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Dukefan4Life
12-03-2008, 12:47 PM
I was very impressed with our defense last night! I was impressed with the way we were composed with all of the hype surrounding the game! But what id like to see is more ball movement on offense. it seems we just pass once twice at the most then look for the jumper or take it to the hole. we seem to again this year to live or die with the outside shot, last night we were hitting them but what happens when they arent falling? we have to have some post play, give the ball to Z,lance, or even post kyle up..overall great game last night id just like to see more passing and more inside play

should_be_working
12-03-2008, 12:50 PM
Hard to judge our offense last night, since it seamed as if we only played one half of it. We did not look good in the spread. Nice to see Jon hitting some 3's though.

Dukefan4Life
12-03-2008, 12:54 PM
It just seems every game we arent moving the ball around like we should. watch next game and you should notice we pass once or twice then make a one on one move or settle for the Jumper! I think we could get much better looks and even some inside scoring if we would just make the extra pass :D

Dr. Rosenrosen
12-03-2008, 12:59 PM
I was very impressed with our defense last night! I was impressed with the way we were composed with all of the hype surrounding the game! But what id like to see is more ball movement on offense. it seems we just pass once twice at the most then look for the jumper or take it to the hole. we seem to again this year to live or die with the outside shot, last night we were hitting them but what happens when they arent falling? we have to have some post play, give the ball to Z,lance, or even post kyle up..overall great game last night id just like to see more passing and more inside play

Boy, I think we've been thru this ad nauseam but... I like our offense. We are taking fewer 3s as a % of total shots. We took good open 3s last night not forced shots. Missed a few but hey. As for inside game, well, why do we have to define it as scoring from the low post position alone? Taking it strong to the hoop counts just the same and has the affect of generating lots of FTs - which by the way we are knocking down at a very nice clip. And, to me, offensive rebounding and stick backs are just as important in the consideration of strong "inside" play. Let's look at the whole picture. I love what I am seeing!

MChambers
12-03-2008, 01:00 PM
I was very impressed with our defense last night! I was impressed with the way we were composed with all of the hype surrounding the game! But what id like to see is more ball movement on offense. it seems we just pass once twice at the most then look for the jumper or take it to the hole. we seem to again this year to live or die with the outside shot, last night we were hitting them but what happens when they arent falling? we have to have some post play, give the ball to Z,lance, or even post kyle up..overall great game last night id just like to see more passing and more inside play

According to Pomeroy, only 31.5% of Duke's shots have been three pointers, which ranks 197th among Division 1 teams. Duke is only shooting 32.9% on three pointers, ranking 198.

What is Duke doing well on offense? Shooting two pointers (ranked 42), offensive (rebounding 11), and getting to the line (14th) and making the free throws (74.4%, ranked 57).

http://kenpom.com/sr.php?team=Duke&y=2009

Dukefan4Life
12-03-2008, 01:03 PM
dont get me wrong i think we looked good too. All im saying is we have to move the ball more. I neve said the offesne is bad im just saying it could be even better if we passed the ball more than twice each time down court

The Gordog
12-03-2008, 01:12 PM
It just seems every game we arent moving the ball around like we should. watch next game and you should notice we pass once or twice then make a one on one move or settle for the Jumper! I think we could get much better looks and even some inside scoring if we would just make the extra pass :D

Also, watch the difference between when Paulus is in vs. Nolan. I don't want to open a whole can of worms or hijack the thread, but I noticed that when GP went in we started drawing more fouls on them -- he seemed to get it to Z or Lance or Kyle in nearly perfect position a few times. Nolan brings other things which have been analyzed a lot on here, so please don't think I'm advocating for anything in particular, I just think we have 2 distinct offenses depending on our PG.

Kedsy
12-03-2008, 01:36 PM
Also, watch the difference between when Paulus is in vs. Nolan. I don't want to open a whole can of worms or hijack the thread, but I noticed that when GP went in we started drawing more fouls on them -- he seemed to get it to Z or Lance or Kyle in nearly perfect position a few times. Nolan brings other things which have been analyzed a lot on here, so please don't think I'm advocating for anything in particular, I just think we have 2 distinct offenses depending on our PG.

I agree with this. Based on what we've seen so far, there's no doubt in my mind that Nolan is the right point guard for this squad. The defense keys off him and we're simply not as good a team when he's off the floor. That said, the offense looks a lot more in synch when Greg is running it. I'm not sure if we score better, but it certainly looks better.

I do think, however, that last night's game was Nolan's best at running the offense. A month or two of experience may be all he needs.

KyDevilinIL
12-03-2008, 01:43 PM
Boy, I think we've been thru this ad nauseam but... I like our offense. We are taking fewer 3s as a % of total shots. We took good open 3s last night not forced shots. Missed a few but hey. As for inside game, well, why do we have to define it as scoring from the low post position alone? Taking it strong to the hoop counts just the same and has the affect of generating lots of FTs - which by the way we are knocking down at a very nice clip. And, to me, offensive rebounding and stick backs are just as important in the consideration of strong "inside" play. Let's look at the whole picture. I love what I am seeing!

