as a senior, he averaged 15.6 pts, 8.6 rebounds, 3 assists per game as a senior.

Capel's problem was that he was on a team with so little talent around him. His team as a senior was as follows:
Kris Lang: best-suited to be a third big
Jawad Williams: role player, and was only a freshman
Capel
Brian Morrison: freshman gunner with no conscious, minimal defense, and minimal shooting skill
Adam Boone: freshman, not an ACC-caliber PG
Melvin Scott: freshman, limited offensive player
Jackie Manual: freshman, no offensive game
Brian Bersticker: not an ACC-caliber big guy
Will Johnson: walk-on, not an ACC-caliber player

Capel was asked to carry a team with minimal talent and even less experience. He put up very solid numbers on a team that just had no chance of winning. Ginyard is putting up very mediocre numbers on a team with a lot more talent.

[alteran]

Coach Roy has "lost" this team.

Actually, this happens sometimes even to great coaches. I follow Penn State football closely and I know Joe Paterno has admitted that he "lost" teams in two seasons. The players and coach can't seem to get on the same wavelength.

Doesn't mean they won't be good next year, but this year's model is broken.

But a man can dream, no? :D

Realistically, there's no WAY they'll be anything like this bad next year. The UNC seniors are no great loss, and the returning guys have GOT to improve. Someone in next year's freshman class, probably H Barnes, will emerge as a go to guy-- a key thing they're missing.

The other key thing they're missing is a great point guard. During Roy's tenure, he's always had an NBA-calibre, top-flight, freakishly fast, break-down-defenses kind of point guard (Felton/Lawson).

He doesn't have one of those now, and he doesn't appear to be getting one next year.

A man can dream...

[allenmurray]

Best parallel is that Duke '95 season. After years of dominance, a very steep and sudden drop-off. Their fans have long held that over our heads -- attributing a (ridiculous assertion of a K meltdown over a terrible team). Kinda funny to see ole Roy's various meltdowns THIS year (as an actual result of their performance apparently). It shows you his capabilities when confronted with merely "good" talent... Never forget that there are a bunch of Parade and McD AA's on this Kerlina squad. So, what's the problem...Roy??

Even with that parallel there is an important difference - the '95 Duke team didn't give up. Despite the 13 - 18 overall record (2 - 14 in conference) the team fought. Those 14 conferences losses include two losses to Maryland by 2 points each, two losses to Florida State by a total of 8 points, a 2 point OT loss to UNC, a 1 point loss to Wake forest, and a 5 point loss to NCSU (8 losses by a total of 20 points). The team was bad, and had a horrible record, but they fought every game. This unc team simply does not care anymore.

[roywhite]

Way back in November, I noticed that this UNC team was not a very good team. I predicted they would lose 10+ games, but never would I have imagined that they would be this bad. I think injuries do have to factor into the dismal season, but in reality they were not that good before Zeller and Davis got hurt.
What I could not see coming was Roy's total ineptitude at handling this team. You could not have drawn up a better plan to mishandle the talent he has. He berated them publically when they needed confidence the most, he continued a helter-skelter substitution pattern when they needed stability and familiarity with each other, he refused to mix up the starting line-up when it was obvious to everyone that a change was needed and he continued to try and run a Lamborghini offense with a Hyundai motor under the hood. Perhaps the worst of all, he tried to portray himself as some poor victim in the wake of his "catastrophic" season.
Is there an award for the "worst" coach of the year because he would win hands down. Best of all, I do not think that he even realizes that he has failed… I know he cries and weeps about how he has to do better and all, but then with the next breath he goes and throws a player or two under the bus… I LOVE IT SO!


Some good points.

Not to make light of actual loss like death (Haiti, for example!), but the Kubler-Ross model of grief lists stages of:

Denial
Anger
Bargaining
Depression
Acceptance

You've described behaviors by Roy that fit into some of these stages. If you watched the UNC/Tech game last night with shots of Roy on the bench, he looked to be somewhere toward steps #4 and #5.

[ice-9]

There was a thread some time back that asked what we'd rather have...a few seasons of excellence but no real post-season success, or up and down seasons that include a national championship and some bad ones.

At first, I thought, easy, I'd take the the national championship season followed by a down year...but man, it sucks to be a UNC fan right now.

Which is better? UNC's 08-09 and 09-10 seasons, or Duke's?

