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feldspar
10-20-2009, 12:51 PM
First the Goodfellas poster. Seriously?

Then this:

Link (http://beyondthearc.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/10/19/2102858.aspx)

We're the prep school nerds of the college basketball world.

Please, Duke. Please make it stop.

InSpades
10-20-2009, 01:00 PM
To get a guy like that to hate you, you must be doing something right. I'm not a huge fan of the poster to be honest, but to each his own. The videos are downright hilarious though.

Duvall
10-20-2009, 01:01 PM
First the Goodfellas poster. Seriously?

Then this:

Link (http://beyondthearc.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/10/19/2102858.aspx)

We're the prep school nerds of the college basketball world.

Please, Duke. Please make it stop.

The linked post is less than convincing, and actually refutes itself. The writer notes that every school has cheesy posters (and this is far from the cheesiest (http://www.blueplanetshots.com/True-Blue/Posterized/6411109_Nfo43#405971672_NMPN9) poster (http://www.blueplanetshots.com/True-Blue/Posterized/6411109_Nfo43#405971920_gmpVG) Duke has ever done) and admits that the video is "moderately amusing."

People don't hate Duke because of stuff like this. People make fun of stuff like this because they hate Duke.

And to be honest, I'm past caring why they hate Duke. But I'm sure that it isn't this silliness.

allenmurray
10-20-2009, 01:03 PM
First the Goodfellas poster. Seriously?

Then this:

Link (http://beyondthearc.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/10/19/2102858.aspx)

We're the prep school nerds of the college basketball world.

Please, Duke. Please make it stop.

They are 18, 19, 20 year old kids. It is all in fun. Relax.

cato
10-20-2009, 01:04 PM
I don't get it. Why would that be cause for hate?

ncexnyc
10-20-2009, 01:06 PM
I wasn't fond of the video clips, but I certainly wouldn't mind having the poster.:cool:

I guess it all comes down to one's individual tastes and if this provides more ammo for the multitude of Duke haters, then so be it.

Kedsy
10-20-2009, 01:09 PM
First the Goodfellas poster. Seriously?

Then this:

Link (http://beyondthearc.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/10/19/2102858.aspx)

We're the prep school nerds of the college basketball world.

Please, Duke. Please make it stop.

This is absolutely not why people hate us. People hate us because we come up with sayings like "We are Duke."

I remember in the early nineties when a lot of Duke fans at the Final Four were smug enough to wear buttons calling it the "Duke Invitational." That's why they hate us, not because some 20 year old kids were silly in front of a camera.

feldspar
10-20-2009, 01:19 PM
Sorry, I should have been more specific.

We are the nerdy prep school kids who always beat you at basketball.

That's why people hate us.

El_Diablo
10-20-2009, 01:30 PM
Sorry, I should have been more specific.

We are the nerdy prep school kids who always beat you at basketball.

That's why people hate us.

bingo

killerleft
10-20-2009, 01:33 PM
People hate us because we win a lot. That's it. While some of the stuff mentioned above doesn't help at times, it all comes down to winning. Why are some of us smug? We win. Why would a silly poster bother someone? We win. Etc., etc., etc.

I hope they hate Duke Football soon.

airowe
10-20-2009, 01:42 PM
El Diablo and KillerLeft hit the nail on the head. Nobody hates the Wolfpack. They're like your friend's little brother who never had a date to the dance. You just feel sorry for them because they can't ever seal the deal.

Let the haters hate. It means Duke's still winning. I grew up in Raleigh as a Duke fan. At a high school of around 1,000 people there were SIX Duke fans. We took pride in the fact that we weren't bandwagon fans (this continued as the bandwagon grew.) College basketball is not a popularity contest. Who cares if people don't like us?

dukiedevil89
10-20-2009, 01:44 PM
this is my favorite article about duke hatred...
http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/23258333/ns/sports-college_basketball/

key line: "Root for a Duke, and not only will the bench rider likely get a lucrative job after graduation: he may get a championship ring, too. No one likes a glutton."

I love when their hatred is actually a compliment!

Battierfan01
10-20-2009, 01:44 PM
I believe and have always believed that people hate Duke because they are JEALOUS of what this program has. There are a lot of programs out there that would give their "right arm" to have a 25 win season and go to the Sweet 16, yet when Duke does this, the season is considered a "failure" or a bad season. And no matter what people say, anybody in their right mind would love to have COACH K on their sideline, coaching their team. People have tired and tired for years to find a major flaw in this program and they just can't do it, so they turn to things like the team poster or a video.

Duvall
10-20-2009, 01:47 PM
Sorry, I should have been more specific.

We are the nerdy prep school kids who always beat you at basketball.

That's why people hate us.

Not much to be done about that.

rthomas
10-20-2009, 01:53 PM
It's college. Enjoy it while you can.

quickgtp
10-20-2009, 02:00 PM
If someone hates Duke more because of the poster or video then they are taking life WAY too seriously. That video was hilarious, IMO. To quote Seth:

"Send in the CLLLOOOOOOOONNNEEEEEE!!!!!!!"

RelativeWays
10-20-2009, 02:00 PM
As the internet kids all say these days "haters gonna hate". So what if the pleebs want to take the Goodfellas poster and the Duke Improv skit seriously and use it as "hate Duke". I don't want those people to be fans of my team, get lost. I love cheering the William Zabka of College basketball. In fact next year the team poster should have everyone in Cobra Kai Karate Gi's with the subtitle of "Sweep the Leg!". I'd give one to every EweNC fan I know.

eightyearoldsdude
10-20-2009, 02:01 PM
People hate us because we win a lot. That's it. While some of the stuff mentioned above doesn't help at times, it all comes down to winning. Why are some of us smug? We win. Why would a silly poster bother someone? We win. Etc., etc., etc.

