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  1. #261
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    I don't think the transfers would affect Shabazz that much. Zeigler would possibly (probably?) not be available to play until 2013-2014, so if Shabazz is a one-and-done then they'd never play together except in practice. And Oriakhi is a forward so he wouldn't be competing for playing time. Unless you're talking number of scholarships in which case yes they could affect each other, but I agree with McFinARL that Coach K is just trying to cover all of his bases in this uncertain world of recruiting.

  2. #262
    Quote Originally Posted by MCFinARL View Post
    Not confident of getting them, sure. Obviously these recruits have choices to make and, while each has kept Duke on his list, there's plenty of reasons to think each might choose another school.

    Moving on, though, I'm not so sure about. Based on reports, Coach K has been keeping in touch with these recruits and is still encouraging them to choose Duke.

    I'd say looking at the transfers is more about maximizing the opportunity to add players by broadening the pool than it is about giving up on getting the high school recruits--trying to set a backup plan in place.
    Not quite what I meant even though it read like that. Didn't mean he had gave up. He never has given up on anything to my knowledge. Has he offered Zeigler? Coach K knows how he stands. I'm sure his gut feeling is right more times than not. I'm just saying he is exploring other options because he just doesn't feel confident on the others, therefore not just sitting back and waiting. If Mason stays, he has two to give. I read more into how Coach K is handling things than I do tweets/recruiting sites mainly because they are often misleading.

  3. #263
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Published yesterday (4/4/12) at http://www.hoopscooponline.com/visit...-visitors.html

    "The race for 6'8 Amile Jefferson from Wynnewood (Friends Central) PA continues to be too close to call. But several people close to the kid think that the #2-ranked senior nationally by the HOOP SCOOP will pick N.C. State over schools like Duke, Villanova, Ohio State, Kentucky, and Temple. So, for our purposes here, we're predicting that Jefferson will pick the Wolfpack. The race also appears to be going right down to the wire for 6'9 Tony Parker from Lithonia (Miller Grove) GA, who currently checks in at #4 on our list of the top seniors nationally, with regards to schools like UCLA, Ohio State, Kansas, Memphis, Duke, and Georgia. However, those in the know think Parker will follow in the footsteps of Muhammad, who will make his college decision one day before Parker is supposed to sign on the dotted line. And, when Parker does sign, the smart money is on the Bruins hitting the daily-double with two more top five-ranked players in this year's recruiting class."

    Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.

  4. #264
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Virginia
    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    Published yesterday (4/4/12) at http://www.hoopscooponline.com/visit...-visitors.html

    "The race for 6'8 Amile Jefferson from Wynnewood (Friends Central) PA continues to be too close to call. But several people close to the kid think that the #2-ranked senior nationally by the HOOP SCOOP will pick N.C. State over schools like Duke, Villanova, Ohio State, Kentucky, and Temple. So, for our purposes here, we're predicting that Jefferson will pick the Wolfpack. The race also appears to be going right down to the wire for 6'9 Tony Parker from Lithonia (Miller Grove) GA, who currently checks in at #4 on our list of the top seniors nationally, with regards to schools like UCLA, Ohio State, Kansas, Memphis, Duke, and Georgia. However, those in the know think Parker will follow in the footsteps of Muhammad, who will make his college decision one day before Parker is supposed to sign on the dotted line. And, when Parker does sign, the smart money is on the Bruins hitting the daily-double with two more top five-ranked players in this year's recruiting class."

    Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.
    What I like about this prediction is that TP may be inclined to follow Bazz. He mentioned something to that effect in the round table article last week (or at least that ucla offered the advantage of maybe having Bazz). The question is does Bazz want to play with TP. From what I have read, the Parker family isn't too keen on UCLA because of distance so maybe Duke offers the best common ground?

