2018 NBA Draft

[Billy Dat]

Duke is building a tradition of undrafted players working their way into NBA careers. Shavlik Randolph, Lance Thomas, Seth Curry, Quinn Cook were all undrafted. As were DeMarcus Nelson, Andre Dawkins, and Marshall Plumlee, all of whom had cups-of-coffee in the NBA. The latter two are still giving it a shot, along with Amile Jefferson and Matt Jones.

So, it can be done. But it's not going to be handed to Duval. He's going to have to check his ego at the door, work off his derriere, listen to the coaching and developmental professionals and be prepared to hear "no" a few times before he hears "yes."

I have a feeling Trevon is going to be an NBA player. I think he's got too much natural talent, and seems to have enough of a work ethic, to make it happen. Per Jim's comments, it sounds like he's got a healthy ego which needs to be channeled, and last night was probably a another step in that process, but I can't believe he'll not have an NBA career.

[jimsumner]

I don't think either was a point in Jim's post, which I believe had to do with takings his lumps with a smile and trying to adapt to what future coaches tell him.

Duval came to Duke as a consensus top-10 recruit, a sure-fire OAD, was handed the point-guard-keys to the pre-season number one team, a starting lineup that included four top-40 draft selections. Kyrie Irving, v. 2.

So, going undrafted has to be pretty sobering. He has to resist some natural human inclinations. He can't blame someone else, he can't feel sorry for himself, he can't lose himself in second-guessing.

He came to a fork in the road and he took it. Next play.

There's an old jazz expression; "woodshedding." He needs to get into the figurative woodshed and refine his craft.

As an aside, I absolutely expected Duval to be drafted last night, no later than mid-40s, likely earlier that that.

So, color me very, very surprised.

[Acymetric]

Duval came to Duke as a consensus top-10 recruit, a sure-fire OAD, handed the point-guard-keys to the pre-season number one team, a starting lineup that included four top-40 draft selections. Kyrie Irving, v. 2.

So, going undrafted has to be pretty sobering. He has to resist some natural human inclinations. He can't blame someone else, he can't feel sorry for himself, he can't lose himself in second-guessing.

He came to a fork in the road and he took it. Next play.

There's an old jazz expression; "woodshedding." He needs to get into the figurative woodshed and refine his craft.

As an aside, I absolutely expected Duval to be drafted last night, no later than mid-40s, likely earlier that that.

So, color me very, very surprised.

(emphasis mine)

Woah woah woah. Who ever considered Duval to be Kyrie Irving 2.0? I'm not even sure Duval's parents would have made that claim (although I generally agree with the rest of the post).

[jimsumner]

(emphasis mine)

Woah woah woah. Who ever considered Duval to be Kyrie Irving 2.0? I'm not even sure Duval's parents would have made that claim (although I generally agree with the rest of the post).

You obviously don't read Duke message boards.

[ChillinDuke]

(emphasis mine)

Woah woah woah. Who ever considered Duval to be Kyrie Irving 2.0? I'm not even sure Duval's parents would have made that claim (although I generally agree with the rest of the post).

It was definitely a term that was thrown around. Perhaps haphazardly. But thrown around nonetheless.

Your technical wording may differ. But he was absolutely billed as the "most athletic Duke freshman PG since Kyrie Irving" and "best freshman handles since Kyrie Irving." In one degree or another. Whether that made people call him Kyrie Irving 2.0 or not, I'm not entirely sure. But it was a thing.

- Chillin

[CDu]

It was definitely a term that was thrown around. Perhaps haphazardly. But thrown around nonetheless.

Your technical wording may differ. But he was absolutely billed as the "most athletic Duke freshman PG since Kyrie Irving" and "best freshman handles since Kyrie Irving." In one degree or another. Whether that made people call him Kyrie Irving 2.0 or not, I'm not entirely sure. But it was a thing.

- Chillin

If true (I can't remember), that was very misguided. He was always way more of a Derrick Rose type than an Irving type.

[Bluedog]

If true (I can't remember), that was very misguided. He was always way more of a Derrick Rose type than an Irving type.

Who led his team to the NCAA championship game as a freshman...(but I agree with you. Not the shooters Kyrie was/is.)

[ChillinDuke]

If true (I can't remember), that was very misguided. He was always way more of a Derrick Rose type than an Irving type.

Yeah, Rose was thrown around too.

But I think Jim's point still holds. Many around here (and in the media) played the comparison game with exceptional college/NBA players. Which is a sobering contrast to what actually played out on draft night for Trevon.

- Chillin

[Acymetric]

It was definitely a term that was thrown around. Perhaps haphazardly. But thrown around nonetheless.

