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Newton_14
10-18-2009, 03:23 PM
I wanted to give Miles his own thread as a place to discuss how well he may play this year and what the expectations of Miles are of the good folks on this board..

I got to campus a little early Friday night and enjoyed some of the pregame activities and there was quite the buzz about "The Plumlee Boys". A lot of talk about their impact on this years team.

I overheard one conversation between a couple of Iron Dukes, and one made the comment that insiders say Miles got better the minute Mason arrived on campus. It seemed to both energize him and make him more comfortable all at once.

I am really hoping that both Miles and Mason play well enough to play starters minutes all year long as I believe that will greatly help this team.

So just what will we see from Miles this year? Does he put it together and become a solid performer on both ends? He scored 10 points in the CTC scrimmage and looked good out there for the most part.

Thoughts??

FireOgilvie
10-18-2009, 03:57 PM
I expect Miles to have a breakout year and probably average 25 min/game, maybe more. I think he's going to be better than Mason this year, which is saying a lot because I think Mason is going to be very solid, particularly for a freshman. I really like the way Miles has developed in the offseason.

As far as I know, when Miles and Mason played together in HS, Miles averaged more points and rebounds. Miles is the better leaper. It should be fun to watch them play together.

Given that, I am guessing that Miles averages single-digit scoring, maybe 9 pts/game. I think Mason will end up around 7 pts/game. They are going to be sharing a lot of time with Lance and Zoubek, so those numbers aren't as high as they could be with more time.

SilkyJ
10-18-2009, 04:57 PM
I expect Miles to have a breakout year and probably average 25 min/game, maybe more. I think he's going to be better than Mason this year, which is saying a lot because I think Mason is going to be very solid, particularly for a freshman. I really like the way Miles has developed in the offseason.


I think Miles will play a lot this year, but I'm not quite where you are just yet. If he plays better than Mason, which is entirely possible, then we could be in for a stellar year. Both of their ceilings appear to be well above LT's or BZ's so if they can each earn 20+mpg I think our ceiling as a time is much higher. Lance will be the consummate glue guy this year though and will play a role that K loves so I expect him to eat into their mins. BZ is a bit of an X factor, but if Miles has bulked up and can bang in a mold similar to McBob then that will really eat up BZ's mins.


As far as I know, when Miles and Mason played together in HS, Miles averaged more points and rebounds. Miles is the better leaper. It should be fun to watch them play together.

That's scary. The only problem is that he knows how good of a leaper he is, so last year he went for wayyy too many blocks and got beat on a backside rebound or something similar. They've got the physical gifts, it all comes down to the mental part for both these guys.

DevilCastDownfromDurham
10-18-2009, 06:34 PM
I think Miles will play a lot this year, but I'm not quite where you are just yet. If he plays better than Mason, which is entirely possible, then we could be in for a stellar year. Both of their ceilings appear to be well above LT's or BZ's so if they can each earn 20+mpg I think our ceiling as a time is much higher. Lance will be the consummate glue guy this year though and will play a role that K loves so I expect him to eat into their mins. BZ is a bit of an X factor, but if Miles has bulked up and can bang in a mold similar to McBob then that will really eat up BZ's mins.

I'm obviously not an "expect the best" guy but I have very high hopes for the Super Plumlee Bros. As good as they each are, I'm excited about using them as a 1-2 punch together. As several people have noted, their physical gifts are elite so the real question is one of chemistry and experience. Playing together I feel like they really have a leg up in that area since they already have chemistry together and big bro has a year under his belt.

I by no means expect them to be break out stars (and I think a lot of the summer hype will slow down as games become less about freewheeling dunks and more about smart reads and proper hedging/recovering) but I think they compliment each other very well and when they are on court together the whole will be much greater than the sum of their parts. If the Big Three can be as good as we hope I think the Plumlees' athleticism and versatility can be used to very good effect off of double teams and covering the paint.

Newton_14
10-18-2009, 07:14 PM
At this point I am cautiously optimistic about Miles. I do think he has all the skills and physical talents needed to excel in college basketball. Playing with Mason will certainly help him as you guys have noted and I think that works both ways. They should feed off of each other while playing together, while also pushing each other the times in practice they are paired against each other.