  5. #265
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Arlington, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
    Published yesterday (4/4/12) at http://www.hoopscooponline.com/visit...-visitors.html

    "The race for 6'8 Amile Jefferson from Wynnewood (Friends Central) PA continues to be too close to call. But several people close to the kid think that the #2-ranked senior nationally by the HOOP SCOOP will pick N.C. State over schools like Duke, Villanova, Ohio State, Kentucky, and Temple. So, for our purposes here, we're predicting that Jefferson will pick the Wolfpack. The race also appears to be going right down to the wire for 6'9 Tony Parker from Lithonia (Miller Grove) GA, who currently checks in at #4 on our list of the top seniors nationally, with regards to schools like UCLA, Ohio State, Kansas, Memphis, Duke, and Georgia. However, those in the know think Parker will follow in the footsteps of Muhammad, who will make his college decision one day before Parker is supposed to sign on the dotted line. And, when Parker does sign, the smart money is on the Bruins hitting the daily-double with two more top five-ranked players in this year's recruiting class."

    Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.
    FWIW, I think the source is off on the decision dates--pretty sure the latest info is that both Muhammad and Parker will announce on the 11th. Obviously, that doesn't mean they can't decide to go to the same school (i'm sure they could text or call each other about it); it does suggest the source is a little sloppy, though.

  6. #266
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North Raleigh
    I need a pep-talk.
    I've decided for my mental health I need to write this get it out of my system and move on.

    Ah iz depressed.
    I cant take the suspense and drama. I'd rather have 1 Rasheed Sulaimon than this nagging feeling we'll be left at the alter 3x's. At least RS knows what he wants and wants to be here, so credit to him.

    As for these other dudes, I cant help but feel we are suckling hind teat to UK for Bazz and Amile. And as far as TP who knows, he moves to his own beat seemingly. As far as I'm concerned, If the answer isn't yes by now, then its no. One of the things I love about being a duke fan is that its (was) impossible to have a meaning conversation w/o Duke. That's not the case anymore. Time has moved forward and we have been usurped by UK.

    We are now a mid-major.
    I've slowly come to accept it. In this show me the money, me 1st culture, where concepts like paying your dues, learning the ropes, refining your craft, working hard and loyalty is not prevalent... Then I really need to re-evaluate just how invested I am in being a fan. Where is the satisfaction I get from it?

    Just not feeling it right now.

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by wilko View Post
    We are now a mid-major.
    If we're a mid-major than every team besides UK is a mid-major. (And even UK has only been a three year phenomenon.)

    According to RSCI:
    Our 2011 recruiting class ranked #2 in the country.
    Our 2010 recruiting class ranked #9 in the country (but included Kyrie, the #2 player)
    Our 2009 recruiting class ranked #8 in the country (but they didn't include Andre, so it was really higher, probably top 5; plus we got Seth that year, too)
    Our 2008 recruiting class ranked #11 in the country (this year's senior class)
    Our 2007 recruiting class ranked #3 in the country
    Our 2006 recruiting class ranked #3 in the country
    Our 2005 recruiting class ranked #2 in the country

    If that's "mid-major," I bet a lot of schools out there want to join up.

  8. #268
    Quote Originally Posted by wilko View Post
    I cant take the suspense and drama. I'd rather have 1 Rasheed Sulaimon than this nagging feeling we'll be left at the alter 3x's. At least RS knows what he wants and wants to be here, so credit to him.
    If I remember correctly, we got a key piece of one of our national championship teams in the spring before his freshman year (Lance Thomas).

    Not saying something similar will happen, but we've shown that this kind of patience in recruiting can pay off.

  9. #269
    Duke signs the #2 recruit in the country, #28, #31, #61, and also signs a Top 15 kid in the Class of 2012 AND GETS HIM TO COME A YEAR EARLY. Did you really expect a big class after that? 5-man classes typically lead to a 1 or 2 man class the following year. Sometimes no recruits.

    Alex Murphy is light years ahead of where he would have been if he had stayed in high school for his senior year in so many categories. Marshall Plumlee got a free year to develop strength and to learn the ins and outs of the Duke defense. Whether or not you're crazy about his ability, he not only got to battle in practice like a normal freshman would have, but he got a full two months head start with the trip overseas.

    Duke has a big senior class, two juniors who are now game-tested and know what they have to do to improve and four guys in the sophomore class who will have been in the program for 15 months leading into October 2012.

