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Jackson
07-16-2009, 01:49 PM
In reading posts, I see a lot of opinions about next year, and things are possibly looking up with (hopefully) the early addition of Andre Dawkins, but I haven't seen anyone saying anything about how lucky we are to have in my opinion the best player in the country next year in Kyle Singler. He should be the unanimous Pre-Season pick as ACC POY and absolutely a 1st Team All American. If he does decide to stay for two more years, I think he would be the last player ever to wear #12 at Duke. Regardless of anything else happening, I am extremely excited to still have him and to see what he can achieve individually and help the team achieve.

CDu
07-16-2009, 01:55 PM
In reading posts, I see a lot of opinions about next year, and things are possibly looking up with (hopefully) the early addition of Andre Dawkins, but I haven't seen anyone saying anything about how lucky we are to have in my opinion the best player in the country next year in Kyle Singler. He should be the unanimous Pre-Season pick as ACC POY and absolutely a 1st Team All American. If he does decide to stay for two more years, I think he would be the last player ever to wear #12 at Duke. Regardless of anything else happening, I am extremely excited to still have him and to see what he can achieve individually and help the team achieve.

Yes, it's certainly a great luxury to have a guy as talented as Singler. It will be even nicer if we can keep Singler as a wing forward rather than having to force him to play/defend guards. But yes, it's absolutely fantastic to have Singler on the team.

As far as 1st Team All-American? I tend to shy away from making predictions before the season. A lot can happen in the course of the next eight months, and there can always be new faces to emerge. Remember that no one really expected Chris Carrawell to be ACC player of the year and a first-team All-American - even after his junior year.

NSDukeFan
07-16-2009, 02:10 PM
In reading posts, I see a lot of opinions about next year, and things are possibly looking up with (hopefully) the early addition of Andre Dawkins, but I haven't seen anyone saying anything about how lucky we are to have in my opinion the best player in the country next year in Kyle Singler. He should be the unanimous Pre-Season pick as ACC POY and absolutely a 1st Team All American. If he does decide to stay for two more years, I think he would be the last player ever to wear #12 at Duke. Regardless of anything else happening, I am extremely excited to still have him and to see what he can achieve individually and help the team achieve.

We are indeed lucky to have Singler back for next year and I share your optimism for his success for next year and hope he can achieve ACC POY and a first team all american status. I would hesitate to say that he should be the pre-season pick for ACC POY or even less likely for first team AA. In the ACC, Booker and Vasquez were also second team all-ACC last year (Booker had more votes than Singler), Delaney and Lawal were third team and Landesburg was honorable mention. Aminu, Davis and Alabi may all take big steps forward, Henson and Favors are top notch freshmen coming in and Thompson does return as a starter from the national champs. I am not saying that I expect any of those players to have as good a year as Singler, but to say that he should be the unanimous preseason pick for player of the year is a bit of a stretch.

I am hoping he is a post-season ACC POY and AA.

gumbomoop
07-16-2009, 02:26 PM
I'm guessing he'll easily be pre-season 1st team All-ACC, and roughly co-fav for POY with Booker, and possibly Davis.

It's true that we've collectively spent perhaps a bit too much time agonizing these past few weeks about whether KS can comfortably move to the perimeter, but I personally am intrigued about the positives of his passing from the perimeter to Z and the MPs on the inside. Or, given my (over-)enthusiasm for MP2's impact, the positives of his receiving nice passes on the inside from MP2 (and RK) on the perimeter.

Any opponent that guards KS, who "seems" to be Duke's 3 at any point, with a 6'4" guy, will surely have a problem when, on any particular possession, KS either slips a screen or simply sets up down low to receive an entry pass from a tall MP2 or perhaps RK.

MChambers
07-16-2009, 02:41 PM
I'm guessing he'll easily be pre-season 1st team All-ACC, and roughly co-fav for POY with Booker, and possibly Davis.

It's true that we've collectively spent perhaps a bit too much time agonizing these past few weeks about whether KS can comfortably move to the perimeter, but I personally am intrigued about the positives of his passing from the perimeter to Z and the MPs on the inside. Or, given my (over-)enthusiasm for MP2's impact, the positives of his receiving nice passes on the inside from MP2 (and RK) on the perimeter.

