Man of the Match vs. UNC (II)

[Jumbo]

Who was the Man of the Match in the game at UNC?

[KShip21]

Scheyer, hands down

[kaufmjo]

Who was the Man of the Match in the game at UNC?
Scheyer was awesome today. Great play by big 3 for Duke, other players didnt show up. jon really has become a real time playmaker and can create his shot now. No whining about refs in post game threads please

[arnie]

Scheyer all the way

[geraldsneighbor]

Scheyer. The shots he makes are always tough and contested. 7/7 at one point.

[Saratoga2]

I think Scheyer played as close to a perfect game as I have seen. He shot exceptionally well, had no turnovers that I noticed and guarded well. While Henderson and Singler had good games, Singler went cold and began to force the ball. Henderson has a little problem with his dribble penetration and is not as secure with the ball as Scheyer.

[captmojo]

Jon for offense. My vote went to Elliot because the more important point was to put the clamps on Lawson. Good job EW.

[Jumbo]

Jon for offense. My vote went to Elliot because the more important point was to put the clamps on Lawson. Good job EW.

He didn't put the clamps on Lawson. Lawson still scored in double figures and had nine assists on a bad foot. Not to mention the fact that we were switching screens, so Scheyer spent a ton of time on Lawson, too, and we were using a trailing big man to keep almost 1.5 guys on Lawson at all times.

Voting for Williams over Scheyer is ridiculous.

[KShip21]

Jon- 7/7 fg 5 ast 3 reb 4 stl and 0 TO in 39 min.......about as good as you can get


Don't like seeing EWill take 5 3s.......

[mickeysgotagun]

Scheyer kept us in on that game, E-Wills gives me some mixed impressions, there were times where he seemed completely out of place(start of 2nd half, where he hesitated on 3) and other times he played great(defense on lawson).

[Duvall]

Don't like seeing EWill take 5 3s.......

To be fair, every single one of them was wide open. Not a little open, but wide open.

[JDev]

He didn't put the clamps on Lawson. Lawson still scored in double figures and had nine assists on a bad foot. Not to mention the fact that we were switching screens, so Scheyer spent a ton of time on Lawson, too, and we were using a trailing big man to keep almost 1.5 guys on Lawson at all times.

There didn't seem to be this "bad foot" you speak of. That seems to have been overblown, as many figured before the game. You are still right about eveything else. Lawson, percentage-wise, probably accounted for just as many of UNC's points as he did in Cameron.

[captmojo]

He didn't put the clamps on Lawson. Lawson still scored in double figures and had nine assists on a bad foot. Not to mention the fact that we were switching screens, so Scheyer spent a ton of time on Lawson, too, and we were using a trailing big man to keep almost 1.5 guys on Lawson at all times.

Voting for Williams over Scheyer is ridiculous.

Proper switching is part of good defense. Lawson didn't get off and around with anywhere near the proficiency he was able to in the first game. I don't buy the alleged foot injury.

[Jumbo]

Proper switching is part of good defense. Lawson didn't get off and around with anywhere near the proficiency he was able to in the first game. I don't buy the alleged foot injury.

Lawson had 13 points and 9 assists in a much slower-paced game (which means fewer possessions). And, as I mentioned, Williams didn't lock him down. It was a complete team approach geared toward stopping Lawson, and it wasn't even that successful. Please explain to me how Williams' part in that mildly successful part of the game remotely compares to Scheyer's all-around game. Thanks.

[Cameron]

Had Williams shot one more three-pointer at a crucial moment he probably would have been on the bench. Player of the game? Right.

I gave the player of the game to Kyle, for the outstanding start to the game he helped energize for us. He was shooting great and playing with that same flair we have become accustomed to over the past two years. The game just kind of slowed for him for too long a stretch in the middle.. It happens.

But, had Tyler not taken off like a space shuttle to draw a "charge" on Kyle late in the second half, Kyle would have went to the line and the game would have been entirely different. At that point in the game, it was 65-58, Carolina, with six minutes left. With the foul called on Kyle, that put Kyle on the bench with four fouls and gave Carolina breathing room.

My hate for Carolina is only growing and growing. It hasn't been this bad since the late '90s. Obviously some of that is due to UNC's recent resurgence. But the majority of it has to do with the insufferable Tyler Hansbrough, the most overhyped joke to play college ball in years. This kid is either shot putting the ball toward the basket while jump driving into his opponent or flopping like a sandal over 75 percent of the time.

He sucks.

