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Huh?
10-25-2008, 12:15 PM
Starting lineup....Smith, Scheyer, Henderson, Singler, Plumlee

I like it.

Jumbo
10-25-2008, 12:49 PM
Discuss. (Well, only if you want to.)

Kedsy
10-25-2008, 12:52 PM
I'm only watching the live stats (as opposed to the actual game), but three fouls in five minutes for Zoubek is disappointing.

JDev
10-25-2008, 12:59 PM
Though I pay for the service, I cannot get the video stream of the game to work. I have tried two different computers and a number of trouble shooting suggestions. It is times like these that I wish I were more computer savvy. If anyone knows what to do I am all ears.

DownEastDevil
10-25-2008, 01:07 PM
Though I pay for the service, I cannot get the video stream of the game to work. I have tried two different computers and a number of trouble shooting suggestions. It is times like these that I wish I were more computer savvy. If anyone knows what to do I am all ears.

Don't waste your time, it's not your computer it's the service. I understand everybody is having the same problem.

Jumbo
10-25-2008, 01:07 PM
Starting lineup....Smith, Scheyer, Henderson, Singler, Plumlee

I like it.

Hmmm ... where did I hear that (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=206596&postcount=10)before? Smith starting over Paulus? Apparently I had lost my mind (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=206605&postcount=17). Plumlee as a starter (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?p=204670#post204670)? That Jumbo must be nuts (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=204685&postcount=16)! Zero chance of Scheyer coming off the bench (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=208407&postcount=25)? Looks like I was crazy (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=208587&postcount=35)again. Oh, wait. Never mind.

RepoMan
10-25-2008, 01:11 PM
I see that Olek has 0 minutes at the half. I am afraid that dkbaseball may lose his mind.

JDev
10-25-2008, 01:12 PM
Don't waste your time, it's not your computer it's the service. I understand everybody is having the same problem.

Thanks, and I see the other thread devoted to that. Very frustrating. Anyway, interesting starting line-up. I wonder how Paulus will react. He is not the type to let it be a detriment to the team, but I'm sure he is not thrilled. But, as many on this board have said, that five may be Duke's best five, and Coach wants to go ahead and have everyone get used to that.

RepoMan
10-25-2008, 01:23 PM
Thanks, and I see the other thread devoted to that. Very frustrating. Anyway, interesting starting line-up. I wonder how Paulus will react. He is not the type to let it be a detriment to the team, but I'm sure he is not thrilled. But, as many on this board have said, that five may be Duke's best five, and Coach wants to go ahead and have everyone get used to that.

That's a valid question, but, assuming Paulus remains out of the starting lineup, he need only look back one year to see an example of a key player putting his ego aside and accepting a 6th man role for the good of the team. Obviously, I don't know him, but from what I have seen of Paulus, I am not worried about it becoming a problem.

fogey
10-25-2008, 01:34 PM
please summarize the game and give a score. waiting for a serial shopper to emerge from a store and going nuts. thanks

bludvlman
10-25-2008, 01:35 PM
please summarize the game and give a score. waiting for a serial shopper to emerge from a store and going nuts. thanks

http://www.goduke.com/liveStats/gamewatcher.dbml?KEY=&DB_OEM_ID=4200&DB_ACCOUNT_TYPE=USER&GAME_STAT_ID=94832&SPORT_ID=1845

here you go

DukeUsul
10-25-2008, 01:37 PM
I seriously hope that Greg and Nolan are both heavily involved in running the team - and that Greg gets time at the SG position. Greg's an extremely important part of this team and we need to have him on the floor. Nolan is also a very talented player and certainly is our future floor general. They both have a lot to contribute. I really don't care which starts. I just want them both to play.

Looks like both are contributing. With 11:27 left the stats are:

Min Pts Ast TO St PF Reb
Nolan 18 6 5 3 0 2 4
Greg 15 8 4 1 2 1 1

I'd love to hear about Nolan's intangible floor management from someone who's watching the game.

bludvlman
10-25-2008, 01:41 PM
Miles is already our best big man.

DevilAlumna
10-25-2008, 01:42 PM
please summarize the game and give a score. waiting for a serial shopper to emerge from a store and going nuts. thanks

With 8 min. to go in the 2nd half, Duke is up, 86-35.

Lead scorers:
Singler - 15
Hendo - 14
Plumlee - 14

DevilCastDownfromDurham
10-25-2008, 01:42 PM
Wow. As I'm typing this Lance has 11 points (behind only the big 3 and Miles!, who also has great numbers) and 4 rebounds. I'll be curious to hear where he's playing on the court and if those were opportunistic putbacks or created from the offense. Either way, I'm hoping he's found something on that end to build on. This is a blowout game that is sure to create some silly numbers, but I'm encouraged by the balanced scoring and especially the play of Lance and Miles.

Edouble
10-25-2008, 01:43 PM
Hmmm ... where did I hear that (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=206596&postcount=10)before? Smith starting over Paulus? Apparently I had lost my mind (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=206605&postcount=17). Plumlee as a starter (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?p=204670#post204670)? That Jumbo must be nuts (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=204685&postcount=16)! Zero chance of Scheyer coming off the bench (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=208407&postcount=25)? Looks like I was crazy (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=208587&postcount=35)again. Oh, wait. Never mind.

:) You get a well-deserved pat on the back from me. Your posts have certainly pointed to the starting line-up that we saw today, albeit we may still see several other versions before the season gets into full swing. Good work, sir.

Jumbo
10-25-2008, 01:53 PM
:) You get a well-deserved pat on the back from me. Your posts have certainly pointed to the starting line-up that we saw today, albeit we may still see several other versions before the season gets into full swing. Good work, sir.

Thanks. I kind of felt like a bit of a jerk after posting that, but the level of noise has increased so dramatically in the last year that it's getting harder and harder to pass along legit info to you guys without getting questioned by people completely out of the loop. I agree that the situation will be fluid -- Duke has a ton of depth, Plumlee is a frosh, who knows how Smith/Paulus will shake out over time, and K has been known to sit even his best players (Elton Brand) as a form of motivation.

Still, I've got to be honest -- I really like that lineup. I just think that Smith's defense is far more important that Paulus' offense. I suspect Paulus will adapt to whatever role he's asked to play. And per an earlier post, if he doesn't, I'm sure Mr. Williams and Mr. Pocius would be happy to pick up those extra minutes.

MChambers
10-25-2008, 01:54 PM
Hmmm ... where did I hear that (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=206596&postcount=10)before? Smith starting over Paulus? Apparently I had lost my mind (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=206605&postcount=17). Plumlee as a starter (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?p=204670#post204670)? That Jumbo must be nuts (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=204685&postcount=16)! Zero chance of Scheyer coming off the bench (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=208407&postcount=25)? Looks like I was crazy (http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showpost.php?p=208587&postcount=35)again. Oh, wait. Never mind.