Any opponent that guards KS, who "seems" to be Duke's 3 at any point, with a 6'4" guy, will surely have a problem when, on any particular possession, KS either slips a screen or simply sets up down low to receive an entry pass from a tall MP2 or perhaps RK.

Yes, but defensive players can switch assignments, and we can't have 3 guys in the lane simultaneously, so at least one of Duke's two bigs will move outside. If that big can't do damage from there, his man can double Kyle.

Sorry to be a nattering nabob of negativism. I still think Kyle will have a great year.

CDu
07-16-2009, 02:56 PM
Yes, but defensive players can switch assignments, and we can't have 3 guys in the lane simultaneously, so at least one of Duke's two bigs will move outside. If that big can't do damage from there, his man can double Kyle.

Sorry to be a nattering nabob of negativism. I still think Kyle will have a great year.

This is a key point that I don't think people were fully considering when talking about our size advantages. It's also a point that would be affected if Dawkins does in fact come early. If Dawkins does come and Singler plays primarily at the "3," it's a bit easier to create a mismatch. Especially when Kelly is playing the "4", he can draw his man away from the basket, leaving only two guys in the post. It gets easier if we have a "5" who is comfortable moving to 12-15 feet away from the rim (which will hopefully be everyone but Zoubek).

The problem you suggest would arise if we don't get Dawkins this year. In that scenario, Singler would spend probably half his time at the "2". This means that we'd spend a lot of time with two guys on the floor that can't really stretch the defense. In that situation, the paint would be crowded and Singler's size advantage as a post-up would go away.

That's yet another reason why getting Dawkins a year early would help a lot. It would create more options to spread the floor, which could create easier mismatch scenarios for Singler.

Greg_Newton
07-16-2009, 03:12 PM
This is a key point that I don't think people were fully considering when talking about our size advantages. It's also a point that would be affected if Dawkins does in fact come early. If Dawkins does come and Singler plays primarily at the "3," it's a bit easier to create a mismatch. Especially when Kelly is playing the "4", he can draw his man away from the basket, leaving only two guys in the post. It gets easier if we have a "5" who is comfortable moving to 12-15 feet away from the rim (which will hopefully be everyone but Zoubek).

Singler is also a good enough passer and K a good enough schemer that I would feel pretty good about Singler getting doubled with one of the Plumlees' defenders (especially Mason). I'm not quite sold on either of their 3 point shots, but they're both most dangerous when attacking the rim. I personally wouldn't want to be the guy rotating over to get in a cutting Mason's way after he receives the return pass from Singler...

But yes, like you said, it gets a little trickier if Singler's at the 2.

RainingThrees
07-16-2009, 04:00 PM
I would like to see Kyle posting up smaller players. Sometimes I think he is too eager to jack the 3's up and from what I have seen he does pretty good on those occasions that he goes into the low post.

jimsumner
07-16-2009, 04:17 PM
I think the chances of Singler being pre-season ACC POY are quite high.

And any ACC POY becomes a presumptive A-A.

BlueDster
07-16-2009, 07:40 PM
Although I definitely agree that Singler is a candidate for the awards discussed above, he has always seemed like a mostly quiet contributor to me. He has the somewhat unique ability to be Duke's leading scorer in many games without drawing tons of attention. Often times I will have no idea how many points or rebounds he had until I look at the boxscore. I can imagine how some may not vote for him perhaps not being as memorable as some candidates.

gumbomoop
07-16-2009, 08:04 PM
Yes, but defensive players can switch assignments, and we can't have 3 guys in the lane simultaneously, so at least one of Duke's two bigs will move outside. If that big can't do damage from there, his man can double Kyle.

Sorry to be a nattering nabob of negativism. I still think Kyle will have a great year.

Yes, I'm with you on this, so perhaps I mis-wrote, or we're writing past each other. I did not mean to suggest that KS would be in game at same time as 3other bigs. Further, I meant to say that if KS was "playing the 3," I'd think that occasionally [not for 5 minutes, but just on any particular time down court] he'd move inside, and, say either [not both] MP2 or RK would temporarily be on the wing. In said scenario, a tall winger, either of whom I think - admittedly from limited evidence but by rep - could easily get the ball inside with a basic entry pass.... to KS, guarded by smaller man. If smaller opponent switches onto MP2 [or RK, if he's in game rather than MP2], ok, but at least that would make entry pass that much easier, or that much easier to shoot over smallish opponent, which, we are told RK can definitely do, and MP2 probably do, at least to 15 feet out.

