PDA

View Full Version : Duke FB still has no respect--the year to prove them all wrong.



CameronBornAndBred
08-24-2009, 05:57 PM
The media has been cranking out lots of promising stories about the future of Duke football, but when it comes down to standing behind words with numbers, they show their true colors. Poll after poll have predicted Duke last once again in the ACC, yet their articles talk of how they will win more, including in the conference.
Here is a really ugly prediction from the sporting news. (http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2009-08-24/college-football-preview-acc-predictions)

They call for a last place finish, and a 3-9(1-7) record. That means that we will lose to one of the following --Richmond, NCCU, or Army. I can buy the last place prediction, but I don't see how anyone can justify that record prediction.

Duke is going to prove lots of people wrong this year.

FireOgilvie
08-24-2009, 06:17 PM
They have BC last overall in the ACC with a 0-8 record. That's probably a step up from previous years for us.

arnie
08-24-2009, 06:28 PM
The media has been cranking out lots of promising stories about the future of Duke football, but when it comes down to standing behind words with numbers, they show their true colors. Poll after poll have predicted Duke last once again in the ACC, yet their articles talk of how they will win more, including in the conference.
Here is a really ugly prediction from the sporting news. (http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2009-08-24/college-football-preview-acc-predictions)

They call for a last place finish, and a 3-9(1-7) record. That means that we will lose to one of the following --Richmond, NCCU, or Army. I can buy the last place prediction, but I don't see how anyone can justify that record prediction.

Duke is going to prove lots of people wrong this year.

I hope you're right - but let's face it, we haven't done anything yet to prove people wrong. We must beat Richmond IMO to have a chance at winning more than 2-3 games. Don't forget the debacle against them a few years ago.

CameronBornAndBred
08-24-2009, 06:30 PM
Don't forget the debacle against them a few years ago.
I know the team hasn't.

JaMarcus Russell
08-24-2009, 06:41 PM
I think that this team has a very different attitude than the teams in the Franks/Roof era. I don't expect them to drop a game against Richmond, NCCU, or Army, especially with a healthy Thad Lewis.

Here are my predictions

Richmond-Win
Army-Win
Kansas-Loss
NC Central-Win
VT-Loss
NC State-Loss
Maryland-Win
Virginia-Loss
UNC-Loss
GT-Loss
Miami-Loss
Wake Forest-Win

So that's a 5-7 record (2-6 in the ACC). If we can beat UVA or NC State on the road, then we may even have a chance to go bowling.

Devil in the Blue Dress
08-24-2009, 06:58 PM
The media has been cranking out lots of promising stories about the future of Duke football, but when it comes down to standing behind words with numbers, they show their true colors. Poll after poll have predicted Duke last once again in the ACC, yet their articles talk of how they will win more, including in the conference.
Here is a really ugly prediction from the sporting news. (http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2009-08-24/college-football-preview-acc-predictions)

They call for a last place finish, and a 3-9(1-7) record. That means that we will lose to one of the following --Richmond, NCCU, or Army. I can buy the last place prediction, but I don't see how anyone can justify that record prediction.

Duke is going to prove lots of people wrong this year.

Unfortunately many people are going to continue to see Duke as a losing program until records amassed by Duke are competitive with the rest of the conference. Even then I suspect the chronic detractors will continue on their merry way.

We know the old days are past. Every win this season will be worthy of savoring and celebrating!

jimsumner
08-24-2009, 07:33 PM
I don't think there's any question that Duke is heading in the right direction.

But take off the blue-tinted glasses. Duke lost its last five games, seven of its last eight, last season to finish 4-8. Duke was hit hard by graduation, has had some attrition, and has relatively few quality seniors. Offensive line and linebacker are major question marks, as is overall depth. DBs are young.

If everything goes right, I could see Duke sneaking into the bowl mix at 7-5. But I could just as easily see another 4-8. A rash of injuries could decimate a young, thin team.

We had a lengthy discussion a few weeks back concerning the over/under for wins. Most of us came down along the lines of five wins, which seems reasonable.

Anything more than five wins is gravy, IMO.

I also think 2010 is the break-out season. Cut's recruiting will have improved the overall talent level of the team and Duke should go from one of the ACC's youngest teams to one of its most experienced, with a lot more quality seniors.

I think the media recognizes that Duke is improving its program. But the media also recognizes how far Duke had to come.

roywhite
08-24-2009, 07:55 PM
I don't think there's any question that Duke is heading in the right direction.

But take off the blue-tinted glasses. Duke lost its last five games, seven of its last eight, last season to finish 4-8. Duke was hit hard by graduation, has had some attrition, and has relatively few quality seniors. Offensive line and linebacker are major question marks, as is overall depth. DBs are young.

If everything goes right, I could see Duke sneaking into the bowl mix at 7-5. But I could just as easily see another 4-8. A rash of injuries could decimate a young, thin team.

We had a lengthy discussion a few weeks back concerning the over/under for wins. Most of us came down along the lines of five wins, which seems reasonable.

Anything more than five wins is gravy, IMO.

I also think 2010 is the break-out season. Cut's recruiting will have improved the overall talent level of the team and Duke should go from one of the ACC's youngest teams to one of its most experienced, with a lot more quality seniors.

I think the media recognizes that Duke is improving its program. But the media also recognizes how far Duke had to come.

Sounds about right to me.

One of the things I like best about Coach Cut is that he talks about winning games now and how good this team can be. Doesn't spend a lot of time bemoaning youth and inexperience; Coach is not much for excuses, in general.

CameronBornAndBred
08-24-2009, 08:19 PM
But take off the blue-tinted glasses. Duke lost its last five games, seven of its last eight, last season to finish 4-8. Duke was hit hard by graduation, has had some attrition, and has relatively few quality seniors. Offensive line and linebacker are major question marks, as is overall depth. DBs are young.

If everything goes right, I could see Duke sneaking into the bowl mix at 7-5. But I could just as easily see another 4-8. A rash of injuries could decimate a young, thin team.

