Livingston's troubles

[watzone]

What could have been and what is! Sad story concerning former Duke verbal Shaun Livingston.http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-livingston0106,0,6224851.story

Sure he could have hurt himself at Duke and not made it to the NBA, but the education would have come in handy. The staff told him he needed to work on his strength and I must say that his young body just wasn't ready for the NBA grind. A lot of what if's for sure. Anyhow, let's all wish him luck.

[ForeverBlowingBubbles]

just found this near the bottom - surprised no one commented. Sorry about the double thread post - my bad.

[Bluedog]

What could have been and what is! Sad story concerning former Duke verbal Shaun Livingston.http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-livingston0106,0,6224851.story

Sure he could have hurt himself at Duke and not made it to the NBA, but the education would have come in handy. The staff told him he needed to work on his strength and I must say that his young body just wasn't ready for the NBA grind. A lot of what if's for sure. Anyhow, let's all wish him luck.

Well, certainly an education would have helped him, but it seems unlikely that he would have stayed at Duke for four years anyways. But hypotheticals are silly, I suppose. As you said, he could have hurt himself at Duke; or maybe he would have gotten stronger at Duke and never hurt himself in the NBA...We'll never know.

At least, he did make over $14 million dollars in less than 5 years of work. Money isn't everything, but that huge amount of money can certainly help in his next pursuit in his life...Not many 22 year-olds have made that kind of coin (well, not many people have period).

Wish him the best. I remember his dad (or maybe it was his uncle or grandfather) seemed like a real class act when Duke was recruiting him. Trying to keep Shaun's head on straight and knew how some people weren't looking out for his best interests.

[JayZee]

As someone who roots for all earnest seeming Duke players or near players (I include Deng, Avery, Maggette and McBob in there, but not Humphries) I would love to see K reach out to Shaun at a tough time like this. Not that this would happen, but I'd also like to see Shaun attend Duke and become part of the Duke bball family. While he obviously could never play, he could get his education, maybe be part of the current staff and get great medical/rehab advice. For some reason, even though he never showed up on campus, he feels like one of our own. I'd still like to see him realize the off the court benefits of the Duke bball experience.

Good luck Shaun.

[SilkyJ]

For some reason, even though he never showed up on campus, he feels like one of our own.

I'd have to say speak for yourself there. There may be some people on this board who agree with you, but I'd bet there's plenty more who don't and who maybe even resent him for not coming. I don't resent him, but I definitely don't feel like he is one of our own, whereas I check the Bulls boxscore every game to check on Luol.

[adam]

I'd have to say speak for yourself there. There may be some people on this board who agree with you, but I'd bet there's plenty more who don't and who maybe even resent him for not coming. I don't resent him, but I definitely don't feel like he is one of our own, whereas I check the Bulls boxscore every game to check on Luol.


Is this to say that in order to be a Duke fan or to be part of the "Duke family", you must have gone to school at Duke? If so, I'm guessing that would disqualify the majority of people (myself included) who post on this site.

I've been a Duke fan since the 3rd grade. My love for this university goes far beyond just hoops. However, I knew attending Duke would never be an option for me since my family couldn't afford $40K a year in tuition expenses.

Perhaps the feelings toward Livingston are different since he was given the opportunity to attend Duke, yet in a way turned his back on the school. Just because you didn't attend school at Duke, you shouldn't be automatically secluded from being part of the Duke community/family.

[DukeDevilDeb]

Is this to say that in order to be a Duke fan or to be part of the "Duke family", you must have gone to school at Duke? If so, I'm guessing that would disqualify the majority of people (myself included) who post on this site.

I've been a Duke fan since the 3rd grade. My love for this university goes far beyond just hoops. However, I knew attending Duke would never be an option for me since my family couldn't afford $40K a year in tuition expenses.

Perhaps the feelings toward Livingston are different since he was given the opportunity to attend Duke, yet in a way turned his back on the school. Just because you didn't attend school at Duke, you shouldn't be automatically secluded from being part of the Duke community/family.

