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Thread: Coaching Staff?

  1. #1

    Coaching Staff?

    Besides Coach K, we have Collins, Wojo, Nate James, and Spatola. 3 former players and a family member. (I believe Carrawell is associated with the program too?)

    I'm just wondering what the general thoughts about the makeup (ie, entirely former players or family) of the coaching staff are--positive? negative? irrelevant? Time for a shakeup? How can you argue with success? etc.

    I know this is a touchy subject, and I'm not wanting to start a flame war or anything of the like, but it seems somewhat germane after the questions that some people raised in the Olek transfer thread. Lastly, I'm genuinely ignorant of this--is it typical for other comparable programs to have staffs made up entirely of alums?

  2. #2
    This is not going to end well.

    In regards to the makeup of the staff, it's kind of hard to argue with the most winningest program in the decade, numerous Top 10 recruiting classes, numerous coaches attending the Duke Coaches Clinic and reporting benefits from learning from the best, putting the most players in the NBA with the highest salaries, etc.

    Although, things can always be better, and there are always areas to improve on. I'm one to not just cast someone aside in order to get something (hopefully) better, but rather improve the people that you do have and make them better. Change by omission is not necessarily a good thing, but making things better is always good change.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    This is not going to end well.
    I should add to mods to not hesitate to close / delete this thread if it is inappropriate. Not my intent.

  4. #4
    My only thoughts concerning the makeup of the staff is not so much who is on it, as each brings certain qualities to the team, though I do not know the background of Spattola enough to make a proper opinion, but whether we should have a big man's coach who has had the related playing experience ti translate that to practice on the court. Some may know better than I about which positional coaches experience they have but that would be my only concern. I don't question the abilities of the coaches (I don't want to start a firestorm here either) individually but rather whether we have all the bases properly covered? How many coaches are we allowed by NCAA rules and could we add such a coach? This may have been covered to some extent in many of the "big men" and "Wojo" posts and I plead "guilty" to missing some comments of those in the know but I would like to be refreshed on this subject a bit more.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuzbad View Post
    Besides Coach K, we have Collins, Wojo, Nate James, and Spatola. 3 former players and a family member. (I believe Carrawell is associated with the program too?)

    I'm just wondering what the general thoughts about the makeup (ie, entirely former players or family) of the coaching staff are--positive? negative? irrelevant? Time for a shakeup? How can you argue with success? etc.

    I know this is a touchy subject, and I'm not wanting to start a flame war or anything of the like, but it seems somewhat germane after the questions that some people raised in the Olek transfer thread. Lastly, I'm genuinely ignorant of this--is it typical for other comparable programs to have staffs made up entirely of alums?
    A touchy subject but a fair question. I would look at it from the perspective of not who these guys are, where they went to school, etc., but can they get the job done? Most evidence suggests they can. The only real risk in my opinion is that a group-think atmosphere could sink in if everyone has similar backgrounds and coaching approaches. My guess is there are enough opinions and strong willed people on the staff that group-think is not a major issue.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Southern Pines, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuzbad View Post
    Besides Coach K, we have Collins, Wojo, Nate James, and Spatola. 3 former players and a family member. (I believe Carrawell is associated with the program too?)

    I'm just wondering what the general thoughts about the makeup (ie, entirely former players or family) of the coaching staff are--positive? negative? irrelevant? Time for a shakeup? How can you argue with success? etc.

    I know this is a touchy subject, and I'm not wanting to start a flame war or anything of the like, but it seems somewhat germane after the questions that some people raised in the Olek transfer thread. Lastly, I'm genuinely ignorant of this--is it typical for other comparable programs to have staffs made up entirely of alums?
    Talk about tripping over the curtain when first entering the stage. I don't see Duke's staff makeup as any kind encumbrance on its performance. I think back to John Kennedy's retort when questioned about his brother's appointment Attorney General. He answered by simply stating that Bobbie was thoroughly screened, and was the best qualified for the position. He added, "Besides, he's my brother"

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuzbad View Post
    I should add to mods to not hesitate to close / delete this thread if it is inappropriate. Not my intent.
    If fellow posters are careful of not fanning the flames I think we can have a very insightful converstaion about this as some are more informed than others and can shed some insightful light of the makings of the staff outside some of the obvious.