I would hardly say I'm wearing blue-tinted glasses, I can see a 4-6 game win season. IF we win more than that I really will be surprised, and way excited. What I can't see it the 3 win season the article suggests. If we only win 3 seasons this year, it will be a very dark december for the football program, but I just don't see that happening.

Wander
08-24-2009, 08:34 PM
I would hardly say I'm wearing blue-tinted glasses, I can see a 4-6 game win season. IF we win more than that I really will be surprised, and way excited. What I can't see it the 3 win season the article suggests. If we only win 3 seasons this year, it will be a very dark december for the football program, but I just don't see that happening.

Realistically, I can't see us losing to Richmond, Army, or NCCU, but it's likely that we'll be the inferior team in all other nine games. I certainly don't expect us to lose all nine, but it's not outside the realm of possibility if a key injury happens, say Vinnie Rey.

My guess is that we go 5-7. Two wins in conference play. It is really nice that our lowest realistic possibility is three wins instead of zero.

YourLandlord
08-24-2009, 08:39 PM
It is really nice that our lowest realistic possibility is three wins instead of zero.

scheduling...

loran16
08-24-2009, 09:30 PM
I got to agree with CB&B on this.

Personally, I'll go with a guess of 5 wins. The 3 easy non conference games, Virginia, and one random ACC team.

I could see us pulling a shocking upset of Kansas too imo...

That said, this shouldn't be surprising to anyone that we get no respect...until we win 6 games or make a bowl game, i doubt we'll ever get it.

sagegrouse
08-24-2009, 11:40 PM
If one were predicting records for a general audience (not a Duke or university audience), why would one ever give any credit to the Blue Devils, until they have a good season where they are are well above the bottom of the ACC?

Just based on dead reckoning, in this year's situation, one would pick Duke as 1-7 and 4-8 -- same as last year. If thought to be a much better team than last year, a predictor would say 2-6 and 5-7.

I.e., long-time losers have to prove it on the field to get any respect from the pollsters or prognosticators.

And I agree with the other posters that the talent this year is probably a bit lower than last year, due to losses on the OL and the defense, but offset a bit by some needed strength at QB and a much stronger coaching staff than before Cut. Moreover, if Cut and Duke are going to be successful, we are going to have to win some games where, on paper, Duke has no chance whatsoever -- like against VT in Durham early in the season.

I like our chances of pulling an upset or two, but back to my original point, no columnist would stake his professional reputation (if anything is left of it) in predicting a big step forward by Duke this year -- until it actually happens on the field.

sagegrouse
'I can't believe this post makes any sense'

wolfpackdevil
08-25-2009, 05:23 AM
If one were predicting records for a general audience (not a Duke or university audience), why would one ever give any credit to the Blue Devils, until they have a good season where they are are well above the bottom of the ACC?

Just based on dead reckoning, in this year's situation, one would pick Duke as 1-7 and 4-8 -- same as last year. If thought to be a much better team than last year, a predictor would say 2-6 and 5-7.

I.e., long-time losers have to prove it on the field to get any respect from the pollsters or prognosticators.

And I agree with the other posters that the talent this year is probably a bit lower than last year, due to losses on the OL and the defense, but offset a bit by some needed strength at QB and a much stronger coaching staff than before Cut. Moreover, if Cut and Duke are going to be successful, we are going to have to win some games where, on paper, Duke has no chance whatsoever -- like against VT in Durham early in the season.

I like our chances of pulling an upset or two, but back to my original point, no columnist would stake his professional reputation (if anything is left of it) in predicting a big step forward by Duke this year -- until it actually happens on the field.

sagegrouse
'I can't believe this post makes any sense'



I dont think they need to beat VT. Duke is a team that is going to have to win the winnable games, which they havnt done in the past.

Virginia Tech is NOT a winnable game. They are too good, point blank.

But the games at Virginia, at North Carolina, Maryland, and Wake Forest, and even at NC State are winnable conference games.


If they can win the 3 easy non-conference games, knock off UVA, UMD and WF, they're 6-6.

And I think everybody would agree that 6-6 would be a VERY VERY good season. they wouldn't make a bowl game, but they would be going into next season favored to play in a bowl.

I think they go 5-7 (2-6). Which is still a step up from last year, and a better season.

I think they beast Richmond, Army, NCCU, UMD, UVA and WF. And they could pull a big upset at Carolina, but lets not get too far ahead of ourselves.

whereinthehellami
08-25-2009, 07:37 AM
I think for Duke to win 6 games they would have to have a pretty magical season. Alot of bounces would have to go their way and they would have to have a lucky run on the injury front (not many). While Duke is getting some ACC type talent they don't have any depth and their O-line is not really up to ACC level talent.

OZZIE4DUKE
08-25-2009, 07:49 AM
I don't think there's any question that Duke is heading in the right direction.

But take off the blue-tinted glasses.




Virginia Tech is NOT a winnable game. They are too good, point blank.
I absolutely refuse to take off my blue-tinted glasses! :cool: It's just not in my nature.

VaTech? Bah! Humbug! Remember September 30, 1989! :D:D:D

Wander
08-25-2009, 09:10 AM
scheduling...

Partially, but there was a time when no game, including Richmond and Army, was a guaranteed win. And it wasn't that long ago.

Kewlswim
08-26-2009, 02:13 AM
Hi,

I'm not sure what I will enjoy more: Watching Duke win enough games to go to a bowl game and shut all those folks up at places like ESPN who have called Duke Football bad names I refuse to repeat or watching Duke basketball (this coming season) win a ton more games than expected and make big time noise throughout the land? Hmmm Is it ok if I just enjoy both a lot?

GO DUKE!

speedevil2001
08-26-2009, 02:15 AM
The media has been cranking out lots of promising stories about the future of Duke football, but when it comes down to standing behind words with numbers, they show their true colors. Poll after poll have predicted Duke last once again in the ACC, yet their articles talk of how they will win more, including in the conference.
Here is a really ugly prediction from the sporting news. (http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2009-08-24/college-football-preview-acc-predictions)

They call for a last place finish, and a 3-9(1-7) record. That means that we will lose to one of the following --Richmond, NCCU, or Army. I can buy the last place prediction, but I don't see how anyone can justify that record prediction.

