Preseason Coaches Poll

[DukeFan78]

I generally, like a lot of people, could care less about preseason polls. But I could not believe this when I saw it. Duke is picked No. 8..... Tarholes picked 4th!!! I do think Carolina is going to be a good team this year but I just don't see how they are picked so high when they lost the core of their team/offense from last year. Yes, they have solid uderclassmen to step up into those positions, but for the most part they are untested....

Any thoughts...............


GO DUKE!

[Welcome2DaSlopes]

I guess the are given the benfit of the doubt since they were the champs last year.(still hurts me to say that)

[airowe]

8th is actually the highest I've seen us this preseason. I guess the coaches have a lot more faith in our backcourt than analysts do.

4th is definitely high for the Heels. Their most glaring weakness is at the PG position and I'm not sold on LD2 yet. They do have a solid frontcourt though I'm not sure how much Thompson will handle being the 2nd or 3rd option as opposed to the 7th or 8th.

Can someone link the poll?

[CameronBornAndBred]

8th is actually the highest I've seen us this preseason.

Ditto. I don't care if they have us higher, makes it more fun when we beat them. Speaking of that matchup, it's going to be a huge game, literally. I'm not sure the last time we'll have seen so many guys that tall on the court at the same time.

[soccerstud2210]

8th is actually the highest I've seen us this preseason. I guess the coaches have a lot more faith in our backcourt than analysts do.

4th is definitely high for the Heels. Their most glaring weakness is at the PG position and I'm not sold on LD2 yet. They do have a solid frontcourt though I'm not sure how much Thompson will handle being the 2nd or 3rd option as opposed to the 7th or 8th.

Can someone link the poll?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/rankings?pollId=2

via espn.com

[airowe]

Here's Goodman's take:

http://community.foxsports.com/goodmanonfox/blog/2009/10/29/coaches_poll_preseason_top_25

Not sure how he says you can't put Miss. St. up there because of eligibility yet doesn't mention Wall.

I think the Heels are a little high but it will be that much more enjoyable when they lose. If Wall is eligible, that UK-UNC game in December will be fun to watch, I just won't know who to pull for.

[DukieTiger]

I cannot believe someone voted Unc #1.

[superdave]

As our freshmen (and sophs) improve over the course of the year, our upside looks pretty good. If Nolan can score consistently all year then we'll be fantastic, as I'm pretty sure Jon and Kyle will be doing everything from the beginning. So Top 10 is a good start for us now but top 3-4 is realistic come Feb.

Unless, Larry Drew is way better than anyone expects, I'm not sure unc has that much upside. It will take a pretty good pg to get easy shots for all those frontcourt players they have. I doubt anyone thinks unc will be an odds-on Final Four favorite by Feb unless Larry really takes off.

[DukieTiger]

I personally think that Unc's ceiling is lower than ours this year (when is the last time you could say that? 2006?) I think they have the potential to be a great defensive team, but offensively they won't quite have the same firepower as the past few years. There aren't any proven, reliable shooters; there isn't a pg who will run right by the defense; there isn't a proven go-to guy in the low post.

[DukieBoy]

I think almost every year, the defending champion seems to get a lot more love in the polls than they should. They will lose soon enough and prove the voters wrong.

I'm glad to see Butler up in the rankings finally. Being from Indiana, I've heard and watched a lot about them. For those that follow them at all, Butler's star forward Matt Howard came from my high school and I managed the high school basketball team when he played. He's a great kid and I'm glad to see Butler high in the rankings.

[brevity]

The coaches' poll is close to how I see it right now, but really, you could put #2-12 in just about any order. Had I a ballot, I'd rank Kansas #1, skip the next several slots, and have a 11-way tie for, uh, 6th.


I cannot believe someone voted Unc #1.

Seeing as the preseason poll is kinda meaningless, I wonder if someone ACC-affiliated did it just to motivate his own players. Gary Williams is the only ACC coach with a vote, but maybe Tommy Amaker or Herb Sendek did it as a favor.

But it's more likely someone who either believes that the defending champion should always be ranked #1 at the start (as they did nothing to lose the distinction), someone who didn't want Kansas to be a unanimous pick, or someone unimpressed with the offseason the Jayhawks are having.