I hope they hate Duke Football soon.

UNC wins more (lately, anyway) and I think most of you would agree that it is not nearly as hated as Duke. Anyway, the poster and video are both dorky, but it's not any different than some of the recent UNC posters or the dorky skits during Late Night with Roy, or most any other MM. It's just kids having fun, and it won't hurt recruiting.

However, their acting is terrible! Doesn't Duke have a good drama program??? ;)

roywhite
10-20-2009, 02:08 PM
Mostly, the "everybody hates us" thing is not a big deal. Generally it just means we win a lot.

The down side of the hate is:
Opposing fans cursing at family members of players, or holding up obscene posters about the player or family member
Proliferation of "Duke gets all the calls" comments in the basketball world which ultimately (even if subtly) can affect getting a fair break from officials
Potential harm to recruiting (some players may not want to go through being generally hated)

FireOgilvie
10-20-2009, 02:09 PM
UNC wins more (lately, anyway) and I think most of you would agree that it is not nearly as hated as Duke. Anyway, the poster and video are both dorky, but it's not any different than some of the recent UNC posters or the dorky skits during Late Night with Roy, or most any other MM. It's just kids having fun, and it won't hurt recruiting.

However, their acting is terrible! Doesn't Duke have a good drama program??? ;)

UNC wins more in the last 3 years or something. Duke has the most wins the past decade and is probably up there in the decade before that. In the last 3 years, the UNC hate, especially for Tyler Hansbrough, went way up. They are definitely the 2nd most hated team behind Duke lately, although I'm sure Kentucky will soon be near the top. Duke and UNC also have the most fans nationally (there are polls that come out every year).

I wouldn't feel too good about myself as a UNC fan when your National Championship-winning PG is telling everyone that will listen about how he wishes he would have left school 2 years earlier (and given up the championship).

CameronBornAndBred
10-20-2009, 02:25 PM
I don't see the beef with the poster or the videos. I think both are lots of fun.

MulletMan
10-20-2009, 02:34 PM
The best part of that article is that he suggests that pictures of Nolan held up from the Titanic sketch are going to somehow break his confidence. Uhhhh... kid did it because he HAS confidence and thought it would get a laugh. My bet is that when a bunch of Terp students hold pictures of Nolan up from that sketch he going to laugh, think to himself, "Man I gotcha," and then drop 25 points on them.

In the first half.

ALLOW ME TO REINTRODUCE MYSELF!

Battierfan01
10-20-2009, 02:52 PM
I totally agree with you MulletMan. I think Nolan has a ton of confidence and I hear that most of his teammates agree that he is the funniest person on the team. I think that if fans of other teams come with posters of Nolan from the video, this will only fuel his fire like it did with JJ.

JaMarcus Russell
10-20-2009, 02:53 PM
This is the kind of "article" that I would have only expected on a site like the Truth About Duke. I guess the author needed to turn something in by a specific deadline, so he had to create a news story.

The connection between Duke basketball and mob culture is so flimsy that it doesn't even deserve a response, and I guess the author has never seen Midnight Madness before in his life. There are similar skits at just about every university that does a Midnight Madness type of show for the fans. and the stuff that Duke did this year is downright funny, especially the skit with Nolan. Even if he has never heard of Midnight Madness before last week (and I think that is certainly possible), how could he have missed the Kansas freshman having to dress in goofy outfits? It was on ESPN, right alongside John Thompson doing a tribute to Michael Jackson and the Duke scrimmage highlights.

This writer seems like a complete buzzkill (or just very biased).

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 03:23 PM
UNC wins more in the last 3 years or something.

I don't really want to get into this, but unc wins more, period (as do Kansas and Kentucky).

So while it may be true that most people that hate Duke do so because of the wins, unc can't be counted in that group.

My challenge to Duke is to take a step back and look at the accomplishments from the outside.

It seems to me that the stat of "most wins in a decade" is often used defensively, justifying "only" two final fours and the sweet sixteen drought. I don't even need to ask if you'd trade records with unc this decade... I'll just repeat what many of you brought up long ago... aren't you prouder of the '90's than the 2000's? Proud isn't the right word, as you're always proud of your team, but wasn't the '90's more of an accomplished decade? So the "most wins" thing is a consolation prize at best to your own success the decade prior.

And while it didn't come up in this thread, the 2009 Conference Championship is much the same thing. Of course it's an accomplishment, but do you really want to boast it, particularly as a comeback to unc fans, when Duke went 0-2 against the regular season winner?

Please, try to remember what you said to Carolina fans in '91 when Duke swept Carolina and went on to win the championship...

And I'm assuming that mention needs to be made of Carolina's 8 - 20 year. Fine. Maybe Duke fans wouldn't want to trade decades with Carolina, because at least Duke doesn't have that stain, nor the shame of running out a coach. You probably know where I'm going with this, but I'm guessing Coach Gaudet's record is pretty similar to Doherty's second year.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's easy to dismiss those that hate you because of your wins. But those that hate you the most, hate you not because of the arrogance that comes with those wins, but the arrogance that comes with what you haven't won.

On the other hand, it could be for Nolan's amusing pose...

