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CEF1959
10-29-2009, 03:19 PM
Josh Hairston has been interviewed about Kyrie Irving's commitment, and his comments were positive. But he and Tyler Thornton were on the same AAU team -- DC Assault -- and I haven't heard how Tyler is reacting to the news that Duke has a new star PG in his class. Anyone else heard anything or have any insights into this situation?

ScreechTDX1847
10-29-2009, 03:26 PM
My understanding is that Tyler has expressed he wants to play with the best players Duke can sign. Perhaps, I am wrong but I believe he has even talked to Kyrie before about it.

jimsumner
10-29-2009, 03:33 PM
Thornton committed to Duke knowing that Duke would recruit other point guards in his class. He has supported that decision with considerable enthusiasm.

ChicagoCrazy84
10-29-2009, 04:12 PM
Tyler was the one that tweeted to him saying he should come to Duke and "you know you want to." It is no big deal. He should actually be grateful so he can learn and grow with such a big time talent. He will learn a lot from Kyrie and once Ty is a junior or so, he will be getting tons of minutes.

ice-9
10-29-2009, 09:05 PM
He should actually be grateful so he can learn and grow with such a big time talent. He will learn a lot from Kyrie and once Ty is a junior or so, he will be getting tons of minutes.

That seems a little presumptious. How do you know Tyler isn't "smarter" from a basketball IQ point of view and simply lacks the physical gifts to be a five star recruit?

I'm sure at the end of the day both players will learn from each other, as they will from the upperclassmen, assistant coaches and of course Coach K himself.

Welcome2DaSlopes
10-29-2009, 10:18 PM
I think due to Ty ranking we don't think he's that good which is a shame. I think Ty is a potentionally great pg. Better then KI no but Ty is still gifted and is prob. a better floor general as well. Idk about you guys but i'm glad to be having Ty join us at duke next year.

ChicagoCrazy84
10-29-2009, 10:23 PM
That seems a little presumptious. How do you know Tyler isn't "smarter" from a basketball IQ point of view and simply lacks the physical gifts to be a five star recruit?

I'm sure at the end of the day both players will learn from each other, as they will from the upperclassmen, assistant coaches and of course Coach K himself.


You're right. They'll learn from each other more so than what I said. Just an assumption that since Kyrie is the All American and has all the accolades, he would be the teacher in the duo.

FireOgilvie
10-29-2009, 10:24 PM
I think due to Ty ranking we don't think he's that good which is a shame. I think Ty is a potentionally great pg. Better then KI no but Ty is still gifted and is prob. a better floor general as well. Idk about you guys but i'm glad to be having Ty join us at duke next year.

I agree, but I'm going to call him "Tyler." I don't like thinking about PGs named "Ty."

Welcome2DaSlopes
10-29-2009, 10:56 PM
I agree, but I'm going to call him "Tyler." I don't like thinking about PGs named "Ty."

hahaha at least he's on our side now.

-bdbd
10-29-2009, 11:16 PM
I seem to remember reading that his defense may be ahead of his offense at this point -- at least ahead of his shooting. So it wouldn't be a stretch to expect Tyler's D, especially under Coach K, to earn him some decent minutes in his first couple years. Bring him in as a "stopper" for quick PG's or 1/2 guards... And K has always been willing to put more than one ball handler on the floor at a time.

It sure is going to be nice to see Duke teams with SPEED again!!

-BDBD :D

DukeBlood
10-29-2009, 11:38 PM
As others have stated, Tyler has been nothing but supportive of Duke's decision to bring in another PG. I believe I once read where Tyler sent Kyrie a tweet saying "welcome home" following his commitment. It's my understanding that Tyler bleeds Duke blue, and is a team first type of guy.

There is no reason these two cant Co-exist. Coach K has used two PG's before, And has seen success with that combination. Not trying too look past this year, but I dont see any major minutes for Tyler next year. Unless, his D is really great. It will be interesting to see how this all shakes out.