[captmojo]

Lawson had 13 points and 9 assists in a much slower-paced game (which means fewer possessions). And, as I mentioned, Williams didn't lock him down. It was a complete team approach geared toward stopping Lawson, and it wasn't even that successful. Please explain to me how Williams' part in that mildly successful part of the game remotely compares to Scheyer's all-around game. Thanks.

Sometimes I take a position for one guy I see, that appears to fulfill his role best, not simply looking at one's stats versus another. I saw very few chances for Lawson to have chances for the same type of dribble penetration that he had in spasm number 1 at Cameron, when EW was on him. That's not to say he was in proper position every time. Lawson did see daylight to the lane, I thought, three times and actually went once, when it was EW on him, one-on-one. Phew! That was long-winded.

[weezie]

I keep singing the same song but Kyle is simply our smartest player on the court each and every game. He's everywhere and always aware of the ball. It made seeing that one foot on the line at the end so hard. Just a microsecond and we're of to the races. He couldn't find Jon, I guess he really doesn't have eyes in the back of his head.
I've never seen a team miss so many of their 2nd free throws like this Duke team does in all their games. It must be some kind of a record.

[ACCBBallFan]

Not even close from a metrics oerspective:

Rating Player
97 Jon Scheyer, G

76 Kyle Singler, F

69 Ty Lawson, G
69 TOTALS-Duke
68 Tyler Hansbrough, F
64 TOTALS-UNC
63 Wayne Ellington, G
61 Danny Green, G-F

52 Deon Thompson, F

49 Gerald Henderson, G-F
45 Elliot Williams, G
45 Lance Thomas, F

33 Bobby Frasor, G

26 Ed Davis, F

08 David McClure, F
07 Brian Zoubek, C
04 Greg Paulus, G
04 Tyler Zeller, F
03 Larry Drew II, G
01 Mike Copeland, F

[FireOgilvie]

Not even close from a metrics oerspective:




Where do you get these numbers?

[Jumbo]

This is Scheyer's line from tonight:
39 minutes, 24 points (7-7 FG, 3-3 3FG, 7-8 FT), 5 assists, 3 rebounds, 4 steals, 0 turnovers.

That's as good a line as anyone has produced all year.

[Jumbo]

Where do you get these numbers?

Beats me. I've been asking him to explain it all season.

[captmojo]

This is Scheyer's line from tonight:
39 minutes, 24 points (7-7 FG, 3-3 3FG, 7-8 FT), 5 assists, 3 rebounds, 4 steals, 0 turnovers.

That's as good a line as anyone has produced all year.

I agree. Most of these are related to offense. I was more focused to defense. I praised Jon's offensive show with the first sentence of explaining my vote. I hope my explanation in my vote seems reasonable.

BTW, if I could vote for a MOTM in the lighter shade, it would be offensive. Ellington hit some unreal, circus looking stuff today.

[Jumbo]

I agree. Most of these are related to offense. I was more focused to defense. I praised Jon's offensive show with the first sentence of explaining my vote. I hope my explanation in my vote seems reasonable.

I wasn't responding to you there. But four steals are not related to offense. And it was interesting that during that brief highlight montage of Ellington's points, only one of his buckets came against Jon (that crazy drive where he somehow flipped the ball over Singler to score). The play where McClure closed out on him late for a three drove me crazy. Scheyer doesn't make those mistakes when guarding Wayne. Never has.

[captmojo]

I wasn't responding to you there. But four steals are not related to offense. And it was interesting that during that brief highlight montage of Ellington's points, only one of his buckets came against Jon (that crazy drive where he somehow flipped the ball over Singler to score). The play where McClure closed out on him late for a three drove me crazy. Scheyer doesn't make those mistakes when guarding Wayne. Never has.

Weird. I went back and made an edit to the last post at the same time you wrote this. Please look. Freaky,huh?

[Madrasdukie]

That was quite easy.

[Greg_Newton]

If Olek Czyz wants to learn how to play basketball, he should just watch this game tape of Scheyer's performance... over and over and over.

In defense of those defending Elliot Williams (and his defense), if you take away Lawson's 9 free throws, many of which were bailout calls on which EWill was right there with him, he only has 4 points. Plus, his 9 assists were more a result of spectacular plays by his teammates than blow-bys and dishes for easy baskets... it seemed like whenever Lawson tried turn on the burners and go one-on-one against Elliot, he stayed in front of him step for step. Green, Ellington and Thompson were the ones that really put the Holes over the top today, their top 2 were far from dominant.

The bigger point here? Our PG issues are officially in the past. You can't ask for a better all around performance from your PG than Scheyer tonight, or for a better defensive effort against an elite opposing PG like Lawson. Should be a fun backcourt tandem to watch for the rest of the year and beyond...