MulletMan
10-20-2009, 03:31 PM
This post was so confusing before I got to the bottom... then it just went off the charts!

So you don't want people to cherry-pick accomplishments to boast about, yet you then cherry-pick accomplishments to boast about? You don't want people to play-up little things like the ACC Tourney title, yet you down-play little things like an 8-20 season? Ha-Whaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

Anyway, thanks for posting that picture of Klang... it never fails to make me laugh. Problem is... he wasn't TRYING to be funny... Nolan was.

And by the by, there is no "regular season" winner of the ACC. There is no round-robin play anymore so there is merely a top seed for the ACC tournament... I'm sure that someday UNC fans will make that arguement when Duke is the top seed for the ACC tournament and then loses. Of course, that seems to happen a lot more to UNC, but I digress...

eightyearoldsdude
10-20-2009, 03:32 PM
UNC wins more in the last 3 years or something. Duke has the most wins the past decade and is probably up there in the decade before that. In the last 3 years, the UNC hate, especially for Tyler Hansbrough, went way up. They are definitely the 2nd most hated team behind Duke lately, although I'm sure Kentucky will soon be near the top. Duke and UNC also have the most fans nationally (there are polls that come out every year).

I wouldn't feel too good about myself as a UNC fan when your National Championship-winning PG is telling everyone that will listen about how he wishes he would have left school 2 years earlier (and given up the championship).

If you think it's only the last three years, or if the number of games won is the appropriate unit, then I guess there's not much I could say to convince you otherwise.

But I agree with your point about Hansbrough. I think the Tyler phenomenon is an example of a more general process that I think explains a lot of the hatred people have for certain programs. I would argue that the media and sportswriters specifically have a dialectic with respect to white basketball stars: when a hoops star is white, he starts receiving media attention that is disproportionate to his accomplishments on the court (and FTR, I don't think much, if any, of this is overt racism on the part of sportswriters). This prompts the inevitable backlash, as we all saw with Tyler and JJ and so on. The effect is heavily magnified if the player is good looking, preppy, a strong student, etc., and if the media also fawns on his off-the-court backstory. Anyway, I think that could explain some of the extra venom people reserve for Duke.

But just to reiterate, I think team posters (actually--why are the players blamed for those and not the media people?) and the midnight madness skits & videos are just kids being dorky and having fun, and they outta be able to do that without being mocked.

throatybeard
10-20-2009, 03:45 PM
People hate us not only because we win, but because we project a snotty, superior identity, much like New York Yankees fans. Winning isn't the only factor.

And yeah, that Goodfellas poster...I wish that hadn't made it out of committee.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
10-20-2009, 03:49 PM
Mostly, the "everybody hates us" thing is not a big deal. Generally it just means we win a lot.

The down side of the hate is:
Opposing fans cursing at family members of players, or holding up obscene posters about the player or family member
Proliferation of "Duke gets all the calls" comments in the basketball world which ultimately (even if subtly) can affect getting a fair break from officials
Potential harm to recruiting (some players may not want to go through being generally hated)

I completely agree. Growing up in Charlotte, I was the only Duke fan I knew in the 80's. I don't mind being hated - it shows people care.

The hate is a product of the winning, and I'm fine with that. As you mentioned, it's the outright meanness directed at the families of players that bothers me. The kids on the court make their own decisions and they can take the heckles and the chants like anyone else.

When you have incidents like at Maryland in recent years (Boozer's mom going to the hospital, JJ's little sister's harassment) I find it crass and repulsive. The families of the athletes should be able to go and revel in the success of their children and the team, not having to worry about abuse from the fans.

Maybe I'm just old fashioned, but giggling at snarky videos doesn't bother me at all. Trying to tell me that "Duke gets all the calls" doesn't bother me. Just at least respect the families.

JG Nothing
10-20-2009, 03:49 PM
I don't really want to get into this, but unc wins more, period (as do Kansas and Kentucky).

So while it may be true that most people that hate Duke do so because of the wins, unc can't be counted in that group.

My challenge to Duke is to take a step back and look at the accomplishments from the outside.

It seems to me that the stat of "most wins in a decade" is often used defensively, justifying "only" two final fours and the sweet sixteen drought. I don't even need to ask if you'd trade records with unc this decade... I'll just repeat what many of you brought up long ago... aren't you prouder of the '90's than the 2000's? Proud isn't the right word, as you're always proud of your team, but wasn't the '90's more of an accomplished decade? So the "most wins" thing is a consolation prize at best to your own success the decade prior.

And while it didn't come up in this thread, the 2009 Conference Championship is much the same thing. Of course it's an accomplishment, but do you really want to boast it, particularly as a comeback to unc fans, when Duke went 0-2 against the regular season winner?

Please, try to remember what you said to Carolina fans in '91 when Duke swept Carolina and went on to win the championship...

And I'm assuming that mention needs to be made of Carolina's 8 - 20 year. Fine. Maybe Duke fans wouldn't want to trade decades with Carolina, because at least Duke doesn't have that stain, nor the shame of running out a coach. You probably know where I'm going with this, but I'm guessing Coach Gaudet's record is pretty similar to Doherty's second year.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's easy to dismiss those that hate you because of your wins. But those that hate you the most, hate you not because of the arrogance that comes with those wins, but the arrogance that comes with what you haven't won.

On the other hand, it could be for Nolan's amusing pose...