I was just thinking about all the Guards we will have available next year. It has me wondering, Which 2011 guards currently have offers? Quin Cook?

dukeballer2294
10-29-2009, 11:42 PM
i get what u guys r saying but who knows that tyler wont be a stud pg HS rankings only amount for so much... however i hope and prey that Kyrie will live up to his top5 ranking

UrinalCake
10-30-2009, 05:17 AM
If your goal is to make it to the NBA, I think playing 20-25 minutes per game on a final four team gives you a better chance of being drafted than playing 35 minutes on a sweet 16 team, assuming your performance during those minutes is equal. There have been numerous examples of players on good teams who are drafted despite sharing minutes. So from Thornton's standpoint, having Irving is a huge plus because the team will do better. And winning has the effect of making you look a lot better.

oldnavy
10-30-2009, 07:48 AM
I seem to remember reading that his defense may be ahead of his offense at this point -- at least ahead of his shooting. So it wouldn't be a stretch to expect Tyler's D, especially under Coach K, to earn him some decent minutes in his first couple years. Bring him in as a "stopper" for quick PG's or 1/2 guards... And K has always been willing to put more than one ball handler on the floor at a time.

It sure is going to be nice to see Duke teams with SPEED again!!

-BDBD :D

Think about the benefit of playing against KI in practice each day. That will only help his D and help KI's O... it's ALL GOOD!

ACCBBallFan
10-31-2009, 10:01 PM
Think about the benefit of playing against KI in practice each day. That will only help his D and help KI's O... it's ALL GOOD!I agree.

I think people who do not have Tyler Thornton as their backup PG are underestimating him. He's a winner and a true PG who excels at defense.

With the potential teammates I think it is important that Thornton a true PG rather than perhaps a more skilled combo be the backup PG, with perhaps Andre playing more WF next year.

People who relegate Thornton to next year's Marty or Olek are under estimating his contribution. I like Marty and Olek but they lacked what coach K values, court sense and defense which Tyler Thornton excels at.

Irving / Thornton / Curry

Smith / Curry / Dawkins

Barnes? or Singler ? / Dawkins / Kelly / Czyz

Singler? / Mason / Kelly / Hairston

Mason / Miles / Hairston
.

Bob Green
10-31-2009, 11:16 PM
I like Marty and Olek but they lacked what coach K values, court sense and defense...

I agree with the basic premise of your post as I believe Tyler Thornton is going to be an invaluable contributor over his four years at Duke. However, in specific regard to Olek Czyz, he looked good during the exhibition win over Pfeiffer. I'm pleasantly optimistic that O.C. might see some meaningful minutes this year as his development as a player continues.

chrisheery
10-31-2009, 11:30 PM
I agree.

I think people who do not have Tyler Thornton as their backup PG are underestimating him. He's a winner and a true PG who excels at defense.

With the potential teammates I think it is important that Thornton a true PG rather than perhaps a more skilled combo be the backup PG, with perhaps Andre playing more WF next year.

People who relegate Thornton to next year's Marty or Olek are under estimating his contribution. I like Marty and Olek but they lacked what coach K values, court sense and defense which Tyler Thornton excels at.

Irving / Thornton / Curry

Smith / Curry / Dawkins

Barnes? or Singler ? / Dawkins / Kelly / Czyz

Singler? / Mason / Kelly / Hairston

Mason / Miles / Hairston
.

IF Barnes choses Duke and IF Singler stays (I know, its not likely, but just saying IF), this team would be amazingly good. Right? Best team since 1999 team as far as talent collection. Curry is going to be very good. Its crazy that this is even possible.

speedevil2001
11-01-2009, 12:33 AM
IF Barnes choses Duke and IF Singler stays (I know, its not likely, but just saying IF), this team would be amazingly good. Right? Best team since 1999 team as far as talent collection. Curry is going to be very good. Its crazy that this is even possible.

if singler stays, theres a chance barnes doesnt come to duke.

soccerstud2210
11-01-2009, 12:39 AM
if singler stays, theres a chance barnes doesnt come to duke.

isnt barnes choosing in two weeks, and we wont know if singler is staying till end of the season???

FireOgilvie
11-01-2009, 12:45 AM
if singler stays, theres a chance barnes doesnt come to duke.

No.

Barnes announces 5+ months before Singler announces on his future. Also, there's absolutely plenty of room for both guys. Singler could easily move back to the 4 with Barnes at the 3. Barnes could definitely play the 2 if we decided to go bigger as well. It would not be a problem.

duketaylor
11-01-2009, 01:15 AM
I would imagine Barnes would prefer the return of Kyle so they could play together, Singler as a senior, Barnes a frosh, on a team that would be a FF favorite. We would have one very talented team with that situation.

Bob Green
11-01-2009, 01:20 AM
if singler stays, theres a chance barnes doesnt come to duke.

