Sos

[nicktonyg22]

I know this is 1H (handy pocket reference), but I've been wondering why we haven't scheduled many true road games before the ACC schedule. I figured that the fact that we haven't had high-quality road opponents in recent years outside of the ACC/Big Ten Challenge might effect our strength of schedule. However, looking at the rpi SOS ratings at kenpom, here is our overall SOS and non-conference SOS over the past 4 years...then I compare that to UNC's over the same time span to make ourselves feel good about playing harder schedules than them...and still being better than them in all things.

Duke
'07: Overall- 3, Non-Conf- 10
'06: Overall- 1, Non-Conf- 6
'05: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 46
'04: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 24

UNC
'07: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 7
'06: Overall- 10, Non-Conf- 70
'05: Overall- 18, Non-Conf- 54
'04: Overall- 5, Non-Conf- 29



9F!

[monkey]

I know this is 1H (handy pocket reference), but I've been wondering why we haven't scheduled many true road games before the ACC schedule. I figured that the fact that we haven't had high-quality road opponents in recent years outside of the ACC/Big Ten Challenge might effect our strength of schedule. However, looking at the rpi SOS ratings at kenpom, here is our overall SOS and non-conference SOS over the past 4 years...then I compare that to UNC's over the same time span to make ourselves feel good about playing harder schedules than them...and still being better than them in all things.

Duke
'07: Overall- 3, Non-Conf- 10
'06: Overall- 1, Non-Conf- 6
'05: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 46
'04: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 24

UNC
'07: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 7
'06: Overall- 10, Non-Conf- 70
'05: Overall- 18, Non-Conf- 54
'04: Overall- 5, Non-Conf- 29



9F!

4,4,1,3 Overall SOS - Jeez, every single game shouldn't have to be a slugfest - Duke seems to be taking enough on to its plate.

[hondoheel]

I count Duke as having 3 non-conference games on the opponent's floor over the last 4 years, excluding the Big 10 /ACC "Challenge." UNC has that many this year alone.

Oh, and of course Duke's ACC schedule is tougher than Carolina's for the last 3 years. I mean, you have to play UNC while they get to play Duke.

[Duvall]

I count Duke as having 3 non-conference games on the opponent's floor over the last 4 years, excluding the Big 10 /ACC "Challenge." UNC has that many this year alone.

Don't wear yourselves out patting yourselves on the back over those stiff tests against Penn, Rutgers *and* a wretched Kentucky squad.

[hondoheel]

Don't wear yourselves out patting yourselves on the back over those stiff tests against Penn, Rutgers *and* a wretched Kentucky squad.

Well, at least it wasn't a directional Kentucky.

[Duvall]

Well, at least it wasn't a directional Kentucky.

Eastern might beat UK this year. Western certainly could.

Also, your math is wrong.

[ugadevil]

Well, at least it wasn't a directional Kentucky.

What makes you so sure UNC played the better of the two Kentucky's?

[kydevil]

Well, at least it wasn't a directional Kentucky.

True. However I honestly think Uk with how they're playing right now would struggle with Eastern Ky. and most likely lose to Western Ky. who played Gonzage down to the wire, beat some solid teams, and hasn't lost to anyone named Gardner Webb.

I think your argument would go well somewhere like.... IC?

P.S. Duvall you beat me to the punch!

[sandinmyshoes]

Our sos is is strong because Coach K schedules a lot of good teams on neutral courts, and non-cupcakes that we should still be heavily favored over in Cameron.

I hate to be this way, but truthfully, I would love for us to go into some tough home gyms and slug it out, but Coach K evidently feels that is not in the best interest of helping the team to progress. Still, I would love to see a home and home with a program like Kansas or UCLA.

[Duvall]

Our sos is is strong because Coach K schedules a lot of good teams on neutral courts, and non-cupcakes that we should still be heavily favored over in Cameron.

I hate to be this way, but truthfully, I would love for us to go into some tough home gyms and slug it out, but Coach K evidently feels that is not in the best interest of helping the team to progress.

Duke will have plenty of tough road games during the conference season.

[dukie8]

I know this is 1H (handy pocket reference), but I've been wondering why we haven't scheduled many true road games before the ACC schedule. I figured that the fact that we haven't had high-quality road opponents in recent years outside of the ACC/Big Ten Challenge might effect our strength of schedule. However, looking at the rpi SOS ratings at kenpom, here is our overall SOS and non-conference SOS over the past 4 years...then I compare that to UNC's over the same time span to make ourselves feel good about playing harder schedules than them...and still being better than them in all things.

Duke
'07: Overall- 3, Non-Conf- 10
'06: Overall- 1, Non-Conf- 6
'05: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 46
'04: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 24

UNC
'07: Overall- 4, Non-Conf- 7
'06: Overall- 10, Non-Conf- 70
'05: Overall- 18, Non-Conf- 54
'04: Overall- 5, Non-Conf- 29



9F!

sos doesn't weight true road games. it should but it doesn't.

[Duvall]

sos doesn't weight true road games. it should but it doesn't.