They will definitely bring a lot to this team if they both play well. It's exciting as to me they are one of the keys to how far this team can go down the road. And with the rise of Nolan, we do not need them to be the main scoring options. They just need to rule the interior blocking/altering shots, rebounding like mad men, and getting a lot of garbage baskets.

Miles showed some promise last year, but I felt he spent too much time "thinking" out there verses just playing.

I am going to stay positive and predict that Miles locks down the starting role and starts every game this year. I am looking forward to seeing how this first month or two progresses and just how far Miles has come. I am pulling hard for him thats for sure!

houstondukie
10-18-2009, 10:29 PM
I expect them to have both great games and lousy games this year. They need more experience before they will be consistent. But when they do, and I think it will most likely be next season and not this season, they will make an awesome frontcourt to go with what should be a deep and talented backcourt.

sagegrouse
10-18-2009, 11:01 PM
Ah, conventional wisdom. It's early in the pre-season, and I don't have the slightest idea what's gonna happen this year with Miles, Mason, Zoubs, and LT.

However, in just two days of live practice, conventional wisdom has been stood on its head. We went through the summer with quotes from players and coaches extolling the talent of Mason Plumlee and his inevitable leadership role on the team -- right away. Most of the other discussion was about how the other big men would fight for minutes and the second starting spot.

Now, we hear that Miles is ahead of Mason, and Mason may be slow in adjusting to college play, whatever his upside.

I dunno if this is the new CW or not, but I look forward to its next iteration.

sagegrouse
'My oft-stated position is to reserve judgment on freshmen 6-10 and up.'

sagegrouse

FireOgilvie
10-18-2009, 11:11 PM
Ah, conventional wisdom. It's early in the pre-season, and I don't have the slightest idea what's gonna happen this year with Miles, Mason, Zoubs, and LT.

However, in just two days of live practice, conventional wisdom has been stood on its head. We went through the summer with quotes from players and coaches extolling the talent of Mason Plumlee and his inevitable leadership role on the team -- right away. Most of the other discussion was about how the other big men would fight for minutes and the second starting spot.

Now, we hear that Miles is ahead of Mason, and Mason may be slow in adjusting to college play, whatever his upside.

I dunno if this is the new CW or not, but I look forward to its next iteration.

sagegrouse
'My oft-stated position is to reserve judgment on freshmen 6-10 and up.'

sagegrouse

I'm not sure much has changed regarding Mason. People still think he's going to have a very solid freshman year. I think the real difference is the amount of improvement that Miles has shown already.

Bob Green
10-18-2009, 11:33 PM
My expectation for Miles Plumlee is to see a vast improvement on defense over last season. He should grab some rebounds and score some points, but I'll refrain from making any kind of WAG prediction. For Mason, once he adjusts, my expectation is for him to grab a lot of rebounds and score some points. Again, no WAG from me.

I also expect Zoubek to earn his minutes and contribute to our solid front line. Thomas will play starters minutes but I'm curious as to how he will be employed this season. He will definitely be on the court when Duke needs to press, but I'm sure Coach K will suprise us all with the way he employs Thomas.

Our front court future appears solid with the Plumlee Brothers and I'm looking forward to the games starting. The athleticism Miles and Mason bring onto the court will create problems for our opponents and excitement for us fans. I expect we will see some alley oops off inbound passes.

Edouble
10-18-2009, 11:58 PM
That's scary. The only problem is that he knows how good of a leaper he is, so last year he went for wayyy too many blocks and got beat on a backside rebound or something similar. They've got the physical gifts, it all comes down to the mental part for both these guys.


Miles showed some promise last year, but I felt he spent too much time "thinking" out there verses just playing.

Not that anyone's wrong or anyone's right, but I think it is interesting to look at two different perspectives on Miles, that to me, seem to be opposites.

Greg_Newton
10-19-2009, 12:38 AM
Not that anyone's wrong or anyone's right, but I think it is interesting to look at two different perspectives on Miles, that to me, seem to be opposites.