    This sky is falling crap is seriously getting old. If Mason Plumlee comes back to Duke, you're looking at a big man rotation that will likely be better than last year.

    Rasheed Sulaimon is a five-star kid praised for his work ethic and an incredibly well-rounded game. He has worked his way into the conversation as the best guard in the Class of 2012 through sheer grit and determination. If he becomes that top rated guard, this will be the third year in a row that Duke has landed the best high school prospect at the guard position.

    But yes, Duke is a mid-major program. Clearly.

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by wilko View Post
    I need a pep-talk.
    I've decided for my mental health I need to write this get it out of my system and move on.

    Ah iz depressed.
    I cant take the suspense and drama. I'd rather have 1 Rasheed Sulaimon than this nagging feeling we'll be left at the alter 3x's. At least RS knows what he wants and wants to be here, so credit to him.

    As for these other dudes, I cant help but feel we are suckling hind teat to UK for Bazz and Amile. And as far as TP who knows, he moves to his own beat seemingly. As far as I'm concerned, If the answer isn't yes by now, then its no. One of the things I love about being a duke fan is that its (was) impossible to have a meaning conversation w/o Duke. That's not the case anymore. Time has moved forward and we have been usurped by UK.

    We are now a mid-major.
    I've slowly come to accept it. In this show me the money, me 1st culture, where concepts like paying your dues, learning the ropes, refining your craft, working hard and loyalty is not prevalent... Then I really need to re-evaluate just how invested I am in being a fan. Where is the satisfaction I get from it?

    Just not feeling it right now.
    I think you need to re-evaluate things anyway. UK just won their first title sine 1998. Duke won the title two years ago. If not winning a national title in two years gets you that depressed, you should think about not following Duke basketball so closely.

  11. #271
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    Duke signs the #2 recruit in the country, #28, #31, #61, and also signs a Top 15 kid in the Class of 2012 AND GETS HIM TO COME A YEAR EARLY. Did you really expect a big class after that? 5-man classes typically lead to a 1 or 2 man class the following year. Sometimes no recruits.

    Alex Murphy is light years ahead of where he would have been if he had stayed in high school for his senior year in so many categories. Marshall Plumlee got a free year to develop strength and to learn the ins and outs of the Duke defense. Whether or not you're crazy about his ability, he not only got to battle in practice like a normal freshman would have, but he got a full two months head start with the trip overseas.

    Duke has a big senior class, two juniors who are now game-tested and know what they have to do to improve and four guys in the sophomore class who will have been in the program for 15 months leading into October 2012.

    This sky is falling crap is seriously getting old. If Mason Plumlee comes back to Duke, you're looking at a big man rotation that will likely be better than last year.

    Rasheed Sulaimon is a five-star kid praised for his work ethic and an incredibly well-rounded game. He has worked his way into the conversation as the best guard in the Class of 2012 through sheer grit and determination. If he becomes that top rated guard, this will be the third year in a row that Duke has landed the best high school prospect at the guard position.

    But yes, Duke is a mid-major program. Clearly.
    Preach it brother.

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxAMillion View Post
    I think you need to re-evaluate things anyway. UK just won their first title sine 1998. Duke won the title two years ago. If not winning a national title in two years gets you that depressed, you should think about not following Duke basketball so closely.
    Amen and Hallelujah!

    Good Lord are we that spoiled? Duke is one of the top programs in the country having won more games this century than any other team. One loss to Lehigh does not change that.

    FWIW, I think Mason is coming back. It is also still possible that at least one or two of the recruits/transfers sign with Duke, and we have a lot of talent returning. UNC took a heavy hit. Even with McAdoo coming back, they will be relying on a freshman PG to run a very complicated offense. What if Page is closer to Larry Drew than Kendall Marshall? 2 of the guys they will rely heavily on are coming off major knee surgeries, and they have no experience in the post beyond McAdoo who is a below average defender. They have far more question marks than Duke does. Kentucky loses their top 6 players with no guarantees of immediate reload. Ohio St has big losses, as does Mich St.