Just a case of a blind pig finding an acorn, you know! Seriously, many of us said we liked that lineup. I think it is a very good lineup defensively and, with the big three, it's not like the 1 and the 5 (if Duke played positions ;)) need to be big scorers.

JDev
10-25-2008, 02:12 PM
Very promising exhibition game, for the most part Duke looked really good. As someone esle said, if this game is any indication (and I hesitate the put too much stock in it), Plumlee is Duke's best big. As far as the other bigs, Lance looked great, really active. He will not start obviously, but if he can play like that he will see minutes and find his niche, which was a big question many fans had. With Zoubek I am just not that sure how much different or better of a player you are getting. He had some moments (a nice jump hook on the baseline for example) but I am holding out judgement.
That first five looked really good in the small portion I was able to see them play together, with the issues with the feed. That is clearly Duke's best defensive unite, but they may be the best offensively as well. A lot to get excited about.

mgtr
10-25-2008, 02:12 PM
Happy to see two frosh in double figures, and Lance looking for a shot. He did well when he was fed from the five. And, he seemed opportunistic, which is a good thing in the middle.

DukeBlueBlood 2.0
10-25-2008, 02:12 PM
Very happy about Plumlee's play. I agree with those that said he is already our best big man.

Question for anyone there, how was the reception for Harrison Barnes?

mo.st.dukie
10-25-2008, 02:21 PM
With Zoubek I am just not that sure how much different or better of a player you are getting. He had some moments (a nice jump hook on the baseline for example) but I am holding out judgement.


Zoubek had 5 pts and 6 rebounds in 12 minutes. Of course he fouled out but he was playing against athletic mobile players who would try to drive around him every time, he's going to get in foul trouble against those types of players. I'll take 5 and 6 from him any day especially with Miles Plumlee playing so good (14 an 7 in 16 mins.)

MChambers
10-25-2008, 02:24 PM
Zoubek had 5 pts and 6 rebounds in 12 minutes. Of course he fouled out but he was playing against athletic mobile players who would try to drive around him every time, he's going to get in foul trouble against those types of players. I'll take 5 and 6 from him any day especially with Miles Plumlee playing so good (14 an 7 in 16 mins.)

And remember that he's coming off a very long layoff. He'll get better as the season progresses.

Kedsy
10-25-2008, 02:29 PM
Zoubek had 5 pts and 6 rebounds in 12 minutes. Of course he fouled out but he was playing against athletic mobile players who would try to drive around him every time, he's going to get in foul trouble against those types of players. I'll take 5 and 6 from him any day especially with Miles Plumlee playing so good (14 an 7 in 16 mins.)

How often will he play against non-athletic, immobile players at this level?

I agree the per-minute production was strong (he also had 3 blocks and 2 steals, I believe), but 5 fouls in 12 minutes is unacceptable if he wants to play anything close to a major role on this team.

Plus, you could argue that the strong rebounding and the blocks were at least partially due to the fact that Virginia Union has a very small team (at least I think they do; I wasn't able to watch the game), so if you discount the fouls for that reason you probably have to discount some of the other numbers as well. Also, I don't think Plumlee had many fouls, and he was playing against the same mobile, athletic players, wasn't he?

BlueintheFace
10-25-2008, 02:31 PM
Here is my rundown of the game player by player (Nobody played over 20 minutes):

Miles Plumlee- I am starting off with Miles because he was probably the MVP. He had just one foul in 16 minutes of action. He hit 6/9 fgs for 14 points. He pulled down 7 rebounds and also managed to get 2 blocks (plus many more affected shots) and 2 steals. Man, I am so excited about this kid!!!

Zoubek- 3 fouls in five first half minutes... not good. He had a few nice hits, but it didn't look great out there.

Olek Czyz- Had one nice play in the waning minutes. He just won't be getting a lot of pt this year, but he has the athleticism to grow into a real role in his next 4 years.

Lance Thomas- LT did a great job cleaning up on broken plays and finishing at the rim. 11 points, not too shabby! He seems to play better when he doesn't have to post up and can play off the big men instead.

E-Will- Elliot has all the tools and confidence to succeed here. He showed a great ability to slash and get to the line which is certainly something we need. He also had pretty good vision out there. Ran the point for the last 5 minutes with very few errors. He tied for the game's high scorer with Kyle at 15 points and did most of his damage on the line (7/10)

Marty Pocius- He and E-will are competing for playing time behind scheyer and those practices are going to get intense. Marty played much much better defense and had a few great slashing drives. HAd trouble with his three though...

Kyle Singler- Had his usual quiet high scoring night with 15 points, 5 rebounds, and 4 assists. What a stud.

Gerald Henderson- He started out struggling from the field but once he started to take the ball to the hoop his offense picked up. 14 points and a solid night.

Jon Scheyer- Jon started out very hot from three, but was very quiet after those first nine points. Didn't see the court much once we built a huge lead.

Dave Mcclure- Dave actually struggled a bit in the beginning but played some solid D after the first 5 minutes he played.

Now for the topic of everybody's conversations... the PG battle.
Look, if anybody thought Nolan was just going to be handed the starting spot on a silver platter and that Greg wouldn't fight to keep it ... oh boy.

Nolan Smith- Nolan started off terribly. He turned the ball over constantly and looked out of sync. This continued through most of the first half until he stepped it up in the last 5 minutes or so. The stats say 3 turnovers, but it could have been a bit more. However, after that, he started to make great plays and value the ball a bit more. He really started to see the court and get comfortable late in the first half. He ended the game with an impressive 6 assists as well as 8 points.

Greg Paulus- Greg was all over the place in this game. He was in the front row of the crazies, on top of cameramen, and on the floor a time or two. He saw Nolan start tonight and was not about to shrink from the challenge. He had one turnover and 5 assists to go along with his 2 steals and 8 points.

I imagine coach K is going to value these two kids' performances based on THIS YEAR (practice and games) and not who was the starter last year or who has more potential. Very simply, you have to earn it on the court. Now we can't see the practices, but after one game the edge has to go to Greg. This could change soon, but one thing is for sure. This is going to be a great competition all year long and should really push both players in practices and games.

mo.st.dukie
10-25-2008, 02:34 PM
How often will he play against non-athletic, immobile players at this level?

I agree the per-minute production was strong (he also had 3 blocks and 2 steals, I believe), but 5 fouls in 12 minutes is unacceptable if he wants to play anything close to a major role on this team.

