PDA

View Full Version : Backwards way to help JJ Redick's career?



JustAFan
07-10-2008, 10:58 AM
This article from the Orlando Sentinel is a rather depressing assessment of JJ Redick's status with the Magic today. A friend of mine in Orlando tells me that the writer, Mike Bianchi, has actually been a strong supporter of JJ for the past two years. Seems like Bianchi has either reached the end of that support, or is trying to "help" JJ find another team. If it's the latter, he sure chose an awkward way to do so.

At least he notes that JJ "has handled the situation with class", but not until the third paragraph from the bottom. Jeez, with friends like these ...


http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/orl-bianchi1008jul10,0,5170407.column

CameronBornAndBred
07-10-2008, 11:58 AM
Interesting article. I don't see what the Orlando GM is thinking when he keeps saying he intends to keep Redick. If I were JJ, I'd think about suing somebody to get out of that contract. Being held to a job that you know is going nowhere must be about as fun as being in jail, and with just as many prospects.

Edouble
07-10-2008, 12:28 PM
If I were JJ, I'd think about suing somebody to get out of that contract. Being held to a job that you know is going nowhere must be about as fun as being in jail, and with just as many prospects.

It's a contract. He signed it. I doubt there's anything in the contract that guarantees any time on the court. There's probably something in the contract that says he's not guaranteed time on the court just so a lottery bust with an ego (I'm not talking about JJ here) doesn't sue his team. We all want the guy to play, but I don't think he has any legal recourse. Any contract lawyers out there to back me up or disagree?

Classof06
07-10-2008, 12:35 PM
This is the best NBA article on JJ that I've ever read. Like I said yesterday in a different thread, when they drafted Courtney Lee from Western Kentucky in this year's draft, that said everything you needed to know. Like JJ, I literally said "the writing is on the wall".

Look at the logic:

-You drafted him #11

-He doesn't get any burn, under 2 different coaches

-You trade with other teams for multiple players at his position (Dooling, Maurice Evans, Pietrus)

-You draft a player at his position 2 seasons later (Lee)

But you won't trade him? The only logical conclusion is that you made a mistake by drafting him or, at the very least, he has no chance of ever making siginificant contributions to your team. Otis Smith and Stan VG denying what any intelligent person can see is just making it all the more awkward. Trade the guy and let him get on with his career. This is just so ridiculous it's not even funny.


And I'm not a contract lawyer but JJ definitely has no legal recourse. Like EDouble said, he signed the contract. Plus the guy will make a cool $2 million in 2008. In the big scheme of things, he has nothing to complain about.

SilkyJ
07-10-2008, 12:38 PM
Interesting article. I don't see what the Orlando GM is thinking when he keeps saying he intends to keep Redick. If I were JJ, I'd think about suing somebody to get out of that contract. Being held to a job that you know is going nowhere must be about as fun as being in jail, and with just as many prospects.

you'd sue somebody for paying you $2 million bucks? you must be very rich my friend.

cspan37421
07-10-2008, 02:15 PM
even if he never becomes an NBA all star, if he gets a chance to play for another team, I would love to watch him torch the Magic from the outside. That would be so sweet.

That said, I suspect that like the Alaskan Assassin, he'll do better overseas. I can't tell you how ironic I find it that the rap on him is that he can't play defense. We're talking the NBA here, right?

_Gary
07-10-2008, 02:23 PM
If JJ gets traded to another NBA team and still can't get off the bench then I'll admit I was wrong about him. I've always thought he could be a decent 15 to 20 minute a night guy in the league. Two years ago he started off being hurt and playing for one of the most pathetic coaches in the NBA - Brian Hill. Last year he just had some bad luck because the guys in front of him shot the ball phenomenally. I still believe he can contribute, in a meaningful way, with some team. And I hope the Magic do indeed trade him. He doesn't need another year under Stan, who just isn't going to play him now that he has another long-armed, defensive stopper on the roster. JJ needs a change of scenery just like Dunleavy did. It can make all the difference in the world.

