Sylvia Hatchell

[oregon98er]

I'm a bit confused about this board, given the recent "policies" regarding banned behavior. Negative comments about Duke people, even when they commit boneheaded mistakes, are shunned. There is a lot of "off-limits" topics. Obviously, this doesn't apply to Sylvia Hatchell.

Let me set this stage of where I'm coimng from. I'm a Duke alum (Trinity '98) and despise anything with THAT other color of blue. I grew up in Gastonia, NC and had to endure all the pro-Carolina, anit-Duke, sentiment in the area. James Worthy was from my hometown...it bleeds Carolina blue (although Sleepy Floyd went to my highschool....not Worthy). Trust me when I say, I despise the Heels.

However, if you know anything about Sylvia's past, she's from Gastonia as well. In fact, my parents and her are extremely close friends. My parents work her basketball camps in the summers and she stops by our house when she's in town. When my father's mother passed earlier this year, Sylvia took time away from the team to come to the funeral home the night before the funeral and stayed for the funeral the next day. That's only a 2.5 hour drive from Chapel Hill, but still a noteworthy gesture in the midst of the season.
My parents were guests of hers at the Final Four the past two years, invited with a personal phone call.

I DO NOT pull for her team, never over Duke, and not even against Tennessee. I WILL NOT pull for anything in Carolina blue and she and I will joke about that. I have been critical, to my parents even, that to me she compalins excessively about officiating. That criticism is warranted.

Sylvia is a phenomenal coach, say what you want. She has won at every level (a national championship at all 3 divisions - only coach to do it) and has 748 career wins (Coach K has 775). However, Sylvia Hatchell is a better person and doesn't warrant the borderline personal attacks on this board. She does lead the EVIL EMPIRE, and for that, should take some scorn. That comes with the territory, just like respect for human beings personal lives and feelings.

All that said, it's nice to see that a UNC team is not going to win a national championship in basketball. I hope Coach G stays to make the rivalry on that side as intense as it has been recently.

I wrote this to insinuate that criticism of people should be treated on both sides on this board. I love Duke and the Duke family, but others should be treated and given the same respect as we give for Duke.

[dukelifer]

I'm a bit confused about this board, given the recent "policies" regarding banned behavior. Negative comments about Duke people, even when they commit boneheaded mistakes, are shunned. There is a lot of "off-limits" topics. Obviously, this doesn't apply to Sylvia Hatchell.

Let me set this stage of where I'm coimng from. I'm a Duke alum (Trinity '98) and despise anything with THAT other color of blue. I grew up in Gastonia, NC and had to endure all the pro-Carolina, anit-Duke, sentiment in the area. James Worthy was from my hometown...it bleeds Carolina blue (although Sleepy Floyd went to my highschool....not Worthy). Trust me when I say, I despise the Heels.

However, if you know anything about Sylvia's past, she's from Gastonia as well. In fact, my parents and her are extremely close friends. My parents work her basketball camps in the summers and she stops by our house when she's in town. When my father's mother passed earlier this year, Sylvia took time away from the team to come to the funeral home the night before the funeral and stayed for the funeral the next day. That's only a 2.5 hour drive from Chapel Hill, but still a noteworthy gesture in the midst of the season.
My parents were guests of hers at the Final Four the past two years, invited with a personal phone call.

I DO NOT pull for her team, never over Duke, and not even against Tennessee. I WILL NOT pull for anything in Carolina blue and she and I will joke about that. I have been critical, to my parents even, that to me she compalins excessively about officiating. That criticism is warranted.

Sylvia is a phenomenal coach, say what you want. She has won at every level (a national championship at all 3 divisions - only coach to do it) and has 748 career wins (Coach K has 775). However, Sylvia Hatchell is a better person and doesn't warrant the borderline personal attacks on this board. She does lead the EVIL EMPIRE, and for that, should take some scorn. That comes with the territory, just like respect for human beings personal lives and feelings.

All that said, it's nice to see that a UNC team is not going to win a national championship in basketball. I hope Coach G stays to make the rivalry on that side as intense as it has been recently.

I wrote this to insinuate that criticism of people should be treated on both sides on this board. I love Duke and the Duke family, but others should be treated and given the same respect as we give for Duke.

