Bad News For Duke, Re: Kentucky

[dukeimac]

Apparently not many people have put it together yet but Kentucky's top pick to replace Tubby is Billy Donovan. With Kentucky and Florida on Patterson's list, if Billy goes to Kentucky, then so goes Patterson.

Some thought this was a good situation for Duke, i.e. Tubby out at Kentucky but it just might be the worst news.:mad:

[tux]

What's the chances that Billy would leave for UK? He didn't play there, but was an assistant under Pitino, right? I think he has little reason to leave the program he's built at UF --- I think he'll use the situation to improve his contract at UF, but my guess is that he'll stay...

[Nittany Devil]

I don't know... Patterson's mom seemed to suggest that Tubby's exodus was a poor reflection on the fans of Kentucky. I have no idea if Donovan will end up at Kentucky, but his hire would do nothing about the circumstances of Tubby's departure, which seemingly left a sour impression on the Patterson family.

[Capn Poptart]

I guess it's possible that Donovan at UK could be more attractive to PP than Donovan at UF, but that's not a given. If Patterson wants to play for Donovan, he'll play for him. It's not like Donovan is coaching a low-profile school now...

[Susan]

Let's just hope Duke makes Patterson's top 3 first, before we start worrying about anything else! Maybe his top 3 will be UVA, Wake Forest, and Duke and we won't have to worry about UK OR Donovan! :)

[dukeimac]

Just read an article that suggests Donovan is the BEST fit for Kentucky. With Donovan there, recruiting will be easier for him (after all it would be Kentucky).

Thus he would be able to get guys like Patterson (and Jai, a good friend of Patterson's) and others to come. Thus, he could sell it to Patterson that he will have a good team around him and being one of the first signees Billy might want to build around him. Thus, Kentucky would look very attractive to Patterson. Not that Duke doesn't but Duke won't build a team around him where in Kentucky Donovan might be able to do that.

And Florida is on his list. IMO, in Patterson's eyes, Donovan + Kentucky might be > than Duke.

[unexpected]

There's no way Donovan leaves for Kentucky.

Yes, Kentucky fans might want Billy Donovan, but that doesn't mean they're going to get him. This whole situation reminds me of Indiana and John Calipari last year.

Donovan has just won 1 basketball championship, and is pretty darn close to winning another. Just saying that "it's Kentucky" doesn't cut it anymore. Kentucky fans have to realize that their program has been barely relevant for the past 10 years.

After the way the fans treated Tubby Smith, Donovan would be an idiot to leave. I'm sure he'll get an offer. Florida's a huge state school, they'll beat it, and then he'll go back home. Kentucky fans will cry and they'll have to go search for another job.

IMO, the Michigan and Kentucky jobs are very similar...seemingly attractive on the surface but with huge pressure to win and terrible fans gunning for your throat.

[Susan]

Just read an article that suggests Donovan is the BEST fit for Kentucky. With Donovan there, recruiting will be easier for him (after all it would be Kentucky).

Thus he would be able to get guys like Patterson (and Jai, a good friend of Patterson's) and others to come. Thus, he could sell it to Patterson that he will have a good team around him and being one of the first signees Billy might want to build around him. Thus, Kentucky would look very attractive to Patterson. Not that Duke doesn't but Duke won't build a team around him where in Kentucky Donovan might be able to do that.

And Florida is on his list. IMO, in Patterson's eyes, Donovan + Kentucky might be > than Duke.

You may very well be right, IF Donovan went to Kentucky. How soon would that be? Would it be before Patterson needed to make a commitment (April 11)? I'm sure Kentucky would try to get Donovan as soon as possible, but, if Florida won another championship, for example, do you think Donovan would then announce in the next day or two "I'm leaving for Kentucky?" Maybe so. Just wondering about timelines.

Actually I'm hoping Butler knocks off the Gators tonight so that Donovan can make his decision more quickly...

[wiscodevil]

pet peeve of mine:
Why do people care so much about the guys we go after and/or miss out on? Every year it is the same thing - fans breathlessly awaiting the decision of some 18 yo.

K gets plenty of the best talent and even that isnt enough to satisfy some. They want ALL of the best players. Kinda silly.

Wish I had archives to look back and see how many duke fans wet themselves in anticipation of shav or mcroberts or nelson, only to complain when those players dind't realize YOUR absurd expectation levels (quickly enough).

1. Wait til Duke signs a player
2. trust K
3. cheer them on.

rant over.

[tux]

My gut tells me that we're not going to land PP. Duke's recruiting doesn't usually play out this way...

[feldspar]

rant over.

Feel better?

[throatybeard]

Apparently not many people have put it together yet but Kentucky's top pick to replace Tubby is Billy Donovan. With Kentucky and Florida on Patterson's list, if Billy goes to Kentucky, then so goes Patterson.

Some thought this was a good situation for Duke, i.e. Tubby out at Kentucky but it just might be the worst news.:mad:

The logical relationship here is flawed. That assertion is predicated on the idea that PP will go wherever Donovan goes. If that's the case, Tubby's departure has no effect on Duke, only on whether PP goes to UF or UK.