Duke is going to prove lots of people wrong this year.

if duke football wants more respect...then the football team needs their own website, something like www.dukefootballreport.com

that cant be that hard right?

wolfpackdevil
08-26-2009, 05:31 AM
if duke football wants more respect...then the football team needs their own website, something like www.dukefootballreport.com

that cant be that hard right?

I love looking at this duke football website!!!

http://bluedevilsfootball.com/

RepoMan
08-26-2009, 08:58 AM
I haven't seen that site before. They did a great job with it. Thanks for posting it.

AtlBluRew
08-26-2009, 09:53 AM
I love looking at this duke football website!!!

http://bluedevilsfootball.com/

What RepoMan said ... that's a nice site, thanks for posting it!

speedevil2001
08-26-2009, 02:14 PM
I love looking at this duke football website!!!

http://bluedevilsfootball.com/

do they have a forum there?

if they do, the mods, should export all the football threads over...lol

airowe
08-26-2009, 02:26 PM
do they have a forum there?

if they do, the mods, should export all the football threads over...lol

If you don't like the football threads, don't click on them. Other people enjoy talking about Duke Football here and have for a long time.

CLT Devil
08-26-2009, 02:37 PM
Partially, but there was a time when no game, including Richmond and Army, was a guaranteed win. And it wasn't that long ago.

There are no guaranteed games when it comes to Duke FB (save VMI) - I am as big of a fan as anyone, and expect big things (relatively) from this year. However, we might only win 1 or 2 games. We might win as many as 6 or 7, but it is near impossible to make an educated guess on this team. I still say we are one year away with getting the new philosophy, mindset and players to really start making some noise (albeit with no Thad or Vince).

Bottom line; If you are predicting more than 2 or 3 wins you're setting yourself up to be disappointed. That being said...go Devils, Let's go Bowling

jafarr1
08-26-2009, 03:50 PM
To counter the "reasonable expectations" crowd, people seem to forget that last year's Duke team was not far removed from 6 W's. We lost at Northwestern by four points despite rolling up far better statistics, and we missed a 42-yard FG at Wake that would have won the game. There was even a dropped INT versus Miami that, had the ball not bounced off our hands, probably would have been another TD and might have swung that game in our favor.

We also won the easy games on the schedule, abused UVa and beat a solid Vandy team at their place. We were only blown out twice, once against Clemson when we lost Thad on the first series. We scared the you-know-what out of Virginia Tech despite having Asack at the helm.

I'm not predicting a bowl or anything; that would be ridiculous. Then again, so are the people who are predicting only one or two W's. Last year wasn't a mirage, and while this team does need more depth at some key positions before they make a ton of noise, I will be heartily disappointed if we don't find our way to four W's. Five W's seems reasonable to me, even if that assumes that Duke needs to break through and win one of these other games that has slipped through our fingers in the past.

ReformedAggie
08-26-2009, 05:55 PM
Duke has the same problem with football that Texas A&M has with basketball. Just saying :)

coachcut
08-26-2009, 05:59 PM
And more agree with us...

http://onlinesportsguys.blogspot.com/2009/08/osg-college-football-2009-predictions_24.html

Gonna run through a wall now...

jimsumner
08-26-2009, 06:11 PM
"We lost at Northwestern by four points despite rolling up far better statistics, and we missed a 42-yard FG at Wake that would have won the game."

Well not actually AT Northwestern.

If we claim the NW game, then what do we do about Vanderbilt, which outgained Duke by 41 yards? Or the Northwestern game the previous season at Evanston, where Duke won despite a big statistical disadvantage?

These things tend to even out.

A couple of points. Assuming wins over Richmond and NCCU, Duke needs seven wins to become bowl eligible. Cutcliffe's position is that a team probably doesn't deserve a bowl bid with six wins so it doesn't matter and it makes sense to take that attitude in public. But it's there.

The other point concerns the game at Charlottesville. I'm amazed by how many people put that in the likely-win category. Sure, Duke waxed the "Hoos last year at home but Virginia regrouped nicely after that. A win at UVa is possible but hardly a sure thing. In fact, I think Maryland and Wake at Wade are more likely wins.

Duke's inexplicable ability to beat Wake Forest has to come to an end sometime and this year is as good as any. A late field goal would hit the spot.

CameronBornAndBred
08-26-2009, 06:41 PM
The other point concerns the game at Charlottesville. I'm amazed by how many people put that in the likely-win category. Sure, Duke waxed the "Hoos last year at home but Virginia regrouped nicely after that. A win at UVa is possible but hardly a sure thing. In fact, I think Maryland and Wake at Wade are more likely wins.

I heavily agree with the UVA call. That is going to be a very tough game to win. What UVA did last year after getting trounced by Duke was amazing, they are not that same team. They never were after leaving Durham. In my ACC win column, I have Wake, and Wake alone. I will not be surprised when we beat other ACC teams (I think we will beat 2 or 3, and my gut guess is one of the others will be VT. Seriously). But UVA will be tough, and the team will really have to ready for that game.

OldPhiKap
08-26-2009, 08:34 PM
I find it hard to gin up a lot of hate for the press on this one. Journalists are creatures of habit (to put it politely) and we haven't arrived until we prove it.

The ball is in our hands. You want respect? Thrash some real teams and get to a bowl. The press will follow like lemmings. Until then, it's potential unrealized.

(And, FWIW, I think it is kind of silly to try to predict records. With the exception of some who may know a heck of a lot about every team on the schedule, you have to make the same broad generalizations about teams and programs that we curse the press for making.)

I truly believe that we have one of the best coaching staffs in the conference. They are only in the second year. While I share the hopes and aspirations of a bowl, we are not a deep team and we are young in some key positions. I am more interested in constant improvement and moving the PROGRAM forward. And I cannot think of a better man at the helm than Cut.

And yes, I bought my tickets for the Wake game to thank our team and hopefully play for bowl positioning.

RIP 'EM UP, TEAR 'EM UP . . . .

and

GTH, C!!!!