I do not know her- but I know people who do and they echo your comments that she is a fine person and one who gives of herself. Most the criticisms (except for her choice of atire) stem from her coaching UNC rather than about her as a person- but the few attacks on her as a person are not warranted. You are right- she is an excellent coach- she clearly motivates and has developed a style that is annoyingly hard to beat. Of course, the same can be said about Dean and Roy. You have to respect great coaches- even if they wear the wrong color blue. But Duke fans like yourself, cannot feel too bad when they lose becaue it does not happen too often. UNC will continue to be a thorn and who would have thought that the UNC/Duke rivalry would extend to the women with both teams near the top every year. Sylvia and Gail made that happen.

[Patrick Yates]

No other top program nationally, not Duke, not MD, not LSU, not Stanford, and certainly not UCONN or Tenn, would ever put up with the stuff she allows.

Last night when the game was over Summitt and Hatchel walked right past one-another and barely acknowledged one another. Summitt is perhaps the greatest class act in college sports with regards to how the interacts with the opposition. She always says something nice to apposing coaches, same with G and Geno. Post game, all three always give credit to the opposing team, coaches, fans, etc.

Hatch does not seemed to be liked by any of her peers. She has recruited thugs, like Latta, and coming soon to a campus near you, McCants the lesser. I am from the area where McCants played High School Ball. Her team featured 3 other Div 1 players, and there was anothe high D-1 player here who played with the other 3 in AAU ball. Each of the others declined to even consider playing with McCants, and one said, on TV, that it would be a cold day in heck that she would even consider a school on McCants's list. Hatch brought her in, and she will be the next poster child for churlishness at UNC. (also, UNC's next PG is from here, Cetera Degraffenried, who can flat out ball. She has a little, v. little, punk in her, but she is like Latta skill wise, only as tough as a rusty nail. Only black girl in a real white area, so she won't back down or whine like Latta)

Geno and Coach G would never tolerate the thugishness of Latta and her cohorts. Summit would never recruit such a player (no that the others would) but if one of the Lady Vols pulled Latta's stunts, Summit might call a time out and kick the player off the team on national television, and take her jersey in the process. Hatch may be nice in person. But she comes off as low class based on her reception by her peers, the players she recruits, her churlishness, and the behavior she tolerates. She is the women's version of Bob Huggins, and I hope nothing good ever happens to her ever again.

Patrick Yates

[FireOgilvie]

She is the women's version of Bob Huggins, and I hope nothing good ever happens to her ever again.




Ouch.

I agree. Ivory Latta is an embarrassment to college sports... and Hatchell lets her get away with everything she does. Classy.

[oregon98er]

I can't stand the antics of Latta either. After the game in Cameron last year, her comments were absolutley uncalled for. That said, I know for a fact, that Coach Hatchell hasn't always been thrilled with Latta's actions and has struggled with how to handle all that comes with Latta's talent and desire.

I still don't think you judge one person based on the antics of another. We don't know what the situation was surrounding the recruiting process. I can think of Duke recruits that K probably wishes he wouldn't have pursued...namely Avery, Magette, Burgess, Newton. And he took a lot of heat for sticking with Shelden after that alleged altercation...Shelden proved to be an upstanding individual.

John Thompson often took chances on kids as well and is generally viewed and remembered for doing more good. Sometimes those chances can backfire, but I don't think you should just discredit or not offer a scholarship to a kid that might backfire. That's not a good policy. Perhaps, Ivory never "developed" personally the way Sylvia would have hoped and that has played out as a overly-****y and annoying player.

And speaking of Pat Head, I got my Master's at Tennessee. She is an incredibly intense person in life and basketball. And she won't put up with a lot of crap...But Bobbit was giving Latta a run for her money, talking trash, during both games this year. In fact, she's at Tennessee to counteract Latta. She did it well last night.

[madscavenger]

It is not just Latta. Latta, while everything that you say, is only reflecting what her coach will tolerate. She would not get away with that behavior under Gail. and many others.

Hatchell's coaching credentials are not what is at issue - it is her lack of professional behavior. She has acted like a bully, at best, over and over and she has had players follow her example. That's why she deserves criticism, severe critcism and lots of it, albeit not childish or obscene taunting. Its an open and shut case, IMO.

[ikiru36]

Don't really want to pile on to either side of this argument, but firstly, thank you Oregon98er for the perspective.