[soccerstud2210]

I personally think that Unc's ceiling is lower than ours this year (when is the last time you could say that? 2006?) I think they have the potential to be a great defensive team, but offensively they won't quite have the same firepower as the past few years. There aren't any proven, reliable shooters; there isn't a pg who will run right by the defense; there isn't a proven go-to guy in the low post.

you should see what they are saying about our team over on the IC boards. apparently we shouldn't even be ranked :) i'll take 8th for not even playing a game this year yet. at this point its all speculation anyways

[Scorp4me]

They think we shouldn't be ranked. They're ranked too high. Going to be a sweet year!!!

[sagegrouse]

UNC in 2009 was a deep and dangerous team, which lost its top four scorers and top four players in terms of minutes played. We will get a chance to see how deep they really were.

I don't care where either team is ranked, except insofar as preseason expectations affect post-season honors for the players. Unlike in football, final rankings for the teams are determined on the court.

It is interesting to see, however, that the ACC scribes had a tie for first in the ACC, better results for Duke than the national poll. I expect that, for the coaches at least, being defending champion gets weight. I mean, UNC is the only school in Division I that has won six games in a row. (And I'm really glad that it wasn't seven!)

sagegrouse

[weezie]

Not sure how he says you can't put Miss. St. up there because of eligibility yet doesn't mention Wall.


I just kind of have the feeling that the media is somehow going to give Wall a pass; a miracle will occur and all will be resolved to ky's advantage. Wall is too much of a ratings gem to risk losing viewers.

[airowe]

I just kind of have the feeling that the media is somehow going to give Wall a pass; a miracle will occur and all will be resolved to ky's advantage. Wall is too much of a ratings gem to risk losing viewers.

Weezie, I completely agree. No matter how unfortunate it is, I think you're right. I mainly stated that because Goodman took the time to comment on Renardo Sidney's questionable eligibility yet Wall is being questioned for the same situation. Sidney has a lot of other issues too, but still.

If you go down a few entries in Goodman's blog, he's gushing over Wall's performance in an open practice. I guess Fox does cover regional games so maybe he is reserving judgement to tow the company line. Who knows?

[meloveduke]

The higher the tar holes are ranked the better. I am going to love to see them do the moonwalk through the ranks. The cherry in top will be watching my brother inlaw squirm as they do it, it's gonna be great.

[ice-9]

Forget the holes, the real story to me of the coach's top 25 is Georgia Tech at #20.

WOW!

Talk about faith in a freshman phenom and that ridiculous wingspan!

[moonpie23]

i don't want to throw a wet blanket on this party, but UNC is going to be good...maybe REALLY good. It's easy to sit around and pick apart this, that, and the other....but let's be honest....those guys didn't get those scholarships cause they were going to some lesser college BB program.

if we had split with them, or even beaten them ONCE in the last four....we might have something to say......but until we can beat them.....at all, we should just have a nice steaming cup of shut up......

don't get me wrong, i love our team, and i'm really looking forward to seeing how this new (and current) talent is going to gel and compete with REAL teams..but i'm sick of taking what rolls down hill from the tarholes......i am jonsing for duke to beat them.....



as you were...

[airowe]

I hear ya moonpie, but you have to admit they have some serious question marks. As do we, and almost every other team out there. Honestly, this year there really aren't too many teams I'd put ahead of them or us. 3-11 is a crapshoot. To me, it's KU, TX, then a bunch of other teams starting out the year. These could change by the end of the year obviously...

[NSDukeFan]

The coaches' poll is close to how I see it right now, but really, you could put #2-12 in just about any order. Had I a ballot, I'd rank Kansas #1, skip the next several slots, and have a 11-way tie for, uh, 6th.


I may very well be proven wrong, but I think there are a few more teams that could potentially be in that top tier. I am thinking of Michigan State, Kentucky, Texas and Villanova. Those teams and KU are the teams that appear to me to be the best on paper. I would put Duke in the next group with UNC, West Virginia, Purdue, Butler and the rest of that top 12. Fortunately, the games are played on the court and not on paper and the season is almost underway.

[SMO]

i don't want to throw a wet blanket on this party, but UNC is going to be good...maybe REALLY good. It's easy to sit around and pick apart this, that, and the other....but let's be honest....those guys didn't get those scholarships cause they were going to some lesser college BB program.

if we had split with them, or even beaten them ONCE in the last four....we might have something to say......but until we can beat them.....at all, we should just have a nice steaming cup of shut up......

don't get me wrong, i love our team, and i'm really looking forward to seeing how this new (and current) talent is going to gel and compete with REAL teams..but i'm sick of taking what rolls down hill from the tarholes......i am jonsing for duke to beat them.....



as you were...