I guess the answer for me depends on how far we get this season. It would suck to get the #1 seed and not advance past the Sweet 16.

[oldnavy]

Some good points.

Not to make light of actual loss like death (Haiti, for example!), but the Kubler-Ross model of grief lists stages of:

Denial
Anger
Bargaining
Depression
Acceptance

You've described behaviors by Roy that fit into some of these stages. If you watched the UNC/Tech game last night with shots of Roy on the bench, he looked to be somewhere toward steps #4 and #5.

I think the crazies should get a t-shirt made that says "Got Tissues?" as a pun on the "Got Roy" t-shirts seen worn by the UNC faithful...

[gumbomoop]

I think this sums it up, although I think that talent is the biggest factor. He was just never good enough offensively to be anything more than the 5th/6th guy on the team. Asking him to lead the team was probably too much.

But all of the things you list probably are playing a role. Along with (4), I'd add (4a): he's a fifth-year senior whose classmates all left. The last three years were basically the same group of guys hanging together. This year, he and Thompson are the "old men" on a team with an entirely different personality. That's tough as well.

Yes, as you and left hook lacey [post #90] note, these young fellows are next generation, in more ways than one, from Ginyard's fellow '09 senior mates, plus vet juniors Ellington and Lawson. I'll just reemphasize that his mates finished with the perfect-ending NC. In some thread [possibly earlier in this one!], someone said that by the NCAAT last year, Ginyard was healthy. The NC it must have been bittersweet for him, for he must have agonized over his [was it his?] decision to take the medical redshirt.

The agony has become palpable for him this season. His perfect '08-'09 senior season was close enough to perfect, but wasn't his. And now his 5th-year senior season is real close to hellish.

Roy really needs to quit feeling sorry for Roy, and think seriously about helping Ginyard, much more than Thompson. Thompson won a NC.

[airowe]

I started to feel bad for the heels when I saw they only had 21 at halftime. Then I just started uncontrollably laughing at what an absolute joke and disaster their season has been.

GTHC. GTH.

[roywhite]

Roy really needs to quit feeling sorry for Roy, and think seriously about helping Ginyard, much more than Thompson. Thompson won a NC.

We make fun of Roy and enjoy the Tarheels' plight, but this really is a test of character for Roy as the rest of the season plays out. The fall from the top has been devastating to him.

Roy is an outstanding coach who can learn from all this. I'd like to see him calm down and try to project a positive, constructive attitude toward his team.

This is not to say that I would like a late-season UNC turnaround. I hope they continue to lose. :)

[BD80]

I think the crazies should get a t-shirt made that says "Got Tissues?" as a pun on the "Got Roy" t-shirts seen worn by the UNC faithful...

This is too easy. They have "Got Roy" t-shirts?

We give them "Got Roids?" tishirts ...

http://tidedruid.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/roy-williams.jpg

[allenmurray]

this really is a test of character for Roy as the rest of the season plays out.

You are correct that this season is a test of character for him.


Roy is an outstanding coach who can learn from all this. I'd like to see him calm down and try to project a positive, constructive attitude toward his team.

And whether or not he does that will show if he "passes the test". What we have seen so far is erratic behavior and casting blame on a bunch of teenagers, rather than shouldering the blame himself in order to take the pressure off the kids.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Roy is an outstanding coach who can learn from all this. I'd like to see him calm down and try to project a positive, constructive attitude toward his team.

Like "Can't wait for Harrison Barnes to come to here next year!" or "When you [Ginyard, Thompson] leave, it'll be addition by subtraction!" or "At least my players have a 3.0 GPA average!" (okay, that last one would never happen...)

In all seriousness, there is unfortunately very little to be positive about. Of course, you can say "they tried really hard," "they're a great team," of use K's patented "I love this team."

[wilson]

He probably feels like his Caddillac's in the shop, and they gave him a Hyundai that spits and sputters as a rental.Small nit to pick here: Hyundais are among the best cars out there these days, with high quality ratings (and getting higher). They've consistently hovered in or near the top five nameplates in measures like problems per 100 vehicles for about five years now. They also are churning out a very good-looking product these days (the Genesis is just a finely designed automobile). On top of this, their quality is backed by an industry-best warranty.
Cadillacs are rebadged Chevrolets.
:p

[Richard Berg]

If the holes are playing in their blue uni's, then the figure skaters would also look more manly.