I would simply say that in Hatchell's case, the dislike for her does extend well beyond her simply being a successful coach at UNC. If she is, and I have absolutely no reason to doubt this, a wonderful, giving person off the court, that is good to hear.

Nevertheless, on the court and in press conferences, she has had a history of both her and her players exuding patently obnoxious and unsportswomanlike reactions and behaviors. The disrespect that she and her players show through their actions and comments, towards other players, coaches, fans, and the officials, stands out when one watches women's athletics. I hope that she does many good deeds off the court, because she's got some making up to do for the poor example she and her players have set for any youth watching UNC women's hoops.

(And that is all said without touching on the afront to decent fashion sense which she frequently represents!)

[Patrick Yates]

I can't stand the antics of Latta either. After the game in Cameron last year, her comments were absolutley uncalled for. That said, I know for a fact, that Coach Hatchell hasn't always been thrilled with Latta's actions and has struggled with how to handle all that comes with Latta's talent and desire.

I still don't think you judge one person based on the antics of another. We don't know what the situation was surrounding the recruiting process. I can think of Duke recruits that K probably wishes he wouldn't have pursued...namely Avery, Magette, Burgess, Newton. And he took a lot of heat for sticking with Shelden after that alleged altercation...Shelden proved to be an upstanding individual.

John Thompson often took chances on kids as well and is generally viewed and remembered for doing more good. Sometimes those chances can backfire, but I don't think you should just discredit or not offer a scholarship to a kid that might backfire. That's not a good policy. Perhaps, Ivory never "developed" personally the way Sylvia would have hoped and that has played out as a overly-****y and annoying player.

And speaking of Pat Head, I got my Master's at Tennessee. She is an incredibly intense person in life and basketball. And she won't put up with a lot of crap...But Bobbit was giving Latta a run for her money, talking trash, during both games this year. In fact, she's at Tennessee to counteract Latta. She did it well last night.

Coach K has had kids who made bad decisions off the court, and he punished each and every one of them. He rarely has a kid make a foul up on court, and those few occur in the heat of the moment, usually followed by a public apology. When has Latta ever apologized, or shown remorse for her antics. Heck, even Hatch never apologised or showed remorse.

For all of Thompson's questionable recruits, most of them handled themselves well on the court. Thompson demanded they behave with respect and class, and he got it. I think that is why parents of many challenged individuals sought out JT, cause he would right their sons, and not take any guff from them.

How to handle the Latta's baggage? She chose to ignore it in the pursuit of victory. That is my point. Geno, Coach G, Coach K, Dean Smith (Rasheed not withstanding, and that was more whining than real d-baggery), Roy, and Pat Summitt would have benched her annoying butt. It might have taken a game or two watching in street clothes, and a few losses, but Latta would have straitened up, transferred, or continued to have great seats for the games.

The coaches I mentioned would not have chosen victory at the cost of sportsmanship, unlike Sylvia.

And as far as her accomplishments, her one NC was a result of the Luckiest Shot in NCAA history, men's or womens. Not even the NCSU NC matches it. A step-back, fade-away 3 from a mediocre center as the horn sounds. The odds of that working are un frakking real.

Patrick Yates

[Richard Berg]

Not all negativity is a personal attack. "K's teams suck at stopping dribble penetration" vs "K is too stupid to teach zone." I hadn't seen many true personal attacks on Hatchell before now, though admittedly this thread has touched off several.

Also, I have no problem with rivalry humor that happens to be personal. For example "UNC women’s coach and walking sartorial disaster Sylvia Hatchell" is (a) true, and more importantly, (b) hilarious.

[bludev03]

She is definitely not well liked, nor respected. As a person, coaches have told me she is very aloof, cold, and distant. A coach told me that at a coaches clinic, while others were interacting with each other, she read her newspaper the whole time - as if she was better than everyone.
Also, she lets players get away with all types of behavior that aren't very sportsmanship like. Her idea of punishing a player is not allowing them to start, but as soon as the jump ball has been thrown up, she's at the score table to check in; as a result, a player can be "disciplined", yet get 37 mins a game.
Her teams in the early 90s had the image of the "Bad Girls" (ala the Pistons Bad Boys). They were physical, fast, and very intimidating. From Tonya Sampson, to Tracey Reid, to Jessica Gaspar, to Nikki Teasely, to Ivory Latta......they dont miss a beat!