CameronBornAndBred
08-26-2009, 09:35 PM
And yes, I bought my tickets for the Wake game to thank our team and hopefully play for bowl positioning.

Cool, be sure to look up the brunchgaters that day.

OldPhiKap
08-27-2009, 09:13 AM
Y'all let me know where it happens, and I'll be happening.

jafarr1
08-27-2009, 10:38 AM
"We lost at Northwestern by four points despite rolling up far better statistics, and we missed a 42-yard FG at Wake that would have won the game."

Well not actually AT Northwestern.

If we claim the NW game, then what do we do about Vanderbilt, which outgained Duke by 41 yards? Or the Northwestern game the previous season at Evanston, where Duke won despite a big statistical disadvantage?

These things tend to even out.


While I agree these things even out, I'm not sure I buy the 41-yard argument for Vandy. I brought up Northwestern because Duke had nearly 150 yards more offense against NW, including 100 yards on the ground, not to mention double the time of possession and double the first downs. Anyone just looking at the stats would think Duke won by 10 or more. I also think the dropped interception against Miami can't be understated.

Still, I don't want to argue semantics. My point wasn't that Duke got unlucky last year. My point is that this team was close to six wins, and was certainly closer to five wins than to three. This team didn't luck into four wins. So why would we suddenly start predicting three wins or fewer? Injuries at key positions are about the only way I see that happening.

jimsumner
08-27-2009, 11:21 AM
jafarr,

I agree with you. In fact, I've made the point a number of times that Duke was two plays from being bowl eligible. Whether Duke would have received a bid at 6-6 is more problematical.

The Northwestern game was just weird. Usually when a team has a big edge in first downs and total yards and still loses, turnovers are the culprit. But Duke only had one turnover, a lost fumble. Or missed kicks are the culprit. But I believe Maggio made both of his field goals.

There were some special teams miscues and a huge penalty late. Still, it's one of those losses one can only attribute to intangibles.

I said earlier that these things tend to even out but I don't think they have at Duke (certainly not against Wake) in recent years and I think that's a result of those intangibles. Call it confidence, call it mojo, call it not knowing how to win. But whatever it is, overcoming that is one of the biggest challenges facing Cutcliffe and his staff. I had hoped that the Vandy win meant Duke was over that hump but they reverted to form later in the season. Wake and UNC were quite winnable and State was much closer than the score suggests. A different QB in Blacksburg and who knows?

But good teams find a way to win close games and Duke didn't do that last year or any year since 1994 on a regular basis. Duke isn't good enough to blow away good teams, so they're going to have to win games like last year's Northwestern and Wake games.

Let me elaborate a bit on the OP of this thread. There seemed to be a suggestion that the media was hypocritical for writing nice things about Duke but still picking them last. I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. Let me make a NASCAR analogy. Duke was a lap off the lead when Cutcliffe took over. Duke is on the lead lap now, but still well behind the leaders. But closing the gap.

Another point. The ACC may not have an 800-pound gorilla (although VT is mighty close) but the balance of the league is astonishing. With Duke achieving competitiveness, there isn't a soft touch anywhere in the league. Duke doesn't move up unless other people move down and there aren't a lot of obvious candidates for moving down; maybe BC but they aren't on Duke's schedule this year.

So, again lots of positive signs, lots of upward movement. And you have to love Cut's confidence and air of competence. So, we'll keep our fingers crossed and see how it plays out. But I don't think it's unrealistic or overly negative to think that Duke might go 5-7, even 4-8 this year while putting in place the pieces to have a big jump in 2010.

jafarr1
08-27-2009, 12:35 PM
We agree on most points, especially the intangibles. It was a couple of posts where people were talking about one or two wins being reasonable expectations that got me going.

Personally, I'd predict either four and five wins. We still have significant question marks at certain positions (OL, LB, and to a lesser degree the secondary) and a schedule that may look reasonable but does us few favors. We get the tougher ACC teams at Wallace Wade and the easier ones on the road, which makes every game a challenge - not to mention that the easiest team on the ACC schedule, UVa, will have the game circled on the calendar because we thumped them last year.

I guess I am leaning towards five wins because I'm thinking our team may have grown in confidence enough that the intangibles start to roll our way. Maybe Thad makes a few more plays this year, now that he's in his second year of the same offense for the first time. Maybe we make the 40-yard FGs that decide the game. Maybe we hold onto the interceptions. That could be enough to swing a couple of games our way, because we were really close to having a couple games swing our way last year and that would just be a natural step in this team's development.

speedevil2001
08-27-2009, 03:32 PM
The media has been cranking out lots of promising stories about the future of Duke football, but when it comes down to standing behind words with numbers, they show their true colors. Poll after poll have predicted Duke last once again in the ACC, yet their articles talk of how they will win more, including in the conference.
Here is a really ugly prediction from the sporting news. (http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2009-08-24/college-football-preview-acc-predictions)

They call for a last place finish, and a 3-9(1-7) record. That means that we will lose to one of the following --Richmond, NCCU, or Army. I can buy the last place prediction, but I don't see how anyone can justify that record prediction.

Duke is going to prove lots of people wrong this year.

i think its better nobody gives them any respect. this way duke can sneak up on a few teams.

plus respect is earned.

OldPhiKap
08-27-2009, 08:19 PM
It takes time to build the mindset to close out and win.

When Duke's hoops team is down 5 with 3 mintutes to go, I know we're still going to win.

In past years, when Duke pigskin was up at the start of the 4th quarter, I knew we'd find a way to lose.

Cut is building the foundation for a great program. But it is a significant hurdle to get through that barrier. That's why I love when he says that this is a bowl-quality team, and it is up to him and the staff to make it happen. Take the pressure off the kids, and put it in a trusted hand.

Just like K telling Laettner "Now, after you make the free throw . . . ."

Got_Duke
08-29-2009, 02:14 PM
Well in all honesty, the season hasn't even started, it's what Cut's second year, and this team hasn't proved (YET) that they otherwise belong anywhere else than last place to start a preseason poll. It's a preseason PREDICTION and worthless so don't put too much stock into it.