[giggle]

[BD80]

We make fun of Roy and enjoy the Tarheels' plight, but this really is a test of character for Roy as the rest of the season plays out. The fall from the top has been devastating to him.

Roy is an outstanding coach who can learn from all this. I'd like to see him calm down and try to project a positive, constructive attitude toward his team.

This is not to say that I would like a late-season UNC turnaround. I hope they continue to lose. :)

Roy has been weighed, Roy has been measured, and Roy has been found wanting.

This carolina team s-s-s-s-sucks. It is just awful. And yet it has SO much talent. Imagine what a good coach would do with this team. Coach K would be much criticized for using a short bench, but he would have them valuing the ball, playing defense and rebounding, and at the top of the conference standings. Bennett, Gaudio or Greenberg would have them over .500 in the conference. Haith or Skinner wouldn't be losing like this.

Better question, which ACC coach would be doing this poorly with this team?

Sorry, an outstanding coach wouldn't be 3-9 in 2010 (winless in last 10 but for NCState).

[dukeimac]

Like "Can't wait for Harrison Barnes to come to here next year!" or "When you [Ginyard, Thompson] leave, it'll be addition by subtraction!" or "At least my players have a 3.0 GPA average!" (okay, that last one would never happen...)

In all seriousness, there is unfortunately very little to be positive about. Of course, you can say "they tried really hard," "they're a great team," of use K's patented "I love this team."

And what happens if Davis goes?

UNC should be going through what Duke has been going through. Without some veteran leadership they should be struggling like Duke did the past 3 years. After Sheldon and JJ left they didn't have anyone who picked up the torch but they still won. UNC should be in the same shoes. They should look good but not great. I believe the colors are shinning through from ol' Roy.

I give my UNC friends a bad time about those "pretty baby blue' uniforms and they look "pretty on the girls team." They get made but not manly. LOL

[airowe]

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/9717/lostseason.jpg

[Duvall]

Roy has been weighed, Roy has been measured, and Roy has been found wanting.

This carolina team s-s-s-s-sucks. It is just awful. And yet it has SO much talent. Imagine what a good coach would do with this team. Coach K would be much criticized for using a short bench, but he would have them valuing the ball, playing defense and rebounding, and at the top of the conference standings. Bennett, Gaudio or Greenberg would have them over .500 in the conference. Haith or Skinner wouldn't be losing like this.

Better question, which ACC coach would be doing this poorly with this team?


Hewitt.

Gary would also have this UNC team near the top of the standings, though I'm not sure he could survive a season of Drew II turnovers.

[sagegrouse]

Coach K would be much criticized for using a short bench, but he would have them valuing the ball, playing defense and rebounding, and at the top of the conference standings. Bennett, Gaudio or Greenberg would have them over .500 in the conference. Haith or Skinner wouldn't be losing like this.

Better question, which ACC coach would be doing this poorly with this team?



Based on his performance last night in drop-kicking a sure win, I vote for Dino Gaudio of Wake Forest. I think he handed out coaching Valium in the locker room. The Deacs ran only one play in the second half -- Ish Smith free-lancing. Even Seth's guys know how to play defense when the offense is totally limited.

sagegrouse

[CameronBornAndBred]

Best parallel is that Duke '95 season. After years of dominance, a very steep and sudden drop-off. Their fans have long held that over our heads -- attributing a (ridiculous assertion of a K meltdown over a terrible team).
I see what your comparing, but I think it ends at the team performances. In '95, Duke got worse after K left, showing the value of his coaching to everyone. This year, Carolina has gotten worse with Roy leading the downhill charge (by his own admission), showing the value of Roy's coaching to everyone.

[uh_no]

with north carolina's loss last night they are now officially eliminated from ACC contention.

Our magic number remains at 5. also elimated are bc, miami, and ncsu

[flyingdutchdevil]

I see what your comparing, but I think it ends at the team performances. In '95, Duke got worse after K left, showing the value of his coaching to everyone. This year, Carolina has gotten worse with Roy leading the downhill charge (by his own admission), showing the value of Roy's coaching to everyone.

Are you assuming that Roy is a bad coach? Are we stooping to the level of IC?

[Indoor66]

Are you assuming that Roy is a bad coach? Are we stooping to the level of IC?

Or is there a recognition of a demonstrated reality?

[jdj4duke]

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/9717/lostseason.jpg

Post of the year!