A unc fan calling another school's fans arrogant is pretty laughable. unc fans do not hate Duke because of "the arrogance that comes with what [we] haven't won" (I bet you were really proud of yourself when you came up with that clever line :rolleyes:). Duke and unc have a rivalry with a whole history behind it that cannot be reduced to one factor. Rivals typically hate each other because they are rivals...period.

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 03:59 PM
This post was so confusing before I got to the bottom... then it just went off the charts!

So you don't want people to cherry-pick accomplishments to boast about, yet you then cherry-pick accomplishments to boast about? You don't want people to play-up little things like the ACC Tourney title, yet you down-play little things like an 8-20 season? Ha-Whaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

Anyway, thanks for posting that picture of Klang... it never fails to make me laugh. Problem is... he wasn't TRYING to be funny... Nolan was.

And by the by, there is no "regular season" winner of the ACC. There is no round-robin play anymore so there is merely a top seed for the ACC tournament... I'm sure that someday UNC fans will make that arguement when Duke is the top seed for the ACC tournament and then loses. Of course, that seems to happen a lot more to UNC, but I digress...


I'm sorry, I wasn't cherry-picking unc so much as countering the biggest two Duke accomplishments that came out of 2009, the ACC championship and ending the decade with the most wins. But I can be broader... Carolina has more wins in every category... wins, national championships, conference championships, yes... regular season championships, and head-to-head. I'd have to research, but maybe even Helm's titles ;).

And I definitely wasn't downplaying 8 - 20. I'm completely owning it. Just saying that in a decade of 5 Championship Games and back-to-back titles, Duke also saw the extremes a coaching shift can bring.

I've always hated Dick Vitale's claim that Duke is the Yankees, and everyone hates both because they always win. The Yankees have won a hundred championships... Duke has won three. Maybe people hate Duke because they're not the Yankees.

And you're welcome for the Klang. I threw that in to balance any tone that may have been perceived over a message board. I really try to be respectful, being a visitor and all...

airowe
10-20-2009, 04:00 PM
People hate us not only because we win, but because we project a snotty, superior identity, much like New York Yankees fans. Winning isn't the only factor.

And yeah, that Goodfellas poster...I wish that hadn't made it out of committee.

Speak for yourself. I'm pretty fair-minded when it comes to college basketball and I don't think I (or any of my other Duke fan friends) portray that kind of attitude. It's true that most stereotypes have a basis in reality but you can't generalize all of the Duke fanbase like that. There's a bad apple in every bunch.

Duvall
10-20-2009, 04:07 PM
I guess what I'm saying is that it's easy to dismiss those that hate you because of your wins. But those that hate you the most, hate you not because of the arrogance that comes with those wins, but the arrogance that comes with what you haven't won.

Bollocks.

The hatred of UNC fans and alumni for Duke University and everything associated with it is far too complex to be summed up as a reaction to arrogance of any kind. It involves issues of class, academic insecurity, regional bias and the occasional echoes of Lost Causism. Also, basketball.

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 04:08 PM
A unc fan calling another school's fans arrogant is pretty laughable.

Agree completely, but the thread is not about why people hate unc.


unc fans do not hate Duke because of "the arrogance that comes with what [we] haven't won" (I bet you were really proud of yourself when you came up with that clever line :rolleyes:). Duke and unc have a rivalry with a whole history behind it that cannot be reduced to one factor. Rivals typically hate each other because they are rivals...period.

Well said (all of it).

mo.st.dukie
10-20-2009, 04:11 PM
I say we do more stuff to make them hate us even more. They already have their perceptions of Duke fans/players as being arrogant, smug, whatever so it's not like those opinions are going to change. Heck, Coach K is one of the most generous coaches out there giving money to charities and helping out those less fortunate yet opposing fans still think he's the devil for whatever reason. Who cares if they hate us? It makes it that much more fun when we beat them. I think the players should pay close attention to all the things said about Duke, and for all I know they do. Listening to all the haters and people telling you that you can't do something only fuels the fire even more, keeps you hungry and motivated. Judging by some comments made by the upperclassmen I'd say this team if focusing on making a statement to all those who hate/doubt Duke.

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 04:12 PM
Bollocks.

The hatred of UNC fans and alumni for Duke University and everything associated with it is far too complex to be summed up as a reaction to arrogance of any kind. It involves issues of class, academic insecurity, regional bias and the occasional echoes of Lost Causism. Also, basketball.

Very, very true. But the arrogance doesn't help...

BD80
10-20-2009, 04:15 PM
Agree completely, but the thread is not about why people hate unc. ...

Wait, isn't there a thread here for that?

"The longest thread ever?"

Welcome2DaSlopes
10-20-2009, 04:16 PM
I'm i the only one who like the new poster?

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 04:21 PM
And somewhat back on the original topic, if Ginyard were laying naked on a couch and Drew II drawing him... really, would it get the same positive reaction, or would more people be calling it creepy?

Part of my whole rambling was just to point out that fanbases should ask themselves what they would say if their rival did the same thing.

NSDukeFan
10-20-2009, 04:22 PM
I'm i the only one who like the new poster?

I like it, though I like Wojo's performance in the skit much more.

SMO
10-20-2009, 04:25 PM
And somewhat back on the original topic, if Ginyard were laying naked on a couch and Drew II drawing him... really, would it get the same positive reaction, or would more people be calling it creepy?

Part of my whole rambling was just to point out that fanbases should ask themselves what they would say if their rival did the same thing.

Well, "arrogance" is about the last thing I would accuse them of if they did that.