Well, I'm talking about more post-oriented players, guys that won't step out and take him off the dribble much. 5 fouls in 12 minutes isn't good but it's just a preseason game and he's still not close to 100% after surgery.

phaedrus
10-25-2008, 02:40 PM
Yeah, Zoubek picked up a bunch of touch fouls, but it's pretty easy to play a bit smarter (or just have a few calls go your way) and avoid many of those. I thought he looked really solid. I don't know why people were expecting him to become Yao Ming over the summer - you're going to see incremental improvements from him, at best, but it won't take many of them before he's a really important player.

I thought EWill looked great in the last 6-7 minutes.

summerwind03
10-25-2008, 02:41 PM
Blue in the face, thanks for the player by player writeup. Very helpful. I'm starting to get a sense of this team from afar, and I'm liking what I sense!

mo.st.dukie
10-25-2008, 02:49 PM
Yeah, Zoubek picked up a bunch of touch fouls, but it's pretty easy to play a bit smarter (or just have a few calls go your way) and avoid many of those. I thought he looked really solid. I don't know why people were expecting him to become Yao Ming over the summer - you're going to see incremental improvements from him, at best, but it won't take many of them before he's a really important player.


I definitely think he's improved since last year, I guess people were expecting him to be a dominant force but Zoubek's not going to be that guy. He's slowly improving and he's going to keep improving every day. If he averages 5 and 6 or 5 and 5 that's really good, especially if Miles is getting 8 and 6 or 8 and 7 a night.

Diddy
10-25-2008, 02:49 PM
You said earlier that it is apparant that coach K is valuing Nolan's Defense over Greg's offense. Nice insight.

That said, do you (or the staff) think that Nolan's offense will catch up over the season to where the gap between him and Greg will be narrower come March.

I ask this because I think we can all agree that Greg will not improve much over the year. He is a good player and brings certain qualities to the board, but what you see is what you get. Nolan on the other hand has the potential to really improve over the season.

Is K planning for March already, or is Nolan's starting gig solely the result of better practices, or whatever.

Thanks

Huh?
10-25-2008, 02:54 PM
Discuss. (Well, only if you want to.)

Smith: I really like his defensive pressure, speed on the break, and his ability to finish around the rim. He brings so much to the table, if he can get his shot to consistently fall he will be one of our best.

Scheyer: Love this guy, I hear a lot about his D being sub-par, but I think he is a really good defender, especially off the ball. A three point threat and his intangibles are great and his knack for the ball are the nearly the best for someone I have seen (I'm young, anyone care to comment on these I would like to hear) at his size.

Henderson: Our most talented. Enough said

Singler: Battier Jr. I may get yelled at for that, but he is everywhere, can do all things well. Defends several positions, can score many ways, has handles, rebounds, great passer......now lets see what kind of leader he can be.

Plumlee: Athletic and a hustle player. Defends the rim and can finish when needed. We will see how he pans out over the course of a tough ACC run, but I saw him in high school and really liked how he loved to do the dirty work even though he was a big time recruit.

Together this combo of players are not only offensively talented, but they are also good defenders and athletic (which is what I thought we lacked the last couple of years overall). Each player brings something different to the table. These guys just seem like a good mix and they must be since K is starting them together. I know its the first game and an exhibition, but I'm excited about seeing this as our lineup for the year.

Carlos
10-25-2008, 03:11 PM
It's really hard to get a feel for things out of this game because Virginia Union, like almost every DII team, had absolutely no size. To paraphrase Rick Pitino - Charles Oakley was not walking through that door... Ben Wallace was not walking through that door. Instead it was Lemoyne Williams and Gregg Thondique and that's just not the same thing.

So Miles Plumlee getting 14 and 7 seems fine but when you're doing it on guys who are 4 inches shorter than you it may not be nearly as impressive. Thomas was very solid and active as always. Right now he's easily the best defensive big man we have in the open floor. In a halfcourt set that may not be the case but when Thomas is on the floor Duke should always press.

The team looked like a group that's only practiced one week and there will be plenty of stuff to work on. Smith only had two field goals but they were both big league moves. Surprisingly, Paulus was the third player off the bench but as noted above, he played hard when he was in there.

Czyz looked really lost when he was on the floor but to be fair a good chunk of that time he was playing at the 3 position which I'm betting is not something he was very familiar with.

VAGentleman05
10-25-2008, 03:18 PM
Very happy about Plumlee's play. I agree with those that said he is already our best big man.

Question for anyone there, how was the reception for Harrison Barnes?

I heard the students chanting for him at least one time.

quickgtp
10-25-2008, 03:24 PM
Just a case of a blind pig finding an acorn, you know! Seriously, many of us said we liked that lineup. I think it is a very good lineup defensively and, with the big three, it's not like the 1 and the 5 (if Duke played positions ;)) need to be big scorers.


Careful, don't upset or disagree with Jumbo! LOL

Yes, he was one of a bunch that agreed on that lineup. It is still early, and this is exhibition season. Let's see how things go DTR.....

Thank you to those who were there and gave updates! I am psyched for the real season to start!

BTW, here is a link to the box score in PDF:

http://www.goduke.com/pdf7/149616.pdf?ATCLID=1611262&SPSID=22724&SPID=1845&DB_OEM_ID=4200

DukeBlue83
10-25-2008, 03:43 PM
From What i saw, Harrison Barnes He sat Beside Andre Dawkins the whole game and Ryan Kelly was sitting with them. During half Andre and Harrison went to the locker room with the team.

MulletMan
10-25-2008, 03:45 PM
It's really hard to get a feel for things out of this game because Virginia Union, like almost every DII team, had absolutely no size. To paraphrase Rick Pitino - Charles Oakley was not walking through that door... Ben Wallace was not walking through that door. Instead it was Lemoyne Williams and Gregg Thondique and that's just not the same thing.

So Miles Plumlee getting 14 and 7 seems fine but when you're doing it on guys who are 4 inches shorter than you it may not be nearly as impressive. Thomas was very solid and active as always. Right now he's easily the best defensive big man we have in the open floor. In a halfcourt set that may not be the case but when Thomas is on the floor Duke should always press.

The team looked like a group that's only practiced one week and there will be plenty of stuff to work on. Smith only had two field goals but they were both big league moves. Surprisingly, Paulus was the third player off the bench but as noted above, he played hard when he was in there.

Czyz looked really lost when he was on the floor but to be fair a good chunk of that time he was playing at the 3 position which I'm betting is not something he was very familiar with.


Yes, but the reincarnation of Nigel "Big Jelly" Dixon walked through the door!