[MChambers]

This is Scheyer's line from tonight:
39 minutes, 24 points (7-7 FG, 3-3 3FG, 7-8 FT), 5 assists, 3 rebounds, 4 steals, 0 turnovers.

That's as good a line as anyone has produced all year.

I didn't need to see the box to know. Scheyer was fantastic. Singler also had a great game, but the refs missed it.

[Deb4Duke4Ever]

I didn't need to see the box to know. Scheyer was fantastic. Singler also had a great game, but the refs missed it.

I agree. The thing I noticed the most was that Jon was completely calm in the game while the others seemed rushed at times (especially G as well as EWill and Kyle a little). I think if everyone was as calm as Jon was the whole game, we would have gotten the stops we needed and probably pulled the win out. IMHO.:)

[jma4life]

Jumbo, are you related to Scheyer?

There is no question Jon was player of the game in my opinion but everyone can have their own opinion. No need to take it personally. Even if Scheyer did just play one of the best games played by a Duke player in the past few seasons.

[DukeDevilDeb]

Jon for offense. My vote went to Elliot because the more important point was to put the clamps on Lawson. Good job EW.

But this is the dumbest vote I have ever seen in an MOTM thread. How ANYONE could vote for Elliot in this game is beyond my comprehension. Elliot is a freshman (I keep telling myself) who played 38 minutes (as many as Kyle and just one less than Scheyer). In that 38 minutes, he shot eleven times from the field (and made 3). Of those 11 shots, 5 were from 3-point range (he made 1). He made one of two free throws; had 4 rebounds and one turnover. We've had lots of players play worse than that.

But Scheyer played an almost perfect game. I cannot imagine who voted for Lance either .... that travel on the last play of the first half, I was ready to jump on him.

I can understand the votes for Kyle, despite the face that he appeared to go on vacation for a long period of time from mid first half to mid second half.

And Gerald...? I think Wayne can safely say that he has won virtually every matchup he's played against G.

The only thing that gave me any please was that Hanstravel fouled out of his senior game. I hope someone is going to send a handkerchief along with him to the NBA... some of the tears when the refs actually had the guts to call a foul on him were pathetic! :mad:

[jma4life]

I agree that it does not make sense to me how one could vote for Williams but Jumbo almost sounded personally offended. Plus, if someone voted for Williams, they're probably not going to respond to criticism of that vote. Pretty much everyone who watched the game knew Scheyer was the man of the match with Singler also playing pretty well.

I mean no offense to Jumbo because I consider him flat out, the best poster on this site but he takes criticism of Scheyer personally and goes out of his way to defend him. Not that he's wrong in any of the cases with his defense of Scheyer but it's almost at the point where I really think he might be related to Jon in how personally he takes it. I suppose it could be because Scheyer is imo undervalued by most Duke/basketball fans.

And no one has voted for G.

[rkm]

And no one has voted for G.
I hope no one does. He's our best player, but I was at the game, and watching live he just looked out of control at times, and more significantly did not try to get his points in the rhythm of the team's offense, except those drives mid-way through the second half when the seams opened up.

[ncexnyc]

The last few MOTM have been tough to select, is it a coincidence they were all wins?

Today's loss was fairly easy, as Jon was there from start to finish and Kyle gets a second place vote.

Other than those two players the rest were MIA.

[Newton_14]

I voted for Jon as he played an almost perfect game and delivered a truly great performance.

But I do not get the criticism of the other guys. I felt our team left it all on the court today. They were facing alot of adversity with injuries to key guys, including being a man down with Nolan out. The holes were hitting all kinds of crazy shots, and this was certainly no highlight reel of Duke getting all the calls. But they hung tough. And had a chance in the end. And all I heard locally all week in the media was that this was going to be a beat down with Duke having no chance at all of preventing a blow out, let alone win.

But they were right there with 2 to go. And we cannot expect perfection from E-Will. He has gone from watching on the sidelines to playing 30+ minutes a game, and having to defend some of the greatest point guards in the country. From my view he has performed really well in this stretch. I had no problems with the shots he took today. Like everyone else, he was trying with all his might to make plays to help his team win. I would be more concerned if he had chosen to pass up wide open 3's. And like Gerald and Kyle, I thought Eliot drew alot of contact on his drives that were not always called.

I like this team. They are a heck of alot better right now, than they were even 3 weeks ago. If they can get healthy, and get the top 7 or 8 guys playing well together, they will be heard from. Loudly.

[Jumbo]

No need to take it personally.

Personal? Hardly. I just can't believe anyone would have watched that game and come to that conclusion, as Deb so nicely summed up as well. So, since we're all entitled to our opinions, as you've said, that's mine.