Agreed. The more we look for options other than the 3 and the more we generate points anywhere other than the perimeter, the better off we'll be. We might not look smooth now because that concept is somewhat new to this bunch of guys and we're still working out the kinks with the Nolan/Greg switcheroo. Once that settles – and especially when a healthy Greg finds a groove in his new situation - we'll be fine.

riverside6
12-03-2008, 01:47 PM
Our offensive efficiency was 114.6 last night, which is a tad below our season average of 116.6.

Duke did in fact take more threes last night (37% of their shots) as compared to the 31% cited earlier.

Stats from here (http://www.scacchoops.com/tt_Game_Box_Score_External.asp?hGame=1417)

Dr. Rosenrosen
12-03-2008, 02:32 PM
Our offensive efficiency was 114.6 last night, which is a tad below our season average of 116.6.

Duke did in fact take more threes last night (37% of their shots) as compared to the 31% cited earlier.

Stats from here (http://www.scacchoops.com/tt_Game_Box_Score_External.asp?hGame=1417)

Considering Purdue was arguably the best team and toughest defense we've played against all year, I would guess that's a great sign if we kept our offensive efficiency at a comparably high level.

31% is an average. There will be deviations of course. As long as they are taking good shots, I can't imagine anyone is going to (or even should) discourage the guys from shooting 3s. And they did in fact take good shots last night.

Unfortunately the only stat that comes close to telling us about heart and hustle (at least against Purdue) is the rebounding margin. If there were a measurable stat for heart/hustle/fearlessness, dare I say we'd be at the top.

Jumbo
12-03-2008, 03:21 PM
A number of thoughts here ...

-Just as Duke's defense was outstanding, and we'd all laugh if Purdue complained about its offense without crediting Duke's D, we have to remember that there was another team on the court. Purdue's pressure D was very good and took Duke out of its flow quite often last night.

-That said, Duke's offense still can improve. I think we'd all like to see more motion, but it's hard, because the basis of Duke's attack involves spreading the floor, giving players the space to take advantage of their skills with the support of numerous shooters drawing the attention of help defenders. In this type of offense, there will always be a certain amount of standing around and the passing game is different, just because passes need to travel a greater distance.

-I have no problem with quick shots, as long as they are good shots. A wide open three on the break, for example, is a good shot. I don't care if it comes off one pass. A contested three off one or two passes, on the other hand, is not a good shot.

-I'm not opposed to more variety. I've advocated posting Henderson as a way to take advantage of his skills around the hoop, and I think we should post Singler more. I do not, however, believe we should just be dumping the ball into Thomas and Zoubek and asking them to make a move. Their work should be done off the ball, and they'll by rolling and receiving, etc.

-I would like to see us run a few more set plays (if only because we generally execute them well). And sure, I'd like to see us make the extra pass more consistently. I'd also like to build a little more movement off the ball -- I think we can still spread the floor and still screen off the ball a bit. We've done this in spurts. It needs to be more consistent. My greatest worry is that against really good defensive teams, we'll struggle against ball-pressure to the point where we have to beat men one-on-one to score. Long-term, that's not a great recipe for success.

-I don't think we're relying on the three too much at all. It's still a relatively easy shot. A drive-and-kick style is still the right approach for the personnel we have. It just needs to be refined a bit.

-And, finally, I've noticed a significant different in the offense when Greg is running the show. More than ever, he's having trouble handling the ball against pressure D. His back is turned, which means he's spending a lot of time dribbling around the hashmark, taking us longer to get into our sets. I posted this last night, but not a lot of people saw it, but the disparity (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=2) between Greg's and Nolan's plus/minus stats is huge. Duke has just been way more effective at both ends of the court with Nolan in the game.

MChambers
12-03-2008, 04:29 PM
-And, finally, I've noticed a significant different in the offense when Greg is running the show. More than ever, he's having trouble handling the ball against pressure D. His back is turned, which means he's spending a lot of time dribbling around the hashmark, taking us longer to get into our sets. I posted this last night, but not a lot of people saw it, but the disparity (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=2) between Greg's and Nolan's plus/minus stats is huge. Duke has just been way more effective at both ends of the court with Nolan in the game.

This also was very apparent against Duquesne. Paulus just looked uncomfortable with the ball.

jv001
12-03-2008, 04:41 PM
Have to agree with Jumbo regarding Greg and Nolan's play on offense. Greg because of his lack of quickness has to turn his back to the goal. He cannot beat his man off the dribble like Nolan can. Nolan creates many plays for others as well as himself. Greg seems to perform better when Nolan or Jon is handling the ball. I feel comfortable with the ball in Jon's hands. He also creates some offense. Once in a while in this type offense we will over dribble but so far so good. What we don't need is Zoubs getting the ball and try to create his own shot. Probably the same for Lance but not as bad.
Go Duke!

JDev
12-03-2008, 04:42 PM
This also was very apparent against Duquesne. Paulus just looked uncomfortable with the ball.

Do you think this is injury related?

robed deity
12-03-2008, 04:52 PM
Despite not having the greatest offensive game (you gotta love those tasty blocks though!!!), Hendo made one of my favorite plays of the night. I can't remember exactly when it was, but on a somewhat broken play, he passed up a relatively open baseline jumper to find Scheyer WIDE open cross corner for a 3 bomb. At first, because of the camera angle, it looked like he was throwing it away, but sure enough, Scheyer was there to stroke it. It was a great look and a big momentum builder (maybe put the lead into double digits?). I think it's also a play that G might not have made last year, so I just want to give him some props.