This is a ridiculous post. First off, as already pointed out, Barnes will announce in two weeks, while Singler will make his NBA decision in April or May. Moreover, if Harrison Barnes knew in advance Singler would be staying for his senior season it would be a major feather in Duke's hat. Don't you think Harrison Barnes desires to win a National Championship? Singler staying would enhance Duke's chances at signing Barnes.

COYS
11-01-2009, 07:11 AM
No.

Barnes announces 5+ months before Singler announces on his future. Also, there's absolutely plenty of room for both guys. Singler could easily move back to the 4 with Barnes at the 3. Barnes could definitely play the 2 if we decided to go bigger as well. It would not be a problem.

Yeah, there's no way Barnes doesn't see the court next year even if Singler stays. It's Barnes' size not skills that have him listed as a SF. He's got all the quickness, shooting ability, and ballhandling skills necessary to be a special SG as well. A potential big lineup of a Senior Smith/Freshman Irving, Barnes, senior Singler, sophomore Mason, and junior Miles would be about as big, fast, athletic, and offensively potent as you can get. Add some ridiculous firepower off the bench in either Smith or Irving, Curry, Dawkins (all three of which would be starters and probably stars virtually anywhere else), Olek, Hairston, and Thornton and you've got a special team. Barnes would at the center of such a team even with all that talent and there's no way he decides to go elsewhere just because of Singler.

Bay Area Duke Fan
11-01-2009, 08:56 AM
IF Barnes choses Duke and IF Singler stays (I know, its not likely, but just saying IF), this team would be amazingly good. Right? Best team since 1999 team as far as talent collection. Curry is going to be very good. Its crazy that this is even possible.

How about talent on 2001 team?

Battier, J Williams, Dunleavy, Boozer, Duhon (2 retired jerseys, 5 NBA starters), plus Nate James.

moonpie23
11-01-2009, 09:28 AM
This is a ridiculous post. First off, as already pointed out, Barnes will announce in two weeks, while Singler will make his NBA decision in April or May. Moreover, if Harrison Barnes knew in advance Singler would be staying for his senior season it would be a major feather in Duke's hat. Don't you think Harrison Barnes desires to win a National Championship? Singler staying would enhance Duke's chances at signing Barnes.

correct-a-mundo......you don't turn down playing with the admiral just cause you're timmy duncan....

theAlaskanBear
11-01-2009, 09:43 AM
How about talent on 2001 team?

Battier, J Williams, Dunleavy, Boozer, Duhon (2 retired jerseys, 5 NBA starters), plus Nate James.

And didn't Dahntay Jones sit out that year for transferring, so theres another NBA players (albeit on the practice squad)? That was the most talented Duke team since the 91-92 teams.

ACCBBallFan
11-01-2009, 07:04 PM
I would imagine Barnes would prefer the return of Kyle so they could play together, Singler as a senior, Barnes a frosh, on a team that would be a FF favorite. We would have one very talented team with that situation.
Yes and besides playing aside one another in games and FF, Barnes could practice against someone as good as he is every day in practice (Singler, and vice versa with Barnes) to get both more ready for NBA.

ACCBBallFan
11-01-2009, 07:20 PM
I agree with the basic premise of your post as I believe Tyler Thornton is going to be an invaluable contributor over his four years at Duke. However, in specific regard to Olek Czyz, he looked good during the exhibition win over Pfeiffer. I'm pleasantly optimistic that O.C. might see some meaningful minutes this year as his development as a player continues.As usual, I agree with you, Bob.

Same is true of Marty BTW. He got better every year but so did his competition for PT.

Olek Czyz did look good though hard to tell vs undersized team. However, whose minutes can he get? There's only 5-10 MPG in backup of Kyle where he is in competiion with Kelly and Dawkins who looked even better.

I think both Olek an Ryan deserve minutes but it will be difficult to get either one of them a whole lot, with the plumlees both starting and Lance and Zoubs having senior experience. Those 4 will consume most of the 80MPG leaving crumbs for Ryan and Olek.

IMO, Ryan was POG vs Pfeiffer. So he has a stronger case than Olek based on lofty rankings and limited sample size so far. Next exhibition they each get less minutes as Lance is back in the mix, pending who is out with flu that Kelly and Thomas have alraeady endured.

At PF, Olek has to beat Lance, Mason and Kelly, and with Duke's size this year Olek will only play post during garbage minutes if at all since Zoubek nd Miles an Mason all have more size.

You make a good point though that when Olek does see the floor, he will not be the liability he would have been last year.