[bludev03]

Here are some acts that I personall recall of the Lady Heels:

1994: Charlotte Smith punches a player from ODU in the face, and was suspended for one game in the NCAA tourney

1993 or 1994: Tonya Sampson was instructed to "take out" Jen Rizzotti from UConn, when UConn was in control of the game. UNC later pulled out the win

Jessica Gaspar: After fouling out in Cameron, before she left the court, she mooned the Crazies , showing her light blue Spandex shorts

Nikki Teasley: where do we begin?! Other than doing the "bobblehead" or the "Teasley Shake" after every score, after playing GT at Chapel Hill, she popped GT's Nina Barlin in the mouth while shaking hands. Nina didnt back down, and the GT staff was heated and complained to the UNC AD, who suspended Teasley for a game

Laquanda Barksdale: Intentionally elbowed Lauren Rice in the mouth during the 2000 ACC Championship Game, leaving her on the floor in serious pain. One time, I saw her in Foot Locker, and I told her congrats on a good season. Her response (I was wearing Duke apparel) was: "So you think I'm getting ACC Player of the Year?!" I said: "This time last year, Georgia already knew she received it...."

Jackie Higgins: Judo slamming Michelle Matasovsky into the press table at Carmichael in 2000.

Ivory Latta: There's not enough space to write about her.....

These incidents come to my mind immediately.......

[Boswell]

My take on Sylvia Hatchell, and some of you have known this story for a couple of years:

Three years ago, my wife, who pretty much couldn't care less about sports and doesn't follow it other than going to Duke games with me, came home from the gym and told me the following story. She was wearing a Duke t-shirt and exercising on an elliptical machine. When she was done, she walked over to the weight machines. Before she got there, a woman she didn't know came up to her and in a mocking tone said, "Awww, poor Duke. Maybe your Blue Devils can do better next year. Too bad!" And then laughed. My wife gave her a quizzical look and didn't respond.

Three or four months later, my wife was back at the gym, and the same woman did something similar. One of the gym employees said to my wife, "Ignore her. She's weird."

The following season, we're at home watching an away Duke/UNC women's game. There's a timeout, and my wife looks up at the tv and says, "Oh my gosh, that's her!!! That's the woman from the gym!!!" It was Sylvia Hatchell.

True story. If you want to know the gym, it's at the intersection of Hwy 54 and Fearrington Road on the southwest corner.

Since then, friends in UNC's athletic department have said that virtually no one likes her there. In a way, it's sad. But given the crap she gave my wife who isn't involved in or cares about sports, I fully support the criticism that comes her way. "Unprofessional" is a modest criticism of this odd woman.

[chris13]

Boswell, I'm a UNC fan and that story is messed up. Sorry your wife had that encounter and sorry that head coach of a major college program would act like that.

It seems to me that Roy and K have more respect for each other than Gail and Sylvia.

[calltheobvious]

Check out row 3, colum 3 of the thumbnails when you search Sylvia Hatchell in Google Images.

http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=sylvia+hatchell&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=2

[oregon98er]

i guess that would depend on the size of screen each user is using and how many pictures were in each row now wouldn't it? confused? and why are you searching on "images" of hatchell? this is the kind of "criticism" that makes no sense. just like the coach k = a rat, billy donovan = eddie munster. does that change the fact that both have back to back titles? not one bit.

show YOUR class.

and did anybody ever talk about the class of woody hayes and steve spurrier? why do i bring those two up? after beating michigan by over 40 in a classic ohio st/michigan football game when going for 2 on the final touchdown, the reporters asked woody hayes why he went for two? his answer: "Because they wouldn't let me go for 3!". And Spurrier, when asked about the Florida/Tennessee rivalry in football commented that "You can't spell Citrus without UT", lamenting Tennessee's lack of success reaching the higher quality bowls. I like coaches who LOVE their program, enough to dislike other programs. Hate is another category, but the lovefest between Duke and UNC doesn't exist among fans, on this board, or in general. Why should it exist in coaches lives?

a lot of the comments i've received on this post are probably why the duke program is hated nationally...the above reporach mentality of the fans. when i mentioned coach k's recruiting, it was quickly denied and defended as above":
"Coach K has had kids who made bad decisions off the court, and he punished each and every one of them. He rarely has a kid make a foul up on court, and those few occur in the heat of the moment, usually followed by a public apology. When has Latta ever apologized, or shown remorse for her antics. Heck, even Hatch never apologised or showed remorse."
give it a rest. i'm a duke homer as well, but crap...even i get sick of reading how we're so much better than every other program in the history of sports...ughhhh

really, should we still frame the gerald henderson/hansbrough play? never. it didn't occur in a still frame...

some relevant posts otherwise than to this latest attack solely on someone's image.