    If K can win 27 games with this years team against the 2nd toughest schedule in the country, he can certainly meet or exceed that total next year. Rasheed is the real deal and will be a huge asset to next years team. Some of those rising sophomores/redshirt freshmen will surprise us with their contributions, Kelly and Curry will score the basketball and Mason will be a beast down low. If we can actually get him the dang ball in the right time and place, he may even be an All-America. He will have a 1st Team All-ACC season, mark it down.

    The sky is not falling. In the words of a famous UVA coach, Duke is Duke (still)

  12. #272

    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    Preach it brother.


    Amen and Hallelujah!

    Good Lord are we that spoiled? Duke is one of the top programs in the country having won more games this century than any other team. One loss to Lehigh does not change that.

    FWIW, I think Mason is coming back. It is also still possible that at least one or two of the recruits/transfers sign with Duke, and we have a lot of talent returning. UNC took a heavy hit. Even with McAdoo coming back, they will be relying on a freshman PG to run a very complicated offense. What if Page is closer to Larry Drew than Kendall Marshall? 2 of the guys they will rely heavily on are coming off major knee surgeries, and they have no experience in the post beyond McAdoo who is a below average defender. They have far more question marks than Duke does. Kentucky loses their top 6 players with no guarantees of immediate reload. Ohio St has big losses, as does Mich St.

    If K can win 27 games with this years team against the 2nd toughest schedule in the country, he can certainly meet or exceed that total next year. Rasheed is the real deal and will be a huge asset to next years team. Some of those rising sophomores/redshirt freshmen will surprise us with their contributions, Kelly and Curry will score the basketball and Mason will be a beast down low. If we can actually get him the dang ball in the right time and place, he may even be an All-America. He will have a 1st Team All-ACC season, mark it down.

    The sky is not falling. In the words of a famous UVA coach, Duke is Duke (still)
    I agree totally. I think we are all getting a little impatient right now. But just remember, we have the best coach in the business! Hands Down! I agree the three recruits are probably going elsewhere, but we still have a good nucleus coming back, and maybe we pick up one good player or maybe not, regardless, I wouldn't want any other coach in charge. Plain and Simple!

  13. #273
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Winterville, NC
    I just have this terrible feeling that we won't get any of these guys. Maybe Zeigler but that's it. I do see a positive in that I think Mason will return and Rasheed Sulaimon looks like he is a heck of a lot better than advertised. His length a size is totally what we need in a guard.

  14. #274
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by wgl1228 View Post
    I just have this terrible feeling that we won't get any of these guys. Maybe Zeigler but that's it. I do see a positive in that I think Mason will return and Rasheed Sulaimon looks like he is a heck of a lot better than advertised. His length a size is totally what we need in a guard.
    Well, I'd say that (based on speculation and reasonable conjecture) the odds are against us getting any of the three recruits. That of course could easily change as these are kids. But it would seem that UCLA has a strong shot and landing both Parker and Muhammad. I'd say our best chance of landing one of those guys is Jefferson, but I think he's the least likely to make an impact next year. As for the transfer possibilities, Oriakhi won't come if Mason is returning. But I'd take that trade off. And I don't think he's all that likely even without Mason. Zeigler is a possibility, and I'd guess he's more likely than Jefferson.

    But I won't be shocked if we get none of those guys. And to be honest, I'm not sure it's all that necessary that we get any of them. Zeigler may be better than Gbinije or Murphy, but we'll see. Jefferson probably won't be more than a 10-15mpg guy next year, and may not be an upgrade over Hairston and Murphy (next year at least). And Parker definitely won't be an upgrade over Mason if Mason returns, so he'd be only a 15-20 mpg guy too. Muhammad is the only guy I'd see being a game changer next year, but I don't think we're going to get him.

    As for Sulaimon, I don't know that I see Sulaimon as being that tall or long. At least, I'd say he doesn't play tall/long. He plays very fast/quick and smooth, but he did not strike me as a long player, and he's not tall. But that being said, I agree that he looks better than expected and I'm very excited about him.

    But we'll be very good if Mason comes back, with or without those guys.

