John Wall Recruitment

[BlueintheFace]

1000th Reply !!!!! I feel special.

Come to Duke John Wall... or don't. At least you provide an interesting topic for debate.

[COYS]

I just do not think there is anyway that we will land Wall now, with UNC going after a championship, a Duke team that can not get past the Sweet 16. With Henderson's' status not looking to well, why would he want to come here? I think we may be looking at the same type of Duke teams for the next 5 or 6 years. There is nothing on earth that is going to stop Roy's ability to recruit. We have a coach with three Championships, and a Gold medal, and we still can not get the top players that we need. What frustrates me the most is that we seem to get better each year, but never as good as our Rival down the road. IF wall goes there it will be the same way. I wish there was some remedy to fix all of this. I just want to be able to compete with them again, I just hope that Duke does not fade off into oblivion over the next 10 years, something like what happened to St. Johns, but with so much venom being directed our way from the media, how are we ever suppose to land the top kids. If you were 18 and you knew that you were going to ridiculed and harassed by the media, and other teams fans, would you really want to go here? This is one of the worst days for me as a Duke fan, and now more than likely we are going to have to listen to every person in NC talk about how great their team is, Roy will have his 2nd and could possible have his third very very soon. Maybe MSU will play the games of their lives, but some reason teams always pull up lame against UNC after they just took down a big team:(

This is a completely over the top post, in my opinion. Honestly, UNC fans were singing this tune just five years ago when Duke was in the FF after their star-studded team underachieved again and Duke was supposedly bringing in Livingston to join Deng, Shelden, Redick, Ewing and co. You haven't even let Mason or Kelly play a game and yet you already give UNC's recruits the nod as being better (who would you rather have now, Hansbrough or McRoberts? The answer now is way different than it was in 2005). You also have already given them Wall for next year's crop. Even if UNC lands Wall, it's not the end of the world for Duke. 2010 is shaping up to be great, as we'll get to add Curry to the '09 class plus bring in Dawkins, Thornton, and Hairston plus we're up near the top of Barnes' list. If we stage a coup and grab a Brandon Knight, our fortunes in the rivalry can turn around, instantly. If 2010 and 2011 are strong classes, we're back to supremacy. It all comes in waves and it ebbs and flows. I'm not really sure how the fate of Wall relegates us to second best on Tobacco Road for five years.

[tommy]

Nbadraft.net has it as a definite that Tyreke Evans will leave Memphis and enter the draft, including hiring an agent. I doubt Wall would have been so interested in Memphis w/o Calipari, but if he was, at least this past season's starting point guard won't be there.

FWIW, UCLA's Jrue Holiday will also test the waters per nbadraft.net. Got to be kidding me on that one -- unlike Evans, he was utterly mediocre as a freshman ,doing nothing to suggest that he's anywhere near ready.

[Faison1]

I just do not think there is anyway that we will land Wall now, with UNC going after a championship, a Duke team that can not get past the Sweet 16. With Henderson's' status not looking to well, why would he want to come here? I think we may be looking at the same type of Duke teams for the next 5 or 6 years. There is nothing on earth that is going to stop Roy's ability to recruit. We have a coach with three Championships, and a Gold medal, and we still can not get the top players that we need. What frustrates me the most is that we seem to get better each year, but never as good as our Rival down the road. IF wall goes there it will be the same way. I wish there was some remedy to fix all of this. I just want to be able to compete with them again, I just hope that Duke does not fade off into oblivion over the next 10 years, something like what happened to St. Johns, but with so much venom being directed our way from the media, how are we ever suppose to land the top kids. If you were 18 and you knew that you were going to ridiculed and harassed by the media, and other teams fans, would you really want to go here? This is one of the worst days for me as a Duke fan, and now more than likely we are going to have to listen to every person in NC talk about how great their team is, Roy will have his 2nd and could possible have his third very very soon. Maybe MSU will play the games of their lives, but some reason teams always pull up lame against UNC after they just took down a big team:(

Let me begin by saying, I understand your pain, and I too am a bit worried about the Wall situation. But the majority of your post is utter nonsense. Are you seriously worried that K is going to let the love of his life drift into mediocrity? Has John Wall called you to say he's going to UNC? You rank this day as one of the worst days as a Duke fan.....comparing it to the championship loss to Louisville in '86, or the finals loss to UConn in '99, not to mention the semifinal loss to UConn in '04, or even the LSU loss in '05?

I haven't even mentioned the other bitter defeats to conference rivals, or ACC tourney games. THOSE are bad days to be Duke Fans. Not a debate over recruiting. And that's all this is. We have the chance to land a really good kid. But we've had lots of chances. And probably missed quite a few, but you didn't know about it because before a few years ago, DBR boards didn't exist or weren't widely followed. Anyway, have faith and place trust in K. He will find a way to win. He always has. He's brought us 28 years of amazing basketball with amazing kids.....admirable kids. Give him the benefit of the doubt.

And congrats to everyone for getting 1000 posts!!!

[_Gary]

THOSE are bad days to be Duke Fans. Not a debate over recruiting.

I agree that neither yesterday, today or even tomorrow (when UNC undoubtedly will win another title) are bad days to be Duke fans. However, should Wall for some crazy reason sign with the Holes - that will rank as a very, very, very bad day to be a Duke fan. And while I think DBFan has overstated how dire the situation is, he hasn't overstated it by that much. We are getting our butts outrecruited right now by ole Roy. That's just flat out plain and obvious. Coach K has made a huge play for a kid he believes can immeditately put us right back in the title hunt next year. If Williams comes in at the last second and gets Wall to sign with him, it tells me he's head and shoulders above us in terms of recruiting and it will set off red warning lights in my mind. Just saying...

[Newton_14]

The Chronicle had a chat with JP Giglio regarding Duke recruiting and Wall

http://sports.chronicleblogs.com/2009/04/04/im-not-comparing-him-to-the-guy-at-the-bar-at-last-call-a-qa-with-the-nos-jp-giglio/

I think his argument that K actively avoided one-and-done players for a short period of time is questionable.

There is little to no truth/fact in JP's responses. He even admitted he was not up to speed on the details of each Duke recruit. He states that Duke only recruited Monroe and Patterson because of the early round NCAA exit's in 06 and 07. That is simply not true. Most all of his other assessments are off base as well. He even suggested we lost out on Brandon Wright because "maybe K insisted that if he committed he would have to play two seasons".

I think it would be a good idea if JP sat down with Mark Watson and got the facts regarding Duke recruiting in this decade. Maybe then he could write an informed article.

[jv001]

I agree that neither yesterday, today or even tomorrow (when UNC undoubtedly will win another title) are bad days to be Duke fans. However, should Wall for some crazy reason sign with the Holes - that will rank as a very, very, very bad day to be a Duke fan. And while I think DBFan has overstated how dire the situation is, he hasn't overstated it by that much. We are getting our butts outrecruited right now by ole Roy. That's just flat out plain and obvious. Coach K has made a huge play for a kid he believes can immeditately put us right back in the title hunt next year. If Williams comes in at the last second and gets Wall to sign with him, it tells me he's head and shoulders above us in terms of recruiting and it will set off red warning lights in my mind. Just saying...

Sometimes it's hard to argue with numbers and facts. Go Duke!

[Faison1]

I agree that neither yesterday, today or even tomorrow (when UNC undoubtedly will win another title) are bad days to be Duke fans. However, should Wall for some crazy reason sign with the Holes - that will rank as a very, very, very bad day to be a Duke fan. And while I think DBFan has overstated how dire the situation is, he hasn't overstated it by that much. We are getting our butts outrecruited right now by ole Roy. That's just flat out plain and obvious. Coach K has made a huge play for a kid he believes can immeditately put us right back in the title hunt next year. If Williams comes in at the last second and gets Wall to sign with him, it tells me he's head and shoulders above us in terms of recruiting and it will set off red warning lights in my mind. Just saying...

I agree with you. It is no fun watching Carolina continue to recruit big man after big man, and guard after guard, while we seem to be getting more denials from top 10 recruits than LOI's. I'm not sure any of us know the reasons behind this change in momentum since about 2004-2005. But I think we'll get it back in the next couple of years. (However, during Dean's years, K admitted he couldn't recruit against him.....UNC just has some serious advantages, as long as they have a good coach.....and they obviously have a great coach now.)

And my apologies to DBFan.....I was a bit too harsh. I just don't think the world is ending, and I certainly don't think Duke will be behind Carolina much longer. I would love to see Wall in a Duke Uni, and it would cause much grief if he ended up in Chapel Hell. But I still think we'll be good with or withour him next year.....

[Devilsfan]

We certainly can out coach them. That's a given. Now let's out recruit them!

[Icarus09]

Here's a question. If Gerald declared and got an agent today, would anybody's opinion about getting John Wall change?

I think this is a thought worth exploring. But I don't think it would. And, as the desperation seems to be steadily growing on this board, I don't think it will change for the better, especially because Gerald declaring seems to be close to certainty. If anything, we're going to feel that getting Wall is more important because we're going to need to fill an even bigger offensive void than just the PG slot. Some points are going to disappear. While I do think that we'll get points from other places if Henderson leaves, we're going to need serious contributions from our incoming freshmen. Scheyer and Nolan will get better, but I don't think we can be certain that Nolan will be able to contribute as a PG. And, I don't think we can afford to burden Scheyer any more than we have. Wall would definitely ease the sting of Henderson leaving. While I think Bledsoe is more of a long-term answer, I don't think we can dispute the fact that Wall would probably compensate better next year for the loss of Henderson than Bledsoe could, not just from a positional perspective but also in terms of points.

[MAG0297]

I think that Duke has been out recruited the last couple of years, but I feel that the Team USA involvement has had a lot to do with this. I have been discouraged the last couple of seasons because we have had a great overall talent level but we were just missing two pieces to the puzzle. Missing out on John Wall would hurt that much more if he went to UNC, but I can't see Duke going the way of St. Johns. I think Duke is going to be a better team next year even if G goes (really hope he stays) and if we miss on Wall. I was HIGHLY encouraged by the way K went after Curry and was also impressed that he went after Wall knowing that we really need a point guard. For me the future is bright! It can only be a good thing to have NBA players like Kobe praising your coach and to have somebody like Dell Curry say that your facilities are on par with the best in the NBA, lets give these sentiments time to develop. Kelly and Plumlee2 are the types that are going to stick around for a couple of years and develop into really good players; add to this what is already a really good 2010 class (could potentially get a lot better) and I would say that Duke is heading in the right direction. We may not win a NC next year, but I would say we will definitely be contending in the next 2 or 3 seasons IMO.

[DBFAN]

I do apologize for seeming so doom and gloom last nigh, it was just tough watching the Tarholes play another team that did not show up, the Gerald Henderson rumors, and the Wall rumors were just a lot to take in at once last night. Lets hope that we get a bit of Good Luck over the next couple of weeks

Go Duke

[UrinalCake]

These things definitely go in cycles. I was a freshman in 1995 and at the time UNC was so dominant that the only thought when we played them was whether or not we'd be run off the floor before halftime. By 1999 the pendulum had swung back in our favor. It doesn't happen overnight, but it will happen, even though it's hard to see that when things aren't going so well.

Also, is it possible we're overvaluing Wall a little bit simply because he's the top unsigned prospect? This kind of thing seems to happen every year. Is it really realistic to think that he will lead us to a national championship as a freshman point guard? Maybe it's not and I'm just speaking out of ignorance, but I just feel like there's been a swell of emotions on this board that has gotten a little out of control and maybe we're getting caught up in wanting what we don't have. Then again maybe he really is that good.

[rotogod00]

These things definitely go in cycles. I was a freshman in 1995 and at the time UNC was so dominant that the only thought when we played them was whether or not we'd be run off the floor before halftime. By 1999 the pendulum had swung back in our favor. It doesn't happen overnight, but it will happen, even though it's hard to see that when things aren't going so well.

Also, is it possible we're overvaluing Wall a little bit simply because he's the top unsigned prospect? This kind of thing seems to happen every year. Is it really realistic to think that he will lead us to a national championship as a freshman point guard? Maybe it's not and I'm just speaking out of ignorance, but I just feel like there's been a swell of emotions on this board that has gotten a little out of control and maybe we're getting caught up in wanting what we don't have. Then again maybe he really is that good.

it's not often a PG is the #1 prospect in a class....he's THAT good

[eddiehaskell]

UNC just has some serious advantages, as long as they have a good coach.....and they obviously have a great coach now.)I think most young people grow up in awe of UNC players - past and present. It's been said before, but the UNC program has "street cred." Guys like Battier, Brand, Laettner, Redick and Boozer are seemingly good people, but I'm not sure they're the type of players/people most recruits grow up idolizing. Would things be different if these players went to UNC? I don't know. As a recruit, imagine having Michael Jordan wanting to meet with you about playing for his alma mater. :eek:

[geraldsneighbor]

I think most young people grow up in awe of UNC players - past and present. It's been said before, but the UNC program has "street cred." Guys like Battier, Brand, Laettner, Redick and Boozer are seemingly good people, but I'm not sure they're the type of players/people most recruits grow up idolizing. Would things be different if these players went to UNC? I don't know. As a recruit, imagine having Michael Jordan wanting to meet with you about playing for his alma mater. :eek:

I'm pretty sure that is a recruiting violation...

[eddiehaskell]

I'm pretty sure that is a recruiting violation...I'm sure there are ways of getting around that.:p

Didn't Jordan go to Shav's high school wearing a Shav-country t-shirt?:eek:

[Edouble]

I'm sure there are ways of getting around that.:p

Didn't Jordan go to Shav's high school wearing a Shav-country t-shirt?:eek:

No, it was just a picture that D'oh sent to Shave, IIRC.

[Icarus09]

I'm sure there are ways of getting around that.:p

Didn't Jordan go to Shav's high school wearing a Shav-country t-shirt?:eek:

From wikipedia:
"UNC coach Matt Doherty sent Randolph a picture of six-time NBA champion and former UNC standout Michael Jordan wearing one of the popular “Shav Country” shirts made at Randolph’s high school."

[eddiehaskell]

From wikipedia:
"UNC coach Matt Doherty sent Randolph a picture of six-time NBA champion and former UNC standout Michael Jordan wearing one of the popular “Shav Country” shirts made at Randolph’s high school."Pretty influential when Jordan lets it be known that he wants you to play for his alma mater. I can't say that having a Battier do something similar would carry the same weight with most recruits.

[hedgehog]

Pretty influential when Jordan lets it be known that he wants you to play for his alma mater. I can't say that having a Battier do something similar would carry the same weight with most recruits.

Jordan wearing the "Shav Country" jersey carried so much weight that Shav committed to ... Duke? Apparently Jordan is not that influential.

[eddiehaskell]

Jordan wearing the "Shav Country" jersey carried so much weight that Shav committed to ... Duke? Apparently Jordan is not that influential.But your conclusion is a non sequitur. I didn't say it worked on every recruit. If it did, Roy would sit back, tell Jordan who he wants and let Jordan put the word out. It would be like a scene out of The Godfather.:p

What I did say is that having "the great one" as an alum and advocate for your program is VERY influential on today's recruits. I don't see how anyone could possibly deny that. If one plays basketball, he or she bows to the throne of Jordan.

[hedgehog]

But your conclusion is a non sequitur. I didn't say it worked on every recruit. If it did, Roy would sit back, tell Jordan who he wants and let Jordan put the word out. It would be like a scene out of The Godfather.:p

What I did say is that having "the great one" as an alum and advocate for your program is VERY influential on today's recruits. I don't see how anyone could possibly deny that. If one plays basketball, he or she bows to the throne of Jordan.

Indeed, my conclusion was a non sequitur, as it was attempting to poke fun at your assertion that was not just sans evidence, but with evidence supporting a contrary position, i.e. that Jordan carried less weight than the UNC program assumed.

[houstondukie]

These things definitely go in cycles. I was a freshman in 1995 and at the time UNC was so dominant that the only thought when we played them was whether or not we'd be run off the floor before halftime. By 1999 the pendulum had swung back in our favor. It doesn't happen overnight, but it will happen, even though it's hard to see that when things aren't going so well.

Also, is it possible we're overvaluing Wall a little bit simply because he's the top unsigned prospect? This kind of thing seems to happen every year. Is it really realistic to think that he will lead us to a national championship as a freshman point guard? Maybe it's not and I'm just speaking out of ignorance, but I just feel like there's been a swell of emotions on this board that has gotten a little out of control and maybe we're getting caught up in wanting what we don't have. Then again maybe he really is that good.

He's not the top unsigned prospect...he is the top prospect.

[Edouble]

He's not the top unsigned prospect...he is the top prospect.

So were Ronald Curry and Greg Paulus. Wall may be as good as advertised, but I do think the hype increases the longer you wait.

[BlueinBlo]

What is this kid waiting for??? I mean he has to know if he is going to follow Cal or go to Duke. The longer he waits the more he will change his mind.

[FireOgilvie]

So were Ronald Curry and Greg Paulus. Wall may be as good as advertised, but I do think the hype increases the longer you wait.

Greg was the 11th overall prospect according to Rivals, and 18th overall according to Scout. Wall is 1st (Rivals), and 2nd (Scout) overall.

[Faison1]

What is this kid waiting for??? I mean he has to know if he is going to follow Cal or go to Duke. The longer he waits the more he will change his mind.

