Taylor King to transfer

[77devil]

Come on. You know exactly what I mean. The difference in results is because we have Coach K and he's D'Oh.

In both cases, the team was going through an era of a number of high-profile recruiting whiffs (along with a few hits). Transfers (Fingleton, Boone, anyone?). Good players but not (maybe) necessarily championship caliber on the roster (Haywood, Capel). Meanwhile, the closest rival is cleaning up in recruiting (best in land) and on the court (final four) and looks quicker on the court, led by a dynamic, driving point guard and an upperclassman with talent and supreme will to win (Battier/Hansblahblah). This is exactly the opposite of the schadenfreude Duke fans enjoyed in that era at Carolina's expense.

No I didn't, and still don't know what you meant. Haywood and Capel were recruited by Smith/Guthridge. Doherty did recruit a couple of decent guys in Mays, Felton, and McCants, the core of the 2005 championship team. I still think your original premise is absurd and you have yet to provide any accurate information to support it.

[juise]

I don't see how early entries are the sign of a declining program. Sure, they put holes in the recruiting plan and hurt continuity. However, I think that successful, NBA-ready players are valuable. I wish Luol had stayed longer, but he was a sign that Duke was getting top-notch talent. Florida's entire rotation (more or less) left early last year... they are still a top tier program.

[_Gary]

Hold on. Now I'm looking not just guys who have left the program, but guys who chose other schools over Duke? You realize those same guys chose their current schools over other places, too, right? You're going to have to be way more specific than that.
Even UNC has missed on a NUMBER of major recruits (see: Love, Kevin).

Jumbo, let's just make it simple: Do you, or do you not, believe that Duke has taken a harder hit than any other national power program in the last 7 years when it's come to transfers and early departures. We can leave the misses out of it if you think that makes it too complicated. No matter how we slice it, I say we have taken the biggest hit in the college bball world. Do you dispute my claim? Yes - or - No.


Gary

[DukieInKansas]

When players transfer, is it always for a basketball reason? Could part of the decision be based on campus life and classroom options? Obviously, someone who was recruited to play basketball at Duke would use that as one of the main factors in any decision to leave, but student/athletes also leave for other reasons.

If it is true that Taylor King is transferring, I echo the sentiments of others on this thread - I'm sorry to see him go and wish him nothing but the best wherever life leads him.

[Wander]

No matter how we slice it, I say we have taken the biggest hit in the college bball world. Do you dispute my claim? Yes - or - No.

The college bball world is a big place. No way have we been hit the most by transfers the most out of the 300-whatever schools in it.

The question should be, have we had significantly more transfers than Kansas, UCLA, etc. I think that's a fair question...

And it should be only transfers, not early departures. Just a guess, but I think Duke has been hit LESS by early departures than is average for a program of Duke's level. I don't have any numbers to back that up, it's just an intuitive guess.

[throatybeard]

We all feel that to play at Duke should be a special, special thing, from the elite starter to the last guy on the bench, and to have such an overwhelming number of transfers every year when compared to other schools in the country leaves me wondering what is going on.

Who's "we all?" (As my old man likes to say, "you got a mouse in your pocket?"). Point being, whoever "we" are, I don't think "we all" can successfully impose our values upon every basketball player who matriculates.

[Duvall]

Jumbo, let's just make it simple: Do you, or do you not, believe that Duke has taken a harder hit than any other national power program in the last 7 years when it's come to transfers and early departures. We can leave the misses out of it if you think that makes it too complicated. No matter how we slice it, I say we have taken the biggest hit in the college bball world. Do you dispute my claim? Yes - or - No.


Gary

I don't understand why you insist on combining the two, since it seems like they would be evidence of two completely different problems.

[sundown]

I don't see how early entries are the sign of a declining program. Sure, they put holes in the recruiting plan and hurt continuity. However, I think that successful, NBA-ready players are valuable. I wish Luol had stayed longer, but he was a sign that Duke was getting top-notch talent. Florida's entire rotation (more or less) left early last year... they are till a top tier program.

Seriously. I would love for Duke to continue to have players whose talent merits early departure (even if we have the occasional player whose talent doesn't, but who leaves anyway). Nothing would be a more welcome sign of the program's health.

[monkey]

No I didn't, and still don't know what you meant. Haywood and Capel were recruited by Smith/Guthridge. Doherty did recruit a couple of decent guys in Mays, Felton, and McCants, the core of the 2005 championship team. I still think your original premise is absurd and you have yet to provide any accurate information to support it.

I never said that Doherty recruited Haywood or Capel. During the Doherty era Carolina missed on a number of recruits that they desperately wanted, especially big men. You want names, go look in the recruiting archives on DBR. That parallels Duke recent run of missing a number of recruits that we wanted, especially big men. Both teams had some hits. When they were missing, we got to laugh ...