Will they be better than last year? OF COURSE

CameronBornAndBred
08-29-2009, 03:01 PM
Will they be better than last year? OF COURSE
Maybe that comment best grabs at my original point. You say of course they will be better, yet the predicted record is actually worse than last year, and includes a loss to a second tier team. That's what I don't get, and that's the level of lack of respect I'm talking about. How any sports writer could justify that prediction after the improvements we have already proved last year is beyond me. It's possible that it comes to be true, I just don't see it happening.

OldPhiKap
08-30-2009, 12:25 PM
Maybe that comment best grabs at my original point. You say of course they will be better, yet the predicted record is actually worse than last year, and includes a loss to a second tier team. That's what I don't get, and that's the level of lack of respect I'm talking about. How any sports writer could justify that prediction after the improvements we have already proved last year is beyond me.

1. Sportswriters are by and large lazy and creatures of habit.

2. We are a young team this year and it would not be too difficult to just assume it's the same old Duke.

3. Thee words: "Bulletin Board Material." Bring it.

sagegrouse
08-30-2009, 01:52 PM
1. Sportswriters are by and large lazy and creatures of habit.

2. We are a young team this year and it would not be too difficult to just assume it's the same old Duke.

3. Thee words: "Bulletin Board Material." Bring it.

In the Sagegrouse's slightly wacky way, I dealt with this in post #13:

(a) No one is going to predict a Duke resurgence. It has to happen on the field.

Every poor football (and hoops) program is talking about a turnaround. It is really hard to separate the wheat from the chaff.

But there's another factor, which is close to Old Phi Kap's #1 above:

(b) Anyone ranking ACC football teams is going to spend most of his or her effort figuring out who is at the top of the ACC and its divisions and whether those teams are strong enough to challenge on a national level. Teams 10-12 are gonna get short shrift and a very simplistic treatment.

And why shouldn't they?

But, like Old Phi Kap, I like the bulletin board material that results.

sagegrouse
'Question: Has Phi Kappa Sigma been kicked off campus more times than my group, Pi Kappa Phi? And BTW, which house holds the record?'

Newton_14
09-01-2009, 09:33 PM
Coach Cut did his radio show today from the Washington Duke Inn and dude was pumped!!

I only caught the first 15 minutes but what I did catch was encouraging. He is not backing down one bit and maintains that this is a bowl team and it is on him, the staff, and the players to make it happen.

Couple of notes from what I was able to hear:

- He of course spoke of having a veteran, very good QB in Thad to lead the team. He is very high on Thad and is confident that in Thad we have one of the better QB's and leaders in the conference.
-He added that the running game would be solid as well.
-When asked about the loss of Eron he immediately responded that, "Make no mistake, this team has playmakers"
-He feels the D-Line had a great training camp/pre-season and will be a strength, and feels that the secondary is making good progress
-Finally, he mentioned that several of the freshman will be able to handle being thrown to the fire and be able to contribute on the first and 2nd units.

I know part of that is selling his team but I get the sense he fully believes this team can get it done if he and the staff do their part and the kids respond.

It is sooo refreshing to have real hope and real expectations with Football for the first time in a long time. I am a realist and have stated all along it would take time to get this program back to competitive, so I know reaching a bowl this year would be an incredible feat, but it is very encouraging to hear Coach expect the best...

Can't wait til Saturday at 7pm.
Go Coach Cut and Go Blue Devil Football!!

All that are able need to get our butts in Wally Wade every game possible and support this program!!

Oh and did I mention Basketball practice starts next month??? Loving it!!

OldPhiKap
09-01-2009, 09:42 PM
Coach Cut did his radio show today from the Washington Duke Inn and dude was pumped!!

I only caught the first 15 minutes but what I did catch was encouraging. He is not backing down one bit and maintains that this is a bowl team and it is on him, the staff, and the players to make it happen.

Couple of notes from what I was able to hear:

- He of course spoke of having a veteran, very good QB in Thad to lead the team. He is very high on Thad and is confident that in Thad we have one of the better QB's and leaders in the conference.
-He added that the running game would be solid as well.
-When asked about the loss of Eron he immediately responded that, "Make no mistake, this team has playmakers"
-He feels the D-Line had a great training camp/pre-season and will be a strength, and feels that the secondary is making good progress
-Finally, he mentioned that several of the freshman will be able to handle being thrown to the fire and be able to contribute on the first and 2nd units.

I know part of that is selling his team but I get the sense he fully believes this team can get it done if he and the staff do their part and the kids respond.

It is sooo refreshing to have real hope and real expectations with Football for the first time in a long time. I am a realist and have stated all along it would take time to get this program back to competitive, so I know reaching a bowl this year would be an incredible feat, but it is very encouraging to hear Coach expect the best...

Can't wait til Saturday at 7pm.
Go Coach Cut and Go Blue Devil Football!!

All that are able need to get our butts in Wally Wade every game possible and support this program!!

Oh and did I mention Basketball practice starts next month??? Loving it!!

Yeah, but isn't Thad only 5'6" or something?

j/k. (Obviously, I hope).

Words cannot express how pumped I am about our football program, and this is coming from a guy who barely made the games when I was a student and we had Spurrier as the head coach. K is great at preaching the positive, but Cut is off the charts.

RIP EM UP, TEAR EM UP, GIVE EM HELL DUKE!!!!!!


GTH, CAROLINA, GTH!!!!



THE DAYS OF BEING COMPLACENT ARE OVER!!!!!



(Sorry for shouting, but I'm jacked.)

Newton_14
09-01-2009, 09:53 PM
Yeah, but isn't Thad only 5'6" or something?

j/k. (Obviously, I hope).

Words cannot express how pumped I am about our football program, and this is coming from a guy who barely made the games when I was a student and we had Spurrier as the head coach. K is great at preaching the positive, but Cut is off the charts.

RIP EM UP, TEAR EM UP, GIVE EM HELL DUKE!!!!!!


GTH, CAROLINA, GTH!!!!


THE DAYS OF BEING COMPLACENT ARE OVER!!!!!