IIRC, Boozer waited until April to announce. I would have to guess that some of the top prospects who expect to go pro soon after they reach college want to see how potential playing time shakes out. If an All-American at their position decides to stay in school after the tourney, the prospect probably won't go there.

My memory is a bit shady about the Boozer announcement, but I think it came shortly after Brand said he'd go pro.

It's another reason I could never be a head coach.....my gut would churn endlessly wondering what these kids were going to do. My gut would also churn endlessly watching some of our frontcourt players get called for moving picks all season long. I don't know how K does it without going crazy.

[Newton_14]

So were Ronald Curry and Greg Paulus. Wall may be as good as advertised, but I do think the hype increases the longer you wait.

I see your point and agree with you to a certain degree. They are all over hyped these days. In fairness to Wall though, not only is he the top rated college prospect, he is also projected to be the number 1 pick in the NBA draft when eligible. While he is not a lock like say Lebron was, he is very much expected to be a high impact player from the beginning. Time will tell of course.

[roywhite]

IIRC, Boozer waited until April to announce. I would have to guess that some of the top prospects who expect to go pro soon after they reach college want to see how potential playing time shakes out. If an All-American at their position decides to stay in school after the tourney, the prospect probably won't go there.

My memory is a bit shady about the Boozer announcement, but I think it came shortly after Brand said he'd go pro.

It's another reason I could never be a head coach.....my gut would churn endlessly wondering what these kids were going to do. My gut would also churn endlessly watching some of our frontcourt players get called for moving picks all season long. I don't know how K does it without going crazy.

More recently, Lance Thomas did not announce for Duke until May 4 of his senior year. Some guys are cautious; it's interesting that, although Wall seemed to like Calipari, he hadn't commited to Memphis.

[BlueintheFace]

More recently, Lance Thomas did not announce for Duke until May 4 of his senior year. Some guys are cautious; it's interesting that, although Wall seemed to like Calipari, he hadn't commited to Memphis.

If I was asked to give the most likely reason for this, I would say:

Wall had Memphis (but really Calipari) as his leader with the assumption that (1) Tyree Evans would leave and (2) Wall would be left with a talented and experienced team to run. He intended to commit after Tyree grabbed an agent.

Now, Calipari is gone, but he went to a team with a bigger PG problem than even Duke. So, if my above explanation is correct, it would seem likely that Wall intends to commit to Kentucky provided that enough pieces are in place for Wall to consider the team talented.

1) Calipari- Check
2) PG vacancy- Check
3) Enough Talent- ???? Probably

[Kewlswim]

If I was asked to give the most likely reason for this, I would say:

Wall had Memphis (but really Calipari) as his leader with the assumption that (1) Tyree Evans would leave and (2) Wall would be left with a talented and experienced team to run. He intended to commit after Tyree grabbed an agent.

Now, Calipari is gone, but he went to a team with a bigger PG problem than even Duke. So, if my above explanation is correct, it would seem likely that Wall intends to commit to Kentucky provided that enough pieces are in place for Wall to consider the team talented.

1) Calipari- Check
2) PG vacancy- Check
3) Enough Talent- ???? Probably

Hi,

I think you are giving a bit too much credit to "logic." I think emotion plays a big role in this too.

GO DUKE!

[houstondukie]

So were Ronald Curry and Greg Paulus. Wall may be as good as advertised, but I do think the hype increases the longer you wait.

You're missing the point.

Wall is not just the top PG in the country. He is the top player overall. Are you seriously comparing Wall to Greg Paulus?

[moonpie23]

what does MAMA think? i bet she's got some influence in this...

[rotogod00]

I know people on these boards don't like unsubstantiated rumors (I don't have a link), and I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but heard from a friend that Wall has told Collins that he is leaning toward NOT coming to Duke, but he was not officially told where he was going.

[roywhite]

I know people on these boards don't like unsubstantiated rumors (I don't have a link), and I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but heard from a friend that Wall has told Collins that he is leaning toward NOT coming to Duke, but he was not officially told where he was going.

Maybe so, but that's not much of a report. It is indeed an unsubstantiated rumor.

[Icarus09]

If I was asked to give the most likely reason for this, I would say:

Wall had Memphis (but really Calipari) as his leader with the assumption that (1) Tyree Evans would leave and (2) Wall would be left with a talented and experienced team to run. He intended to commit after Tyree grabbed an agent.

Now, Calipari is gone, but he went to a team with a bigger PG problem than even Duke. So, if my above explanation is correct, it would seem likely that Wall intends to commit to Kentucky provided that enough pieces are in place for Wall to consider the team talented.

1) Calipari- Check
2) PG vacancy- Check
3) Enough Talent- ???? Probably

I agree with this, but it's pretty disconcerting. If Wall is thinking this way, he's probably considering not just if there's enough talent on Kentucky's team but if Kentucky has more talent on their team than Duke does. I think Wall thinking this would give us the advantage.

[Cameron]

After Wall's quote last week saying he "would love to play with Kyle and Gerald because they can make things happen for me," I'd say we are losing ground.

He's not coming.

[Greg_Newton]

After Wall's quote last week saying he "would love to play with Kyle and Gerald because they can make things happen for me," I'd say we are losing ground.

He's not coming.

I don't think there's any reason to get all doomsday yet. The last actual news we heard was that Wall had a great meeting with Coach K, that Clifton loves Coach K, that UNC is not currently recruiting him, and that he is considering Kentucky and Memphis. One unsubstantiated rumor about G shouldn't change any of that... plus, there's a good chance Wall will decide before G decides whether to hire and agent, seeing as the deadline for that is sometime in June. UK is probably the favorite, but who knows.

In the meantime, I'm pretty excited to see him play in the Hoops Summit next weekend. I can see him and Mason playing well off of each other Whether he's coming to Duke or not, it'll be fun to watch him actually play a full game after reading our 1,000+ speculative posts. Will his north-south speed be as nuts as it looks from the highlights? I have a feeling it will be.

It will also be interesting to see what his on-court demeanor and body language is like. Furthermore, it will be interesting to see if him and Mason play off of each other well. They can both run and jump like crazy, and I believe they've played AAU together in the past. Who knows, if it turns out they play very well together it could help our prospects with Wall.

Lastly, does anyone know what Wall's wingspan is? It's got to be something ridiculous, like 6'8 or so.

[G man]

I don't think there's any reason to get all doomsday yet. The last actual news we heard was that Wall had a great meeting with Coach K, that Clifton loves Coach K, that UNC is not currently recruiting him, and that he is considering Kentucky and Memphis. One unsubstantiated rumor about G shouldn't change any of that... plus, there's a good chance Wall will decide before G decides whether to hire and agent, seeing as the deadline for that is sometime in June. UK is probably the favorite, but who knows.

In the meantime, I'm pretty excited to see him play in the Hoops Summit next weekend. I can see him and Mason playing well off of each other Whether he's coming to Duke or not, it'll be fun to watch him actually play a full game after reading our 1,000+ speculative posts. Will his north-south speed be as nuts as it looks from the highlights? I have a feeling it will be.

It will also be interesting to see what his on-court demeanor and body language is like. Furthermore, it will be interesting to see if him and Mason play off of each other well. They can both run and jump like crazy, and I believe they've played AAU together in the past. Who knows, if it turns out they play very well together it could help our prospects with Wall.

Lastly, does anyone know what Wall's wingspan is? It's got to be something ridiculous, like 6'8 or so.

Pretty sure he played AAU with Ryan Kelly not Mason

[CameronCrazy'11]

Pretty sure he played AAU with Ryan Kelly not Mason

That is correct.

[MIKESJ73]

We are assuming that Cal gets his players. How attractive would a 14 loss UK team be if Pattersen Leaves, and Cousins and Henry go elsewhere. Wall is probably waiting to find out the answers on all the players at all the schools. He waited this long, I wouldn't think he would make his decision in the next two weeks at the Jordan Classic with everyone elses decisions up in the air now.

If G returns I would think Duke would be the most attractive to win a title, if G goes we are still in it.

[bjornolf]

If he really cares about what the team he's going to will have, wouldn't a stable situation like Duke make more sense than a chaotic one at Kentucky, especially if he's only staying one year and wants to do as much damage as possible in that one season? Calipari may get a lot of talent at UK, but if it's all freshman talent, there are questions of chemistry and inexperience that could really torpedo a chance at a deep run in March.

Of course, that's balanced by the chance of going to Kentucky and maybe being part of the team that re-establishes them as a national powerhouse instead of a joke. He'd be a god there forever. That's an awfully big draw for an 18 year old kid.

Of course, he could also bring Duke back to dominance. We're not in as bad a shape as Kentucky, obviously, but he could still attain titanic status in duke's annals if he pulls it off, even if he only stays a year.

[whereinthehellami]

Did anyone else find it suprising that Wall's Word of God team did not win the State championship? Word of God also had CJ Leslie who is ranked as high as RK and MP? That si basically 2 top 10 recruits on the same HS team.

[Icarus09]

Did anyone else find it suprising that Wall's Word of God team did not win the State championship? Word of God also had CJ Leslie who is ranked as high as RK and MP? That si basically 2 top 10 recruits on the same HS team.

A little surprising, but Word of God lost to United Faith off a desperation three at the buzzer. The possession before the shot, Wall turned the ball, dribbling it off his foot.

[BlueintheFace]

Here's a devious thought... What if G intend to declare (with or without an agent) but K has asked that he wait until John Wall commits somewhere?

That is certainly not outside the realm of possibility.

[Icarus09]

Here's a devious thought... What if G intend to declare (with or without an agent) but K has asked that he wait until John Wall commits somewhere?

That is certainly not outside the realm of possibility.

I suppose the slyness (or deception) of this move would depend upon how important G staying was to Wall when Wall was talking to Coach K. Either way, Wall probably won't sign a LOI immediately so he could simply opt out of his verbal commitment if he committed to Duke and then G declared.

[camion]

In any event, G can't delay indefinitely. There is a deadline in declaring for the draft.

[moonpie23]

as everyone else is doing, i'm thinking about wall and what his motivations / concerns are with regard to coming to duke, or going somewhere else.

is there any chance that the academics of a school would come into play in his decision?

are the academics at UK, MEM, MIAMI or BAYLOR (or even unc) going to pose any more daunting a task for the "one " of the one and done?

it would be naive to think that any school can't (wink wink) arrange for his course load to be commensurate with his ability.....

[dukelifer]

Did anyone else find it suprising that Wall's Word of God team did not win the State championship? Word of God also had CJ Leslie who is ranked as high as RK and MP? That si basically 2 top 10 recruits on the same HS team.
Some here have somehow elevated Wall to be Lebron James. He is not. He is likely a talented player but more than likely is not - I repeat not- a finished player. I expect he could fill a void if G should leave- but he has much work to do on all aspects of his game- particularly his shooting and decision making. Basketball is much more that being able to go fast with the ball and dunk over high school players. For Wall to be an elite player- he will need to have great natural playmaker skills and make others around him better. This is a huge unknown at the moment. If he comes to Duke, he might learn to play D a lot better and that could help him a lot at the next level. He will likely not progress much more in just one year on his offensive game.

[Icarus09]

as everyone else is doing, i'm thinking about wall and what his motivations / concerns are with regard to coming to duke, or going somewhere else.

is there any chance that the academics of a school would come into play in his decision?

are the academics at UK, MEM, MIAMI or BAYLOR (or even unc) going to pose any more daunting a task for the "one " of the one and done?

it would be naive to think that any school can't (wink wink) arrange for his course load to be commensurate with his ability.....

Academics probably play much less of a role in the minds of one year players. Now, if he weren't so interested in the NBA I would think that he would be pressured by his mom to pick a good academic school. But the courses he would encounter in his first year at duke (especially if he takes a summer course or two) probably won't be that different from many schools, so I don't think he would pick UK because he thought the classes would be easier. I think he's looking at the quality of players around him at the schools he's looking at. Is Patterson going to stay? Meeks? G? I think they're really affecting when he's going to make a decision.

[BD80]

... If he comes to Duke, he might learn to play D a lot better and that could help him a lot at the next level. He will likely not progress much more in just one year on his offensive game.

Coach K is a very talented offensive coach. Wall would learn more about spacing (offensive and defensive) at Duke than at Baylor or Ky or at most NBA teams (they don't teach much in the NBA - except in Charlotte). He would also learn the elements of D'Antoni's offense. With a player like Wall to push the ball and make good passes to the wings, Duke's offense would open up. He would learn more in a year a Duke than he would learn in any other year in his basketball experience.

[-bdbd]

Academics probably play much less of a role in the minds of one year players. Now, if he weren't so interested in the NBA I would think that he would be pressured by his mom to pick a good academic school. But the courses he would encounter in his first year at duke (especially if he takes a summer course or two) probably won't be that different from many schools, so I don't think he would pick UK because he thought the classes would be easier. I think he's looking at the quality of players around him at the schools he's looking at. Is Patterson going to stay? Meeks? G? I think they're really affecting when he's going to make a decision.

Keep in mind that we're talking about a 17-year-old kid. From that perspective: (1) Yes, he could feel a little intimidated by the academics of "Duke Unviversity," rightly or wrongly (I firmly believe that for a one-and-done kid that demand can be easily managed for a semester, or 2); but (2) Even if he doesn't intend to get his degree right away/ever (?) I could see a kid like that seeing great benefit in forever being known as "a Duke guy" and (again, rightly or wrongly) the possible inference that he is a really smart guy if he went to Duke...

Clearly Duke offers (1) a more secure/stable situation, (2) probably (along with more veteran players) a greater likelihood of going further in the NCAAT next year than, say, a KY, or Baylor or Calipari-less Memphis; (3) playing really close to home; and (4) AT LEAST as much visibilty as any of the aforementioned schools (hard to beat virtually every game being on network TV, and matchups every year in at least 1-2 major metro markets like NYC or Chicago).

For those chicken-littles among us, I say that I like our chances (even if some think KY is more likely). How many times recently have we heard that about a player early-on having Duke as his lead, only to see a last second change....wouldn't it be sweet to have the opposite perspective of that situation???


-BDBD :D

[JG Nothing]

it would be naive to think that any school can't (wink wink) arrange for his course load to be commensurate with his ability.....

If Duke ever (wink wink) arranged a player's courseload simply to keep him eligible, then I would be very sad.

[JG Nothing]

Here's a devious thought... What if G intend to declare (with or without an agent) but K has asked that he wait until John Wall commits somewhere?

That is certainly not outside the realm of possibility.

So are you basically suggesting that K might withhold information from Wall to
keep Duke in the running? If K has any integrity and sense of honesty whatsoever, then, yes, it is outside the realm of possibility.

[JG Nothing]

Academics probably play much less of a role in the minds of one year players.

I'm sure you are correct. So, should we call one year players student-Athletes or is that even too generous?

[houstondukie]

Some here have somehow elevated Wall to be Lebron James. He is not. He is likely a talented player but more than likely is not - I repeat not- a finished player. I expect he could fill a void if G should leave- but he has much work to do on all aspects of his game- particularly his shooting and decision making. Basketball is much more that being able to go fast with the ball and dunk over high school players. For Wall to be an elite player- he will need to have great natural playmaker skills and make others around him better. This is a huge unknown at the moment. If he comes to Duke, he might learn to play D a lot better and that could help him a lot at the next level. He will likely not progress much more in just one year on his offensive game.

That said, he will still be one of the best PG in the country next year.

[Icarus09]

I'm sure you are correct. So, should we call one year players student-Athletes or is that even too generous?

Maybe we should say they're in the Collective Bargaining Boomer generation, a generation of basketball players forced into the onerous task of playing basketball and going to class (god forbid), before they can go to the NBA, where they wanted to go in the first place .
It seems Calipari has benefited enormously from this generation.

[Jaymf7]

Here's a devious thought... What if G intend to declare (with or without an agent) but K has asked that he wait until John Wall commits somewhere?

That is certainly not outside the realm of possibility.

I'm not even sure this would help. I could see how G declaring might actually help land Wall. If he wants to be used like J Will (or that is our selling point), it would help to have the ball in his hands a lot more than might be possible if G were still here.

That said, as Rose proved last year, a PG who leads a dominant team while subordinating his numbers a bit can still land the #1 draft spot. Wall would certainly have that chance if G stays.

[Greg_Newton]

Pretty sure he played AAU with Ryan Kelly not Mason

I know he played with Ryan, but I thought I had read somewhere that he had also played with Mason before. Could be wrong.

I wonder how many views this thread will have by the time Wall makes a decision. It currently looks like it's getting a solid 5,000-10,000 per day, so I'm going to guess between 200,000-250,000. Let's see UK/UNC match that...

[MulletMan]

It currently looks like it's getting a solid 5,000-10,000 per day, so I'm going to guess between 200,000-250,000. Let's see UK/UNC match that...

Yeah... I mean, I haven't seen this much hand-wringing over a recruit since Lance Thomas.

[rotogod00]

That said, he will still be one of the best PG in the country next year.

no, he's THE best PG prospect in the country

[Devilsfan]

Yes but a 5 star PG is a little different matter.

[BlueintheFace]

Yeah... I mean, I haven't seen this much hand-wringing over a recruit since Lance Thomas.

(shaking head) impractical dreams and aspirations, meet MulletMan's foot, foot, dreams.

[Icarus09]

Now that Meeks is testing the NBA waters and Patterson might, I wonder where UK falls on Wall's list if both of them jump.