Until Duke can beat them they should be ranked #4??? I don't follow you there. Plus, couldn't any top program make the same argument you lay out in your first paragraph? "Well, they got scholarships for some reason! They must be good!"

For what it's worth, I think UNC is ranked too high, Kentucky too low, and Duke about right. Of course, rankings at this point have little meaning.

[NMYMND]

As our freshmen (and sophs) improve over the course of the year, our upside looks pretty good. If Nolan can score consistently all year then we'll be fantastic, as I'm pretty sure Jon and Kyle will be doing everything from the beginning. So Top 10 is a good start for us now but top 3-4 is realistic come Feb.

Unless, Larry Drew is way better than anyone expects, I'm not sure unc has that much upside. It will take a pretty good pg to get easy shots for all those frontcourt players they have. I doubt anyone thinks unc will be an odds-on Final Four favorite by Feb unless Larry really takes off.

I always love the viewpoint of "our guys will improve and their guys won't, so we'll be better." I think the only ones that take the opposite approach of "our guys will stink and their guys will get better" are NC State fans.

[DukieBoy]

If it's any consolation, Dickie V has us 5th to UNC 7th. Actually, I don't know if that makes things worse or better.

[BD80]

... I think the only ones that take the opposite approach of "our guys will stink and their guys will get better" are NC State fans.

but they can back that argument up with facts!

[Kedsy]

if we had split with them, or even beaten them ONCE in the last four....we might have something to say......but until we can beat them.....at all, we should just have a nice steaming cup of shut up......


Well, not to nitpick, but we did split with them twice in the last four years.

[JasonEvans]

If it's any consolation, Dickie V has us 5th to UNC 7th. Actually, I don't know if that makes things worse or better.

Rivals has us #8 (http://collegebasketball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1008048). They are counting down all the top teams and we are the latest to enter the rankings. UNC has not been ranked by them yet, so the Holes are somewhere between #1 and #7.

Other ACC teams in the Rivals rankings: (http://collegebasketball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=989561)

UNC ??
Duke #8
Clemson #23
Ga Tech #25
Wake Forest #33
Fla State #39
Maryland #45
Va Tech #51
BC #59
Virginia #81
Miami #115
NC State #121

--Jason "wow, they really think State is gonna suck this year" Evans

[moonpie23]

last four games.... that's a "run"....


all i'm saying is....they're the champs.....recently, we haven't had much to yak at them or about them about....

[Kedsy]

last four games.... that's a "run"....

Sorry, I thought you meant years. However, even looking at the last four games, your statement is inaccurate. We have won one of the last four, although we have lost three in a row. And personally I wouldn't consider three in a row a "run." To me, it's they were better than us last year, after splitting the year before.

[Wander]

I thought Kentucky was the obvious #2 choice behind Kansas. I'm surprised they're down at #5. UNC shouldn't be quite that high, but when you win the title, you're going to get the benefit of the doubt that other teams don't get.

Not as obvious, but I still say Maryland is the third best team in the ACC, and in fact that they're not all that far behind UNC and Duke.

[CEF1959]

Not as obvious, but I still say Maryland is the third best team in the ACC, and in fact that they're not all that far behind UNC and Duke.

I think pollsters have caught on to the Clemson Shuffle and are anticipating it by starting them a little higher to begin with.

Every year it seems an unheralded Clemson team plays nobody for a couple months and emerges with a gaudy undefeated record. So up they go in the polls. Then league play forces them back to reality and they slide down again.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

I expect this years Heels to be a defensive and rebounding monster. I promise you a team will struggle to score on them.

Their length and athletism 1 thru 5- backed up by 6 thru 10- is awesome, and the opposing coaches know it.

They will score plenty to win, and we'll check back later, but I'd be willing to bet now that they will be one of the top, if not the top, rebounding and blocked shots teams in the country.

Putback jams will replace feathery Ellington 3's...and the individual talents by position seem to be complimentary...a nice fit.

I think LDII will be a solid/quality leader and PG, in the Jimmy Black mold. He is a good player with lots of talent around him. I especially like his anticipation defense. He can get into the passing lane to disrupt. His handle is good enough and decision making improved steadily all season, I see no reason to think he can't run this team well as a tested soph. He's no TL, but who is?