El_Diablo
10-20-2009, 04:26 PM
Carolina has more wins in every category... wins, national championships, conference championships, yes... regular season championships, and head-to-head.

No offense, but people don't really care about 1957, and the collective memory of 1982 is pretty weak as well. So throwing those out there doesn't really explain why people should hate UNC more than Duke. I mean, by that logic, UCLA should be the most hated team then, right? Same logic for the most wins "in history"...we weren't around in the 20s and 30s, so why do should people really care how good your 5 white players were when they beat Kentucky's 5 white players in some high school gym by a score of 23-22?

The hatred for Duke is partially about WHEN...not just HOW MANY. Over the last 20-25 years, when college basketball has exploded (thanks to the creation of ESPN), Duke has been pretty dominant. 3 titles...not "100" titles, but who has more in that period? UNC is right there too now, and you'll probably see a lot more outside hatred coming UNC's way if you keep rolling like you have for the past few years. But it won't be because you have some titles or extra wins back in the day...it's because you'd be hogging the spotlight NOW, much like we have for the past couple decades. I mean, almost every Duke game is nationally televised, and it has been this way for several years now.

For most teams, you can point out their terrible graduation rates. Or thuggish players. Or huge recruiting scandals. Or their coaches doing bad things in a restaurant after hours. Not for Duke--people hate that Duke can win cleanly, and do it with people who aren't always the most athletic people in the world. All the haters can do is bite their tongue when we win and gloat whenever we lose. It's happened more frequently recently, so the gloating is just louder and more frequent. Oh well. But once we turn it around on the court and start delivering in March, the haters will mostly scamper off again until we have another down period.

El_Diablo
10-20-2009, 04:32 PM
And somewhat back on the original topic, if Ginyard were laying naked on a couch and Drew II drawing him... really, would it get the same positive reaction, or would more people be calling it creepy?

Part of my whole rambling was just to point out that fanbases should ask themselves what they would say if their rival did the same thing.

"creepy" does not mean "hate-inducing"

I wouldn't "hate" UNC any more if I saw that. I'd probably laugh to myself, and then rib all of my UNC friends about it. :)

But I still don't get why someone should hate Duke for that skit...

JaMarcus Russell
10-20-2009, 04:32 PM
I like it, though I like Wojo's performance in the skit much more.

Agreed 100%. I thought the dunk contest was a great idea, the skits were funny, and Wojo and Nolan showed some decent comedic talent.

ETA


And somewhat back on the original topic, if Ginyard were laying naked on a couch and Drew II drawing him... really, would it get the same positive reaction, or would more people be calling it creepy?

I would give them a ton of props for not taking themselves seriously. It's always good to see athletes behaving like regular people instead of repeating cliches about thanking God and giving 100+% effort.

Bostondevil
10-20-2009, 04:33 PM
There is one category where Duke beats UNC in wins.

National Championships
Coach K - 3
Dean Smith - 2

It's the only one I care about. K has more national championships than Dean and always will.



The only one who showed semi-decent acting ability was Nolan. He actually did some acting. I'm a director. I could cast him in something. The rest of them? Not so much.

airowe
10-20-2009, 04:35 PM
Very, very true. But the arrogance doesn't help...

This arrogance you speak of is present in every fanbase with success, even your Tarheel brethren.

I think a lot of the perceived national hate of Duke comes from who hates us. UK fans still hate us because of The Shot and Carolina fans hate us because we're their rival, and they should. Not to mention the constant aggrandizing of every move by national media folks like Gregg Doyel and many others from UNC's journalism school which puts many in the field largely due to it's size.

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 04:35 PM
Well, "arrogance" is about the last thing I would accuse them of if they did that.

Agree completely. And while I do hope that Duke gets made fun of for their choice of skit, I almost wish it had been a rival in order to hear what the Crazies would do with it, rather than what one might expect from, say, Maryland fans.

Fingers crossed, Carolina does nothing to shame themselves.

Also, for what it's worth, I like the new poster well enough. Certainly more than Carolina's "300" pose.

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 04:42 PM
There is one category where Duke beats UNC in wins.

National Championships
Coach K - 3
Dean Smith - 2

It's the only one I care about. K has more national championships than Dean and always will.


Couple that with the soon-to-be-most overall wins, and you'd certainly have an argument as to one being the better coach. I'm not going to make that argument, but I certainly wouldn't argue against it...

SMO
10-20-2009, 04:46 PM
Agree completely. And while I do hope that Duke gets made fun of for their choice of skit, I almost wish it had been a rival in order to hear what the Crazies would do with it, rather than what one might expect from, say, Maryland fans.

Fingers crossed, Carolina does nothing to shame themselves.

Also, for what it's worth, I like the new poster well enough. Certainly more than Carolina's "300" pose.

Now that you mention it, I remember the "300" pose. For what it's worth, my reaction was along the lines of, "that's weird". Maybe that makes me arrogant in some minds. Didn't make me hate them more or less. It's a poster for crying out loud.

airowe
10-20-2009, 04:51 PM
Fingers crossed, Carolina does nothing to shame themselves.


The dressing in drag thing from last year's event certainly drew a lot of hate from other fanbases, including Duke's. Like someone said earlier, its just kids having fun. We should just leave it at that...

shoutingncu
10-20-2009, 04:53 PM
Now that you mention it, I remember the "300" pose. For what it's worth, my reaction was along the lines of, "that's weird". Maybe that makes me arrogant in some minds. Didn't make me hate them more or less. It's a poster for crying out loud.