Gary

Huh?
07-10-2008, 02:27 PM
How can he be considered a failure if he doesn't even get a chance to play??? I know he was a lottery pick, but a failure has to show he can't do it.....right?

hq2
07-10-2008, 02:50 PM
Well, I blame this entirely on the Magic, not J.J. It was well known when he was drafted that he was not a defensive player, and the Magic already had 2 or 3 very good 3 point shooters on the team. I don't know why they wasted a pick on him. They should have gotten someone else who could help them where they need help (small forward, especially), and left J.J. for another team. That being said, he needs a trade to a team that needs a good off the bench three point shooter. I'm sure if the Magic looked around the league, they could find someone who would give them something for him. I just don't think they've tried hard enough, or else the other teams have decided to let his original contract expire and pick him up for nothing.

Edouble
07-10-2008, 03:19 PM
even if he never becomes an NBA all star, if he gets a chance to play for another team, I would love to watch him torch the Magic from the outside. That would be so sweet.

That said, I suspect that like the Alaskan Assassin, he'll do better overseas. I can't tell you how ironic I find it that the rap on him is that he can't play defense. We're talking the NBA here, right?

Umm, that would be so sweet to see him throw down 6 or 7 threes in one game against the Magic.

I think Redick has a fine chance to make it on the NBA level, much moreso than Trajan did. He's taller, more athletic, a better three point shooter, and a better shooter overall. I can see why the Magic didn't play him much when Bogans was shooting so well from behind the arc, but to not trade him does seem silly. It seems like they could at least get a future second round pick and some cash for the guy from someone. Why not just trade him last draft night for another second round or late first round pick? I think I have to see who the Magic end up signing to make sense of it though. If they sign Lee, and just keep Redick on the bench, then it doesn't make much sense to hold onto him. But if they don't have another reliable SG on the bench after free agency and summer league, then they've gotta hold onto Redick, even if he never plays, just in case someone is injured.

CameronBornAndBred
07-10-2008, 04:10 PM
you'd sue somebody for paying you $2 million bucks? you must be very rich my friend.

I wish. I just find it must be extremely frustrating for them not to even negotiate. And if they refuse to let you go, and refuse to play you, then that basically equates to captivity of sorts. Even if he were playing in Europe, or in the D-league, he could showcase his skills. Right now he can't even do that.

moonpie23
07-10-2008, 05:08 PM
I If I were JJ, I'd think about suing somebody to get out of that contract.


hahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaha

BD80
07-10-2008, 06:55 PM
I think Redick has a fine chance to make it on the NBA level, much moreso than Trajan did. He's taller, more athletic, a better three point shooter, and a better shooter overall. ...

but to not trade him does seem silly.

Who can JJ guard in the league? Not point guards, nor many of the 2 guards, who are now typically 6-7 or taller.

If you can work out a defensive scheme for him, you still need the right situation for him. I can see two - the Cavs or the Lakers. Each has a tall ballhandler that can command a double team, freeing up JJ for the spot up jumper. Both have a bunch of flotsam on their rosters to offer.

Another option, Philly now has a big guy that commands a double team and can find an open three point shooter - and a PG that doesn't hesitate to pass - but do they have a salary they would be willing to trade?

The Magic are wasting an asset (a lottery pick in his rookie contract) and are mishandling an obligation (JJ's salary). They are getting absolutely NO production out of JJ. Still they have refused to entertain offers (by declaring he is NOT going to be traded). Now it is a buyer's market, as teams know that the Magic need to dump JJ to alleviate the overstocked 2 guard position and to create room for another PG. Only a couple of teams can take JJ without giving a salary back (Charlotte and Golden State?). The Magic sure aren't going to get much in return for the #7 pick.

EarlJam
07-10-2008, 07:20 PM
I may get blasted for this, but "here it goes:"

As much as I liked Redick, I was never totally sold on him. Awesome, great, wonderful, magnificant, shooter? YES. Who could question that?