My head swims. I'm sure I'm overthinking [i.e., probably underthinking] these scenarios. Probably the dizzying, enchanting effect of possible early arrival.

NSDukeFan
07-16-2009, 08:07 PM
I think the chances of Singler being pre-season ACC POY are quite high.

And any ACC POY becomes a presumptive A-A.

I don't disagree with you, but I do not believe it to be a slam-dunk unanimous pick at this point. I am certainly hoping and expecting that he will earn it by the end of the year, though.

sagegrouse
07-16-2009, 08:14 PM
Yes, I'm with you on this, so perhaps I mis-wrote, or we're writing past each other. I did not mean to suggest that KS would be in game at same time as 3other bigs. Further, I meant to say that if KS was "playing the 3," I'd think that occasionally [not for 5 minutes, but just on any particular time down court] he'd move inside, and, say either [not both] MP2 or RK would temporarily be on the wing. In said scenario, a tall winger, either of whom I think - admittedly from limited evidence but by rep - could easily get the ball inside with a basic entry pass.... to KS, guarded by smaller man. If smaller opponent switches onto MP2 [or RK, if he's in game rather than MP2], ok, but at least that would make entry pass that much easier, or that much easier to shoot over smallish opponent, which, we are told RK can definitely do, and MP2 probably do, at least to 15 feet out.

My head swims. I'm sure I'm overthinking [i.e., probably underthinking] these scenarios. Probably the dizzying, enchanting effect of possible early arrival.

"Playing the 3" sounds like Dean Smith talk. K doesn't use positions; they are all "basketball players." There will be plenty of times when Jon or Nolan will be on the floow with Kyle and three of the aforementioned "bigs." There will also be many times when Jon, Nolan, and Andre (I love writing this part) will be on the court along with Kyle and only one of the "bigs."

FWIW I believe K would like from time to time to have a team of five skilled basketball players that are largely interchangeable -- kinda like what Bob Knight called "K's all-forward team."

sagegrouse

MChambers
07-16-2009, 08:25 PM
Yes, I'm with you on this, so perhaps I mis-wrote, or we're writing past each other. I did not mean to suggest that KS would be in game at same time as 3other bigs. Further, I meant to say that if KS was "playing the 3," I'd think that occasionally [not for 5 minutes, but just on any particular time down court] he'd move inside, and, say either [not both] MP2 or RK would temporarily be on the wing. In said scenario, a tall winger, either of whom I think - admittedly from limited evidence but by rep - could easily get the ball inside with a basic entry pass.... to KS, guarded by smaller man. If smaller opponent switches onto MP2 [or RK, if he's in game rather than MP2], ok, but at least that would make entry pass that much easier, or that much easier to shoot over smallish opponent, which, we are told RK can definitely do, and MP2 probably do, at least to 15 feet out.

My head swims. I'm sure I'm overthinking [i.e., probably underthinking] these scenarios. Probably the dizzying, enchanting effect of possible early arrival.
I just wanted to point out that it isn't as simple as some posts made it sound.

If Kyle is guarded by [remember we don't play positions] by the other team's 2 or 3, yes, he can try to post up, but good defense isn't simply man-to-man, there are team responsibilities. If Duke's two biggest players in the game are playing who don't draw close attention away from the basket (e.g., Lance, Miles, and Brian), then their defenders can rotate on to Kyle. Of course, our bigs can then set screens for other Duke players, like Nolan and Jon (and Andre, yay!), but it would be better if at least one of our bigs could shoot from outside, or drive from outside. Yes, RK probably can do that, and maybe MP2 can, but they are freshmen, and freshmen often don't shoot well from outside.

So I agree with those who added to my message: Kyle posting up works best with teammates who can spread the floor.

I think you and I agree.

MChambers
07-16-2009, 08:34 PM
"Playing the 3" sounds like Dean Smith talk. K doesn't use positions; they are all "basketball players." There will be plenty of times when Jon or Nolan will be on the floow with Kyle and three of the aforementioned "bigs." There will also be many times when Jon, Nolan, and Andre (I love writing this part) will be on the court along with Kyle and only one of the "bigs."