Yeah, I don't hate Duke any more after seeing either the skits or poster than I did the day before.

I agree with those that say the original article linked is silly.

Bostondevil
10-20-2009, 04:55 PM
Agree completely, but the thread is not about why people hate unc.






This the Duke Basketball Report, every thread is about why people hate UNC. Including the Longest Thread Ever.

Bostondevil
10-20-2009, 04:58 PM
It is however possible to hate Tyler Hansborough more after he's shown taking all the credit for saving puppies when he did none of the real work. ;)

(I wink, but I still hate him more than ever before.)

RelativeWays
10-20-2009, 05:02 PM
EweNC, Twerp and maybe UK fans aside, most people hate Duke, because they are sheeple and they love to climb on the hate bandwagon because they want to fit in with everyone else, the media plays on it to get cheap hits. Seriously, you're a fan of a Pac-10, Big 12, Big 10 or SEC team and you "hate" Duke? Shut up and try to get an original thought for a change. Duke doesn't play your team except maybe in the tourney once in a blue moon or some preseason match up. Thats not much of a foundation for hate. "BUT DOOD, DEY TAWK ABOUT DUKE AW DA TYME ON ESPN, I HATES 'EM" Yes, media fatigue can contribute to one's dislike of a team, I'm certainly tired of the red sox, Yankees and Pats because ESPN is constantly yapping about them. But being sick of, and sports hate are two different things. I don't hate the Yankees because I have no need to. My team, the Cubs is national league, and will only play the Yanks in those rare post season crossovers. I'd much rather hate the White Sox or Cardinals (sorry Throaty but you know how it is). I don't hate the Patriots either, because the Saints seldom play them (though they do this year) but I HATE HATE HATE the Falcons, can't stand 'em and love it when they lose. Because ATL and NO are actually rivals. If your team has no natural or historical rivalry with Duke, shut up and bug off, find a new bandwagon to ride. You're obviously incapable of driving yourself anywhere.

weezie
10-20-2009, 05:33 PM
"Don Wojo" was great!

But seriously...the blog writer transferred TO Kansas to watch Paul Pierce play? hahahaha
From where?

Son of Mojo
10-20-2009, 06:40 PM
First and foremost, I liked the poster. Although I actually think the theme would work better for unc (mob buying their titles & calls..........I keed, I keed........maybe :p ). The Cobra Kai idea would RULE--Sweep the Leg shirts would be great. Personally I cannot stand the Yankees comparison that gets attached to us. I think it's more applicable to the holes due to the entitled attitudes both fanbases possess. One last comment--why is it when others win the ACC tournament, it is the absolute be-all, end-all event of events, but when we win the tournament it doesn't matter? :rolleyes: I'm really getting amped for the season to start--football team doing well & appears to be improving and a very talented hoops team getting ready to begin. I like our chances to finish well in both sports.

dukemsu
10-20-2009, 09:20 PM
Nothing on that video or that poster is any dorkier than Danny Green's dancing the last ten years.

GTHC.

My only suggestion is to lighten up. It's college.

dukemsu

dukeballer2294
10-20-2009, 09:50 PM
i personally love the pic, seth curry looks like a thug

El_Diablo
10-20-2009, 10:28 PM
Honestly, our poster is a lot better than this:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_DNWziKTu2TU/Rx_9mweY1ZI/AAAAAAAAAQY/gMci5-8nUFo/s1600/283143149.jpg

-jk
10-20-2009, 11:08 PM
Sorry to be late to jump in, but I'll see your Lang and raise you a Kenny!

-jk

jkidd31
10-20-2009, 11:19 PM
I thought the video was a riot.

gumbomoop
10-21-2009, 08:16 AM
Bollocks.

The hatred of UNC fans and alumni for Duke University and everything associated with it is far too complex to be summed up as a reaction to arrogance of any kind. It involves issues of class, academic insecurity, regional bias and the occasional echoes of Lost Causism. Also, basketball.

Duvall gets bumped up to first team All-ACC for this post. And IIRC, one can find some evidence for several of these factors in a perhaps surprising place: the UNC-grad Will Blythe's wonderful book, "To Hate Like This Is To Be Happy Forever." Duvall's subtle point about "occasional echoes of Lost Causism," for example, is related to Blythe's comments about Southern religion. Good stuff, even if Blythe's story is, for the most part, lighter and smile-inducing.

Props to Blythe and Duvall.

CLT Devil
10-21-2009, 09:19 AM
My Tarhole friends sent me that video...I tried to counter w/ the 300 poster, but there really is no comparison. I almost had to turn off when Wojo came on because I was embarrassed for him...but the whole Smith naked skit was a bit much. I dunno, I just think they could have come up with something a little funnier/wittier that. I am with the original poster who said this is why people hate Duke...although I wouldn't say 'hate' - but more like 'this is why Duke is a bunch of dorks.' I know other teams do skits, but this was a planned skit that was very goofy...and a little disturbing at times.

CLT
Duke '02

Wheat/"/"/"
10-21-2009, 09:34 AM
Sorry to be late to jump in, but I'll see your Lang and raise you a Kenny!

-jk

Now that's funny..."raise you a Kenny" ...(slaps knee)...:)

I think we forget over the years just how daring we were in college...and silly in retrospect. Let 'em all have some fun.

Exiled_Devil
10-21-2009, 10:29 AM
And somewhat back on the original topic, if Ginyard were laying naked on a couch and Drew II drawing him... really, would it get the same positive reaction, or would more people be calling it creepy?