But besides N.C. State in his freshman year, I don't recall him being tremendously clutch, and I never really felt comfortable with him taking a last shot (2004 Final Four, UConn).

Then came a signature moment: LSU in the 2006 tourney.

That was a peek of things to come and may be something Hansbrough wants to study. They absolutely SHUT REDICK DOWN. And they were a physical team.

Welcome to the NBA, where that style of LSU '06 play takes place every night.

The writer makes a good point - two coaches, two styles, and J.J. still couldn't get playing time. Those coaches aren't stupid.

I always thought Redick would end up being a "rich man's" Steve Kerr, and that's about it (and that's pretty freakin' awesome). I still think he can be that and can become the "missing link" to a team trying to an NBA team trying to get to the next level.

-EarlJam, who really is pulling for J.J.

shadowfax336
07-10-2008, 07:53 PM
Another option, Philly now has a big guy that commands a double team and can find an open three point shooter - and a PG that doesn't hesitate to pass - but do they have a salary they would be willing to trade?


You beat me to it...
all the articles about the Brand signing kept mentioning Philly's need for a shooter to keep defenses honest now that Korver's gone and they have Brand. I'm not sure how the salaries work exactly, but it would seem to make a whole lot of sense to look in to.

CameronBornAndBred
07-10-2008, 08:03 PM
hahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaha

I'd complain about that response, but I left the exact same answer to somebody else's post in a different forum today. Maybe even to the letter. Damn karma.

jkidd31
07-10-2008, 08:08 PM
I'd like to see the Cavs pick him up. I'm also surprised they didn't make a play for Brand or Duhon. The Cavs looked slow against Boston and I thought the big reason for the trade they made was to free up cap room after this past season.

LJ needs some help. I'm afraid he's gone when his contract is up.

bludvlman
07-10-2008, 08:14 PM
I've checked some of the magic boards and there is a story that JJ cleaned out his locker today, take that for what it is worth. The source is a unnamed Magic employee but the poster is usually accurate there. Also the rumor is that the Heat are the team he could go to.

bludvlman
07-10-2008, 08:14 PM
I'd like to see the Cavs pick him up. I'm also surprised they didn't make a play for Brand or Duhon. The Cavs looked slow against Boston and I thought the big reason for the trade they made was to free up cap room after this past season.

LJ needs some help. I'm afraid he's gone when his contract is up.

Thats what happens when you GM goes to a horrible school :D

CameronBornAndBred
07-10-2008, 08:23 PM
I've checked some of the magic boards and there is a story that JJ cleaned out his locker today, take that for what it is worth. The source is a unnamed Magic employee but the poster is usually accurate there. Also the rumor is that the Heat are the team he could go to.

Here is to hoping the rumor is true. Go show 'em what you got JJ!

Uncle Drew
07-10-2008, 08:29 PM
I may get blasted for this, but "here it goes:"

As much as I liked Redick, I was never totally sold on him. Awesome, great, wonderful, magnificant, shooter? YES. Who could question that?

But besides N.C. State in his freshman year, I don't recall him being tremendously clutch, and I never really felt comfortable with him taking a last shot (2004 Final Four, UConn).

Then came a signature moment: LSU in the 2006 tourney.

That was a peek of things to come and may be something Hansbrough wants to study. They absolutely SHUT REDICK DOWN. And they were a physical team.

Welcome to the NBA, where that style of LSU '06 play takes place every night.

The writer makes a good point - two coaches, two styles, and J.J. still couldn't get playing time. Those coaches aren't stupid.

I always thought Redick would end up being a "rich man's" Steve Kerr, and that's about it (and that's pretty freakin' awesome). I still think he can be that and can become the "missing link" to a team trying to an NBA team trying to get to the next level.

-EarlJam, who really is pulling for J.J.