I think he was "thinking" too much on offense, which made him look awkward with the ball. He looks a lot more confident now in that respect. However, he may need to think a little more on defense... if he's not a little more disciplined, he's going to get in some serious foul trouble. He was called for 3 fouls in the b/w game, but it could have easily been double that.

He is going to catch some nasty lobs this year though, I'll tell you that much... both by beating the opposing big men on the break and by catching the weak side defender sleeping in the halfcourt set (both of which we saw Friday night)!

slower
10-19-2009, 10:18 AM
Ah, conventional wisdom. It's early in the pre-season, and I don't have the slightest idea what's gonna happen this year with Miles, Mason, Zoubs, and LT.

However, in just two days of live practice, conventional wisdom has been stood on its head. We went through the summer with quotes from players and coaches extolling the talent of Mason Plumlee and his inevitable leadership role on the team -- right away. Most of the other discussion was about how the other big men would fight for minutes and the second starting spot.

Now, we hear that Miles is ahead of Mason, and Mason may be slow in adjusting to college play, whatever his upside.

I dunno if this is the new CW or not, but I look forward to its next iteration.

sagegrouse
'My oft-stated position is to reserve judgment on freshmen 6-10 and up.'

sagegrouse

It seems to me that there was a change in perception right after the "Miles Jumps Over Zoubek" report. Reminds me of political polling. Anyway, we're all expecting (at least) good things from both Plumlees.

And, although one game does not an informed opinion make, I thought that Mason looked a little smoother out there. Maybe it's just different styles of play.

Memphis Devil
10-19-2009, 10:27 AM
I posted this back in March...

While I agree that MP1 is kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place with the tenure and experience of Z and Thomas ahead of him and the allure of MP2 and Kelly coming in behind, I really like what I saw from this kid. The knock on MP2 and Kelly is that neither is a back to the basket low post scorer, more of a wing/forward type ala Kyle. The knock on Z and Thomas is that neither possesses the athleticism (Z) or size (Thomas) to be a dominate inside threat. MP1 showed some real potential to develop into a dominate force in the paint. Perhaps not as a go to scorer, but certainly as a rebounder and shot alterer if not blocker. He appears to be extremely athletic with great mobility and hops for a 6'10" player. I like to think of him possibly developing into a version of Cole Aldrich from Kansas. Even MP2 has said that his older brother is more athletic than he is. Perhaps I am being a little to glass half full (maybe even 3/4 full), I am excited to see what the offseason does for his development. I think that he already has the size (maybe he could add a little more muscle, but who couldn't). He really just needs to learn the college game and more to the point the Duke game. Having someone with his athleticism in the paint really makes our risk/reward, overplaying/shooting the passing lanes style of defense that much better.

Again, maybe my glass is a little too full on MP1, but I am truly excited to see what next year can bring for him. I really think he is a diamond in the rough and may be the best thing to happen for Duke defensively since "The Landlord". I hope he has the work ethic and desire to fully maximize his natural gifts.

Reports of Miles' development over the Summer have me really excited about what this kid may bring to the court this season.

Kedsy
10-19-2009, 10:28 AM
I think confidence is the key. Last year Miles showed physical gifts but not much confidence. He was tentative and that led to mistakes. This year, either because of the addition of his brother or his work over the summer, he seems more confident, and thus he's playing better and getting even more confident. To a great extent it's a chicken and egg thing. Hopefully he won't regress in this area after a bad game or two. Having his brother around should help with that.

Nolan seems more confident as well, which is why I foresee big things from him this season. He also seemed tentative at times last year.