FWIW I believe K would like from time to time to have a team of five skilled basketball players that are largely interchangeable -- kinda like what Bob Knight called "K's all-forward team."

sagegrouse
Well, none of us want to sound like El Deano! I'm personally insulted! ;-)

I think people are trying to point out that players have strengths and weaknesses that affect where they are most effective on the floor. Lance (and Dave McClure), for example, is not bad in the open floor on D, but he's lost at the 3 point line on offense, except for setting screens (and has a tendency to get cheap fouls there). Kyle is good everywhere on offense; on D, he's good down low, and probably adequate outside.

I think a lot of us have been worried about a lack of quickness on the perimeter on defense, and a lack of true low post scoring. So we use labels like 3 and 4 to explain.

I think my all-time favorite non-Duke team was a group assembled for the East in the NBA All-Star game years ago: Grant, Laettner, and three other guys who helped: Jordan, Pippin and A Hardaway. Four interchangeable parts and Laettner, who recognized his job was to rebound, throw outlet passes, and screen, if they had to run a half court set. They killed the West.

But this Duke team doesn't truly have as many interchangeable parts as we'd like. Yes, both Scheyer and Nolan can play both guard positions, and Kyle can play all over the court.

I'm still optimistic, mind you, but I'd love to have E-Will back.

trinity79
07-17-2009, 02:43 AM
I just like the sound of that. :D And I don't think opposing teams will like it when all three of them are on the floor together.

CDu
07-17-2009, 09:16 AM
Well, none of us want to sound like El Deano! I'm personally insulted! ;-)

I think people are trying to point out that players have strengths and weaknesses that affect where they are most effective on the floor. Lance (and Dave McClure), for example, is not bad in the open floor on D, but he's lost at the 3 point line on offense, except for setting screens (and has a tendency to get cheap fouls there). Kyle is good everywhere on offense; on D, he's good down low, and probably adequate outside.

I think a lot of us have been worried about a lack of quickness on the perimeter on defense, and a lack of true low post scoring. So we use labels like 3 and 4 to explain.

I think my all-time favorite non-Duke team was a group assembled for the East in the NBA All-Star game years ago: Grant, Laettner, and three other guys who helped: Jordan, Pippin and A Hardaway. Four interchangeable parts and Laettner, who recognized his job was to rebound, throw outlet passes, and screen, if they had to run a half court set. They killed the West.

But this Duke team doesn't truly have as many interchangeable parts as we'd like. Yes, both Scheyer and Nolan can play both guard positions, and Kyle can play all over the court.

I'm still optimistic, mind you, but I'd love to have E-Will back.

I agree with most of this. I've always felt the "Duke doesn't have positions" is bit of a handwaving statement and not entirely accurate. I don't even think Coach K really means it when he says it, or at least not in the sense that people here have taken it. If it was really the case, then why not just have Zoubek defend Lawson? Or why not have him playing on the perimeter? Since we don't have positions, there's no problem there, right? Why would Coach K specifically talk about looking for a PG and a big man in the media earlier this year?

And you're right on with the reason people use the position numbers. They are especially useful when discussing the defensive end of the floor. On that end, you certainly don't want Zoubek guarding Malcolm Delaney do you? No, you want him guarding the other team's big man (or "5s"). Similarly, I don't think you really want Ryan Kelly guarding quicker wing players. I think we'd prefer to see him guarding slower forwards (or "4s"). Hence the lingo.

I think the ideal allotment would be to have a PG, a post player, and then versatile wings and forwards to fill the other three spots (some quicker, smaller ones, and some bigger more physical ones). We're getting closer to that with the addition of Dawkins, having Smith and Dawkins as smaller/quicker guys and Singler, Thomas, and Kelly as bigger, forward types. Scheyer is still more suited to be a wing, but we can get by with him or Smith at the point assuming we have enough contributions offensively from Smith and the freshmen.

Wander
07-17-2009, 10:01 AM
I'd pick Singler as the best player not on the two big K's - Kentucky and Kansas. Collins, Wall, Singler, Patterson, Aldrich as my preseason 1st team.

NSDukeFan
07-17-2009, 11:23 AM
I'd pick Singler as the best player not on the two big K's - Kentucky and Kansas. Collins, Wall, Singler, Patterson, Aldrich as my preseason 1st team.