The best part about Plumlee, offensively, is that he can get up and down the floor better than Zoubs.

I was suprised that Paulus did not come into the game until the 14 minute mark of the first half, but he did shoot well.

I think Marty looks to be one of the most improved players in that he is more agressive, and I don't think he'll be an offensive liability.

This game was, for the most part, kind of painful to watch. LIttle flow, little competition and there were stretches where our shot selection was attrocious. Did we shoot 5 consecutive 3 balls to start the second half? Without even looking to move the ball or pass inside?

The best play of the game was in the half court during the second half where Nolan made a nice entry pass to Z on the block and he dished the ball to LT cutting behind him for the lay in. Good hands, good vision, everybody where they were supposed to be.

I agree with Carlos, though, very difficult to tell what's going on with this team due to the level of competition.

3rd Dukie
10-25-2008, 03:48 PM
Blue in the face, thanks for the player by player writeup. Very helpful. I'm starting to get a sense of this team from afar, and I'm liking what I sense!

Blue - Same here thanks much!
Jumbo - Good call!

This might be fun.

Oriole Way
10-25-2008, 04:03 PM
From What i saw, Harrison Barnes He sat Beside Andre Dawkins the whole game and Ryan Kelly was sitting with them. During half Andre and Harrison went to the locker room with the team.

I think the fact Andre Dawkins is on the Barnes case is the best news I've heard from the exhibition thus far.

Very happy if Andre was indeed there working on Barnes. Safe to say he did a great job with Hairston and Thornton.

BlueintheFace
10-25-2008, 05:28 PM
Here is a quote from Nolan after the game:


“We have many players in this locker room that can start,” said Smith. “My goal right now is to keep it up, keep running the team, and keep playing defense. Come the first game, whoever is starting, it doesn’t really matter to me, and it doesn’t matter to Greg [Paulus]. We are going to continue to come in and play together like we did today, and be maybe the best two point guards in the ACC.”

Compare this to these words from Ty Lawson:

"We're gonna kill Duke this year...Greg Paulus, I'm comin' for ya."


... YAH, I'm definitely ready to get this season rolling. Bring it Ty!!!

ACCBBallFan
10-25-2008, 06:40 PM
It's really hard to get a feel for things out of this game because Virginia Union, like almost every DII team, had absolutely no size. ...
So Miles Plumlee getting 14 and 7 seems fine but when you're doing it on guys who are 4 inches shorter than you it may not be nearly as impressive. Thomas was very solid and active as always. Right now he's easily the best defensive big man we have in the open floor. In a halfcourt set that may not be the case but when Thomas is on the floor Duke should always press.



That's exactly the point I was going to make about Plumlee and Lance looking good. Certainly vs. guys as small or smaller than them, remains to be seen how they wiill fare vs/ 6.9" 240 pounders vis a vis Zoubek. Duke will need both. Z needs to keep his hands straight up on D or refs will call whether he really does foul or not.

Same VA Union point about Nolan starting. Against this type of team, Nolan will fare better but against others, you may see Greg start. They will both play about the same amount IMO.

One exhibition game does not a trend or starter projection make, just as it would not have if Lance/Zoubs and Greg had started. For a variety of reasons, good to start Miles and Nolan this game, not Z or Greg, though it would not matter since VA Union was obviously over matched except possibly vs. Duke's third stringers.

K said in the post game only reason he played Elliott at PG was to let him practice defense, not to run the team.

But he was better off the dribble.

I tried to rank the player performances taking all the stats into consideration, including who fouled out or would have fouled out in 40 minutes.

Results are farily consistent with eye winess accounts by posters. I only saw the second half since GoDuke.com PPV had problems first half.

Today vs VA Union I came up with:

Henderson47
Plumlee 44
Thomas 40
Smith 34
Singler 33
Williams 32
Paulus 29
Scheyer 25
Zoubek 23
McClure 18
Pocius 08

Even though Zoubs had a lot of fouls, he also had some decent metrics in the 12 minutes he played.

This is not to say Scheyer should not be starting, just that it was not a stellar game for him, relative to some of his teammates.

http://www.goduke.com/pdf7/149616.pdf?ATCLID=1611262&SPSID=22726&SPID=1845&DB_OEM_ID=4200

I excluded Steve Johnson who played great in his few minutes and Olek Czyz since their few minutes when extrapolated to 40 would be skewed, and also since they clearly are third stingers.

With the exception of Zoubek and Paulus, just about everybody on Duke is a good to better than good athlete, and the best athletes at their respective positions seemed to fare best against a fast small relatively inexperienced team.

dukestheheat
10-25-2008, 07:17 PM
Blue in the Face-

Thank you for your excellent synopsis of the team performance! One former favorite player for Duke (for me) is Thomas Hill; I read your comments about Elliot Williams and I thought about T Hill when you noted that Williams 'could slash and get to the line' and that he'd 'run the point for about 5 minutes with no errors'. I'm wondering if you see some of T Hill in Williams?

thanks,

dth.

kinghoops
10-25-2008, 08:25 PM
im still convinced that the trio of plumlee, thomas and zoubs can handle the 5 position in a very respectable manner, maybe would like to see the number of threes come down to around the 20 mark

jimsumner
10-25-2008, 08:42 PM
"Scheyer: Love this guy, I hear a lot about his D being sub-par"

If someone try to tell you that Scheyer plays sub-par defense, then you can tune them out, because that person has just indicated that they know not of what they speak.

I'm not sure I see the Elliott Williams-Thomas Hill connection. Thomas was mcuh stronger and EW has a lot of work to do to be TH's equal on defense. And Hill was a great rebounder for a guard.

But Hill had very mediocre ball skills for an All-ACC caliber guard. In 141 games at Duke, he had 177 assists and 189 turnovers. I'll be very surprised and very disappointed if Williams doesn't do a lot better than 1.2 assists per game over his Duke career.

elvis14
10-25-2008, 10:00 PM
Thanks for the posts from those of you that were able to watch the game today. I was very excited to hear about the starting lineup (Nolan!) and to see Miles do so much damage. I know the competition is weak but hey, I've been waiting so long for Duke Hoops to start back up, just hearing about any Duke basketball game right now has me geeked. I think we are smart enough to celebrate the good play against this kind of team without losing perspective. I hope that Marty has made and continues to make strides and although the reports of Zoubeks play haven't been great, I think that just getting him court time is a good thing. I bet he'll be more in sync in a couple of weeks and our 3 headed monster at the 5 will do it's share of damage.