Graves can shoot it, make no mistake, and will get his chance to prove it. He reminds me of a Charles Barkley type player in that he is a tough player to match up with in that body frame relative to his skills. (Not that he plays like Barkley). If he could catch fire, get some confidence, or Mcdonald/Strickland can step up from deep, the skies the limit for this team.

They will make some youthful mistakes, but these are not average freshmen from what I read. Basically all 5 star talents. The learning curve is likely to be short. We'll see.

The few losses will come from the free throw line against the more wing oriented teams.

That's my quick preseason take of the Heels in a nutshell...and top 5 is about right, imo.

[NSDukeFan]

I expect this years Heels to be a defensive and rebounding monster. I promise you a team will struggle to score on them.

Their length and athletism 1 thru 5- backed up by 6 thru 10- is awesome, and the opposing coaches know it.

They will score plenty to win, and we'll check back later, but I'd be willing to bet now that they will be one of the top, if not the top, rebounding and blocked shots teams in the country.

Putback jams will replace feathery Ellington 3's...and the individual talents by position seem to be complimentary...a nice fit.

I think LDII will be a solid/quality leader and PG, in the Jimmy Black mold. He is a good player with lots of talent around him. I especially like his anticipation defense. He can get into the passing lane to disrupt. His handle is good enough and decision making improved steadily all season, I see no reason to think he can't run this team well as a tested soph. He's no TL, but who is?

Graves can shoot it, make no mistake, and will get his chance to prove it. He reminds me of a Charles Barkley type player in that he is a tough player to match up with in that body frame relative to his skills. (Not that he plays like Barkley). If he could catch fire, get some confidence, or Mcdonald/Strickland can step up from deep, the skies the limit for this team.

They will make some youthful mistakes, but these are not average freshmen from what I read. Basically all 5 star talents. The learning curve is likely to be short. We'll see.

The few losses will come from the free throw line against the more wing oriented teams.

That's my quick preseason take of the Heels in a nutshell...and top 5 is about right, imo.

I don't disagree that the Heels will be talented, loaded up front and be a top rebounding and shot-blocking team. What I would be worried about if I was a fan of theirs (thank goodness I'm not) is how consistently will Graves, Strickland and McDonald be able to shoot from the perimeter. Otherwise, why would you have any of your defensive players stand outside the key against them? I think they have a few more questions than the top 5 teams in my mind (KU, MSU, Texas, Nova and UK) but expect them to be in the next batch with the potential to contend for the top four, but hopefully behind Duke.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

I don't disagree that the Heels will be talented, loaded up front and be a top rebounding and shot-blocking team. What I would be worried about if I was a fan of theirs (thank goodness I'm not) is how consistently will Graves, Strickland and McDonald be able to shoot from the perimeter. Otherwise, why would you have any of your defensive players stand outside the key against them? I think they have a few more questions than the top 5 teams in my mind (KU, MSU, Texas, Nova and UK) but expect them to be in the next batch with the potential to contend for the top four, but hopefully behind Duke.

I don't worry too much about outside shooting because I think it will be OK, maybe not great, but OK.

If teams pack it in, we will make enough shots to spread the floor. Teams can try that, and and this team will still likely get the rebounds.

Foul shooting is the achillies Heel- pun intended.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Lucas just put up this good read (http://tarheelblue.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/102809aaa.html) that mirriors much of my take on this years Heels. Saves me a lot of writing.

[Welcome2DaSlopes]

I'm Shocked UK didn't get at least one first place vote.

[rthomas]

WVU students are giddy about the talent on the Mountaineers this year. Huggy has finally gotten the big kids he has wanted, rather than Beilein's skinny kids.

[Indoor66]

I'm Shocked UK didn't get at least one first place vote.

Probably because the coaches don't get as caught up in the puffery of the recruit watching fanatics.

[jv001]

Lucas just put up this good read (http://tarheelblue.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/102809aaa.html) that mirriors much of my take on this years Heels. Saves me a lot of writing.

Two guys looking at "their team" through ugly light blue glasses. lucas and wheat. I certainly admire your devotion to your team, but unc has question marks just like Duke. Sure unc is tall, but so is Duke. Our front court has some questions yet to be answered. Just like unc's back court and wing players. I see no way that unc will be as athletic as last years ncca champs. I believe many unc fans will see how much lawson meant to that team. Then take away hanstravel & ellington and unc can't be near the team they were last year. Only time will show. So let the games begin. I can't wait. Go Duke!