(Sorry for shouting, but I'm jacked.)

Shout away Ol Phil! I am shouting with you! We all should be shouting. This program was not at the bottom of the barrell, it had actually embedded into the barrell bottom. What Cut has done in the short time he has been on board is beyond amazing. A great hire and the perfect man for the task at hand. I think he will prove all the naysayers wrong and take his program well beyond where most felt the ceiling was....

CameronBornAndBred
09-01-2009, 10:08 PM
I know part of that is selling his team but I get the sense he fully believes this team can get it done if he and the staff do their part and the kids respond.

All great salesman believe in their product, that's why they are great. I get your sense of the sale too, as well as Cutcliffe's believing. Thanks much for the update, I'd drive to Durham now if I thought I'd be allowed in the Card lot to help set up our tent.

OldPhiKap
09-01-2009, 10:19 PM
What Cut has done in the short time he has been on board is beyond amazing. A great hire and the perfect man for the task at hand.

Bingo. And we all need to remember that building a program is a process, not a quick fix. As jacked as I am for this year, think of the foundation we are building for the future as well.

Think about this. When Cut was hired, he called a select group of coaches (mainly his Old Miss crew) to come to Durham. They all accepted, coming from the New York Jets, Alabama, and Tennessee. TO COME TO DURHAM. And, to emphasize the matter, they all signed on for a second year. It is really easy to gloss over what an incredible accomplishment this is, and what it says about their faith in Cut and their loyalties to each other.

Make no mistake, I supported Roof and wished that the administration had given him adequate support. But there is no question that we have a bona fide, D-I, Grade A guy at the helm now. And the entire staff, from head to conditioning, is light years ahead of what we have accepted as adequate for years. Cut has often said that he thinks Duke has the best coaching staff in the country. I don't think he is kidding, and I don't think he speaks from a point of ignorance on the subject.

Devil in the Blue Dress
09-02-2009, 07:19 AM
Bingo. And we all need to remember that building a program is a process, not a quick fix. As jacked as I am for this year, think of the foundation we are building for the future as well.

Think about this. When Cut was hired, he called a select group of coaches (mainly his Old Miss crew) to come to Durham. They all accepted, coming from the New York Jets, Alabama, and Tennessee. TO COME TO DURHAM. And, to emphasize the matter, they all signed on for a second year. It is really easy to gloss over what an incredible accomplishment this is, and what it says about their faith in Cut and their loyalties to each other.

Make no mistake, I supported Roof and wished that the administration had given him adequate support. But there is no question that we have a bona fide, D-I, Grade A guy at the helm now. And the entire staff, from head to conditioning, is light years ahead of what we have accepted as adequate for years. Cut has often said that he thinks Duke has the best coaching staff in the country. I don't think he is kidding, and I don't think he speaks from a point of ignorance on the subject.
What you say is absolutely on point. There are only a couple of things I would add to the important point about the strength, quality and continuity of the coaching staff.

The first is that this star studded coaching staff arrived with a carefully crafted program and playbook.... a very detailed system for all aspects of the program. It's impossible to put a price on the value of such factors in building a football program geared to excellence and success.

The second point is the significant difference the support of the university, particularly the administration, is to the very existence of the program.

This upsurge is long overdue. GO DUKE!

OldPhiKap
09-02-2009, 07:56 AM
What you say is absolutely on point. There are only a couple of things I would add to the important point about the strength, quality and continuity of the coaching staff.

The first is that this star studded coaching staff arrived with a carefully crafted program and playbook.... a very detailed system for all aspects of the program. It's impossible to put a price on the value of such factors in building a football program geared to excellence and success.

The second point is the significant difference the support of the university, particularly the administration, is to the very existence of the program.

This upsurge is long overdue. GO DUKE!

Great points as always, DitBD. The fact that this staff had worked together in the past allowed them to hit the ground running. The fact that Dear Old Duke put real funds into the staff salaries and the facility upgrades is also a very imporant factor.

OldPhiKap
09-02-2009, 08:36 PM
Question: Has Phi Kappa Sigma been kicked off campus more times than my group, Pi Kappa Phi? And BTW, which house holds the record?'

We didn't recognize the administration, and they didn't recognize us. Detante.

"Campus" is a pretty amorphous thing, anyway.

Hope we overlapped. I am sure I woke up in that section more than once.

Devil in the Blue Dress
09-02-2009, 09:20 PM
We didn't recognize the administration, and they didn't recognize us. Detante.

"Campus" is a pretty amorphous thing, anyway.

Hope we overlapped. I am sure I woke up in that section more than once.

How about Kappa Alpha Order? Surely the record holder for being kicked off campus!

OldPhiKap
09-02-2009, 10:11 PM
How about Kappa Alpha Order? Surely the record holder for being kicked off campus!

What's a quad dog between friends, anyway?

Jarhead
09-02-2009, 10:23 PM
How about Kappa Alpha Order? Surely the record holder for being kicked off campus!

Back in the day when I was in school, the KAs were in the dorm section to the left under the clock tower. Those guys used to come out on the quad and do close order drill as if they were all in NROTC. The dorm on the other side of the tower had a rust colored stain about two feet wide and two or three feet off the ground. I think it's still there. That dorm was the Beta house.

Many of the football players were KAs. Them were the good ole days, and the Blue light was the closest place to get a beer. Oh, yeah... We had a coach, with a staff. The Stadium is named after him. Maybe we'll soon be calling it Cutcliffe Field at Wallace Wade Stadium, a la GaTech.

Devil in the Blue Dress
09-03-2009, 09:21 AM
Back in the day when I was in school, the KAs were in the dorm section to the left under the clock tower. Those guys used to come out on the quad and do close order drill as if they were all in NROTC. The dorm on the other side of the tower had a rust colored stain about two feet wide and two or three feet off the ground. I think it's still there. That dorm was the Beta house.

Many of the football players were KAs. Them were the good ole days, and the Blue light was the closest place to get a beer. Oh, yeah... We had a coach, with a staff. The Stadium is named after him. Maybe we'll soon be calling it Cutcliffe Field at Wallace Wade Stadium, a la GaTech.