[CDu]

Now that Meeks is testing the NBA waters and Patterson might, I wonder where UK falls on Wall's list if both of them jump.

The word on the street is that Williams is now starting to recruit John Wall to UNC. If Patterson and Meeks go, that may work against UK, but may not work in favor of us. It is very possible that UNC backdoors their way into getting Wall.

[BlueintheFace]

The word on the street is that Williams is now starting to recruit John Wall to UNC. If Patterson and Meeks go, that may work against UK, but may not work in favor of us. It is very possible that UNC backdoors their way into getting Wall.

God, that would hurt so bad.

[CDu]

God, that would hurt so bad.

Yes, that would displease me immensely.

[spifi]

Word is that Wall was interested in UNC all along, but didn't want to deal with such matters directly and let his "handler" deal with it all. His handler is his AAU coach. Roy (and many other coaches) won't deal with handlers at all, and in return most handlers "hate" coaches that won't and will say so publicly. Wall's handler has had seriously bad things to say about Roy this way.

Lately, however, Wall called Roy directly and told him he was interested. Roy apparently said he was as well, but that they'd need to talk more after the tournament. This is presumably because he was busy, but also because Roy has no scholarships for next year unless somebody leaves early. That was basically a given at the time, but Roy can't be going around SAYING that, either. Roy has said he'll be off "recruiting" as early as Wednesday of this week, though. But I'd bet that won't involve any airplane trips.

My gut says Ellington and Lawson leave early, but nobody else from UNC does. The door will be open for Wall to come to UNC if he wants to talk to Roy directly and go against his AAU coach. But he'll also have to be willing to submit to a bit more of a regime than his handler has indicated in most of what *he* has said, but that guy sounds a little like a lunatic to me. Based on what he's said there's no way Wall would fit in at Duke, either. I think Wall is a little more "normal" than his handler would indicate, and if that's the case, he could very well end up at UNC. And if so and assuming Ed and Deon stay (and that seems likely to me), UNC is a championship contender again. Chemistry and experience will be the big issues to deal with, but talent won't be.

[_Gary]

The word on the street is that Williams is now starting to recruit John Wall to UNC.

Good Lord, please don't let this happen! Honestly, I just can't take this crap any more. If this kid goes to UNC Duke might as well just be content with being #2 in the ACC for a very long time to come. Yes, we have some fantastic recruits coming in, but I just don't think it will be enough to overcome this stockpiling of talent down the road. Williams has yet to have to deal with NOT having a preimere player at every position.

If Wall ends up over there it will demonstrate to me that Roy can take anyone he wants, and we will play second fiddle to him for many years to come. I don't see any silver linings in this potential scenario of Wall to UNC. Nothing good can come of this for us.

[bluebear]

Good Lord, please don't let this happen! Honestly, I just can't take this crap any more. If this kid goes to UNC Duke might as well just be content with being #2 in the ACC for a very long time to come. Yes, we have some fantastic recruits coming in, but I just don't think it will be enough to overcome this stockpiling of talent down the road. Williams has yet to have to deal with NOT having a preimere player at every position.

If Wall ends up over there it will demonstrate to me that Roy can take anyone he wants, and we will play second fiddle to him for many years to come. I don't see any silver linings in this potential scenario of Wall to UNC. Nothing good can come of this for us.

No silver lining and obviously this would be bad but... UNC would have a very young team next year assuming everyone leaves who is expected to leave. They will have a lot of talent and could make a run but with their youth, they are not nearly as scary as this year. If G stays, I'd take Duke..If G leaves, UNC has the edge..but then in one year, Wall is gone..Davis is gone (if not now). We bring in a talented class in '10 and are right back with them. Wall is a one year addition as a frosh PG..I don't think he puts them over the top given the youth of their remaining talent.

[Kewlswim]

Good Lord, please don't let this happen! Honestly, I just can't take this crap any more. If this kid goes to UNC Duke might as well just be content with being #2 in the ACC for a very long time to come. Yes, we have some fantastic recruits coming in, but I just don't think it will be enough to overcome this stockpiling of talent down the road. Williams has yet to have to deal with NOT having a preimere player at every position.

If Wall ends up over there it will demonstrate to me that Roy can take anyone he wants, and we will play second fiddle to him for many years to come. I don't see any silver linings in this potential scenario of Wall to UNC. Nothing good can come of this for us.

Hi,

17-18-19 year old kids are hard to predict. The key is to recruit many players because one never knows what will happen. UNC may indeed get Wall, but it appears it has nothing to do with our lack of trying to get him. What else would you like the program do? Who is to say that Wall isn't a better fit for UNC than Duke? It hurts to have the rival pick him up, I agree with you there.

However, I think you are also selling Coach K a bit short. This man is incredibly competitive, he is not just going to sit by as his program goes down the tubes or plays second fiddle to anyone.

Every action has consequences. Coach K felt that representing his country and bringing back the gold was his duty and he put his whole being into it. I believe he spread himself a bit thin. The result is that Duke, whether he wants to admit it or not, suffered. Well, Coach K is back and badder than ever. :D I can't wait for next season!

GO DUKE!!

[Kewlswim]

Hi,

I think everyone should go on the premise that John Wall is a one and done player. Yet, I don't know if that is John Wall talking or his handlers. A year in college where those people are not as influential, well maybe another year becomes a possibility.

How does this sound as a yucky scenario: John goes to UNC and likes it, kicks his handlers to the curb, and stays two or three years leading the Holes to another couple of championships. As long as we are thinking gloom, doom, end of the world scenarios--there you have one. Furthermore, John goes on to say that he was within a whisker of matriculating at Duke, but was convinced that English Comp would be too hard at Duke and decided to go elsewhere. How did he know about English Comp? While taking a tour of UNC an instructor surreptitiously (how else do they do things at the Evil Empire?) showed him samples of the writing quality that would be expected of him at Duke. ugh ugh ugh

GO DUKE! GTHC!

[watzone]

Before some of you turn this thread into another emotional meltdown, please think about waiting to jump off cliffs and let recruiting play out. If and when you hear so and so to this school, then you can start to freak out. Until then, let's not speculate on every individual drop of sweat or comment at so and so's board. UNC won the title last night, but they haven't won all the recruiting battles just yet. And enough of the race and class garbage. It's getting hard to read through this thread and find facts, but there is plenty of doom and gloom moving in. It would be nice to see Duke fans represented without all the defeatist attitudes which comes from what another team did on the court. Folks, Duke still has the most wins in this decade and the last time I checked, our staff is working it hard. Give this UNC beat us and Michigan State thing a rest until emotions are in check.

[CameronBornAndBred]

I wonder what the N&O's Giglio will write about Roy's recruitment of Wall. He called K's recruitment of him "a desperate act".

[rotogod00]

rivals article from yesterday (my apologies if it was posted previously)

http://basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=932823

[jjasper0729]

I'm really worried about the last line (his quote about really looking at North Carolina)...

[rotogod00]

I'm really worried about the last line (his quote about really looking at North Carolina)...

yeah, that one kinda stood out for me too :(

[SupaDave]

I wonder what the N&O's Giglio will write about Roy's recruitment of Wall. He called K's recruitment of him "a desperate act".

Good call but something tells me it wont be a "desperate act"...

[JG Nothing]

I wonder what the N&O's Giglio will write about Roy's recruitment of Wall. He called K's recruitment of him "a desperate act".

Giglio (April 3):
"Roy Williams' decision to call John Wall is not only a desperate move but the epitome of the eternal "Can you top this?" contest between Duke and Carolina I referenced in Duke's pursuit of Wall last week."

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/accnow/desperate-act-by-unc

People on this board were quick to point out Giglio's criticism of Duke as desperate for recruiting Wall. I wonder why, in five days, no one has mentioned that Giglio called carolina desperate as well. (I suppose that would not contribute to the everyone hates Duke persecution complex that seems to permeate this bulletin board.)

[SupaDave]

I'm really worried about the last line (his quote about really looking at North Carolina)...

I wouldn't. He's from the area, I'm sure he's seen a LOT of UNC. Just wants to hear Ol' Roy's spill...

[BlueinBlo]

I think it is safe to say that if he gets an offer that matches Duke's offer he is going to UNC. If Wall goes there and G leaves, power is back at UNC. This sucks!!!

[jv001]

Everyone is anointing Wall as a program changer and leading them to the FF and even a championship. Well he did not do it for his high school team. As the nations best point guard you would think he would be able to do so. And as someone else pointed out, unc will be young next year. With an even younger point guard it seems to me that reaching such a high level of play would be harder than say at Duke where he would be surrounded by more experienced players. )Especially if Gerald stays). I trust Coach K and I believe he will do what's necessary to get Duke back to FF days. Anyway this is Master's week. It's golf season. Go Duke!

[Maxwell1977]

I think it is safe to say that if he gets an offer that matches Duke's offer he is going to UNC. If Wall goes there and G leaves, power is back at UNC. This sucks!!!

Offer? Are you implying something under the table?

[Ian]

When did the Duke fanbase acquire so many chicken littles?

It's one thing to realistically assess the strengths and weaknesses of the program, it's another to run around screaming "we're dooooooomed" at every drop of the hat.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Giglio (April 3):
"Roy Williams' decision to call John Wall is not only a desperate move but the epitome of the eternal "Can you top this?" contest between Duke and Carolina I referenced in Duke's pursuit of Wall last week."

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/accnow/desperate-act-by-unc

People on this board were quick to point out Giglio's criticism of Duke as desperate for recruiting Wall. I wonder why, in five days, no one has mentioned that Giglio called carolina desperate as well. (I suppose that would not contribute to the everyone hates Duke persecution complex that seems to permeate this bulletin board.)
Thanks for the update. I hadn't mentioned it because I hadn't read it. (I only visit the Duke section of the N&O :D)

[Kedsy]

It's getting hard to read through this thread and find facts, but there is plenty of doom and gloom moving in.

Thanks, Watzone, for your rational words. Frankly, I would modify your statement to say "it's getting hard to read through this thread." Period.

I feel good about next year. I feel good about the year after that. I'd love to get Wall but don't think the world will end if we don't. I don't give a d*mn about Carolina.

[RepoMan]

When did the Duke fanbase acquire so many chicken littles?

It's one thing to realistically assess the strengths and weaknesses of the program, it's another to run around screaming "we're dooooooomed" at every drop of the hat.

Amen brother.

[rotogod00]

When did the Duke fanbase acquire so many chicken littles?

It's one thing to realistically assess the strengths and weaknesses of the program, it's another to run around screaming "we're dooooooomed" at every drop of the hat.

yes, but do people really see and understand the weaknesses of the program. i think some people do, but others appear to look at things with such rose-colored glasses.

[mph]

You could create a derivatives market with the amount of trouble people are borrowing in this thread.

[jjasper0729]

Giglio (April 3):
"Roy Williams' decision to call John Wall is not only a desperate move but the epitome of the eternal "Can you top this?" contest between Duke and Carolina I referenced in Duke's pursuit of Wall last week."

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/accnow/desperate-act-by-unc

People on this board were quick to point out Giglio's criticism of Duke as desperate for recruiting Wall. I wonder why, in five days, no one has mentioned that Giglio called carolina desperate as well. (I suppose that would not contribute to the everyone hates Duke persecution complex that seems to permeate this bulletin board.)

maybe it's because there wasn't a headline saying it was a "desperate act"

[Icarus09]

Well he did not do it for his high school team. As the nations best point guard you would think he would be able to do so.

This is faulty logic. While I agree that Wall does not immediately equal final four he is still a very good player capable of changing teams. Word of God lost at the buzzer in the championship despite a great game (at least stat-wise) by Wall. If we follow the logic above, we should only recruit high schoolers on championship teams. High school success (especially HS championships) does not necessarily translate into college success. A great player can still play for an average team and many great teams do not make it to championships.

[billybean]

http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2009/04/04/4105901.htm

click Skip Welcome screen (top right) after clicking the link above

[jv001]

This is faulty logic. While I agree that Wall does not immediately equal final four he is still a very good player capable of changing teams. Word of God lost at the buzzer in the championship despite a great game (at least stat-wise) by Wall. If we follow the logic above, we should only recruit high schoolers on championship teams. High school success (especially HS championships) does not necessarily translate into college success. A great player can still play for an average team and many great teams do not make it to championships.

I have not seen Wall play in person this year. However those that have tell me he has the qualities to be one of the best to play that position. Those same people are worried about how he plays the game. He at times plays out of control and needs work on his outside shot. From what I've heard him say about the schools he is considering he has made a point he wants to play for a coach that will let him play his game. I cannot imagine a freshmen point guard playing out of control for Coach K and not being set down to get his head in the game. Duke will not go down the tubes if we do not get him. It could be it's not meant to be. Go Duke!

[_Gary]

Before some of you turn this thread into another emotional meltdown, please think about waiting to jump off cliffs and let recruiting play out.

Watzone, I appreciate the call for calmer emotions. I know I'm on pins and needles because I do sincerely believe that Wall to Duke makes us huge contenders for a title, and I also believe that Wall to UNC is a devastating blow no matter how it's spun. So to me the stakes are as high right now as they have been for many, many years as far as Duke/UNC recruiting. No, Duke won't go in the crapper if we don't land this kid. I'm not suggesting otherwise. But I'm also not Pollyanna enough to blow it off if we do lose him (especially to UNC) and act like it's not a huge deal.

[BlueintheFace]

When did the Duke fanbase acquire so many chicken littles?

It's one thing to realistically assess the strengths and weaknesses of the program, it's another to run around screaming "we're dooooooomed" at every drop of the hat.

When the clouds cleared to reveal a BRIGHT Baby Blue sky

[G man]

The big issue is not if we get wall, but happens if we do not get Wall and Bledsoe? What type of team will we be? Are we going to have to play slower half court ball? What do we do if the worst comes to pass?

[dgoore97]

http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2009/04/04/4105901.htm

click Skip Welcome screen (top right) after clicking the link above

he's just calling John Wall "to check in and see how he's doing"... i am sure he does this with all HS players, not just No 1. PGs...

[Classof06]

yes, but do people really see and understand the weaknesses of the program. i think some people do, but others appear to look at things with such rose-colored glasses.

Or Duke-blue colored glasses haha. I'll co-sign this.

While I believe Duke is still a darn good program, there's nobody on this board that is going to convince me we're currently getting the caliber of recruits that we have in the past.

And if you truly believe that we are (and I know some of you on here do), then you need to take those glasses off.

[MChambers]

he's just calling John Wall "to check in and see how he's doing"... i am sure he does this with all HS players, not just No 1. PGs...

somebody said earlier this is a quiet period. Was it a quiet period when Ol' Roy called? If so, it can't be enough to simply say that it wasn't a recruiting call, just like when Bill Self "accidentally" ran into Wall.

[rotogod00]

Or Duke-blue colored glasses haha. I'll co-sign this.

While I believe Duke is still a darn good program, there's nobody on this board that is going to convince me we're currently getting the caliber of recruits that we have in the past.

And if you truly believe that we are (and I know some of you on here do), then you need to take those glasses off.

i agree with you, obviously since you quoted my post. but one point i differ with you slightly on. we do still get great recruits, but not at the positions we need. we're terrific at getting top 2s, wing players, and face-up big men. where we have been lacking though is getting that great point guard, one that can just break down the defense any time we need him to. and of course, a banger down low would be nice too.

[Boston Dukie]

I think Wall is one of the 3 most important recruits in the K area

1) Johnny Dawkins - launched the program back to glory and the national stage and ushered in other top recruits to do the same for a long stretch

2) Elton Brand - after coach K's back problem and some lean years, he was the top guy in highschool, brought in Battier with him (Shane Called Elton), made Duke cool again, brought some toughness and ushered in other top recruits for a long stretch

3) John Wall - would be first elite recruit since program stumbled (both on the court and with recruiting and early entry), would make the team a favorite for the NC (if Henderson stays), make Duke cool again, and usher in other top recruits for a long stretch

Btw, if Henderson does leave, he needs to do well in the NBA. Boozer and Duhon did great and exceeded expectations, but the Jay Will injury hurt, and JJ and Shelden and Mcroberts have reinforced the notion that Duke doesn't groom great NBA players. If Henderson stayed 1 more year, I am convinced he would be a great NBA player sooner rather than later (if ever)

Also - it doesn't matter how many regular season games Duke has won this decade or even ACC titles. The NCAA tournament is what matters, and since 2004 it has been very poor for Duke if you factor in their seed. They should have been at least to the sweet 16 (actually much farther) all these years, and consistently under performed

Last - now is the time (in the recruitment of Wall) when Johnny Dawkins will be really missed

[_Gary]

I think Wall is one of the 3 most important recruits in the K area

1) Johnny Dawkins - launched the program back to glory and the national stage and ushered in other top recruits to do the same for a long stretch

2) Elton Brand - after coach K's back problem and some lean years, he was the top guy in highschool, brought in Battier with him (Shane Called Elton), made Duke cool again, brought some toughness and ushered in other top recruits for a long stretch

3) John Wall - would be first elite recruit since program stumbled (both on the court and with recruiting and early entry), would make the team a favorite for the NC (if Henderson stays), make Duke cool again, and usher in other top recruits for a long stretch

Btw, if Henderson does leave, he needs to do well in the NBA. Boozer and Duhon did great and exceeded expectations, but the Jay Will injury hurt, and JJ and Shelden and Mcroberts have reinforced the notion that Duke doesn't groom great NBA players. If Henderson stayed 1 more year, I am convinced he would be a great NBA player sooner rather than later (if ever)

Also - it doesn't matter how many regular season games Duke has won this decade or even ACC titles. The NCAA tournament is what matters, and since 2004 it has been very poor for Duke if you factor in their seed. They should have been at least to the sweet 16 (actually much farther) all these years, and consistently under performed

Last - now is the time (in the recruitment of Wall) when Johnny Dawkins will be really missed

I agree with this post entirely. When talking about the program overall since K I'm not sure there can be much disagreement with the Dawkins signing and the Elton signing. I believe if we land Wall he will indeed be the 3rd most important when we factor in the "timing" of it for the program and the fact that an overwhelming need is filled. Well said, Boston Dukie.

