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  1. #1

    Next Football Coach Search

    The first attribute I would seek is someone who can build a quality staff. I have read that the Duke HC job is one of the least desirable in college football. Well, what does that make the coordinators? And the assistants? Without doing any research I would guess that coaches who turn around programs quickly bring in a great staff of assistants.

    The requirement would be filled by someone who is a head coach and would bring most of his staff with him or a well traveled name guy who could build a staff based on his contacts and reputation. Salaries will have to be competitive.

    Bringing in a head coach who did a good but not great job at a bigger program would be ok with me. I think Illinois is pretty happy with Ron Zook, who lost the Florida job.

    Promoting a successful coach from a smaller school is ok if he can bring his staff.

    While USC hired Pete Carroll he hired Norm Chow as his OC and took on the DC job himself so he could save that salary and give it to Chow, who probably made more that the Duke HC at the time. A name guy without college experience can do fine.

    I also want the coach to have respect for Duke's reputation - academically and otherwise.

    I have mixed feelings about Alleva leading the process. His hires for men's golf, women's bball, and men's lacrosse seem like good ones. His football hires not only did not work out but it retrospect they were doomed from the start.

    SoCal

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Meeting with Marie Laveau

    The next football coach

    It will matter little who the next coach is if the University does not change in its neglect and lack of interest in the football program.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalDukeFan View Post
    The requirement would be filled by someone who is a head coach and would bring most of his staff with him or a well traveled name guy who could build a staff based on his contacts and reputation. Salaries will have to be competitive.
    what about someone who WAS a head coach...like Marty Shottenheimer (sp?)

    i heard someone else mention his name on the board. i would KILL to get that guy.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkyJ View Post
    what about someone who WAS a head coach...like Marty Shottenheimer (sp?)

    i heard someone else mention his name on the board. i would KILL to get that guy.
    I certainly hope not. Age would be an issue there as well as the fact that he's never coached in a college environment. we need a respected 1-A coach if we can get him and if not, a well respected 1-AA coach. in either case, hopefully they bring an established staff.

    Alleva said in his presser that it's a foregone conclusion that the salary will have to be competitive and the facilities are going to need an upgrade. One of the reporters threw out steve logan's name, but alleva put it in the context of logan being someone to talk to and nothing more than that. He went into a lot of detail about stadium renovations and the phases/years for it.
    Duke '96
    Cary, NC

  5. #5
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    Washington, DC
    Quote Originally Posted by Devil in the Blue Dress View Post
    It will matter little who the next coach is if the University does not change in its neglect and lack of interest in the football program.
    I feel exactly the same way. I think a change at this point was needed, but it's not like Roof was given the greatest change to succeed.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Boston, MA

    This is Simple

    It's all about creativity. There are literally dozens of coaches out there who have turned non-football schools into contenders due 100% to their creative approach to the game.

    Fact is, at Duke, you are never going to be bigger and faster than Florida State, Miami and Virginia Tech. Never. Ever. You also likely will never play for a championship. But that doesn't mean you can't compete, and it doesn't mean you can't beat Florida State, Miami and Virginia Tech from time to time. Look at Wake, or Boston College, or Hawaii, Troy, Vanderbilt, Stanford, you name it.

    We need a coach who has offensive creativity that can at times confuse college defensive players. The offense will lend itself to a lot of yards and a lot of scoring, which then makes it easier to get decent QB's, running backs and WR's who you sell on the fact that if you come here you will put up big numbers and eventually get drafted in the NFL (see Dilweg, Anthony).

    Finally, you have a person on the staff dedicated to finding a FG kicker. This should be easy. On average, kickers tend to be better students. You go to them and say we are giving you a full ride to go to Duke University, where you will get a great education, and you'll get drafted by the NFL.

    Then, you hope to get a surprise recruit who has talent but is not recruited by the big boys and comes here and becomes a stud.

    It's not that far-fetched.

    The nice thing is that 4 wins will be seen as a savior.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalDukeFan View Post
    The first attribute I would seek is someone who can build a quality staff. I have read that the Duke HC job is one of the least desirable in college football. Well, what does that make the coordinators? And the assistants? Without doing any research I would guess that coaches who turn around programs quickly bring in a great staff of assistants.

    The requirement would be filled by someone who is a head coach and would bring most of his staff with him or a well traveled name guy who could build a staff based on his contacts and reputation. Salaries will have to be competitive.

    Bringing in a head coach who did a good but not great job at a bigger program would be ok with me. I think Illinois is pretty happy with Ron Zook, who lost the Florida job.

    Promoting a successful coach from a smaller school is ok if he can bring his staff.