[crimsonandblue]

Two guys looking at "their team" through ugly light blue glasses. lucas and wheat. I certainly admire your devotion to your team, but unc has question marks just like Duke. Sure unc is tall, but so is Duke. Our front court has some questions yet to be answered. Just like unc's back court and wing players. I see no way that unc will be as athletic as last years ncca champs. I believe many unc fans will see how much lawson meant to that team. Then take away hanstravel & ellington and unc can't be near the team they were last year. Only time will show. So let the games begin. I can't wait. Go Duke!

Agreed. Good grief, Wheat, comparing Graves even in passing to Barkley? Short learning curves for skinny freshmen asked to play positions not entirely suiting their skill sets? A Roy Williams team committing to defense and rebounding first? A Roy Williams team missing key shooters that won't struggle with a good zone?

Oh, and your schedule is fairly brutal. I can see putting them maybe in the top ten. Maybe. I can see UNC being a threat in the ACC. I can't see them top five. You took the engine (Lawson), the oil (Ellington) and the gas (Hansbrough) out of your race car and replaced them with Drew, Ginyard/Strickland/Henson and Davis/Zeller. Those are nice parts, but completely at odds with the way UNC played a year ago. I can't imagine being so confident...

Good luck with that.

[sagegrouse]

I'm Shocked UK didn't get at least one first place vote.

Do you really think the other coaches are going to cut Calipari any slack, after his shenanigans have besmirched the coaching profession? He is going to have earn everything he gets -- twice over -- in the coaches poll.

sagegrouse

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Agreed. Good grief, Wheat, comparing Graves even in passing to Barkley? Short learning curves for skinny freshmen asked to play positions not entirely suiting their skill sets? A Roy Williams team committing to defense and rebounding first? A Roy Williams team missing key shooters that won't struggle with a good zone?

Oh, and your schedule is fairly brutal. I can see putting them maybe in the top ten. Maybe. I can see UNC being a threat in the ACC. I can't see them top five. You took the engine (Lawson), the oil (Ellington) and the gas (Hansbrough) out of your race car and replaced them with Drew, Ginyard/Strickland/Henson and Davis/Zeller. Those are nice parts, but completely at odds with the way UNC played a year ago. I can't imagine being so confident...

Good luck with that.

This is a different year, absolutely.

If you expect to see the same high octane- push to score quick at all cost -offense from the Heels of last year, you are likely to be disappointed.

Here was my quote you referenced once again..."He reminds me of a Charles Barkley type player in that he is a tough player to match up with in that body frame relative to his skills. ]Not that he plays like Barkley)."

note......"Not that he plays like Barkley"

I could have easily used a player like Dejuan Blair to make my point. Would you think I thought Graves plays like Blair?

Graves has one of those games that is hard to define, and hard to match up with when he's playing well. And I know that has not happened much at all. His problems have been between his ears, and I'm not convinced he's matured, or is in shape. But I could see the kid has game. We'll see if he can show it this year.

I can't comment too much on Henson because I need to see him play for myself. I do know what I read, and I have played against that type of player. It's a pain to shoot against them and they suck up rebounds while scoring "ugly". This kid is supposed to be a better ballhandler and more athletic version of B. Wright -who's in the NBA, BTW. If so, that's trouble for all...We'll see.

Deon is the most polished post scorer in the country- and an underrated defender. Nobody likes guarding him.

Davis is simply put-a beast.

Zeller is a smooth 7 footer that runs the floor and is filling out his body. He's stronger, so I hear, and has NBA talent. He could be this years biggest surprise player for the Heels, and that's saying a lot.

Ginyard is a utility guy that is supposedly in the best shape of his life, and he was always in shape, pre injury. People forget what a good defender and intuitive player he is. He makes plays.

This team will be good, very good. I feel confident with that statement.

Just because I am discussing the Heels here, don't think I don't know Duke is a very good team too. Scheyer and Singler are two of the best in the country at what they do, what they lack in speed they more than make up for in smarts, heart and desire. I like the quickness of Nolan Smith, and think he's underrated as a player because he has yet to really hit his stride. This could be his year.

Zoubek and Thomas are solid, if unspectacular players.

Miles Plumblee has some game and length, it would not surprise me to see him become a starter this year and become a really good player.

Can't really comment on the rest until I see them play, but Dawkins and Mason P's style of play, according to reports, seem to fit well with Duke's needs.

It will be a fun year to watch both teams develop.