[flyingdutchdevil]

Post of the year!

Wait a second, wait a second!!!

There is no way that Henson has THAT much muscle.

[Devilsfan]

Maybe I'm wrong but a good coach adapts his playing style to the players on his roster. It's easier to play an up and down game when you have three first round NBA players on your squad. This year is the true test, imo, of Ol' Roys ability as a coach and I think if not failing he has a D+ average.

[shoutingncu]

I DVRd it last night. Looking forward to watching the game tonight. An appetizer to the Duke game. UNC basketball is like watching a sitcom with Roy and Henson as the main characters. Kind of like Dumb and Dumber meets the White Shadow.

I liked this movie better when Bill Murray and Andie McDowell starred...

[shoutingncu]

He [Ginyard] probably knows where everyone is supposed to be on the floor at any time, and with this group, he probably looks around during any particular play and goes "damn!", what the hell are they doing. Same story on defense.

And that's why he dribbles off his foot?

[CameronBornAndBred]

Are you assuming that Roy is a bad coach? Are we stooping to the level of IC?
Nope..I'm not assuming it, I'm flat out stating it. He might be great with X's and O's, but when a coach says he questions his own confidence publicly (he said this back in January), and then proceeds to lose control of his team, he is not performing a good coaching job, or even a moderate coaching job.

[Matches]

Yes, as you and left hook lacey [post #90] note, these young fellows are next generation, in more ways than one, from Ginyard's fellow '09 senior mates, plus vet juniors Ellington and Lawson. I'll just reemphasize that his mates finished with the perfect-ending NC. In some thread [possibly earlier in this one!], someone said that by the NCAAT last year, Ginyard was healthy. The NC it must have been bittersweet for him, for he must have agonized over his [was it his?] decision to take the medical redshirt.

The agony has become palpable for him this season. His perfect '08-'09 senior season was close enough to perfect, but wasn't his. And now his 5th-year senior season is real close to hellish.



This is almost exactly what Tim Brando said on Charlotte talk radio this week. He cited a source close to the team who said that Ginyard deeply regretted redshirting last season and really does not want to be there. He also said that Ed Davis has been "playing to not get hurt" (and he noted the irony), and suggested that those guys' attitude has filtered down to the rest of the team.

At this point it's fairly apparent they've quit, and most of the UNC fans I know have given up on this year as well. It'll be interesting to see if Roy is able to pull it back together next year with a lot of the same guys (minus Ginyard, Thompson and probably Davis).

[OldPhiKap]

Maybe I'm wrong but a good coach adapts his playing style to the players on his roster. It's easier to play an up and down game when you have three first round NBA players on your squad. This year is the true test, imo, of Ol' Roys ability as a coach and I think if not failing he has a D+ average.

I can fit this square peg into the round hole, dagnammit.

[shoutingncu]

There was a thread some time back that asked what we'd rather have...a few seasons of excellence but no real post-season success, or up and down seasons that include a national championship and some bad ones.

At first, I thought, easy, I'd take the the national championship season followed by a down year...but man, it sucks to be a UNC fan right now.

Which is better? UNC's 08-09 and 09-10 seasons, or Duke's?

I guess the answer for me depends on how far we get this season. It would suck to get the #1 seed and not advance past the Sweet 16.

This is always an interesting hypothetical...

This year has been compared to Duke '95 (barring the effort part). Let's not forget that '95 came in the midst of a five title game decade. How would you not take that knowing that the rebuilding to follow would lead to '99-'04?

Similarly, I can handle 8-20 when it dominoes into 2005 - 2009. I can only hope that this season has similar results.

I know it's easy to say, being on the losing side, but this season for Carolina is only as bad as the next few. There's no way to tell which way that will go. I agree that Roy has lost this team. My fear is that most of this team comes back... can he regain them? We're going to need Strickland and Henson, specifically, to be major contributors if we're going to turn it around next year. But if we get three years out of Henson and two out of Barnes, my optimism has me hoping we won't be talking much about 2010 anymore.

Besides... Roy's just setting us all up for his NCOY campaign in 2011.

[wilko]

There's no way to tell which way that will go. I agree that Roy has lost this team. My fear is that most of this team comes back... can he regain them?

With all due respect, I hope not.

IMHO - This is the PERFECT way to celebrate 100yrs of UNC basketball. I'm crazy enuff to dream of another hundred JUST like it...