    While USC hired Pete Carroll he hired Norm Chow as his OC and took on the DC job himself so he could save that salary and give it to Chow, who probably made more that the Duke HC at the time. A name guy without college experience can do fine.

    I also want the coach to have respect for Duke's reputation - academically and otherwise.

    I have mixed feelings about Alleva leading the process. His hires for men's golf, women's bball, and men's lacrosse seem like good ones. His football hires not only did not work out but it retrospect they were doomed from the start.

    SoCal
    Every AD since Eddie Cameron has had a poor record hiring football coaches! Alleva has made good hires in other coaches. He doesn't do it alone, anyway.

  8. #8
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    Cary, NC
    nicely put. there's nowhere to go but up.

    i think too that offensive over defensive will be important.

    as alleva said in his presser, duke's not going to win many games 10-7, but they have a better shot of winning games 42-40.
    Duke '96
    Cary, NC

  9. #9
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    Jun 2007
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    Parts Unknown
    Quote Originally Posted by jjasper0729 View Post
    I certainly hope not. Age would be an issue there as well as the fact that he's never coached in a college environment. we need a respected 1-A coach if we can get him and if not, a well respected 1-AA coach. in either case, hopefully they bring an established staff.

    Alleva said in his presser that it's a foregone conclusion that the salary will have to be competitive and the facilities are going to need an upgrade. One of the reporters threw out steve logan's name, but alleva put it in the context of logan being someone to talk to and nothing more than that. He went into a lot of detail about stadium renovations and the phases/years for it.
    we need a respected coach . people need to get beyoine 1-a, big name, etc. We need a quality coach period

    I would not expect him to comment on a individual at this point. It would not be proper.

  10. #10
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Udaman View Post
    Fact is, at Duke, you are never going to be bigger and faster than Florida State, Miami and Virginia Tech. Never. Ever. You also likely will never play for a championship.
    wrong...! i tell my daughter she can be anythign she wants to be...so can Duke

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Western North Carolina

    Requirements

    One thing that Duke needs to look at is the style that the guy runs. Look at the BCS this year and last year.

    Last Year's NC: those G-Darn Gators (mom's family is from Knoxville, TN. Hate FLA).

    The top two teams in this year's BCS standings? Mizzou, WVU. Oregon and KS were up there until recent losses/catastrophic injuries. Hawaii is the only undefeated team in the nation.

    What do all these teams have in common? The Spread Option Offense. A little team called App St. runs a version of this. FLA's QB is a virtual lock for the heisman after throwing for 25+ tds and Running for 20+ more.

    The spread is a great way for a team like Duke to maximize our potential strengths, while minimizing our potential weaknesses.

    In my mind, Duke's strengths, both as far as the current roster and on a going forward basis are:

    Solid to good (bordering on near great) skill players. I would stack our QB/WRs up against any team in the ACC. Our RB situation is less stable, but, that is the deepest position, in ANY sport, in the nation. Look at the NFL. Some of the leading rushers are guys you never heard of prior to them getting drafted in the 7th round. Sure, guys like LT, Adrien Peterson, or Mcfaddon are nice, but not necessary to win. The spread is designed to get the playmakers, ie WRs, RBs, and QBs on islands where they can make plays.

    Brains. This may be Duke elitism, but I bet the kids we have now, and the ones we will have in the future, are smarter than your average bear. We have the type of guys that can make the Spread Option motor. Guys who can quickly learn a complicated system, and guys smart enough to make the quick reads/adjustments necessary to make the O hum.

    (as a caveat, I know that Tebow is a BAD example. He is a once in a lifetime athlete who was designed for the spread option)

    Duke's negatives:

    Size on the line. I do not know why, but linemen are the dumbest athletes typically. I know. I played line in HS. And at a public school in the rural App. Mountains of WNC, my co-linemen were dumb. I mean circus dumb. Recruiting huge, talented, Duke-caliber linemen will ALWAYS be a problem at Duke. Besides, guys like that can go to Michigan or OSU. Why Duke? Well, why not, but you cannot count on getting them.

    The spread O negates this by letting the QB make decisions, ie, get rid of the ball, before the opposing D has the time to overcome deficient linemen. Now, the line cannot be epically bad, but all they have to be is decent.

    I think Duke is tailor made to run the spread O. Any other type of O is unacceptable.

    Which is why......

    Duke must look at the O coordinator in conjuntion with HC. For the OC slot, I humbly put forth Gus Malzan. He is the former HS coach who Ark hired. Nutt disrespected him, calling him High School and ignoring his suggestions, and basically ran him off. Ark is now 114 in the nation in Passing O. Malzahn went to Tulsa, implemented his O, to the tune of 500+ ypg.