Luke Harangody? I'd pick Kalin Lucas over Wall right now, but am not sure who the other preseason 1st team guard would be, but doubt it would be a freshman, even a very talented one. Evan Turner should be considered in there as well as Booker (the elder).

gumbomoop
07-17-2009, 11:30 AM
"Playing the 3" sounds like Dean Smith talk.

sagegrouse

Ah, it's precisely because one occasionally gets in trouble for even vaguely referring to numbered positions that (a) I put [what in writing circles are referred to as] "scare quotes" around the words you are unhappy with, and (b) in posts on other threads I've said that, at least on O, it's probably sensible simply to refer to "the wings."

As for sounding like Deano, well, in a literal sense to be told that one sounds like he did in pressers and interviews is truly a put down, as I always found him irritating, cloying, disingenuous, always on guard to say nothing that any writer could misinterpret, and thus, deflecting any semi-serious observation as far away as possible, all this in the guise of "protecting my team." Whereas K, rather more to my liking, mostly talks straight. So, your comment stings and possibly wounds me mortally, I fear.

But here with my last breath I will admit to thinking Deano a real good basketball coach. [See what your wounding words have made me do: spend my last breath on Deano! Jeez.......]

shadowfax336
07-17-2009, 12:46 PM
I'd pick Singler as the best player not on the two big K's - Kentucky and Kansas. Collins, Wall, Singler, Patterson, Aldrich as my preseason 1st team.

Overhyped much??

I mean Kansas and Kentucky are the 2 most talented teams for sure, and I can see arguments for Collins and Aldrich certainly. But lets wait to see what Wall can do on the floor before you anoint him one of the 5 best college players in the nation. Patterson wasn't even an honorable mention all american last year, lets calm down the hype there please.

1 Team (I admit freshmen like Wall might make it by the end, but putting them on now is a crapshoot)

G- Kalin Lucas -Mich St. (HM Last year)
G- Sheron Collins -KU (3rd Team last year)
F-Kyle Singler -Duke(HM Last year)
F- Cole Aldrich -KU(HM last year)
C-Luke Harangody - ND (2nd Team last year)

2nd Team

G- John Wall - UK
G- Evan Turner -OSU(HM Last year)
F- Matt Howard - Butler (HM Last year)
F - Craig Brackens - Iowa State (HM Last year)
C- James Varnado - Missippi State(HM last year)

3rd Team

G- Talor Battle -PSU
G- Scotty Reynolds-Nova
F- Robbie Hummel -Purdue
F- Ed Davis - UNC
C- Derrick Favors - GT

A few more
ACC- Booker, Vasquez, Aminu
Big East- Kemba Walker, Greg Monroe, Da'Sean Butler(surprisingly few big name stars in the BE this year, down year there outside of Nova and WVU)
Big 10- Raymar Morgan, Manny Harris, DeShawn Sims
Big 12- Damion James, Willie Warren, Avery Bradley
SEC- Patterson, Tyler Smith (SEC is down again)
PAC-10- (note that they had nobody on the first 3 teams) Patrick Christopher, Nic Wise, Isaiah Thomas, Abdul Gaddy
Other-Jerome Jordan, Matt Bouldin?, Chris Wright (not a whole lot off the beaten track this year)

Jackson
07-17-2009, 01:25 PM
Although this centers on Singler, how about a mention for Scheyer for at least Honorable Mention All American? I can forsee him having a type of year statistically at least that could rival many of the names thrown about here.

DevilDan
07-17-2009, 01:42 PM
MARK MY WORDS ... YOU HEARD IT HERE ! ( haaaaaaa )
We have NOT seen the REAL KYLE SINGLER to this point. If Mason comes in and rocks the boat with the frontcourt, and Andre gets here to complement Nolan and Jon on the perimeter, it SHALL free up KYLE to have an incredible year, where his true skills and abiities will SHINE. GO DUKE !

Kedsy
07-17-2009, 01:50 PM
Overhyped much??

I mean Kansas and Kentucky are the 2 most talented teams for sure, and I can see arguments for Collins and Aldrich certainly. But lets wait to see what Wall can do on the floor before you anoint him one of the 5 best college players in the nation. Patterson wasn't even an honorable mention all american last year, lets calm down the hype there please.