There is a HUGE difference between the college and NBA game. And while defense isn't considered a focal point as one other poster said. It's a lot easier for NBA players to defend a guy who is slower and shorter than them. I'm not saying JJ is Forrest Gump with leg braces but earl is right that he never handled really physical athletic guys guarding him. He ran his butt off in college and used screens to get open. Steve Alford used to have the same type game and could do nothing in the NBA. With less time on the NBA shot clock there isn't time to run five screens to get a guy open.

But we all remember Paxon and Kerr getting open looks and knocking them down when a certain someone got double or tripple teamed. Put JJ on the Lakers or Cavs and I think he could fill that same type of role. Since the Magic obviously won't trade JJ when is his contract up where he can be a free agent?

My question is, and I'm not sure I want the answer but is there a chance the Magic have actually TRIED to trade him and nobody wanted to give up anything to get him?

EarlJam
07-10-2008, 08:51 PM
But we all remember Paxon and Kerr getting open looks and knocking them down when a certain someone got double or tripple teamed. Put JJ on the Lakers or Cavs and I think he could fill that same type of role. Since the Magic obviously won't trade JJ when is his contract up where he can be a free agent?

TRUE. WORD.

J.J. is the "missing link" in some great team's playoff puzzle. Hell, the ONLY reason most people remember Kerr in the NBA was because of his sharp shooting with mostly the Bulls as "what's his name" was double-teamed.

Kerr was huge for the Bulls then. J.J. can be huge for someone too, but in the role of a "Super-Kerr." And that ain't bad folks. Aint bad at all!

Now, let's see if destiny shines on our beloved former shooting guard. I hope it does. I'm sending out the all-powerful, oft-affective, DBR positive VIBES!

-EarlJam

TheBrianZoubekExperience
07-10-2008, 11:15 PM
Some of his defensive problems are because you can't put him on the court with Jameer. Someone has to guard that other teams 2 guard. I think JJ would do a bit better if he plated with a PG would could guard the other team's 2. Not saying its a fix all or that he'd be much better but I think playing with Jameer complicates things.

Jaymf7
07-11-2008, 08:38 AM
There is a HUGE difference between the college and NBA game. And while defense isn't considered a focal point as one other poster said. It's a lot easier for NBA players to defend a guy who is slower and shorter than them. I'm not saying JJ is Forrest Gump with leg braces but earl is right that he never handled really physical athletic guys guarding him. He ran his butt off in college and used screens to get open. Steve Alford used to have the same type game and could do nothing in the NBA.

From reports I have read about Magic practices over the past two years, this is not the problem. At times, JJ has dominated practices and lead the second squad to victories despite the ridiculous talent gap (not that this happened frequently, I'm sure). In numerous interviews, Magic brass has acknowledged that JJ can score but said that his defense and rebounding are what keeps him off the court. Indeed, when he has gotten into games he has been a fairly efficient scorer (even though one would expect that he would lack confidence after the early part of his pro career).

JJ could score if given the minutes. The question is how many points and second chance points his team would give up if he was on the court instead of a solid NBA defender. At 6'5", he is 3 inches bigger than Alford but still too small to handle SFs. He is too slow to defend NBA PGs. He never was a great rebounder. All this means he will likely never be an NBA star. That said, he can certainly play a role of providing instant offense off the bench (particularly to a team with other superstars to draw the D and a need for 3 point shooters). The Magic covered the latter part of the need this year.

I would love to see Redick at a place like Cleveland or Miami this year.

bludvlman
07-11-2008, 08:51 AM
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9434

Indoor66
07-11-2008, 09:26 AM
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9434

I might go to a Heat game if JJ is there - though I would wait to see them play next year....:D

Davidson09
07-11-2008, 09:53 AM
I personally would love it if he moved to either Washington ot Charlotte (I'm from the DC area, but go to school at Davidson). I don't think Washington is a possibility. Even though we have some money b/c of Gilbert Arenas' contract, and the fact that our backup SG signed with San Antonio, Gilbert Arenas will start at the PG position, and I don't see the Wizards getting rid of our starting SG, DeShawn Stevenson (of "LeBron is overrated" fame). There's our backup PG, Antonio Daniels and our backup SG, 2nd year player Nick Young out of USC. If JJ we re to come to the Wizards, he'd most likely be 3rd option for SG. Not really a change from the current situation.