[roywhite]

I agree with this post entirely. When talking about the program overall since K I'm not sure there can be much disagreement with the Dawkins signing and the Elton signing. I believe if we land Wall he will indeed be the 3rd most important when we factor in the "timing" of it for the program and the fact that an overwhelming need is filled. Well said, Boston Dukie.

I'll be happy if John Wall decides to come to Duke.

But 3rd most important recruit in the K era??

Certainly not more important than:
Danny Ferry---the nationally prized recruit whose signing meant the Dawkins/Alarie group was not a one-shot deal
Grant Hill---a true superstar who put us over the top to win 2 national championships and single-handedly carried a team to a finger nail away from a 3rd national championship
Bobby Hurley---the all-time assist leader, a super competitor and winner.

[Duvall]

I think Wall is one of the 3 most important recruits in the K era

Okay, maybe it's time to shut the boards down again.

[slower]

I think it is safe to say that if he gets an offer that matches Duke's offer he is going to UNC. If Wall goes there and G leaves, power is back at UNC. This sucks!!!

It's ALREADY there! Not to say that it won't swing back (2010 looking very good).

[mr. synellinden]

I agree with this post entirely. When talking about the program overall since K I'm not sure there can be much disagreement with the Dawkins signing and the Elton signing. I believe if we land Wall he will indeed be the 3rd most important when we factor in the "timing" of it for the program and the fact that an overwhelming need is filled. Well said, Boston Dukie.

I don't think Elton was a bigger recruit for the Duke program than Danny Ferry and Grant Hill. Those two were the bridges that helped sustain the program's greatness following the Dawkins class. By the time we signed the Elton-Battier et al class, Duke was already the dominant program in college basketball. In Ferry's case we beat out UNC for him and in Hill's case we beat out UNC and Gtown. Imagine if UNC had signed Ferry and Hill.

On a separate note, I think losing Shaun Livingston was the biggest blow to the program of the last decade. With just two years of Livingston I beleive we would have competed for the national championship in 2005 and likely won the title in 2006. I think the last three RELATIVE down years would have been much more "tolerable" if JJ, Shelden and Livingston had led us to a title in 2006.

[_Gary]

I'll be happy if John Wall decides to come to Duke.

But 3rd most important recruit in the K era??

Certainly not more important than:
Danny Ferry---the nationally prized recruit whose signing meant the Dawkins/Alarie group was not a one-shot deal
Grant Hill---a true superstar who put us over the top to win 2 national championships and single-handedly carried a team to a finger nail away from a 3rd national championship
Bobby Hurley---the all-time assist leader, a super competitor and winner.

You do realize when Boston Dukie and I say "3rd most important" we aren't suggesting he'll break any assist records, scoring records, or lead us to 2 or more championships. We all know the kid is almost assuredly a one and done, so it's not about some of the things you mentioned. It's about where Duke is at right now and how we can see things improve drastically with this one signing. It's a huge deal because of what we've had happen to this program over the last several years. We've not made the Elite 8 for five years now. We've not had an elite point guard for at least six years now, and we've whiffed on big time recruits we badly wanted and needed for several years now.

[BlueintheFace]

I think Wall is one of the 3 most important recruits in the K area

1) Johnny Dawkins - launched the program back to glory and the national stage and ushered in other top recruits to do the same for a long stretch

2) Elton Brand - after coach K's back problem and some lean years, he was the top guy in highschool, brought in Battier with him (Shane Called Elton), made Duke cool again, brought some toughness and ushered in other top recruits for a long stretch

3) John Wall - would be first elite recruit since program stumbled (both on the court and with recruiting and early entry), would make the team a favorite for the NC (if Henderson stays), make Duke cool again, and usher in other top recruits for a long stretch

Btw, if Henderson does leave, he needs to do well in the NBA. Boozer and Duhon did great and exceeded expectations, but the Jay Will injury hurt, and JJ and Shelden and Mcroberts have reinforced the notion that Duke doesn't groom great NBA players. If Henderson stayed 1 more year, I am convinced he would be a great NBA player sooner rather than later (if ever)

Also - it doesn't matter how many regular season games Duke has won this decade or even ACC titles. The NCAA tournament is what matters, and since 2004 it has been very poor for Duke if you factor in their seed. They should have been at least to the sweet 16 (actually much farther) all these years, and consistently under performed

Last - now is the time (in the recruitment of Wall) when Johnny Dawkins will be really missed

How can you possibly measure how important a recruit is until after he has left? Seriously?

[Kedsy]

I agree with this post entirely. When talking about the program overall since K I'm not sure there can be much disagreement with the Dawkins signing and the Elton signing. I believe if we land Wall he will indeed be the 3rd most important when we factor in the "timing" of it for the program and the fact that an overwhelming need is filled. Well said, Boston Dukie.

Well, I disagree. But whether or not signing Wall would be great for Duke (it would), I think it's a mistake to get so worked up over something that has by all accounts less than a 50/50 chance of happening (probably much less).

Duke's in the running, which is saying something if you consider the history of the Wall recruiting saga, but we're not the favorite. If you place so much importance on this, you're just setting yourself up for years of therapy.

And, by the way, if one of them "brought in" the other, it was Battier who brought in Brand -- the story is that Shane called Elton to lobby him the minute he (Shane) decided he would attend Duke. One could argue, therefore, that Battier was a more important recruit than Brand, and certainly more important than Wall. I think Jason Williams was a pretty important recruit as well. John Wall's supposed to be a great player, but to say he's more important than Battier or Jason Williams or Shelden Williams or any of a dozen other great Duke recruits over the years, seems kind of silly to me.

[_Gary]

I still think what BD was saying is that we are at a critical time in the history of the K era. That's what makes this such an important recruiting battle. It's not that he's going to be better than Danny or Grant or Bobby or Jason, etc. The point is we needed Johnny as that first elite recruit to get the ball rolling. Then after we were down again we got Elton, who was a different type player than the kind we had been getting previously (a back to the basket monster). Now we've seen another let down (by Duke standards) and this kid can really turn things around for the program. So he's very important in this sense of the timing of things for the program overall.

[blueduke59]

3rd most important recruit in the K era

Christian Laettner with his 2 titles and 4 Final Fours says hi

[_Gary]

And, by the way, if one of them "brought in" the other, it was Battier who brought in Brand -- the story is that Shane called Elton to lobby him the minute he (Shane) decided he would attend Duke.

Yep, that's correct. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise. I knew Shane's role in helping to bring Elton in.

[BobbyFan]

2) Elton Brand - after coach K's back problem and some lean years, he was the top guy in highschool, brought in Battier with him (Shane Called Elton), made Duke cool again, brought some toughness and ushered in other top recruits for a long stretch.

Perhaps this statement can be made in retrospect. But at the time, Elton wasn't the #1 prospect. He was earlier around #10 and then jumped to the top 5 in the final rankings. But IIRC, McGrady, Odom, and Baron Davis were generally considered the top players.

[_Gary]

I just remember the day that Elton said he was coming Dick Vitale was on the radio (along with another college bb expert) talking about how Brand's signing would make this a huge class for Duke and that Elton's style of play would bring something new to the Blue Devils as far as his back to the basket play. I do believe he was special in that sense, and I wish he would have stayed at least one more year. As much as I've loved other Duke 5's, Elton will always be the best of the bunch in my book (just based on the skills he brought). It was a thing of beauty to see the ball passed into the post and watch him go to work.

[mph]

Perhaps this statement can be made in retrospect. But at the time, Elton wasn't the #1 prospect. He was earlier around #10 and then jumped to the top 5 in the final rankings. But IIRC, McGrady, Odom, and Baron Davis were generally considered the top players.

I think Brand, Battier, and Burgess were all ranked #1 by at least one recruiting service. I'm not sure about the timing of their ranking.

[mgtr]

I worry about a lot of the posts that I read hear. It seems that some people would just about rather have UNC fail than Duke succeed. Personally, I am optimistic about next year's team, regardless of what additional we may get. I throw my lot in with Coach K, and am willing to back him all the way.
Next year we will (probably) still have our three-legged stool, Smith will be healthy all year, Zoubek will have a healthy summer to practice, we will still have Thomas, Williams will hopefully have the typical frosh to soph gains, and we should get some useful time out of Plumlee1-Plumlee2-Ryan. Sounds like another 30 win season to me. What does UNC do? I don't care.
Go Duke!!!!

[slower]

I worry about a lot of the posts that I read hear. It seems that some people would just about rather have UNC fail than Duke succeed.

and is quite common where heated rivalries exist. You can also find parallels throughout history and literature. Nothing uncommon about it, really. Just human nature.

[NSDukeFan]

I still think what BD was saying is that we are at a critical time in the history of the K era. That's what makes this such an important recruiting battle. It's not that he's going to be better than Danny or Grant or Bobby or Jason, etc. The point is we needed Johnny as that first elite recruit to get the ball rolling. Then after we were down again we got Elton, who was a different type player than the kind we had been getting previously (a back to the basket monster). Now we've seen another let down (by Duke standards) and this kid can really turn things around for the program. So he's very important in this sense of the timing of things for the program overall.

I am quite enjoying this letdown where we had a 30 win season and ACC championship this season; have 2 McD's AAs next year added to a veteran lineup; Seth Curry (leading freshman scorer in the country), Andre Dawkins and Josh Hairston (2 top 30 recruits at worst) and Tyler Thornton (solid PG recruit) with the chance at another great recruit in 2010.

We are looking good the next couple of years with or without Wall and G, though I would love to have either or both, G especially.

[slower]

this level of angst has almost EVERYTHING to do with the recent relative success of our ugly blue neighbors.

Standalone, we're doing okay and looking like we'll do even better in the next several years.

[Ian]

We are looking good the next couple of years with or without Wall and G, though I would love to have either or both, G especially.

Honestly from reading this thread I get the feeling that if put up a poll asking people they can have either G back for his senior year or get John Wall for a year, but not both, about 80% would rather get Wall for a year.

I think that's kind of sad.

[bass-piscator]

"Christian Laettner with his 2 titles and 4 Final Fours says hi"

Great response.

Sometimes I think this board is like a wine forum. Never satisfied with a truly excellent bottle. Always wanting more. The master of the vineyard doesn't select the best grapes. The winemaster doesn't take those fruits and blend them to make the finest wine. And like pompous arses we raise our glasses and discuss what could have been instead of enjoying the moment. The vineyard down the road made our wine taste like vinegar. Alas!

Great year. Looking forward to next. Go Duke! Go Siena!

BTW, the fans at IC couldn't even spell Siena correctly.... repeatedly.

[Kedsy]

I still think what BD was saying is that we are at a critical time in the history of the K era. That's what makes this such an important recruiting battle. It's not that he's going to be better than Danny or Grant or Bobby or Jason, etc. The point is we needed Johnny as that first elite recruit to get the ball rolling. Then after we were down again we got Elton, who was a different type player than the kind we had been getting previously (a back to the basket monster). Now we've seen another let down (by Duke standards) and this kid can really turn things around for the program. So he's very important in this sense of the timing of things for the program overall.

I understand what you're saying, and I agree to an extent. There is a perception that Duke is down and can no longer bring in the great point guards or back-to-the-basket centers. To the extent that any recruit refutes that myth and leads other recruits to consider Duke that may not have considered us otherwise, that recruit is obviously important.

My differences with you in this particular discussion are twofold: first, even with the above explanation, I think we've had a lot more than three recruits who were more important than a known one-and-done; and second I'm not sure if the perception is more in our fans' minds than it is in the recruits' minds. If it's the former (which is what I suspect), then that lessens Wall's importance.

Obviously I don't have personal information about this, but it doesn't seem all that credible to me that top wing guards and face-the-basket big men think Duke is "cool" but point guards and back-to-the-basket centers don't think so. And even if it were true, how much will getting one guy change so many minds? Anyway, that's why I said I disagreed, not because I didn't understand your point or thought your basic premise was flawed.

In any event, I totally agree with you that getting John Wall would be a fabulous coup for the program.

[Boston Dukie]

I still think what BD was saying is that we are at a critical time in the history of the K era. That's what makes this such an important recruiting battle. It's not that he's going to be better than Danny or Grant or Bobby or Jason, etc. The point is we needed Johnny as that first elite recruit to get the ball rolling. Then after we were down again we got Elton, who was a different type player than the kind we had been getting previously (a back to the basket monster). Now we've seen another let down (by Duke standards) and this kid can really turn things around for the program. So he's very important in this sense of the timing of things for the program overall.

Yes Gary, this is exactly what I meant. Getting the #1 prospect after joining the party late, when everyone was saying Duke is down, K can't get the top guys anymore, etc. all while dramatically increasing Duke's chances to win an NC and increase its coolness factor would create huge momentum for Duke and shut up all the pundits instantly.

Whether Wall would have the on court impact of Ferry, Hill, Laettner, or Jwill is crazy to think, but there is a lot more at stake here. The flood gates would re-open and things would 180 in an instance.

Things are fine if Duke doesn't get Wall, but getting him would be huge for the next 5-7 years (creating the third coach K phase of glory).

Btw, someone mentioned that it was Battier who recruited Brand (sorry if I had that backward), if so than I think Brand/Battier as a pair would be the 2nd most important recruit(s).

[geraldsneighbor]

Yes Gary, this is exactly what I meant. Getting the #1 prospect after joining the party late, when everyone was saying Duke is down, K can't get the top guys anymore, etc. all while dramatically increasing Duke's chances to win an NC and increase its coolness factor would create huge momentum for Duke and shut up all the pundits instantly.

Whether Wall would have the on court impact of Ferry, Hill, Laettner, or Jwill is crazy to think, but there is a lot more at stake here. The flood gates would re-open and things would 180 in an instance.

Things are fine if Duke doesn't get Wall, but getting him would be huge for the next 5-7 years (creating the third coach K phase of glory).

Btw, someone mentioned that it was Battier who recruited Brand (sorry if I had that backward), if so than I think Brand/Battier as a pair would be the 2nd most important recruit(s).


I agree. We need a PG though. Wall is a PG and is very talented. I think as fans we saw the importance of having a dominant PG who the position comes naturally to. While Jon performed well, he is a 2-guard and we need him there. Landing a PG would help immensely for this team.

I want G over Wall but that is just me. I love G obviously and want him back because we need him to be successful. Hopefully a PG comes with him back to Durham.

[turnandburn55]

this level of angst has almost EVERYTHING to do with the recent relative success of our ugly blue neighbors.

Standalone, we're doing okay and looking like we'll do even better in the next several years.

Disagree. 2 Final Fours in this decade (and none in the last 5 years) is what's making us feel anxious. 30 win seasons and Sweet 16 appearances are fine, but at some point, we're all getting anxious to returning to being the big dog. UNC's success only underscores that point.

[DUKIE V(A)]

Winning National Championships these days is not about one important recruit...it is about getting a series of excellent recruits and being fortunate enough to have the stars align (pun intended) to keep them together long enough to take advantage...I hope we get Wall, Bledsoe, or one or more of the guys that are potentially floating out there with all the coaching changes and possible sanctions against UCONN. I am sure Coach K and our staff will do their best to get the guy or guys they think we need. (VA Preps is reporting Deshawn Painter is no longer going to Florida by the way.) More importantly, I hope G stays. Lots can happen and things are unpredictable for those of us (like me) who follow college hoops closely but are not in the know. Who would have thought Carolina would stay in tact this time last year? I certainly didn't.

UNC doesn't win this year without all their players coming back...Even if they lost Green (who was probably the least important of the returning players), I am not sure they win the ACC regular season (at least not outright). They had many pieces and as much as it pains me to admit, they earned the title. The proved to be the best this season. A series of excellent recruits, who played well together and stayed together against the odds.

2001 -- Battier, Booz, JWill, Mikie D, Duhon, (Fifth-year) Natedog, etc. We, like Carolina, likely don't win the title without all those pieces...We, like them, are fortunate to have had all these guys around to get this done as many of these guys could have gone and played in the NBA earlier.

1992 Laettner, Hurley, G Money, THill, Parks, Lang, BD, Clark, etc.
1991 Laett, Hurley, G Money, THill, Lang, McCaffrey, BD, Lang, Koubek, etc.

All of these teams were extremely balanced, experienced, and fortunate to have all their players around. Interestingly, they all overcame injuries to key players at various points in the season to win the title.

To me, the biggest losses for Duke were Deng and Livingston and Humphries. I know Mikie D, Avery, and to a lesser extent Maggette were surpise departures as well, but the unexpected nature of the Deng's departure and not getting either Livingston and Humphries cost us a great opportunity or two. Those are the breaks in major college hoops I guess.