[Wander]

Graves has one of those games that is hard to define, and hard to match up with when he's playing well. And I know that has not happened much at all. His problems have been between his ears, and I'm not convinced he's matured, or is in shape. But I could see the kid has game. We'll see if he can show it this year.


I don't like Graves at all, and to be honest I don't see him as a UNC caliber player. He'll probably get some time, but only by necessity and he'll be the clear weak-link on the floor whenever he's in.

I do agree with everything else though. It would not surprise me if once the season really gets going I think of UNC as the best defensive team in the country. I think Carolina is basically a Nolan Smith at point guard away from being a truly complete defensive team. I have no idea why Kentucky would not be ahead of them given UNC's questions on offense, but I'm not going to nitpick about one or two poll spots.

[NSDukeFan]

This is a different year, absolutely.

If you expect to see the same high octane- push to score quick at all cost -offense from the Heels of last year, you are likely to be disappointed.

Here was my quote you referenced once again..."He reminds me of a Charles Barkley type player in that he is a tough player to match up with in that body frame relative to his skills. ]Not that he plays like Barkley)."

note......"Not that he plays like Barkley"

I could have easily used a player like Dejuan Blair to make my point. Would you think I thought Graves plays like Blair?

Graves has one of those games that is hard to define, and hard to match up with when he's playing well. And I know that has not happened much at all. His problems have been between his ears, and I'm not convinced he's matured, or is in shape. But I could see the kid has game. We'll see if he can show it this year.

I can't comment too much on Henson because I need to see him play for myself. I do know what I read, and I have played against that type of player. It's a pain to shoot against them and they suck up rebounds while scoring "ugly". This kid is supposed to be a better ballhandler and more athletic version of B. Wright -who's in the NBA, BTW. If so, that's trouble for all...We'll see.

Deon is the most polished post scorer in the country- and an underrated defender. Nobody likes guarding him.

Davis is simply put-a beast.

Zeller is a smooth 7 footer that runs the floor and is filling out his body. He's stronger, so I hear, and has NBA talent. He could be this years biggest surprise player for the Heels, and that's saying a lot.

Ginyard is a utility guy that is supposedly in the best shape of his life, and he was always in shape, pre injury. People forget what a good defender and intuitive player he is. He makes plays.

This team will be good, very good. I feel confident with that statement.

Just because I am discussing the Heels here, don't think I don't know Duke is a very good team too. Scheyer and Singler are two of the best in the country at what they do, what they lack in speed they more than make up for in smarts, heart and desire. I like the quickness of Nolan Smith, and think he's underrated as a player because he has yet to really hit his stride. This could be his year.

Zoubek and Thomas are solid, if unspectacular players.

Miles Plumblee has some game and length, it would not surprise me to see him become a starter this year and become a really good player.

Can't really comment on the rest until I see them play, but Dawkins and Mason P's style of play, according to reports, seem to fit well with Duke's needs.

It will be a fun year to watch both teams develop.

I don't disagree with most of what you are saying, but Deon the most polished post player in the country? I admit I am sure I haven't seen him play near as much as you, but my recollection from the Duke games was he hit the open 12-17 footer a few times because the D was focussed on the rest of the starters and he was open. He scored more than I thought last year at 11.6 per game, but I can't imagine he is the most polished post player, even if that is an underutilized part of today's game. (Cole Aldrich, Luke Harangody are a couple of players off the top of my head that I would think are better post scorers.)

[kong123]

from HB's blog

"I was going against Will Graves, and I didn’t realize how good of a shooter he was until he lit me up… a lot! But I feel like I came back and did pretty well. He had trouble guarding me, and I obviously had trouble guarding him. It was real good competition."

Will Graves may not appear to be a UNC caliber player, but he shows flashes. Perhaps he could be a Reyshawn Terry? He is capable of being a great athlete but maybe lacks the discipline and heart. He is the best outside shooter in practice, but does not factor in the game time adrenaline into his stroke.

One thing we can say is both teams will be fun to watch this year because of all the unknowns. I imagine after we win the ACC/Big Ten Challenge, the picture will be much clearer.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

I don't disagree with most of what you are saying, but Deon the most polished post player in the country? I admit I am sure I haven't seen him play near as much as you, but my recollection from the Duke games was he hit the open 12-17 footer a few times because the D was focussed on the rest of the starters and he was open. He scored more than I thought last year at 11.6 per game, but I can't imagine he is the most polished post player, even if that is an underutilized part of today's game. (Cole Aldrich, Luke Harangody are a couple of players off the top of my head that I would think are better post scorers.)