You can add Phi Delt and ATO to the football fraternities on into the sixties. Phi Kap was a basketball fraternity as was Kappa Sig to some extent.

I'm with you about the possible naming of the field in the future!

CameronBornAndBred
09-03-2009, 09:47 AM
You can add Phi Delt and ATO to the football fraternities on into the sixties. Phi Kap was a basketball fraternity as was Kappa Sig to some extent.

I'm with you about the possible naming of the field in the future!
I'm a Cutcliffe fan, but lets win a few bowl games before we start travelling down that road.

Devil in the Blue Dress
09-03-2009, 09:55 AM
I'm a Cutcliffe fan, but lets win a few bowl games before we start travelling down that road.
It certainly was not my intention to suggest that such a move be in the immediate future. The program's got to reach and maintain the levels Coach Cutcliffe projects in order to validate its standing. I foresee any such renaming far into the future..... after a number of winning seasons and bowl appearances.

House G
09-04-2009, 12:49 PM
Duke has the same problem with football that Texas A&M has with basketball. Just saying :)

You could also claim that Texas A&M has the same problem with football that Duke has with football. :D

godukerocks
09-05-2009, 03:13 PM
Is there any way I can watch the game tonight online somewhere?

Bob Green
09-05-2009, 03:22 PM
Is there any way I can watch the game tonight online somewhere?

I do not know where you can watch online but I'll be listening on the radio:

http://www.wsfl.com/

or

http://www.1010wspc.com/

are the URLs where I listened last season.

FireOgilvie
09-05-2009, 03:29 PM
Is there any way I can watch the game tonight online somewhere?

http://www.theacc.com/accselect/usersguide-dukerich.html

Costs $7.95 for just this game.


I don't know about anything else. I think this is probably it.

godukerocks
09-05-2009, 04:00 PM
Thanks for those links. I'll definitely watch.

Jim3k
09-05-2009, 05:07 PM
Is anybody else having trouble making the registration page work? I have a Mac and have tried both Safari and Firefox for Mac. I got a message to load the newest version of Silverlight. I did, though I think it's the same version I had before.

Then back to the registration page. It kicks me to a page which say 'click to load' or something like that. But it's dead. Nothing happens.

Ideas?

Edit -- wait -- I got it. Silverlight ver. 3.0

YourLandlord
09-05-2009, 09:41 PM
And commands no respect until it can beat a 1-AA team at home.

buddy
09-05-2009, 11:48 PM
So much for the bowl specuation. For all the hype going into this game, Duke just got pushed all over the field. Forced zero turnovers. Lewis consistently threw behind receivers. Offensive play calling was done by Ted Roof's offensive coordinator. Very predictable, very conservative, very unproductive. Special teams play was especially awful. One blocked punt returned for a touchdown, two makeable field goals missed. Duke makes a big play on offense and gets called for taunting. I am amazed that a team that has won 10 games in the lastsix years or so can taunt anyone. Once you win something you make get the right to rub it in, but not when you are a national laughingstock. Cutcliffe made big noises about this being a bowl team, but he and his staff obviously overlooked Richmond, or at least let their players overlook Richmond. If this doesn't turn around immediately, Lewis has to go to the bench--why go to the well with a guy who can't help you in the future. The OC needs to take a long, long look at his game plan--the object is to march down the field, not from one sideline to another. Special teams need focus and discipline, neither of which were there for the kicking game. And Cutcliffe needs to grow a pair. 4th and 2 at the Richmond 22 in a game where you are behind because your special teams broke down, why not liven things up by going for it. Give the fans something to cheer about. But after the hype, this game was flat BORING. Not sure I'll come back, although the tail gate food was great. This game certainly did not give me any reason to believe that anything positive will happen this year.

Bob Green
09-06-2009, 12:02 AM
As dedicated Duke fans, I believe it would be productive to step back, take 10 deep breaths, and focus on the big picture. Yes, tonight's (today in my case) loss was extremely frustrating and not the start to the season we've all been dreaming about this past summer. However, Rome wasn't built in a day. I know, I know, a cliche. However, it is true. We need to give Coach Cutcliffe and the team more time. The season isn't over. We will win some games. Everyone needs to take a chill pill.

CameronBornAndBred
09-06-2009, 08:20 AM
They call for a last place finish, and a 3-9(1-7) record. That means that we will lose to one of the following --Richmond, NCCU, or Army. I can buy the last place prediction, but I don't see how anyone can justify that record prediction.
Well crap.

grossbus
09-06-2009, 08:48 AM
"As dedicated Duke fans, I believe it would be productive to step back, take 10 deep breaths, and focus on the big picture."

and avoid drinking too much of the DBR forum kool-ade that precedes both football and basketball seasons... :)

buddy
09-06-2009, 09:53 AM
As dedicated Duke fans, I believe it would be productive to step back, take 10 deep breaths, and focus on the big picture. Yes, tonight's (today in my case) loss was extremely frustrating and not the start to the season we've all been dreaming about this past summer. However, Rome wasn't built in a day. I know, I know, a cliche. However, it is true. We need to give Coach Cutcliffe and the team more time. The season isn't over. We will win some games. Everyone needs to take a chill pill.

Bob,
It was Coach Cutcliffe at his Tuesday night radio show who said "I know what a bowl team looks like, and this is a bowl team." Talk is cheap. Right now Cutcliffe is all hat and no cattle. If he is going to talk big, he needs to be able to back it up. Richmond is a very good team, but they won not because they are better than Duke, but because Duke did not execute. And because the offensive game plan had no imagination. And because "Sean Renfree will see a lot of action" (according to Cutcliffe) never left the bench. Bowl teams execute. Don't promise what you can't deliver Coach.

Devilsfan
09-06-2009, 10:50 AM
Cut WILL produce. Don't give us that "all hat, no cattle" crap. Someone now in a very high political office has earned the rights to that phrase. Thad needs time to throw down field where imo he is best. The O line forced us into East and West throws. Also the special teams let us down. The kicking game to be more specific. Given time (a couple of years) Cut and his staff WILL produce. That said, it is still no excuse to lose to a small division school. Richmond, Army and NC Central are supposed to be automatic W's. It's truely dissapointing but we are still Duke fans and will be pulling for the Devils next week and every week.