1 Team (I admit freshmen like Wall might make it by the end, but putting them on now is a crapshoot)

G- Kalin Lucas -Mich St. (HM Last year)
G- Sheron Collins -KU (3rd Team last year)
F-Kyle Singler -Duke(HM Last year)
F- Cole Aldrich -KU(HM last year)
C-Luke Harangody - ND (2nd Team last year)

2nd Team

G- John Wall - UK
G- Evan Turner -OSU(HM Last year)
F- Matt Howard - Butler (HM Last year)
F - Craig Brackens - Iowa State (HM Last year)
C- James Varnado - Missippi State(HM last year)



I'm not trying to be rude, but it amuses me that you begin a post with the phrase "overhyped much," explain that it would be ridiculous to "anoint [a freshman] as one of the 5 best college players in the nation," and then have Wall as a second team All-American yourself. I guess it's that much less hype to declare him one of the 10 best college players in the nation, eh?

FWIW, my uneducated guess is Singler is a pre-season consensus 2nd team All-American, but if he and the team have a great year, he could possibly sneak up to first team.

Wander
07-17-2009, 03:11 PM
Overhyped much??

I mean Kansas and Kentucky are the 2 most talented teams for sure, and I can see arguments for Collins and Aldrich certainly. But lets wait to see what Wall can do on the floor before you anoint him one of the 5 best college players in the nation. Patterson wasn't even an honorable mention all american last year, lets calm down the hype there please.


It's all guesswork to some degree anyway. Wall might be more guesswork than others, but we've seen precedent recently for talented freshmen to be considered one of the five best players in the country. Add in that one of those was a point guard under Calipari, and I feel pretty good with the pick (OK, I know that Rose didn't officially make first team AA in 2008, but he was one of the top five players that year to me).

As for Patterson, I've always felt that he's been underrated, partially due to Kentucky sucking last year. The other part - and I know that I'm in the minority on this one - is that I think Meeks is vastly overrated, which takes away from PP.

So yeah, it's all guessing, including Singler (who if you forced me to make a decision right now would probably be my prediction for NPOY), but it's not guessing that's simply born out of empty hype.

I like most of your list by the way; one guy you didn't have that jumped out on me was Hayward on Butler.

slower
07-18-2009, 03:43 PM
Overhyped much??

I mean Kansas and Kentucky are the 2 most talented teams for sure, and I can see arguments for Collins and Aldrich certainly. But lets wait to see what Wall can do on the floor before you anoint him one of the 5 best college players in the nation. Patterson wasn't even an honorable mention all american last year, lets calm down the hype there please.

1 Team (I admit freshmen like Wall might make it by the end, but putting them on now is a crapshoot)

G- Kalin Lucas -Mich St. (HM Last year)
G- Sheron Collins -KU (3rd Team last year)
F-Kyle Singler -Duke(HM Last year)
F- Cole Aldrich -KU(HM last year)
C-Luke Harangody - ND (2nd Team last year)

2nd Team

G- John Wall - UK
G- Evan Turner -OSU(HM Last year)
F- Matt Howard - Butler (HM Last year)
F - Craig Brackens - Iowa State (HM Last year)
C- James Varnado - Missippi State(HM last year)

3rd Team

G- Talor Battle -PSU
G- Scotty Reynolds-Nova
F- Robbie Hummel -Purdue
F- Ed Davis - UNC
C- Derrick Favors - GT

A few more
ACC- Booker, Vasquez, Aminu
Big East- Kemba Walker, Greg Monroe, Da'Sean Butler(surprisingly few big name stars in the BE this year, down year there outside of Nova and WVU)
Big 10- Raymar Morgan, Manny Harris, DeShawn Sims
Big 12- Damion James, Willie Warren, Avery Bradley
SEC- Patterson, Tyler Smith (SEC is down again)
PAC-10- (note that they had nobody on the first 3 teams) Patrick Christopher, Nic Wise, Isaiah Thomas, Abdul Gaddy
Other-Jerome Jordan, Matt Bouldin?, Chris Wright (not a whole lot off the beaten track this year)

Warren will be getting a lot of hype. I'm guessing he'll at least be on one of the pre-season first three teams.

ACCBBallFan
07-21-2009, 02:55 AM
Yes, Warren for sure.

A few other ACC possibilities would be Delaney,
Scheyer , Shumpert , Lawal, and Aminu.