    Our HC must be a publicity darling, star recruitor, and hopefully a D guy. We need to hire a Spread Option OC and give him total control of the O. We do not need to let the HC dictate the OC slot, unless the HC is a spread option guy himself. [If this is the case, then we need to take the DC out of the HC's hands, cause Spread Option HCs seem to be truly bum fuzzled by fielding a D]

    Before anyone jumps down my throat about not letting a HC hire his OC, I have an example. This past season a HC retired (probably would have been encouraged to leave at any rate). Before naming a new HC, the owner of this team hired a OC, and foisted him on the new HC. That team was Dallas, and their O is thriving.

    Duke needs to look at football from a different perspective. This is not about hiring a "guy." I doubt that there is a single guy that can fix all of Duke's problems. At least, there isn't one who would take the job. Duke needs to hire a staff. We MUST NOT hire a HC until we know who all of the major assistants will be. At the least, we must know the OC, DC, and Spec Teams coaches will be, what schemes they will run, etc.

    This is a watershed moment for Duke FB. The future of the game is playing out at the highest levels this year, and Duke must embrace the movement.

    Patrick Yates

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluedawg View Post
    wrong...! i tell my daughter she can be anythign she wants to be...so can Duke
    I hope she wants to be a football all-american at Duke!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Meeting with Marie Laveau

    Hiring a coach or changing a program?

    Quote Originally Posted by Indoor66 View Post
    Every AD since Eddie Cameron has had a poor record hiring football coaches! Alleva has made good hires in other coaches. He doesn't do it alone, anyway.
    Ever wondered why that trend in hiring football coaches developed? Look to the new hires in faculty and dean's positions during the same period of time. Look at the leadership provided by the university presidents. It was not and is not now important to those running the university that there be a successful football program.

    I am a lifelong Dukie. I lived in Durham for over 40 years. I'm telling you guys who keep dreaming up names that the sad state of things in Allen Building will negate what any new coach can do. If you want Duke football to get better, you'd better speak up now and demand changes starting in Allen Building.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalDukeFan View Post
    The first attribute I would seek is someone who can build a quality staff. I have read that the Duke HC job is one of the least desirable in college football. Well, what does that make the coordinators? And the assistants? Without doing any research I would guess that coaches who turn around programs quickly bring in a great staff of assistants.

    The requirement would be filled by someone who is a head coach and would bring most of his staff with him or a well traveled name guy who could build a staff based on his contacts and reputation. Salaries will have to be competitive.

    Bringing in a head coach who did a good but not great job at a bigger program would be ok with me. I think Illinois is pretty happy with Ron Zook, who lost the Florida job.

    Promoting a successful coach from a smaller school is ok if he can bring his staff.

    While USC hired Pete Carroll he hired Norm Chow as his OC and took on the DC job himself so he could save that salary and give it to Chow, who probably made more that the Duke HC at the time. A name guy without college experience can do fine.

    I also want the coach to have respect for Duke's reputation - academically and otherwise.

    I have mixed feelings about Alleva leading the process. His hires for men's golf, women's bball, and men's lacrosse seem like good ones. His football hires not only did not work out but it retrospect they were doomed from the start.

    SoCal
    This all sounds good, but Duke seems to be in a tough spot. I'm not sure why a proven head coach at the Div-I level would want the Duke job, unless:

    (1) He's just been fired elsewhere and has little/no chance of getting hired in the near future, except at Duke;
    (2) Like Ross, has been out of the game a few years and is looking for one more HC job before he retires;

    I.e., someone who is fairly desperate; OR

    (3) He's an alum;

    But, I'm not sure any current HC fits that criteria.

    An alternative seems to be:

    (4) a HC from a lower division who has a stable staff --- i.e., pay at Duke is likely to be a promotion for everyone involved; I mean, even as bad as the Duke job appears to be, it almost has to be a step up for a coach and staff at a Div-II school. The problem is that really good coaches at smaller schools probably have other reasons for having stuck around so long --- it's there alma mater, for geographical/family reasons, etc. (The Duke job may still not look very attractive.)


    I think Alleva knows next to nothing about football. I watched the press conference, and as usual was under-whelmed by Alleva's presentation. He's a quality bean counter and probably a nice guy who loves Duke, but I just don't think he would even know what to really look for... I hope to God he surrounds himself with people who can and has the sense to not get in the way.

    I know there are objections on the board re: making a hire based on race, but I do agree that the pool of quality African-American coaches is a great place to look (or start looking) given how few of those guys have gotten their shot over the years.