I am happy with what Duke is doing (though I am always disappointed when the season ends earlier than we all would hope). We have a lot of great players coming in to add to a talented roster. If G stays, I'll take my chances with our team against anyone. If he leaves, we will still be very good and hopefully will respond like the 2000 team did. Perhaps Singler will respond like Battier did and stay for his senior year (even when there will be a huge pull for him to go to the NBA). For National Championship dreams, this is the type of thing that needs to happen whether or not we get the Carmelo Anthony's or Wall's of the world.

[slower]

Disagree. 2 Final Fours in this decade (and none in the last 5 years) is what's making us feel anxious. 30 win seasons and Sweet 16 appearances are fine, but at some point, we're all getting anxious to returning to being the big dog. UNC's success only underscores that point.

that UNC's current level of success is what has driven the current mood from discontent to near-hysteria. An angst turbocharger, if you will.

[Duke76]

I think we would have won another championship. That one hurt just as much as losing Deng or Cory. Actually i think we would have 2 or 4 more had all those guys not left

[DDB4208]

As many of you know John Wall was contacted by Roy Williams before the Final Four and Brain Clifton (JW's AAU Coach) said to the News and Observer, "I have no desire to talk to, to be involved with, to visit, to contemplate in any shape, form or fashion John Wall going to play for Roy Williams. Zero." John Wall also said "It wasn't anything major, he just called to check in, see how I was doing, what was going on. It's nothing big. North Carolina is not recruiting me right now." But now I have seen on multiple forums and websites that say that John will heavily consider UNC if they do recruit him because it is as he said "my decision". This is bad news for us because we are now no longer have a leg up on every other school in terms of closeness to home. Plus UNC just won a championship, so I would not be surprised at all if John goes to UNC (The last sentence was MY opinion only I have no sources to back it up).

This site has updates on J-Walls recruitment:

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/category/tags/John-Wall

[DDB4208]

Has anyone seen He Got Game with Ray Allen (Great movie)? Because this is starting to seem a lot like it.

[moonpie23]

As many of you know John Wall was contacted by Roy Williams before the Final Four and Brain Clifton (JW's AAU Coach) said to the News and Observer, "I have no desire to talk to, to be involved with, to visit, to contemplate in any shape, form or fashion John Wall going to play for Roy Williams. Zero." John Wall also said "It wasn't anything major, he just called to check in, see how I was doing, what was going on. It's nothing big. North Carolina is not recruiting me right now." But now I have seen on multiple forums and websites that say that John will heavily consider UNC if they do recruit him because it is as he said "my decision". This is bad news for us because we are now no longer have a leg up on every other school in terms of closeness to home. Plus UNC just won a championship, so I would not be surprised at all if John goes to UNC (The last sentence was MY opinion only I have no sources to back it up).

This site has updates on J-Walls recruitment:

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/category/tags/John-Wall


Great....at least we're pretty sure that we've got someone ix-naying the holes on a regular basis with John..


let's all envision this.....

introducing John in CIS to a DEAFENING CRESCENDO OF CHEERS on opening night........


(the wine and cheese crowd would be out getting a pinot grigio at the snack bar and would miss it) :)

[sagegrouse]

I think we would have won another championship. That one hurt just as much as losing Deng or Cory. Actually i think we would have 2 or 4 more had all those guys not left


WRT to Ed McCaffrey's little brother Billy (Ed has Duke connections through his marriage to the daughter of Duke Olympian and world record holder Dave Sime), you are saying that with Billy McCaffrey still in Duke blue, we would have won the 1993 tournament (where we lost in the 2nd round to Cal). Since we won the 1992 tournament without Billy, I am hard-pressed to see how he would have helped us that much in 1993.

WRT losing Deng or Maggette, I tend to think that if Luol had stayed at least three years, we would have returned to the FF and perhaps won a championship. But that's the world we live in. Top players were leaving from the competitors as well (Okafor, e.g.) plus the trio (Big, Little and Crazy) that brought the championship to the Heels in 2005. Thus, I don't think "other things equal" (ceteris paribus) is a realistic assumption.

sagegrouse
'The "of" in the message title should be "or"'

[gep]

I agree. We need a PG though. Wall is a PG and is very talented. I think as fans we saw the importance of having a dominant PG who the position comes naturally to. While Jon performed well, he is a 2-guard and we need him there. Landing a PG would help immensely for this team.

I don't know anything about Wall except for what I read here on DBR. First, it appears very likely that Wall is a one-and-done player. Totally speculating here... maybe, as a one-and-done, he's not the "typical" Duke student-athlete, especially if his "performance" with Duke is more important personally than the team. Then, if he *is* the PG that Duke *really* needs and leads Duke to the FF or NC, what happens the next year when he leaves? Is Duke back in the "need a really good PG to go far" situation again? Or is the successful recruitment of Wall the "feather in the cap" of Duke, which by perception, is more important than building for the future... just 1/2 cent thoughts...:rolleyes:

[ice-9]

I strongly disagree with the idea that Wall could be the third most important recruit in Duke history. In fact, I think it's kinda rubbish. One recruit does not make Duke basketball.

Even if Wall turns us down, what if we get Brandon Knight? Or Harrison Barnes? Eric Bledsoe? Irving? Not to mention the 5-star recruits we already have on board.

The PG position is the toughest to adjust to going from one level to the next. While Wall is an undeniable talent, it's just not that clear what his impact to Duke will be should he enroll.

Even if Wall ends up at UNC, it's hardly the end of the universe. Remember that just a few years ago we had UNC's momentum; all it took was a few players who did not meet expectations (Hansbrough and Lawson to exceed; McRoberts, Paulus, Livingston to fall short) to reverse that momentum.

Recruiting is such an inexact science, you just never know when that pendulum will swing again. To say that Wall will definitively be that turning point is...it's just too much.

[hokieDEVIL83]

http://prepinsiders.blogspot.com/2009/04/memphis-still-in-wall-chase.html

Basically the article is arguing that Memphis is still in the mix due to the new coach's "friendship" with Wall's mentor/handler. He was also the "point person" when Calapari was recruiting Wall at Memphis.

The article goes on to mention Wall's Duke visit and a "very good" meeting with Coach K. It also mentions the Roy Williams call and states that Wall himself said Williams just called to see how he was doing and that UNC is not recruiting him.


Sorry if this info was already mentioned in previous post (I only read the last 30 or so ;)

[Franzez]

http://prepinsiders.blogspot.com/2009/04/memphis-still-in-wall-chase.html

Basically the article is arguing that Memphis is still in the mix due to the new coach's "friendship" with Wall's mentor/handler. He was also the "point person" when Calapari was recruiting Wall at Memphis.

The article goes on to mention Wall's Duke visit and a "very good" meeting with Coach K. It also mentions the Roy Williams call and states that Wall himself said Williams just called to see how he was doing and that UNC is not recruiting him.


Sorry if this info was already mentioned in previous post (I only read the last 30 or so ;)
No problem.

[RockyMtDevil]

Just got a text message from an UK basketball insider saying they are "very confidant" wall is following Calipari to Kentucky.

too bad.

[SupaDave]

At this point, due to this board, many of us are ready for him to decide so that we can close this thread.

[freshmanjs]

Just got a text message from an UK basketball insider saying they are "very confidant" wall is following Calipari to Kentucky.

too bad.

at this point that is a decent outcome for us.

[jv001]

At this point, due to this board, many of us are ready for him to decide so that we can close this thread.

Best post on this thread to date. Please get it over with & KY is alot better than the ugly blue. Go Duke!

[CMS2478]

Agreed.......at this point I feel he will either end up at UK or UNC. I have not seen anthing, other than a quote saying his visit went well (which all recruits say), that would lead me to believe he is going to Duke. The sooner this over the better and then we can all move on.

[KyDevilinIL]

http://www.kentucky.com/978/story/754120.html

Looks like UK suddenly has a big ol' gaping hole at point guard.

This clears both a scholarship and a position for John Wall. Methinks Calipari wouldn't have let even a maligned PG such as Porter depart without a backup plan.

[CDu]

http://www.kentucky.com/978/story/754120.html

Looks like UK suddenly has a big ol' gaping hole at point guard.

This clears both a scholarship and a position for John Wall. Methinks Calipari wouldn't have let even a maligned PG such as Porter depart without a backup plan.

Definitely lays out nicely for Calipari if Wall decides to follow him there.

[JBDuke]

Note that I have just deleted a bunch of posts speculating on the impacts NBA players have on current recruiting. The original post was destructively negative, not to mention inane. The rest were replies that had little or nothing to do with the thread and mostly called out the OP for making a ridiculous comment.

Let's try to stay on topic. Better yet, let's let this thread die down until we actually hear something from Mr. Wall.

[RelativeWays]

At this point, I just want a good solid PG, whether it's Wall, Bledsoe or whoever.

[roywhite]

http://www.usabasketball.com/news.php?news_page=09_hsum_feature_wall

An interesting piece from the usabasketball site about John Wall. The game is this Saturday 4/11 in Portland, Ore (believe it will be televised); Mason Plumlee is also on the USA roster.

Not sure about Wall's height being listed as 6'1" here; normally see 6'4". Glad to see he watched the 2008 USA Olympics team.

[Icarus09]

I've read some Florida and UK forums on Wall and it's always interesting to see that a fair amount of them think he's a Duke lean. I guess everyone has widely different perceptions.

[gotham devil]

http://www.usabasketball.com/news.php?news_page=09_hsum_feature_wall

An interesting piece from the usabasketball site about John Wall. The game is this Saturday 4/11 in Portland, Ore (believe it will be televised); Mason Plumlee is also on the USA roster.

Not sure about Wall's height being listed as 6'1" here; normally see 6'4". Glad to see he watched the 2008 USA Olympics team.

One of the interesting aspects, from a scouting perspective, of the Summit was that they have made both squads get officially measured for accurate heights and weights. If those are the official heights and weights, as measured at the Summit, Plumlee is 6'10," 210.

[Classof06]

i agree with you, obviously since you quoted my post. but one point i differ with you slightly on. we do still get great recruits, but not at the positions we need. we're terrific at getting top 2s, wing players, and face-up big men. where we have been lacking though is getting that great point guard, one that can just break down the defense any time we need him to. and of course, a banger down low would be nice too.

Yeah, we are getting good perimeter recruits, but against Villanova, it was painfully clear that Henderson (and Eliot) were the only two players capable of beating anyone off the dribble. Not only was it painfully clear, it was painful to watch. How many shots did we throw up with 4 or less on the shot-clock that night?

That's what I was getting at in regard to perimeter players. As good as Scheyer is, he's never going to be able to beat a defender off the dribble and get to the rim with regularity. When you don't have a big man to get easy baskets and you don't really have any penetrators, you're forced to rely on the 3-point shot even more than you already do...and Duke already lived and died by the 3.

[dgoore97]

I've read some Florida and UK forums on Wall and it's always interesting to see that a fair amount of them think he's a Duke lean. I guess everyone has widely different perceptions.

everyone expects and prepares themselves for the worst, so while i haven't looked at other sites, i would imagine while mostof the posts here expect he goes to UNC or UK, i bet the UK folks think he'll go to duke or unc, etc..

[robobevan]

everyone expects and prepares themselves for the worst, so while i haven't looked at other sites, i would imagine while mostof the posts here expect he goes to UNC or UK, i bet the UK folks think he'll go to duke or unc, etc..


One of the interesting aspects, from a scouting perspective, of the Summit was that they have made both squads get officially measured for accurate heights and weights. If those are the official heights and weights, as measured at the Summit, Plumlee is 6'10," 210.

i also found it interesting that Wall was very impressed with the olympic team and how well all the stars played as a team and fit into their roles. I forget. Who coached that team?

[DDB4208]

Just got a text message from an UK basketball insider saying they are "very confidant" wall is following Calipari to Kentucky.

too bad.

Yesterday John Wall told D-One Sports that he is still completely undecided. It seemed that Duke, UK and UNC were the teams he liked the most. In terms of teams he rooted for in the past he likes UNC better than Duke. He also said that Roy would call him when he was in Oregon for the Hoop Summit and Xavier Henry text him saying that Xavier decided to go to Kansas. Also John said that he really did like the Duke visit to his teammates not to some random newspaper so he actually means it.

My thoughts: Cousins just committed to UK (John and him are semi-good friends); What is in our advantage the most is that UNC and UK both just came into the picture. Even though we came in late for most recruit's standards it seems to be down to us three and I think that UNC will have a hard time getting John to commit when they only will have 21 days to recruit him (They are not recruiting him yet and the LOI Deadline is May 1, 2009). John will probably commit close to that date.

[DDB4208]

btw Daniel Orton just decommitted from UK although his Dad says he will still go there and that this is just an untrue rumor. I don't think this will affect JW's decision but who knows. And it seems that Nolan Dennis (SG) will go to UK as well, after asking for his de-commitment from Memphis.

[Greg_Newton]

Let's try to stay on topic. Better yet, let's let this thread die down until we actually hear something from Mr. Wall.

It's probably a good idea to keep in mind that 5,000+ people are checking this thread daily for news on Wall, so every new post with no update generates hundreds and hundreds of disappointed thread viewers. And that includes this post... so sorry, and I'll try to keep my mouth shut for a while!

Thanks to roywhite and DDB for the quasi-news, though... I'm as much on the edge of my seat as anyone else. Is there a link to that D-One interview?

[DDB4208]

Is there a link to that D-One interview?

Sorry I should have been more clear. I am a player in NC and while I don't know John, I know people on D-One Sports which is the AAU team that John played for.

[G man]

I've read some Florida and UK forums on Wall and it's always interesting to see that a fair amount of them think he's a Duke lean. I guess everyone has widely different perceptions.

I think it is because everyone is preparing themselves for the worst and hoping for the best. I sure hope it ends well for us

[Duvall]

It's probably a good idea to keep in mind that 5,000+ people are checking this thread daily for news on Wall,

Probably more like five people checking this thread 1000+ times a day.

[BlueintheFace]

Betcha Wall ends up at UNC

funny how expectations and hopes shift. There once was a time when nobody wanted Wall and thought of him as "dirty". Then everybody around here wanted him, but figured he would go to Memphis. Then everyone briefly had their hopes boosted when Wall said he had a good talk with K and when Calipari left Memphis. Now a lot of people seem to be just hoping that Wall doesn't go to Carolina and that Duke can at least get Bledsoe.... and the story continues

[Franzez]

Betcha Wall ends up at UNC
UNC already signed Dexter Strickland, a McDonalds AA.

[Franzez]

I'm looking at the Memphis site and they are reporting that Wall will sign with Kentucky with an official announcement coming soon.

[DDB4208]

UNC already signed Dexter Strickland, a McDonalds AA.


Relevance? They clearly are going after him.

"He (Roy) just called to check in," said Wall. "He is supposed to meet with me after the tournament. In the end this is my decision, so I'll definitely be looking at North Carolina." - John Wall

And do you have a link to the Memphis site that says that he is close to committing to UK? Thanks.

[Franzez]

Relevance? They clearly are going after him.

"He (Roy) just called to check in," said Wall. "He is supposed to meet with me after the tournament. In the end this is my decision, so I'll definitely be looking at North Carolina." - John Wall
Link?
How does UNC have another scholarship to recruit Wall & why would Strickland stick around if they do?



And do you have a link to the Memphis site that says that he is close to committing to UK? Thanks.
http://ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=363660

[CDu]

Link?
How does UNC have another scholarship to recruit Wall & why would Strickland stick around if they do?

http://ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=363660

Why would they not have another scholarship available? They are going to lose Lawson, Ellington, Hansbrough, Graves (kicked off team), Green, and Frasor. So, they'll have the following players on scholarship next year:

Davis
Thompson
Zeller
Ginyard
Drew
Strickland
McDonald
Henson
Wear
Wear
Watts

That's 11 players. Add Ellington in the unlikely scenario that he doesn't go pro, and they are at 12. That still leaves them with one space available. They'd have no problem adding Drew if they want him and he wants to go there. Not saying UNC will get him, but they do have the space to get him.

[Franzez]

Why would they not have another scholarship available? They are going to lose Lawson, Ellington, Hansbrough, Graves (kicked off team), Green, and Frasor. So, they'll have the following players on scholarship next year:

Davis
Thompson
Zeller
Ginyard
Drew
Strickland
McDonald
Henson
Wear
Wear
Watts

That's 11 players. Add Ellington in the unlikely scenario that he doesn't go pro, and they are at 12. That still leaves them with one space available. They'd have no problem adding Drew if they want him and he wants to go there. Not saying UNC will get him, but they do have the space to get him.
Ellington & Lawson don't count for the 2009 recruiting class, that has already been beaten to death by Carolina fans.

Those scholarships are added to the 2010 class where they are expecting another 4 man class.

[CDu]

Ellington & Lawson don't count for the 2009 recruiting class, that has already been beaten to death by Carolina fans.

Those scholarships are added to the 2010 class where they are expecting another 4 man class.

No offense, but what are you talking about? A team is allowed 13 scholarships in any given year. In 2009, UNC currently has 11 (or 12, if Ellington returns) committed. Thus, they have room for one or two more recruits. After 2009, they'll shed Ginyard, Thompson, and Ellington (if he returns) for sure, and Wall (if he comes).

So, for 2010, they'll have the following players:
Drew
Watts
Strickland
McDonald
Marshall
Bullock
Henson (if he stays)
Davis (if he stays)
Zeller
Wear
Wear

Again, that's only 11. So they have space for two more players. Wall is likely a one-and-done, so he'd likely be gone by 2010 anyway.