  15. #275
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    As for Sulaimon, I don't know that I see Sulaimon as being that tall or long. At least, I'd say he doesn't play tall/long. He plays very fast/quick and smooth, but he did not strike me as a long player, and he's not tall. But that being said, I agree that he looks better than expected and I'm very excited about him.
    Rasheed is pretty tall for a combo guard. He's 6'5". He does have a 6'7" wingspan (as of I'm guessing last fall). Those are exactly the same measurements as Austin Rivers.

    If we're looking at the big picture for next year's team, the dropoff from Rivers to Sulaimon is very, very small.

  16. #276
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    Rasheed is pretty tall for a combo guard. He's 6'5". He does have a 6'7" wingspan (as of I'm guessing last fall). Those are exactly the same measurements as Austin Rivers.

    If we're looking at the big picture for next year's team, the dropoff from Rivers to Sulaimon is very, very small.
    He certainly didn't look 6'5", and your estimate is the first time I've seen him listed as anything other than 6'3" or 6'4". And he certainly doesn't play big, which was my main point. That said, I definitely agree that Sulaimon is going to be really really good. He does some things (off ball play, shooting, perhaps defense, passing) better than Rivers and other things (attack the rim) nearly as well. And as a PG/SG he's definitely plenty big. He's quicker and appears to be a better leaper, but not quite as good a ballhandler.

    The only reason I would see him not starting is if neither he nor Curry can play PG next year and the team goes with Curry as the starter. He looks that good, and I'd expect a lot of minutes from him. I just don't see the team going with a small SF again next year. My point about his size was to dissuade folks from thinking that we'll see a Cook/Curry/Sulaimon backcourt, or even a Thornton/Curry/Sulaimon backcourt.

  17. #277
    Sorry, I meant to link his DraftExpress.com profile that takes measurements from the Nike Hoop Summit I believe: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/...Sulaimon-6280/

  18. #278
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    FWIW, I think Mason is returning as well and that makes Parker's recruitment that much less critical, at least for next year's team. As others have stated, the only guy that's a true game changer is Bazz. Out of all the guys we are talking about (recruits and transfers) he's the only one that would make a huge difference next year by being able to step right in and dominate. If any of the other guys come - G-R-E-A-T. We are Duke and we are family and I'll welcome them with open arms and cheer them on. But to be brutally honest, the makeup of the team we have next season (again, I'm assuming Mason is returning) isn't going to be drastically upgraded unless Shabazz decides on Duke. If he doesn't come (and the chances appear very small that he will) then I think what we have right now is just fine. Rasheed will be a special player and if he is the only guy actually coming in it's still a great get. Plus, we will have plenty of upper class leadership and that has to count for something - remember 2010. If you don't think that was important that year I've got some swamp land I'd like to sell you.

  19. #279
    Quote Originally Posted by wgl1228 View Post
    ... Rasheed Sulaimon looks like he is a heck of a lot better than advertised.
    Agree with your overall point about Rasheed's great promise, but I'll add that the "advertisements" about his game have been consistently and noticeably ever-more-positive over the past 9-10 months.

    1. Every time I've seen him on TV, commentators praise his game, for his shooting, handle, D, passing, smarts. As they should; eye-test confirms his multi-talents. Not spectacular; just solid-good many ways.
    2. All the recruiting gurus I've seen have moved him up, gradually. He's top-12, among 3-4 guys fighting for #1 SG. And we'll get more chances to compare him to these guys [Harris, MichSt, and Goodwin, UK]. See #4 & 5, below.
    3. He won McDonald's 3-pt contest, and was among 3-4 most productive players in the game. Again, solid-good, many ways.


    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    I don't know that I see Sulaimon as being that tall or long. At least, I'd say he doesn't play tall/long. He plays very fast/quick and smooth, but he did not strike me as a long player, and he's not tall.
    v.

    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    Rasheed is pretty tall for a combo guard. He's 6'5". He does have a 6'7" wingspan (as of I'm guessing last fall). Those are exactly the same measurements as Austin Rivers.
    We can maybe judge who's right on this height-issue, for ....