Part of my whole rambling was just to point out that fanbases should ask themselves what they would say if their rival did the same thing.

Eff the other fanbases.

When did their opinions ever matter? Things like this don't contribute to them throwing things at our player's families or screaming obscenities at our players nonstop. What contributes to those things? A serious lack of civilitiy combined with a desire to be more like us.

I used to hang out on an ACC board in the early part of the decade. Other fan bases thought we were dorks for tenting, and then consulted with line monitors to figure out how to handle lines for big games. They thought the Crazies were doofus's for the cheers (and cheer sheets) and then they hired a consultatn in, pumped music into the stadium and wore tie die.

Again, who cares if the fans hate Duke and Duke fans. The reason it happens is becuase of consistent winning, consistent graduation and the consistent success of the students both in school and after. I''m not a Duke alum and I can see this. There is no doubt some Duke fans are arrogant, like some fans of all teams. However, Duke students have a reason to feel good about themselves and their situation. Accusing them of arrogance is a typical defense mechanism for someone disliking success in others.

Bluedog
10-21-2009, 11:13 AM
Well, they showed clips of the video on ESPN last night (on the TERRIBLE show called SportsNation, but I saw they were about to talk about Duke, so I stayed on the channel), including Nolan's Titanic role...along with some random person's twitter opinion that it's "stupid" or something. I personally think the video is hilarious.

allenmurray
10-21-2009, 11:16 AM
Well, they showed clips of the video on ESPN last night (on the TERRIBLE show called SportsNation, but I saw they were about to talk about Duke, so I stayed on the channel), including Nolan's Titanic role...along with some random person's twitter opinion that it's "stupid" or something. I personally think the video is hilarious.

People "twittering" in response to an ESPN show about what a bunch of 18 & 19 year old college kids are doing for fun is the very definition of stupid.

I agree that the video was fun. The poster was okay, not the best one I have seen, but again, it was proably fun for a bunch of college kids.

feldspar
10-21-2009, 11:43 AM
Eff the other fanbases.


Keep it classy, Ex.

When Duke does stuff like this, it it's cool and just a bunch of kids having fun. But when a Carolina player sprawls out on the bench for a photo he's mocked mercilessly until the end of time.

Got it. This thread has been even more enlightening than I had hoped for.

Duvall
10-21-2009, 12:10 PM
When Duke does stuff like this, it's cool and just a bunch of kids having fun. But when a Carolina player sprawls out on the bench for a photo he's mocked mercilessly until the end of time.


That's a sloppy argument. Duke fans have and will continue to mock Kris Lang for that picture, but they don't hate Lang and Carolina because of the picture. They hate Carolina for much more permanent and substantial reasons.

No one has suggested that opposing fans won't mock Duke with this. I'm sure they will. But they don't hate Duke because they are mocking the video, they are mocking the video because they hate Duke.

flyingdutchdevil
10-21-2009, 12:39 PM
In all honesty, I hope that people make fun of us for this amazing video collection. Would we make fun of Larry Drew II had he removed all his clothes minus the "ice"? Absolutely! It's why I find the Scheyer-face posters so funny.

Mockery is one aspect of the college basketball fan experience. Nolan knew exactly what he was getting into when he made that. If Nolan complains about being made fun of for that video, which I'm very confident he won't, I will have absolutely no sympathy.

Mockery can easily go too far, however (thinking profanity and Maryland with JJ and Singler). That said, I'm looking forward to the ways that opposing fans make fun of Nolan. And something tells me that Nolan will use that energy on the floor.

Billy Dat
10-21-2009, 01:28 PM
How about a more basic analysis of why the nation seems to hate Duke more than UNC....

The UNC basketball program is, culturally, boring.

-Compared to ol' Roy, K is like Denis Rodman
-Compared to the wine and cheesers, the Crazies are like the English soccer fans
-Compared to the Dean Dome, Cameron is like CBGBs (R.I.P)

There's so much "tradition" at Carolina, that I can practically smell musty old books as I type this.

Bring on the hate, at least people are interested enough to care.

RelativeWays
10-21-2009, 02:28 PM
Keep it classy, Ex.

When Duke does stuff like this, it it's cool and just a bunch of kids having fun. But when a Carolina player sprawls out on the bench for a photo he's mocked mercilessly until the end of time.

Got it. This thread has been even more enlightening than I had hoped for.

Actually both are true. It is just college kids having fun and UNC players shouldn't care what Duke fans think about their posters and skits anymore than Duke players should care what UNC fans think about..well, anything really.
At the same time, when your arch-rival does something goofy or awkward, you tease them, mercilessly. The key is maintaining perspective. I think the Klang picture and the Beaker glamourshot montage are hilarious, because it makes Duke's archrival look goofy. I also have the common sense to know that those pictures don't really say anything or real value or merit. I'm not going to really judge Klang, Beaker or EweNC based on those, or the silly skits. They're just funny and its low hanging schadenfreude fruit. I'd imagine that most hole fans feel the same way about Nolan and the other Duke skits, but I have a hope that they're smart enough not to take them too seriously.