Post scorer...

Deon's footwork and touch after recieving the ball shows the most polished offensive post game in the country, that's what I'm saying.

There may be other post players who are more effective, like Harangody, but none more "polished".

Graves can play. The question is will he?

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Just checked Grave's profile on the official UNC site and it lists him at 6'6'' 260lbs!

260lbs? Then on the roster he's shown at 240lbs...?

3 years in the program and still out of shape? Can't think of another player that became heavier without getting in better shape each year at UNC, ever.

He needs to be at 220lbs and time is running out. Two seasons left.

Deon is a strong 6'9, 245lbs after coming in at a soft 260lbs plus as a freshman. If Graves can somehow find that commitment then he will become a player, otherwise he will fade into history and become a trivia question.

[BD80]

... but I'd be willing to bet now that they will be one of the top, if not the top, rebounding and blocked shots teams in the country. ...

... The learning curve is likely to be short. ...

Agree and disagree.

So agree with the top rebounding team. tar heel hands will look like masons' hands, swollen and crooked, from picking up all those bricks.

Frankly, the Devils will not be much different.

This will be a great comparison of coaching.

Coach K is a far superior defensive coach (or puts more emphasis on D), whereas ol' roy has a better reputation for developing post scoring and fast break offense.

Considering the teams have similar amounts of talent (recruiting rankings might give the tar heels the edge), we are left with coaching to develop talent and to win with the talent on the team.

I think there will a steep learning curve for the tar heels, there is VERY little experience, and no experience as team leaders or go-to-guys. The heels will be very dangerous come tourney time.

The Devils will be more dangerous. There will be a long learning curve for the defensive schemes that we will employ. Hopefully, we will be winning games on the defensive end by the end of the year. The development of Miles and Mason will be key.

Put me in the camp that thinks the heels have more talent (but wait 'till next year!), but the Devils have the better coach and will wind up the better team.

[striker219]

Just because I am discussing the Heels here, don't think I don't know Duke is a very good team too. Scheyer and Singler are two of the best in the country at what they do, what they lack in speed they more than make up for in smarts, heart and desire. I like the quickness of Nolan Smith, and think he's underrated as a player because he has yet to really hit his stride. This could be his year.

Zoubek and Thomas are solid, if unspectacular players.

Miles Plumblee has some game and length, it would not surprise me to see him become a starter this year and become a really good player.

Can't really comment on the rest until I see them play, but Dawkins and Mason P's style of play, according to reports, seem to fit well with Duke's needs.

It will be a fun year to watch both teams develop.

You should be careful, well reasoned, rational thought isn't often welcome in Carolina country, considering the subject matter. They're going to take away your Carolina card.

;-)

[Edouble]

I generally, like a lot of people, could care less about preseason polls.


Any thoughts...............


GO DUKE!

I think you mean you couldn't care less. :o

[oldnavy]

Sorry, I thought you meant years. However, even looking at the last four games, your statement is inaccurate. We have won one of the last four, although we have lost three in a row. And personally I wouldn't consider three in a row a "run." To me, it's they were better than us last year, after splitting the year before.

They were better than us both years. The only game we won was when Lawson was out with his ankle sprain. It pains me to say it, but they have had our number the last couple of years.

This year should be different. They certainly are no better than they were last year. Losing Lawson will hurt them, a lot! He was the difference maker on that team, not Hansblah, or Ellington, or Green. We are going to be better. Losing G and Elliot hurts, but we have the proven returning starters in SSS and Mason will improve our offensive boarding...

It's all good! Can I get an AMEN!

[oldnavy]

I think you mean you couldn't care less. :o

Edouble, you are technically correct, but "I could care less" is sort of slang/sarcastic for "I COULD care less, but I don't"... Plus it rolls better off the tongue.:)

[JRJOE]

I'm a huge UNC fan and I feel rankings mean nothing in Nov. In my honest opinion I feel Duke would beat us if we played today. We'll have some bumps early, but our tough schedule will help us in the long run. The pace we play will help us out more than people think. We'll see alot of zone, but if we play good D and rebound our pace will wear u down. As far as larry drew, his biggest opponent is ty lawson. All season long people will compare him to ty, we don't need him to be ty. UNC's style doesn't require him to score a lot, but he can not hurt us with poor decisions. My biggest fear is Will Graves, can he stay focused?