I see yet another post pimping Jon and his defense and overall play....good! What I don't see mentioned all that often is just how good things tend to happen around that guy. With talent, hustle and skill he does all the stuff that shows up in the stat sheet but what I notice about him is how many subtle things he does that benefits the team. Just things like tipping a ball to a teammate or being in the right position or setting a quality pick and the way he's always around the ball when it's loose. I see the same sort of stuff happen around McClure as well but just not to Jon's level. It's fun to watch and it's the reason I love watching him play.

BlueintheFace
10-25-2008, 10:18 PM
Blue in the Face-

Thank you for your excellent synopsis of the team performance! One former favorite player for Duke (for me) is Thomas Hill; I read your comments about Elliot Williams and I thought about T Hill when you noted that Williams 'could slash and get to the line' and that he'd 'run the point for about 5 minutes with no errors'. I'm wondering if you see some of T Hill in Williams?

thanks,

dth.

I'm not so sure Thomas Hill is the best comparison. Perhaps Daniel Ewing would be a bit closer. Let me know if any of you agree/ disagree. It is pretty hard to compare current Duke players to former ones since there are always differences to be found. Plus, it is still early in his career... we shall see, but Ewing is the first that comes to mind for me.

devildeac
10-25-2008, 10:24 PM
The old, big-headed Blue Devil was also there and well-received by the crowd;).

jimsumner
10-25-2008, 10:58 PM
"I'm not so sure Thomas Hill is the best comparison. Perhaps Daniel Ewing would be a bit closer."

Ewing is closer than T. Hill, IMO. I see some similarities with Phil Henderson, some with Jeff Capel but I think EW has a bit more explosiveness and thus a higher ceiling.

ldavid1
10-26-2008, 07:09 AM
With the exception of Zoubek and Paulus, just about everybody on Duke is a good to better than good athlete, and the best athletes at their respective positions seemed to fare best against a fast small relatively inexperienced team.


Not sure I understand this comment......I think Paulus is a tremendoous athlete!! Maybe not the quickest but an incredible athlete just the same.

davekay1971
10-26-2008, 07:51 AM
I'm excited by everything I read about this game. Granted, yes, the level of competition needs to be taken into account. But, some good early season trends:

1) Smith and Paulus are both excellent point guard options, each with his own strengths...and they can play 1-2 when the situation calls for it. Solid play at the point is essential for a deep run in March. How many teams in the country will be able to call on two point guards of this quality?

2) Miles Plumlee is ready to contribute right away - not just from what we saw in the VU game, but also with what he did in the Blue-White scrimmage. Along with Zoubek and Thomas, that gives us 3 bodies to play at the 5...and may even allow Thomas to spell Singler at the 4. We should be much better off trying to defend the post and get boards compared with last year.

3) Williams appears able to contribute at the 2. Obviously our backcourt is loaded, but he brings a different skill set than Scheyer or Pocius, which we can use to exploit mismatches. Imagine a team trying to find 3 guys quick enough to keep Williams, Smith, and Henderson out of the lane at the same time...

4) With Scheyer, Singler, and Henderson, we've got 3 talented, smart, versatile scorers. Add in Paulus's 3 point shooting and fearlessness, Smith's ability to drive and create. Anything offense we can get from the 5 spot will be gravy. Teams will not be able to shut us down this year.

Did Lawson really say that about Duke? I hope Carolina gets caught up reading their press clippings this year. I really do. I hope they believe every talking head and sportswriter who's already handed them the championship. Duke's got something for them...

davekay1971
10-26-2008, 07:54 AM
4) With Scheyer, Singler, and Henderson, we've got 3 talented, smart, versatile scorers. Add in Paulus's 3 point shooting and fearlessness, Smith's ability to drive and create. Anything offense we can get from the 5 spot will be gravy. Teams will not be able to shut us down this year.

Wow, I really need to drink my coffee before I post. That was a virtually incoherent paragraph. I'm just going to stop posting for awhile...

Saratoga2
10-26-2008, 10:59 AM
Here is my rundown of the game player by player (Nobody played over 20 minutes):

Miles Plumlee- I am starting off with Miles because he was probably the MVP. He had just one foul in 16 minutes of action. He hit 6/9 fgs for 14 points. He pulled down 7 rebounds and also managed to get 2 blocks (plus many more affected shots) and 2 steals. Man, I am so excited about this kid!!!

Zoubek- 3 fouls in five first half minutes... not good. He had a few nice hits, but it didn't look great out there.

Olek Czyz- Had one nice play in the waning minutes. He just won't be getting a lot of pt this year, but he has the athleticism to grow into a real role in his next 4 years.

Lance Thomas- LT did a great job cleaning up on broken plays and finishing at the rim. 11 points, not too shabby! He seems to play better when he doesn't have to post up and can play off the big men instead.

E-Will- Elliot has all the tools and confidence to succeed here. He showed a great ability to slash and get to the line which is certainly something we need. He also had pretty good vision out there. Ran the point for the last 5 minutes with very few errors. He tied for the game's high scorer with Kyle at 15 points and did most of his damage on the line (7/10)

Marty Pocius- He and E-will are competing for playing time behind scheyer and those practices are going to get intense. Marty played much much better defense and had a few great slashing drives. HAd trouble with his three though...

Kyle Singler- Had his usual quiet high scoring night with 15 points, 5 rebounds, and 4 assists. What a stud.

Gerald Henderson- He started out struggling from the field but once he started to take the ball to the hoop his offense picked up. 14 points and a solid night.

Jon Scheyer- Jon started out very hot from three, but was very quiet after those first nine points. Didn't see the court much once we built a huge lead.

Dave Mcclure- Dave actually struggled a bit in the beginning but played some solid D after the first 5 minutes he played.

Now for the topic of everybody's conversations... the PG battle.
Look, if anybody thought Nolan was just going to be handed the starting spot on a silver platter and that Greg wouldn't fight to keep it ... oh boy.

Nolan Smith- Nolan started off terribly. He turned the ball over constantly and looked out of sync. This continued through most of the first half until he stepped it up in the last 5 minutes or so. The stats say 3 turnovers, but it could have been a bit more. However, after that, he started to make great plays and value the ball a bit more. He really started to see the court and get comfortable late in the first half. He ended the game with an impressive 6 assists as well as 8 points.

Greg Paulus- Greg was all over the place in this game. He was in the front row of the crazies, on top of cameramen, and on the floor a time or two. He saw Nolan start tonight and was not about to shrink from the challenge. He had one turnover and 5 assists to go along with his 2 steals and 8 points.

I imagine coach K is going to value these two kids' performances based on THIS YEAR (practice and games) and not who was the starter last year or who has more potential. Very simply, you have to earn it on the court. Now we can't see the practices, but after one game the edge has to go to Greg. This could change soon, but one thing is for sure. This is going to be a great competition all year long and should really push both players in practices and games.