[Jumbo]

but he takes criticism of Scheyer personally and goes out of his way to defend him. Not that he's wrong in any of the cases with his defense of Scheyer but it's almost at the point where I really think he might be related to Jon in how personally he takes it. I suppose it could be because Scheyer is imo undervalued by most Duke/basketball fans.

I'm not sure that term means what you think it does. I get frustrated by bad basketball analysis. There's nothing personal about that. You are confusing my being irritated with what I read (true) with my being somehow personally affronted (false).

[jipops]

This is Scheyer's line from tonight:
39 minutes, 24 points (7-7 FG, 3-3 3FG, 7-8 FT), 5 assists, 3 rebounds, 4 steals, 0 turnovers.

That's as good a line as anyone has produced all year.

He only shot the ball 7 times. I have a big problem with that :).

[jma4life]

I'm not sure that term means what you think it does. I get frustrated by bad basketball analysis. There's nothing personal about that. You are confusing my being irritated with what I read (true) with my being somehow personally affronted (false).



Fair enough.

Agree that I would have liked Scheyer to look for his shot more today but I suppose part of why he is so good is that he never really forces the issue. Takes what he can get and makes the smart/right play at a ridiculously high percentage of the time. But sometimes, I would like to see him force the issue a bit more.

[Jumbo]

Fair enough.

Agree that I would have liked Scheyer to look for his shot more today but I suppose part of why he is so good is that he never really forces the issue. Takes what he can get and makes the smart/right play at a ridiculously high percentage of the time. But sometimes, I would like to see him force the issue a bit more.

It looked like at the end of the first half, Duke wanted to post him on Lawson, and two trips in a row, Scheyer intiated the play, and then Williams/Thomas botched the next step(s). Scheyer and K were visibly frustrated. Would've liked to have milked that size advantage in the post a bit more.

[DukeDevilDeb]

And no one has voted for G.
I hope no one does. He's our best player, but I was at the game, and watching live he just looked out of control at times, and more significantly did not try to get his points in the rhythm of the team's offense, except those drives mid-way through the second half when the seams opened up.

Everyone can have a bad night, especially on offense. But defense should always be there, as should free throw shooting. I thought Gerald's defense was not great; I thought his offense was awful. How could he miss three free throws in a row? Admittedly, it probably wouldn't have made a difference in the game. But that part of the game seemed to epitomize to me that Gerald's head just wasn't at the Dean Dome today. He does sometimes zone out, and this was as bad a zone out as I've seen from him in a while.

G was 4 for 11 (only one make better than Elliot) and 0 for 1 from 3 point range. Even worse, he had 4 rebounds, 3 assists, and FIVE (5) turnovers! The team had 11 turnovers, which means Gerald had nearly 50% of them! Interestingly, Kyle had 4 turnovers, Lance and Elliot each had one... which means that Jon once again had ZERO turnovers.

Great players step WAY UP in tough games. I thought Jon stepped up throughout the game... Kyle did in the first part... but Gerald just never did.

I can't remember which announcer said that Gerald could benefit from another year at Duke, but I totally agree. He cannot play like that in the NBA and expect to have a long career!

[jv001]

It has to be Jon. Great stats. Way to go Jon and as far as Elliot. He does not deserve a vote in this game. unc gave him open 3 point shots and he could not hit them. He's not a good shooter at this point in his career. Needs work on free throws. Hey he's only a freshmen and a good one at that. Go Duke!

[jma4life]

Agree that Gerald was really pretty bad today though he did have more points than shots. He didn't step up in this game.

But I'm not going to say that he's not a very good to great player because he didn't step up today. If G didn't step up on the first Thursday of the tournament last year, Duke goes home before the first weekend for the second consecutive year. In numerous other big games this year, G has stepped up.

Also give some credit to Carolina's defense. They did a good job on him. He played a pretty subpar game today. Just remember that it was one game.

[tele]

I voted for Scheyer. He had another very great game, really solid with the ball and his shooting was a big bonus. Kyle was also very good, he looked gassed in the second half, maybe working so hard on defense took away some from his offense. Just really needed another scorer in this game and maybe a few more rebounds. If a few more shots had fallen or a few more foul calls gone their way (which seems to be a basically random event lately) they had the game.

As amazing as Scheyer has been doing at the point, it would be nice to see him get a few more assists. At times the offense seems sort of, well, sticky. Not saying it is all Scheyers fault, but be nice to see some passes to scorers in rhythm off the dribble, or passes off penetration to cutting players. Not just from Scheyer but from G, and other guards too. Be nice to get some easy baskets instead of winding up looking for a super one on one play as the shot clock runs down. That said they have all been playing great against really tough competition with injuries, scheduling and poor officiating to contend with, no real complaints at all. Now to just get healthy, get rested and get ready to make some noise in the post season!