  8. #8
    I think I should also have stated my opinion, which would roughly follow the "it's hard to argue with success" line, but with a caveat: in sports (and business, personal life, everything else) it's always important to reevaluate situations. Sometimes things stay the same from inertia rather than for any good reason. Sometimes they are the way they are for the best of reasons!

    I do naturally find myself feeling just a hint of distaste at a "all former players/family staff." As SMO stated there's always the risk of group-think, and while I too would tend to agree that there are so many strong personalities involved, thus diminishing the risk of group-think, I believe it's still a risk. There are reasons why companies frequently go outside the company family to find leadership rather than always promoting from within.

    Now, I'm not calling for Kevin White to form an oversight committee of day-to-day basketball operations (or anything remotely close to that) or any assistant coaches to be let go, (and I think the Wojo/Big Man topic has been talked to death 100 times here!) but I do think it's a fair topic for discussion.

  9. #9

    On The Otherhand..

    Duke sports assistant coaches that have:

    - been part of a national champion in the past decade.
    - spent several summers working in close contact with Pro Coaches Nate
    McMillan and Mike D'antoni to help mine their heads on Pro style offenses
    and defenses (well, maybe not D'antoni defenses).
    - spent several summers working with Jim Boeheim and Mike Krzyzewski to
    mine their heads about Zone and Man to Man defenses (acknowledged
    leaders of both)
    - spent several summers scouting International Teams and players, being
    exposed to aspects of basketball well beyond what college basketballers
    are exposed to.
    - spent several summers working with the top Professional players (Kobe,
    Dwayne, LeBron) to mine their heads about habits and motivation

    surely have been growing beyond the cocoon that is the Duke Basketball campus enough to make anyone feel comfortable that they are not just coaching inbreds.

    Who in the assistant coaching ranks of the USA, pro and amateur, had a more robust preparation? Also noting that other than Nate's attributes as a result of working out, neither of these coaches made their mark in basketball as a result of athleticism. They worked hard and had high basketball IQs, which translates well to coaching.

    Larry
    DevilHorse

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wentzville, MO

    I have read before...

    and it might have been from posters that arent up to speed with the subject, but I remember some threads on Wojo being the "big man" coach? Now I for one LOVE the fact that past players are part of the coaching staff. I think it works well for us in general. But if it is true why not move Wojo (who is one of my favs from the past teams) to a point guard coach, and bring in Laettner for or "big man coach" It is Christmas and all and that would be my Christmas wish. Hope eveyone has a wonderful and safe holiday.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by obsesseddukefan View Post
    and it might have been from posters that arent up to speed with the subject, but I remember some threads on Wojo being the "big man" coach? Now I for one LOVE the fact that past players are part of the coaching staff. I think it works well for us in general. But if it is true why not move Wojo (who is one of my favs from the past teams) to a point guard coach, and bring in Laettner for or "big man coach" It is Christmas and all and that would be my Christmas wish. Hope eveyone has a wonderful and safe holiday.
    That was discussed a while back:
    http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/...light=laettner

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by obsesseddukefan View Post
    and it might have been from posters that arent up to speed with the subject, but I remember some threads on Wojo being the "big man" coach? Now I for one LOVE the fact that past players are part of the coaching staff. I think it works well for us in general. But if it is true why not move Wojo (who is one of my favs from the past teams) to a point guard coach, and bring in Laettner for or "big man coach" It is Christmas and all and that would be my Christmas wish. Hope eveyone has a wonderful and safe holiday.
    Scoring opportunities for big men are created for them by point guards and wing players. They don't create their own opportunities. Thus, who better to coach big men about offensive positioning than a former point guard?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wentzville, MO

    Indeed

    Quote Originally Posted by allenmurray View Post
    Scoring opportunities for big men are created for them by point guards and wing players. They don't create their own opportunities. Thus, who better to coach big men about offensive positioning than a former point guard?
    Couldnt agree with you more. I guess what I was trying to say was movement of the big men down in the post. I am not sure if that would just be on the individual learning on thier own or if a point guard could teach that. I think a big man coach could really teach the big men a thing or too about movement with the ball and or positioning. Thoughts?