I don't think that's what he meant at all. In Shaun's case, he was offered a much sought after Duke b-ball scholarship, gave a verbal commitment, then didn't come. Many people feel that he, like Kris Humphries, could never be a part of the Duke family. I've never heard anyone say that, in order to be part of the Duke clan, you need to have been a student here... you just need to care about Duke and do your best as a fan, faculty member, student, or whatever to promote Duke.

[wallyman]

I think it should be obvious that you don't have to have gone to duke to be a duke fan, DBR regular or member of the tribe. we're all equal on this bus. i think the point on livingston was that there's no reason to view him the same way as people who took advantage of the amazing opportunity to play ball at duke. so i, of course, don't wish him ill, but nor do i view him as part of the duke family. in fact, it wouldn't be entirely mean spirited to harbor a bit of resentment toward someone who accepted a scholarship, impacted the recruiting for that year and then said, whoops, never mind. so we're all equal on the board, whether we went to duke or not. but while wishing livingston all the best and feeling badly for his bad luck as a pro, there's no reason to view him the same way as players who came to duke to play. that said, i hope he heals and finds a way to realize his enormous potential.

[JayZee]

I'd have to say speak for yourself there.

Fair enough. I see your point. I should have been more clear. Instead of "he feels like one of our own" I should have said I feel like he's one of our own. Right or wrong, I feel like he accepted the scholly in good faith. Only the exogenous force of his rapid rise in the eyes of the pros, and his very defendable decision to take advantage of that fleeting opportunity, kept him from attending Duke. It is in some ways not so different than Dunleavy who by all accounts was a lock to be a 4 year guy. Only when the NBA called saying "high lottery" did he listen. Humphries was different. He, by most accounts, made selfish demands and left (got pushed) to join another college team purely to serve his own needs.

I'm sure we can agree to disagree on Shaun. I just see him a bit as a prodigal son. However, I also sure we can agree to wish Shaun well.

[Matches]

No reason he can't go get an education *now*. He certainly has the $ to pay for it...

[CDu]

No reason he can't go get an education *now*. He certainly has the $ to pay for it...

Exactly. He can more than afford to pay his own way to any institution to which he can be granted entrance. Additionally, given the millions he's made, it's probably less pressing for him to get that college education, as he could easily be financially secure for the rest of his life.

And, as someone pointed out, it was unlikely that he was going to complete his degree while playing in a Duke uniform anyway (likely a one- or two-and-done type).

Livingston's dream was to play in the NBA. He was a high lottery pick. Going to college wouldn't have made him much more money through the draft. Unfortunately for him, he got hurt and that has derailed his career moving forward. But had he gotten hurt at Duke, he'd have likely never made the millions he's secured by going pro.

[Jaymf7]

I see a material difference between Livingston and Humphries. While both committed and did not attend, Livingston had a tremendous rise in NBA stock before he arrived and took advantage of the opportunity to get straight to the NBA and purse that dream. He was skilled enough to get drafted high and get minutes on the next level. His not coming hurt us because we were not deep at the point and did not expect his dramatic change in stock.

Although I am not an expert and have no inside info, Humphries apparently was determined to jump to the NBA after one year. He did not have the ability to go straight to the NBA, but rather wanted to showcase himself for a year then make the jump. There were rumors that he or his family made demands about playing time and I think he (rightfully) had doubts about how well he would perform in our crowded frontcourt. He ultimately backed out of his commitment not to go to the NBA, but top go to another college (Minnesota -- where he was the big fish and led the Big 10 in rebounding and perhaps scoring as a frosh).

World apart in my opinion. Due to an unforeseen change in circumstances, Livingston chased the dream of playing in the NBA earlier than expected. His potential was sky high and he was a solid contributor. Humphries, by contrast, left Duke to go to a competitor (another school) so he could showcase himself instead of pursue an education and team success. He has done next to nothing in the NBA (and likely never will).