Are you sure? I know that the full RPI rating has taken location into account for the last several years.

Road games are grossly overrated, anyway.

[sandinmyshoes]

Duke will have plenty of tough road games during the conference season.

Of course they will, but so will teams like Kansas, Texas, UCLA and UNC. They also schedule some pretty tough out of conference series.

Now, I do not think UNC's road schedule was all that tough this year, aside from being long, but when the series was scheduled they had no way of knowing Kentucky would be so down. So kudos for scheduling that kind of marquee matchup. I just wish we would do the same.

I really think Kansas and Duke would be a great series (not that I'm sure Self would accept it) with Cameron and Phog just overflowing with tradition.

[Duvall]

Of course they will, but so will teams like Kansas, Texas, UCLA and UNC. They also schedule some pretty tough out of conference series.

Now, I do not think UNC's road schedule was all that tough this year, aside from being long, but when the series was scheduled they had no way of knowing Kentucky would be so down. So kudos for scheduling that kind of marquee matchup. I just wish we would do the same.

I really think Kansas and Duke would be a great series (not that I'm sure Self would accept it) with Cameron and Phog just overflowing with tradition.

I would love a home and home series with Kansas, but I would consider Duke's series with Georgetown to be a marquee matchup. The Hoyas are certainly stronger than Kentucky at present.

[sandinmyshoes]

I would love a home and home series with Kansas, but I would consider Duke's series with Georgetown to be a marquee matchup. The Hoyas are certainly stronger than Kentucky at present.

It is a great matchup, to be sure. Oddly enough, however, I don't think it projected quite so strongly when it was set up, Georgetown really surged last year. Such is the uncertainty of scheduling series.

I also wouldn't mind a west coast series either. But in any event Coach K could set up two series, with them set up so that we always play one of the marquee series games at home and one away each season.

[HumboldtDevil]

I say that "true" OOC road games are highly overrated, especially by Carolina fans that try to use them as an example of Duke's weak scheduling (which is an obvious fallacy).

Here is a list of Duke's "true" road games:
FSU, VT, Maryland, UNC, Wake Forest, Miami, NC State, Virginia.

Here is a list of neutral site games:
Princeton, Illinois, Marquette, Davidson, Temple, Pitt
--------------------------------------------------------------------

For comparisons sake, UNCs "true" roadies:
Ohio State, Kentucky, Penn, Rutgers, Clemson, GT, Miami, FSU, Virginia, State, BC, Duke.

Neutral site:
Davidson, ODU, BYU,
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Carolina's has more road games, but they aren't that tough OOC. Ohio State and Kentucky look good on paper, but the Buckeyes are pretty average (followed UNC loss with 19-point loss at Butler where they were outscored 34-8 over final 7+ and 54-21 over final 27+) and Kentucky is just bad. Penn is an Ivy League school and Rutgers is no good despite a nice home court advantage.

To save everyone the trouble, here are the conference roadies unique to either team:

Duke - VT, Maryland, Wake, UNC
UNC - Clemson, BC, GT, Duke

Both play at FSU, Miami, State, and Virginia. Clemson and BC are tougher tests than VT and Maryland, but none of those games are gimmes. Wake is probably better than GT right now, though. I'll admit that UNC will have an advantage over Duke when ACC play rolls around and they hit the road because Duke will have its first "true" road game. But that's about it.

[sandinmyshoes]

UNC does not really get credit for OSU even if they had been good this year, because that was a Challenge game.

But this stuff about OOC road games being overrated sounds like justification to me. If they are overrated, why not play them? They're good publicity if nothing else.

I know we all tend to be defensive of Duke in the face of taunting. And Coach K's iconic stature seems to make some people bristle at any criticism. But in my opinion, and that's all it is, I think our schedules have not been as tough as their ratings would suggest the past few years. This neutral site scheduling just doesn't have any old school thrill to it. Again, just my opinion.

[yancem]

Our sos is is strong because Coach K schedules a lot of good teams on neutral courts, and non-cupcakes that we should still be heavily favored over in Cameron.

I hate to be this way, but truthfully, I would love for us to go into some tough home gyms and slug it out, but Coach K evidently feels that is not in the best interest of helping the team to progress. Still, I would love to see a home and home with a program like Kansas or UCLA.

In the late 80's early 90's Duke did have home and home schedules with big name ooc teams. UCLA stopped playing us because they thought losing was hurting their instate recruiting. We stopped playing Michigan when Amaker became coach. I'm not sure why we stopped playing Arizona but we did play them for several years. We also had a long run of St Johns games but unfortunately their program has lost its luster.

Really it has only been the last couple of years that we haven't had a couple of other BCS league games. I think the shift has been in part because in order to succeed in the NCAA tourney you have to beat a couple of feisty mid-majors. I also think that it helps the mid-majors out a little bit.

I do hope that we keep scheduling G-Town. I think that they are going to be a strong program for many years. Adding Kansas would be cool but if we could UCLA back on the schedule, it would be a bigger boost with regards to recruiting. California always has a couple of studs each year.