[Duvall]

Hate is another category, but the lovefest between Duke and UNC doesn't exist among fans, on this board, or in general. Why should it exist in coaches lives?

You seem to be under the impression that it's just Duke coaches and fans that dislike Hatchell. That is not the case - *no one* in women's college hoops thinks much of Hatchell.

She may be a wonderful person in Gastonia, but on the basketball court she, and her teams, are repellent, and have been for years.

[oregon98er]

I guess that's whay a NATIONAL program like UNC has dismissed her. Come on, that program, though somewhat evil, is image conscious. If she and her program are as ill-conceived as you suggest, I don't think that Coach Smith and the rest of the athletic department would allow things to continue...take off the Devil-blue glasses.

As my name suggests, I'm in Oregon now, not in North Carolina. I'm not privy to a lot of the daily interactions of ACC basketball, much less women's basketball. Some of you probably are closer than I to the situation and the women's program. Sylvia is a good person whether you, or I, like her players, her recruiting decisions, or her workout conversations...

[FireOgilvie]

As my name suggests, I'm in Oregon now, not in North Carolina. I'm not privy to a lot of the daily interactions of ACC basketball, much less women's basketball. Some of you probably are closer than I to the situation and the women's program. Sylvia is a good person whether you, or I, like her players, her recruiting decisions, or her workout conversations...

Good. I don't know anything about Sylvia Hatchell personally. All I know is what I've seen from her program.

People are going from personal experiences... and it sounds like everyone around here but you so far has the same experience. You can't get mad at people for disliking someone based on years of bad experiences when you like her based on your own personal experiences.

I'm sure UNC keeps her around because she's a coach that gets wins. Image perception isn't really that big of a deal in women's basketball... it doesn't get 1% of the press coverage that men's basketball does.

There are plenty of coaches at Duke that I don't like........... ^^^^

.......but that doesn't mean that Duke is evil.

[KandG]

oregon, I always like to hear the other side of the coin when it comes to someone is obviously polarizing like Hatchell is, and your early contributions to this thread are appreciated. However, people have responded with some very damning observations about her general behavior, and *not* just from Duke people or ACC opponents. You can choose to believe what you want, but you are quickly undermining your credibility by resorting to name calling and pulling out "Gerald-gate"...which is more fit for Inside Carolina type fans.

I find it's easy to lay the hate on visibly successful figures representing opposing programs -- Auriemma, Summit, Roy, Donovan, etc etc -- but going beneath the surface of these figures, there is much that is commendable about the way they run their programs and have their players represent their schools. Many fans -- even those frothing with passion about rivalries -- can acknowledge what these coaches have done.

In Hatchell's case, though, it's amazing how much evidence exists of her less than gracious behavior, and it's easy to read between the lines when you hear coaches in the women's game talk about each other...there are barbs to be sure, but a good deal of mutual respect between most coaches...yet it's amazing how little respect Hatchell commands as an individual from most opponents, and how gracelessly she handles herself compared to other coaches.

I'm sure she has done many good things for the people and causes she cares about, and thank you for bringing in your perspective. From my vantage point, though, I will reserve my admiration and grudging respect for opponents like Roy Williams. I haven't heard any evidence to the contrary (beyond your limited contributions) to indicate that she should command a similar level of respect, or that she is able to extend respect to her peers and colleagues outside of her own program. She comes across as a very small person in relation to the stature of the school she represents.

[vmurray]

I don't know Hatchell at all but some of her press conferences have been abrasive but not dramatically different from other college coaches. I also cannot testify as to whether she is liked or disliked by her peers or other UNC coaches. I have seen,however,how supportive all of these coaches are of each other. Football coaches and players attend basketball and baseball games. Our basketball players and coaches attend each others games (mens and womens) as well as football and baseball games. Maybe they are all just sportsaholics but it is very nice to see that kind of support and either it doesn't happen as frequently at other schools or they just don't show it on TV. I would have really liked to see someone go to bat for Goestenkors. I think she deserved more than she got.
VMurray