I can't say I view either of the two as "Duke guys," but I have no hard feelings for Livingston and am saddened to see his recent comeback fall short.

[JayZee]

Exactly. He can more than afford to pay his own way to any institution to which he can be granted entrance. Additionally, given the millions he's made, it's probably less pressing for him to get that college education, as he could easily be financially secure for the rest of his life.

And, as someone pointed out, it was unlikely that he was going to complete his degree while playing in a Duke uniform anyway (likely a one- or two-and-done type).

Livingston's dream was to play in the NBA. He was a high lottery pick. Going to college wouldn't have made him much more money through the draft. Unfortunately for him, he got hurt and that has derailed his career moving forward. But had he gotten hurt at Duke, he'd have likely never made the millions he's secured by going pro.

I think every player on Duke's team would say their dream is to play in the NBA. Some may be more inclined to stay than others if they could be drafted. But can you name a lottery pick who didn't leave immediately except JWill? I bet if Singler or G had gotten notice that they were lottery picks last year, they would have been gone. And I would have been fine with that.

My point is that, if Shaun wants to get an education, I'd like to see him get it at Duke. I'd also like the program to reach out to him and see if it makes sense. Will he come to Duke? Very little chance. Would I find it cool if he did? For sure. Would other people who felt burned by him be annoyed. Of course.

[Bluedog]

But can you name a lottery pick who didn't leave immediately except JWill?

Here's one: Josh McRoberts. Projected as lottery pick out of high school and, at least, a mid-first rounder after his freshman year. Obviously, went downhill in draft status tremendously after his sophomore year. There are many others.

[Indoor66]

But can you name a lottery pick who didn't leave immediately except JWill?

Dawkins, Laettner, Ferry, Hill, Hurley, Brand, Battier for some.

[eddiehaskell]

Imagine if his knee would've blown while at Duke. :eek: He would've likely never played in the NBA.

[Magnolia888]

I've been a Duke fan since the 3rd grade. My love for this university goes far beyond just hoops. However, I knew attending Duke would never be an option for me since my family couldn't afford $40K a year in tuition expenses.

I find this offensive and obnoxious to imply that every Duke student comes from a family that can afford $40K a year in tuition, when that is plainly false. Almost half of undergraduates are on some sort of financial aid.

My father is a machinist and my mother worked at Wal-mart. I'm a Duke grad because I worked my butt off to make it happen with scholarships and jobs, and Duke's generosity to people like me who can't afford the full price.

I really hate when people ask where I went to college and I say "Duke" and I get a snide comment about how it must be nice to be so rich. (The media coverage during the lacrosse situation was downright infuriating at times, because this seems to be a common assumption.) Some of us worked for our education because it was important to us.

And no way is Shaun Livingston part of the Duke family in any way. Please.

[mgtr]

Here is an interesting test in this case. Does the Duke alumni association consider him to have matriculated, and therefore solicit him for membership and contributions?

[adam]

I find this offensive and obnoxious to imply that every Duke student comes from a family that can afford $40K a year in tuition, when that is plainly false. Almost half of undergraduates are on some sort of financial aid.

My father is a machinist and my mother worked at Wal-mart. I'm a Duke grad because I worked my butt off to make it happen with scholarships and jobs, and Duke's generosity to people like me who can't afford the full price.

I really hate when people ask where I went to college and I say "Duke" and I get a snide comment about how it must be nice to be so rich. (The media coverage during the lacrosse situation was downright infuriating at times, because this seems to be a common assumption.) Some of us worked for our education because it was important to us.

And no way is Shaun Livingston part of the Duke family in any way. Please.

I was simply referring to myself and my personal financial situation. Even with financial aid, there is still no way I would have been able to afford it. How you think that translates into me stating only rich kids go to Duke, I have no idea (since that isn't what I stated whatsoever). Calm down, bro. I was simply stating a fact about me and my family.