[dukeimac]

"Just saying that "it's Kentucky" doesn't cut it anymore."

Can this be said about Duke?

And I'm not saying where Donovan goes Patterson goes, but put the two together and that might make it more attractive.

As much as I want Patterson at Duke and I think Duke needs him, I'm not sure Donovan + Kentucky wouldn't be more attractive.

I just hope the current and incoming class will help to get Patterson at Duke cuz I think within 2 years Duke will be at the top again with him.

[mcdukie]

I agree with the post that says they feel we are not going to get Patterson. On one board I saw him maybe going with Jai Lucas and that would not be Duke. I hope I am wrong but I don't have a good feeling either.

[burnspbesq]

Hard to see any way that Tubby's departure and the speculation over Donovan's future reduces Duke's chances of getting Patterson (whether it increases those chances is difficult to determine).

And to the extent that Donovan decides to play the Kentucky card to extract more cash from UF, then UF has that much less cash with which to tempt Coach G.

[MChambers]

and if we have another last second inbounds play to win the game, bet Kentucky covers the guy inbounding the ball!
Look, I hope Patterson comes to Duke, but I want him to do it because he likes Duke, not because Smith's out or Donovan's moving, or whatever.

[TampaDuke]

There's no way Donovan leaves for Kentucky.

Yes, Kentucky fans might want Billy Donovan, but that doesn't mean they're going to get him. This whole situation reminds me of Indiana and John Calipari last year.

Donovan has just won 1 basketball championship, and is pretty darn close to winning another. Just saying that "it's Kentucky" doesn't cut it anymore. Kentucky fans have to realize that their program has been barely relevant for the past 10 years.

After the way the fans treated Tubby Smith, Donovan would be an idiot to leave. I'm sure he'll get an offer. Florida's a huge state school, they'll beat it, and then he'll go back home. Kentucky fans will cry and they'll have to go search for another job.

IMO, the Michigan and Kentucky jobs are very similar...seemingly attractive on the surface but with huge pressure to win and terrible fans gunning for your throat.


Agreed. There is no way that Donovan leaves UF, especially given the fact that he convinced his entire team last year to stay for another run out of loyalty. UF, while always a football school first and foremost, has injected a lot of resources and excitement into its basketball program. Combine that with its location, weather, academics, etc. and it will be a high-profile basketball program for years to come.

[wiscodevil]

Feel better?

tip top. you?

[cato]

My gut tells me that we're not going to land PP. Duke's recruiting doesn't usually play out this way...

No? How does Duke's recruiting usually play out?

[Classof06]

My gut tells me that we're not going to land PP. Duke's recruiting doesn't usually play out this way...

What!? We got Kyle Singler to leave Oregon and come across the country, we got Scheyer away from Illinois when Weber's brother was his HS coach, and we got Lance Thomas to come down even though he had natural feelings for Rutgers. Where have you been the past few years?

[jagger]

"And I'm not saying where Donovan goes Patterson goes, but put the two together and that might make it more attractive.

As much as I want Patterson at Duke and I think Duke needs him, I'm not sure Donovan + Kentucky wouldn't be more attractive.
"

You assume that he loves Billy Donovan, but is unsure about Florida, and at the same time, loves Kentucky, but is unsure about Tubby Smith.

Is that assumption true? If not, then your conclusion makes no sense.

[adam]

1. Wait til Duke signs a player
2. trust K
3. cheer them on.


Amen to that. As long as Coach K is leading the way, Duke will always be Duke.

[ikiru36]

Apparently not many people have put it together yet but Kentucky's top pick to replace Tubby is Billy Donovan. With Kentucky and Florida on Patterson's list, if Billy goes to Kentucky, then so goes Patterson.

Some thought this was a good situation for Duke, i.e. Tubby out at Kentucky but it just might be the worst news.:mad:

I, honestly, just don't get the negativity. We're guessing at a lot of hypotheticals here which to me is a situation which provides a Rorschach as to people's underlying attitudes. If (huge "if") Donovan were to go to Kentucky, there is turmoil at both of the other main schools Patterson is likely considering (keeping in mind that he still has not officially narrowed down to three). How you can spin that (at this moment) as a clear negative is beyond me.

That's not to say that I can't imagine Donovan going to Kentucky and Patterson deciding to go there (and I appreciate people raising such possiblities, as they are valid and worthwhile to consider). I just don't get jumping to the worst possible interpretation of events as likely, especially when I can only imagine it serving to diminish our own joy and embolden our opposition.

And I'm not saying that those who are wired more to look for negatives aren't as true Duke fans as those who, all things being equal, prefer to emphasize the hopeful signs. I understand the human tendency, sometimes, to "expect the worst" as a defense against later potentially painful disappointment. I simply prefer to err on the side of hopeful realism, especially as regards things I care deeply about (like Duke and Duke Basketball). If I'm gonna risk self-fulfilling a prophecy in any way, I'd rather it be a positive one.

