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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Ohio State '07 = Duke '99?

    A few months ago, I recall reading a posting in which Jason Evans pontificated that this year's Ohio State could be as big a favorite as Duke was in '99 in the tournament. (Jason, my apologies if I mischaracterized your comments...please feel free to correct me.) Maybe it's because there seem to be more top echelon teams this year (UNC, Georgetown, Texas, Florida, Kansas, UCLA) as compared to '99, when it seemed like it was Duke vs. the world (although, IIRC, UConn spent a significant portion of the season as #1), but I don't think Ohio State's failure to win the torurnament would be viewed as anything more than perhaps a mild upset.

    Does anyone believe this is the OSU Invitational like it was the Duke Invitational in '99? Certainly, it doesn't seem like that in the media.
    Rich
    Cameron Crazies Do Not Storm The Court

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Ohio State '07 = Duke '99?

    Ooops...I had to correct the title.
    Rich
    Cameron Crazies Do Not Storm The Court

  3. #3
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    Goldsboro, NC

    EEEHHHHH I don't think so

    I think they will go to FinalFour because they have a cupcake walk to get there IMO. But I don't see them winning it all.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    A few months ago, I recall reading a posting in which Jason Evans pontificated that this year's Ohio State could be as big a favorite as Duke was in '99 in the tournament. (Jason, my apologies if I mischaracterized your comments...please feel free to correct me.) Maybe it's because there seem to be more top echelon teams this year (UNC, Georgetown, Texas, Florida, Kansas, UCLA) as compared to '99, when it seemed like it was Duke vs. the world (although, IIRC, UConn spent a significant portion of the season as #1), but I don't think Ohio State's failure to win the torurnament would be viewed as anything more than perhaps a mild upset.

    Does anyone believe this is the OSU Invitational like it was the Duke Invitational in '99? Certainly, it doesn't seem like that in the media.
    I think there's a general perception that OSU is the worst team of the #1 seeds, so no, I don't believe anyone would consider it a huge deal if they lost.

  5. #5

    don't think so

    The only evidence I need to refute OSU's dominance is that they struggled to beat Penn State TWICE this season. Those games were from mid-February on, so you can't tell me it was early in the season. In the first game Penn State had a chance to win at the end, and Penn State isn't even close to being as good as a 16 seed. It seems like Ohio State has let teams hang around before pulling away late. Is it possible that their first round game will be close for a while? I think they have too much talent not to pull away eventually, but maybe it'll be interesting for a little while.

  6. #6
    Put this year's OSU team against the '99 team and have them play 50 games, I don't think OSU wins a single game. Take a look back at the margin of victory for that '99 Duke team. Only team to ever go 16-0 in the ACC, and most of the games weren't even close...

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Reisen View Post
    Put this year's OSU team against the '99 team and have them play 50 games, I don't think OSU wins a single game. Take a look back at the margin of victory for that '99 Duke team. Only team to ever go 16-0 in the ACC, and most of the games weren't even close...
    That ACC was very weak, though. I mean, if St. John's could hang and MSU could hang (twice), I don't see why this OSU team couldn't hang. I'd say it's more like this OSU team would win 2 out of 10 or maybe 2 out of 15 from Duke 99.

  8. #8
    umm the 99 team would absolutely kill any team in the country from this year.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by smackedownz View Post
    umm the 99 team would absolutely kill any team in the country from this year.
    Interesting. What would UConn 99 do the competition this year? MSU 99? SJU 99?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    Interesting. What would UConn 99 do the competition this year? MSU 99? SJU 99?
    I think that the '99 UConn team was better than most of the teams out there this year, even given that most of us biased Duke fans think that we would have won that championship game 8 out of 10 times. Looking back at it, that '99 team would have been a prohibitive favorite this year.

  11. #11
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    Feb 2007
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    New York, NY

    duke 99

    Duke 99 beats Uconn 99 42/50
    and beats SJU and MSU 48/50
    and beats any current team at least 40/50, and outside the top seeds, probably closer to 50/50.

    They were great.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    The reason we lost that game is because a couple of guys on the team had a UConn 06 attitude and went out partying late the night before the game. They didn't take it seriously.

    You take Duke '99 and give them the heart and passion of Duke '01, and you've got a team that beats anyone in that year's field or this year's 999 out of 1000.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by smackedownz View Post
    umm the 99 team would absolutely kill any team in the country from this year.
    Agreed. The talent level in college basketball today is not what it was a few years ago when early entry was not as common.