Once Mason gets his confidence, he'll start giving us what many have expected. Hopefully that's this year (I think it will be).

jv001
10-19-2009, 10:44 AM
I think both the Plumlee boys will have solid years. It's important for Miles to do the little things we need him to do, rebound, outlet pass, follow shots and finish them and play good solid defense. He does not have to be a; 15ppg, 10 rebs pg guy. As far as Mason goes, I think he will be called on to do a little more; inside- outside play. Good defense as in blocking some shots and rebounding, put the ball on the floor and take it to the basket strong. We need our inside guys to be strong with the ball and not bring it down where it will be stripped away. I have seen that too many times the last few years. Let's hope we see an improvement this season. Go Duke!

airowe
10-19-2009, 01:34 PM
Great article on Miles.

http://duke.scout.com/2/910683.html

Newton_14
10-21-2009, 09:31 PM
Great article on Miles.

http://duke.scout.com/2/910683.html

Excellent article. Speaks to the character of Miles in more ways than one. Rather than pouting about going from starter to at times DNP, and blaming coaches, he takes responsibility, and he determines to do something about it. I like how he indicated that while sitting at key stretches last year, his mindset was "I should be out there helping the team" but he wasn't because his game was not where it needed to be.

There seems to be a lot of glass half full vs glass half empty going on in the other threads about how good the Plumlees and the team will perform this year. I think this article offers more evidence that we should be feeling a bit more optimistic, with a little caution thrown in. It would be sweet though if MP1 and MP2 blow up and exceed expectations..

I think we will see an improved Miles this year and as for Mason, at this point all we have is one scrimmage and the thoughts of Jay Williams and Jon Scheyer who seem to think the kid might be able to contribute a little.. I will go out on a limb and take them at their word on that one....

verga
10-22-2009, 12:12 AM
as i was watching Miles play in the pro am league at NCCU this summer, i noticed a player with great physical ability. He didn't seem to worry as much about the game as last year. He tried numerous spin moves and other things i had not seen of him previously. Then i began to wonder how much of this new found confidence would he be able to transfer to the real season. The answer is i don't know, i've seen enough bball to realize that July is not March. I believe if Miles has this ability in him, K will get it out of him. When that will take place, i certainly don't know. It's exciting to think about a kid bustin' loose, i hope he does. The team needs it and we as fans would love to see it. I believe he'll do fine, he has a year on the pines to remind him of what not to do. I wish him the best.

DevilDan
10-22-2009, 07:43 PM
This is an awesome thread ... there's been a lot of talk about Mason -- I have been in that mix, calling him the "basketball jones" of this year's team. He not only has (at least the makings of) Game, he brings a Bravado to the court that DUKE has been missing for awhile -- i.e., since Christian Laettner graduated.

Like others, I think his presence is a catalyst that is going to push Miles to new heights -- where he will JUST PLAY, and not get paralysis-thru-analysis by overthinking when he gets a touch. Miles has a great set of physical skills -- let's hope that this year they will translate into Hoop Skills.

Next year? Hey, this is a team that can put it all together THIS YEAR. So many great pieces, with the best Coach in the college game ready to make them a great TEAM ... boys & girls, I can't WAIT ! AGHHHHHHH ! GO DUKE ! ! !

Edouble
10-23-2009, 03:05 AM
Great article on Miles.

http://duke.scout.com/2/910683.html

"For me it comes down to playing strong and playing to the skillet I have and using it to my advantage."

Pre-game meal? Ha ha ha :p

BD80
10-23-2009, 09:30 AM
"For me it comes down to playing strong and playing to the skillet I have and using it to my advantage."

You have no idea what goes on in the low post.

Miles' skill set includes cookware, cutlery and small appliances.

hq2
10-23-2009, 03:42 PM
I think the most important thing is for K to show some confidence in Miles . K needs to realize that he's the player with the potential to contribute more this year. Zoubeck, I mean come on, the guy couldn't even dunk when he was wide open on the baseline, and Lance isn't going to get any taller, and probably shouldn't get any heavier; with our guard rotation still sort of thin, Singler may get minutes at 2, which means Lance needs to help playing quicker small forwards at 3. That leaves MP1 as the player who needs to step up under the basket. With either MP, Scheyer, Singler, and hopefully Smith, we'd have a pretty balanced attack. But K needs to stick with him, and that means leaving him out there, giving him a chance to play through mistakes, and get confidence in his game. If he does that, I think he'll start getting it going by the time the conference season rolls around.