Your technical wording may differ. But he was absolutely billed as the "most athletic Duke freshman PG since Kyrie Irving" and "best freshman handles since Kyrie Irving." In one degree or another. Whether that made people call him Kyrie Irving 2.0 or not, I'm not entirely sure. But it was a thing.

- Chillin

"Best since Kyrie" is way different than "as good as Kyrie" or "Kyrie 2.0". The quotes you made were probably true, or at least expected to be true, but that doesn't mean that most folks were expecting a Duval to actually be as good as Kyrie.

I would also suggest that Duval is more athletic than Kyrie in terms of explosiveness.

[jimsumner]

"Best since Kyrie" is way different than "as good as Kyrie" or "Kyrie 2.0". The quotes you made were probably true, or at least expected to be true, but that doesn't mean that most folks were expecting a Duval to actually be as good as Kyrie.

I would also suggest that Duval is more athletic than Kyrie in terms of explosiveness.

Forest, trees and all that.

There is no question that a sizeable portion of the Duke fan base favorably compared Duval to a number of esteemed predecessors--including Irving--and expected him to play at an elite level as a freshman.

A burden of expectations he was unable to fulfill.

Let me put it another way. If someone had said back in October that Trevon Duval would be healthy all season, that Duke would win 29 games and that Duval would be undrafted in the 2018 NBA draft, I think most of us, myself included, would have found that highly unlikely.


Which goes back to the original point, which is that Duval is going to have to recalibrate his expectations and work hard to end up where we thought he was going to end up.

[53n206]

I too expected Duval to be a star, the point guard who would bring everything together toward a championship. Never saw it develop. Not a bad player, but not a star. Perhaps if he had stayed longer. I wonder whether his lack of development was a key to his leaving the team. although it's hard to say he is leaving the team when he's trying to go to the next level, but that's how I look at it.

[superdave]

I too expected Duval to be a star, the point guard who would bring everything together toward a championship. Never saw it develop. Not a bad player, but not a star. Perhaps if he had stayed longer. I wonder whether his lack of development was a key to his leaving the team. although it's hard to say he is leaving the team when he's trying to go to the next level, but that's how I look at it.

Duval really was turning the corner end of February, first of March. He rolled his ankle against Unc and kept getting into foul trouble. But he was playing under control, shooting well, making great passes after drawing the defense. I recall the team seemed really bummed vs Unc when he rolled his ankle. They felt like Duval was going to put them over the top.

That said, he's an elite athlete. Explosive. I expect him to make the NBA after a few years in the G League.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Duval really was turning the corner end of February, first of March. He rolled his ankle against Unc and kept getting into foul trouble. But he was playing under control, shooting well, making great passes after drawing the defense. I recall the team seemed really bummed vs Unc when he rolled his ankle. They felt like Duval was going to put them over the top.

That said, he's an elite athlete. Explosive. I expect him to make the NBA after a few years in the G League.

And should anyone doubt that explosiveness, he put that to rest with his dunk in that Unc game...(then tweeted about it at half...SMH)

[Acymetric]

And should anyone doubt that explosiveness, he put that to rest with his dunk in that Unc game...(then tweeted about it at half...SMH)

It wasn't at halftime, it was immediately after the game, not that it changes the narrative significantly.

[DukieInBrasil]

I too expected Duval to be a star, the point guard who would bring everything together toward a championship. Never saw it develop. Not a bad player, but not a star. Perhaps if he had stayed longer. I wonder whether his lack of development was a key to his leaving the team. although it's hard to say he is leaving the team when he's trying to go to the next level, but that's how I look at it.

I think Duval would have been a huge beneficiary (along with Wendell) of not having Bagley added so late. Bagley is a great player, and i'm NOT saying Duke would have been better w/o him. However, having both Bagley and Carter on the floor, along with having 3 other enormous dudes as backups, at all times kept the lane clogged and severely limited Duval's ability to do what he does best: drive. So he had to learn how to do new things, and he went thru some growing pains. He did get better as a shooter, but his FT shooting was still horrid for a PG. He was an inexplicably poor finisher at the rim relative to his reputation as a guy who wants to get to the rim.
Still, he has a chance to continue to grow as a player, and as a young man. Perhaps he can build his shot up to "not a liability". Perhaps he can become a quality FT shooter. Perhaps he can become a quality at-the-rim finisher. His athleticism will continue to attract interest for at least as long as he continues to show improvement.

[Truth&Justise]

This will eventually tie back to Duval, but I want to highlight for you all what draft night was like as a Wizard's fan.

