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bjornolf
01-13-2009, 10:33 AM
I was semi-listening to the ESPN radio station here in the DC area last night while doing the dishes, and the Gary Williams Show came on. The first thing they talked about was how Vasquez was booed by the student section when he had a bad game the other night, and how inappropriate he thought it was that they were yelling things at him about where he came from and his ethnicity. He said they had crossed a line that shouldn't be crossed with anybody, let alone one's own team. He spoke about how they had the best fans who cheered on their team, and that this disappointed him. That insulting people was beneath them. That it was important to support one's own team, while at the same time not demeaning one's opponent.

My question would be where was this attitude when this student section that he holds to such a high standard was throwing bottles and batteries at the Boozers? Or when they were yelling and holding signs containing sexual references involving JJ's little sister? Or any other number of demeaning personal references to Duke's players, coaches, and families? Or putting up websites referencing the humiliation, degradation, and murder of all things Duke, in the specific and in the general? Or the F*** D*** shirts and chants (not that that's a personal attack, so I don't have too much problem with that)? Did that not cross a line that shouldn't be crossed with anybody? Or is Duke beneath the consideration of common courtesy?

Maryland's attitude toward all things Duke reminds me a little of the attitude that the Middle East has towards Israel. It's not good enough to peacefully coexist, no matter the concessions given. They just want it obliterated entirely, buried, and forgotten.

I just thought it was funny, that's all. Gary must have blinders and earplugs every time Duke plays at Maryland. Or maybe he gets so intense during those games that the sweat gets in his eyes and clogs his ears. :eek:

allenmurray
01-13-2009, 10:45 AM
I was semi-listening to the ESPN radio station here in the DC area last night while doing the dishes, and the Gary Williams Show came on. The first thing they talked about was how Vasquez was booed by the student section when he had a bad game the other night, and how inappropriate he thought it was that they were yelling things at him about where he came from and his ethnicity. He said they had crossed a line that shouldn't be crossed with anybody, let alone one's own team. He spoke about how they had the best fans who cheered on their team, and that this disappointed him. That insulting people was beneath them. That it was important to support one's own team, while at the same time not demeaning one's opponent.

My question would be where was this attitude when this student section that he holds to such a high standard was throwing bottles and batteries at the Boozers? Or when they were yelling and holding signs containing sexual references involving JJ's little sister? Or any other number of demeaning personal references to Duke's players, coaches, and families? Or putting up websites referencing the humiliation, degradation, and murder of all things Duke, in the specific and in the general? Or the F*** D*** shirts and chants (not that that's a personal attack, so I don't have too much problem with that)? Did that not cross a line that shouldn't be crossed with anybody? Or is Duke beneath the consideration of common courtesy?

Maryland's attitude toward all things Duke reminds me a little of the attitude that the Middle East has towards Israel. It's not good enough to peacefully coexist, no matter the concessions given. They just want it obliterated entirely, buried, and forgotten.

I just thought it was funny, that's all. Gary must have blinders and earplugs every time Duke plays at Maryland. Or maybe he gets so intense during those games that the sweat gets in his eyes and clogs his ears. :eek:


I am a graduate of the University of Maryland. I am incredibly embarassed that I have that in common with Gary Williams. He is a complete moron.

bjornolf
01-13-2009, 10:52 AM
Hey, I took summer classes there a few times while I was at Duke. It's a fine school. This was just before Maryland's hatred for Duke began ('93-'97), so I got a little good-natured ribbing, but no biggy. Now, I'd be afraid to admit where I went if I were there. I used to attend Duke-Maryland games in my duke gear and it was no big deal. Now, you'd have to pay me A LOT of money to do that.

gw67
01-13-2009, 11:31 AM
Tim Brant broadcast the Tech game with Dan Bonner. Tim's a Maryland grad who played linebacker for the Terps about 30 years ago. He recently returned to a local TV station and I caught the end of his sportscast last night while reading the paper. He came on very strong that Vasquez should apologize to the school, alums and fans for his reaction to the crowd and that Williams needs to reign in his star player.

I agree 100% with Tim. The players need to turn a deaf ear to the immature idiots in the stands and Williams needs to take the lead for ensuring that this happens.

gw67

gw67
01-13-2009, 11:43 AM
According to Steve Yanda, Williams has put the kabosh on Vasquez talking back to the fans. We'll see.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/terrapins-insider/

gw67

calltheobvious
01-13-2009, 01:47 PM
Tim Brant broadcast the Tech game with Dan Bonner. Tim's a Maryland grad who played linebacker for the Terps about 30 years ago. He recently returned to a local TV station and I caught the end of his sportscast last night while reading the paper. He came on very strong that Vasquez should apologize to the school, alums and fans for his reaction to the crowd and that Williams needs to reign in his star player.