[77devil]

Here is an interesting test in this case. Does the Duke alumni association consider him to have matriculated, and therefore solicit him for membership and contributions?

Of course not. He never enrolled.

[CDu]

My point is that, if Shaun wants to get an education, I'd like to see him get it at Duke. I'd also like the program to reach out to him and see if it makes sense. Will he come to Duke? Very little chance. Would I find it cool if he did? For sure. Would other people who felt burned by him be annoyed. Of course.

At the risk of sounding like a jerk, I'd be annoyed by Livingston getting a chance to go to Duke now. And I completely respect his decision to go pro when he did and I have no problem with it. When you are a lottery pick, I think you should go pro, unless professional basketball is not your priority.

The reason I'd be against it is because I doubt he'd be a candidate to come to Duke if it weren't for basketball. Since he's no longer eligible to represent the basketball team, he'd simply be taking the spot of a deserving student elsewhere. And given his financial situation, I'd rather Duke give that spot to an exceptional student from a poor family a chance instead.

[JayZee]

Dawkins, Laettner, Ferry, Hill, Hurley, Brand, Battier for some.

Dawkins through Hurley - different times, especially at Duke. Brand and Battier? Think Brand really was a lottery pick after his injury ridden frosh year? Battier? I don't think I ever heard anything about his being a possible lottery pick after his junior year. Even after his stellar senior year, there were still plenty of NBA types who questioned his value in the pros. They were of course wrong, but the concerns were there.

As to Cdu's points, I'm not so sure Livingston would not be qualified to be a Duke student outside of bball. It's not just SAT scores that gets someone in. And accepting one more student is not a zero sum game. He would not necessarily be taking one person's spot.

All speculation anyway.

[JayZee]

At the risk of sounding like a jerk, I'd be annoyed by Livingston getting a chance to go to Duke now.

I don't think it makes you sound like a jerk. I see your point(s), I just disagree with them. Not too vehemently, but definitely disagree.

[MrBisonDevil]

Update: Shaun Livingston is investing his money in movies. He's the executive producer of an urban comedy: Next Day Air (in theaters May 8th)

http://www.nextdayair-themovie.com/
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/next_day_air/

Urban comedies tend to be very profitable in their niche market, especially when they go to DVD distribution. Maybe Elton Brand hooked him up with the movie biz when they were with the L.A. Clippers.

[Bluedog]

As another update, Livington signed with the Oklahoma City Thunder on March 31 to a multi-year contract.

http://newsok.com/oklahoma-city-thunder-signs-shaun-livingston-recalls-d.j.-white/article/3357798

[SupaDave]

And no way is Shaun Livingston part of the Duke family in any way. Please.

Not true - he genuinely liked the school and Coach K but at the time he had to face a decision and he chose what was obvious - MONEY.

I know from personal conversations with Shaun that he would have loved to come and he's kinda in that Kobe mindset where it just was his school of choice.

I also know that he hangs around other Duke players. Don't count folks out so easily.

[SupaDave]

Update: Shaun Livingston is investing his money in movies. He's the executive producer of an urban comedy: Next Day Air (in theaters May 8th)

http://www.nextdayair-themovie.com/
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/next_day_air/

Urban comedies tend to be very profitable in their niche market, especially when they go to DVD distribution. Maybe Elton Brand hooked him up with the movie biz when they were with the L.A. Clippers.


Glad you posted this b/c the irony of it is that I met Shaun WITH Elton...

[SupaDave]

At the risk of sounding like a jerk, I'd be annoyed by Livingston getting a chance to go to Duke now. And I completely respect his decision to go pro when he did and I have no problem with it. When you are a lottery pick, I think you should go pro, unless professional basketball is not your priority.

The reason I'd be against it is because I doubt he'd be a candidate to come to Duke if it weren't for basketball. Since he's no longer eligible to represent the basketball team, he'd simply be taking the spot of a deserving student elsewhere. And given his financial situation, I'd rather Duke give that spot to an exceptional student from a poor family a chance instead.