There's only 15 overall but these guys may at least get some consideration along with Kyle, Booker, Davis et al already mentioned, though not sure who they might displace, probably most likely the frosh

mgtr
07-21-2009, 03:02 AM
Lets give a little more love to KS. He will be the man next year, and without him and Jon, we don't have much. We talk on and on about new recruits, but the mainstays of our team next year (barring massive surprises) will be Kyle and Jon.

gumbomoop
07-21-2009, 08:47 AM
Lets give a little more love to KS. He will be the man next year, and without him and Jon, we don't have much. We talk on and on about new recruits, but the mainstays of our team next year (barring massive surprises) will be Kyle and Jon.

Yep, you've got a good point, though one not likely to engender much disagreement. We've sort of collectively fallen into a default position of not saying much about KS and JS, focusing instead, over last 2 months, on problems: What would G decide? Missed on Wall/Bledsoe, so how will Duke cope with only 3 guards? Oh, crap, EW has to transfer, now we're down to 2 guards! Can Kyle play "the 2?" Can LT defend "the 2/3?" Can KS, JS, and NS each handle 35+ mpg? Can MP2 and RK contribute significant minutes right away? Ooohh, will we get a Christmas gift in July? Now that AD [or DD?] is "almost here," how much will he play, and can he defend, period?

We all -again, default position - assume that KS and JS are mainstays. As to love for KS, well, there is a mini-debate going on about whether he's preseason All-Am first or second team, so there's some love. Actually, maybe it's JS who's been a bit more forgotten even than KS. So we are perhaps remiss in failing to sing his praises daily, but it's not for lack of love. Rather, it's that we gotta solve all of K's other now-intriguing problem-possibilities, so that KS and JS can have a legit shot to get us to FF.

Duke of Nashville
09-24-2009, 11:52 AM
http://www.sportingnews.com/college-basketball/article/2009-09-23/college-basketballs-top-10-small-forwards

Article has Kyle Singler only behind Evan Turner.

Wish we had them in the ACC/BigTen Challenge.

Azdukefan
09-24-2009, 03:26 PM
wearing Duke blue glasses but I see no one on that list that should be ranked higher than Kyle. I can remember hearing coach say he has never had any freshmen more ready to play in the ACC than Kyle and he has continued to improve every year (I expect nothing less this year). I truly feel like he will be NPOY but I guess we shall see! Is it October yet?

DBFAN
09-24-2009, 03:36 PM
wearing Duke blue glasses but I see no one on that list that should be ranked higher than Kyle. I can remember hearing coach say he has never had any freshmen more ready to play in the ACC than Kyle and he has continued to improve every year (I expect nothing less this year). I truly feel like he will be NPOY but I guess we shall see! Is it October yet?


Not yet.........sigh

jws
09-24-2009, 03:43 PM
Singler playing the 2 position, if he truly is playing that position, would present horrendous matchup problems for any opposing defense, whether the post players can reliably hit outside shots or not.

No question that defenses can, and will, make many adjustments to counter that, but for most teams, none of the choices are going to be very good. If Singler gets the ball on the low block and someone comes to double, he's an excellent passer and would make the defense pay through the nose far more often than not, and it doesn't require Brian Zoubek knocking down threes, it simply requires whoever's man leaves to double going to the place on the floor that makes the defense pay for that double. If it's Zoubek's man, he can go to the opposite block for a dump-and-dunk, or he can cut to the bottom of the circle, or go screen for someone else.

A team with Carolina's depth might make life a bit more difficult, because their depth of size might allow them to play Singler straight up most of the time, even on the block, but Singler one-on-one against anyone is not a good situation for the defense.

Kedsy
09-24-2009, 05:08 PM
Singler playing the 2 position, if he truly is playing that position, would present horrendous matchup problems for any opposing defense, whether the post players can reliably hit outside shots or not.

No question that defenses can, and will, make many adjustments to counter that, but for most teams, none of the choices are going to be very good. If Singler gets the ball on the low block and someone comes to double, he's an excellent passer and would make the defense pay through the nose far more often than not, and it doesn't require Brian Zoubek knocking down threes, it simply requires whoever's man leaves to double going to the place on the floor that makes the defense pay for that double. If it's Zoubek's man, he can go to the opposite block for a dump-and-dunk, or he can cut to the bottom of the circle, or go screen for someone else.

A team with Carolina's depth might make life a bit more difficult, because their depth of size might allow them to play Singler straight up most of the time, even on the block, but Singler one-on-one against anyone is not a good situation for the defense.

I think most would agree with your assessment. The real issue for Kyle is not offense but how often Kyle guarding a smaller, quicker player would present an undesirable mismatch on defense.