Where I draw the line are tha bandwagoners and bloggers who essentially cry out "hey I hate Duke too, aren't I cool, can I sit at the cool table with you guys, will you give my meritless blog cheap hits. I wanna hate Duke too, its fun and easy and I don't have to try" Carolina fans forget that they've already been here, with Deano, they were easily the most hated team in the ACC until Dean retired. But, no internet, or youtube, or pointless blogs seeking hits. Just wait. Wait till K retires and if Roy is still around, I guarantee the internet sports cynic will turn on Huckleberry Hound faster than he can chug a coke.

elvis14
10-21-2009, 03:07 PM
How about a more basic analysis of why the nation seems to hate Duke more than UNC....

There are three types of people that hate Duke:


People that hate the ESPN image of Duke
People who love teams that have lost to Duke (understandable)
TarHole fans

There are three types of people that hate UNC:


People that have spent a significant amount of time around UNC fans
People who love teams that have lost to UNC
Duke fans

El_Diablo
10-21-2009, 03:38 PM
There are three types of people that hate Duke:


People that hate the ESPN image of Duke
People who love teams that have lost to Duke (understandable)
TarHole fans

There are three types of people that hate UNC:


People that have spent a significant amount of time around UNC fans
People who love teams that have lost to UNC
Duke fans



There are also people who just like to drink this

http://vinceparker.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/haterade.gif

simply because they like the taste of it, and it makes them forget so many things about themselves that they'd rather not address...

Matches
10-21-2009, 04:04 PM
The hatred for Duke is partially about WHEN...not just HOW MANY. Over the last 20-25 years, when college basketball has exploded (thanks to the creation of ESPN), Duke has been pretty dominant. 3 titles...not "100" titles, but who has more in that period? UNC is right there too now, and you'll probably see a lot more outside hatred coming UNC's way if you keep rolling like you have for the past few years. But it won't be because you have some titles or extra wins back in the day...it's because you'd be hogging the spotlight NOW, much like we have for the past couple decades. I mean, almost every Duke game is nationally televised, and it has been this way for several years now.



Almost every UNC game is nationally televised, too, and it's been that way for quite some time. Despite UNC's success over the last several years AND the fact that their signature player was a goofy-looking white kid, you'd have to agree I think that there's not so much outside hatred for UNC as there is for us. Certainly WE hate on them, but UNC-hating is a regional rather than a national phenomenon. If the Heels continue to win over the next few years, and the national hate doesn't develop, how will we as a group explain that?

The hatred for Duke isn't JUST because we win a lot. Lots of teams win a lot. Florida wins a lot in both football and basketball. The Spurs won 4 NBA titles in the last decade. Those teams aren't hated - success alone doesn't do it; there's almost always something more.

People hate the Yankees because their seemingly-unlimited funds mean they can buy up all the good players. People hate the Patriots because their coach is a jerk who got caught cheating.

And people hate Duke because we - and by "we" I mean the coaching staff, the fans, and occasionally the players, sometimes project a self-righteous condescending attitude. We unfortunately spend a lot of time talking about how special we are. When we win, the attitude we project is that we didn't win because we ran faster, jumped higher, shot better, but because we were better *people*. Our fanbase repeats "we will win because we are Duke" like a mantra at times. THAT's the arrogance people are talking about - you combine that with the (unfair at times, fair at others) perception that we're a nerdy group, and presto - Instant Hater-Ade.

With that said, a goofy video or poster seems like a dumb reason to "hate" on 18 and 19-year old kids.

El_Diablo
10-21-2009, 04:31 PM
Almost every UNC game is nationally televised, too, and it's been that way for quite some time. Despite UNC's success over the last several years AND the fact that their signature player was a goofy-looking white kid, you'd have to agree I think that there's not so much outside hatred for UNC as there is for us. Certainly WE hate on them, but UNC-hating is a regional rather than a national phenomenon. If the Heels continue to win over the next few years, and the national hate doesn't develop, how will we as a group explain that?

The hatred for Duke isn't JUST because we win a lot. Lots of teams win a lot. Florida wins a lot in both football and basketball. The Spurs won 4 NBA titles in the last decade. Those teams aren't hated - success alone doesn't do it; there's almost always something more.

People hate the Yankees because their seemingly-unlimited funds mean they can buy up all the good players. People hate the Patriots because their coach is a jerk who got caught cheating.

And people hate Duke because we - and by "we" I mean the coaching staff, the fans, and occasionally the players, sometimes project a self-righteous condescending attitude. We unfortunately spend a lot of time talking about how special we are. When we win, the attitude we project is that we didn't win because we ran faster, jumped higher, shot better, but because we were better *people*. Our fanbase repeats "we will win because we are Duke" like a mantra at times. THAT's the arrogance people are talking about - you combine that with the (unfair at times, fair at others) perception that we're a nerdy group, and presto - Instant Hater-Ade.

With that said, a goofy video or poster seems like a dumb reason to "hate" on 18 and 19-year old kids.

Yeah, that post was in response to someone else pointing out that UNC has more wins than us historically. I was simply saying that it doesn't translate quite as easily. Obviously, there's more to it than winning--I was just trying to address that aspect of it. Duvall summed the whole issue up best I think:

http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=322316&postcount=33

Bostondevil
10-21-2009, 04:35 PM
Disagree with you almost entirely, Matches. I don't live in Durham anymore, haven't for years. Up here, Duke fans don't have that reputation so much. Nobody sees us as more obnoxious than well, UConn fans have a bad rap around here. So, quite frankly, do Carolina fans. We're not seen as worse and among a certain group of guys I know, we're not even on the radar of fanbases they hate.

One other thing that surpised me about your post. People hate the Pats!?! Since when? ;) And we love Bill Bellichik.