Charlotte would be a much better fit. Charlotte, as someone has stated in a previous post, has become a daycare for not-quite-NBA-ready Carolina players. I'm not saying JJ will be a star for the Bobcats, but he would be a solid 2nd SG. They have Jason Richardson as SG, who is pretty good. JJ will be a solid off-the-bench player. The problem is, Charlotte has no superstar who will draw double-teams, leaving JJ to take god shots (that's not to say he can't find his shot on his own).

All in all, I think he has a few options in terms of places he could play more minutes... Charlotte, Miami and Cleveland are all good options.

Edouble
07-11-2008, 10:20 AM
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9434

This is pretty huge news. It's nice to see that JJ is worth a Jason Williams to the Heat. I hope JJ really did clean out his locker.

Jaymf7
07-11-2008, 10:29 AM
Make it happen. Miami even gets to play Orlando regularly. How sweet would it be to give JJ a chance for some revenge (first round playoff upset, maybe)?

CameronBornAndBred
07-11-2008, 10:31 AM
Good news, thanks for the link bludvlman.

crimsonandblue
07-11-2008, 03:39 PM
The Heat's roster (http://www.nba.com/heat/roster/) doesn't exactly scream "room for Redick." Even assuming White Chocolate is moved, you've got Ricky Davis, Shawn Marion, Marcus Banks, Daequan Cook, Dwyane Wade, Mario Chalmers. There's a lot of bodies out there from the 1 through 3. But there is a good assemblage of strong defensive players who could maybe hide Redick a little on the defensive end of things, while letting Redick shine on the offensive end. And there are a lot of penetrators who could generate open looks on pitches.

On the bright side, if he's moved soon, he and Blake Ahearn can go one-on-one to settle who's the bettern free thrower.

juise
07-11-2008, 05:10 PM
On the bright side, if he's moved soon, he and Blake Ahearn can go one-on-one to settle who's the bettern free thrower.

I just noticed that Ahearn got almost twice as many MPG as JJ last year (in 12 games vs. JJ's 34). Even with the small sample size and the fact that the Heat essentially played zero meaningful games last year, I just threw up in my mouth a little.

dukemomLA
07-12-2008, 02:32 AM
PLEASE help me with good thoughts that JJ will have the opportunity to get the heck out of there!

Oriole Way
07-12-2008, 01:19 PM
The Heat's roster (http://www.nba.com/heat/roster/) doesn't exactly scream "room for Redick." Even assuming White Chocolate is moved, you've got Ricky Davis, Shawn Marion, Marcus Banks, Daequan Cook, Dwyane Wade, Mario Chalmers. There's a lot of bodies out there from the 1 through 3. But there is a good assemblage of strong defensive players who could maybe hide Redick a little on the defensive end of things, while letting Redick shine on the offensive end. And there are a lot of penetrators who could generate open looks on pitches.

On the bright side, if he's moved soon, he and Blake Ahearn can go one-on-one to settle who's the bettern free thrower.

That's a great assessment. Didn't the Magic just sign James Jones? He would probably be the biggest detriment to playing time for JJ, since Jones is a big 3-point specialist.