Thanks for your very good synopsis of the players performances. I have been unable to see any of their work this year and look forward to television coverage.

It is encouraging to see the depth at each position. That should provide relief when the inevitable injuries or sicknesses occur, plus we should be able to use fresh legs without too much of a drop off. It may even be possible this year to get 30 minutes a game out of our big men with reasonable points, rebounds and defense. We really didn't have that last year and had to rely on Singler to do so much inside that it impacted his play later in the year. Looking forward to a very fine season.

awhom111
10-26-2008, 11:03 AM
It's really hard to get a feel for things out of this game because Virginia Union, like almost every DII team, had absolutely no size. To paraphrase Rick Pitino - Charles Oakley was not walking through that door... Ben Wallace was not walking through that door. Instead it was Lemoyne Williams and Gregg Thondique and that's just not the same thing.

You do realize that Ben Wallace went to Virginia Union, right?

Diddy
10-26-2008, 11:07 AM
"Scheyer: Love this guy, I hear a lot about his D being sub-par"

If someone try to tell you that Scheyer plays sub-par defense, then you can tune them out, because that person has just indicated that they know not of what they speak.



It is not that Scheyer is a "Bad" defender. Saying this is wrong, because such a phrase would serve to encompass the totality of playing Defense.

Overall, Jon is a good defender. He is a mediocre on the ball defender. What he lacks in pure athleticism he almost makes up for in intelligence and anticipation. But the bottom line is that he will have some trouble with a superior athlete in a clearout situtation.

Despite this imperfection, Scheyer is good overall defender, mainly becuase he is one of the best off the ball, or team, defenders that Duke has ever had. His team defensive skills are up their with Battier (who could do it all on D). He anticipates passes, jumps passing lanes, and gets a hand in there to disprupt whatever is going on. This more than makes up for the handful of times a year that he gets burned.

I think this is why K started Nolan. With Paulus and Scheyer, there are too many defenders who have trouble staying in front of their guy. Having one on the court is fine, especially if the other guy in the backcourt is a great defender. Our guards help and switch on each others guys all the time. You can have one weak(ish) tooth on the cog and be OK, but you can't have two weak(ish) tooths on the cog, especially if they are right next to each other.

This means that the starting quesion is not between Nolan and Paulus, but rather between Paulus and Scheyer. Right now, and probably going forward, Scheyer simply brings more to the table on O and D than Paulus. All three will play, and probably at the same time occasionally, but to start the game with two of our weaker on-the-ball defenders has the potential to get Duke off on the wrong foot.

LetItBD08
10-26-2008, 11:08 AM
You do realize that Ben Wallace went to Virginia Union, right?

They both did. To be fair, from a strictly height-wise argument, they both could be considered undersized for their positions.

Jumbo
10-26-2008, 11:08 AM
You do realize that Ben Wallace went to Virginia Union, right?

That was the point of Carlos' post. Ben Wallace went to Virginia Union. He's not there anymore.

CameronBornAndBred
10-26-2008, 12:01 PM
Any chance of correcting the score on the homepage. It's right in the article.(which by the way is a great breakdown, especially for those of us who could not watch it) Hate giving the other team 10 free points.

Philadukie
10-26-2008, 12:36 PM
It is not that Scheyer is a "Bad" defender. Saying this is wrong, because such a phrase would serve to encompass the totality of playing Defense.

Overall, Jon is a good defender. He is a mediocre on the ball defender. What he lacks in pure athleticism he almost makes up for in intelligence and anticipation. But the bottom line is that he will have some trouble with a superior athlete in a clearout situtation.

Despite this imperfection, Scheyer is good overall defender, mainly becuase he is one of the best off the ball, or team, defenders that Duke has ever had. His team defensive skills are up their with Battier (who could do it all on D). He anticipates passes, jumps passing lanes, and gets a hand in there to disprupt whatever is going on. This more than makes up for the handful of times a year that he gets burned.

I think this is why K started Nolan. With Paulus and Scheyer, there are too many defenders who have trouble staying in front of their guy. Having one on the court is fine, especially if the other guy in the backcourt is a great defender. Our guards help and switch on each others guys all the time. You can have one weak(ish) tooth on the cog and be OK, but you can't have two weak(ish) tooths on the cog, especially if they are right next to each other.

This means that the starting quesion is not between Nolan and Paulus, but rather between Paulus and Scheyer. Right now, and probably going forward, Scheyer simply brings more to the table on O and D than Paulus. All three will play, and probably at the same time occasionally, but to start the game with two of our weaker on-the-ball defenders has the potential to get Duke off on the wrong foot.

Yes, I think your post highlights the missed nuance that generates dispute over Scheyer's D. He is one of the best defenders on the team, when you consider all aspects of playing defense. However, his on-the-ball defense, although good, is not as good as, say, Nolan, or a similar quick-footed guard. This does not mean that he is a worse defender than Nolan, however. In fact, I would argue he's better because of how well he exceeds in those other aspects you mention.

(Not picking on Nolan, just using him as an example. You can substitute any other quick on-the-ball defender.)

RainingThrees
10-26-2008, 01:55 PM
Not sure I understand this comment......I think Paulus is a tremendoous athlete!! Maybe not the quickest but an incredible athlete just the same.


Are you serious?

Jumbo
10-26-2008, 02:14 PM
[Scheyer] is a mediocre on the ball defender. What he lacks in pure athleticism he almost makes up for in intelligence and anticipation. But the bottom line is that he will have some trouble with a superior athlete in a clearout situtation.

Can you point to some examples? This is a myth and I think I know the source: Eric Maynor. People remember that one play very clearly, don't pay any attention to where Duke's help defenders were in that specific scheme, forget that Maynor had gone right all day and hadn't pulled up, and don't know the scouting report. I submit that were it not for that one jumper, no one would even mention Scheyer's on-ball D. Plus, he was guarding a point guard. At 6'5", that shouldn't have to be his job, but he got shifted onto Maynor because Paulus couldn't stay with him.

But they idea that he can't guard superior athletes in clear-out situations is silly. Here's just one example (and I can dig up more, if you like): Thaddeus Young. Scheyer faced him twice when both were freshmen. Young is a FREAKISH athlete -- 6'8", quick, long -- he actually started at the FOUR for the Sixers down the stretch last year, and is moving back to the three this year. Anyway, in thieir first matchup, Scheyer guarded Young for most of the game. He only got off five shot attempts. Granted, he hit four of them, but five attempts in 32 minutes is darn good D. And Young turned it over four times. Gotta give Scheyer credit there. In the second meeting (I remember writing about this at the time), Scheyer drew the assignment on Young again for much of the game. Young was 3-for-7 in 31 minutes for seven points. You're not going to face many more athletic wings at the college level. Scheyer, as a freshman, did an excellent job.