Unless both Lawson and Ellington return next year, there is basically no circumstance in which UNC doesn't have the scholarship space to land Wall.

[DDB4208]

Link?
How does UNC have another scholarship to recruit Wall & why would Strickland stick around if they do?

I don't want to come off as rude but if Roy didn't have a way to get Wall to UNC for free do you think he would recruit him?

J-Wall: "Coach after you traveled 3,000 miles to see me in Oregon and now that you guys are really recruiting me...I want to go to UNC!"

Roy: "Great! Here's the thing...you have to be a walk-on....Have a Coke while you think it over."

I think that UNC will have enough scholarships if everyone leaves but even if that doesn't happen, Roy has taken away a scholarship from a UNC player before (I think it was Frasor or Wes Miller). In terms of Strickland, a lot of people think that he will play SG. Everyone at UNC who is good plays a lot, so even a player like Wall won't eat up all the minutes. Plus Strickland absolutely loves UNC, so I guarantee he will not leave even if they get MJ to come back to school as PG.

The link that you gave was a site where you needed a password. Can you paste the info or do you need to pay to be a member of the site?

[CDu]

I don't want to come off as rude but if Roy didn't have a way to get Wall to UNC for free do you think he would recruit him?

You are correct. UNC has 11 players under scholarship for next year (assuming that Lawson and Ellington go pro as expected), and 11 players under scholarship for 2010-2011. In either case, there's plenty of room for Wall - even assuming he's not a one-and-done, and assuming neither Davis nor Henson leave after 2009-2010.

[-jk]

The link that you gave was a site where you needed a password. Can you paste the info or do you need to pay to be a member of the site?

Please don't quote from pay sites, and only quote other sites while following the posting guidines.

Regards,

-jk

[NYDukie]

I'm looking at the Memphis site and they are reporting that Wall will sign with Kentucky with an official announcement coming soon.

Hmmmm....then someone is lying (not you Franzez) as Andy Katz says on his blog that Wall is visting Miami later in the month. So much rumor and I can see this becoming even more a soap opera.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=4053508&name=katz_andy

[geraldsneighbor]

Hmmmm....then someone is lying (not you Franzez) as Andy Katz says on his blog that Wall is visting Miami later in the month. So much rumor and I can see this becoming even more a soap opera.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=4053508&name=katz_andy

Wall said he has seen all he needs to see from Miami and has enough to make a decision. AKA he ain't going.

[Exiled_Devil]

I think Wall is one of the 3 most important recruits in the K area

1) Johnny Dawkins - launched the program back to glory and the national stage and ushered in other top recruits to do the same for a long stretch

2) Elton Brand - after coach K's back problem and some lean years, he was the top guy in highschool, brought in Battier with him (Shane Called Elton), made Duke cool again, brought some toughness and ushered in other top recruits for a long stretch

3) John Wall - would be first elite recruit since program stumbled (both on the court and with recruiting and early entry), would make the team a favorite for the NC (if Henderson stays), make Duke cool again, and usher in other top recruits for a long stretch

Btw, if Henderson does leave, he needs to do well in the NBA. Boozer and Duhon did great and exceeded expectations, but the Jay Will injury hurt, and JJ and Shelden and Mcroberts have reinforced the notion that Duke doesn't groom great NBA players. If Henderson stayed 1 more year, I am convinced he would be a great NBA player sooner rather than later (if ever)

Also - it doesn't matter how many regular season games Duke has won this decade or even ACC titles. The NCAA tournament is what matters, and since 2004 it has been very poor for Duke if you factor in their seed. They should have been at least to the sweet 16 (actually much farther) all these years, and consistently under performed

Last - now is the time (in the recruitment of Wall) when Johnny Dawkins will be really missed

My thoughts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQCU36pkH7c)

You are over-emphasizing Today. Your post really shows a lack of historical insight about the recruits which people have pointed out in many ways.

As for G 'needing to well in the NBA', that is a ridiculous statement. First of all, his success in the NBA is not a a relevant reflection on the program. Secondly, you forgot Deng, Battier, Jones, Maggette, Brand. Compare our NBA players of the last 10 years to Carolina's. Duke alum are performing significantly better than UNC in recent years.

And the idea that number of games won and numbers of ACC titles won is irrelevant is ridiculous. Coach K takes pride in all of those accomplishments - why don't you? It demeans the game and the team to suggest that the NCAA tourney is the only measure of success that matters.

[DDB4208]

Please don't quote from pay sites, and only quote other sites while following the posting guidines.

Regards,

-jk

I was asking if he could paste the quote, unless of course it was a pay site. Because I think it is a free blog but I do not want to set up a free account just to see one quote.

[umdukie]

2001 DUKE TEAM
J Will, Duhon, Dunleavy, Battier and Boozer

2010 DUKE TEAM
Wall, Henderson, Scheyer, Singler and M. Plumlee

The similarities in abilities and potential are frightening.:eek:

[ice-9]

2001 DUKE TEAM
J Will, Duhon, Dunleavy, Battier and Boozer

2010 DUKE TEAM
Wall, Henderson, Scheyer, Singler and M. Plumlee

The similarities in abilities and potential are frightening.:eek:

Are you being sarcastic? That's 4 NBA starters from 2001 team, and probably 5 if J-Will was still playing.

[FireOgilvie]

Are you being sarcastic? That's 4 NBA starters from 2001 team, and probably 5 if J-Will was still playing.

I don't think it's fair to compare any possible team next year vs. the 2001 championship team, but a team of Wall, Henderson, Scheyer, Singler, and MP2 would have a lot of potential NBA talent.

Wall will undoubtedly go in the top 5 of the 2010 NBA Draft, Henderson is a lottery pick (if he comes back and plays up to his potential), Singler very well could be a late lottery pick, and MP2 has the athleticism and potential to be a top 10 pick (a 6'10-6'11" guy that runs the floor and can jump through the roof). Scheyer probably won't play in the NBA, but he's obviously very good. Coming off the bench would be athletic guys who very well could be NBA players with Nolan Smith, Elliot Williams, and Ryan Kelly. Throw in veterans Lance Thomas and Brian "Greg" Zoubek... that's a pretty formidable team.

Although I don't see that potential team materializing, it would be very good... maybe not 2001 good, but very good.

[gotham devil]

And the idea that number of games won and numbers of ACC titles won is irrelevant is ridiculous. Coach K takes pride in all of those accomplishments - why don't you? It demeans the game and the team to suggest that the NCAA tourney is the only measure of success that matters.
I don't mean to get between the two of you, but, respectfully, the NCAA has cheapened its own regular season, through tournament expansion and television saturation. It's also what heightens the excitement of the NCAA Tournament.

Some programs' fans gauge their season's success by achieving X wins or a postseason appearance, but the few elite programs' fans tend to judge their seasons, to be blunt, by postseason success.

[Franzez]

No offense, but what are you talking about? A team is allowed 13 scholarships in any given year. In 2009, UNC currently has 11 (or 12, if Ellington returns) committed. Thus, they have room for one or two more recruits. After 2009, they'll shed Ginyard, Thompson, and Ellington (if he returns) for sure, and Wall (if he comes).

So, for 2010, they'll have the following players:
Drew
Watts
Strickland
McDonald
Marshall
Bullock
Henson (if he stays)
Davis (if he stays)
Zeller
Wear
Wear

Again, that's only 11. So they have space for two more players. Wall is likely a one-and-done, so he'd likely be gone by 2010 anyway.

Unless both Lawson and Ellington return next year, there is basically no circumstance in which UNC doesn't have the scholarship space to land Wall.
Did you not see where I mentioned UNC is targeting 4 or 5 players for their 2010 class.
Bullock & Marshall are already commited but they are looking to add 2 more players for their class.

I dont think you even realize that John Wall going to UNC would make no sense after UNC has already landed Strickland and has Drew returning.

[Biscuit]

Did you not see where I mentioned UNC is targeting 4 or 5 players for their 2010 class.
Bullock & Marshall are already commited but they are looking to add 2 more players for their class.

I dont think you even realize that John Wall going to UNC would make no sense after UNC has already landed Strickland and has Drew returning.

Strickland is a combo guard, not a point guard. He's the kind of guy that can spell a PG, not run an up-tempo offense.

Wall would be seen as a 1-2 year bridge to either an experienced Drew or Kendall Marshall in one or two seasons. There's a huge hole in the UNC lineup at PG next season, and it's one that will be filled by 2011-2012 for sure and probably 2010-2011. A year from Wall, or even two years, fits perfectly. He might not go to UNC, and you can argue the character issue and one-and-done thing all day, but you can't deny that from a basketball standpoint it's a perfect fit.

[sandinmyshoes]

Did you not see where I mentioned UNC is targeting 4 or 5 players for their 2010 class.
Bullock & Marshall are already commited but they are looking to add 2 more players for their class.

I dont think you even realize that John Wall going to UNC would make no sense after UNC has already landed Strickland and has Drew returning.

Strickland is a combo guard who probably isn't ready to play point, yet. That leaves them Drew as the only point guard on their roster. A one and done Wall makes perfect sense as a bridge to a Drew/Marshall tandem at the point.

I don't know if they'll get him, but they have reason to try.

Also, Graves was suspended, but I'm told that he'll probably be back next year, and was with the UNC team at the final four, in street clothes.

I guess we'll see how this all washes out. I think K can sell Duke as a serious title contender next year, especially with Wall. I'm not sure UNC can do that, although they could be on the verge of top ten by the end of the season. I suppose it's even possible they could challenge for the national championship if everything fell just right for them, but that seems unlikely to happen.

[Highlander]

Strickland is a combo guard, not a point guard. He's the kind of guy that can spell a PG, not run an up-tempo offense.

Wall would be seen as a 1-2 year bridge to either an experienced Drew or Kendall Marshall in 2010-2011. There's a huge hole in the UNC lineup at PG next season, and it's one that will be filled by 2011 for sure and probably 2010. A year from Wall, or even two years, fits perfectly. He might not go to UNC, and you can argue the character issue and one-and-done thing all day, but you can't deny that from a basketball standpoint it's a perfect fit.

No offense, but a guy like Wall would be a "perfect fit" at pretty much any program in the country, so UNC is not unique in that regard. The only team I can think of that wouldn't need/want Wall would be a program who has an established, top tier point guard who isn't planning to go pro this year (e.g. UNC/Wake if Lawson/Teague decided to return). Even if a team already had a strong PG starting in the fall, I can't see a program being unwilling to pick up Wall for a year and let their Freshman PG take a back seat.

[Carlos]

Did you not see where I mentioned UNC is targeting 4 or 5 players for their 2010 class.
Bullock & Marshall are already commited but they are looking to add 2 more players for their class.

I dont think you even realize that John Wall going to UNC would make no sense after UNC has already landed Strickland and has Drew returning.

UNC may be targeting additional players in the class of 2010 but that has absolutely no bearing on their alleged interest in John Wall in the class of 2009. As has been pointed out already, John Wall is likely going to be a one-and-done player so he has no impact on the roster for the class of 2010. He'll be gone. In the unlikely scenario that he's not gone, well Ol' Roy could just sign 3 players instead of 4 which wouldn't be a bad deal since it means he would keep an experienced guy who was #1 in his freshman class.

You had made the statement earlier that "Ellington & Lawson don't count for the 2009 recruiting class," which is just not true. Once those guys are no longer enrolled in the university their scholarships are freed up to be used. It's not like a school is locked into reserving that scholarship for 4 years regardless of if a player is there or not. As soon as they leave (be it for the pros, transfer, or flunk out) that scholarship is available. So the scholarships that Ellington & Lawson are currently holding could be applied to the upcoming freshman class if both guys go pro as expected.

As for it not making sense for John Wall to go to UNC - not making sense for whom? It certainly seems to make some sense for John Wall as he's said he's going to look at UNC. Having Larry Drew II on the team doesn't seem to intimidate him since he's clearly a better point guard that Drew. Having Dexter Strickland on the team doesn't seem to bother him especially since Strickland is more of a combo guard than a point guard. He's very much like Daniel Ewing in that he can play the point if needed but he's not a great ball handler.

Wall to UNC seems to make sense to Roy Williams since he's recruiting Wall. So maybe you have this realization, but the key players in the situation don't share your opinion.

[Biscuit]

No offense, but a guy like Wall would be a "perfect fit" at pretty much any program in the country, so UNC is not unique in that regard. The only team I can think of that wouldn't need/want Wall would be a program who has an established, top tier point guard who isn't planning to go pro this year (e.g. UNC/Wake if Lawson/Teague decided to return). Even if a team already had a strong PG starting in the fall, I can't see a program being unwilling to pick up Wall for a year and let their Freshman PG take a back seat.

That's not exactly true. Every player has downsides. If you are a team that doesn't like one-and-dones, or has concerns about his character, or has a desperate need for scholarship players in the front court, he's not a perfect fit, especially if you have a good PG. For example, I doubt that Syracuse would think he's worth the risk, because the upgrade he provides over their returning backcourt isn't that significant. Oklahoma might also pass because they already have Warren next season and need to replace both Griffins in the frontcourt. There's lots of others out there. The larger point is, if you assume that there are negatives associated with him, then there are some teams for which the value he adds outweighs the negatives more than it would for other teams. Wall is good, but he's not LeBron James good. He just happens to fit right into a 1-2 year opening in the roster with UNC. That's not true elsewhere, so they might be less willing to take on the downsides.

Also, there's the question of style of play. I'm sure Bo Ryan at Wisconsin would love to have him, but I don't think Wall would consider the Wisconsin half-court milk the clock offense a perfect fit. UNC's 90 ppg offense probably appeals to him more than most.

[UrinalCake]

Even though Wall is assumed by all to be a one-and-done'er, I could see him impacting the recruiting class of 2010 for whatever school ends up getting him. A high school senior next year could see that Wall is at the school and it's not 100% guaranteed that he'll leave. Maybe the high schooler wants to make a decision in the fall, when no one has seen how good Wall will really be in college. So maybe this other top prospect ends up not going to that school because of Wall, and the school misses out on a player that would have been around longer. I guess this is the whole argument against going after one-and-done'ers; it's great for the year that you have him but could potentially have an overall negative impact.

[CDu]

Did you not see where I mentioned UNC is targeting 4 or 5 players for their 2010 class.
Bullock & Marshall are already commited but they are looking to add 2 more players for their class.

And as I said, the 2010 class is completely irrelevant with regard to John Wall's recruitment. Wall is a one-and-done player, so he'll be gone by the time the 2010 class rolls in. UNC will have room for two more players in the 2010 class whether they get John Wall or not.

Further, you said something silly in that Ellington and Lawson don't count toward the 2009 class, just the 2010 class. That is just not true. They will allow UNC to recruit a one-and-done for 2009 (like Wall), and STILL have space for their 2010 class.


I dont think you even realize that John Wall going to UNC would make no sense after UNC has already landed Strickland and has Drew returning.

At least this is rational point of discussion. However, I think you're again mistaken. Strickland is a combo guard who is more of a SG than a PG, so one year of John Wall doesn't matter. And Drew is a bit of a project (or just plain mediocre). Wall is by all counts an upgrade over Drew (period) and Strickland (as a PG). So one year of John Wall would give him more time to develop, or at least give them a gap-fill until Marshall arrives.

Why do you think Williams would be wasting his time starting to recruit Wall at this point if there wasn't a place for him? I think it is YOU who fails to realize that Wall actually DOES make sense from a UNC perspective. He steps in for a year in which they'd otherwise be stuck with a mediocre PG and a freshman combo guard playing a bit out of position.

[yancem]

Man, between the posts bemoaning Wall's handlers, declaring him to be a one-and done, hating on one-and-dones, picking apart his character or more correctly, misinformed perceptions thereof and explaining how he would be a perfect fit for UNC, it will be no wonder what so ever if he signs somewhere else. Can we please try to focus a little more on any actual credible news/information with regards to the status of Wall's recruitment?

[roywhite]

Man, between the posts bemoaning Wall's handlers, declaring him to be a one-and done, hating on one-and-dones, picking apart his character or more correctly, misinformed perceptions thereof and explaining how he would be a perfect fit for UNC, it will be no wonder what so ever if he signs somewhere else. Can we please try to focus a little more on any actual credible news/information with regards to the status of Wall's recruitment?

I've posted this elsewhere, but we can see Mr. Wall play along with Mason Plumlee in the Nike Hoops Classic this Saturday 4/11. They are on the USA team taking on an International squad; these games are usually competitive and better played than most all-star games, as each side wants to win.

The game is carried on Fox Sports South (and some other regional Fox sports channels, I believe); it's at 10:00 PM Eastern on Saturday 4/11. On DirecTV, Fox Sports South is channel 646.

There are also interviews with Mason, John Wall, and others on the usabasketball.com site.

[CDu]

Man, between the posts bemoaning Wall's handlers, declaring him to be a one-and done, hating on one-and-dones, picking apart his character or more correctly, misinformed perceptions thereof and explaining how he would be a perfect fit for UNC, it will be no wonder what so ever if he signs somewhere else. Can we please try to focus a little more on any actual credible news/information with regards to the status of Wall's recruitment?

I'm guessing this was in response to my posts. I'm not saying by any means that UNC will get Wall. I just was trying to clarify that UNC has room for him, and they have reason to be interested.