Olek Czyz and Casey Peters will make a valuable contribution guarding Kyle at practice, when Lance or Kelly are not doing that. Curry and Dawkins pair off with Scheyer and Smith, and the trees (Plumlees, Zoubek and Kelly) pair off, with Lance floating acorss each group to provide a defensive presence vs. each starter.

chrisheery
11-01-2009, 07:41 PM
And didn't Dahntay Jones sit out that year for transferring, so theres another NBA players (albeit on the practice squad)? That was the most talented Duke team since the 91-92 teams.

Trajan (NBA player for 3 or 4? years)
William Avery (NBA player, out of the league due to attitude, not talent)
Elton Brand (2nd or 3rd most talented player ever at Duke - depends on how you rank Christian)
Corey Maggette (NBA player, incredible athlete)
Shane Battier (NBA, president of the united states)
Chris Carawell
Nate James

Really, the 1999 team would have beaten the 2001 team. It won by an average of like 20 points a game. Only lost two games all year and should have won both of those if they had played like themselves. The 2001 team was incredible and I love them, but more talent? No way.

In fact, I think this is one of the most talented college teams of all time. I'm not even counting Burgess who was a good talent, just never lived up to his potential.

JaMarcus Russell
11-01-2009, 08:14 PM
Yeah, I loved watching the 1999 team. Since I started watching college basketball as a little kid in 1992, it has been the most dominant team that I have ever seen in college ball. It's just a shame that they had their worst game of the season against UConn.

UrinalCake
11-01-2009, 10:00 PM
While we're on the topic of Tyler Thornton (or at least, we were at one point...) what about Seth Curry? When he decided to transfer, Duke was just a few days removed from an embarrassing tournament loss, and potentially facing a dearth of guards for the next two years. It looked like he was going to be a sure starter in 2010. Now he's in the mix with five guys who will be able to play PG and/or SG, with the potential for more.

JaMarcus Russell
11-01-2009, 10:35 PM
Keep in mind that Elliot Williams was still a part of the team at the time Seth Curry transferred from Liberty. Also, Andre Dawkins was committed (albeit as a member of the 2010 class) along with Thornton and Irving, Knight, and Barnes all had offers from Duke. I don't think that the situation has really changed all that much from Seth's perspective. The main difference is that Dawkins will have actual game experience, while Williams is gone. It's probably close to a push.

DukeBlood
11-01-2009, 10:58 PM
While we're on the topic of Tyler Thornton (or at least, we were at one point...) what about Seth Curry? When he decided to transfer, Duke was just a few days removed from an embarrassing tournament loss, and potentially facing a dearth of guards for the next two years. It looked like he was going to be a sure starter in 2010. Now he's in the mix with five guys who will be able to play PG and/or SG, with the potential for more.

There's alot of options with so many talented guards. Does Duke go to a 3 guard system? I think alot of Duke's line-up depends on if Singler goes and Harrison comes. Honestly, Who does Duke start if Singler stays and Harrison comes?! I think Nolan, Kyle, Mason and Miles would be starters. Wait.. One of Kyrie or Harrison NOT starting?

Really, Think about it. Alot of talent coming off the bench.

cwaugh
11-01-2009, 11:05 PM
How can you say that Miles and Mason would be locks for starters next year? We haven't even seen Mason play a real game yet and what we saw of Miles last year didn't prove that he is a lock. IMO if Kyle stays and Barnes comes to Duke the starting lineup would potentially look like this.

Kyrie Irving
Nolan Smith
Harrison Barnes
Kyle Singler
Mason/Miles Plumlee

Welcome2DaSlopes
11-01-2009, 11:06 PM
OMG stop talking like this. I only hope it comes true but lately it has led to big letdowns (i.e. John wall, kenny B, Greg Monroe.

Welcome2DaSlopes
11-01-2009, 11:07 PM
How can you say that Miles and Mason would be locks for starters next year? We haven't even seen Mason play a real game yet and what we saw of Miles last year didn't prove that he is a lock. IMO if Kyle stays and Barnes comes to Duke the starting lineup would potentially look like this.

Kyrie Irving
Nolan Smith
Harrison Barnes
Kyle Singler
Mason/Miles Plumlee

I was thinking the same thing as well. But just imagine Seth, Ryan, Olek, and Andre coming off the bench as well as one of the Plumlee Brothers. DOMINATION.