The Wiz haven't had any draft picks in the last two drafts. I was certain they'd trade their picks to dump a bad contract (compounding mistakes like that is the Wizard's specialty), but they kept the picks and nearly hit a home run! Michael Porter Jr. slid down the board, well worth the risk at #15, but he got picked by Denver at #14. So close. With a bevy of talented wings still available (Lonnie Walker, Zhaire Smith, Josh Okogie, Donte DiVincenzo, Grayson Allen) and a promising big man in Robert Williams, the Wizards went with a slightly less heralded player, Troy Brown Jr. Not a terrible pick, but it's hard to be a 3&D wing when you shoot 29% from three.

Then, in the middle of the second round, the Wizards took Issuf Sanon, an unknown 18-yr old Ukranian point guard. Who knows, maybe the kid pans out, but does he really have more potential than Duval? Or any of the guys drafted just after, like Hamidou Diallo, De'Anthony Melton, Svi Mykhaliuk, Keita Bates-Diop and Chimezie Metu? I'm convinced this was purely about money -- you don't have to pay a draft-and-stash player until (unless) he comes over.

In a few years, maybe Brown turns out better than those other wings, and maybe Sanon one day makes his way to the US. But this isn't the type of draft night that inspires confidence. We really didn't want to give Duval, or anyone else, a chance? We couldn't trade down?

Blegh.

[luvdahops]

This will eventually tie back to Duval, but I want to highlight for you all what draft night was like as a Wizard's fan.

The Wiz haven't had any draft picks in the last two drafts. I was certain they'd trade their picks to dump a bad contract (compounding mistakes like that is the Wizard's specialty), but they kept the picks and nearly hit a home run! Michael Porter Jr. slid down the board, well worth the risk at #15, but he got picked by Denver at #14. So close. With a bevy of talented wings still available (Lonnie Walker, Zhaire Smith, Josh Okogie, Donte DiVincenzo, Grayson Allen) and a promising big man in Robert Williams, the Wizards went with a slightly less heralded player, Troy Brown Jr. Not a terrible pick, but it's hard to be a 3&D wing when you shoot 29% from three.

Then, in the middle of the second round, the Wizards took Issuf Sanon, an unknown 18-yr old Ukranian point guard. Who knows, maybe the kid pans out, but does he really have more potential than Duval? Or any of the guys drafted just after, like Hamidou Diallo, De'Anthony Melton, Svi Mykhaliuk, Keita Bates-Diop and Chimezie Metu? I'm convinced this was purely about money -- you don't have to pay a draft-and-stash player until (unless) he comes over.

In a few years, maybe Brown turns out better than those other wings, and maybe Sanon one day makes his way to the US. But this isn't the type of draft night that inspires confidence. We really didn't want to give Duval, or anyone else, a chance? We couldn't trade down?

Blegh.

I think Brown brings a skill set beyond just 3 and D. He has a good handle and passing skills (grew up playing PG), and has drawn comparisons to guys like Tyreke Evans and Evan Turner. Still may not be what the Wiz really need though.

[MartyClark]

Good luck to the young man. He has some athletic ability and the potential to improve.

I liked him but thought he was wildly inconsistent at Duke. At times he could dominate the game. At other times, he appeared lost and confused.

I never got much of a sense for what type of person he is. I assume he listened to Coach K and was a good teammate.

Point guard is tough. He has the innate physical skills, It's unclear, at least to me, whether he can develop the timing, judgment and play making skills necessary to be an NBA point guard. As others have pointed out, he needs to shoot much better.

I would have liked him to stay another year. Two point guards is good and I think he and Tre Jones could have co-existed and been a successful combination point guard duo.

[ncexnyc]

It wasn't at halftime, it was immediately after the game, not that it changes the narrative significantly.

Didn't the dunk happen in the first UNC game, which was played on a Thursday night and the following game was on Sunday against GT, which was the game Trevon didn't get the start? Shall we say a teaching moment from Coach K?

[dukelifer]

I think Duval would have been a huge beneficiary (along with Wendell) of not having Bagley added so late. Bagley is a great player, and i'm NOT saying Duke would have been better w/o him. However, having both Bagley and Carter on the floor, along with having 3 other enormous dudes as backups, at all times kept the lane clogged and severely limited Duval's ability to do what he does best: drive. So he had to learn how to do new things, and he went thru some growing pains. He did get better as a shooter, but his FT shooting was still horrid for a PG. He was an inexplicably poor finisher at the rim relative to his reputation as a guy who wants to get to the rim.
Still, he has a chance to continue to grow as a player, and as a young man. Perhaps he can build his shot up to "not a liability". Perhaps he can become a quality FT shooter. Perhaps he can become a quality at-the-rim finisher. His athleticism will continue to attract interest for at least as long as he continues to show improvement.

Can’t “not shoot” and “not finish”. You have to be elite at something when you are his size. He will get better but the down payment on the new ride will have to wait.