Devil in the Blue Dress
09-06-2009, 11:08 AM
Cut WILL produce. Don't give us that "all hat, no cattle" crap. Someone now in a very high political office has earned the rights to that phrase. Thad needs time to throw down field where imo he is best. The O line forced us into East and West throws. Also the special teams let us down. The kicking game to be more specific. Given time (a couple of years) Cut and his staff WILL produce. That said, it is still no excuse to lose to a small division school. Richmond, Army and NC Central are supposed to be automatic W's. It's truely dissapointing but we are still Duke fans and will be pulling for the Devils next week and every week.

I couldn't agree more. When a program is allowed to decline as much as ours did, rebuilding takes years, much longer than rebuilding a basketball program. Last year's improvements felt dramatic compared to years of disappointment. This year and next year will be the hardest in the rebuilding process.

loran16
09-06-2009, 11:09 AM
Well crap.

Were you at the game, CB&B? Missed you in Snubchat's awfulness.

buddy
09-06-2009, 12:19 PM
Some of you clearly missed my point. It was Cut who said this year's team was a bowl team. I agree that when a team has been down as long as Duke has been that you don't turn it around overnight. But it is the COACH who is saying this is a bowl team. When he raises those expectations--in a situation where the fan base would be quite content with "we're young and we'll struggle but we'll compete"--don't blame the fans for believing him. And based on his hype, yesterday's game was a huge disappointment. Don't get my hopes up and then come out and play a flat and uninspiring game, replete with an unimaginative game plan. I was there, and I felt like I was in a time warp to 2006. With that, 'nuff said.

arnie
09-06-2009, 12:40 PM
Some of you clearly missed my point. It was Cut who said this year's team was a bowl team. I agree that when a team has been down as long as Duke has been that you don't turn it around overnight. But it is the COACH who is saying this is a bowl team. When he raises those expectations--in a situation where the fan base would be quite content with "we're young and we'll struggle but we'll compete"--don't blame the fans for believing him. And based on his hype, yesterday's game was a huge disappointment. Don't get my hopes up and then come out and play a flat and uninspiring game, replete with an unimaginative game plan. I was there, and I felt like I was in a time warp to 2006. With that, 'nuff said.

Buddy - I think your assessment is fair; although I do believe that Cut can be a good head coach, where, Roof and Franks were certainly in over their heads from Day 1. The optimism at the beginning of the season was unwarranted by the fans and the coaching staf. We are miles away from having a respectable kicking game and 19 total rushing yards against a smaller subdivision team is atrocious.

The idea that it will take years to "build" this team to a point where we can beat a good subdivision team or compete with lower echelon BCS teams is hard to swallow. Other teams with less history than Duke football have done it in shorter periods of time than 40+ years.

DukeUsul
09-06-2009, 01:07 PM
Some of you clearly missed my point. It was Cut who said this year's team was a bowl team. I agree that when a team has been down as long as Duke has been that you don't turn it around overnight. But it is the COACH who is saying this is a bowl team. When he raises those expectations--in a situation where the fan base would be quite content with "we're young and we'll struggle but we'll compete"--don't blame the fans for believing him. And based on his hype, yesterday's game was a huge disappointment. Don't get my hopes up and then come out and play a flat and uninspiring game, replete with an unimaginative game plan. I was there, and I felt like I was in a time warp to 2006. With that, 'nuff said.

What's the coach supposed to say? "Eh, we're probably not good enough to be a bowl team this year, if we're lucky, we'll be able to win maybe 4 or 5 games...." I don't want that coach. I want a coach who'll inspire his guys to be better than they think they are.

ScottDuke04
09-06-2009, 01:27 PM
Buddy - I think your assessment is fair; although I do believe that Cut can be a good head coach, where, Roof and Franks were certainly in over their heads from Day 1. The optimism at the beginning of the season was unwarranted by the fans and the coaching staf. We are miles away from having a respectable kicking game and 19 total rushing yards against a smaller subdivision team is atrocious.

The idea that it will take years to "build" this team to a point where we can beat a good subdivision team or compete with lower echelon BCS teams is hard to swallow. Other teams with less history than Duke football have done it in shorter periods of time than 40+ years.

In defense of Roof and Franks, Franks' last season/Roof's first season had 4 wins--the same number Cutcliffe got in his first season. Roof also managed to recruit quite a few decent players (VO [5-star!], Tauiliili, Riley, Okpokuwurk, Boyette, etc). Agree that coaching-wise, the staff WAS NOT good enough (especially offensively). Last night at times felt like a 2007 game rather than a 2009 game though...

Duke has struggled with near consistency for 40 years--I don't expect the program to turn around overnight, but with the amount of money [from coaching salaries, new staff positions, etc to stadium renovations] being put into the program now, I DO expect it to turn around.

Anybody know if there are any potential 5-stars like VO on the horizon for Duke football?

devildeac
09-06-2009, 02:16 PM
Were you at the game, CB&B? Missed you in Snubchat's awfulness.

He was right next to me in the general admission section and we did NOT play any drinking games like we did on-line during the VT game last year.:rolleyes:

CameronBornAndBred
09-06-2009, 03:27 PM
Were you at the game, CB&B? Missed you in Snubchat's awfulness.
Yup, we were brunchgating. Had a great time, even with the loss.

ncexnyc
09-06-2009, 06:05 PM
What's the coach supposed to say? "Eh, we're probably not good enough to be a bowl team this year, if we're lucky, we'll be able to win maybe 4 or 5 games...." I don't want that coach. I want a coach who'll inspire his guys to be better than they think they are.
Well if this is your idea of inspirational play then the season is going to be verrrrrrry long indeed.;)

DukeUsul
09-06-2009, 07:45 PM
Well if this is your idea of inspirational play then the season is going to be verrrrrrry long indeed.;)

True. Here's to hoping he can inspire the guys to play better next week.