Well maybe not a jerk BUT do you realize what his experiences could add to some of our programs. Hell, he probably could BE a knee specialist at this point. Don't be so short-sighted...

And he wouldn't be taking some deserving student's spot. Who's to say who's deserving and who's not? There is no set enrollment "number"...

[CameronBornAndBred]

Not true - he genuinely liked the school and Coach K but at the time he had to face a decision and he chose what was obvious - MONEY.

I know from personal conversations with Shaun that he would have loved to come and he's kinda in that Kobe mindset where it just was his school of choice.

I also know that he hangs around other Duke players. Don't count folks out so easily.
To me that makes him another Duke fan. I wouldn't associate him as part of the "Duke family" either. For me, you gotta put some time in wearing a uniform or coaching on the bench to earn the family tag.

[SupaDave]

To me that makes him another Duke fan. I wouldn't associate him as part of the "Duke family" either. For me, you gotta put some time in wearing a uniform or coaching on the bench to earn the family tag.

So what would you consider yourself and others of this site? There are MANY people associated with the program. A program does not run on coaches and players alone. Just doesn't make sense.

[CameronBornAndBred]

So what would you consider yourself and others of this site? There are MANY people associated with the program. A program does not run on coaches and players alone. Just doesn't make sense.
I am a die hard fan. I would consider Livingston to be a fan. "Family" implies more than that status, and as I said, I wouldn't include him in the family.

[BoozerWasFouled]

I consider Livingston to be like a first cousin of the Duke family. I follow him, not with the same interest as if he had played for Duke, but definitely more closely than non-Duke players. He made a good decision to go to the NBA. He was a great player, and his injury was a freak one. I was delighted when he was signed to that contract and I am looking forward to seeing him emerge next year.

[moonpie23]

I consider Livingston to be like a first cousin of the Duke family. I follow him, not with the same interest as if he had played for Duke, but definitely more closely than non-Duke players. He made a good decision to go to the NBA. He was a great player, and his injury was a freak one. I was delighted when he was signed to that contract and I am looking forward to seeing him emerge next year.

sooooo...... can we say COUSIN KOBE????

[Duke #33]

sooooo...... can we say COUSIN KOBE????

probably second cousin Kobe. Livingston I think verbally committed to Duke then very late decided to enter the draft. Kobe I don't think ever had any intentions to play in college, but he has said that if he had to college, then he would have gone to Duke.

[flyingdutchdevil]

probably second cousin Kobe. Livingston I think verbally committed to Duke then very late decided to enter the draft. Kobe I don't think ever had any intentions to play in college, but he has said that if he had to college, then he would have gone to Duke.

As we recruited Lebron a little bit (much like the rest of the nation), does that make Lebron a third cousin in the Duke family? ;)

[DukieBoy]

As we recruited Lebron a little bit (much like the rest of the nation), does that make Lebron a third cousin in the Duke family? ;)

We would have one helluva family pick up game.

[SupaDave]

I am a die hard fan. I would consider Livingston to be a fan. "Family" implies more than that status, and as I said, I wouldn't include him in the family.

There are many of us here who are more than just fans...

[Indoor66]

There are many of us here who are more than just fans...

What does that mean (and I really don't understand what you are trying to say)?

[SupaDave]

What does that mean (and I really don't understand what you are trying to say)?

Are you following? We are talking about being in the Duke "Family"... This board is composed of graduates, trainers, doctors, and employees of Duke University - all of whom are fans and all of whom are so much more.

I mean, why be so short-sighted and exclusive? Do you think Grant Hill gave a doggone if those DUKE doctors graduated from Duke?? As much time as he spent with them I'm sure he considers them family.

You think the players don't consider the Crazies family?

Shaun Livingston has spent more time talking to Coach K than the majority of us on this board - and still does speak to him as Coach keeps up with more folks than it seems is humanly possible. If the Coach can take him in - why can't you?