    4. Rasheed will play on the US Junior National Select Team in the upcoming Nike Hoop Summit. [TV alert: this Sat eve, 4/7, 10 p.m. FoxSportsSouth]
    5. He's also in the Jordan Brand Classic. [TV alert: Sat 4/14, 7 p.m. ESPN]


    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    If we're looking at the big picture for next year's team, the dropoff from Rivers to Sulaimon is very, very small.
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    I definitely agree that Sulaimon is going to be really really good. He does some things (off ball play, shooting, perhaps defense, passing) better than Rivers and other things (attack the rim) nearly as well.
    Two well-known nutters, airowe and CDu. Obviously loony. Discount their opinions re Sulaimon. Pencil him in for 3 mpg overall and DNP by ACC schedule.

  20. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    Duke signs the #2 recruit in the country, #28, #31, #61, and also signs a Top 15 kid in the Class of 2012 AND GETS HIM TO COME A YEAR EARLY. Did you really expect a big class after that? 5-man classes typically lead to a 1 or 2 man class the following year. Sometimes no recruits.

    Alex Murphy is light years ahead of where he would have been if he had stayed in high school for his senior year in so many categories. Marshall Plumlee got a free year to develop strength and to learn the ins and outs of the Duke defense. Whether or not you're crazy about his ability, he not only got to battle in practice like a normal freshman would have, but he got a full two months head start with the trip overseas.

    Duke has a big senior class, two juniors who are now game-tested and know what they have to do to improve and four guys in the sophomore class who will have been in the program for 15 months leading into October 2012.

    This sky is falling crap is seriously getting old. If Mason Plumlee comes back to Duke, you're looking at a big man rotation that will likely be better than last year.

    Rasheed Sulaimon is a five-star kid praised for his work ethic and an incredibly well-rounded game. He has worked his way into the conversation as the best guard in the Class of 2012 through sheer grit and determination. If he becomes that top rated guard, this will be the third year in a row that Duke has landed the best high school prospect at the guard position.

    But yes, Duke is a mid-major program. Clearly.

    Great post! I just hope we don't judge the whole board (readers and writers) by a few extreme opinions, written at possibly a down moment. In a big community we are going to have a range of opinions, and I love how we have folks that keep the extremes in check, but they will always be there.

    I also just don't get the obsession with the remaining Duke targets. We just don't seem to me to be that desperate for any of them. The only obsession I get is the fervent hope that Mason returns, now that will make a huge difference next year. Just not sure that any of the other recruits changes our ceiling that much NEXT year.

    TP is a good, physical player who needs polish. AJ is a slender tweener with more polish and less physicality. With Ryan, Marshall, Josh, and Mason, I don't think either makes much difference NEXT year. Without Mason, either certainly helps deepen our rotation, but can we really say that either is definitely getting into the starting lineup if they come? Seems like a longshot.

    TZ is a very good guard. We already have Seth, Andre, Tyler, Quinn and Suliamon all of whom are going to demand playing time. Does he provide a (bit) of extra length, sure. Will he completely displace any of these guys? Not so sure. A difference perhaps, but just not that much of one NEXT year. For the following year when Andre and Seth are gone he will be more useful in a still deep rotation.

    Bazz is off the charts. So was Austin. He will have an immediate impact in how we play, but he will also have an impact on our chemistry. I think adding a rookie distributing point guard (Kyrie) helps everyone and makes it easier to integrate a freshmen among veterans. Adding a rookie, who makes rookie mistakes, who takes a high proportion of shots, and thrives in isolation is harder to integrate. This was true with Austin even though he was our best player and leading scorer, and I think it will be true of Bazz. We will be different with him, but how much better is endlessly debatable. This is especially true because we have two athletic, talented guys in Alex and Mike that know the system and should provide a marked improvement at the 3 than we had this year. Big difference NEXT year, yes. Big improvement NEXT year with Bazz versus without, not so sure.

    From my limited perspective at least, the one and only certain game changer for next year is Mason Plumlee. Stay big fella, stay!
    Last edited by Bluealum; 04-06-2012 at 11:40 AM.

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