Similarly, I think Wall is a perfect fit for Duke. We certainly ALSO have room for him, and reason to be interested in him. There aren't too many programs in the country for which an extremely-talented PG wouldn't be a great fit. There are probably some, but neither Duke nor UNC are among them.

[watzone]

Man, between the posts bemoaning Wall's handlers, declaring him to be a one-and done, hating on one-and-dones, picking apart his character or more correctly, misinformed perceptions thereof and explaining how he would be a perfect fit for UNC, it will be no wonder what so ever if he signs somewhere else. Can we please try to focus a little more on any actual credible news/information with regards to the status of Wall's recruitment?


How many of these posters know or have even heard John Wall? How many have any firsthand knowledge instead of message board banter? This thread has become ridiculous and is in no way helping with the perception of Duke fans nor does it have many facts. We now return you to as the spin doctor turns.

Seriously, recruiting threads have become so whack, that I am taking a break from them. It's so tempting to react to every little rumor. You will not find many truths in public message boards, but they are entertaining and record long threads. Maybe, just maybe, it's time to start a new Wall thread and hope it stays on subject. This thing is going to last for another three weeks folks.

[watzone]

I've posted this elsewhere, but we can see Mr. Wall play along with Mason Plumlee in the Nike Hoops Classic this Saturday 4/11. They are on the USA team taking on an International squad; these games are usually competitive and better played than most all-star games, as each side wants to win.

The game is carried on Fox Sports South (and some other regional Fox sports channels, I believe); it's at 10:00 PM Eastern on Saturday 4/11. On DirecTV, Fox Sports South is channel 646.

There are also interviews with Mason, John Wall, and others on the usabasketball.com site.


Finally, some good information;) I am setting my DVR to channel 646 for I will be covering Harrison Barnes and more at the Boo Williams Invitational. Thanks for the heads up for I would have missed it.

[roywhite]

Finally, some good information;) I am setting my DVR to channel 646 for I will be covering Harrison Barnes and more at the Boo Williams Invitational. Thanks for the heads up for I would have missed it.

Happy to give you that tidbit, Mark. You provide a lot of info to readers of this site, and it's appreciated.

By the way, I see on some other message boards that 'Ole Roy is sniffing around Mr. Barnes (which only makes sense, I guess, since Harrison is apparently quite a prospect). If you see 'Ole Roy, swat him on the nose and tell him to stay away. :)

[BD80]

... I see on some other message boards that 'Ole Roy is sniffing around Mr. Barnes ... If you see 'Ole Roy, swat him on the nose ...

To do that he might have to smack Barnes in the butt :D

With the California tan 'ol roy was rockin at the Final Four, at least it won't be so obvious how brown his nose is getting.

You would think young men that have to deal with the bs on a nearly constant basis would immediately see through 'ol roy and his aw shucks, gee willickers facade. To me, the coach that would get my attention is the guy with the military background but can identify with Lebron, Kobe, Jason Kidd et al and get them to work as a team.

[Exiled_Devil]

Man, between the posts bemoaning Wall's handlers, declaring him to be a one-and done, hating on one-and-dones, picking apart his character or more correctly, misinformed perceptions thereof and explaining how he would be a perfect fit for UNC, it will be no wonder what so ever if he signs somewhere else. Can we please try to focus a little more on any actual credible news/information with regards to the status of Wall's recruitment?

A guy in the locer room at the Y told me that UNC was getting another National Championship because Wall was going to UNC; Wall didn't trust Coach K's pitch of 'you can be like JWill' becuase if he did, he would have signed with Duke right after meeting; and Elliot Williams is still thinking about transferring.

He knew all of this because he heard it at the barbershop. He also wore baby blue shorts. <sarcasm>Very credible.</sarcasm>

[RepoMan]

A guy in the locer room at the Y told me that UNC was getting another National Championship because Wall was going to UNC; Wall didn't trust Coach K's pitch of 'you can be like JWill' becuase if he did, he would have signed with Duke right after meeting; and Elliot Williams is still thinking about transferring.

He knew all of this because he heard it at the barbershop. He also wore baby blue shorts.

Dude, I heard the exact same thing this afternoon from the sandwich guy at Quiznos. Damn.

[El_Diablo]

Dude, I heard the exact same thing this afternoon from the sandwich guy at Quiznos. Damn.

Probably a UNC graduate...if he finished at the top of his class.

[dubayuw]

http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/story/1479282.html

A lot of stuff we already knew... but confirms that UNC is NOT recruiting him as of this morning.

Also, there was this:

Wall said he doesn't look at internet comments about him very often and has not been offended by anything he has read.

"Some people know you, but most don't," Wall said. "People are going to talk about you. I don't pay much attention."

Haha, good for us i guess:rolleyes:

[geraldsneighbor]

Probably a UNC graduate...if he finished at the top of his class.

Can I just say how much I love the direction this thread has taken lately. John, please drag out your signing as long as you want. I'm enjoying this thread way too much for it to end now.

[dubayuw]

ESPN came out with a new ESPNU100 today.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/columns/story?columnist=biancardi_paul&id=4054919

Here is were our recruits are at:
Wall moved up from #6 to #5
Plumlee moved up from #11 to #10
Kelly moved down from #12 to #17
Bledsoe is just outside the top 100

All UNC recruits dropped except the Wear Bros(#36 and #37):
Henson from #3 to #6
Strickland from #21 to #27
McDonald from #24 to #32

I know it doesn't really have an effect on anything but I enjoy rankings and this thread is already a lost cause in terms of relevance. Not to mention it was nice to see the UNC players drop:cool:

[moonpie23]

i wonder if john has turned the lights off and gone to bed yet?











it's a JOKE!!!!!!


sheesh...

[G man]

Here is a thought maybe if Henderson makes the choice to move on. That may be what Wall wants to hear. With Gerald around he obviously won't be the man. Granted Singler will still be around, but that would be the only other major pro-prospect at this juncture. So who knows if it will help or hurt if G leaves!

[Greg_Newton]

i wonder if john has turned the lights off and gone to bed yet?

Hahaha. Jeez. I wonder if he fully realizes how many grown men spend a significant portion of their days just thinking about him and what's on his mind.

But while we're overanalyzing: "He has no leader now, he said. Wall said he talks to other players about their recruitment and would talk with teammates this weekend."

I noticed Mason said something about looking forward to playing with Wall this weekend, and that he was hoping he'd come to Duke - time to turn on the charm big fella!!!

[KyDevilinIL]

I wonder if he fully realizes how many grown men spend a significant portion of their days just thinking about him and what's on his mind.

Oh, I assure you he realizes it. And I'd bet the "building anticipation and drama" factor is significant part of why he's taking his time to make a decision. He may very well be torn, but either Wall or his supervisors want to build a frenzy, then make as big a splash as possible when the time comes.

We're all just pawns in John Wall's game. Haha.

[NYDukie]

Oh, I assure you he realizes it. And I'd bet the "building anticipation and drama" factor is significant part of why he's taking his time to make a decision. He may very well be torn, but either Wall or his supervisors want to build a frenzy, then make as big a splash as possible when the time comes.

We're all just pawns in John Wall's game. Haha.

Haven't we seen and heard this song and dance before??? And you all know who I mean!!! Just curious to see who will be jilted and who he takes to the dance!

[NashvilleDevil]

A guy in the locer room at the Y told me that UNC was getting another National Championship because Wall was going to UNC; Wall didn't trust Coach K's pitch of 'you can be like JWill' becuase if he did, he would have signed with Duke right after meeting; and Elliot Williams is still thinking about transferring.

He knew all of this because he heard it at the barbershop. He also wore baby blue shorts. <sarcasm>Very credible.</sarcasm>

Well this is what I heard about the Wall recruitment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UR594f25pQ

[G man]

Hahaha. Jeez. I wonder if he fully realizes how many grown men spend a significant portion of their days just thinking about him and what's on his mind.

I think that this is so funny and true! This just shows how big college ball is. We all wait on pins and needles hanging on his every word.

[DDB4208]

Here is a thought maybe if Henderson makes the choice to move on. That may be what Wall wants to hear. With Gerald around he obviously won't be the man. Granted Singler will still be around, but that would be the only other major pro-prospect at this juncture. So who knows if it will help or hurt if G leaves!

It would hurt us.

1. Gerald will be ACC POY if he stays. John as a freshman would not be close to as good as G would be as a senior. So I would much rather have G if I had to pick one or the other.

2. J-Wall knows he will play at any school he goes to. G won't take away many minutes from him because they are different positions.

3. John wants to play at a school with a certain type of offense. Coach K tried to tell John that if he comes to Duke he can be like J-Will and that Duke changes how they play depending on what players they have. G's game complements John's game. I have seen John play and he loves to get up and down with his team and just overwhelm the other team with his and his teammate's athleticism

4. John mentioned G when he talked about Duke and he seemed to respect/like G.

Then again you could be right about the ego thing. He might want to be "the man" at the school he goes to.

[DDB4208]

Some free input from Rivals.com (http://basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=933869)...

Q: With DeMarcus Cousins committing to John Calipari, do you believe John Wall will choose [to stay] close to home and possibly decide on Duke or UNC? Or will he follow Cousins to Kentucky? - Josh from Selby, N.C.



A: Will John Wall end up staying close to home?
Josh, you have the Wall dilemma broken down into its basic components. When it comes down to it, I think his choice will be stay at home or play for Calipari at Kentucky. If he chooses to stay at home, Duke and North Carolina are his two compelling choices.

With Kentucky, he would be able to team up with Cousins and play in the dribble drive offense. Prior to Calipari's transition, Memphis was Wall's favorite. If Wall would play for Calipari in Conference USA, you would certainly think he would play for him in the SEC. The difference now from when Wall was favoring Memphis is that Duke has picked up its recruiting effort and North Carolina has begun its recruiting effort.

As for Duke, Wall had a very productive meeting with coach Mike Krzyzewski a week and a half ago, just prior to Calipari's departure to Kentucky. Wall came away from the meeting with a positive impression. Coach K sold Wall on his opportunity to speed up the Duke offensive attack and the ability to flourish under his guidance.

It has been rumored that Wall has always wanted to play for North Carolina. A rift, however, between UNC coach Roy Williams and Wall's travel team coach Brian Clifton kept Wall and the Tar Heels apart up to this point. But recently it has become more apparent that Wall truly will make his own decision and that he just might prefer to stay close to home and his mother. Hence a phone call from Williams during the Final Four and an eagerness of Wall to meet with Williams.

All three schools share a common denominator. With Wall running the point, each would be a legitimate national championship contender. Without Wall, things get a lot tougher since all three teams lack a legitimate point guard.

-----------------------------

A lot of stuff we already know but just incase anyone was interested.

[DDB4208]

I also thought this link (free) from Rivals.com (http://collegebasketball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=933486) was interesting. It is a set of rankings of the PG's in the 2009 class. It also says that J-Wall is considering UK, Duke, UNC and Miami. And that Eric Bledsoe is considering Alabama, Cinci, Florida and UK but says nothing about Duke.

[buzz]

Wall only gets one shot at this thing, so I have to wonder how much of an impact the supporting squad factors into his decision. It that respect, I think G leaving would hurt our chances, because we would not be nearly as strong a Final Four contender without Henderson.

Kentucky could face a similar scenario if one or more of the following happens: (a) Patterson declares (b) Meeks gets an agent (c) Orton doesn't sign (d) Henry doesn't sign. UNC is still sweating an Ed Davis change-of-heart, and Kansas (if they are still in it) has all kinds of potential changes in play - some good for them and some not. If I were in Wall's shoes, I'd delay my decision as long as possible to let things shake out.

Btw, when is Roy going to be taken to task for his illegal recruiting call during a dead-period?

[dgoore97]

http://dukeblueforever.com/2009/04/06/dukes-potential-point-guard-solutions-john-wall/

mildly interstig tho. apologies if it's been posted previously

[dgoore97]

[QUOTE=buzz;285409]Wall only gets one shot at this thing, so I have to wonder how much of an impact the supporting squad factors into his decision. It that respect, I think G leaving would hurt our chances, because we would not be nearly as strong a Final Four contender without Henderson.

G can make a call to wall and hey can agree to try to win a NC at Duke next year?

[Icarus09]

An interview posted today by a website covering the Portland Trail Blazers, where Wall was playing/practicing. Among other things, Wall replied that, no, UNC winning the title isn't affecting his decision.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/4/10/829755/john-wall-the-future

[BD80]

... Btw, when is Roy going to be taken to task for his illegal recruiting call during a dead-period?

I believe a school was allowed one call per recruit during that week.

[Greg_Newton]

An interview posted today by a website covering the Portland Trail Blazers, where Wall was playing/practicing. Among other things, Wall replied that, no, UNC winning the title isn't affecting his decision.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/4/10/829755/john-wall-the-future


It really doesn't even matter about the exposure.

I just want to go to a team that needs a point guard. That's where I'm trying to come in. I'm trying to be the missing piece to a team.

I don't want to come in and be the person they have to go to every key play because for a freshman that would be kind of tough. I wouldn't mind taking challenges but I'm going to be honest, it's going to be a tough one as a freshman, going through so many games, travelling.

So to have some veterans on the team and you come in and be the missing piece, that's going to be [what I'm looking for].

Duuuuuuuke....

[Icarus09]

"It really doesn't even matter about the exposure.

I just want to go to a team that needs a point guard. That's where I'm trying to come in. I'm trying to be the missing piece to a team.

I don't want to come in and be the person they have to go to every key play because for a freshman that would be kind of tough. I wouldn't mind taking challenges but I'm going to be honest, it's going to be a tough one as a freshman, going through so many games, travelling.

So to have some veterans on the team and you come in and be the missing piece, that's going to be [what I'm looking for]."

I feel like Meeks and Patterson leaving UK would put them at a disadvantage if this is really what Wall is thinking. Even if G leaves we have a star in Singler and great leadership with Scheyer, LT, etc.

[DDB4208]

Well I was as optimistic for as long as I could be, but I never thought that J-Wall would sign and now I'm giving up. I don't like the sound of this at all, it's from FoxSports.com (http://community.foxsports.com/blogs/goodmanonfox/2009/04/09/NATIONAL_CHAMPS_MAKING_LATE_RUN_AT_WALL).

"Wall grew up wanting to play for the Tar Heels – and one source said Wall still wants to wear Carolina blue."

[Kedsy]

Well I was as optimistic for as long as I could be, but I never thought that J-Wall would sign and now I'm giving up. I don't like the sound of this at all, it's from FoxSports.com (http://community.foxsports.com/blogs/goodmanonfox/2009/04/09/NATIONAL_CHAMPS_MAKING_LATE_RUN_AT_WALL).

"Wall grew up wanting to play for the Tar Heels – and one source said Wall still wants to wear Carolina blue."

That's fine, you give up. I'm going to wait and see what the young man says in a couple weeks. That OK with you?

[dukemsu]

That's fine, you give up. I'm going to wait and see what the young man says in a couple weeks. That OK with you?

Oh, I cannot imagine the angst if Wall is a Heel. Of course, if he's as good as reputed, it may be warranted angst.

Found it interesting that the kid's AAU coach is not a big fan of Ol'Roy. Is Ol'Roy not beloved by those in the AAU set?

dukemsu

[Exiled_Devil]

Well I was as optimistic for as long as I could be, but I never thought that J-Wall would sign and now I'm giving up. I don't like the sound of this at all, it's from FoxSports.com (http://community.foxsports.com/blogs/goodmanonfox/2009/04/09/NATIONAL_CHAMPS_MAKING_LATE_RUN_AT_WALL).

"Wall grew up wanting to play for the Tar Heels – and one source said Wall still wants to wear Carolina blue."

From what I understand, ol' Roy didn't offer Wall when they met/talked yesterday. That would seem to me to be a bad sign for UNC.

I attribute the Tar Heel push to a lot of local UNC fans in RDU who WANT Wall, and are trying to talk him to UNC up in order to make it happen. IT is amazing the number of people who know 'his cousin's girlfriend' or 'his Momma's neighbor' or some other semi-relation that is a surefire source.

Edit: Can we count how many different articles quote the coach -

``I have no desire to talk to, to be involved with, to visit, to contemplate in any shape, form or fashion John Wall going to play for Roy Williams. Zero.”
I don't even recall where the first citation of that is. Who actually had that conversation with is AAU coach? And how many people have pawned that off as their own reporting? (this is inspired from reading the Fox Sports link)

[umdukie]

I have a terrible, terrible feeling from reading some of the UK fan boards that Wall is waiting for Lawson to declare for the draft before he makes any sort of decision regarding UNC. This will most likely happen soon enough...

[DDB4208]

From what I understand, ol' Roy didn't offer Wall when they met/talked yesterday. That would seem to me to be a bad sign for UNC.

I attribute the Tar Heel push to a lot of local UNC fans in RDU who WANT Wall, and are trying to talk him to UNC up in order to make it happen. IT is amazing the number of people who know 'his cousin's girlfriend' or 'his Momma's neighbor' or some other semi-relation that is a surefire source.

Edit: Can we count how many different articles quote the coach -

I don't even recall where the first citation of that is. Who actually had that conversation with is AAU coach? And how many people have pawned that off as their own reporting? (this is inspired from reading the Fox Sports link)

The quote from the coach was originally from the News & Observer but John made it clear that he would make his own decision. A.K.A Brain Clifton would not. Roy didn't offer him because he didn't meet with John yesterday. UNC has not made an offer yet but I am willing to bet they will today or tomorrow. Roy is supposed to meet with Wall tomorrow in Oregon. I just don't see the edge that we have anymore.