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by obsesseddukefan View Post
    Couldnt agree with you more. I guess what I was trying to say was movement of the big men down in the post. I am not sure if that would just be on the individual learning on thier own or if a point guard could teach that. I think a big man coach could really teach the big men a thing or too about movement with the ball and or positioning. Thoughts?
    What we need is a big-man coach in the who played the same position as Pete Newell, arguably the best big man coach there was.

    Oh wait, we already have one.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by hughgs View Post
    What we need is a big-man coach in the who played the same position as Pete Newell, arguably the best big man coach there was.

    Oh wait, we already have one.
    90% of the posters on this board don't know who Pete Newell is.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Chicago, IL

    Are we really back on this again?

    My suggestion:

    We have a yearly thread, entitled "Wojo can't coach big men, (fill in appropriate year) edition", similar to the Hatred Tsunami threads.

    dukemsu

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2009

    Its time for Wojo and Chris Collins to go...

    They both are ready for head coaching jobs and by them staying on K's staff-they are just plugging up the pipeline for all the others waiting in line-Williams,Paulus,Langdon,Etc.

    I still can't believe that atleast one of them hasn't landed a HC gig yet...

  18. #18
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    Mar 2007
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    Bethesda, MD

    Fair question

    but none of us (well most of us) don't really know how good these guys are as coaches. We have our perceptions, but we don't really know.

    That said, my perception is this:

    Collins is a basketball junkie and from all accounts works as hard as anyone could on analyzing the next opponent and helping the team prepare. Perhaps he was not the most "heady" player with his predisposition to jacking up shots, but many people are better coaches than they were players.

    Wojo was essentially a coach on the floor in his senior year. However, he never had the requisite talent to be a stud. Does that preclude him from being a good coach? No way. Should he coach big men? No, probably not, but as has been discussed, there are many teams without a "big man coach." I think we should have one, but that is different than asking whether Wojo is an excellent staff member. I think he brings a lot to the table.

    Spatola? no idea

    Nate is a total badass and we all love hime despite the fact that most of us have never met him. That kind of "coolness" is obvious and must help with recruiting and team morale. The players clearly love him and he seems to be doing a great job with recruiting.

    When CC or Wojo moves on, who should come in next? I guess we would all hope it is a big man. Carawell knew how to post players up and is already in the loop, so he has an inside track. I don't think it should be Paulus, just another PG and too close in age to the current guys. Its hard to come up with a post player who is not in the NBA and not already going down his own path (Giminski, Christian, Sheldon, Boozer). Maybe an outside guy would be ideal at this point. I'll leave that up to Coach K, I guess.

  19. #19
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    Mar 2007
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    Wentzville, MO

    Collins

    Quote Originally Posted by Cockabeau View Post
    They both are ready for head coaching jobs and by them staying on K's staff-they are just plugging up the pipeline for all the others waiting in line-Williams,Paulus,Langdon,Etc.

    I still can't believe that atleast one of them hasn't landed a HC gig yet...
    Agreed Cockabeau, I think Collins would make a fantastic HC anywhere he winds up.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    Halifax, Nova Scotia
    Quote Originally Posted by Cockabeau View Post
    They both are ready for head coaching jobs and by them staying on K's staff-they are just plugging up the pipeline for all the others waiting in line-Williams,Paulus,Langdon,Etc.

    I still can't believe that atleast one of them hasn't landed a HC gig yet...
    I assume this is a joke.

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