[CameronBornAndBred]

Are you following? We are talking about being in the Duke "Family"... This board is composed of graduates, trainers, doctors, and employees of Duke University - all of whom are fans and all of whom are so much more.
.

You think the players don't consider the Crazies family?

Livingston never went to Duke, never worked for Duke. Therefore he is a fan. This is my opinion. And the last I'm metioning it.

[SupaDave]

Livingston never went to Duke, never worked for Duke. Therefore he is a fan. This is my opinion. And the last I'm metioning it.

Ahhhh, but he did COMMIT to Duke and in his mind was going to suit up. Which is more than most fans ever DREAM of - even the ones that pay 10K for camp (b/c of course they're just fans with money who keep coming back - rolleyes)...

This article puts it pretty well and it's damn near depressing to read but it's a great piece of history to let you know that Livingston and Duke will always be mentioned together...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2004/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=1820873

[Duke4Ever32]

Livingston never went to Duke, never worked for Duke. Therefore he is a fan. This is my opinion. And the last I'm metioning it.

Agreed. That's a consequence of the choice Livingston himself made, when he chose money over having any official affiliation with Duke. You can't have it both ways.

[sagegrouse]

Everything has been said, but not everyone has said it. Now it's my turn.

Livingston never wore the uniform and never enrolled at Duke. While he may be a sidebar to Blue Devil history (like Bill Bradley, e.g.), he is not a part of it.

sagegrouse

[Wander]

There's an argument about whether or not Livingston is part of the Duke family? Is this one of those inside jokes that I don't know about?

Maybe Greg Monroe is part of the Duke family too - after all, he's spent more time talking to Coach K than the majority of us on this board, and seriously considered playing for Duke after getting an offer, which is more than most fans ever DREAM of.

[Indoor66]

I wonder if Livingston cares about this issue? Anybody know?

[Smitty1911]

Ahhhh, but he did COMMIT to Duke and in his mind was going to suit up. Which is more than most fans ever DREAM of - even the ones that pay 10K for camp (b/c of course they're just fans with money who keep coming back - rolleyes)...

This article puts it pretty well and it's damn near depressing to read but it's a great piece of history to let you know that Livingston and Duke will always be mentioned together...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2004/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=1820873

I remember reading that article the first time and feeling like I just ate some bad chicken. I would've loved to have seen Livingston play along side JJ, Shelden et al. Interesting that the article you linked has this quote...

Deng said he feels he's a part of the Duke family now and likely forever. He said Livingston probably won't have that feeling after missing the "Duke atmosphere."

[SupaDave]

I remember reading that article the first time and feeling like I just ate some bad chicken. I would've loved to have seen Livingston play along side JJ, Shelden et al. Interesting that the article you linked has this quote...

Deng said he feels he's a part of the Duke family now and likely forever. He said Livingston probably won't have that feeling after missing the "Duke atmosphere."

Yep - I liked the quote b/c a Duke player said it. He knows what Livingston missed out on. The fact that there was something TO miss is important there. It wasn't an Arizona or UConn player - but a Duke player they chose to include in the article. He was also spending time with Shaun - b/c of course they recruited him during Deng's freshmen year and he played pick-up ball and the like with the team. Not to mention all the time spent with Elton.

When I met Shaun out in L.A. he was hanging with Dahntay and Elton. Go figure...

Call him whatever but he's a great kid and I would've been happy to see him actually don that jersey.

[Wander]

When I met Shaun out in L.A. he was hanging with Dahntay and Elton. Go figure...

Call him whatever but he's a great kid and I would've been happy to see him actually don that jersey.

Nobody here has said he's a horrible person or that we wouldn't have wanted to see him come to Duke. Are you actually trying to make an argument or do you just want to point out that you've met Duke stars before?