[crimsonandblue]

Schadenbump for Wheat...

Poor form on my part?

[allenmurray]

Schadenbump for Wheat...

Poor form on my part?

I think at this point the Tar Heels are gluten free.

[shoutingncu]

I imagine after we win the ACC/Big Ten Challenge, the picture will be much clearer.

If only this were true...

[oldnavy]

Thanks for retriving this post. I really enjoyed reviewing all the hype from Wheat on how good, really good this year's UNC squad was going to be...

Amazing how the color of one's glasses can affect one's vision. I wonder how it looks in hindsight?

[crimsonandblue]

Thanks for retriving this post. I really enjoyed reviewing all the hype from Wheat on how good, really good this year's UNC squad was going to be...

Amazing how the color of one's glasses can affect one's vision. I wonder how it looks in hindsight?

Kind of blue and red with a funny emblem in the middle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Haiti).

http://www.ebogjonson.com/files/images/Haiti-flag.gif

[gumbomoop]

Texas seems to have self-destructed, though not so thoroughly as the Heels. What's up? I vaguely recall some discussion - probably in the context of the persistent debate re Duke's relatively short rotation - that Rick, like Roy, plays too many, no rhythm, etc.

Who knows what's up - or down - with Texas?

[proelitedota]

wow, looks like someone needs a serving of delicious crow.

[77devil]

Schadenbump for Wheat...

Haven't seen Wheat around these parts lately. Probably seeking refuge at Inside Carolina.


Poor form on my part?

Not at all.

[Duvall]

I expect this years Heels to be a defensive and rebounding monster. I promise you a team will struggle to score on them.

Their length and athletism 1 thru 5- backed up by 6 thru 10- is awesome, and the opposing coaches know it.

They will score plenty to win, and we'll check back later, but I'd be willing to bet now that they will be one of the top, if not the top, rebounding and blocked shots teams in the country.

Putback jams will replace feathery Ellington 3's...and the individual talents by position seem to be complimentary...a nice fit.

I think LDII will be a solid/quality leader and PG, in the Jimmy Black mold. He is a good player with lots of talent around him. I especially like his anticipation defense. He can get into the passing lane to disrupt. His handle is good enough and decision making improved steadily all season, I see no reason to think he can't run this team well as a tested soph. He's no TL, but who is?

Graves can shoot it, make no mistake, and will get his chance to prove it. He reminds me of a Charles Barkley type player in that he is a tough player to match up with in that body frame relative to his skills. (Not that he plays like Barkley). If he could catch fire, get some confidence, or Mcdonald/Strickland can step up from deep, the skies the limit for this team.

They will make some youthful mistakes, but these are not average freshmen from what I read. Basically all 5 star talents. The learning curve is likely to be short. We'll see.

The few losses will come from the free throw line against the more wing oriented teams.

That's my quick preseason take of the Heels in a nutshell...and top 5 is about right, imo.

This is just...wow. I think we need to stop making fun of Wheat for his Bersticker boosterism now. This is so much worse.

[OldSchool]

I don't know why, but for some reason these fantastic over-the-top exaggerations by Wheat of the talents of the tar hole players in light of the harsh reality of their season brought to mind a scene from an Indiana Jones movie:


Professor Henry Jones: Marcus? You didn't drag poor Marcus along did you? He's not up to the challenge.

Walter Donovan: He sticks out like a sore thumb. We'll find him.

Indiana Jones: The hell you will. He's got a two day head start on you, which is more than he needs. Brody's got friends in every town and village from here to the Sudan, he speaks a dozen languages, knows every local custom, he'll blend in, disappear, you'll never see him again. With any luck, he's got the grail already.

[Cut to middle of fair in the Middle East, Marcus Brody wearing bright suit and white hat, sticking out like sore thumb]

Marcus Brody: Uhhh, does anyone here speak English?

[whereinthehellami]

This is just...wow. I think we need to stop making fun of Wheat for his Bersticker boosterism now. This is so much worse.

Too funny. I guess I should eat a plate of crow too though as I bought into the paper tiger that UNC was. Best crow I'll ever eat though.

[91_92_01_10_15]

This is just...wow. I think we need to stop making fun of Wheat for his Bersticker boosterism now. This is so much worse.

In fairness to Wheat, much of what he said about the players is true. Roy's inability to coach them would have been hard to predict in the preseason. I certainly did not.