[striker219]

BTW, my favorie moment in the game last night vs GT was with 5 minutes to go in the first half, on TV, during a pause in the action, they are panning at court level across the court and zooming in on a arms-folded, sorta sour-looking Roy, as GT is starting to pull away (12 point margin at that juncture). And the announcer just happens to start into one of their promo spots.... "Want to get away? Well, Southwest Airline is having a promotion..." I almost spit out the beverage I was drinking on seeing that! :eek:

I choked on my dinner and almost sent food out my nose. That was so unbelievably awesome. If anyone has a recording of the game and can cut that clip out and post it up I would be eternally grateful.

[striker219]

I think the crazies should get a t-shirt made that says "Got Tissues?" as a pun on the "Got Roy" t-shirts seen worn by the UNC faithful...

At the very least someone needs to buy a bunch of boxes of tissues and hand them out to all of the crazies to wave at Roy and the kids.

[BD80]

... There's no way to tell which way that will go. I agree that Roy has lost this team. My fear is that most of this team comes back... can he regain them? ...

It is easy to figure out who is to blame for unc's horrible season, just wait and see who does NOT come back. Those will be the ones that ol' roy will blame when dealing with next year's team. The true value of Ginyard and Thompson (and Davis?) will be as next year's scape goats.

Question is, how willing are the remaining players to buy into the deception?

Here is where ol' roy's veneer can wear thin. The guys remaining should be smart enough to realize that they could be the next year's scape goats.

[SharkD]

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/9717/lostseason.jpg

Ginyard looks smashing in that low-cut spaghetti-strap tank top. And it's even the right color.

I heartily suggest that Carolina adopt that look for their uniforms for the rest of the season.

[Troublemaker]

My fear is that most of this team comes back...

I do expect some transfers this offseason (although I'm rooting for everyone to stay - can Ginyard get a 6th year of eligibility? Muahahaha).

[coachbob]

It really hit home with me last night while watching the Wake V Tech game. They showed V Tech's resume for getting into the NCAAT. Their only bad loss was to unc. Gotta love when losing to unc is embarassing!

[shoutingncu]

Gotta love when losing to unc is embarassing!

Welcome to the Wolfpack's world...

[OldPhiKap]

It really hit home with me last night while watching the Wake V Tech game. They showed V Tech's resume for getting into the NCAAT. Their only bad loss was to unc. Gotta love when losing to unc is embarassing!

Good times.

You also have to love that Bobby Cremins @ Charleston beat unc this year as well.

Poor 'Ol Roy. Meanwhile, Kansas is pretty good this year . . . .

[oldnavy]

Good times.

You also have to love that Bobby Cremins @ Charleston beat unc this year as well.

Poor 'Ol Roy. Meanwhile, Kansas is pretty good this year . . . .

Do you think our friends at Kansas are missing Roy? I bet not. I didn't realize, but Self has a better (slightly) winning percentage than Ol Roy did at KU...

[OldPhiKap]

Well, lessee --

1. we know that Roy "doesn't give a @#$% about UNC"

2. We know that he shows up to a KU Final Four game with a big 'ol Jayhawk emblem on his shirt.

3. We know he looks awkward in it, and the KU fans basically tell him to FU*.


So, all in all, I'd say that Roy pines for Kansas (much lower pressure) than KU fans pine for Roy (turncoat).




* Feel Uninvited

[gotham devil]

http://twitter.com/GTCoachDLaB

I'm not a huge fan of Coach K but his teams always play hard, tough, & with extreme pride in their program. That will win a lot of games
5:45 PM Feb 17th from web

[sagegrouse]

http://twitter.com/GTCoachDLaB

I'm not a huge fan of Coach K but his teams always play hard, tough, & with extreme pride in their program. That will win a lot of games
5:45 PM Feb 17th from web

I assumed this post -- which is interesting -- was just a "bump" to get the Tech-UNC score back on the front page.

sagegrouse

[left_hook_lacey]

Small nit to pick here: Hyundais are among the best cars out there these days, with high quality ratings (and getting higher). They've consistently hovered in or near the top five nameplates in measures like problems per 100 vehicles for about five years now. They also are churning out a very good-looking product these days (the Genesis is just a finely designed automobile). On top of this, their quality is backed by an industry-best warranty.
Cadillacs are rebadged Chevrolets.
:p

I was hoping no one would call me on that. :D