As I said, there's more where that came from. Just let me know if I should do more digging.


I think this is why K started Nolan. With Paulus and Scheyer, there are too many defenders who have trouble staying in front of their guy. Having one on the court is fine, especially if the other guy in the backcourt is a great defender. Our guards help and switch on each others guys all the time. You can have one weak(ish) tooth on the cog and be OK, but you can't have two weak(ish) tooths on the cog, especially if they are right next to each other.

This means that the starting quesion is not between Nolan and Paulus, but rather between Paulus and Scheyer. Right now, and probably going forward, Scheyer simply brings more to the table on O and D than Paulus. All three will play, and probably at the same time occasionally, but to start the game with two of our weaker on-the-ball defenders has the potential to get Duke off on the wrong foot.

This is not correct. The staff loves Scheyer's D. Next time you see one of the coaches, ask them. Heck, this is one of the biggest reasons he started over Hendo as a frosh, and I think they'd still take Scheyer's D over Henderson's. The battle is purely between Smith and Paulus. Yes, those two will play some together. And sure, everyone would prefer that Scheyer guard wings and not opposing point guards. But there's a problem defensively regardless of who is playing alongside Paulus. Because even if Smith/Scheyer pick up the point guard, Paulus gives up heigt AND quickness to opposing shooting guards.

JDev
10-26-2008, 03:02 PM
Sheyer seems to suffer from the same sort of perceptions on the defensive end of the floor that JJ did during his time at Duke. Sheyer, like JJ, is a very smart and quality off the ball perimeter defender. He has a high basketball IQ and understands positioning, and that goes a long way (I remember JJ denying a wing pass to McCants at the end of a close game at Cameron because he knew where the ball would go, as they used that same play late to beat UConn). To go with the Young example mentioned above, Sheyer has also faired reasonably well against Ellington.

RainingThrees
10-26-2008, 04:14 PM
I just wish Jon would look for his shot a little more. There are tons of times when he has had a wide open 3 and he passes the ball.

DevilCastDownfromDurham
10-26-2008, 04:48 PM
(I remember JJ denying a wing pass to McCants at the end of a close game at Cameron because he knew where the ball would go, as they used that same play late to beat UConn).

Mmm, thanks for that. J.J., in fact, sealed the win for us with that play in 2005 (i.e. the last time we beat UNC at Cameron). Like a warm bath on a cold night, that's a memory that always makes me very, very happy. :)

On a different point, I remember Jumbo suggesting last spring that there could be a place for Duke to full-court press in a quasi-Nolan Richardson fashion with Lance at the 5 and Nolan, Jon, G, and Kyle behind him. I still really like that idea and am curious if others (esp. Jumbo) still think that's a viable option and if people in the know have heard any suggestion that the coaches are looking that way.

I've really, really missed "Duke" defense of the Billy King, Tommy Amaker, Shane Battier school, where opposing guards are just completely lost and offenses never even get started past the half court line. I think we might have the horses for that again, both at specific positions and in terms of team depth and attitude. I'd love to see it cultivated and unleashed, especially on some of those "big" team that have abused us in the post recently. Speed kills, and I'm ready to see us run some teams off their feet.

BlueintheFace
10-26-2008, 04:55 PM
I just wish Jon would look for his shot a little more. There are tons of times when he has had a wide open 3 and he passes the ball.

As do I, but in my opinion this is a bit of a complex issue. Scheyer has a very good sense of spacing on the floor and does a great job of finding openings on the perimeter for his shot. The problem is, when he finds his opening for shots, he has this minor bad habit-- He often pump fakes on closing defenders when he should rise up for the open shot.

Now, I understand the value of this. If the defender closes too fast and bites on the pump then Scheyer has an open lane to score or create an interior basket. However, lots of defenders do not bite on the fake and have learned the correct way to close out on shooters. This leads to Scheyer having NO shot. In my opinion Scheyer should use his shot fake a good deal less and rise up for the open shot more (the exception being in transition when the close out is often from behind).

DukieInBrasil
10-26-2008, 04:57 PM
Before we get all hot and bothered by our performance against VUU, let's keep a few things in mind. It was the first exhibition game for both teams, so as much as we may have looked out of synch at times, at least the same goes for them. This is why I don't put too much stock in the offensive output of any players, or the lack thereof. Defensive intensity is worth taking a look at, and K said that he liked what he saw. Also worth remembering is that exh. games are a good time to get a look at new players and/or give minutes to guys who the staff is uncertain about. I think it's pretty safe to say that K is not uncertain about how he wants to use The Gerald, Kyle and Jon, leaving pretty much everybody else under observation.

As a distant observer and regular reader of this board, there were two things that were most in question and most people were "eagerest" to see. Let's get to the one that garnered the most surprise, Plumlee starting and/or piling up more stats than Z. Congrats to the Fr., first of all. He got an opportunity and made a very good show of it. But the same criticism that was used against Z (facing smaller, slower players than in ACC and he STILL didn't score a zillion points and haul in a gazillion rebs) also must be kept in perspective when lauding Miles. Also keep in mind that Z is still recovering from his foot surgery and will continue to make gradual progress for a while. In any case, if we get even half of the production in ACC games that we got from this pair against VUU, Duke will be sitting pretty.

Second attention grabber: Nolan starting over Paulus. This is something many people have wanted to see for a while and while Nolan didn't stink up the joint, IMHO, he did not run away with the gig. If anything, both played well enough to keep this a hot-button issue for a while to come, which can only benefit Duke if both guys can keep their egos in check, which from what they are saying to the press, seems to be the case. What I liked from GP was the a/to, 5/1. That alone will garner minutes for the Sr; while Nolan's was pretty atrocious, 6/5 (actually about the same as last year). Neither scored prolifically, nor did they need to. Apparently Greg was up to the task in terms of playing with guts, and I'm assuming that Nolan played hard D as well. In the end, I think K is gonna ask Greg to pull a Nate James and acquiesce the starting gig to Nolan, but the duel between the two will hopefully extract every last ounce of talent, passion and determination from the both of them. The competition is still close enough that the one that does not give his all will not start.

The starting line-up surprised me somewhat, not that K went with that squad, but that he went with it so early. I seriously doubt that we will see this line-up every game. As he has done in the past, K is not afraid to experiment with line-ups, especially early in the year, to get players' attention, to get a feel for how different combos work together, etc. Do not be surprised to see a different line-up starting the 2nd exh. game.