Not sure if he would be able to get much PT in Miami, but at least the Heat seem to actually want him.

bhd28
07-12-2008, 01:52 PM
The heat could go with Chalmers, Wade, Redick, Marion, and Beasley to have a sick scoring team that will likely be poor defensively and probably the smallest team in the NBA since the mid 50's.

heyman25
07-13-2008, 01:45 AM
The Magic have treated JJ like a doormat for 2 years.I hope he gets traded or there will be a decline from even his 2nd year. Screw Van Gundy and Smith. I hope he doesn't go to the Heat,but anything would be better being idle in Orlando. Cleveland Oklahoma City LA Clippers might put JJ in games

Bluedog
07-13-2008, 10:43 AM
It looks like JJ has gotten a bit bigger since his Duke days...Anybody else notice this? Just look at the size of his arms on the front page and his body in general. I imagine he has been putting in hrs at the gym for strength training to try to better guard stronger 2s. Even compare his early press photos with the magic (http://assets.espn.go.com/photo/2008/0418/nba_a_redick_sq_300.jpg) to the photo on front page. Definitely looks like he's put on 10-15 lbs (hopefully, of muscle).

Edouble
07-13-2008, 10:49 AM
It looks like JJ has gotten a bit bigger since his Duke days...Anybody else notice this? Just look at the size of his arms on the front page and his body in general. I imagine he has been putting in hrs at the gym for strength training to try to better guard stronger 2s. Even compare his early press photos with the magic (http://assets.espn.go.com/photo/2008/0418/nba_a_redick_sq_300.jpg) to the photo on front page. Definitely looks like he's put on 10-15 lbs (hopefully, of muscle).

I noticed that myself. When he first got to Duke, he was a teeny bit round. Then he put time into conditioning and got more definition in his arms and became a more athletic player. Now it looks like he's been curling 60 lb dumbells.

As long as it doesn't hurt the shot. :)

Duke05
07-13-2008, 08:39 PM
Kerr was huge for the Bulls then. J.J. can be huge for someone too, but in the role of a "Super-Kerr." And that ain't bad folks. Aint bad at all!


I always thought Redick would end up being a "rich man's" Steve Kerr, and that's about it (and that's pretty freakin' awesome). I still think he can be that and can become the "missing link" to a team trying to an NBA team trying to get to the next level.

Sorry to pick on you EarlJam, but I'm curious why you think J.J. would be a "Super-Kerr" or a "rich man's" Steve Kerr. Someone said on another thread that Kerr shot 57% from 3pt range at Arizona the only year they had a 3pt line. As spectacular a shooter as J.J. undeniably is, Kerr also needed some talent to end up as the best 3pt shooter in NBA history.

Picky tangent over; just wanted to note a bit pedantically that I'll be content even if J.J. ends up a poor man's Kerr.

moonpie23
07-13-2008, 08:50 PM
I personally would love it if he moved to either ------------ or Charlotte


Charlotte would be a much better fit. .


just kill me now... charlotte?

EarlJam
07-13-2008, 10:34 PM
Sorry to pick on you EarlJam, but I'm curious why you think J.J. would be a "Super-Kerr" or a "rich man's" Steve Kerr. Someone said on another thread that Kerr shot 57% from 3pt range at Arizona the only year they had a 3pt line. As spectacular a shooter as J.J. undeniably is, Kerr also needed some talent to end up as the best 3pt shooter in NBA history.

Picky tangent over; just wanted to note a bit pedantically that I'll be content even if J.J. ends up a poor man's Kerr.

You know more about Kerr than I do. Based on your e-mail, I agree with your thoughts here!

-EJ

EarlJam
07-13-2008, 10:36 PM
just kill me now... charlotte?

The Charlotte Bobhornets........where Tarheel careers go to die.

Here's to Charlotte being a "No J.J. Zone."

-EarlJam

phaedrus
07-14-2008, 03:15 PM
I would like nothing more than for JJ to become a key player for Charlotte. And I don't like the Bobcats a bit.

Edouble
07-15-2008, 09:51 AM
I would like nothing more than for JJ to become a key player for Charlotte. And I don't like the Bobcats a bit.

The Bobcats could use a little infusion of Duke blood into the line-up. It might wake them up a little. None of those 'Heels want to be shown up by a Blue Devil. ;)