[G man]

Well the article links that were just posted make me feel on the up and up. If he really wants to be the missing piece we are his best choice! What worries me though is that he grew up wanting to play at UNC that is hard to go agaisnt. I feel more positive than I have in the last few about the whole situation.

[stickdog]

For those (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHL3A76xW70&fmt=18) who think that the competition at Duke for PT could be negative for Wall or that the possibility of Wall's staying past his freshman season could ward off potential 2010 recruits.

[Coballs]

For those (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHL3A76xW70&fmt=18) who think that the competition at Duke for PT could be negative for Wall or that the possibility of Wall's staying past his freshman season could ward off potential 2010 recruits.

His game is dirty. Wow!

[CameronCrazy'11]

His game is dirty. Wow!

That's probably why this is the 1,225th post in a thread about his recruitment :)

But yeah, he's very, very, very good. As in he would be drafted before Ty Lawson this year, if he were eligible.

[mo.st.dukie]

[QUOTE=G man;285464]Well the article links that were just posted make me feel on the up and up. If he really wants to be the missing piece we are his best choice! What worries me though is that he grew up wanting to play at UNC that is hard to go agaisnt. [QUOTE]

Mason was a huge UNC fan growing up as were a number of other former Duke players. And let's not kid ourselves here, he could be the missing piece to a UK team that brings back some talented players (IMO Meeks returns) and will probably have at least Cousins and Dennis from Memphis, plus they have Calipari. If UNC offers, they have the 2nd ranked recruiting class plus more established big men (Thompson and Davis) than Duke does. So while Duke does have a lot of the pieces to the puzzle in place, the other two major players could too.

[moonpie23]

i sure don't wanna see THAT in a baby blue uni...


hey, if i set up a JOHN WALL PLEASE COME TO DUKE facebook page, would Duke make me take it down?

[Exiled_Devil]

Roy didn't offer him because he didn't meet with John yesterday. UNC has not made an offer yet but I am willing to bet they will today or tomorrow. Roy is supposed to meet with Wall tomorrow in Oregon. I just don't see the edge that we have anymore.

huh. Everything I read said that he was going to UNC on Thursday, and that he did go to UNC on Thursday.

[BlueinBlo]

huh. Everything I read said that he was going to UNC on Thursday, and that he did go to UNC on Thursday.
Ya, I was watching ESPN and Roy even said he was working on recruiting on Thursday.

[Franzez]

If UNC lands Wall, there should be an escape clause for Strickland or Drew to leave the program.

Their PG situation will probably only be resolved with a transfer or someone leaving early.

Next season they would have 3 McDonalds All-Americans at PG with a 2010 McDonalds All-American(Kendall Marshall) coming in the following season.

If Strickland reopens his recruitment, I dont see why he doesnt consider us.

Isn't Hurley the head coach at St.Patrick?

[sandinmyshoes]

If UNC lands Wall, there should be an escape clause for Strickland or Drew to leave the program.

Their PG situation will probably only be resolved with a transfer or someone leaving early.

Next season they would have 3 McDonalds All-Americans at PG with a 2010 McDonalds All-American(Kendall Marshall) coming in the following season.

If Strickland reopens his recruitment, I dont see why he doesnt consider us.

Isn't Hurley the head coach at St.Patrick?



Strickland is not a point guard. He is a combo that will possibly be able to play some point in the future.

If Wall is good enough, he will be a one and done.

So, next year, with Wall, UNC would have two point guards on their roster. Then if Wall leaves, the next year they would have two point guards on their roster.

I think we have to hang our hopes on something besides this idea that Wall going to UNC would crowd their backcourt. My hope is that Duke looks more likely to challenge for a championship next year. That might be appealing for Wall.

[Franzez]

Strickland is not a point guard. He is a combo that will possibly be able to play some point in the future.

If Wall is good enough, he will be a one and done.

So, next year, with Wall, UNC would have two point guards on their roster. Then if Wall leaves, the next year they would have two point guards on their roster.

I think we have to hang our hopes on something besides this idea that Wall going to UNC would crowd their backcourt. My hope is that Duke looks more likely to challenge for a championship next year. That might be appealing for Wall.
Unless John Wall suffers a serious injury there is no way he returns for his sophmore year anywhere, simply because of his family situation.

Duke should be the favorite to win the National Championship if Henderson returns.

[BlueintheFace]

http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/view/98792-tar-heels-joins-chase-for-top-pg-recruit?eref=fromSI

Stupid tarheels...LEAVE US ALONE ROY!!!

[Kedsy]

I have a terrible, terrible feeling from reading some of the UK fan boards that Wall is waiting for Lawson to declare for the draft before he makes any sort of decision regarding UNC.

Well, the UK fan boards obviously have inside information, so I can understand your "terrible, terrible" feeling.


What worries me though is that he grew up wanting to play at UNC that is hard to go agaisnt.

You realize that this idea that he always wanted to be a Heel stems from one article quoting a single, unnamed source, right? The height of reliability.


I just don't see the edge that we have anymore.

Why do you think we ever had an "edge"? We have a chance, that's all. So do the other suitors. Duke's chance has never been anywhere close to 50/50, and it isn't now. Neither is UNC's. If he comes to Duke, great. If he doesn't, we'll move on. It won't be a tragedy or even a failure. Just because we want him doesn't mean he somehow belongs to us or we're entitled to get him.

Great players go to other schools all the time. If Coach K had never contacted John Wall nobody would be making such a big deal about this and if he went elsewhere nobody would be bemoaning our recruiting inabilities. We could use DeMarcus Cousins but he committed to Calipari (twice). We never had a chance. Does that mean the world is ending? We should be excited that we have any chance at Wall, rather than wringing our hands over the possibility that other teams have a chance too.


hey, if i set up a JOHN WALL PLEASE COME TO DUKE facebook page, would Duke make me take it down?

I'm assuming this is a joke.

[DDB4208]

huh. Everything I read said that he was going to UNC on Thursday, and that he did go to UNC on Thursday.

That was never confirmed. I never heard Wall or Williams or UNC confirm that.

This is from the Raleigh News & Observer (http://www.newsobserver.com/821/story/1481653.html) published this morning.

"But Wall said Thursday that he had not talked to Williams since that long-distance conversation. Wall said he does expect to talk to Williams at some point, but he doesn't know of any timetable."

So if John visited UNC Thursday I think he would have said something about it since this quote was on Thursday.

[darkblue2769]

hey, if i set up a JOHN WALL PLEASE COME TO DUKE facebook page, would Duke make me take it down?

there actually is one, apparently

[DDB4208]

Why do you think we ever had an "edge"? We have a chance, that's all. So do the other suitors. Duke's chance has never been anywhere close to 50/50, and it isn't now. Neither is UNC's. If he comes to Duke, great. If he doesn't, we'll move on. It won't be a tragedy or even a failure. Just because we want him doesn't mean he somehow belongs to us or we're entitled to get him.

Great players go to other schools all the time. If Coach K had never contacted John Wall nobody would be making such a big deal about this and if he went elsewhere nobody would be bemoaning our recruiting inabilities. We could use DeMarcus Cousins but he committed to Calipari (twice). We never had a chance. Does that mean the world is ending? We should be excited that we have any chance at Wall, rather than wringing our hands over the possibility that other teams have a chance too.

By edge I meant the close to home team that had prestige, which gave us a chance. UK has prestige but isn't in NC. NCSU is NC but doesn't have prestige or isn't an elite team. Baylor, Oregon, Miami all have neither prestige or a close proximity. I didn't mean that we had the edge for the entire recruitment, but just in one aspect. In my earlier post, which you replied to, I said "I never thought that J-Wall would sign". So I know that we never had a 50/50 chance. You don't need to lecture me on whether or not it would be a "failure" or a "tragedy" or that "the world was ending". I never said those things. I want John Wall to come to Duke and I don't want him to go to UNC. When I heard that he wanted to play for UNC growing up and that a source said he still wants to play for UNC I was disappointed because we lost one of our selling points or edge. Now UNC is in this and they are close to home and have prestige. So John doesn't look at Duke now and think "This is the only elite team that is 40 minutes from my house." That's all I meant by that. I feel like you are arguing with me but we want the same thing and believe the same things so I don't see what the problem is.

[davekay1971]

Well, the UK fan boards obviously have inside information, so I can understand your "terrible, terrible" feeling.



You realize that this idea that he always wanted to be a Heel stems from one article quoting a single, unnamed source, right? The height of reliability.



Why do you think we ever had an "edge"? We have a chance, that's all. So do the other suitors. Duke's chance has never been anywhere close to 50/50, and it isn't now. Neither is UNC's. If he comes to Duke, great. If he doesn't, we'll move on. It won't be a tragedy or even a failure. Just because we want him doesn't mean he somehow belongs to us or we're entitled to get him.

Great players go to other schools all the time. If Coach K had never contacted John Wall nobody would be making such a big deal about this and if he went elsewhere nobody would be bemoaning our recruiting inabilities. We could use DeMarcus Cousins but he committed to Calipari (twice). We never had a chance. Does that mean the world is ending? We should be excited that we have any chance at Wall, rather than wringing our hands over the possibility that other teams have a chance too.



I'm assuming this is a joke.

This strikes me as kind of a harsh slam-fest. I don't have a dog in the fight or anything, but c'mon...

[Kedsy]

That's all I meant by that. I feel like you are arguing with me but we want the same thing and believe the same things so I don't see what the problem is.

I wasn't arguing with you so much as the general tenor of this thread. I just happened to pick your quote because it seemed to match the point I was trying to make. If you and I believe the same things here then I apologize for singling you out.

However, I don't think my post was a mere "slam-fest" as davekay said. Every rumor seems to send this board into a frenzy and that's neither healthy nor productive. People should try to maintain at least a tiny bit of perspective.

[Kewlswim]

Hi,

Until this thread really got going I didn't even know there was a kid named John Wall who played hoops. It sort of reminds me of Lance Thomas. Until I read the boards and how much we had to have him, well I didn't know there was a kid in Jersey we had to have. Sadly, I still don't see the NCAA Championship I thought Lance's presence was supposed to have guaranteed us or was that another thread? I get lost reading about all these "saviors."

As much as it pains me to write, I think we are turning into Kentucky fans. We don't seem to enjoy victories, we collectively just seem relieved we won. We don't appreciate success unless it is a National Championship. We don't appreciate our team, there is always someone better we should have had on the roster Sheesh. Reading this thread one would think that if John Wall decides to go to UNC it will hurt Duke basketball for the next millennium. This is selling Coach K, his staff, and the kids already on the roster as well as those on their way to Duke, very, very, short. People who have done that in the past have found themselves sadly mistaken at the resiliency of the Duke program under Coach K.

GO DUKE!

[Kedsy]

Hi,

Until this thread really got going I didn't even know there was a kid named John Wall who played hoops. It sort of reminds me of Lance Thomas. Until I read the boards and how much we had to have him, well I didn't know there was a kid in Jersey we had to have. Sadly, I still don't see the NCAA Championship I thought Lance's presence was supposed to have guaranteed us or was that another thread? I get lost reading about all these "saviors."

As much as it pains me to write, I think we are turning into Kentucky fans. We don't seem to enjoy victories, we collectively just seem relieved we won. We don't appreciate success unless it is a National Championship. We don't appreciate our team, there is always someone better we should have had on the roster Sheesh. Reading this thread one would think that if John Wall decides to go to UNC it will hurt Duke basketball for the next millennium. This is selling Coach K, his staff, and the kids already on the roster as well as those on their way to Duke, very, very, short. People who have done that in the past have found themselves sadly mistaken at the resiliency of the Duke program under Coach K.

GO DUKE!

Amen, brother. You said it better than I did.

[ikiru36]

Hi,

Until this thread really got going I didn't even know there was a kid named John Wall who played hoops. It sort of reminds me of Lance Thomas. Until I read the boards and how much we had to have him, well I didn't know there was a kid in Jersey we had to have. Sadly, I still don't see the NCAA Championship I thought Lance's presence was supposed to have guaranteed us or was that another thread? I get lost reading about all these "saviors."

As much as it pains me to write, I think we are turning into Kentucky fans. We don't seem to enjoy victories, we collectively just seem relieved we won. We don't appreciate success unless it is a National Championship. We don't appreciate our team, there is always someone better we should have had on the roster Sheesh. Reading this thread one would think that if John Wall decides to go to UNC it will hurt Duke basketball for the next millennium. This is selling Coach K, his staff, and the kids already on the roster as well as those on their way to Duke, very, very, short. People who have done that in the past have found themselves sadly mistaken at the resiliency of the Duke program under Coach K.

GO DUKE!

Word up! Thanks Kewlswim.

[mgtr]

Hi,

Until this thread really got going I didn't even know there was a kid named John Wall who played hoops. It sort of reminds me of Lance Thomas. Until I read the boards and how much we had to have him, well I didn't know there was a kid in Jersey we had to have. Sadly, I still don't see the NCAA Championship I thought Lance's presence was supposed to have guaranteed us or was that another thread? I get lost reading about all these "saviors."

As much as it pains me to write, I think we are turning into Kentucky fans. We don't seem to enjoy victories, we collectively just seem relieved we won. We don't appreciate success unless it is a National Championship. We don't appreciate our team, there is always someone better we should have had on the roster Sheesh. Reading this thread one would think that if John Wall decides to go to UNC it will hurt Duke basketball for the next millennium. This is selling Coach K, his staff, and the kids already on the roster as well as those on their way to Duke, very, very, short. People who have done that in the past have found themselves sadly mistaken at the resiliency of the Duke program under Coach K.

GO DUKE!

I agree that this is a great post, and a timely one. I am just happy that we have a coach who can maintain his sanity better than those of who post on this board (and, yes, sometimes that includes me). I certainly don't have enough info to speak knowledgeably about whether player X would be the right for our team or not, and, while it is fun to speculate, I will try not to get carried away in the future. Go Duke!!

[ikiru36]

Having watched this evening's Nike Hoops Summit, I agree that Wall looked like a special talent. Henry, Sidney, Henson...etc. as well (though, perhaps, Wall most of all). Ya know what. They lost the game.

John Wall will make whichever school he goes to better and vastly more dynamic and fun to watch. The question to me is where is he most likely to most further develop the mixture of discipline and passion which is also necessary to be great. Tonight was my first chance to see Wall and his pure explosiveness, coupled with very good court vision (particularly when in transition) is a joy to behold. But despite all that, he's never won a State championship (despite having another good D1 prospect on his team) and now we've just watched him lose when surrounded by an exceptionally athletically gifted cast.

Meaning no particular slight to the other coaches and programs recruiting Wall, but I believe that Coach K and Duke will offer John the greatest focus on developing his simultaneous drive to be a great person and basketball star. Ask Kobe, Lebron, D. Wade...etc., whose respect Coach K earned (and who have each seemed to take their NBA games and teams to yet another level after last summer). John will likely have a good time, Sportscenter highlights, and some notable victories wherever he goes (given the high caliber of the 4 programs he's likely most considering).

But I don't believe that anyone in the world (who is also a top notch, internationally regarded basketball coach) will put more care and commitment into developing John Wall to become the greatest, most successful person he can be than Coach K.

John, I wish you all good luck and health wherever you go. You likely have no "wrong choices" out there, but no place on Earth is more right or will benefit you more in the long run than Duke University. And, oh yeah. Every, and I mean every game will more easily be watched by all basketball fans and NBA scouts than playing for any other team could provide, so that's not a bad thing either :0)

Go Duke!!!!!!! Go Blue Devils!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GTHCGTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[LaettnerWannabe]

I don't have anything new to add, but I saw that we were getting dangerously close to one full day passing with no new posts about John Wall. We can't have that, right?

[dubayuw]

As much as it pains me to write, I think we are turning into Kentucky fans.
Please NO! Anything but that!

Good post though. We had such a good run going from the late 90s until about 2005 and it is impossible to believe we could has sustained that level of play forever. It is just hard to accept that we can't always be the best or at least in the final four every year. Its even harder to have a few average(at duke's standards) years when your rival is winning everything. But don't worry, times will turn and we will have another run of final fours. John Wall or not we will be back to ncaa success in a few years.

That being said, I think if G stays and Wall comes we have a very legitimate chance of making a good run. I don't think Wall will be our "savior" and I don't think he wants to be a "savior" but I do think he fits into our most important need and can be a big contributer next year. More importantly, G has to stay. If we dont have G or Wall in the next year then we will probably have a very similar year to the last few but you never know.

[geraldsneighbor]

Is the new CBA going to impact Wall's class as far as having to stay a second year in college?

[dgoore97]

nice article here on the tobacco road recruiting battle:

http://dukeblueforever.com/2009/04/13/duke-vs-unc-head-to-head-recruiting-battles-john-wall/

[geraldsneighbor]

With Collins returning to Kansas, I think we can cross off Kansas on Wall's list. That leaves us with Baylor, Memphis, Duke, Miami, NC St., and unc.

[El_Diablo]

With Collins returning to Kansas, I think we can cross off Kansas on Wall's list. That leaves us with Baylor, Memphis, Duke, Miami, NC St., and unc.

Is that assessment based solely on the scholarship situation at KU?

If that's the case, the Collins/Aldrich decisions are good news (in eliminating a competitor for Wall's services), but bad news (in that Kansas will be very good next year).