NSDukeFan
10-23-2009, 03:53 PM
I think the most important thing is for K to show some confidence in Miles . K needs to realize that he's the player with the potential to contribute more this year. Zoubeck, I mean come on, the guy couldn't even dunk when he was wide open on the baseline, and Lance isn't going to get any taller, and probably shouldn't get any heavier; with our guard rotation still sort of thin, Singler may get minutes at 2, which means Lance needs to help playing quicker small forwards at 3. That leaves MP1 as the player who needs to step up under the basket. With either MP, Scheyer, Singler, and hopefully Smith, we'd have a pretty balanced attack. But K needs to stick with him, and that means leaving him out there, giving him a chance to play through mistakes, and get confidence in his game. If he does that, I think he'll start getting it going by the time the conference season rolls around.

Were you referring to our player who, in situational play, had the best +/- per 40 minutes on the team last year? I believe his name is Brian Zoubek and he may not be as athletic as Miles, but will still likely play a role on the team this year and be effective in certain matchups. Lance will also be an effective player this year, especially now that he will not be matched up with larger players most games.

I agree with your basic premise (that Miles should get more playing time this year and perhaps be allowed to learn from his mistakes) I just disagree with knocking down a couple seniors' (who have represented their school very well and done everything asked of them) abilities as a way of making your point.

Newton_14
11-18-2009, 12:19 PM
Since Miles is off to a really good start I wanted to bump this back to the front page.

He has passed Step 1 (Playing well against the soft portion of the schedule) with flying colors. Now he has to show he can do it against stiffer competition. My money says he will!! (And to be honest, last night he did go up against an ACC Caliber big man in Spears and did well)

So way to go Miles! Keep it up and you can become a force to be reckoned with!!

Huh?
11-18-2009, 12:40 PM
GREAT game from Miles last night, I will take a double double from him all day long. I loved how he was grabbing rebounds with authority and altering some shots. He seems to make the catch in traffic other big men we have don't.

AND THE DUNKS! I gaurantee opposing players will think twice before trying to block his shot when attacking the rim...big advantage for Miles.

DUKIE V(A)
11-18-2009, 12:45 PM
WOW! Miles has been very impressive early on. Kudos to those who predicted Miles to have a great season. I love his aggression...It's early yet and don't get all over me for saying this, but Miles MAY turn out to be the most skilled offensive post presence we have had since Boozer (and I love Shelden). Remember this is only early in his sophomore season...He still has a lot of growing to do. Perhaps our big man, postman is already in house.

BlueintheFace
11-18-2009, 12:48 PM
Next 2-3 games are CRITICAL for Miles. He needs to build on the Charlotte game to solidify his confidence.

roywhite
11-18-2009, 12:49 PM
WOW! Miles has been very impressive early on. Kudos to those who predicted Miles to have a great season. I love his aggression...It's early yet and don't get all over me for saying this, but Miles MAY turn out to be the most skilled offensive post presence we have had since Boozer (and I love Shelden). Remember this is only early in his sophomore season...He still has a lot of growing to do. Perhaps our big man, postman is already in house.

Agree....his game has come miles. The dude can just plum play. And he's very alert to what's happening, perky you might say.

Memphis Devil
11-18-2009, 12:49 PM
Since Miles is off to a really good start I wanted to bump this back to the front page.

He has passed Step 1 (Playing well against the soft portion of the schedule) with flying colors. Now he has to show he can do it against stiffer competition. My money says he will!! (And to be honest, last night he did go up against an ACC Caliber big man in Spears and did well)

So way to go Miles! Keep it up and you can become a force to be reckoned with!!

To continue being honest, Spears had a pretty good game as well, but he did it against two ACC caliber big men, an ACC caliber wing forward, and two ACC caliber guards. That being said, if you cannot play well against the lesser teams on the schedule it certainly changes things. I think Miles (along with Mason) is in for a special year. When its all said and done, I hope other programs fans are asking the question, "Why didn't we recruit this kid?" Much like many posters on these boards do when a diamond in the rough becomes polished.

NSDukeFan
11-18-2009, 01:08 PM
Agree....his game has come miles. The dude can just plum play. And he's very alert to what's happening, perky you might say.

He seems to have marshaled his talent and seems as strong as a mason out there.

Indoor66
11-18-2009, 01:16 PM
He seems to have marshaled his talent and seems as strong as a mason out there.