[bjornolf]

I thought Scheyer was magnificent last night. He did EVERYTHING he needed to do to help this team win. AND he proved to me once and for all that he can play the point. Doing it against a player like Lawson and get his line proves just how good a PG he can be.

I thought we defended Lawson pretty well over all, and while I don't think he was the tough guy that the commentators seemed to think he was the first five minutes of the game, I do think it bothered him a little. When he did turn on the jets, he just didn't seem to be QUITE as fast, or cut QUITE as cleanly, as usual. I think that definitely contributed to our defenders, particularly Williams, being able to stay on him. Like I said, I don't think he was in any real pain (he was never limping when play was stopped that I saw, which is often a sign...adrenaline keeps these guys from feeling it during play, but they'll often limp a little after a whistle), but he took a pretty long break in the first half, and I don't think he was quite as fast.

And I didn't think Kyle was on his game in the second half. The stepping out of bounds on the rebound for one thing. But the big thing is he didn't seem to have all of his nasty streak or his mental acuity for the 2nd half. In particular, there was a play pretty soon after Hansbrough came back in with 3 fouls that Kyle pump-faked a 3. Tyler left his feet, flying towards Kyle. Instead of jumping into Hansbrough like Scheyer did with another Heel earlier in the game and getting him his fourth foul early (which could have totally changed the game), he drove in a few feet and took a jumper. I think he hit the jumper, but three foul shots and Tyler on the bench with 4 with several minutes left in the game would have been a better outcome for the play, I thought. That just seems like the kind of thing that Kyle would usually have in mind and pull off, but last night, he didn't.

[rthomas]

But this is the dumbest vote I have ever seen in an MOTM thread. How ANYONE could vote for Elliot in this game is beyond my comprehension. Elliot is a freshman (I keep telling myself) who played 38 minutes (as many as Kyle and just one less than Scheyer). In that 38 minutes, he shot eleven times from the field (and made 3). Of those 11 shots, 5 were from 3-point range (he made 1). He made one of two free throws; had 4 rebounds and one turnover. We've had lots of players play worse than that.

But Scheyer played an almost perfect game. I cannot imagine who voted for Lance either .... that travel on the last play of the first half, I was ready to jump on him.

I can understand the votes for Kyle, despite the face that he appeared to go on vacation for a long period of time from mid first half to mid second half.

And Gerald...? I think Wayne can safely say that he has won virtually every matchup he's played against G.

The only thing that gave me any please was that Hanstravel fouled out of his senior game. I hope someone is going to send a handkerchief along with him to the NBA... some of the tears when the refs actually had the guts to call a foul on him were pathetic! :mad:

It was I who voted for Lance becasue a)we are kindered with the whole Thomas thing. and b) becasue I think the whole MOTM thing is dumb and I like laughing at people like you who take it way too seriously. Afterall Duke is a team and there is no MOTM in TEAM.

Sheesh...A lot of anger in this particular poll. Our team played hard abainst UNC. We have between 2 and 9 games left. Enjoy what we have left.

[micah75]

It was I who voted for Lance

Ahh, I had a funny feeling it might have been you.


becasue a)

Becky Sue? Or did you mean to say Peggy Sue? Do you really think that Buddy Holly songs are relevant to this topic?


we are kindered with the whole Thomas thing. and b) becasue I think the whole MOTM thing is dumb and I like laughing at people like you who take it way too seriously.

Protest votes, eh? I agree that sometimes we take this a bit too seriously. But still. We don't want to go in the opposite direction and make this poll a total farce either.


Afterall Duke is a team and there is no MOTM in TEAM.

Well, doesn't Duke hold a banquet ceremony after the season is over and dole out numerous individual awards? Maybe Coach K should be reminded about the fist?

[Reddevil]

Agree that Gerald was really pretty bad today though he did have more points than shots. He didn't step up in this game.

But I'm not going to say that he's not a very good to great player because he didn't step up today. If G didn't step up on the first Thursday of the tournament last year, Duke goes home before the first weekend for the second consecutive year. In numerous other big games this year, G has stepped up.

Also give some credit to Carolina's defense. They did a good job on him. He played a pretty subpar game today. Just remember that it was one game.

It looked like unc's gameplan heavily involved not letting G beat them. That said, kudos to Jon for stepping up. Duke beats most teams playing like they did. Just a couple more stops and scores would have altered the outcome. In other words, they can now play with anyone.