I hope this didn't sound condescending to anyone, cause it truly isn't intended that way. I dig all y'all (except trollers, of course) for caring about Duke Basketball, from whatever perspective works for you. Just sharing a piece of my own perspective. :0)

Go Lady Devils!!!!!! Go Duke!!!!!! GTHCGTH!!!!!!

[jimsumner]

RE: the Patterson-Lucas package deal.

I wouldn't lose any sleep over this. Every year we here about these package deals and very, very few pan out. Remember Lance Thomas was linked with several package deals that would have kept him away from Durham. Last fall UCLA fans were all ga-ga about how Kevin Love and Kyle Singler were an inseparable duo and since UCLA was the only school recruiting both, Singler was a lock for UCLA. Didn't seem to work out that way.

[dukeimac]

It is interesting how people can twist things.

I've NEVER said that Patterson LOVES Donovan, nor have I implied that. What I see is a guy who liked Donovan & the Gators and Tubby & Kentucky as well as Coach K & Duke. And that by putting Donovan in Kentucky might be a "more attractive" situation. Hence my caption "Donovan + Kentucky."

IMO, Donovan is a good coach (maybe one of the next best to Coach K) and Florida is a nice place but still a football school while Tubby was a so-so coach but Kentucky has a rich history in college basketball. Put a good coach together with a program that has a rich history in college basketball, it makes for an appealing story, i.e. Patino & Kentucky or Roy & Kansas.

Thus, if he is to come to Duke someone best put out the love for him or just play the wait and see game, that might work.

[ikiru36]

It is interesting how people can twist things.

I've NEVER said that Patterson LOVES Donovan, nor have I implied that. What I see is a guy who liked Donovan & the Gators and Tubby & Kentucky as well as Coach K & Duke. And that by putting Donovan in Kentucky might be a "more attractive" situation. Hence my caption "Donovan + Kentucky."

IMO, Donovan is a good coach (maybe one of the next best to Coach K) and Florida is a nice place but still a football school while Tubby was a so-so coach but Kentucky has a rich history in college basketball. Put a good coach together with a program that has a rich history in college basketball, it makes for an appealing story, i.e. Patino & Kentucky or Roy & Kansas.

Thus, if he is to come to Duke someone best put out the love for him or just play the wait and see game, that might work.

I have no idea if you were referring at all to my post but I would simply state that to me your original statement "if Billy goes to Kentucky, then so goes Patterson" is not equivalent to your more recent summation that "Donovan in Kentucky might be a 'more attractive' situation".

If you originally meant the latter, as I'd stated in my earlier post, "I appreciate people raising such possiblities, as they are valid and worthwhile to consider".

I agree that Donovan at Kentucky could woo Patterson as it mitigates the proximity advantage as well as the "Basketball school" issue. At the same time, Kentucky is the least successful, in recent years, of all three schools, its fans have been generally acknowledged as being overly harsh on players/coaches (the irony of some recent postings, here, notwithstanding), and it has the weakest academic reputation nationally of the three schools (not meaning to denigrate it as a quality University in general).

I am just saying that even this hypothetical scenario would still not be a clear-cut disadvantage to Duke, unless his #1 factor overall has been liking Donovan (which may be true, but I haven't yet seen the evidence).

I imagine Duke is sending him all the "love" and attention legally allowed, but in the end it is a wait and see game for us, as fans. And whether Patrick chooses us or not, I'll still be loving our team and anxiously awaiting Basketball season.

Go Lady Devils!!!!!! Go Duke!!!!!! GTHCGTH!!!!!!

[bhd28]

Has no one read any of the articles on how Tubby was a big reason for PP liking Kentucky? I heard so many things about how his family got along really well with Tubby's family and all that. Recently about how angry he was at Tubby leaving? Something like

'Patterson took the news hard, according to his mother, Tywanna, who used the words "hurt," "sad," "shocked" and "mad" to describe her son's reaction to the news.

"Like a family member had died," she said.'
and
"If I was to go to Kentucky, Coach Tubby Smith would be one of the main reasons because I want him to mentor me in the game of basketball and he is such a great coach," Patterson said. "He would be one of the main reasons I'd go to Kentucky other than the education and the basketball team."

*both from the DBR linked site on the main page.*


and an old one on
"After Kentucky's Tubby Smith watched a recent game, he greeted the Pattersons and offered to shake hands with Tywanna Patterson, Patrick's mother. She gave Smith a hug. An NCAA representative happened to be there, so Smith made sure to point out who initiated the contact -- almost like arguing ablock/charge call during a game."
from http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaab/news?slug=allaccessthecourtshipofp&prov=tsn&type=lgns

My question is what changed to where people think Patterson liked Kentucky but not Smith (that he is so so or whatever)? I had always thought Smith was one of the big reasons PP and his family liked Kentucky.

[JasonEvans]

My gut tells me that we're not going to land PP. Duke's recruiting doesn't usually play out this way...

Not sure what you mean by that but this feels no different from how the Boozer recruitment went. We rarely get this invovled in late commit recruits, but this is playing out like many late commit recruits do as far as I can tell.