So what have we learned so far in Phase 0, ao nosso amigo Jumbo? Mostly that K is still discovering what his team has to offer. I guess we learned that MiP can be a capable player at the 5, and that the Showdown at the Point Guard Corral is not over yet.

RainingThrees
10-26-2008, 04:58 PM
Did anyone film any part of the game? Some youtube clips would be amazing if anyone did film anything. Oh and did you guys show Harrison Barnes how a game in Cameron is?

Jumbo
10-26-2008, 05:56 PM
Sheyer seems to suffer from the same sort of perceptions on the defensive end of the floor that JJ did during his time at Duke. Sheyer, like JJ, is a very smart and quality off the ball perimeter defender. He has a high basketball IQ and understands positioning, and that goes a long way (I remember JJ denying a wing pass to McCants at the end of a close game at Cameron because he knew where the ball would go, as they used that same play late to beat UConn). To go with the Young example mentioned above, Sheyer has also faired reasonably well against Ellington.

Again, I don't see many similarities between Scheyer (is his name really that tough to spell) and Redick. J.J. was never a good defender. I never claimed he was. He probably never claimed he was (that excellent read against McCants notwithstanding). I see Scheyer as a plus-defender. The coaching staff sees him as a plus-defender. Scouts see him as a plus-defender. Opposing teams see him as a plus-defender. I'm not sure what else it takes to convince people. Just like he's nowhere close to the shooter J.J. was, J.J. was nowhere to the defender/playmaker Scheyer is. Apples and oranges -- let's stop comparing them to one another.

jimsumner
10-26-2008, 06:22 PM
"Scheyer (is his name really that tough to spell?)"

Naw, John's name is real easy to spell. :)

BlueintheFace
10-26-2008, 06:41 PM
The starting line-up surprised me somewhat

You weren't the only one...

http://community.foxsports.com/blogs/goodmanonfox/2008/10/26/DUKES_NEW_LOOK_PAULUS_ON_BENCH

ACCBBallFan
10-26-2008, 07:45 PM
Not sure I understand this comment......I think Paulus is a tremendoous athlete!! Maybe not the quickest but an incredible athlete just the same.

I agree Greg was a great high school athlete, being all state in two sports. But he is not going to out athlete many college PGs.

So if his competition is the normal US population, or the not so normal posters on this board, yes, Greg is a great athlete.

But given that anybody who plays college basketball is greater than the majority of that compettition, relative to ACC basketball players Greg's athleticsim in his new peer group is average at best.

OTOH, Greg shoots 3's a lot better than most college players, has great court sense. leaership skills and a lot of other admirable traits. Duke is fortunate to have two PGs who in the aggregate are such a great composite PG, to be used as the sitation warrants.

JDev
10-26-2008, 08:26 PM
Again, I don't see many similarities between Scheyer (is his name really that tough to spell) and Redick. J.J. was never a good defender. I never claimed he was. He probably never claimed he was (that excellent read against McCants notwithstanding). I see Scheyer as a plus-defender. The coaching staff sees him as a plus-defender. Scouts see him as a plus-defender. Opposing teams see him as a plus-defender. I'm not sure what else it takes to convince people. Just like he's nowhere close to the shooter J.J. was, J.J. was nowhere to the defender/playmaker Scheyer is. Apples and oranges -- let's stop comparing them to one another.

I know comparisons are often coupled with unrealistic expectations, but they are not necessarily as bad as some think, IMHO. It provides Duke fans with a frame of reference. In talking about the two in the same sentence no one is saying Scheyer will become Duke and the ACC's all-time leading scorer. The two play the same position, for the same coach, in the same era, at the same university. It is okay to talk about how their skills compare. And, once again in my opinion (which I know isn't worth a lot), I think you are selling JJ's off the ball defense a little short. But, that is neither here nor there at this moment, as he is not wearing the royal blue anymore. To stick to the task at hand, Scheyer is a very good defender and will do well against the many quality off guards he will see this year.

yancem
10-26-2008, 08:52 PM
While I'm glad to hear that Miles had a great showing, I hope that everyone maintains realistic expectations. Several freshman have gotten off to great starts in the b/w game and exhibitions only to see their minutes disappear by the time the acc games started. Zoubek was the leading scorer 2 of his first 3 games and Taylor King got off to a hot start last year. I hope that Miles ends up being a solid contributor all season but am going to wait before raising my expectations too high.

All that being said, if Miles ends up continuing along his current path, then what a great late pick up he will end up being. Also, since Mason is currently considered to be a better prospect, I'm really looking forward to his arrival.

duketaylor
10-26-2008, 08:55 PM
The starting line-up surprised me somewhat, not that K went with that squad, but that he went with it so early. I seriously doubt that we will see this line-up every game. As he has done in the past, K is not afraid to experiment with line-ups, especially early in the year, to get players' attention, to get a feel for how different combos work together, etc. Do not be surprised to see a different line-up starting the 2nd exh. game.

I'd think you don't pay much attention to how K runs his line-ups, then. He'll start whomever is playing/practicing the best. So I'd doubt he changes starters for the next ex game unless someone distinguished himself during the 1st ex game and warranted a change. Do you think anybody changed his mind? If not, then expect the same starters. Very possibly the same line-up to start the season. The fact that Miles started the game last night should be very telling, Nolan, as well.

This will be a deep team, that will play ball pressure a lot and run.

davekay1971
10-27-2008, 08:54 AM
"Scheyer (is his name really that tough to spell?)"

Naw, John's name is real easy to spell. :)

Yeh, John Shiar is one of my favurit I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.ies. And I think we shudn't kompair him to JJ Reddik, too.

davekay1971
10-27-2008, 08:55 AM
Yeh, John Shiar is one of my favurit I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.ies. And I think we shudn't kompair him to JJ Reddik, too.

Lord, the stuff you see edited around here. That would be dukies, as spelled in Chapel Hill NC, Stoors CT, College Park MD, and Lexington KY. Dear mods...unclench just a little.

Jumbo
10-27-2008, 09:05 AM
Lord, the stuff you see edited around here. That would be dukies, as spelled in Chapel Hill NC, Stoors CT, College Park MD, and Lexington KY. Dear mods...unclench just a little.

The board software has a language filter that automatically changes that stuff.

davekay1971
10-27-2008, 09:17 AM
The board software has a language filter that automatically changes that stuff.

I figured that much, Jumbo, thanks. Just surprised sometimes by what the software filter is programmed to catch. Me and my potty-fingers.

jimsumner
10-27-2008, 09:23 AM
A wanker? Next stop, Picadilly Square?