[weezie]

Yeah, whatever. He managed to dance around, string everybody along and then accomplish exactly zip in the pros. It's "nice" to feel warm and fuzzy about an almost guy, I guess. I'm cheering for JJ and Carlos and Shane. GTHC, GTH. Whoever said life was fair anyway?

[wilson]

I consider Livingston to be like a first cousin of the Duke family. I follow him, not with the same interest as if he had played for Duke, but definitely more closely than non-Duke players. He made a good decision to go to the NBA. He was a great player, and his injury was a freak one. I was delighted when he was signed to that contract and I am looking forward to seeing him emerge next year.

I think this is a really good way of stating it. To draw a non-basketball analogy, I feel precisely the same way about Morgan Pressel. She's the LPGA star who accepted a golf scholly to Duke (for those who were unaware, Duke is home to not-so-arguably the best women's golf program in the nation for the past decade-plus), then decided to go pro before her freshman year. She has three career pro victories so far, despite still being two weeks shy of her 21st birthday. This includes a major championship, the Nabisco, at age 18(!!!). She's the youngest-ever major winner. Despite not quite being a part of Duke's inner circle, I keep up with her play and like seeing her do well. Any light she shines on the university itself is, I suppose, rather dim, but she nevertheless makes me feel at least vaguely good about Duke.

[SupaDave]

Nobody here has said he's a horrible person or that we wouldn't have wanted to see him come to Duke. Are you actually trying to make an argument or do you just want to point out that you've met Duke stars before?

It's so you might understand the personal reference. An inside view so to speak that some of these guys care more than you think...

[speedevil2001]

livingston was suppose to be duhon's replacement at point guard along side dockery, but went straight to the pros. drafted #4 ahead of loul deng, who left after his freshman year. duhon was drafted in the second round after his senior year. All 3 players made millions in the nba, but only duhon has a degree from duke (i think). i dont feel sorry for livingston at all. he accomplished his dream of going to the nba and making money for his family. injuries happen. take a look at grant hill, after years of injuries and surgries, he finanlly played in a full season. livingston is still young, he can pay his own way to college, or work on getting healthy enough to play again. i still feel more sorry for grant hill, losing many of his prime years, and for jason williams than i do livingston.

[speedevil2001]

Yeah, whatever. He managed to dance around, string everybody along and then accomplish exactly zip in the pros. It's "nice" to feel warm and fuzzy about an almost guy, I guess. I'm cheering for JJ and Carlos and Shane. GTHC, GTH. Whoever said life was fair anyway?

if your talking about the duke guys in the playoffs, dont forget about danty jones with the denver nuggets.

[speedevil2001]

i would say jason williams. i loved duhon, he was under appreciated.

dockery hugh heart, i will always remember his shot again vtech, but never developed into a lead point guard. livingston was suppose to be next, but never made it to duke. paulus just was talented and a good floor general but he wasnt skilled enough to be great, just average. nolan smith more of a combo guard, not a great passer, but still to be determined. guys like ewing, nelson, and scheyer are more sg than pure point guards. btw im really surprised ewing is not on a nba roster. i last saw him with the clippers. i think he could be like a eddie house on the right team.
duke really needs john wall even for 1 year.

[Duke #33]

danty jones .

I think its spelled Dahntay Jones, not Danty.

[Edouble]

i would say jason williams. i loved duhon, he was under appreciated.

dockery hugh heart, i will always remember his shot again vtech, but never developed into a lead point guard. livingston was suppose to be next, but never made it to duke. paulus just was talented and a good floor general but he wasnt skilled enough to be great, just average. nolan smith more of a combo guard, not a great passer, but still to be determined. guys like ewing, nelson, and scheyer are more sg than pure point guards. btw im really surprised ewing is not on a nba roster. i last saw him with the clippers. i think he could be like a eddie house on the right team.
duke really needs john wall even for 1 year.

Who is Hugh Heart?

Duhon was underappreciated?

Paulus is as talented as Livingston?

This is a cRaZy post!