I agree 100% with Tim. The players need to turn a deaf ear to the immature idiots in the stands and Williams needs to take the lead for ensuring that this happens.

gw67

This simply begs Bjornwolf's question of what calculus Gary uses to decide what constitutes acceptable vs. unacceptable fan behavior.

There are clearly two different issues that need to be addressed. Nobody disagrees with the notion that bad news for Vasquez to jaw with fans of any sort (when it involves Maryland fans, it becomes downright weird). But for Tim Brant to publicly castigate Vasquez and Williams and--according to your description--not admonish the fair-weather fans in the same paragraph, is disturbing. Because that's going to be widely interpreted as a justification of the fans' boorish behavior. And frankly, your account reads like Brant had no problem whatsoever with Maryland students letting their own team have it during the Tech game.

And since I'm noting someone else begging a question, I'll approach an ad hominem. This story does nothing to change my opinion of Tim Brant, having listened to twenty-five mind-numbing years of his inane college football commentary.

gw67
01-13-2009, 02:09 PM
calltheobvious - As I mentioned, I caught the end of his sportscast. It is possible that he addressed the fan behavior earlier. I just don't know.

I like Brant as a play-by-play man for ACC college basketball but don't watch enough ACC football to offer a comment.

This has nothing to do with his broadcasting abilities but years ago when my three sons were small, I used to take them to one of the "Old Pro" miniture golf courses in northern Ocean City when we were at the beach. On one occasion, we were behind a father and three boys who I will simply describe as the wild bunch. It was Brant and his sons. As a father with active boys, I was impressed how he kept his cool and had a great time with his kids. Besides my three looked pretty benign in comparison.

Dumb question but is Pittsburgh the Birmingham of the North?

gw67

calltheobvious
01-13-2009, 02:42 PM
calltheobvious - As I mentioned, I caught the end of his sportscast. It is possible that he addressed the fan behavior earlier. I just don't know.

I like Brant as a play-by-play man for ACC college basketball but don't watch enough ACC football to offer a comment.

This has nothing to do with his broadcasting abilities but years ago when my three sons were small, I used to take them to one of the "Old Pro" miniture golf courses in northern Ocean City when we were at the beach. On one occasion, we were behind a father and three boys who I will simply describe as the wild bunch. It was Brant and his sons. As a father with active boys, I was impressed how he kept his cool and had a great time with his kids. Besides my three looked pretty benign in comparison.

Dumb question but is Pittsburgh the Birmingham of the North?

gw67

Sorry I missed the part about you only having caught the end of the interview. That's obviously relevant.

As for your question, well done. I actually got a pm this week from someone wondering whether it was Birmingham, Michigan, but no, I'm farther east. The location is a play on a present and former place of residence.

El_Diablo
01-13-2009, 07:13 PM
Maryland's attitude toward all things Duke reminds me a little of the attitude that the Middle East has towards Israel. It's not good enough to peacefully coexist, no matter the concessions given. They just want it obliterated entirely, buried, and forgotten.

:eek:

I hope you don't really believe that...

Biscuit King
01-14-2009, 07:56 AM
I don't like Vazquez, but I'm with him 100% on this one. You don't boo your own players at a college game. You certainly don't curse them or harass them, unless they've done something to embarrass the school. And whether you like him or not, Vazquez is all guts out there, and he represents the school well. If Maryland fans bait him, he has every right to tell them to take a hike. Let's face it, that school WOULD be better off without fans like that. Of course, they probably wouldn't have any fans left if all those people jumped off the bandwagon.

PumpkinFunk
01-14-2009, 08:24 AM
I agree with Biscuit King here. While my respect for Greivis as a person is not all that great, because I know he has a temper and he lashed out at us when we played Maryland, I think he is well within his rights to lash out against his own fans being far worse to him that we were. He plays for the team, and works his I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. off every game. Players have bad games... and getting booed for it is a poor show of fandom. Maryland fans have a bad reputation (hell, even a decent amount of Tarhole fans are willing to admit that they are probably the worst fans in the ACC - take that for what it's worth), and getting called out by the best player on the team isn't going to help Gary's recruiting or Maryland's reputation. Greivis doesn't need to apologize to the fans, the fans need to apologize to the team. If you show up, you stay the whole game, and support the team the whole game, win or lose. That's something that we do well (in basketball)

jv001
01-14-2009, 08:26 AM
:eek:

I hope you don't really believe that...

To not believe it would mean you're kidding yourself.

stickdog
01-14-2009, 10:38 AM
To not believe it would mean you're kidding yourself.

Or that you believe that there are two sides to every story.

-jk
01-14-2009, 11:33 AM
Let's keep the thread on topic, please. Please take the policy discussion to the policy board or drop it.

thanks,

-jk