    -Jason

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Agreed. The talent level in college basketball today is not what it was a few years ago when early entry was not as common.

    -Jason
    Not only that, but early entry from Duke was unheard of. That team was the first one to start losing players early to the NBA.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    Does anyone believe this is the OSU Invitational like it was the Duke Invitational in '99? Certainly, it doesn't seem like that in the media.
    I think the thing that led to the 1999 team seeming so unbeatable was the margin of victory. That team routinely was up by 20+ points at halftime. It won by 30 or even 40 points all the time. It set a record for margin of victory in ACC games.

    We didn't just win a lot, we killed EVERYONE. Even the games against UNC were largely laughers (we won by 12, 22, and 23 points in the 3 contests). We were challenged maybe 3 or 4 times all year until the Final Four.

    A lot of folks think that the lack of any real competition really hurt us when it came to the close game with UConn.

    -Jason "I do agree that we would win 4 of 5 or probably more like 6 out of every 7 games against UConn that year" Evans

  16. #16
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    The 99 team gets better with age

    Quote Originally Posted by johnb View Post
    Duke 99 beats Uconn 99 42/50
    and beats SJU and MSU 48/50
    and beats any current team at least 40/50, and outside the top seeds, probably closer to 50/50.

    They were great.

    I love that 99 team and it should have won the national championship but to suggest it would have beaten uconn/sju/msu a combined 90 out of 100 that year is going too far. We had to battle to beat msu twice. Two tight games that we barely won hardly suggests we would have a 98 percent success rate against them. We barely beat st. john's, in overtime. We lost to uconn. That's a 75 percent success rate in games actually played.

    I expected Duke 99 to win it all and still feel that should have happened but we lost that year to the only team that I feared going into the tournament. That uconn team was wrongly overlooked that year. It was no fluke they beat us in a 1-shot deal, painful as it was.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by feldspar View Post
    The reason we lost that game is because a couple of guys on the team had a UConn 06 attitude and went out partying late the night before the game. They didn't take it seriously.

    You take Duke '99 and give them the heart and passion of Duke '01, and you've got a team that beats anyone in that year's field or this year's 999 out of 1000.
    I have read and heard the late partying hyperbole before, but never seen any substantiation.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Agreed. The talent level in college basketball today is not what it was a few years ago when early entry was not as common.

    -Jason
    This is one of the most talent-filled years in recent college basketball history. There's probably more talent this year than in 99. The ACC was especially weak that year with only three teams making the NCAA tournament.

    Duke 99 was a young team that was great in 99 but certainly not some all-time great team. If the sophomores had stayed together two more years, THEN we're talking about an all-time great team.

    There's a lot of "and Bill Werber served the beer" mentality in this thread (from throaty's handy pocket reference), except more like "and Nan Keohane didn't serve".
    Last edited by Troublemaker; 03-14-2007 at 09:38 AM.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troublemaker View Post
    This is one of the most talent-filled years in college basketball history. There's probably more talent his year than in 99. The ACC was especially weak that year with only three teams making the NCAA tournament.

    Duke 99 was a young team that was great in 99 but certainly not some all-time great team. If the sophomores had stayed together two more years, THEN we're talking about an all-time great team.

    There's a lot of "and Bill Werber served the beer" mentality in this thread (from throaty's handy pocket reference), except more like "and Nan Keohane didn't serve".
    Without trying to get into the overall talent levels of '99 vs. '07, I do think that the talent level on Duke that year was phenomenal. I haven't double checked, but I think that our margin of victory was 26 points/game. That's unreal, and a sign that we just ran over everyone. Half time scores often had a larger margin because the team would back off from the beating they were giving people (I think scores were as ugly as 60-18 at halftime against the lesser competition). It was a lot of fun rooting for the team and seeing them play in person.

    Given the way we destroyed our competition, the conversations we had at the time didn't center around which other NCAA teams could give us a hard time, but rather whether Duke '99 could beat the Clippers. Ironically, they now ARE the Clippers. Do you really think that there is a single team in the NCAA this year who belongs in any conversation about beating any of the pro teams? It didn't feel wrong to compare Duke '99 to the worst pro team.

  20. #20
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    Dear Trouble,

    you are posting a lot (almost 8/day), but I don't recall seeing your handle over the past decade. From my limited point of view, it is cool to disagree, but you might want to demonstrate some basketball knowledge before making fairly unsubstantiated statements (particularly if you are going to go up against one of the primo posters of all time, Mr Evans). Just being contrarian doesn't make you right.

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