Duke, IMO, this year, looked a half step slow as compared to UNC. In the D'oh era the roles were reversed. Then, Duke had a dominating team while UNC went through a relative lull. Now, again, the roles are reversed. Yes we aren't suffering through the 2001-02 UNC season - we had a much, much better result.

But there are a lot of parallels.

BTW, as for the team record, UNC in D'Oh's first year won 26 games (13-3 in the ACC) and lost in the second round of the NCAA tourney before falling apart in the second year. 19 games in the last year.

[Duvall]

But there are a lot of parallels.

BTW, as for the team record, UNC in D'Oh's first year won 26 games (13-3 in the ACC) and lost in the second round of the NCAA tourney before falling apart in the second year. 19 games in the last year.

Pretty sure the comparison ain't gonna last too much longer.

[monkey]

Pretty sure the comparison ain't gonna last too much longer.

If you mean that Duke won't enjoy a resurgence after a down stretch, including a championship, I hope you're wrong

[DevilCastDownfromDurham]

I don't understand why you insist on combining the two, since it seems like they would be evidence of two completely different problems.

I think it's helpful for understanding why we've had so much trouble lately to look at all "losses" from transfers to early entry (and add in injury as, imo, our number 1 problem of late). That said, I agree that transfers and early entry are more like opposite problems than connected symptoms. I was sad to see Luol go, but proud of his (and the staff's) success in making him an NBA player and happy that Duke's profile was raised in a positive way. Transfers, OTOH, represent something of a "failure" whether of the player's attitude, the coach's ability, or the school's attractiveness.

It also stings more when a guy who clearly has a great attitude and seems to love being here leaves. Losing Sweet and MT didn't bother me a bit, they didn't fit with the program and I'd argue we got better the second they packed their bags. Guys like Jamal and Taylor, however, seemed to love being here, so losing them hurts me as a fan much more. It may also say something about the program, but it might also just be that California kids don't like our winters.

[dukemsu]

This is bad news on a lot of levels. Personally, losing anyone with size hurts. It takes away a contributor who might be able to play a bit in the paint, along with TK's shooting stroke.

That said, if he's unhappy or is geniunely not a good fit for the program, best for him to go now and succeed elsewhere.

I wish I felt good about it, though. TK seemed like a unique player and a guy who very much wanted to contribute at Duke.

We don't (and probably won't) know the whole story.

I'd pretty much kill for some good news right about now.

[devildownunder]

I have to think that TK had the potential to be a major contributor over 3 or 4 years in the duke program. A shooter with his size and range could have developed into a real asset, whether he ever became a solid defender or not, IMO, and there is no reason to believe that with the right attitude and work ethic he couldn't have become at least as competent as jj did at the defensive end. And Redick was a plus at the end by the time he left.

As for whether this is part of a larger trend that should concern us for the future of the program, only someone with real inside info knows that. Can't really speculate.

I'll watch TK's post-Duke career more closely than for most transfers. He struck me as a real potential favorite at Duke.

[BlueintheFace]

http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/7...ng-to-transfer

Goodman at Foxsports.com is reporting that Taylor will be looking at Villanova and Gonzaga! ... On a sidenote- how does goodman get so much info so quickly about Duke. He always has Duke stories before all the other major sites (ESPN, SI, cbssportsline, yahoo sports, etc...)

[Cameron]

I just got on the boards. Initial reaction: My heart feels like it's gone.

Why, Taylor? Bolt when the times are tough, huh?

I'm so sad right now.

[SupaDave]

So much gloom and doom. And there are other programs who have taken far larger hits. Just look at George Mason after their final four run. UMass JUST made it back to the tourney. See much of Indiana before "Air" Gordon? Georgetown is really only recently back in the national spotlight. Do I even need to mention UConn?

And since I saw the post more than a few times. I would be impressed if someone could name me a program that has suffered more than the Univ. of Michigan since the day the Fab 5 walked off of that campus.

I like to think Duke is in a pretty good place with an Olympic head coach. Taylor will be fine as well and he has represented Duke University well.

[BlueintheFace]

Let's look at the bright side folks... More playing time for Olek/ Marty (whoever would have been losing time there). I love Taylor, but if this bumps Marty up on the shooters depth chart then I can't help but feel a little happy on that front.

I do have to add though- If I see Taylor in a Gonzaga uniform (a very real possibility) then I am going to be a little peeved. Can't we just send him over to Herb in Arizona. They could really use him and I'd like to see ASU become the Duke JV team!

[Duke09]

If we land Boynton, McDonald and a big guy like Orton plus Plumblee, we are going to be very good. But we need a big class like that. This scholly opening up lets us do that.

[pfrduke]

If you mean that Duke won't enjoy a resurgence after a down stretch, including a championship, I hope you're wrong

I think Duvall meant we won't fall off a cliff next year, a la Doherty's next couple of teams.