    Other than that, I guess I would be fine with a guy using Duke as a stepping stone, ala Spurrier. At this point we would be lucky for someone to warrant a big-time job after coaching Duke for a few years; that would mean that Duke was winning again. Then, maybe we can make a better follow-up hire than we did when Steve left.

    I'm not sold on an NFL guy, like Marty S... One positive thing about hiring assistants (remember Spurrier was an assistant at the time) is that a bad record can be attributed to that person "not being ready to be a head coach" --- that seems to be what Joe was saying today when he said the next coach has to have head coaching experience... Bring in an ex-NFL guy: if he wins 3 games in 3 years, he'll leave on his own accord and I'm sure claim that "Jesus Christ himself couldn't win at Duke." We're pretty screwed now, but we'll be extremely screwed then...

    The problem is that Duke is a perfect job for a talented but young assistant, if Duke would just do all the other stuff to improve football. It seems like they are now going to make some of those improvements, but just when past failures make hiring an assistant almost impossible...
    Last edited by tux; 11-26-2007 at 04:24 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil in the Blue Dress View Post
    Ever wondered why that trend in hiring football coaches developed? Look to the new hires in faculty and dean's positions during the same period of time.
    What does this even mean?

  16. #16
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    Cary, NC
    In response to Patrick Yates, the head coach at georgia southern, Chris Hatcher came from valdosta state and has a knack for a passing attack. the only thing there is he's been at GaSou for only a year after 7 at Valdosta State so it may be harder to get him out of there. Hatcher is a protege of Hal Mumme (who made a star out of tim couch for crying out loud). I think that is a good way to go. The guy is young and has a good staff and has the ties to the deep pool of talent in Georgia
    Duke '96
    Cary, NC

  17. #17
    I mentioned this (probably prematurely) in the first Roof thread, but I will say it again here. If I had my druthers, the next football coach at Duke would be current Tulsa OC Gus Malzahn.

    I truly believe Malzahn may have what it takes to be the next Spurrier, both at Duke and on a national level.

    Like others said, from a fan support perspective it will be important to bring in a good offensive guy, and Malzahn is exactly that. He runs his own variation of the spread option, the Hurry Up No Huddle, and his model has been adopted by coaches at all levels across the country. He even authored a book on the subject, you can find it on Amazon. The HUNH is a highly versatile attack, and you can run and pass from it with equal success (as Malzahn has proven over the last two years). Perhaps most crucially for Duke, the HUNH is something of an equalizer, with smart schemes and good execution making up for disparities in talent.

    Malzahn has found success everywhere he's been. He had a legendary career as a high school coach in Arkansas, winning at both big schools and small. In the late 90's, he led tiny Shiloh Christian to a 40+ game winning streak and a national ranking. At Arkansas he was instrumental in transforming a once vanilla running game into the complex and innovative system that has made Darren McFadden and Felix Jones one of the most productive running back tandems of all time. Rivals named him the national assistant of the year after the 2006 season, his first in the college ranks. This year at Tulsa, his offense leads the NATION in yards per game.

    To top if off, Malzahn is relatively young, a character guy, and a good recruiter who can bring excitement back to the program. Among realistic candidates, I see him as the IDEAL hire.

  18. #18
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    Aug 2007

    Question to Devil in the Blue Dress.

    Never mind, I reread your post. I guess you're not very fond of our administration.

  19. #19
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    Skinker-DeBaliviere, Saint Louis
    I agree that AfAm coaches/HBC coaches are a good place to start looking simply because what you've got is an undermined pool of talent.

    Take Croom at Mississippi State. Bulldogs only got him because Bama passed on him a year earleir. Croom's turned it around at MSU in year 4, has beaten Bama twice, and has outlasted the man they passed him over for, David Shula.

    A movie is not about what it's about; it's about how it's about it.
    ---Roger Ebert


    Some questions cannot be answered
    Who’s gonna bury who
    We need a love like Johnny, Johnny and June
    ---Over the Rhine

  20. #20
    How about Bobby Hauck of University of Montana at Missoula? We did OK with someone from Missoula in the past!


    From the U of M website:

    http://www.montanagrizzlies.com/cont...ball/hauck.htm

    Bobby Hauck (pronounced HOWK) has had an exemplary four-year tenure at his alma mater, going 41-13 overall and 24-5 in Big Sky Conference games.

    He has guided the Grizzlies to four straight league championships -- the most by any coach in Griz history.

    He has also led the Griz to four NCAA Football Championship Subdivision (the FCS was formerly called Division I-AA) playoff appearances in a row, including the title game in 2004.

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