Yours and the one quoted in your post are, truly, perky comments.

ipatent
11-18-2009, 01:17 PM
Miles looks like a completely different player so far, and it bodes well for Duke's future. He still needs to improve his post defense, but has the strength and athletic ability to be an all-ACC player before he leaves Duke. He seems more confident, quicker, stronger and meaner than what we saw last year.

If Mason can play at the same level, this is a front line that can stand toe to toe with Davis and Thompson. I have always been a big Z supporter, but I see his minutes being cut back substantially when Mason returns.

Kedsy
11-18-2009, 01:37 PM
I have always been a big Z supporter, but I see his minutes being cut back substantially when Mason returns.

I hope Z's minutes don't get cut back too much. He may not look like much, but his per minute production is amazing. I spelled out the details in a post in the post-game thread (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=332195&postcount=54) so I won't repeat them here, but we'd be wrong to dismiss Z's ability to get things done when he's on the floor.

whereinthehellami
11-18-2009, 01:46 PM
Confidence and consistency are key for Miles over these next few games for him to keep building that solid foundation.

feldspar
11-18-2009, 01:48 PM
I hope Z's minutes don't get cut back too much. He may not look like much, but his per minute production is amazing. I spelled out the details in a post in the post-game thread (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=332195&postcount=54) so I won't repeat them here, but we'd be wrong to dismiss Z's ability to get things done when he's on the floor.

Agreed, but Z is clearly still just a role player, not an impact player on a game-to-game basis. He's not a post-up and score player, he's a rebound and put-back player.

Miles seems to be the whole package. I'm excited.

NSDukeFan
11-18-2009, 01:53 PM
Agreed, but Z is clearly still just a role player, not an impact player on a game-to-game basis. He's not a post-up and score player, he's a rebound and put-back player.

Miles seems to be the whole package. I'm excited.

Don't discount the rebound and put-back player, they can provide a valuable role, especially with the perimeter players we have. I don't know that Miles is much of a post-up and score player either, but that does not dampen my enthusiasm for his contributions so far and hopefully in the future.

Greg_Newton
11-18-2009, 02:33 PM
Yours and the one quoted in your post are, truly, perky comments.

:rolleyes: Get outta here with that Czyz...

I can't wait until Miles discovers the drop step. He was built for that move.

Hermy-own
11-18-2009, 02:43 PM
What about that sky hook Miles tried in the game? It didn't fall, but is there a place for that in college hoops? I hope so - If Miles is a big time scoring threat, our frontcourt will be deadly. And the sky hook looks funny, too.

Dukeface88
11-18-2009, 02:46 PM
Ah, conventional wisdom. It's early in the pre-season, and I don't have the slightest idea what's gonna happen this year with Miles, Mason, Zoubs, and LT.

However, in just two days of live practice, conventional wisdom has been stood on its head. We went through the summer with quotes from players and coaches extolling the talent of Mason Plumlee and his inevitable leadership role on the team -- right away. Most of the other discussion was about how the other big men would fight for minutes and the second starting spot.

Now, we hear that Miles is ahead of Mason, and Mason may be slow in adjusting to college play, whatever his upside.

I dunno if this is the new CW or not, but I look forward to its next iteration.

sagegrouse
'My oft-stated position is to reserve judgment on freshmen 6-10 and up.'

sagegrouse

I think of it as revising opinions as additional information becomes available. MP1 has had a few solid games, so cautious optimism seems warranted. On the other hand, MP2 can't play and is probably limited in practice to conditioning stuff; expecting some delay in development is not illogical.

I think who gets more playtime between the two MPs and Z will probably be determined by the specific matchups. I'd expect to see a lot of variation in minutes depending on the opposing team; that goes for the other bigs as well.

Devilsfan
11-18-2009, 03:15 PM
He's looking a lot better than last year. Let's hope he's the real deal because our team needs some inside pressence. It's amazing with two seniors our best player imo is a sophomore. I didn't include our Mr. Everything, Kyle as an inside player for this thread.

jpfrizzle
11-18-2009, 03:20 PM
Looking good out there Miles, keep up the great work!!