DukeBlood
11-01-2009, 11:09 PM
How can you say that Miles and Mason would be locks for starters next year? We haven't even seen Mason play a real game yet and what we saw of Miles last year didn't prove that he is a lock. IMO if Kyle stays and Barnes comes to Duke the starting lineup would potentially look like this.

Kyrie Irving
Nolan Smith
Harrison Barnes
Kyle Singler
Mason/Miles Plumlee

The coaches have been raving about both Miles and Mason, If those raves turn out to be true, then what? Plus in your scenario you are moving Kyle back to the post after the year before moving him to the wing? Unless you have 4 on the wing and 1 in the post??

As far as brooklyn, Its a message board. I in NO WAY have my hopes up for that happening. If it happens, great. If not, well thats life. You dont like this topic, Dont read? Its about Tyler and Kyrie once they arrive on campus, so it is about NEXT years team. That came off as harsh. Not meant to be so harsh, Sorry.

cwaugh
11-01-2009, 11:14 PM
I would say that most of the time our 4 man doesn't play a whole lot in the post. Also, with a team that versatile it wouldn't matter really who was in the post. Kyle and Barnes could switch in and out. What would be incredible is that all 5 starters could dribble very well and move fast up and down the court. Now that would be some high scoring games.

DukeBlood
11-01-2009, 11:17 PM
I would say that most of the time our 4 man doesn't play a whole lot in the post. Also, with a team that versatile it wouldn't matter really who was in the post. Kyle and Barnes could switch in and out. What would be incredible is that all 5 starters could dribble very well and move fast up and down the court. Now that would be some high scoring games.

Fair enough. Plus I didn't say they would be locks to start in that post. I just think Coach K would use that height and athletic ability to his advantage. It really doesn't matter as this season is here. Interesting to think about none the less.

cwaugh
11-01-2009, 11:21 PM
Fair enough. Plus I didn't say they would be locks to start in that post. I just think Coach K would use that height and athletic ability to his advantage. It really doesn't matter as this season is here. Interesting to think about none the less.

You are right. All of this can change depending on how well players play this season and what recruits we get. I just find it fun discuss potential lineups for the future whether they pan out or not. Either way I think this year and next years lineup will be very dangerous. Coach K does his best with teams that are versatile.

dukeballer2294
11-01-2009, 11:41 PM
honestly if this scenario comes true we could play like 9-10 guys ranging from 15-25 minutes. Theyd be fresh all game we could press all game and wear out teams. We could also adjust to any team (ie 3 guards 2 bigs etc)

theAlaskanBear
11-02-2009, 07:31 AM
Trajan (NBA player for 3 or 4? years)
William Avery (NBA player, out of the league due to attitude, not talent)
Elton Brand (2nd or 3rd most talented player ever at Duke - depends on how you rank Christian)
Corey Maggette (NBA player, incredible athlete)
Shane Battier (NBA, president of the united states)
Chris Carawell
Nate James

Really, the 1999 team would have beaten the 2001 team. It won by an average of like 20 points a game. Only lost two games all year and should have won both of those if they had played like themselves. The 2001 team was incredible and I love them, but more talent? No way.

In fact, I think this is one of the most talented college teams of all time. I'm not even counting Burgess who was a good talent, just never lived up to his potential.

I guess it just all depends on how you judge talent. I am looking at production in the NBA, rather than college results, because most of 2001 team left school early. I agree that Brand is completely awesome, he was my favorite NBA player for a long time, but a player by player comparison shows the 2001 edging the 1999.

First off, both teams had SHane Battier and Nate James!, so they will be judged against themselves, and not count.

PG: Jason Williams vs Trajan Langdon, big edge: Jay Will
Langdon played 3 yrs, played only spot minutes, played 10, 65 then 44 games. Jason passed his point total in 1 year in the NBA, and is by far a better, more complete player.

Will Avery vs Mike Dunleavy, big edge Mike.
Sorry, but your claim Avery had the talent to stick in the NBA is just not true. a 2ppg avg over 3 seasons.

Magette vs Duhon; both valuable NBA players. Maggette gets an edge tho.
He has done it longer, and is a much better scorer than Duhon.

Brand vs Boozer, slight edge Brand. They are both rebounding machines, but Brand averages 4ppg more for his career.

So edge to the 2001 team, judging by NBA results.

Duhon beats Langdon, Jay Will beats Avery, Dunleavy and Maggette are even, Battier v Battier, even. Brand beats Boozer, but only by a little.

The only advantage the 1999 team had was Brand, who is a great player.